₦airaland Forum

Bishopkingsley:
Lol

MaxInDHouse:
You really tried with your scriptural points but there are deeper things you should look into before answering thought provoking questions of that nature!

Enoch and Elijah were humans meaning they are descendants of Adam and undoubtedly must have inherited sin through Adam {Romans 5:12} according to God's word the wages sin pays is DEATH {Romans 6:23} so there's no way any human born of the lineage of Adam can escape death! John 3:13
Jesus said that out of all those who lived from the time of Abel till John the baptist none is greater than John the baptist {Matthew 11:11} which means neither Enoch nor Elijah could have had any privilege before God that's more than what John had.
So it means these two people were hidden from the face of those who knew them in order for people not to know how they died or their grave. That's exactly what God did to Moses, if it wasn't recorded that Moses died and was buried by angels of course the Israelites will never believe that such a person can die. Remember God's word said there was no ISRAELITE prophet greater than Moses {Deuteronomy 34:10} therefore they both died but their corpses were hidden from people!

AntiChristian:
I wonder how Jesus could do all this and still be lesser than his Father?

He is 100% God and 100% man! Which makes 200% God man. But his father remains at 100%. Jesus can even do many things his father can't do! He can shit. He can live in the human womb, pass through the birth canal, be protected by other humans, Eat, drink, feel hunger, die, cry, receive lashes of beating and even worship his father! I don't think the father can do all this!

But why do you say he is 100% man when man can sin? If Jesus can't sin then he's not 100% man.

And Jesus when alive with his 200% God-man status was still limited in knowledge! And when he died the God part didn't die but the human part died yet he remains human but with no blood cos the blood was shed...!

How does all this makes sense to you guys?

Liposure:
On the contrary:https://www.gotquestions.org/John-Baptist-Elijah.html

livingchrist:
@ bolded It was recorded that moses died
Joshua 1:1
Now after the death of Moses the servant of the LORD it came to pass, that the LORD spake unto Joshua the son of Nun, Moses' minister, saying,
But enoch and elijah didnt die

MaxInDHouse:
Were they also part of the descendants of Adam?
Were they free from sin which wage is death?
What did Jesus say about humans going to heaven?

If you think deeply about these point you don't need anyone to tell you that no human has ever lived on this planet without seeing death! John 16:12-13

livingchrist:
Are you saying God prevent a man from dying if he so wish?

I believe Elijah and enoch are the two witnesses that will be returned to the earth during the tribulation period they will eventually be killed by the antichrist but would be raised again and taken up to heaven.

Kobojunkie:
So, are you saying that Jesus Christ was wrong in saying that John the Baptist was indeed Elijah returned?
Either you believe Jesus Christ lied or He didn't, so which one is it?

Liposure:
remember Elijah appeared Christ while he was alive

AntiChristian:
I wonder how Jesus could do all this and still be lesser than his Father?

He is 100% God and 100% man! Which makes 200% God man. But his father remains at 100%. Jesus can even do many things his father can't do! He can shit. He can live in the human womb, pass through the birth canal, be protected by other humans, Eat, drink, feel hunger, die, cry, receive lashes of beating and even worship his father! I don't think the father can do all this!

But why do you say he is 100% man when man can sin? If Jesus can't sin then he's not 100% man.

And Jesus when alive with his 200% God-man status was still limited in knowledge! And when he died the God part didn't die but the human part died yet he remains human but with no blood cos the blood was shed...!

How does all this makes sense to you guys?

AntiChristian:
I wonder how Jesus could do all this and still be lesser than his Father?

He is 100% God and 100% man! Which makes 200% God man. But his father remains at 100%. Jesus can even do many things his father can't do! He can shit. He can live in the human womb, pass through the birth canal, be protected by other humans, Eat, drink, feel hunger, die, cry, receive lashes of beating and even worship his father! I don't think the father can do all this!

But why do you say he is 100% man when man can sin? If Jesus can't sin then he's not 100% man.

