₦airaland Forum

In my archdiocese's newspaper they said Anglican rite

^ trash

What I'm saying is the behaviors of a pope is not conditioned by his predecessor. period

Each pope is different, so is each papacy, you are only trying to draw stupid lines and moronic conjectures. Our popes don't come to do what Peter used to do they come to follow the teachings of God ,our doctrines and lead us .period

Sal C: Simply put, since God is omnipotent, he is capable of doing anything at which ever point he chooses. I spoke in riddles but hope you will understand.

got u , seems so obvious now

idnoble135: Says the Bible and it over rides every thought and assumptions of men.
This is my take to you.

dude where and when Mary died ? How ? Who and what killed her ? Lmao funny people

woky: lolzz i tot his ur son

Yeaa, we must bring him back on the right path

I gave the evidences here, please take the time to scroll up before jumping on me and bringing us back behind. The virginity of Mary and her assumption have been proved beyond any doubt

I can't*

Kamsy10: My friend d op observed you right and he took the words out of my mouth.you've opened 47 threads between October 1st and now.
You get work so? And some are plain silly posts


Meanwhile I ask again: which church do you attend? I really want to know

Shame dey worry him, u know their business ventures can have very funny names, ask peppy luv

Ubenedictus: facebook keep away from d bolded arguement

can you please elaborate?

ledafaze: Who is this Olodo Preacher? Do you think you are jokers in here? Who wrote the book of James? And mind you... Mary was disflowered by the birth of Jesus and she never remained a virgin...

Gosh!

Your comment doesn't worth any meaningful answer . Contradictions upon contradictions.

[quote author=lana_Vello]As dead as the dead sea
josh...nostalgia?[/quote]please go back to your chatbox u are clearly not a Christian

Yoruba Muslims are considered as fake muslims this a worldwide known fact, they go to the,mosque on Friday and visit babalawo the day after . Most ritualists and organs traffickers in yorubaland are Muslims. Why are you playing fool here? Or maybe the people answering here are all Yoruba Abeg go ask Hausa/northerner Muslim what he thinks about Yoruba muslims .

@op some simply don't see Yoruba holy/pure/honest whatever that means enough to lead the prayers.
Is it wrong I don't think so , I can not attend a mass done by a fornicator .

Joshthefirst: Morning guys. I'm having that feeling one gets when he listens to christmas songs and sees decorations...I've forgotten what its called.



Pope. Mary gave birth to Jesus' brothers. Mary was a woman. Mary got filled with the spirit. Mary died. Do not be misled. Take this to another thread please.

May God forgive you .

Jesus' brothers? Smh
Mary died ? Arrant nonsense, are saint dead ? (Answer this question)

idnoble135: Only the first is true. All others are false.

says who?

[quote author=lana_Vello]so you're saying joseph didn't touch mary till death and her hymen remained sealed?!? wow.....just hearing of that erhhmmmm...do i call it ideology now...[/quote]there's a beginning for everything sir .

BERNIMOORE: computer or nairaland is not the issue here, but clearly catholic traditions and practices are Allien to what the alledged pope "apostle peter" practice and belief, and this further shows that there was no iota of truth that peter was linked to the catholic!

because you cant show any evidence!

your analogy doesn't make sense so because Peter and john Paul were not wearing the same things/clothes it means John Paul is illegitimate? Ah ah don't kill me with laughter. Every pope are free to put their papacy
under a specific saint .

Peter is the first pope and therefore linked to catholic church stop throwing punches in the air, you can't fight the obvious

Logicboy03: A and B arew okay
C is false.....gimme time to research and redfresh my cathecism

if you need time, you don't have to reject it

C is true and while I don't believe one is more than the other, I'm afraid to say c is the most important here . Anyway Take your time bro

What's the Anglican rite? , shouldn't former Anglican priests be forced to divorce(contradiction I know) before joining the Catholic church?

I know Christian unity is Part of God's goal for us , however I think it wrong to accept married people and allow them to become priest. I'm always happy to see people embracing Catholicism but this time ehn I feel so so

BERNIMOORE: @italo

The catholics alledged that apostle Peter, is the first pope(no biblical basis for that except catholics own tradition), but Peter never mention the “Virgin Mary”? in all his letters. Not only did he not mention her, but zero nothing is said by peter apostle about the need to venerate or worship her. This fact speaks volumes against the Catholic’s view of Mary because;

All popes worshipped Mary and leaned on her for salvation, and they have, and if Peter was the first pope, why does he not praise and adore Mary in the same vein as other popes?

peter did not prostrate to mary's idol in any shrine! no record of that!

