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I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! - Religion (2) - Nairaland

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Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by tpia: 11:14pm On Dec 22, 2008
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Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by PastorAIO: 11:28pm On Dec 22, 2008
tpia:



you mean you're really a pastor?

and unfortunately, no one is reinventing the wheel here.

Nothing on this thread which anyone can't find out for themselves while doing research.

And most people have heard of ifa at some time of the other.

na even Hispanics dey do ifa pass. How's that for migration. Our ancestors' gods also migrated to greener pastures. They like foreign currency too, just as much as their human subjects.

Itefa can mean ifa stepping on someone, but this particular construction seems more like the other way round,imo.

Sorry o! I thought you were interested in having a conversation about traditional religion. I wasn't aware that you were being aggressive. I feel the aggression now. I'm not claiming to offer you anything that you cannot research on the web. Even me, I got most of it on the web and from books that I bought and various awos that I've met and discussed with. I never claimed otherwise.

I'm also not competing with anyone to do Ifa pass them. If hispanics want to do Ifa that is their perogative.

If itefa means stepping on Ifa then perhaps that is what they do. They go into the grove and step on Ifa. Na you be de agbedegbeyo o!
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by Kuns: 11:30pm On Dec 22, 2008
@Pastor Aio

E soo

agba ato

ire o
,
,
,

Ope ni fun olorun

Iba Kori,

Iba Ajala Mopin,

Iba Aludundun-Orun,

Iba Odo-Aro, ati Odo-Eje,

Orun Ori nile, e oo jiyin,

e oo jabo oun ti e ri
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by spikedcylinder: 7:21am On Dec 23, 2008
All these yoruba things you are typing Pastor Aio, what are the interpretations? Thats what I meant when I used the " ".
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by IDINRETE: 8:37am On Dec 23, 2008
aboru aboye

Ogbon sawo mawi
oro bologberi mamo
adifa fun alukoso aye
abu fun aludundun orun
nijo ti won ntikole orun bo wa ikole aye
won ni ki won sakaale
ebo ni ki won o wa se
nje alukoso aye se o ngbo o
aludun dun orun se on gbo o
ototo la yan eda o o to to

ela boru ela boye ela bo sise
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by olabowale(m): 9:40am On Dec 23, 2008
The Ifa man will be poor in this life and hereafter! His cloth will be " pon bi Aparo ni", and in the day of Judgement will be thrown into the fire. I guess he will make his ifa work for him, in the fire of Hell.
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by PastorAIO: 11:13am On Dec 23, 2008
olabowale:

The Ifa man will be poor in this life and hereafter! His cloth will be " pon bi Aparo ni", and in the day of Judgement will be thrown into the fire. I guess he will make his ifa work for him, in the fire of Hell.

Whatever you say Alhaji! . . . if it floats your boat.

spikedcylinder:

All these yoruba things you are typing Pastor Aio, what are the interpretations? Thats what I meant when I used the " ".

I translated everything that I wrote, at least as best I could.  Look again at the posts you replied too and you will find the translations interjected between the verses. 

Or perhaps even with the interpretations you won't understand because as Idinrete puts it:
IDINRETE:

aboru aboye

Ogbon sawo mawi
oro bologberi mamo
adifa fun alukoso aye
abu fun aludundun orun
nijo ti won ntikole orun bo wa ikole aye
won ni ki won sakaale
ebo ni ki won o wa se
nje alukoso aye se o ngbo o
aludun dun orun se on gbo o
ototo la yan eda o o to to

ela boru ela boye ela bo sise


Wisdom does Awo and doesn't reveal (speak of it)
Words meet the uninitiate (ologberi) without registering as knowledge.

1 Like 1 Share

Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by IDINRETE: 11:41am On Dec 23, 2008
olabowale:

The Ifa man will be poor in this life and hereafter! His cloth will be " pon bi Aparo ni", and in the day of Judgement will be thrown into the fire. I guess he will make his ifa work for him, in the fire of Hell.


