PresidentBuhari:
Today I went transferred funds from my Nigerian bank and was charged
N550/€ by my bank, I am going back there tomorrow to transfer more, I don tire for Nigeria.

How did you manage to get EUR at that rate, what method did you use for the transfer? I also want to hedge with some EUR/dollar

cucumbar:
which one is usdt?
Seems like it increases by at least, 1 dollar each day. At this rate, it will exceed 600 naira to 1usd before December.
I've been changing my naira to usd and just keep in a domiciliary account. But I'm being careful, make Dem no come tomorrow and say that you can't access USD. That's what is holding me back somhow.
The way the country is going is actually scary.

If things continue this way, then soon enough, they'd come for domiciliary accounts... just like woth Argentina e.t.c....
So far Nigeria's currency crises seems to be following the Lebanon pathway and it's quite clear CBN is running out of ideas

LutanFyah:
How will the naira grow when the CBN left Fintechs in Nigeria and paid $500m to a Barbadian Fintech company to program the e-naira?

That huge amount would have provided the much needed FX, jobs and grown our nascent tech-economy but it was given to foreigners. Rwanda and Southafrica used their youths to provide their e-currency solutions,so what stops Nigerians from doing same.

Please, you and your fellow Patriots should allow the treasury bills thread to do their business and don't bring your gaslighting and propaganda here.

The way CBN is rushing into this e-currency stuff which seems to be borne out of the need to make sure forex repatriations go thru them might very well just boomerang... Just like the failure of their Naira for dollar scheme..

The ease of interoperability between crypt0 assets might mean they'd just end up dollarising the economy...

Countries who have been testing central bank issued soins for years are yet to roll it out... Makes me more sceptical how quickly cbn cane to this idea

freeman67:

...

They are US and Crypto adherents that CBN policies and actions have dealt with and they want other people to be involved too maybe that would touch the CBN. Once they are not getting their way, they start name calling, bullying and all other tactics that will still not change the mind of those whose mind are already made.

The organic members of this thread already knows that though sometimes CBN policies might not be favourable to the investors. However, they will always find a legal means to move on instead of ranting for a decision that was made within ambit of CBN responsibilities. OMO was open to us all here back then and we could invest in it at will depending on your Bank and availablity. Now we cannot longer do it.

We discussed that and moved on without name calling and insinuations. That's what should happen but no they would rather do the opposite.

Hehe... It's interesting you believe CBN policies had any negative impact on those holding forex or trading crypt0.... Contrarily they seem to be the ones who benefit

Within a year of placing restrictions on crypt0, CBN has turned round and is going to be one of the first to issue a central bank crypt0 asset. That says enough

BTW, discuss and move without demanding change hardly solves any problem

I no trust am phor this coun3ri.

The dollar wey I buy in Jan 2020 has gained 50 percent in value while the Naira wey I put for bonds has lost 50 percent (we could say make we add 10% annual yield and $5 percent reinvestment interests but still 35% loss in value).

Anyone who has held Naira since Jan 2020 up till date has lost 50 percent of its real value.
Jan 2020 - $1 bought at N370
Sept 2021 - $1 bought at N550.

Boyhood:
[b]
ah.. President Buhari, even you?

5 million naira loan needed for the completion of a project that generate minimum of 2 million naira annually.
*10% yearly interest for a loan period of 2-3 years.
* Non depreciating fixed asset collateral currently value at 40% to 50% more than loan (LTV ratio) .

* Collateral security is within Lagos mainland residential area.

PresidentBuhari:
I no trust am phor this coun3ri.

The dollar wey I buy in Jan 2020 has gained 45 percent while the Naira wey I put for bonds has lost 45 percent (we could say make we add 10% annual yield and $5 percent reinvestment interests but still 30% loss in value).

Anyone who has held Naira since Jan 2020 up till date has lost 45 percent of its real value.
Jan 2020 - $1 bought at N370
Sept 2021 - $1 bought at N530.

Lol…..Devaluation is devastating than inflation or Tax. If you invest your money at 10% Apr, when your income Tax is at 100%, you are left with no interest at the end of the year, tax takes everything leaves only your capital.

If you invest your money at 10% Apr, with no paying of tax but inflation is rising at 10%, at the end of the year, one is still left with no interest. Inflation at 10% takes away the 10% Apr, leaving your capital.

If you invest your money at 10% Apr, with no tax, no inflation when a country is devaluing it own currency’s, devaluations occurs at 50% or more, your capital, your interest are all taken away. Your interest rate does not matter, devaluation scrap the main money itself!!!

