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Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 7:51pm On Jan 12, 2019

FTF2069:
Communism is clearly more than Marx's view. But to keep the topic simpler I'll stick with Marx's.

talking about Communism, it's majorly about Economics and religion is well about itself.

Materialism as a philosophical approach was what Marx saw as best to achieving a good Communist State as at the time.

A good counter-question, to help you understand what communism and athiesm have, is to also ask (given that Communism is often set against Capitalism), What does Capitalism share with athiesm; it's a question, I suppose should help you see.

At that time organized religion ( which the Church did it for over hundreds of years) was either a political power, or co-opted by another power (monarchs) to help pacify the oppressed lower classes. Marx viewed religion as a natural result of the current way of society and the state and his materialist examination of religion lead him to his conclusion, that with the triumph of communism will religion wither away (along with the state) it is not necessary for the communists to be atheists. Karl Marx, as a man, observed his material environment for his deductions and for someone else, who is likewise observing, trying to study and infer from it, may find themselves on the side on the side with communism, even though he/she is religious. And there would be nothing stopping them from advocating Marxism and Marxist economics - Marxism is not a cult that has strict rules and boundaries.

While it is true that he also said atheism is inseperable from Marxism, the whole deal is behind understanding this complex phrase: Regardless of one's own religion, they must act as if they were atheist; just as they are free from the constraints of their nationality and race as they are Marxists, so shall they be free from the constraints of religion and act not by the guidance of religion but by that of a communist ideology . This means, on the grounds where religion and Marxism contradict each other, reconciliation is impossible: The church bureaucracy needs to be abolished.

To understand communism Perfectly you have to take yourself back to the time Marx was speaking and writing at.

There are things that can legitimately be called communism/communist yet are religion based:
There's a concept of "Religious Communism". Sometimes called Communalism, but in many ways in it's goals and points are very communist.

@danvon
I took my time to briefly explain Communism to you and how it relates to Atheism.

What the likes of Stalin and Hitler were about isn't just about Atheism there is something else. Which I consider move to ursurp the Church. Communism is also about that but doesn't justify murdering anyone and neither is it an advocate. Those acts are not right and should be stopped at every chance we get Which I said is a responsibility for all to prevent such.

But religion has we have it over the years has been a movement for these act justifying them with the name of the Lord. Atheists and agnostics do not behave less morally than religious believers, even if their virtuous acts are mediated by different principles. They often have as strong and sound a sense of right and wrong as anyone, including involvement in movements to abolish slavery and contribute to relief efforts associated with human suffering. The converse is also true: religion has led people to commit a long litany of horrendous crimes, from God’s command to Moses to slaughter the Midianites, men, women, boys and non-virginal girls, through the Crusades, the Inquisition, theThirty Years War, innumerable conflicts between Sunni and Shiite Muslims, and terrorists who blow themselves up in the confident belief that they are going straight to paradise, Genital mutilation, Sexism all justifying them with "it's the Lord way".

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 7:37pm On Jan 12, 2019

danvon:
Isn't this what communism tried to achieve morality without religion it simply painted the ruling class as slave masters using religion to enslave the masses and they were fighting for humanity for freedom

Why shouldn't thieves be killed

Communism is clearly more than Marx's view. But to keep the topic simpler I'll stick with Marx's.

talking about Communism, it's majorly about Economics and religion is well about itself.

Materialism as a philosophical approach was what Marx saw as best to achieving a good Communist State as at the time.

A good counter-question, to help you understand what communism and athiesm have, is to also ask (given that Communism is often set against Capitalism), What does Capitalism share with athiesm; it's a question, I suppose should help you see.

At that time organized religion ( which the Church did it for over hundreds of years) was either a political power, or co-opted by another power (monarchs) to help pacify the oppressed lower classes. Marx viewed religion as a natural result of the current way of society and the state and his materialist examination of religion lead him to his conclusion, that with the triumph of communism will religion wither away (along with the state) it is not necessary for the communists to be atheists. Karl Marx, as a man, observed his material environment for his deductions and for someone else, who is likewise observing, trying to study and infer from it, may find themselves on the side on the side with communism, even though he/she is religious. And there would be nothing stopping them from advocating Marxism and Marxist economics - Marxism is not a cult that has strict rules and boundaries.

