TMKsouth:
I don't understand. U mean u wanna rearrange the setup or re-orientate South Africans?

I can't do that.......Only South Africans can.

Foreign nationals aren't enemies, no nation is truly independent.

ajl:


And you are singling out a group of people on ethnic basis. How about our yoruba brothers who are often into credit cards frauds ... every group got something. And stop that hate.

Dont mind him

IronGalaxy:
Correction, South Africa is not only made of black people. There's consensus amongst South Africans of all walk of life with regards to immigration issues

Do not argue against the Sun

Mhurfhy:
I wish Africans can travel to any African country and live and do business legally without paying much.

Hahaha so that Niger Nigerians can abandon this hell hole and troop in to other countries

Koolspot:
Too bad that Africans don't want to accommodate their fellow Africans.
What a shame.

A race that hate themselves.. If you really want to learn how to hate your fellow Africans , then go to SA. Hatred is in thier DNA. I am sure apathied really did alot of damaged to their pyschic and thier children

IronGalaxy:
Is there an African country with an immigration ticking time bomb like South Africa? you narrow everything down to Xenophobia showing how narrow you think

Nigeria has 7 million illegal immigrants in our territory
We dont go demonising or killing them
Its one thing to advocate for strong borders and controls
It's another thing to demonize groups of people

fergie001:

I can't do that.......Only South Africans can.

Foreign nationals aren't enemies, no nation is truly independent.

I think if poor South Africans can be given a chance to enter the workforce and increase their fortunes, the anti-foreigner sentiment would drastically decrease (which is not only against other Africans btw - it's just that they are fighting those in their proximity such as Africans and Pakistanis). Remember SA has a completely different history and economic structure from the rest of the continent - so thorough analysis is needed instead of this knee-jerk lambasting of previously (and currently) disadvantaged groups.

For example someone like me and my peers with varsity qualifications and solid job opportunities is not easily intimidated by foreigners - but for poor and under-educated South Africans they have to compete for menial jobs with migrants. I don't know if you've ever been to SA fergie but it's a fact that Zimbabweans for examples form the majority of waiters in SA restaurants for the simple fact that employers wanna pay less (South Africans are usually unionized). Same thing in retail stores owned by Ethiopians, Nigerians, Somalis, Pakistanis and Chinese - they prefer Malawians, Zimbabweans, etc who will work for peanuts but the exchange rate favours them.

Just this month Botswana and Zim introduced protectionist labour laws outlawing the employment of foreigners in certain industries, but if SA does it it's labelled xenophobic. Bear in mind SA has million of undocumented migrants while these two neighbouring countries don't and benefit from migration into SA themselves. On top of that, SA has an unresponsive government that seeks to appease the continent at the expense of its own citizens while Zim and Bots have no qualms closing South Africans outside.

Someone needs to give SA a break guys. Sorry for the essay but it's a complex issue.

RodgersAkpafu:

Nigeria has 7 million illegal immigrants in our territory
We dont go demonising or killing them
Its one thing to advocate for strong borders and controls
It's another thing to demonize groups of people

we don't go around killing Nigerians too, as for "demonizing" it's totally up to you which light you wanna be seen in

Emuforlife1:
Do not argue against the Sun

I am telling you about my own country so I don't expect arguments as it is.

Princedapace:


that is not the crime they are talking about. There is usually looting during break down of protests everywhere... It happened in Nigeria, it happened in USA, it happened in China, etc.

The crimes they are talking about are rapes, stealing, car hijacking, human trafficking, etc. Let not pretend. Many people who migrate illegally to other countries tend to do these kind of things to survive because most of them didnt migrate with any competent indemand profession or skillsets.

Even in Ghana, a lot of them are complaining about crimes committed by Nigerians. Everyone can not be wrong at the same time. We shouldnt like about our potential rate of committing crime to make money to oppress our village people. It is a mindset thing.

I can break this down for u. Countries that dont complain much about these things are developed countries that have strong security systems to catch these illegal immigrants and crime committers such as USA, Canada, Germany, etc. A country like SA is still developing and does not have such strong security system like her developed counter parts. That is why the ordinary citizens are suffering the most from all these petty crimes committed at rural areas.
I personally dont know what someone will be doing another person's country illegally with no skillset, no education, nothing. What else will they do? Crime.
We should stop being cowards and fix our country instead of running away illegally.