Agbigbo ni fiye apa s'elu legan
Adifa fun Akala ipapo
eyi ti n selenini bara petu
Ida olominrinmirin ki yun ni lorun tii
gbogbo eni ti o ba nse elenini Ifa
Ida olominrinmirin asi ma yun won lorun


Ela boru Ela boye Ela bosise
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by spikedcylinder: 1:39pm On Dec 23, 2008
Oh ok.
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by tpia: 5:37pm On Dec 23, 2008
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Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by omolawo: 12:44am On Dec 24, 2008
Wow, I seem to have stirred some lively discussion! As for my own standing - although my foot was indeed "pressed to the Earth" in igbodu Ifa, I am hesitant to call myself a Babalawo. I merely stand in the shadow of my venerable Oluwo and serve Ifa according to my own level, so I am more comfortable with the title Omolawo for me.

Brother Pastor, here is a question for you,

I have visited Ifa worshiping communities in North America, South America and the Caribbean. Ifa practice seems to take on a regional flavor wherever you find it's adherents (in a sense, this can be said of Islam as well). I personally LOVE Yoruba culture: food, music, language, traditions, customs, etc. I think it is impossible to understand Ifa independent of Yoruba culture. Do you agree? Or do you feel that Ifa can be practiced/understood apart from the cultural decorum?

Happy to read your responses!

Ore re,
Omolawo
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by bawomolo(m): 4:56am On Dec 24, 2008
see all the emi esu. i rebuke yall in jesus name. loruko jesu. now scatter grin grin
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by Kuns: 7:41am On Dec 24, 2008
Our people are confused, why are they equating Esu with the European concept of Satan.

When the opposite is the Case? This is what the western religion has done to our minds, In Yoruba the precept of Esu Alagbara is not to be confessed with the con-cept of Devil and Satan at postulated by the european westernized religion of Christianity.

Esu is the messenger of Olodumare,  The europeans studied our culture deeply and still do then said that Jesus (Jesu) is the messenger of Olodumare (God as mis-translation by the europeans).

ESU = J[b]esu[/b] Phonetically it is the same sound.

Esu, Oga La luu = Big man in the Town, the jesus also a big man in town.

Atobajaiye eleso Ogun = One who has powerful medicine = Jesus healing the sick, raising the dead, opening blind eyes, he had power that could sustain life atobajaiye.

Esu a CHIEF deity (God) to the Yoruba (Oba Ajiki) = Jesu is a chief (deity).

Esu = lord of the crossroad = Jesus said No man gets to the father, except through me.


Know that they (European elites) have studies in all our mystery schools and still do too this very day in 2008.

This is what you call cultural fusion, taking the way of life of your subjects (occuiped territories) and fusing (fusion) the religion (to tie into) of the occupier (invader, colonizer). The Romans used this when they invaded Greece and Culturally fused the two cultures giving them Jesus from Zeus.

Know the greeks would not easily give up their culture, so they culturally fused their myths into Greek mythology,which led to christianity. So if the greeks complain about this new religion they will say Zeus is Jesus, they look alike, zeus was God and Jesus is God so what's the problem.

This is also what has happenened in our case as well with Esu and Satan. Esu is a attribute or aspect of our nature (as individual) that may test us, however, this is not to be confused with Satan.
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by PastorAIO: 2:02pm On Dec 24, 2008
tpia:


you're the one being aggressive here.


I asked if you were really a pastor and you seem to be dodging the question.

My point about the hispanics practicing ifa is- just as ifa was imported to Yorubaland/upgraded to the state religion in olden days, its also been exported to other parts of the world in a similar way. So I wouldnt really say Nigeria has it on lockdown. Many ifa priests transfer the religion together with its "secrets", to other places. I think it would be stretching the truth somewhat to assume there's no financial incentive involved. Just like with every other religious system.

what's an agbedegbeyo? its rather tiring continually asking for these translations.

Wha'eva!!
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by olabowale(m): 2:31pm On Dec 24, 2008
@Pastor AIO: « #38 on: Yesterday at 11:13:40 AM »

Quote from: olabowale on Yesterday at 09:40:47 AM
The Ifa man will be poor in this life and hereafter! His cloth will be " pon bi Aparo ni", and in the day of Judgement will be thrown into the fire. I guess he will make his ifa work for him, in the fire of Hell.


Whatever you say Alhaji! . . . if it floats your boat.