While it is true that he also said atheism is inseperable from Marxism, the whole deal is behind understanding this complex phrase: Regardless of one's own religion, they must act as if they were atheist; just as they are free from the constraints of their nationality and race as they are Marxists, so shall they be free from the constraints of religion and act not by the guidance of religion but by that of a communist ideology . This means, on the grounds where religion and Marxism contradict each other, reconciliation is impossible: The church bureaucracy needs to be abolished.

To understand communism Perfectly you have to take yourself back to the time Marx was speaking and writing at.

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 10:51am On Jan 12, 2019

danvon:
Totalitarian cults? Sounds more like Communism product of atheism

Communism product of Atheism??.
If Marx was an Atheist, does that mean His Ideas sprouted out of Atheism, . Karl Marx was a brilliant individual, he acknowledges the benefits of Religion but the downside as well.

If Communism sounds like Totalitarian cult, then you have no idea of what it really is or supposed to be. Spend some time reading Marx's Communism manifesto.

If all you're thinking are the Stalin, Hitler etc. Those had nothing to do with atheism. In fact they were Christians that grew to have vendetta/problem with the Church and power it had over the people at that time.

You may then say, These guys were dangerous because of their Communist / Socialist / Marxist world view, which is underpinned by Atheism. It is the application of this world view, with no moral constraints that allowed them to overthrow systems of government and establish their personal ambition as the only “law”, so as to justify the murder of hundreds of millions who broke their law.

Atheism has nothing to do with that, the containment of personal inclinations toward self glorification and tyrannical oppression is a responsibility for us all. We can't lose our thinking capabilities as an alternative forgone for such. Which is what religion proposes.

The offer of Religion as a offer of certainty, as a offer of security, no matter how tempting it is, the offer of impermeable faith that can't give way; is an offer of something not worth having.

And if you think without religion, man has no Morality. I'll suggest you reassess your presupposition.

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 7:13pm On Jan 11, 2019

Do not let anyone belittle you for saying you don't believe in any Messiah or God anywhere.

"That you're dead until you believe like they do and that you can only live by accepting an absolute authority over life". I would urge you to look at the set of people who say these things to you as people who've lost grasp of reality, delusional with a poisoned mindset.

It's a frame work in the mind. You can imagine telling a Man/woman who believes God gave him/her the job s/he's at, saw him/her through school and believes tons of things about life on that premise called God. Imagine telling this fellow that God doesn't exist. He/She would mostly not be able to reconcile what you've just said with life. Because they've been taught for so long that an absolute authority must be in place for them to live life. It shatters their whole reason for life and existence in general. It takes a brave heart to come out of religion to a place of responsibility in thoughts and in actions.

We atheist accept we do not Know, we don't know everything, and we don't know anything as we ought to know hence the reason for our pursuit of knowledge, philosophy, science, logic because that is the only systematic process of making enquires that does not support jumping into conclusions without a justified true, documented evidence.

Religion serves the plate of deciet with the basis that the ground for relevation is that you belief in what is being served. Claims to know In entirety the universe, the creator, the particular God that designed it and even claims to know the mind of this Creator and the destiny of man as a race as its part a divine plan, That this Creator is genuinely concerned with your affairs, knows the number of hair in your pubic areas. And that this God Creator is all loving and Caring. A father they call "him". My beloved brother and sisters I'll like you to reflect on this, do you think God created man in his own image or Man created God in his own image.

Religion is a powerful force in the world. It just happens to ride on a false track of what Good, love and truth is.

Religion is what happened to you when others read the scriptures to you.

If you think every event recorded the scriptures called Bible/Qur'an is True, Good and a depiction of goodness and positivity for humanity to follow. Then you're deluded. I need not to pin point myself. But only religious people who believe they have a divine permission will ever carry out activities that not only does not benefit them, but also doesn't benefit the society.

Slavery, genital mutilation, war, Women stereotyping, are general examples of questionable acts that the Lord God who is "ever" good delights in.

