Sheniqua, thank you my dear - I spoke from the heart.

Xiomarra, your posts have me laughing too much!     But yes, I am comfortable in that I know what I want and (hopefully) how to achieve it, according to MY OWN schedule. 

Thankfully, I am nowhere near being "old cargo" yet!

I think the "politically correct" answer is probably "YES"  

The reality is, as some previous posters have said, it depends on your definition of "poor".  If it means someone with no ambition, drive or sustainable dreams, then for me, it will probably mean NO.  I am all for supporting someone with ambition etc, but that will not pay the mortgage, school fees or utilities!  It also depends on the woman's socio-economic class and what she is used to (either because she comes from a wealthy family, or has a high standard of living) when she meets the guy.  This topic is close to my heart because I used to be the kind of woman who said it didn't matter what the guy earns.  But previous relationship experience made me wake up and understand that it DOES, and also that love is NOT everything.  Having worked, earned my own money and being able to afford a good standard of living for myself (before marriage), once I am married, I want to stay at home and raise my children for a few years after they are born.  I can't do that if my husband is not earning enough to sustain that way/standard of life.  Clearly, however (with reference to 'spermdrops' post), there are several other factors which make for a healthy and happy marriage.

In addition, I think it has to do with gender/genetics/culture/society - house husbands is a new concept but growing in countries like the UK and USA

It is probably less of an issue in the reverse (man marrying poor lady) 

I can really relate to this thread    I am a so called "big girl" who is currently unmarried.  This is not completely by choice, but due to a number of (reasonable) factors:  I was raised (strict Caribbean background) to obtain an education and develop my career before marriage.  I am glad I did this.  I think I will be a better mother and wife when the time comes.  These days, a woman cannot and should not wait on a man to "complete" her dream.  It is my view that the right partner does not "complete" you, but compliments you.  Consequently, I purchased my home, progressed in my career, worked on becoming a better person and generally got on with enjoying my life as a single (but not necessarily looking) woman.  Although I am now ready for marriage and motherhood, I would not have done it a minute sooner.  I am glad I have had the opportunity to obtain my education and learn more about myself before committing 110% to marriage, partnership and family life.  I will never resent being a homemaker/housewife (if that is what my husband and I decide) because I have been out there and have experienced what it is like to be truly independent.  God's willing, I will have all the time and energy to devote to my husband and children, having already achieved what I set out to in life as a single, independent woman.  Whilst I value independence, it is possible (and desirable) to submit to the right man who has proved himself capable of being the head of the household.  Depends on your definition of "submission though:  in my world, it means learning how to give and take - one person can't be right all the time!  Clearly, the same skills that work for me in my career and my particular line of work will NOT always work in a marriage.

All that being said, I am in love with an amazing  Nigerian man who compliments me beautifully.    We are planning to be married in the near future.  Better late (I am in my early 30s) than never . 

If I had to do it all over again I would wait for the right man, rather than "Mr Right Now".

ps:  However, I do believe the following general (clearly there are exceptions) statements are true about dating and partnership in the 21st century:
1) The more successful a woman is, men are sometimes more intimidated to approach her
2) Love is NOT everthing - partners need to be equally "yolked" (no significant economic, cultural, religious or social disparities)
3) There is a perception that it is easy to divorce if you're just "not feeling him/her" anymore
4) Women are sometimes unrealistic in their expectations of black men
5) Game playing/mind games is considered MANDATORY
6) People meticulously and painstakingly prepare for their weddings, but NOT their marriages
7) There is a general lack of 'old school' patience and humility - we (particularly women) want everything & it must be perfect NOW

pps: Marriage is NOT for everybody!   So, we must all with the help of God individually work on making ourselves happy, because although husbands/wives/lovers/partners can facilitate our happiness and wellbeing, they cannot and do not create or define it for us.

Holla!!!! So what do we now that we have "hooked up"?