As we type, many Nigerians are looking for how best to manipulate documents to stay in SA, how to use tourism visa to hide and remain in SA. These things are not good.
Remember, there was a time Nigerians also asked Ghannians to leave Nigeria
We would have done same if we were South Africans. No be their fault. Make we fix our own country

100%

stevebond007:


More likely. I hear the unemployment among SA youths is 70%+. Do you blame foreigners for that?

No I blame foreigners for making the sky blue...wtf!

Apartheid don hammer their brains wella. The psychological impact will take another 400 years to overcome.

Imagine, ghosts (English and Afrikaners) comes to your country - takes your land, forced labour, denies you basic human rights, rapes your women, beats you and your children whenever they are bored, kills if thirsty for blood - does this for 300 years and overnight you are supposed to be a rational, analytical and caring human being. Impossible!

They need therapy camps not even money sef

TMKsouth:


I think if poor South Africans can be given a chance to enter the workforce and increase their fortunes, the anti-foreigner sentiment would drastically decrease (which is not only against other Africans btw - it's just that they are fighting those in their proximity such as Africans and Pakistanis). Remember SA has a completely different history and economic structure from the rest of the continent - so thorough analysis is needed instead of this knee-jerk lambasting of previously (and currently) disadvantaged groups.

For example someone like me and my peers with varsity qualifications and solid job opportunities is not easily intimidated by foreigners - but for poor and under-educated South Africans they have to compete for menial jobs with migrants. I don't know if you've ever been to SA fergie but it's a fact that Zimbabweans for examples form the majority of waiters in SA restaurants for the simple fact that employers wanna pay less (South Africans are usually unionized). Same thing in retail stores owned by Ethiopians, Nigerians, Somalis, Pakistanis and Chinese - they prefer Malawians, Zimbabweans, etc who will work for peanuts but the exchange rate favours them.

Just this month Botswana and Zim introduced protectionist labour laws outlawing the employment of foreigners in certain industries, but if SA does it it's labelled xenophobic. Bear in mind SA has million of undocumented migrants while these two neighbouring countries don't and benefit from migration into SA themselves. On top of that, SA has an unresponsive government that seeks to appease the continent at the expense of its own citizens while Zim and Bots have no qualms closing South Africans outside.

Someone needs to give SA a break guys. Sorry for the essay but it's a complex issue.

It's not just any essay...It is worth reading.

Protectionism? This is infact one of the things NOI was employed to fight at the WTO. For Nigeria here, it's anything goes.

I know Ghana has begin to enforce theirs recently.....

We just have to factor a way out somehow.

IronGalaxy:
No I blame foreigners for making the sky blue...wtf!

Don't dodge with sarcasm.
Mthokozisi

stevebond007:

Don't dodge with sarcasm.
Mthokozisi

Maybe you're just too slow for me, Foreigners are blamed for what they are responsible of. So telling me foreigners are the reason of unemployment in SA is exaggeration on your part and those were never my words.

hannsg:
Apartheid don hammer their brains wella. The psychological impact will take another 400 years to overcome.

Imagine, ghosts (English and Afrikaners) comes to your country - takes your land, forced labour, denies you basic human rights, rapes your women, beats you and your children whenever they are bored, kills if thirsty for blood - does this for 300 years and overnight you are supposed to be a rational, analytical and caring human being. Impossible!

They need therapy camps not even money sef

These are the types that know veey little about South Africa but scream the loudest. You come to our countries undocumented and do as you please then blame apartheid .

IronGalaxy:
Maybe you're just too slow for me, Foreigners are blamed for what they are responsible of. So telling me foreigners are the reason of unemployment in SA is exaggeration on your part and those were never my words.

I asked a question, earlier...
Cos you pour all your frustrations on the foreigners.
(you don't need the insult).
An unemployed S.A man pours his anger and frustration on a foreigners' shop. Instead of the government and the system that made you contend with 2.2% of SA wealth

TMKsouth:


I think if poor South Africans can be given a chance to enter the workforce and increase their fortunes, the anti-foreigner sentiment would drastically decrease (which is not only against other Africans btw - it's just that they are fighting those in their proximity such as Africans and Pakistanis). Remember SA has a completely different history and economic structure from the rest of the continent - so thorough analysis is needed instead of this knee-jerk lambasting of previously (and currently) disadvantaged groups.