And Jesus when alive with his 200% God-man status was still limited in knowledge! And when he died the God part didn't die but the human part died yet he remains human but with no blood cos the blood was shed...!

How does all this makes sense to you guys?

Kobojunkie:
So, are you saying that Jesus Christ was wrong in saying that John the Baptist was indeed Elijah returned?
Either you believe Jesus Christ lied or He didn't, so which one is it?

sonmvayina:
In Christianity..it does not have to, they just typed it. They don't even believe it. They know it is just jargons...

Well, what else can I say ?

sonmvayina:
In Christianity..it does not have to, they just typed it. They don't even believe it. They know it is just jargons...

Well, what else can I say ?

Bishopkingsley:
This statement has been thought to mean that Jesus is something less than God the Father. However this is not what Jesus said. He was not comparing his nature with that of God the Father. Rather he was comparing their positions.

He Was Lesser In Position When He Came To Earth

When Jesus came to earth he came in the form of a servant. This is also known as His humiliation. The Apostle Paul wrote.

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although he existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Being found in appearance as a human, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross (Philippians 2:5-8 .

Jesus Has Now Been Exalted

Jesus has now been exalted. Continuing his thought in Philippians, Paul wrote.

For this reason also, God highly exalted him, and bestowed on him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father (Philippians 2:9-11).
Summary

The fact that Jesus said, "My Father is greater than I" has led some to conclude that he was lesser in nature than God the Father.

However this statement refers to Jesus' state of humiliation that he took when he became a human being. It does not to have reference to his basic nature.

sonmvayina:
Jesus did not lie.. it is the unknown writter of the fictional story that is ignorance of the divine laws of God...
When the real creator of the universe is ready to send the Messiah if the world merits it, be rest assured that he will send Elijah to proceed him.
Then he will truly bring peace to the world. And the daily sacrifice to God will resume after building the 3rd temple.

Trust me, it is not far again.
The Messiah is not divine or a deity...he is a normal human like us..He will make human revere their creator by obeying the universal divine laws...

Peace will reign...

MaxInDHouse:
You only need to become one of Abraham's children through FAITH. The only difference between believers and unbelievers is certainty in our hearts to discern what our God can and cannot do!
When God promised Abraham that this man is going to have children do you think someone like will still trust in such a promise at 99 years of age? When God told Abraham that He is going to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah this is what the father of all those having FAITH said to challenge the Almighty God:

Then Abraham approached and said: “Will you really sweep away the righteous with the wicked? Suppose there are 50 righteous men within the city. Will you, then, sweep them away and not pardon the place for the sake of the 50 righteous who are inside it? It is unthinkable that you would act in this manner by putting the righteous man to death with the wicked one so that the outcome for the righteous man and the wicked is the same! It is unthinkable of you. Will the Judge of all the earth not do what is right?”

Abraham challenged the most high God telling Him "i know you you CAN'T destroy the good along with the wicked, it's just unthinkable of you to do such a thing"
So God's standard says "all sinners must die!" the only way out of such expiring date is after the ultimate sacrifice has been offered!
After Jesus offered himself as the ultimate sacrifice he must present it before God and all the 24 elders in heaven, then wait until the time God will give him the right to start his government on earth. Until that time no human is free from expiring date!

Of course the Bible talked about the two Witnesses but they're figurative not just two humans!

I will cause my two witnesses to prophesy for 1,260 days dressed in sackcloth.” [color]These are symbolized by the two olive trees and the two lampstands[/color] and are standing before the Lord of the earth Revelations 11:3

I know how much they've poisoned you against JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES but all you need is to act like the Beroeans {Act 17:11} find out every details to be sure of what you want to believe (trust) that's what will help you to resist falsehood. If you're not certain of what God can and cannot do then all things any religion say will go after all you're not sure if your God has changed his mind on what he told you!

sonmvayina:
If the Jesus story came from Ghana, probably his name was kwasi . Would you have believed it ?