Let alone of the inconsistency of the stories, lack of evidence to support it's history, and Scaring people to Hell for lack of belief in their proposed, wishful thinkings.

Let me say it here to those of you believers reading this: Your Miracles won't do it. I hope I have time to trash out these miracle thing of a topic.

We atheist accept that we don't know anything like enough yet, that we haven't understood enough, that we can't know enough. And hence we are always hungrily operating on a margin of potential harvest of greater future knowledge and wisdom, that will help and propel our world, our universe to a better place and for the greater good and convinience of her inhabitants and not to instill into people it's doom and catastrophic ending that only the belief in a religious Messiah can ease us from.

The offer of Religion, the offer of certainty, the offer of security, the offer of imperméable faith that can't give way is an offer of something not worth having.

Thank you.

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 5:53pm On Jan 11, 2019

orisa37:
Even if you were "Suya", I won't bite you, 'cos you are a Liar.

Liar, you said. May you tell me at what point exactly.

It's only religious people I meet that blow up their convictions about a subject matter and care not about the truthfulness/correctness of their position.

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 5:49pm On Jan 11, 2019

rekinomtla:
"Fanatics, mental slavery, totalitarian cult, endangerment to our species" this sounds like the cult of atheism.

Thanks that made me laugh.

But like I said it's only to shed more light, deliver us from the shackles of religion.

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Are Ignorant Of The Facts That Proves God's Existence by FTF2069(m): 10:45pm On Jan 06, 2019

jesmond3945:
@FTF2069
Please can you explain the similar template, since you have roped all religion to be one

Of course yes, the gaps in knowledge cannot be filled by you or whoesever, ok can you from my reply infer what clothes I am wearing at the moment to type this? Probably an algorithm can be devised but alas such an algorithm has flaws and we keep on trying to improve to close the gap and plunge ourselve further to a whirlpool

What is the viral pill you are talking about? I would say knowledge without spirituality is dead because philosophy is a child of spirituality.

I was never an athesit even when surrounded by many like because its inclinations was never marketable to
me. Just making the point that with the kind of knowledge i delved into I could have been one.

Let me tell you spend more time arguing with christians feeling proud when you put them in place and then you go back to arm yourself for more attacks. When it would be said you are done and you face your unbelief? Why must it be when you hear Jesus, your logical armoury is set up to launch more attacks and arguments? It is called emptiness.

You are a bad student of atheism, you dont even read your books to know more about your religion. You have Aleister crowley and so many people you can look up to.

Firstly, my stance isn't just against Christianity, I'm of the opinion that proclaiming a deity as the source of life and to whom Moral and ethical code of conduct are derived.
Is nonsensical. Religion, as we have it either, proclaims a God or numerous gods that we can say purposed life and has the ultimate plan.

These religions with Christianity being one that proselytizing and populism is a core function of a believer makes it more worrisome.
If you were a Muslim I would I've argued accordingly if you were a Buddhist, a Hindu amongst others I would have argued accordingly. However, as we have it here in Nigeria, Islam and Christianity are the
two most widely practiced religion spreading this falsehood of perverted history and insidious claims with no argument as facts.

In this case;
You asked why I spend more time arguing with Christians and why can't I just face my unbelief in the malignant, stereotypical, impenitent conceptual God you claim to know.
because you Guys won't stop bringing it up everywhere. In schools, in politics etc. Lying to Children, denying them right to proper self-identity and awareness. Claiming monopoly on morality., Justifying gruesome acts with the Lord's name. Teaching false stories as facts that needs to be believed without criticism.

I said it before, I will say it again. Religion has been giving a free ride for too long without being Checkmated.

Knowledge without Spirituality is Dead??. Maybe. But I'll like to bring to your attention that there wouldn't be Spirituality without knowledge. What you claim to carry about in Religion is unjustifiable,
widely untrue dogmas left for ages unchecked. What is preached isn't even a matter of truth, it's about believing in the matter regardless of empirical evidence to prove the case with factual certainty and history.

I'm a bad student of Atheism?. Lol, all you need to be an atheist is disbelief in Theistic concept. Atheism is not a religion. Let me be even more clear about my person, you could consider me an atheist, but more specifically, I'm an anti-deist. Maybe you read more than i do, i wouldn't know. I don't work as an atheist and I read at least a book in a week cutting across my profession, history, biography etc.