For example someone like me and my peers with varsity qualifications and solid job opportunities is not easily intimidated by foreigners - but for poor and under-educated South Africans they have to compete for menial jobs with migrants. I don't know if you've ever been to SA fergie but it's a fact that Zimbabweans for examples form the majority of waiters in SA restaurants for the simple fact that employers wanna pay less (South Africans are usually unionized). Same thing in retail stores owned by Ethiopians, Nigerians, Somalis, Pakistanis and Chinese - they prefer Malawians, Zimbabweans, etc who will work for peanuts but the exchange rate favours them.

Just this month Botswana and Zim introduced protectionist labour laws outlawing the employment of foreigners in certain industries, but if SA does it it's labelled xenophobic. Bear in mind SA has million of undocumented migrants while these two neighbouring countries don't and benefit from migration into SA themselves. On top of that, SA has an unresponsive government that seeks to appease the continent at the expense of its own citizens while Zim and Bots have no qualms closing South Africans outside.

Someone needs to give SA a break guys. Sorry for the essay but it's a complex issue.

You just said it now. Your country thrives on foreign investment. So if they leave that's good bye.

They should just place a quota

Black South Africans are living in a bubble and they don't know it yet. They think if you eject every Black African from their country, it is suddenly going to get better. Meanwhile the reason they are still in bondage lives with them. They might be free from apartheid but their minds are still caged.

stevebond007:

I asked a question, earlier...
Cos you pour all your frustrations on the foreigners.
(you don't need the insult).
An unemployed S.A man pours his anger and frustration on a foreigners' shop. Instead of the government and the system that made you contend with 2.2% of SA wealth

The same foreigners that mug people, push drugs, hijack buildings, litter everywhere make demands, etc, that's enough to make anyone frustrated.

IronGalaxy:
The same foreigners that mug people, push drugs, hijack buildings, litter everywhere make demands, etc, that's enough to make anyone frustrated.

Yeah, you right. But S.A nationals are not exempted from this nefarious activities.
Even if all foreigners leave, the disparity in wealth will still make many S.A poor, and crime higher and higher.
Your struggling politicians have a way of digressing and blame the entire problem of S.A on foreigners. Only Julius can see clearly.

Lazy South africans

fergie001:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQnd2T-3af0

“Someone said to me ‘if you want us to vote for you in 2024 you must abandon this thing of foreigners.’ I’m prepared to go home. I’m fine. I will never take a platform and denounce Africans. I will never do it. If it means votes are going, let them go. I’m prepared to go home. But to take a platform and please the White minority by pointing a finger at other fellow Black brothers, I’m not going to do that. When I see a Nigerian or a Zimbabwean or a Congolese or Ghanaian, I see myself.

“The EFF can do internal research to see how much this thing is hurting the EFF, but I am not prepared to take a platform to say, ‘Foreigners must go home.’ I would rather not be the president of South Africa. I will be the president of my children at home. We will practise Cabinet issues there. I don’ want. You mean I should go and tell these hungry Zimbabweans to leave and when I tell them to leave, I send them where?”

Malema is an agent! He and the EFF are funded by a Swazi billionaire Impostor, what I call the fake Jews. Nathan Kirsch has been funding the EFF since at LEAST 2016.
In politics you sing the song of your sponsor! THAT rule applies EVERYWHERE competitive politics is practiced: Uruguay, Belgium, Mexico or here in Kenya. Kirsch is one of the 0.01% who set the agenda down South - it's NOT the ANC or the media!
These Elites are the same responsible for the 4 mn illegal immigrants who tbh are involved in MUCH criminal F'ERY EVEN without mentioning the "Hardworking tribe."
Zimbos do snatch and grabs in the towns and many of their ex troops also do VIOLENT robberies and cash in transit jobs. Entire shanties are filled with Malawians, Mozambicans, Zimbos and Congolese.
For real its too MUCH for Saffas to bear: no nation SHOULD be expected to shoulder such a burden.

Born2conquer:
I believe we Africans are not capable of ruling ourselves yet

Simple.

Ethnicity and religion have made mess of our brains. The whole of Africa needs recolonization.

stevebond007:

Yeah, you right. But S.A nationals are not exempted from this nefarious activities.
Even if all foreigners leave, the disparity in wealth will still make many S.A poor, and crime higher and higher.
Your struggling politicians have a way of digressing and blame the entire problem of S.A on foreigners. Only Julius can see clearly.