Did he ever mention nairaland or computer? Nonsense

Logicboy03: Abeg.....pope.....teacher no teach me nonsense.

As a catholic before, I thought that the doctrine was that mary is called a virgin because she gave birth to jesus as a virgin......not because she is or remained a virgin because jesus had half brothers

she's called a virgin because
A) before giving birth to our Lord she was a virgin
B) during she was a virgin
C) after the birth of our lord she remained a virgin and ascend to the heaven as a virgin .
So which nonsense am I teaching?

Jesus doesn't have brothers .

[quote author=Mr. Aladin]should i paste all?[/quote]I think so ,or try to copy it(the link) right

[center]inity of Mary

The Greek word for brother in the

well-known

The

adelphos.

is

Testament

Protestant linguistic reference An Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words [by W. E. Vine], defines it as follows:

Adelphos: denotes a brother, or near kinsman; in the plural, a community based on identity of origin or life. It is used of:

1. male children of the same parents . . .

2. male descendants of the same parents, Acts 7:23, 26; Hebrews 7:5; . . .

4. people of the same nationality, Acts 3:17, 22; Romans 9:3 . . .

Luke

neighbour,

a

man,

any



5.

10:29; Matthew 5:22, 7:3;

6. persons united by a common interest, Matthew 5:47;

by a common

persons united



7.

calling, Revelation 22:9;

8. mankind, Matthew 25:40; Hebrews 2:17;

by

so,

and

disciples,

the



9.

implication, all believers, Matthew 28:10; John 20:17;

10. believers, apart from sex, Matthew 23:8; Acts 1:15; Romans 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:4; Revelation 19:10 (the word sisters is used of believers, only in 1 Timothy 5:2) . . . 202

[202 Vine, An Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words, Vol. 1, 154-155.]

range

the

from

evident, therefore,

is



It

possible definitions of adelphos, that Jesus' "brothers" need not necessarily be siblings of Jesus on linguistic grounds, as

commentators, learned and unlearned, seem to assume uncritically. By examining the use of adelphos and related words in Hebrew, and by comparing Scripture with Scripture

the

determine

can

one

("exegesis",

sensible explanation of all the biblical data taken collectively. Many examples prove that adelphos has a very wide variety of meanings:

* In the King James Version, Jacob is called the "brother" of his Uncle

The

29:10).

29:15;

(Gen.

Laban

same thing occurs with regard to

14:14

(Gen.

Abraham

and

Lot

11:26-27). The Revised Standard Version uses "kinsman" at 29:15 and 14:14.

* Use of brother or brethren for mere kinsmen: Deuteronomy 23:7,

Samuel 1:26, 1 Kings 9:13, 20:32, 2

34:9,

Jeremiah

10:13-14,

Kings

Amos 1:9.

* Neither Hebrew nor Aramaic has a word for cousin. Although the New Testament was written in Greek, which does have such a word, the literal rendering of the Hebrew word ach, which was used by the first disciples and Jesus, is indeed adelphos, the literal equivalent of the English "brother." But even in English, brother has multiple meanings as well.

Moving on to more direct biblical evidences of the perpetual virginity of Mary, we discover the following facts:

* In Luke 2:41-51: the story of Mary and Joseph taking Jesus to the Temple at the age of twelve, it is fairly obvious that Jesus is the only child. Since everyone agrees he was the first child of Mary, if there were up to five or more siblings, as some maintain (arguing, for example, from Matthew 13:55), they were nowhere

This

time.

this

at

found

be

to

passage alone furnishes a strong argument for the implausibility of the "literal brothers" theory.

* Jesus Himself uses brethren in the larger sense. In Matthew 23:8 He calls the "crowds" and His "disciples" (23:1) "brethren." In other

other's

each

are

they

words,

"brothers" (that is, the brotherhood of Christians). In Matthew 12:49-50 he calls his disciples and all who do the will of his Father "my brothers."