2 October

osegwu: true words indeed.

na2day?: Heeeyy, thanks for your no doubt generous offer am gonna have to get my friends to talk to your friends and maybe we can BE friends (from Notorious B.I.G. track "Big Poppa "

The truth is this is VERY painful, but God's willing I will come through the other side.

Thanks for your support

one more thing!!
u guys are like centuries apart!!!
imagin!!!!! the chasm between nigeria and the uk, and u expect him, to be faithful to "the cause".
girl!!! OUT OF SIGHT IS OUT OF MIND". when he is with u, he concurs but when he is in nigeria in the mist of his folks, his thoughts change.
forget all those fairytale stories about love

- I'm sure you're right. I guess it was unrealistic for me to think that he would be "faithful to the cause". But why start all of this in the first place?? We both knew the deal and had long, long, long, talks about the viability of a long term/long distance relationship. That was ahy him coming to UK was really important to solidify our partnership.


meanwhile don't forget the "nigerian factor - an igbo man".
his pride/home folks/friends (guys) will advise him that as u are the higher income earner, you will proberbly pull the strings in the home (suppose u guys tie the knot).so he bailed, not liking the future.
Every nigerian man dreads that scenario talklesss of an igbo man!!!!

- Well, I guess I can't argue with the cultural factor but the way I was raised (Caribbean and Caribbean parents), it doesn't matter who earns more, it is still a partnership. Even if my man earns less than me, he is still the man of my household provided that he has demonstrated he has earned that title (in other ways). My ex's behaviour is not that of a man but a child. At least be man enough to say that it won't work. Just don't dissapear. He doesn't owe me anything so there is no reason (in my view) to avoid me or "the talk". But maybe I am being unrealistic and am in fantasy land. It is difficult being a professional woman. You try to be reasonable, understanding, loving and it still gets you nowhere. Oh well. Thanks for your views, kobikwelu.

na2day?: Thanks for your views and support. I still maintain that pregnancy was not the foundation of our relationship. In any event, it all matters not because the way he chose to deal with the whole situation means that it is a futile consideration. It's over, no contact, no relationship. Peace.

na2day?:  Perhaps you are right.  But it was not quite like the way I expressed it.  I believe in marriage before children, but we both had personal reasons for why we would have equally been happy if I became pregnant.

"lawyer" thank you for your views. You are probably right that I have been "dealt with" but there are few misconceptions you appear to have about my relationship which I will seek to address:

(1) the whole "groundnorm" of the relationship was NOT marriage - in fact it was not first brought up by me, it was the guy. I simply mentioned it in the post to give some an indication of how serious we both perceived the relationship to be.

(2) Our courtship time was sufficient for us to make our decisions about how we thought we wanted to plan for our future. That is not really something I expect you would understand and I maintain it is personal to each couple. Yes of course, people should spend time getting to know each other, but in some instances (and it is in fact my view) it doesn't take long to work it out.

(3) I was not "economical" with the truth, with respect to the last conversation I had with him. The conversation was entirely positive. But obviously I can't read his mind so he clearly had an agenda I was not aware of.

(4) I did NOT do "shakara". I don't need to swear it. I am not Nigerian in any event but it is something I really don't do in relationships. If he fails to respect me because I didn't, then clearly he was the wrong person for me. End of.

I feel that you drew many inferences from my post which were in fact incorrect. It is difficult in such a forum to highlight each and every occurrence which may or may not be relevant, so I can understand that you feel you know me or him, and completely understand the situation. But the reality is, you don't. That being said, I am glad that it was able to provide you with some amusement. Thank you for your point of view.

Kenny: you could be right but we have only ever spent a brief period of time together (on holiday in Spain), so there is very little that he could have deduced from that experience to turn him off in that way. However I appreciate that you were speaking figuratively.

