NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU - Health (27)

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NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU - Health (27) - Nairaland

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Doctors To Embark On Nationwide Strike Over NUC’s PhD Directive / JOHESU Set To Embark On Indefinite Strike / Strike: "JOHESU is Selfish, They don't know what they want" must read!! (2) (3) (4)

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Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by ayencoforequity: 11:54am On May 22, 2018

A nurse is now made the American surgeon general by Donald Trump

Will nma be ready to build a team where everyone becomes strong and reliable ?

See the attachment

2 Likes

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Thanks18(m): 12:29pm On May 22, 2018

PLEASE TAKE A LOOK TO OLD COMESS AND OLD CONHESS:
COMESS 3 (which is the starting point for doctors) #260,865.58
CONHESS 7 (which is the starting point for some health workers like accountant etc) #118,765.
(difference of #142,100.00) 120% difference.
CONHESS 9 (which is another starting point for health workers eg pharmacist etc) #161,670.33.
(difference 99,195.25) 61% difference.
NOW LETS STILL COMPARE THE SALARY OF A NEWLY EMPLOYED DOCTOR ABOVE WITH A HEALTH WORKERS THAT HAVE SPENT 6 TO 9 YEARS IN SERVICE WHICH IS CONHESS 11.
CONHESS 11:#223,345.58 (difference of #37,520.00) 17% difference.
ABOVE IS FOR OLD CONMESS AND OLD CONHESS....
TAKE A LOOK AT THE NEW CONMESS AND PROPOSED CONHESS BY JOHESU, PLS SIR I WILL STILL WANT YOU TO COMPARE THIS NEW CONMESS WITH THE OLD CONHESS THAT JOHESU IS PRESENTLY RECEIVING NOW....
NEW CONMESS 3 :# 312,944.83.
PROPOSED CONHESS 7: #165,541.08
(difference of #147,403.75)
89%difference.
PROPOSED CONHESS 9: #190,227.25 (difference of #122,717.58)
65% difference.
PROPOSED CONHESS 11:
#255,184.83.
(difference of #57,760.00)
23% difference.
I WANT TO ALSO WRITE THAT OF THE ZENITH OF BOTH PROFESSION :
OLD CONMESS 7: #704,209.08
OLD CONHESS 15: #476,855.00
(DIFFERENCE #227,354.08)
48% DIFFERENCE.
NEW CONMESS 7:
#999,698.50
PROPOSED CONHESS 15:
#697,024,42.
(difference of #302,674.08)
43% Difference
now did NMA see the parity they have been singing with

I TOOK OUT MY PRECIOUS TIME TO HIGHLIGHT THIS FIGURES OUT because WHEN I AM TALKING I LIKE WORKING WITH FACT because THE TRUTH CAN'T BE HIDDEN.
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Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by fitzfrankses7(m): 8:54pm On May 23, 2018

