Honor Killings - Islam for Muslims - Nairaland
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| Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 11:02pm On Oct 05, 2009 |
Respected Nairaland Islamic scholars, Assalamu Alaykum wa Rahmatu Allah wa Barakatuh. Honor killings are very rampant in Islamic nations. What does Islam say about honor killings? Does Islam really have a concept of honor killings, most of the victims here are females; so does Islam really order to kill females in the name of honor? |
| Re: Honor Killings by Abuzola(m): 11:27pm On Oct 05, 2009 |
Never heard of that, the arabs used to kill a female child because they believe they bring misfortune , it was islam that forbade it and gave them equal right. It is unislamical to kill anybody except adulterers, murderer and an apostate |
| Re: Honor Killings by luvola(m): 1:29am On Oct 06, 2009 |
so if u yur wive commit adultery ,u gonna kill her ? abuzola 1 Like |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 1:46am On Oct 06, 2009 |
[size=14pt] Honor killing[/size] From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia An honor killing (also called a customary killing) is the murder of a family or clan member by one or more fellow family members, where the murderers (and potentially the wider community) believe the victim to have brought dishonor upon the family, clan, or community. This perceived dishonor is normally the result of (a) utilizing dress codes unacceptable to the family or (b) engaging in certain sexual acts. These killings result from the perception that defense of honor justifies killing a person whose behavior dishonors their clan or family. Honor killing is mostly widespread in Islamic countries or countries with predominantly Muslim populations.[1] The United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) estimates that the annual worldwide total of honor-killing victims may be as high as 5,000. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing |
| Re: Honor Killings by olabowale(m): 2:29am On Oct 06, 2009 |
Aloy.Emeka is playing a believer by his Salaam. Well Mister, "wa aleykum!" There is nothing called honor killing in Islam. Just like there is no Gold tooth in Islam, but some people cap their teeth, while Allah says no tooth Binding, or sharpening. The prophet (AS) said no usage of Gold for men. But the shortage of men wearing Gold necklaces, etc, is not in my Yorubaland and other places, I must say! There is no honor killing because Islam prohibits killing, as if any death is like snoofing off all mankind, and rightly so, since mankind becan with just one man; Adam! What you find are the traditional ethnical killings based on arrogance, and complete ignorance laced with humongous anger. |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 2:54am On Oct 06, 2009 |
olabowale: Explain this quranic verse and Hadith please: Quran- 4:15 “If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, take the evidence of four (reliable) witness from amongst you against them; if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them. Or God ordain for them some (other) way.” Now some sahih hadiths: Bukhari: Volume 7, Book 63, Number 196: Narrated Abu Huraira: A man from Bani Aslam came to Allah's Apostle while he was in the mosque and called (the Prophet ) saying, "O Allah's Apostle! I have committed illegal sexual intercourse." On that the Prophet turned his face from him to the other side, whereupon the man moved to the side towards which the Prophet had turned his face, and said, "O Allah's Apostle! I have committed illegal sexual intercourse." The Prophet turned his face (from him) to the other side whereupon the man moved to the side towards which the Prophet had turned his face, and repeated his statement. The Prophet turned his face (from him) to the other side again. The man moved again (and repeated his statement) for the fourth time. So when the man had given witness four times against himself, the Prophet called him and said, "Are you insane?" He replied, "No." The Prophet then said (to his companions), "Go and stone him to death." The man was a married one. Jabir bin 'Abdullah Al-Ansari said: I was one of those who stoned him. We stoned him at the Musalla ('Id praying place) in Medina. When the stones hit him with their sharp edges, he fled, but we caught him at Al-Harra and stoned him till he died. (See also Bukhari: Volume 7, Book 63, Number 195.) |
| Re: Honor Killings by olabowale(m): 3:44am On Oct 06, 2009 |