Hey Monsho: I didn't give him an easy ride so much as I offered to have his back in whatever way. He told me that the last girl he planned to marry eventually married someone else because she couldn't wait for him while he tried to get his new business off the ground. He told me that it hurt because he loved her and I vowed to be different. Maybe that was my downfall because the truth is I don't know everything she went through before coming to that decision. My problem with him is not that he is having problems, but just that he refuses to talk and his behaviour for me seems shady. I am extremely principled (I think) and only really tend to understand black and white and not much in between. I like to know what the bottom line is at all times but all he seemed to speak was the language of variables. So even when I begged him to tell me what the problem was he just said he needed to sort out "the plan" to make sure we could be together for life. And I was totally totally down for that. But when your man starts ignoring your calls and pretending like you don't exist, maybe you need to read between the lines. And, BTW, that is the real reason I don't call. Believe you me, I have tried the "lets have a serious heart to heart" route but it didn't really get me anywhere. He just reassured me and then there has been NOTHING. The reason his sister got involved is because she lives at one of the houses that I have the number to. So when I kept calling his cell and work numbers with no response, then I called to see if he was OK. It is so painful to be so far away and not know what is happening with your loved one. And in that way he has been unforgivably selfish. I think I have been humble but I suppose it is not for me to assess that: I definitely wasn't on the marriage tip; we wanted to have a child together and I told him that notwithstanding the way I was raised, I would be cool with getting pregnant before marriage, providing marriage was on the cards. I simply left it as whatever God has in store for our partnership. He was cool with that. He is not "loaded" in my view. If anything, I am the one who is financially better off and more independent. So, I love him because we were/are emotionally, spirtually and culturally compatible. The attraction is off the hook and we share the same values. Anyway, seeing as it is perfectly obvious that I am being given the "brush off", I wrote him a long e-mail setting out my feelings and that I could no longer continue as things are. If I ever meant anything to him, it may touch him and at maybe at some point I will get the explanation I so desire. Maybe he will come back. Who knows? At the end of the day, only God and time will reveal the ultimate answer. I can only pray for the strength to get through this experience.

Hi na2day?

Good looking out brother. The truth is I really don't know if his "story" is real but all the indications are that it is 4 real - but I do appreciate your offer to help. However, I suspect he has got to deal with it in his own way and on his own terms. I have to respect him in this way and therefore not interfere. In fact, the only way I can help him is in terms of getting sponsored to come to London. But he refuses and his pride. I guess sometimes pride is stronger than love. It is very painful like you said, but there is little that I can do, thanks for your kind words and advice. I will definitely keep you posted.

He didn't get any stress - I've passed that stage in courtship and it's not how I handle my biz in relationships. Don't believe in wasting people's time, but I appreciate your views. But you are right, everything in life is a cycle. Peace.

True, I think I have been dumped. There was daily calls/texts/IMs in tne beginning and then things changed. I asked so many times if we should just cool things but I was constantly reassured. Now it has been over 4 weeks since contact. He avoided my calls so I eventually stopped making the effort. Our last conversation was upbeat and we even talked about marriage! So, needless to say it is a hurtful way to go about things and I am devastated. Believe me, it is better to be up front and honest. Any other way (especially because I think this is a guy thing although I do recognise some girls do it) is in my view cowardly.

4Him,

Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. I was afraid that might be the reality of my situation but he knew my circumstances when we first met so I really don't understand why it is such a problem now. I was/am prepared to be totally down for him and have his back but he isn't even giving me the chance to do that. Oh well. I still care very deeply for him and probably will for some time to come. If we are meant to be it will happen for us. I guess all I can do is get on with my life and pray that happiness will not elude us. Cheers,