Some of us have seen and experienced the truth... We need to rise above petty tirades to save our ailing health sector
Revisiting The NMA Strike -*
The Candid Opinion Of A UK-Based Doctor
By *Dr. Ijabla Raymond*
Although I practise abroad, I should point out
that this strike affects me too. My family and
friends all live in Nigeria.
I feel compelled to write on this subject
because of its seriousness and the dearth of
objective analyses on our social media. It is
an emotive subject for both *NMA* and
*JOHESU* members, and I can understand
why punches fly around, but both parties must
rise above petty and emotional considerations
if we are to find a way forward.
For clarification purposes, the *NMA*
represents medical doctors whilst *JOHESU*
is a union of all health workers who are not
doctors.
The NMA has a list of *24 demands* but I will
limit myself to the most contentious ones. At
this stage, it is probably best that I introduce
myself. _*I am medical doctor of Nigerian
heritage practising in the UK.*_
*WHO SHOULD HEAD THE HOSPITAL*
There is no contention – the medical doctor is
the head of the *clinical team.* He/she leads
the ward rounds, clinics, surgical operations,
multidisciplinary meetings and so on because
the ultimate and final responsibility for patient
care rests in his/her hands.
The headship of the hospital is a different
matter. This is an *administrative* office,
which needs not be occupied by a medical
doctor. This job is better in the hands of
people who have administrative or business
management skills. _This is the case in
countries like the UK, Canada and the US,_
which heavily influence our health system.
Therefore, it is difficult to reason with the
NMA why this job should be the exclusive
right of medical doctors.
*NON-MEDICAL CONSULTANTS*
The doctor-patient ratio in Nigeria is
_dangerously low._ In my view, the roles of
non-medical professionals such as nurses,
physiotherapists, pharmacists etc need to
expand to cope with the demands on doctors.
It is important that this is done in a _safe
way_ by providing the appropriate level of
training for these individuals. *This is the case
in countries such as the UK, Canada and the
US where consultant nurses, pharmacists etc
have existed for a few decades now.* I do not
see any problem with non-medical consultants
as long as these individuals are appropriately
trained and can practise both competently and
safely within an *agreed framework* . These
professionals have separate (but
complimentary) job descriptions and their
roles are not designed to replace or dispense
with the services of the doctor. If this
arrangement enhances patient care, then
where is the problem with it? The NMA needs
to demonstrate to the public and to the
government how the creation of these non-
medical consultant positions will adversely
affect patient care, otherwise, its demands will
be perceived as obstructing the professional
development of JOHESU members, and I don’t
think this is helpful to anybody.
*HAZARD ALLOWANCE*
The types of hazard and the level to which
healthcare workers are exposed vary
considerably and depend on the type of job
they do. For instance, psychiatrists are hardly
exposed to body fluids and their risks for
contracting diseases like HIV and hepatitis are
much less than for a theatre scrub nurse. The
risk of physical assault by a patient is higher
for a psychiatrist than for a surgeon. And
because psychiatric nurses spend more time
with patients, their risks of assault are
arguably higher than those of consultant
psychiatrists.
The people who work in radiology
departments such as radiologists,
radiographers, nurses, porters and so on have
greater exposure to radioactive materials than
everyone else in the hospital.
The current health hazard allowance of
N5,000 is unconscionable – it needs to
increase. However, I think it is imperative to
get an independent risk assessor for impartial
advice.
*MISCELLANEOUS*
I have read far too many emotional arguments
on these issues and very little of an objective
discourse. It is important that I draw your
attention to a few of these.
What has become obvious is the lack of
understanding of the *concept of teamwork* .
There is a pervasive notion among doctors
that the other healthcare workers are there to
serve them. JOHESU members think that
doctors have become too conceited for their
own good and are determined to put them in
their “places”. *The most important person in
the hospital is the patient* – it is *not* the
_doctor_ , _nurse_ , _pharmacist_ or
_laboratory scientist_ or anyone else. Every
team member is important and must be
respected, including the people who do the
least clinical jobs like cleaning. I don’t