@Aloy.Emeka: The issue of adultery is an illegal sexual inetrcouse by a married person with somebody he/she is not married to. Thats the worst type of illegal sexual act. For example, if its a woman that commits this illegal sex, her husband will be so hurt that he would wish that the woman dies. If its the husband that commits the illicit sex, then am sure the woman would wish he dies. This is the nature of human beings. No one wants the spouse to cheat, so Allah orders what all wish in their hearts when in this difficult situation, because it is fair and appropriate Justice! So stoning is a deterrance for illicit sex. You know a married person has no reason for sex outside the matrimonial bed. Now the Quranic verse above from Surah Nisaa speaks about "until death comes to them or Allah makes another way" simply means that everyone will die, in this case a natural death, and not that she would be killed, because below ahadith already gave you the insight of how stoning may occur. The Allah makes another way means that the other conditions that happen in life of marriage when there is a problem may occur, they reconcile, or truly may not be able to reconcile and people go their separate ways. |
| Re: Honor Killings by Nezan(m): 12:50pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
@olabowale, you dare deny honour killings? are you well versed in sharia law? why are you denying the basic aspects of sharia law .  . . ?2 Likes |
| Re: Honor Killings by olabowale(m): 12:59pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
by Allah, i know honor killing is not part of Islam!. i hope you are not confusing stoning of adultery male or famale to honor killing. by the way whats honor killing to you? |
| Re: Honor Killings by Nezan(m): 3:05pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
Do you know that if a son or daughter recants islam, the immediate family orders him/her to be killed to restore honour to the family name? You will deny because yoruba is not a completely muslim territory, that is why when the chips are really down, a yoruba muslim is just another kaferi to the northern muslims. 2 Likes |
| Re: Honor Killings by muhsin(m): 4:34pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
In a much hurry, I said it once to you, Aloy.Emeka and I'll say it again: that "thing" called Honor Killing is utter unislamic and its not in Islam. Only Arabs illiterates do it and in mostly villages. Again, there is a world of difference b/w that and adultery as I see you quoted one hadeeth up there. That is phenomenally irrelevant. BTW, do you believe in everything content in wikipedia encyclopaedia? Just curious to know. Thanks |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 6:11pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
muhsin: There are instances where an Arabian diplomat was arrested in South America for honor killings. many Arabians are in US jails for honor killings and they always relate it to their Islamic background. Are these people all illiterates?. If Honor killing is a barbaric act, why is the sharia infested middle east not chopping off heads of the so called traditionalists that still practice it especially in Saudi Arabia? |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 6:16pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
Nezan: I know a yoruba muslim boy who is a staunch muslim. He is from ogbomosho but grew up in kano. We lived in the same room during NYSC camp and all these while, I took him for an hausa boy until he told me one day that he is not hausa. He clearly alienated himself from his ethnicity in order to be fully accepted into the islamic caucus of the north. His Yoruba insignia will only make him look like a kaferi. You are right. It's like the so called igbo muslim, they will remain novices till the end of time and I doubt if they will agree with many practices in islam. Forget Muhsin, he is an online muslim but when the real need for his islamic faithfulness arises, you will know why hausas refer to yoruba muslims as keferi. It is wrong tho, because the likes of jarus and Olabowale to a large extent is an embodiment of Islam and thinking they are hypocrites is just wrong. 2 Likes |
| Re: Honor Killings by GEW: 6:18pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
muhsin: muhsin:surprise surprice. your wonderful moslems kill their girls in london in the name of honour too. do you regard london, UK as a village too? 2 Likes |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 6:19pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
GEW: I was wondering why they pretend not to know anything about honor killings. 2 Likes |
| Re: Honor Killings by Ohsisi: 6:32pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