May Allah give me enough money to buy a large fleet of boats; Trowlers to do industrial fishing in Nigerian and international waters. Also to do shrimps. Bigger and more efficient than whats in Forest Gump! Amin.

Then to buy a yacht for the enjoyment purposes. Islam is not boring. Pastor and co, you will be welcomed to come aboard, minus the Ifa and "aso Pipon bi aparo!" If we continue to be friendly, it will be possible. Okun and Osa will be our route. Bi oko ba re okun, bo re osa, a pada si ebute. Not ebute meta o. The yacht will be too big to leave the sea.
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by PastorAIO: 2:36pm On Dec 24, 2008
omolawo:

Brother Pastor, here is a question for you,

I have visited Ifa worshiping communities in North America, South America and the Caribbean.  Ifa practice seems to take on a regional flavor wherever you find it's adherents (in a sense, this can be said of Islam as well).  I personally LOVE Yoruba culture: food, music, language, traditions, customs, etc.  I think it is impossible to understand Ifa independent of Yoruba culture.  Do you agree?  Or do you feel that Ifa can be practiced/understood apart from the cultural decorum?

Happy to read your responses!

Ore re,
Omolawo  

Does Christianity survive migration across cultural boundaries?  Does any cultural artifact survive migration across cultural borders?  As a cultural artifact, I believe the answer is no!  However if the subject is Truth, absolute essential Truth then this is something that remains regardless of circumstance like Oyigiyigi.  Religion as a cultural artifact can have allusion to the Truth yet we must not lose sight of the fact that it is a cultural artifact and as such is subject to all the factors that influence cultures.  

Ifa has persisted in Africa through many generations in which the cultures it is a part of have slowly evolved.  Is the Ifa practiced today the same Ifa that was practiced 200years ago.  Some like to say that Ifa verses are ancient Truth, but really?  I'm more inclined to believe that such verses about the Whiteman on the Sea front came about when yorubas encountered Europeans who came by Sea.  So the white man had his boat docked on the waterfront and he came ashore to do business.  This happened a few hundred years ago so I do not think that that ifa verse is so ancient.  I've heard verses explaining the origins of the Telephone in Ifa too.  

What I get from this is that Ifa is dynamic and adapting to the changes in culture.  So why cannot that adaptation include migration to other parts of the world.  Ultimately this is a matter of Identity.  Can Ifa in Cuba be said to be Identical to any extent with Ifa in Nigeria?  Can Ifa in the present day be said to be identical with Ifa of 200 years ago?  

My interest in Ifa is also largely cultural.  I love the philosophy, the songs, the poetry of it.  But I also love the various cultural artifacts of other cultures too.  I'm fascinated by the Tantric traditions of India, for instance.   Yet apart from these Artistic/Aesthetic considerations there is also the matter of Truth.  Religious Truth.  While I believe that all religions have, to varying degrees, some allusions to Truth, I do not believe that they contain Truth in their forms.  Truth is Absolute Being, yet religious forms are subject to Becoming.  

So in response to your question whether Ifa can be practiced outside the yoruba cultural context, I ask, "What is Ifa, and what is the Yoruba cultural context?  Are these fixed things that can be defined and fixed or are they in constant state of flux and without boundaries?"

2 Likes

Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by PastorAIO: 2:40pm On Dec 24, 2008
olabowale:

@Pastor AIO: « #38 on: Yesterday at 11:13:40 AM »
May Allah give me enough money to buy a large fleet of boats; Trowlers to do industrial fishing in Nigerian and international waters. Also to do shrimps. Bigger and more efficient than whats in Forest Gump! Amin.

Then to buy a yacht for the enjoyment purposes. Islam is not boring. Pastor and co, you will be welcomed to come aboard, minus the Ifa and "aso Pipon bi aparo!" If we continue to be friendly, it will be possible. Okun and Osa will be our route. Bi oko ba re okun, bo re osa, a pada si ebute. Not ebute meta o. The yacht will be too big to leave the sea.

God bless you my brother. May you achieve what you aspire for. Boats, trawlers, Yachts et al. And by the grace of God you won't forget me at that time and I will be a welcome guest. Amen
Re: I'm Establishing an Ifa Temple! by ilaugh1: 2:42pm On Dec 24, 2008
may ifa chop of your dik@Poster.

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