27:56,

Matthew

comparing

By



*

Mark 15:40, and John 19:25, we find that James and Joseph --mentioned in Matthew 13:55 with

Jesus'

as

Jude

and

Simon

"brothers" -- are also called sons of Mary, wife of Clopas. This other Mary (Matthew 27:61, 28:1) is called Our Lady's adelphe in John 19:25 (it

two

were

there

that

likely

isn't

women named "Mary" in one family -- thus even this usage apparently

distant

more

or

"cousin"

means

relative). Matthew 13:55-56 and Mark 6:3 mention Simon, Jude and

and

James

with

along

"sisters"

Joseph, calling all adelphoi. Since

least

at

that

sure

for

know

we

James and Joseph are not Jesus'

likely

most

the

brothers,

blood

interpretation of Matthew 13:55 is that all these "brothers" are cousins, according to the linguistic

At

above.

discussed

conventions

the very least, the term brother is not determinative in and of itself.

* Firstborn: the use of this term to

"second-

had

Mary

that

assert

borns" and "third-borns" proves nothing, since the primary meaning of the Greek prototokos is "pre-

is

David

illustrate:

To

eminent".

described by God as the firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth (Ps. 89:27). Likewise, God refers to Ephraim (Jeremiah 31:9) and the

Israel (Exod. 4:22) as "my

nation

firstborn." Jesus is called "the

in

creation"

all

of

firstborn

Colossians 1:15, meaning, according to all reputable Greek lexicons, that he was pre-eminent over creation, that is, the Creator. The Jewish rabbinical writers even

Bekorah

Father

the

God

called

Shelolam, meaning "firstborn". Similarly, God is called the "first" in Scripture (Isa. 41:4; 44:6; 48:12; cf.

are

Christians

21:6-7).

1:8;

Rev.

called "the firstborn" in Hebrews 12:23. Literally speaking, however, among the Jews, the firstborn was ordinarily the child who was first to open the womb (Exod. 13:2), whether there were other children or not. This is probably the meaning of

case

which

in

1:25,

Matthew

hypothetical younger children of Mary are not implied at all, contrary

present-day

standard

the

to

Protestant assertions.

* Mary is committed to the care of the Apostle John by Jesus from the Cross (John 19:26-27). Many Protestant interpreters agree with the Catholic view that Jesus likely would not have done this if he had brothers (who would all have been younger than he was). Many Church

interpretation,

this

held

Fathers

including St. Athanasius, St. Epiphanius, St. Hilary, St. Jerome, and St. Ambrose, and used it in the

perpetual

Mary's

of

defense

virginity.

* Catholics believe that Mary's reply to the angel Gabriel's announcement that she would bear the Messiah, at the Annunciation --"How can this be, since I have no husband?" (Luke 1:34) -- indicates a prior vow of perpetual virginity. St. Augustine, in his work Holy Virginity (4, 4), wrote: "Surely, she would not say, 'How shall this be?' unless she had already vowed herself to God as a virgin . . . If she intended to have

have

wouldn't

she

intercourse,

asked this question!"

These conclusions are not merely the result of "Catholic bias" and special pleading, as many charge. For example, the prominent Protestant Commentary on the Whole Bible comments on Matthew 13:55:

An exceedingly difficult question

these

were

What

arises:

here

"brethren" and "sisters" to Jesus? Were they, first, His full brothers and sisters? Or, secondly, Were they His step-brothers and step-sisters,

former

a

by

of Joseph

children

marriage? Or, thirdly, were they His cousins, according to a common way of speaking among the Jews

collateral

of

persons

respecting

descent? On this subject an immense deal has been written, nor

means

any

opinions yet by

are

agreed . . . In addition to other

best

the

of

many

objections,

interpreters, . . . prefer the third

Thus dubiously we

.

.

.

opinion

prefer to leave this vexed question, encompassed as it is with difficulties. 203

[203 Commentary on the Whole Bible, Robert Jamieson, Andrew R.

editors,

Brown,

David

&

Fausset,

Grand Rapids, Michigan: Zondervan, 1961 (originally 1864), 928; emphasis added.]

Matthew 1:24-25: "Joseph . . . knew her not until she had borne a son."