Tax and Inflation eat your money right from the edge. Devaluation eat your money starting right from the middle

PresidentBuhari:
I no trust am phor this coun3ri.

The dollar wey I buy in Jan 2020 has gained 45 percent while the Naira wey I put for bonds has lost 45 percent (we could say make we add 10% annual yield and $5 percent reinvestment interests but still 30% loss in value).

Anyone who has held Naira since Jan 2020 up till date has lost 45 percent of its real value.
Jan 2020 - $1 bought at N370
Sept 2021 - $1 bought at N530.

Quite succint...

Someone who bought TBs at 7% a month ago has already lost 7% of their investment and are now at breakeven. Their question would now be how much more would they loose over the next 11 months... When a currency is that unstable, the risk comes with holding investment assets directly correlated with the currency.
An extreme example will be holding Zimbabwean or Lebanese TBs or bonds and thinking one is making profit..

With all the ill thought intervention cbn did over the last 2 weeks, it was clear the naira will react badly which it has began to do...

Registering devaluation against the dollar doesn't even do full justice.... It's estimated that over the last 1-1.5yrs, the dollar had devalued by upto 20% against scarce assets.. now comparing how the naira fared against the dollar, you'd see the real devaluation rate is much worse...

What's even worse is the inflation that'd follow this round of devaluation. I've come to see that it takes about 3 months for the impact of a devaluation exercise to really be felt in the market....i.e, by November, cost of cooking gas, diesel, rods, cars, building materials should be at least 7-10% higher than their cost today....thats if the naira remains around 530. A further dip will be more catastrophic....

It's a sad tale...
Let's hope the cbn has some useful tricks up it's sleeves...though I doubt as it's their wrong decision making that caused the present chaos..

wise:
5 million naira loan needed for the completion of a project that generate minimum of 2 million naira annually.
*10% yearly interest for a loan period of 2-3 years.
* Non depreciating fixed asset collateral currently value at 40% to 50% more than loan (LTV ratio) .

* Collateral security is within Lagos mainland residential area.

Check with your family members friends church members and neighbors

wise:
5 million naira loan needed for the completion of a project that generate minimum of 2 million naira annually.
*10% yearly interest for a loan period of 2-3 years.
* Non depreciating fixed asset collateral currently value at 40% to 50% more than loan (LTV ratio) .

* Collateral security is within Lagos mainland residential area.

Talk to your relationship officer in the bank

emmanuelewumi:



Talk to your relationship officer in the bank

Thank you Sir Emmanuel, the bank is offering a higher interest rate that is unfavorable in all sense of it . Considering your wealth of experience in the financial and investment space, I wouldn't mind a referral to any bank or organisation that will accept my offer, if you know of any.

wise:
Thank you Sir Emmanuel, the bank is offering a higher interest rate that is unfavorable in all sense of it . Considering your wealth of experience in the financial and investment space, I wouldn't mind a referral to any bank or organisation that will accept my offer, if you know of any.

Try Fintech guys.


Why should I give you a loan at 10%, when risk free investments are giving 12%

Hamachi:
Check with your family members friends church members and neighbors

. You do know it takes a lot of thought prior bringing such here and being from a family where you are seen as the "bread winner" but barely baking enough bread for yourself, your dream and personal obligation. Thank you Hamachi .

Hamachi:
Check with your family members friends church members and neighbors

. You do know it takes a lot of thought prior bringing such here and being from a family where you are seen as the "bread winner" but barely baking enough bread for yourself, your dream and personal obligation. Thank you Hamachi .

emmanuelewumi:



Try Fintech guys.


Why should I give you a loan at 10%, when risk free investments are giving 12%

Not expecting such from A human database of investment options like yourself. I have at least four pages of investment tips from you and other smart minds on here ready to utilize in the nearest future as part of retirement but for now, still personal business.

wise:
Not expecting such from A human database of investment options like yourself. I have at least four pages of investment tips from you and other smart minds on here ready to utilize in the nearest future as part of retirement but for now, still personal business.

Nobody will give you a loan at 10% per annum, start small and grow

If it is worth it, people buy equities in your business. At this stage of your business, I think equity is cheaper than debt

jedisco:


If things continue this way, then soon enough, they'd come for domiciliary accounts... just like woth Argentina e.t.c....
So far Nigeria's currency crises seems to be following the Lebanon pathway and it's quite clear CBN is running out of ideas

exactly my fear! You mean Argentina did something like that?

cucumbar:
exactly my fear! You mean Argentina did something like that?