muhsin: You are a blaady liar !! see below When she was just 19, Sandeela Kanwal traveled from America to Pakistan for an arranged marriage to a cousin twice her age. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,391531,00.html It happens in Egypt,Pakistan,Afhanistan,Iran,Turkey all Arab countries and wherever Islam is mentioned. They transport it to America and other parts of the West. There are cases in France,London,Germany,Netheralands.All by Muslims It is not an Arabic thing. It is Islamic Islam sanctions killing of women for "crimes against chastity",these honor killers are only obeying the laws of Islam. |
| Re: Honor Killings by Ohsisi: 6:53pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
Read up the story of Sarah and Amina Said (pronounced Sayed) here in the USA first the pictures of the 2 cute girls hacked to death in honor killing by their own father http://images.google.com/images?sourceid=navclient&rlz=1T4ADBS_enUS276US278&q=sarah+and+amina+said&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=zITLSp7PLImQtgfNz_zaAQ&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=5 |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka9: 7:35pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
Ohsisi:Jehovah Nissi!!!!. This is heinous. |
| Re: Honor Killings by Ohsisi: 7:49pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
Mr. Said immigrated to the United States from Egypt in 1983 and was granted U.S. citizenship in about 1997. Family members said he met and married his wife, Patricia, 36, when she was about 15 years old, while he was working as a convenience store clerk in Tarrant County. Their three children were born in quick succession. Connie Moggio, Mrs. Said's sister, said his controlling and violent nature gripped the family from the start. Once, he shot out the tires on his wife's car to keep her home. Another time, Mrs. Moggio said, he blocked her car in a driveway because he thought she was going to help her sister and children escape. Eventually, friends and family members say, Mr. Said moved his family from Euless to Lewisville to break up his daughter and her boyfriend. Some Muslims believe that it can be religiously acceptable for Muslim men to marry non-Muslim women but that it is never acceptable for a Muslim woman to marry outside the faith. Friends said the sisters suffered quietly through a life controlled by their father, a life in which social interaction with their peers was forbidden. One friend said Mr. Said installed spy software on the home computer and plotted with a relative to tap the phone lines. Sarah never shared her address with her closest friends for fear of what her father might say or do if they came by the house, said Zohair Zaidi, a devout Muslim whom Sarah turned to in her quest to become more religious. Still, Sarah knew her father would have disapproved of their friendship, primarily because Mr. Zaidi is male. On Christmas Day, Mrs. Said, her daughters and their boyfriends fled the state. They stopped at a relative's house in Kansas and then rented an apartment under an assumed name in Tulsa. Mr. Said had filed a missing persons report with Lewisville police on Dec. 26. Mrs. Said called Lewisville police Dec. 27 to tell them she and her daughters were safe. The report reads: "Patricia stated that she was not going to call back again, as she was in great fear of her life. Patricia said she is very fearful of her husband harming her and/or her children, which is the reason she left her husband. Patricia further advised she and her children, Sarah and Amina, are just fine, and are going to continue hiding from her husband." The next day an officer filed a reported recommending the case be closed, citing an interview with one of Mrs. Said's relatives. "Patricia had told her that since they are Muslim that the daughter was only allowed to date other Muslims. Yaser had found out she went on a date with a non-Muslim and became very angry and threatened her with bodily harm. This concerned Patricia because Yaser has been violent in the past and Patricia was afraid that Yaser would severely hurt their daughter. At that time Patricia decided it would be best to leave her husband and take their daughters and go into hiding." On New Year's Eve, Mrs. Said and her daughters returned to Lewisville. Amina told her aunt that her mother lied to her, saying the trip was to put flowers on their grandmother's grave. Mrs. Said told police she felt guilty about leaving her husband. Sarah wore a brown sweatshirt with yellow puppies when she left with her dad to go to dinner on New Year's Day. Amina had on a tan hooded jacket with fur trim, similar to one she's wearing in a photo on her MySpace page. A headline on the page reads: "I don't want to , become a memory." read the story about how this scum shot his own daughters to death. http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/stories/011008dnmetteenskilled.7ba7cc6.html |