This verse has been used as an argument that Mary did not remain a virgin after the birth of Jesus, but the same Protestant source also comments:

The word till does not necessarily imply that they lived on a different footing afterward (as will be evident from the use of the same word in 1 Samuel 15:35; 2 Samuel 6:23; Matthew 12:20); nor does the word firstborn decide the much-disputed

any

had

Mary

whether

question,

children to Joseph after the birth of Christ; for, as Lightfoot says, "The law, in speaking of the firstborn, regarded not whether any were born after or no, but only that none were born before." 204

[204 Ibid., 882; first emphasis

Timothy

1

8:22,

Romans

added.

4:13, 6:14, and Revelation 2:25 furnish four further examples of a similar meaning of until.]

John Calvin used this very argument

establish the fact of Mary's perpetual virginity, which he believed (based primarily on Scripture alone), as did Luther, Zwingli, Bullinger, and many later prominent, theologically conservative, and scholarly Protestants (such as John Wesley). No one had ever denied this doctrine until the late 4th century, when one

with

unsuccessfully

tangled

Helvidius

Jerome. Calvin appealed to St. Jerome in his own commentary on this issue, and the issue of Jesus' supposed blood brothers did not come up again until the last few centuries, in

often

has

criticism"

"higher

which

employed to question traditional interpretations of the Bible.[/center]

woky: i pray he accept the truth



you knw say truth no dy sweet

he can't lmao

^ the link can't b opened.

[quote author=lana_Vello]speaking of forefathers,i honestly doubt if you know yours talkless of speculating abt mine.
I didn't say i don't believe mary's virginity,read my question again[/quote]you implied, I hope you know what it means

Sorry I don't teach lazy students and I don't entertain lazy people. There's no straight answer here, it is a doctrine+a dogma nothing to summarize either . She's called virgin because she's . is that straight enough for you ? Happy?

DK Jaleel: Jesus was guilty of offence no 1, 6 and 11...

how dare u ?

woky: True teachers are those who use themselves as bridges over which they invite their students to cross


pls dnt teach what you dont practice

so true

[size12pt][quote author=Mr. Aladin]From the Annunciation to the
Crucifixion of her Son, Mary can be
seen as God's ultimate validation of
free will. The Virgin Mary's obedience
to the will of God as conveyed to her
in the angel Gabriel's message was no
less voluntary in its affirmation than
the disobedience of the virgin Eve had
been in its negation.

In the 2nd
century St. Irenaeus the Bishop of
Lyon and a second generation disciple
from the Apostle John wrote: "...so also
Mary, betrothed to a man but
nevertheless still a virgin, being
obedient, was made the cause of
salvation for herself and for the whole
human race. [...]. Thus, the knot of
Eve's disobedience was loosed by the
obedience of Mary.

What the virgin
Eve had bound in unbelief, the Virgin
Mary loosed through faith." Against
Heresies, 3.22.4, Irenaeus, Bishop of
Lyons.

Mary, as the first human to kiss the
face of God and the first to believe in
Jesus as her Savior, took her place in
Salvation History as the first Christian.
She is also the one disciple of Jesus
who didn't flee or doubt when all the
others fled and doubted, but who
stayed and accepted to the very end
the burden of being under the Cross.
Down through the ages the weeping
Mary of the Cross witnessing her son's
torture and death stands in solidarity
with all believers who also suffer and
live under the shadow of the Cross.


The gift of Mary to the Church was
Jesus' last human act from the Cross.
He placed His mother's care in the
hands of the only apostle present at
the cross, the Apostle John, "Seeing his
mother and the disciple whom he
loved standing near her, Jesus said to
his mother, 'Woman, this is your son.'
Then to the disciple he said, 'This is
your mother.' And from that hour the
disciple took her into his home." [ John
19:26-27] This is one of only two
scenes in which Mary is present in
John's Gospel. The first is the
narrative of the Wedding at Cana in
chapter 2 of John's Gospel. These two
scenes in which Mary is present have
several things in common. First, Mary
is addressed as "gunai" [from the
Greek gune] or "dear Woman" by
Jesus in both scenes; second, she is
never called by name but only
identified as "the mother of Jesus";
and third, in both cases a "new family"
is formed: at Cana by the wedding
itself and in the second scene in John
chapter 19 a new family is formed by
a kind of adoption in which "the
beloved disciple" takes Mary as his
mother and in the greater sense, as
the mother of Christ's family, the
Church--a role she continues to fill to
this day.