Most countries with currency crises eventually did that... Argentina, Lebanon e.t.c. usually, the dollars in dom accounts are seized and forcefully converted to the local currency at the central bank rate.

CBN doing that will be going against the high and mighty of the society which is why I believe they've not done it.... So far, their interventions have been targeted against the poor or younger folks and they're at a stage where there's not much more they can target and folks are no longer buying their excuses. Fact is the average Nigerian might even welcome such a move and the defence would be to ask what folks are storing dollar for

But with all the little things they've done recently incl the e-naira, they're getting more desperate and running outta ideas... The arbitrage between both rates is now 30%. Sooner or later, CBN will be forced to make a big move which IMO will either be to end the dollar susidy on many items or go for dom accounts.... We already know how the market will react to the second option.

Some people will come here and be making noise because of dollars and other easy way they want to make money. The Chinese guys in Benin into different building materials are thr making money and can't even meet demands. The ones into agriculture and products are all making money.They come here and be making noise like if you give them MFB they will manage it well talkless of CBN.Abeg make we hear word about this dollar to naira everyday..How many small industry have you created to support the economy .

LutanFyah:
How will the naira grow when the CBN left Fintechs in Nigeria and paid $500m to a Barbadian Fintech company to program the e-naira?

If this is true, then this government is beyond laughable. It's not bad enough that they are aggressive about e-naira only after few months of banning crypto, they are now pushing that contract to a Barbadian fintech...Like WTF!!

And the guy above me is asking why we are not building small industry to support the economy? For country wey no ready to support their own? These guys went to launch Nigeria Air logo in Dubai, spending millions of naira, whereas thousands of Nigerian designers are available.

No need to be begging people to open industry, if the policies and conditions are favourable, people will create businesses of course. Doing business in Nigeria was fucking tough, before I moved I did laundry business, fashion retail and even logistics, but omor mehn I was going crazy...

So after all my experiences with business difficulty, tbills inflation and real estate wahala, I think I can be allowed to do what now works for me. If it were you, you would do the same, so stop pointing fingers abeg...

jedisco:


Most countries with currency crises eventually did that... Argentina, Lebanon e.t.c. usually, the dollars in dom accounts are seized and forcefully converted to the local currency at the central bank rate.

CBN doing that will be going against the high and mighty of the society which is why I believe they've not done it.... So far, their interventions have been targeted against the poor or younger folks and they're at a stage where there's not much more they can target and folks are no longer buying their excuses. Fact is the average Nigerian might even welcome such a move and the defence would be to ask what folks are storing dollar for

But with all the little things they've done recently incl the e-naira, they're getting more desperate and running outta ideas... The arbitrage between both rates is now 30%. Sooner or later, CBN will be forced to make a big move which IMO will either be to end the dollar susidy on many items or go for dom accounts.... We already know how the market will react to the second option.

Well said.
Were Nigeria governed with even a fraction of the competence that is available to us, the CBN should have ended this dollar subsidy nonsense long ago. Nigeria's situation is approaching that of Argentina in 2018 - and headline inflation figures are probably massaged anyway - the interesting thing to see will be whether the CBN and the politicians will continue to bleed the country as hitherto. Knowing Nigeria, I'm sure they will.

No amount of patriotism can change that fact.

Tobex4realTobex234:


If this is true, then this government is beyond laughable. It's not bad enough that they are aggressive about e-naira only after few months of banning crypto, they are now pushing that contract to a Barbadian fintech...Like WTF!!

And the guy above me is asking why we are not building small industry to support the economy? For country wey no ready to support their own? These guys went to launch Nigeria Air logo in Dubai, spending millions of naira, whereas thousands of Nigerian designers are available.

No need to be begging people to open industry, if the policies and conditions are favourable, people will create businesses of course. Doing business in Nigeria was fucking tough, before I moved I did laundry business, fashion retail and even logistics, but omor mehn I was going crazy...

So after all my experiences with business difficulty, tbills inflation and real estate wahala, I think I can be allowed to do what now works for me. If it were you, you would do the same, so stop pointing fingers abeg...