imagine that any hospital will remain open for
longer than a week if its cleaners went on
strike and dirt was allowed to accumulate to
the point where it constitutes a health risk.
I have heard so many anecdotal accounts of
nurses not joining doctors on ward rounds or
pharmacists altering prescriptions without first
discussing these with the prescribing doctors
or laboratory scientist slapping doctors; and
these accounts are being given as reasons
why doctors must continue to head hospitals.
These are *disciplinary matters,* which should
be managed according to existing procedures.
These excuses are emotional and should not
be used to block the professional development
of others.
The other reason I have heard doctors give for
not wanting our non-medical colleagues to
bear the "consultant" title is the fear that
patients will confuse them or anybody else in
a white-coat for a doctor and give such people
an excuse for autonomous practice.
This reason is *not good enough* because
this problem can be solved by wearing names
badges and/or colour coded uniforms. Also
health professionals should introduce
themselves to patients at the start of
consultations. But more significantly, this can
be an issue of regulation - any one found to
be (criminally) practising over and beyond
their job description, competence level or
professional registration becomes liable to
disciplinary procedures.
Our health system suffers from poor
regulation. This is why anyone can open a
chemist and dole out antibiotics
indiscriminately. It is the reason doctors are
scared that consultant pharmacists, nurses
and physiotherapists will steal their patients.
But it is also the reason why doctors may
recommend an operation to a patient where
none is necessary just so they can charge
more. This is a problem that is in urgent need
of attention.
I hope that this something both NMA &
JOHESU will flag up in the near future.
Another recurrent theme in these debates is
the abuse of junior doctors by both medical
and non-medical staff, which appears to be
endemic. There is a consistent narrative of
junior doctors being asked to do other
people’s jobs such as collecting blood from
blood banks, taking samples to laboratories
etc. In extreme cases, these doctors are asked
to undertake non-clinical tasks by more senior
doctors. This is simply unacceptable! I think it
is fair to place the blame for this at the hands
of consultants who are supposed to be
responsible for junior doctors. But this in
itself is not a good argument for blocking
JOHESU members from becoming consultants
in their specialties or for stopping them from
heading hospitals if they have the right
qualifications.
I am concerned that the NMA is losing public
sympathy. Increasingly, I hear people describe
doctors as selfish and heartless. This is very
sad and rather unfortunate. They say doctors
do not have any motivation to end the strike
because patients are forced to pay exorbitant
fees to them in their private hospitals. Those
patients who cannot afford these fees are left
to suffer or die. If the NMA has made any
efforts to change this public perception, then
these do not appear to have been effective.
*CONCLUSION*
The current strategy (i.e., recurrent strikes) is
not working. Over the last decade or two, the
NMA and non-medical health workers (more
recently represented by JOHESU) have taken
turns to go on strikes. Perhaps, it is time for
both parties to sit together, talk to each other
and resolve these contentious issues once
and for all. _It’s pointless for the government
to enter into agreements with one party
knowing fully well that the other party will ask
for a reversal of those agreements._
I think the time has come to incorporate
Ethics, Teamwork and Communications into
undergraduate curricula. The various online
comments I have read from medical and non-
medical colleagues show that whilst many
easily mouth off "team work", a practical
understanding of what this means is lacking.
Disciplinary procedures are there for a reason.
They must be followed when necessary.
Although I practise abroad, I should point out
that this strike affects me too. My family and
friends all live in Nigeria. And who says I am
not planning to come home to practise?
Lastly, we must all be mindful of our own
mortality. Most of us will be ill someday.
And when this happens, the only thing that
will matter to us is to be looked after by
caring and competent health-workers
regardless of their individual specialisation.
We can create that environment if we forget
our individual egos and work as a team.
*Ijabla Raymond,* a medical doctor of
Nigerian heritage writes from the UK. Contact:
_ijabla.raymond@facebook.com._