[Before I go further on discussing spirituality as a topic, we might need to clear the meaning of the term itself.]

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Are Ignorant Of The Facts That Proves God's Existence by FTF2069(m): 5:06pm On Jan 06, 2019

I'm appalled at how religion has taking hold of our brains such that we no longer see the reality and how this vicious and viral pill called religion is a barrier to our progressive mentation as well as it being a threat to our moral and ethical sustenance. Anyone who is educated should be able to perceive the disadvantages of religion. The disadvantages of religion outweighs the advantages.

Religion has been given a free ride for too long particularly in this part of the world without being checkmated. Every other thing can be criticized except your “God”.

I’m sure there’s is an innocent, naive child out there being brainwashed into this mental slavery and totalitarian cults called religion. Some fanatics will try to defend their religious convictions saying; my xyz is not a religion it’s a relationship with God. My brothers and sisters, there is no known God in the heavens whom you owe any explanation, judges your thought and is responsible for your existence, let no one deceive you. I’ve met too many persons wallowing in guilt (born of the original sin they call it), depression, expecting a messiah whom has being in existence before the foundations of the earth to come and redeem. These fairytales from various religious sects with no arguments are even more insidious as they are being told to our children as facts.

The problem i observed with religion is that it’s not being seen for what it is.

As a race and as a being capable of processing thought, i think we are an endangered specie thanks to the Fanatics. The night is dark and full of evil, thanks to our Lord for he/she/it has ordained it to be so and it is by those he has elected that his kingdom of light shall be established. Cut the Crap you fanatics.

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Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Are Ignorant Of The Facts That Proves God's Existence by FTF2069(m): 5:04pm On Jan 06, 2019*

jesmond3945:
i live in europe and i can tell you Christianity in africa has been corrupted and i understand how you feel.

>>>It's not about being in Europe, religion across the world share similar template. Religion is more like a meme.

Infact if there is anyone who should be an atheist is me becuase i have gone deep into the field of knowledge

>>> The more we know the more we should know we don't know much.. That should even make you more careful in judgement but no, religion claims to know everything, ascribing gaps in knowledge to some diety's omnipotence

Knowledge without philosophy is bullshit. I don't know what field you're trained in. But if you're trained in any field related to social science or pure science you're just a victim of the viral pill like so many out there.

but I know without Christ being in your state of mind is a miserable journey. I have done that and I am no more interested to be an atheist.

>>> Once again this is victimy being displayed, I've met too many people like you wallowing in helplessness and guilt. I guess when you "were" an atheist maybe you became one out of rebellion, gross insurbodination of religious moral code etc. Not out of genuine touch with history, human sociology, political and religious evolution, proper mentation and solid philosophy.

Your life would be hollow and empty. What do you think is your purpose?

>>> Concerning the maps of meaning for an atheist, the fact that no holy book was dedicated to atheism doesn't mean there isn't purpose. Atheism is not for dump people trust me, neither is it for the weak at heart. The lack of a definite and wholistic maps of meaning is why some of you people who understands the falsehood of religious cult don't have the balls to say so. I hope I have more time to talk about this later on.

So you just appeared and would one day dissapear. Then why not kill self instead of waiting to dissapear because there is no point of you being here.

>>> This is just stupid

Christianity Etc › Re: Atheists Are Ignorant Of The Facts That Proves God's Existence by FTF2069(m): 12:31pm On Jan 06, 2019

Vrengkat:
First, I am not lying, I don't lie, unlike you believers your pastors. I don't want to stress this point cause I'm not proud of it, but i won so many souls...

I'm normal, we were all born with reason and scientific curiosity, but no one was born with religion, we are brainwashed into it

I did not say I'm not an atheist, check again... I said I don't like being referred to as an atheist, i'm just a normal guy.

Jesus did not die on any cross, no historical evidence shows this, and the Romans keep records of everything

Check again bro, I promise you, you will get millions of videos of pastors who became atheist on the same YouTube, these are people who have everything to lose coming clean...