Bishopkingsley:
This statement has been thought to mean that Jesus is something less than God the Father. However this is not what Jesus said. He was not comparing his nature with that of God the Father. Rather he was comparing their positions.

He Was Lesser In Position When He Came To Earth

When Jesus came to earth he came in the form of a servant. This is also known as His humiliation. The Apostle Paul wrote.

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although he existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Being found in appearance as a human, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross (Philippians 2:5-8 .

Jesus Has Now Been Exalted

Jesus has now been exalted. Continuing his thought in Philippians, Paul wrote.

For this reason also, God highly exalted him, and bestowed on him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father (Philippians 2:9-11).
Summary

The fact that Jesus said, "My Father is greater than I" has led some to conclude that he was lesser in nature than God the Father.

However this statement refers to Jesus' state of humiliation that he took when he became a human being. It does not to have reference to his basic nature.

Bishopkingsley:
It does not matter where the story came from
If you notice Isreal is not even among real white people they were once even slaves in Africa
Yet pure white men like America, Rome, Europe believed their God

Test and see show me another man who did what Jesus did

sonmvayina:
The bold is my problem.

When did God say his son was coming to change his laws or start a new religion or covenant where he has to sacrifice his life or men has to kill him to appease him.
I have read the old testament.. I have not seen it anywhere..
So where did Mathew, Mark, Luke, John and Paul get the idea from ?

Clearly what they wrote is not eye witness account..

So where did they get the idea from...Not from the old testament because the old testament says in Isaiah 45:5 " I am the Lord and there is no other....beside me there is no God.. "

Please explain.

Kobojunkie:
But I dont trust you nor can I even make any sense of what you claim you believe since it all seemed to be cooked up in your mental without much connection to be outside of the confines of that which is your mind.

sonmvayina:
All I am saying is that God gave all of humanity his divine laws to obey. So that they can enjoy the experience of being a human( human being). The romans hijacked it and replaced it with the worship of a man as God. Which is tantamount to idolatry.

So follow your creator and his laws. No more no less.


But you are following an idol created by Rome, To deceive..

Learn the Torah.
Why do we love Torah? Because it is the tree of life. It nourishes and sustains us. It makes us more loving. It teaches us wisdom. Torah brings God into our lives. It points us toward a right relationship with Him. We soak up its teachings and soon they are written on our hearts. May you fall in love with Torah and may it draw you nearer to God's love.

Bishopkingsley:
God said he would do it letter shows us how he will do it through becoming a man a son

Jeremiah 31:31-34

31 The Lord says, "The time is coming when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.
32 It will not be like the old covenant that I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand and led them out of Egypt. Although I was like a husband to them, they did not keep that covenant.
33 The new covenant that I will make with the people of Israel will be this: I will put my law within them and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
34 None of them will have to teach a neighbor to know the Lord, because all will know me, from the least to the greatest. I will forgive their sins and I will no longer remember their wrongs. I, the Lord, have spoken."
...................................
Now taking about the new covenant to the one who will come he says

Isaiah 42:6

6 "I, the Lord, have called you and given you power to see that justice is done on earth. Through you I will make a covenant with all peoples; through you I will bring light to the nations.
.........................................
After saying it he prophecied his coming son

Isaiah 7:14

All right then, the Lord himself will give you the sign. Look! The virgin will conceive a child! She will give birth to a son and will call him Immanuel (which means ‘God is with us’).

sonmvayina:
In Christianity..it does not have to, they just typed it. They don't even believe it. They know it is just jargons...

Well, what else can I say ?

Bishopkingsley:
This statement has been thought to mean that Jesus is something less than God the Father. However this is not what Jesus said. He was not comparing his nature with that of God the Father. Rather he was comparing their positions.

He Was Lesser In Position When He Came To Earth

When Jesus came to earth he came in the form of a servant. This is also known as His humiliation. The Apostle Paul wrote.

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although he existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Being found in appearance as a human, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross (Philippians 2:5-8 .