| Re: Honor Killings by Abuzola(m): 8:24pm On Oct 06, 2009 |
@ALOY & co, all u are saying is bullshit, d fact umaru fornicated should nt b generalize, produce a hadith if u truthful |
| Re: Honor Killings by AloyEmeka3: 12:26am On Oct 07, 2009 |
I believe I've already produced one above. What else do you need? Osisi also posted a long list of incidences on the relationship between Islam and honour killings. Did Osisi make up those stories? |
| Re: Honor Killings by Abuzola(m): 8:35am On Oct 07, 2009 |
How on earth can you merge Hadith of adultery by stoning and killing for honor ? Haba |
| Re: Honor Killings by GEW: 10:23am On Oct 07, 2009 |
BIN ABUSOLA, if at 22 you are this daft i wonder what you will be at 40 that is you grow old to be 40 cos you would have joined booko haram then |
| Re: Honor Killings by Abuzola(m): 10:28am On Oct 07, 2009 |
GEW, what have i done to deserve ur bullshit, for rejecting honour killing ? |
| Re: Honor Killings by GEW: 10:51am On Oct 07, 2009 |
why would you want to waste more 18yrs here on earth when you have 70virgins waiting for you in paradise? |
| Re: Honor Killings by RichyBlacK(m): 11:56am On Oct 07, 2009 |
Abuzola: This Abuzola fellow must be a complete an utter fool! A solid idiot! It is arrogant imbeciles like you that make Islam look like a relic to be ignored in the stone age dustbin of history! While sensible people have discarded the barbaric aspects of their religions, goons like you still hold on to these stone-age beliefs about killing people who refuse Islam. How foolish can you be? If the youths of today cannot reason without bring up despicable aspects of outdated belief systems, how on earth are we going to resolve crises that could be tied to religion? If all Christians and Jews behaved like your ignorant bloodthirsty ass, Palestine and Saudi-Arabia will be wiped out in 60 seconds! However, many Christians and Jews put aside barbaric religious views and champion the cause of the Palestinians based on the fundamental principles of human rights, due process, justice and equity; concepts alien to scoundrels like Abuzola. It is Muslims like you that work against Muslims suffering in Palestine, Darfur, Somalia and Northern Nigeria. With foolish arrogant bloodthirsty beliefs spinning in your blocked head, why won't so many non-Muslims profile Muslims as terrorist and suicide bombers? Can some sane Muslim talk some sense to this charlatan called Abuzola? Nonsense! |
| Re: Honor Killings by olabowale(m): 1:34pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
While sensible people have discarded the barbaric aspects of their religions, goons like you still hold on to these stone-age beliefs about killing people who refuse Islam. How foolish can you be?You must be an irreligious person, and you found your match in women among the Somalians (remember your girlfriend among them?). Are you better than Moses who said an eye for an eye? Is any Jews better than him, yet they discard the law that he brought to liberate them and allowing the rightful owner of properties to assume that their properties are secured and cant be taking away and deprived them of the benefit without recourse? Are you better than Jesus or is any Christian better than him as he had instructed that the laws should be respected and acted upon without mising a single jot, yet they deviants walked away from it? Please spare me your own kindness which I am certain that when push really comes to shoving, you will shove hard and with venom! If the youths of today cannot reason without bring up despicable aspects of outdated belief systems, how on earth are we going to resolve crises that could be tied to religion?Whats outdated about Islam? Is it the fact that Abuzola said that doers of evil should die that you are complaining about? Tell me this then; if a man is determined to kill you as he broke into your home, with a knife against your jugular, will you not kill him, if you have a gun to stop him? If you will not, I hope that you realise that you do not value your own life, how then will you value the lives of others; lets start from people who are dear to you, rather than arbitrary and remote faces. They say charity begins at home, and the greatest in your home among mankind should be you. No? If all Christians and Jews behaved like your ignorant bloodthirsty ass, Palestine and Saudi-Arabia will be wiped out in 60 seconds! However, many Christians and Jews put aside barbaric religious views and champion the cause of the Palestinians based on the fundamental principles of human rights, due process, justice and equity; concepts alien to scoundrels like Abuzola.You think it is not the desire of the Christians and Jews to wipe out these places, indeed all the