I don't care what your friends believe in, all I know is reason... I'm a realist

I don't believe in any spirits, witchcraft, amadioha, djinee etc.

When I savoured the bible, I was a believer that time... I can't read that crap now, while I have creative writers like Shakespeare to engulf.

Paul did not listen to people, but he listened to God and became the greatest follower earth had ever seen.

The grasses do not adore him bro, they just exist, survive, and die. Also why did your Bible forget to mention that trees to entered the ark, you know trees are living things to, and most can't survive under water right?

It's funny how much you are sweating right now, I did a better job defending Jesus(when I was a Christian) than you right now

Thank you @Vrengkat. The whole point of Christainity and God. Dwells a lot on the person of Jesus who the Christians claim to have lived. For you Christians out there let it be know to you that the proof of existence of this man you called Jesus is close to nothing, manipulation of facts and nothing else. The prophecy was manipulated, his birth and situation surrounding it has been debunked timed without numbers. The isreali archeologist conceded that there is no other evidence or record outside of the bible to support the book of Exodus for instance.

Maybe a deluded rabbi whom the illiterates in the middle east believe to be close to God did exist. But the story of Jesus as it appears in the book called Bible is a fabrication of events that not only did not occur but was crafted purposefully with intent to manipulate history in order to preserve its religious ego.

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Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 12:02am On Jan 06, 2019

bizza45:
Dude if u are looking for attention go to 3rd main land bridge or better go and look for pant to thief u will get all the attention u need

I bet you can't handle the thought of God not existing.

The severity of this virus is what is being displayed by your comment.

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Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 11:55pm On Jan 05, 2019

I need not to proof that God doesn't exist. The corpus you carry as the word of God crafted by con artist; men like you and I to make sure you don't see the reality in front of you.

Do you think every word in that book claimed to be from God is true. A woman got pregnant without copulation and her child is the son of the most high. Or that the prophet is sent from the Good Lord to lead us aright.

Christianity Etc › Re: God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 11:37pm On Jan 05, 2019

solite3:
Are you talking of religion or God? How Can What Does Not Exist die? Can you prove God does not exist?

I meant that figuratively. The death isn't like a human dying.
It's to express the idea that proper education and enlightenment killed the possibility of belief in God or any gods having ever existed in our heads.

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Christianity Etc › God Is Dead. God Remains Dead. by FTF2069(op): 11:13pm On Jan 05, 2019

Yes you read it right: “God is dead”.

I just created this account after about 2 years since i deleted my previous account. Although i try to browse through nairaland as often as i can for news, information and education, i do so as a guest. I’m however appalled at how religion has taking hold of our brains such that we no longer see the reality and how this vicious and viral pill called religion is a barrier to our progressive mentation as well as it being a threat to our moral and ethical sustenance. Anyone who is Educated should be able to perceive the disadvantages of religion. The disadvantages of religion outweighs the advantages.

Religion has been given a free ride for too long particularly in this part of the world without being checkmated. Every other thing can be criticized except your “God”.

I’m sure there’s is an innocent, naive child out there being brainwashed into this mental slavery and totalitarian cults called religion. Some fanatics will try to defend their religious convictions saying; my xyz is not a religion it’s a relationship with God. My brothers and sisters, there is no known God in the heavens whom you owe any explanation, judges your thought and is responsible for your existence, let no one deceive you. I’ve met too many persons wallowing in guilt (born of the original sin they call it), depression, expecting a messiah whom has being in existence before the foundations of the earth to come and redeem. These fairytales from various religious sects with no arguments are even more insidious as they are being told to our children as facts.

The problem i observed with religion is that it’s not being seen for what it is.

As a race and as a being capable of processing thought, i think we are an endangered specie thanks to the Fanatics. The night is dark and full of evil, thanks to our Lord for he/she/it has ordained it to be so and it is by those he has elected that his kingdom of light shall be established. Cut the Crap you fanatics.

I’m an atheist but more specifically an anti deist. The purpose of this post is to create an awareness, spark a discussion, make a case that theism isn’t above criticism and as far as i’m concerned it’s nonsensical, spiteful and a debasement of the human spirit.

Thank you. You may bite me...

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