One thing I forgot to add which may (or may not) be relevant is that there is certain level of financial disparity between us.  I own my home and am completely financially independent and am a qualified professional.  He has a business in Lagos but he has advised me that things have been dificult and business is not doing so well.  This has been independently verified by his Sister and other things I have discovered - so I am satisfied he is not feeding me a line about that.  Although we did have a lovely holiday together in Europe where he completely looked after me (and paid for everything), I wonder whether his principles prevent him from "stepping" to me and finalising marriage plans unless/until he is fully established? Is this dictated by culture/tribe to any extent? We had a "make or break" conversation in January 2008 where he told me the issue was not his love for me but the "plan", which came down to him and I having a viable future together.  So what I am wondering is whether this is a plausible explanation or just an excuse?  But why wouldn't he just tell me the truth? Perhaps I could assist.  BTW, although I know he does not have his own home in Lagos, he has NEVER asked me for money or assistance in any way.  Principled and proud or just plain disinterested??  Again, Nairalanders, I value your time in reading my lengthy posts and offering any advice or guidance which might give me some insight into my situation.  Peace.

Hi guys, my situation is pretty much like the other ladies on Nairaland - met a lovely Igbo guy, fell in love, I didn't do the whole "shakara" thing and everything was beautiful for about three months until he started to change.  He claimed that he was going through some difficulties so I initially took his word for it although due to past experiences where I have been hurt I was a little afraid that this may just have been an excuse.  I still kept calling because I didn't want him to think I was simply going to abandon him because he was having problems.  He insisted that he still loved and wanted to marry me but he needed to "sort some things out" and wanted to make sure everything would be in place for a marriage between us.  Anyway, things eventually ground to a halt the day after Valentine's day.  We had a great conversation, spoke about marriage and me visiting him in Nigeria (I'm in London - he's in Lagos) and then, NOTHING.  No calls, no texts, no e-mails.  I decided to back off to see if he would intiate calls but so far I have had no response.  I haven't been calling because I have some pride! I have come to the conclusion (I have no choice I think) that it is clearly OVER but tell me, is this a common thing that Nigerian guys do?  I have NEVER been in this position before. If things are not working out I have always been taught to be up front and straightforward. Men I have dealt with in the past have pretty much always shown me that level of respect so his behaviour baffles me (he is the second Nigerian guy I have dated). I would have thought (and expected) that he would at least advise me that it is over or tell me what the real problem is.  I asked so many times in the past if he wanted to cool down on things or if he simply wasn't feeling me any longer - he said NO.  I asked if he needed space, but he insisted that was not the issue.  He is adamant that he will come to London on his own terms (think he was denied his visa earlier this year) and refuses to ask my help (which I initially admired) because he doesn't want my friends or family thinking he is using me for immigration.  He just said that I should wait for him here in London (but wouldn't I be foolish to do that?). I have said so many times that all that matters is what I think and not anyone else - if I agree to marry him and him acquiring his UK citizenship is a product of that, so be it.  To be fair, things cooled down after our plans for him to come to London did not work out (like I said before I think he visa was actually declined). I know this might sound so naive so please forgive me but could there be any GENUINE explanation for his behaviour?  What if after months of non-contact, I move on and he comes back into my life and says I should have waited for him?  I am a young professional in London with my own home and he is a thriving businessman in Lagos - we are in my view well matched.  I am seriously confused.  It all started well and the answer seems obvious except my intuition tells me there is more to the story.  ps:  I know he is not married or seeing anyone in Lagos and I speak to his Sister fairly regularly although she has not been able to shed much light on the situation (she thinks if he doesn't want me he would let me know).  I know I have written an eyeful but would really appreciate nairalanders' views.  Thanks!!!!

funkybaby,

Thank you so very much for your advice! I will call him and advise him to make this call to hear what has happened, I suspect he may have been declined.

Thanks again

Hi!  I know this is not the ideal thread for this question but this thread seems to have the most activity relating to UK visas - my other half applied for a visa in December and like to know how long it is taking to process visas.  I think he has applied for a normal tourist visa but possibly also a business visa in order to travel to the UK.  I just don't understand why it is taking so long for him to hear about his visa - it has been nearly eight weeks!! Has anyone had any similar experience??  Grateful for any advice you can offer,