The fact that the are South African criminals is not an invitation for thousands to come to spoil our country, South African criminals are criminals in their country not in Accra, Kinshasa, Lusaka or wherever, Your Malema must go to hell! he doesn't even understand the logistical and social nightmare that will ensue when we open borders for everyone, no African country does that but why must we? it's honestly not our responsibility to take care of Africa, what are African governments doing for their people? Nigerians were almost sorely the nationality that was responsible of highjacking buildings and turning them into brothels or crime dens and Mashaba when he was JHB Mayor, recovered 100+ buildings from undocumented Nigerians, mind you there are actual South Africans without housing but there are illegal aliens occupying our buildings. But somehow we must clap hands for that because the minute we complain is "Xenophobic" Stuff you man

tenpipsperday:




Simple.

Ethnicity and religion have made mess of our brains. The whole of Africa needs recolonization.

Speak for Nigeria boss, we don't all subscribe to this brain-dead inferiority mentality.

IronGalaxy:
The same foreigners that mug people, push drugs, hijack buildings, litter everywhere make demands, etc, that's enough to make anyone frustrated.

I keep asking you Saffers to give us stats on the percentage of Foreign national criminals in your jails, prisons as a percentage of overall crime statistics so we can see. Numbers don't like but Rhetoric travels far.

Point 1. There is an immigration problem in South Africa no doubt about it.

Point 2. There are different types of immigrant groups in South Africa but for convenience they are all lumped into the category of "foreign nationals." once upon a time they were just "foreigners" or "Kwerekwere's" before they got upgraded with the suffix "nationals" as a pretense to give them some sort of dignity as humans.

Point 3. There are approximately 5 million foreign nationals- encompassing of legal immigrants, illegal migrants, economic migrants and refugees.

Of this 5 million mathematically reduce their numbers to just males, you will get an approximate 2.5 million

of this 2.5 million males remove youngers btw the ages of 0- 18 who are less likely to commit crimes or heinous crimes for that matter, we get about 1. 8 million males over the age of 18 and potential criminals.

of this 1.8 million remove another 30 % of skilled labor,who are approximate for legal immigrants such as lawyers, doctors, teachers etc, we are left with about 1.2 million

of the 1.2 million remove men engaged in the informal sector in jobs under-skilled remove another 30 % and we are left with an approximate 880,000 potential deviants.

of this 880,000 factor in different types of criminal activity- so your fraud, petty theft, cyber crimes, heinous crimes such as rape, hijackings. killings etc and only about 30% of this group would engage in the most despicable of crimes.

That comes out to about 260,000 foreigner all nationalities as the highest degree of a threat to the SOuth African society in comparison to a population of about 50 million blacks, whites, coloreds and Indians.


When you do the math we come to realize that the "propaganda" of foreign nationals" s the bain of South Africa is exactly what it is. PROPAGANDA!!!!!

IronGalaxy:
Dream on son, you were celebrating road markings of Sokoto road just yesterday You guys are essentially still languishing in the stone age

I typed a proper response but cleaned it off…its not everyday that the less intelligent should be trampled on….run along and play with your specie.

morpheus24:


I keep asking you Saffers to give us stats on the percentage of Foreign national criminals in your jails, prisons as a percentage of overall crime statistics so we can see. Numbers don't like but Rhetoric travels far.

Point 1. There is an immigration problem in South Africa no doubt about it.

Point 2. There are different types of immigrant groups in South Africa but for convenience they are all lumped into the category of "foreign nationals." once upon a time they were just "foreigners" or "Kwerekwere's" before they got upgraded with the suffix "nationals" as a pretense to give them some sort of dignity as humans.

Point 3. There are approximately 5 million foreign nationals- encompassing of legal immigrants, illegal migrants, economic migrants and refugees.

Of this 5 million mathematically reduce their numbers to just males, you will get an approximate 2.5 million

of this 2.5 million males remove youngers btw the ages of 0- 18 who are less likely to commit crimes or heinous crimes for that matter, we get about 1. 8 million males over the age of 18 and potential criminals.

of this 1.8 million remove another 30 % of skilled labor,who are approximate for legal immigrants such as lawyers, doctors, teachers etc, we are left with about 1.2 million

of the 1.2 million remove men engaged in the informal sector in jobs under-skilled remove another 30 % and we are left with an approximate 880,000 potential deviants.

of this 880,000 factor in different types of criminal activity- so your fraud, petty theft, cyber crimes, heinous crimes such as rape, hijackings. killings etc and only about 30% of this group would engage in the most despicable of crimes.