muslims? Please give me a break. In all the kindness of America, it is only by Allah's grace that we Muslims after 911 did not find ourselves in concentration camps like the interment camps that they had for the Japanese in the 2nd WW or what the Nazis did for the Jews, the same that Israel and their zionist agenda have created by snaking walls between neighbors in palestine, and america was doing the same in Iraq just the past 2 years! Please come out of this self delution of Christianity and Jewish combo against islam! If Islam in its "stone age" mentality have not stood firm against One World Order agenda of Papa Bush and the cronies after him, by now we will be expect microchips imbedded in the bodies of new borns, and before long, the whole of Nigeria is just a "town" at best a region under this evil regime that is going to even sell water to the people whose bloodline have been natives of the land where the water flows! So that you know; a military general, a congress man and many church Televangelists in America wanted to attack Makka. We said let them go, since their god or gods is or are bigger and more ppowerful and of greater resources than Allah. I was very confident that the Lord of Kaaba will defeat them as He did of the army of Abraha and his elephant; the tank of its time when sword was the biggest weapon of choice! It is Muslims like you that work against Muslims suffering in Palestine, Darfur, Somalia and Northern Nigeria. With foolish arrogant bloodthirsty beliefs spinning in your blocked head, why won't so many non-Muslims profile Muslims as terrorist and suicide bombers?What did he say, in the above that he deserved such a summary ugly painting of his person from you? The fact that people should be killed for proven adultery and not fornication which the Jewish law that Jesus vowed to ever keep relevant demand? Do you think Islam should change to accept your type? No. Islam was complete and relevant at all time. Proof; No one woman or man whose spouse is caught in illict sexual act will not wish death or some great evil on this person right there and then! Please dont be a bleeding heart liberal. It is what cost Michael Dukakis the American Presidency against VP Bush in the days, when he said he will not retaliate agaisnt a person who killed his wife, or do his family some great harm! And the whole of palestine and these places mentioned, are not all practicing Muslims or muslims for that matter. Some of them are worse than outright disbelievers. They are hypocrites, not making salah on time, etc! Can some sane Muslim talk some sense to this charlatan called Abuzola? Nonsense!Whats there to say when you have said it all? And whats stone aged about following and obeying God and being humble to Him? |
| Re: Honor Killings by muhsin(m): 1:58pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
Hi there! I "enjoyed" reading all the crap written by Aloy.Emeka, GEW and Ohsisi. Those words deserve nothing but to rightly be consigned into trash for they are horrible jargons. LOL  Lets reason it along; if Honor Killing is truly Islamic why is there NO Qur'anic verse or Prophetic tradition that in whatsoever sensible way support it? That hadeeth you brought, Aloy.Emeka, is phenomenally talking about something else. . .but you shamelessly enough fail to see that plain truth. Yet you are proudly under a frayed facade attributing it to Honor Killing. How unfair of you? I challenge you to bring fourth any prove supporting your allegation. . .if you fail, then you are just being saying horse shit (am sorry to use the expression). Waiting. . . @RichyBlack, I personally kinda feel disappointed in you after reading that your reply above. Wallahi, i.e. I swear with my Creator Allah, you are (or were?) on of the NL members I respect very much. I read your writings. . .and I think you might know me as I frequented your child-board in recent time. Please take it easy. Thanks |
| Re: Honor Killings by Nezan(m): 4:34pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
If muslims are so ashamed of their practices to the extent of denying them as unislamic, then why still remain muslim? |
| Re: Honor Killings by MrCrackles(m): 4:37pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
Topic I dont really think the honour killing thing is a muslim/islam thingy. . . . We can argue it is rampant in muslim dominated countries but i still believe the bottom of it has to do with cultural beliefs and practises! |
| Re: Honor Killings by jaybee3(m): 4:39pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
MrCrackles:GBAM  |
| Re: Honor Killings by muhsin(m): 4:50pm On Oct 07, 2009 |
Nezan: If its Islamic, simply prove that. |
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