You did all those businesses and they failed.And you felt it was government doing.Oga there are people in that field making good money.You decided to chicken out to earn dollars and for that you must promote it to make easy money.I have chains of businesses and they are not failing.Next year I am going into metal/wood industry in my state imo.The demand is there because of real estate is doing well in my state.I have a friend who is into tomato paste production in anambra and he making good money.A friend in kd who is into rice de stoning and bagging is now a big boy.He was formally a bank MD and resigned.Oga opportunities full if you have what it takes even with all your dollars, inflation.The only challenge I see now is the aspect of insecurity which has more of political angles and less of economic situation in this country.

Cyberknight:


Well said.
Were Nigeria governed with even a fraction of the competence that is available to us, the CBN should have ended this dollar subsidy nonsense long ago. Nigeria's situation is approaching that of Argentina in 2018 - and headline inflation figures are probably massaged anyway - the interesting thing to see will be whether the CBN and the politicians will continue to bleed the country as hitherto. Knowing Nigeria, I'm sure they will.

No amount of patriotism can change that fact.

It's not even patriotism.... Keeping silent when ones country is being pillaged by a few is cowardice... It's like going to put on the AC for someone who's Bleep*ng your wife.

As a patriotic Nigerian, it's part of my national duty to speak upand resist wicked leaders... If the generation before me did that, perhaps Nigeria will not be where it is today.

If folks had spoken up when they told us rice was worsening our forex, perhaps we would not be here today... Look at the recent bdc debacle... Immediately there was a media expose on it, the cbn had to backtrack.... Earlier in 2015 when same system was in place and no one spoke about it, it was left to fester on.

Very soon, people will say why are you complaining when bandits erase a village, rape people and abduct hundreds of kids.... After all, do you know more that our CinC or our govs, or is it the first time people are killed or are there not thousands of school kids that are not kidnapped..that why are you disturbing everyone because just 45 people were killed....afterall, the population of the state has not dropped.

People should learn to look beyond their circles....

It was on this thread that some insulted youths that came out during end sars protests calling them lazy because their mates bringing in container from china. Some said they're not bothered cos their money is in TBs. It was also on this thread that someone insinuated that the solution to Nigeria's problems is to let the poor people die....

An economy is a sum of its parts....

Its like someone saying no need to provide free and compulsory education for the out of school kids in Kano bbecauseDangote is paying millions for his kids in same Kano...

During the civil war, some Igbos ate fat off it... That did not mean that millions of Igbos were not left desolate. People have become millionates due to the insurgency in Borno... That does not mean millions haven't paid dearly for it.

What is going on in the north today is evidence that if the child next door cannot get good education, that cancels out whatever education you can provide for your child.

jedisco:
It was also on this thread that someone insinuated that the solution to Nigeria's problems is to let the poor people die....

Really?

IamR:

Really?

Yeah... The chap was making an argument for capitalism trying to say that's how its done in the West... That the poor should be left to die...Sometimes, it's shocking how people think..

It's easy to forget that social spending takes about the biggest chunk of the budget is same Western nations.... I had to point out that the difference between UK and Nigeria is not based on what their rich can afford but the fact that the poorest UK citizen has free access to much better and prompt healthcare than even governors in Nigeria...

jedisco:


Yeah... The chap was making an argument for capitalism trying to say that's how its done in the West... That the poor should be left to die...Sometimes, it's shocking how people think..

It's easy to forget that social spending takes about the biggest chunk of the budget is same Western nations.... I had to point out that the difference between UK and Nigeria is not based on what their rich can afford but the fact that the poorest UK citizen has free access to much better and prompt healthcare than even governors in Nigeria...

You fail to address something critical. If the UK pollution as at 1960 is 52 million and come to this present date, there population is 62million.
Nigeria population in 1960 was 45 million.
To this present day 2021 is more than 200million.

Now tell me, let's assume Nigeria population was swap to England, do you think there will be something like social walfare?

Economic growth and population should go and in hand.

just2endowed:


You fail to address something critical. If the UK pollution as at 1960 is 52 million and come to this present date, there population is 62million.
Nigeria population in 1960 was 45 million.
To this present day 2021 is more than 200million.

Now tell me, let's assume Nigeria population was swap to England, do you think there will be something like social walfare?

Economic growth and population should go and in hand.

Decisions the UK made are responsible for keeping their population within manageable limits... Every country passed thru this stage.... The Issue is what they did to make progress

In the pyramid of development, countries usually pass thru certain macro stages viz;
High birth rate and high death rate>>> high birth rate and low death rate>>> low birth rate and low death rate.
It's decisions made that push nations from one to the other.