That comes out to about 260,000 foreigner all nationalities as the highest degree of a threat to the SOuth African society in comparison to a population of about 50 million blacks, whites, coloreds and Indians.


When you do the math we come to realize that the "propaganda" of foreign nationals" s the bain of South Africa is exactly what it is. PROPAGANDA!!!!!

Exactly! Just another reason for them to loot shops and kill their fellow black Africans...

JAWBONE:
Black South Africans are living in a bubble and they don't know it yet. They think if you eject every Black African from their country, it is suddenly going to get better. Meanwhile the reason they are still in bondage lives with them. They might be free from apartheid but their minds are still caged.

Lol, when you specify "black South Africans" do you know the stance of other South Africans with regards to foreigners because I can tell you right now there's a general consensus among South Africans regarding this issue, people are tired man! we can't be Africa's Santa Claus, South African people must come first.

And to correct you, no one is saying we don't want black Africans here because that's a lie, we generally would welcome skilled Africans from all over the continent, your doctors, engineers etc, we're just tired of the riffrafffs that come into the country with nothing to offer, or to loiter around doing nothing andend up committing crimes just being a burden on our system

the other stuff about "apartheid" is pure trash!

IronGalaxy:
The fact that the are South African criminals is not an invitation for thousands to come to spoil our country, South African criminals are criminals in their country not in Accra, Kinshasa, Lusaka or wherever, Your Malema must go to hell! he doesn't even understand the logistical and social nightmare that will ensue when we open borders for everyone, no African country does that but why must we? it's honestly not our responsibility to take care of Africa, what are African governments doing for their people? Nigerians were almost sorely the nationality that was responsible of highjacking buildings and turning them into brothels or crime dens and Mashaba when he was JHB Mayor, recovered 100+ buildings from undocumented Nigerians, mind you there are actual South Africans without housing but there are illegal aliens occupying our buildings. But somehow we must clap hands for that because the minute we complain is "Xenophobic" Stuff you man

Understandably,
No one wants crime. Same energy is needed for realignment of wealth distribution in S.A.
More jobs for your nationals would go a long way.
I wish you well.

IronGalaxy:
The fact that the are South African criminals is not an invitation for thousands to come to spoil our country, South African criminals are criminals in their country not in Accra, Kinshasa, Lusaka or wherever{/quote]

Nonsensical point if I might suggest.

[quote author=IronGalaxy post=107741220]
Your Malema must go to hell! he doesn't even understand the logistical and social nightmare that will ensue when we open borders for everyone, no African country does that but why must we? it's honestly not our responsibility to take care of Africa, what are African governments doing for their people?

The narrative being peddled is that SA borders must be set wide open. That to me is not wise, however I fully understand Malema's gesture when he claims he will not betray the African brother for the Capitalist white run system. Open border is not a practicality in any state that seeks to be soverign and if you listen attentively you will understand that Malema does not put his words correctly but is more or less advocating African intra-trade and Africane inter dependence.

IronGalaxy:

Nigerians were almost sorely the nationality that was responsible of highjacking buildings and turning them into brothels or crime dens and Mashaba when he was JHB Mayor, recovered 100+ buildings from undocumented Nigerians, mind you there are actual South Africans without housing but there are illegal aliens occupying our buildings. But somehow we must clap hands for that because the minute we complain is "Xenophobic" Stuff you man

These are criminal elements that must be flushed out of any society. No one is telling you to accept criminality in your borders but the way your "mayor" shapes is the arguments are patronizing to his citizenry in an attempt to stare up hate, xenophobia and resentment.

Simply state that there are open border problems with the country that must be dealt with and the foreign nationals engaged in these nefarious acts will be targeted with the full might of law enforcement.

While we deal head on with these criminal elements in our society, we acknowledge the fact that there are nationals of other African countries who are economic migrants within out borders seeking a better life for themselves. While we are signatories to the Hague convention which requires us to welcome refugees, it has become apparent that most of the foreign residents within South Africa are "economic migrants" who are in competition with our underskilled labor force. This is a problem that must be resolved and will be tackled by making sure resources are channeled to South Africans first as out primary obligation is to our citizenry.

While we acknowledge and sympathize with the plight of these economic migrants in the country it has become unsustainable to carry this burden and it is imperative that we discourage economic migration into the country by taking so and so steps"

Your Mayor cannot even articulate himself in the above manner is a xenophobe in disguise.