It is Mary who bridges the Old and
New Testaments. The Old Testament
records God's plan for man's salvation
in His preparations to make the world
ready for the Incarnation. Of all the
tribes of the earth He chose a
particular people to whom He reveals
Himself. He nurtures and instructs
them through His prophets in order
for them to be able to recognize the
Son of God when it was time for Him
to come. In order to accomplish this
He takes these people to Himself in a
covenant bond, establishing worship
based on sacrifice to prepare them to
understand the ultimate sacrifice that
the Son of God would offer for the
salvation of man, for these people
would be the conduit through which
the message of the Son would be
carried to the world. And when the
time came, from among these people,
He chooses a woman from a certain
preordained family, the house of
David. It was absolutely necessary that
she be set apart in her purity and
virtue so as not to make the
Incarnation of the Son of God a
sacrilege and so she is conceived
without original sin and set apart in a
holy state of purity and perpetual
virginity.

This is Mary's role in Salvation History:
ever virgin and yet fruitful mother. It
is Mary, a daughter of the Old
Covenant, who is not only the bearer
of Christ in the Annunciation but Mary
also "labors" in prayer in the Upper
Room with the other disciples for the
birth of the Church at Pentecost for
the New Covenant believers will
become her spiritual children. She
stands as the Christian model, which
we should all emulate. From her
obedience at the Annunciation to the
events of Christ's passion she
illustrates for us a model of Christian
virtue, faith and obedience as she
remained true to Christ and His word.
Her fidelity shows us that true faith
can be preserved in one individual and
down through history the Church has
honored her for this by considering
her the mother of the true remnant of
Israel in the New Covenant Church. It
has been as Mary prophesized, filled
with the Holy Spirit, "Yes, from now
onwards all generations will call me
blessed!"


After the descend of God the Holy
Spirit at the second great Pentecost
[the first was the revelation of God at
Mt. Sinai], the Apostle John spread the
Gospel of Jesus Christ first with Peter
in Judea and later in Asia Minor,
serving many years as the Bishop of
Ephesus. According to tradition Mary
accompanied John to Ephesus and
lived there several years.
Unfortunately the years after Christ's
Resurrection were years of intense
persecution for the early Church, first
from the Jews and later from the
Romans. Many documents written
before Christianity was protected by
the Edict of Milan [early 4th century]
were destroyed. For example the
great Church Father Origen wrote over
6,000 books of which only a few
copies now survive. The great library
at Caesarea in Palestine and the
Church library at Alexandria, Egypt,
which we know contained numerous
works from the first centuries of the
Church, were destroyed in the 7th
century AD Moslem invasions just as
the great libraries in Rome were
destroyed by successive barbarian
invasions in the 5th century AD. The
result is that we do not have reliable
information on Mary's later years.
However, surviving works like The
Protoevangelium of James [James was
the first Bishop of Jerusalem and
kinsman of Jesus] written sometime in
the last of the 1st or early 2nd century
and a several other documents do
contain information about Mary's early
life. Although rejected as non-
canonical in the 6th century, The
Protoevangelium of James provided
the names of Mary's parents Anna and
Joachim, [honored as saints by the
Church] as well as material for many of
the most important medieval legends,
artistic representations and
theological beliefs about Mary.
While Scripture reveals nothing about
Mary's death, St. John Damascene [died
749] recorded a story reportedly
shared at the Council of Chalcedon in
451AD that Mary had died in the
presence of the Apostles but when the
tomb was opened they found it empty,
"wherefrom the Apostles concluded
that the body was taken up to
heaven." From this testimony the
Church has taught that Mary was
assumed bodily and now tastes the
Resurrection for which all Christians
hope. This teaching is one of the four
dogmas, or truths, of Mary held by the
Church[/size].[/quote]

Holy Virgin Mary, mother of God and queen of heaven pray for us .

woky: mornin bro


hw ur nyt

pretty good my brother , what about yours?

Sal C: POPEII how is vatican this morning?

I'm actually giving the papal blessings , Vatican is cold tho