Have you wondered why in Nigeria, poorer regions generally have a higher birth rate and even in particular regions, poorer folks generally give birth to more kids...

Also some of the laws in place in the UK e.g child support, child protection e.t.c makes raising kids serious business hence people don't go around popping kids at will.

It's been proven that one of the best ways to reduce the birth rate is by ensuring good universal education. Take Kano for example with about the highest birth rate in the world. Provide good schools and make it mandatory for those kids roaming the streets to be in school... In the next 25yrs, the birth rate would easily be halved and you'd have a more productive workforce.

That's why it irks me when the ruling few sustain measures that ensure the vast majority of the people become poorer and remain in abject poverty and rather than citizens to speak up, folks will say we should keep quiet because in their little view, they think it wouldn't affect them. It's like rejoicing that you have a prime cabinet on a sinking ship.. Sooner or later, the fact will become obvious.

jedisco:


Decisions the UK made are responsible for keeping their population within manageable limits... Every country passed thru this stage.... The Issue is what they did to make progress

In the pyramid of development, countries usually pass thru certain macro stages viz;
High birth rate and high death rate>>> high birth rate and low death rate>>> low birth rate and low death rate.
It's decisions made that push nations from one to the other.

Have you wondered why in Nigeria, poorer regions generally have a higher birth rate and even in particular regions, poorer folks generally give birth to more kids...

Also some of the laws in place in the UK e.g child support, child protection e.t.c makes raising kids serious business hence people don't go around popping kids at will.

It's been proven that one of the best ways to reduce the birth rate is by ensuring good universal education. Take Kano for example with about the highest birth rate in the world. Provide good schools and make it mandatory for those kids roaming the streets to be in school... In the next 25yrs, the birth rate would easily be halved and you'd have a more productive workforce.

That's what irks me when the ruling few sustain measures that ensure the vast majority of the people become poorer and remain in abject poverty and rather than citizens to speak up, folks will say we should keep quiet because in their little view, they think it wouldn't affect them. It's like rejoicing that you have a prime cabinet on a sinking ship.. Sooner or later, the facts become obvious.

What's the way forward. The scarce resources we have as a nation is not even enough for a region in Nigeria. We fail to address population with economic growth. Education is also a key here as it can transform us productively like China but population explosion is still the biggest problem in economic growth in West Africa.

A senator was parading 4 wives at the floor of the house and bragging about it. Now let's assume there was a constituency project he need to carry out. A thought about his family will make him want to steal more because of too much hands to feeds

just2endowed:


What's the way forward. The scarce resources we have as a nation is not even enough for a region in Nigeria. We fail to address population with economic growth. Education is also a key here as it can transform us productively like China but population explosion is still the biggest problem in economic growth in West Africa.

The large population we have can be an advantage if utilised properly....

IMO, certain macroeconomic moves can be put in place that'd reduce problems by a long way...

From an economic POV, first we need to end the triad of subsidies... (I.e petrol, dollar and electricity)... Hx has enough proof that it doesn't work.. They only serve to further impoverish a poor nation at the expense of a chosen few.. Ideally, things like petrol should be taxed... There is a reason why Western nations do not subsidize petrol or forex despite their large budgets for social care...

Also CBN needs to support cheaper borrowing rates to SMEs... Their policy mandating banks to borrow out more had some good effect... But they could build on that... Of course, they'd need to make more robust the current ID system we have and possibly a credit rating system so lenders can give deserving folks cheap credit... That's a major difference between thirsd and first world nations

OBJ did well with the pension reforms, CBN could build on that and fastrack a proper mortgage industry.... When I look at Western nations, I believe the mortgage industry (along with the stock market) are the miracles of modern economics. It's impressive how people took the age long process of buying land and building and transform it to a vast industry that now supports the greatest economies. The benefits of such a system are endless... It's just like distilling raw crude into it's components.... It's an industry so big that the collapse of the industry brought a worldwide recession...

Of course, things like universal and mandatory free basic education, cutting the cost of government, community or state policing and some semblance of fighting corruption should be a given

just2endowed:
A senator was parading 4 wives at the floor of the house and bragging about it. Now let's assume there was a constituency project he need to carry out. A thought about his family will make him want to steal more because of too much hands to feeds

Truth be said, individuals choices arent really an issue moreso when it comes to something that has religious backing for some.... Some can afford it too

Every country has lavish folks which isn't bad
What's annoying is getting macroeconomic policies that have a direct impact on the lives of millions...case in point is petrol subsidy