Jesus Has Now Been Exalted

Jesus has now been exalted. Continuing his thought in Philippians, Paul wrote.

For this reason also, God highly exalted him, and bestowed on him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father (Philippians 2:9-11).
Summary

The fact that Jesus said, "My Father is greater than I" has led some to conclude that he was lesser in nature than God the Father.

However this statement refers to Jesus' state of humiliation that he took when he became a human being. It does not to have reference to his basic nature.

livingchrist:
Abraham, enoch, Elijah and other old testament saints were sinners by birth but God declared them righteous so, God can keep them from dying if he wishes.
Jesus told peter that If he, Jesus, will's he could make John stay till he return. So you see that He can do it if he will's. He preserved Elijah and enoch most probably for future purpose.

The two witnesses are humans most probably enoch and Elijah your organisation gives out errors , I have searched my bible and Jehovah witness organisation has being found to be liars.

Kobojunkie:
All you are saying means nothing if there isn't any evidence for the claims you make outside of your mind.

Please provide evidence of these claims you continue to make so we can reason with you in this. Or accept you just enjoy rambling meaninglessly in these this, worse accusing the Almighty of lying .

Yes, that you have yet to figure that out by now only further established you a rambler and nothing else. By your very claims you accuse the same God who you protest gave the same Law to all of humanity of lying especially when you make reference to the Jewish scriptures of Him and His ways.

sonmvayina:
Ok..go to your village...look for the elders probably anyone above 70 years..ask them about the laws of the land. Write it down...so we can compare with what the jews wrote down. You can also go to the next town and do the same...

We passed ours orally from grand father to father to son to grand son....that is also what was happening in ancient near east until Ezra and the other scribes decided to write it down to form the Torah...

https://searchworks.stanford.edu/view/7913720
https://ehrafworldcultures.yale.edu/ehrafe/citation.do?method=citation&forward=browseAuthorsFullContext&id=ff62-003
That is books about igbo laws and yoruba laws..

Read them and do the comparisons with the Jewish Torah..
Don't be lazy..

MaxInDHouse:
Well i've told you, the difference between you people and us is the trust in the words of our God. Do you believe your God sent Muhammad? Of course you should because according to you He may decide to do something else apart what you read in the Bible. Do you believe Guru Maharaj? Of course you should because your God may choose to surprise you in another dimension. That's why there are so many religions all claiming Christians with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines after all your God may choose to change his mind in some things.
Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego stood on what they knew about their God through His written words and they were prepared to die even if it means for the words of their God.
Of course you will bow to that image because your God may use Nebuchadnezzar to spice up the worship. That's why all of you can't stay on one lane since you're not sure of what your God can and can't do. Surely if some supernatural men appear today telling you people they are Enoch and Elijah you people don't have anything to refute such claims since you can't predict your God.
Well that's what makes us different from all of you!

You've said it before so there is no need arguing with you over it but we know that our own God can't contradict Himself that's why we are sticking to His written word Bible!

Kobojunkie:
I am not the lazy one here who has made unfounded claims about God and the Old Law .

Alright.. now we have references to work with so which would you like for us to compare first against the Jewish Torah to find out if there is evidence for the claim you continue to make against the Hebrew God.

Do you wish to create a separate thread for each cause I am dying to learn how to you arrived at your claim that the very same Law is giving by God to each of those you have listed.

livingchrist:
you believe in your organisation why I [b]believe in Jesus christ [/b]the son of God that is the major difference here, you seek to preach your organisation while I preach Jesus christ the saviour what were you expecting that light and darkness should agree? Certainly not!
I know the anger and hate you have against Christians and how you organisation has turned you through their doctrines to do satan's work in turning people from Jesus christ.

One of your stand towards islam is that islam is not wrong but just the way people go about it, really? You think this way because you havent found the light still in darkness like your fellow religionists.



why were you arguing before?
God does not contradict himself only lack of understanding makes you think he did.