6 Likes

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by emekatheo: 6:31pm On May 24, 2018

[color=#990000][/color]

The Pharmaceutical Society of Nigeria (PSN) heartily appreciates the dynamic gover
nor of Lagos state, HE Akinwunmi Ambode for the creation of pharmacists’ consultancy cadre in the Scheme of Service of Lagos state, Nigeria. This is a milestone in the history of health care system in Nigeria in general and Lagos state in particular. The governor is surely in a march to advance mankind.
This circular was, however, visited with an uncivilized growing dictatorship and cruel tyranny from the NMA where they threatened and requested for the withdrawal of the circular, with even a deadline. PSN ordinarily never wanted to join issues with NMA, considering the fact that NMA is in crisis with itself in an ego cocoon, complicated by gross ignorance, incompetence and clear display of deficiency of wisdom that lengthened the strike action with JOHESU. This has turned the health sector into ridicule, a situation any serious minded body will avoid as enshrined in the Hippocratic Oath. At times like this, when inter-professional collaboration is the way forward in International best practices, NMA has chosen the path of desperate destruction.
For the sake of clarity, let me educate NMA on global best practices.
The World Health Organization (WHO), is the highest body in the world which set or make a standard for international best practice on all issues of health. Just as other systems of the world are so dynamic, so is the healthcare delivery system-dynamic in all ramifications. And any government that proclaimed good governance should always refer to WHO standard on regular bases to meet the health needs of its nation. To buttress our precarious situation, let’s look at current International best practices according to WHO ranking (April 2018) under the following headings:
The first 5 best hospital systems in the worldThe worst 5 hospital systems in the worldConsultancy/specialists status in the two systemsHealth administration in the two systems (best and worst)
The first 5 best hospital systems in the world
According to WHO ranking of 191 member countries April 2018, the following are the best 5 with effective healthcare delivery system
FranceItalySan MarinoAndorraMalta
The worst 5 hospital systems in the world
The bottoms up ward, which are considered the worst 5 among 191 member countries are:
Sierra LeoneMyanmarCentral African RepublicDemocratic Republic of the CongoNigeria
Among the 191 WHO member countries, Nigeria is sadly ranked 189 in healthcare service provision. It’s is very obvious that in Nigeria, healthcare service delivery is averse to change. We are where we are today because of the cataclysmic barrier NMA catalysed by their poor choices in the health sector. These barriers prevent the policy makers from seeing reality from the international point of view. Lagos State Government is absolutely in line with harmony and inter-professional needs to attain International best practices in the healthcare delivery system.
To understand global best practices, according to a 2017 report of the Economists Intelligence Unit, on the global access to healthcare index: UK, Canada, Australia and USA make the top 10. While Nigeria ranks among the bottom 6 overall of the 60 countries listed on the same global index. Let me take a drive with you to the practices in these countries
Health administration in the two systems
Health administration entails administrative structure in the health sector, the incumbent ministers and other heads down the structure and the bases or criteria of selection will be x-rayed to justify current positions in WHO ranking.
CountryMinister of HealthSpecialtyFranceMorisol TouraineEconomicsItalyBeatrice LorenzinJournalism and politicsSan MarinoDidier GamerdingerLawAndorraCristina Rodriguez GalanMolecular BiologyMaltaChristopher FearneMedicineUSAAlex AzarLawGermanyJens SpahnLawSaudi ArabiaTawfiq Al RavishMathematicsIsrealYaakov LitzmanTorahSpainDolors MontserratLawIndiaJagat Prakash NaddaLawCanadaGenette Petitpas TaylorSocial works
A look at the above appointments is a testimony that performance index is dependent on neutrality and administrative prowess and not on ‘medical qualification’ as commonly claimed by Nigerian medical doctors. Incidentally the Director General of World Health Organisation (WHO), Tedros Adhamon, an Ethiopian, studied Biology. If he, and all those above, were in Nigeria, NMA would have protested. This is the situation the NMA of Lagos is attempting, and writing to a Governor as knowledgeable as HE Ambode Akinwunmi- a distinguished administrator who knows his onions and is committed to advance mankind.
The criterion for selection in these great and successful countries is based on professional and administrative experience and this is the same down the administrative structure. In Nigeria (‘International best practices’ epitome!!), the criteria for selection are solely based on MBBS qualification and it is also the same down the administrative structure. Does that tell you the reason(s) for failure? Yes indeed. What a shame!!
Consultancy/Specialist status
Specialists and consultants in various fields in healthcare are a common trend. They are mandated to train and award fellowships based on their skills and competences. These healthcare team members earn specialist allowances as they render services to the patients. In this current loggerhead, NMA said the consultancy cadre is sacred to only doctors (yet, citing certain international best practices). We run Fellowship in the West African Postgraduate College of Pharmacists to improve our knowledge, attitudes, skills and competences to promote and maintain a high standard of professional pharmacy practice. We have Primary level (1 year), Part One (Two years) and Part two (Two years). Pharmacists undergo a minimum of 12 months Residency training and present dissertation that are assessed by erudite academics (Professors and all PhD holders), before the award of Fellowship in various specialties. In fact, in the USA, a Nigerian (Dr Teresa Pounds- a consultant pharmacist) heads the Residency training and runs the consultancy program in one of the biggest Universities.
I read with utmost dismay, as NMA has turned both Judge and jury in its case. Representing all parties in the health sector. Deciding the fate of everybody and declaring others as they will. This has messed up the sensibilities and sensitivities of the health sector by incessant and unrelenting relegation of others. What we have is a contradistinction to the labour law. NMA determining what others should get when NMA is not an employer of labour. This negates labour engagement and a breach of human rights. I all along thought the NMA was a serious union, until recently when the deficiency of purpose and leadership was obviously testified especially in this pharmacy consultancy cadre as embraced by a leading state in Nigeria.
A profession regulating another? This is strange. Only in an indecent and decaying system can this happen. Can a Building engineer regulate the training of a civil engineer? Can an Architect tell government not to recognize the M.Sc of a Building engineer? Nigeria is not and should not sink so abysmally. Other health professional have the right to develop themselves in line with best international practices-sincere practices please; NOT the one only NMA has access to. The interference with growth and development of healthcare in this country is becoming an embarrassment to civility.
The pharmacy consultancy cadre, as approved by Lagos State Government in the service of scheme is the best thing the health sector can achieve. PSN shall not relent in promoting the health sector in Nigeria. We commend the Lagos state Government for this bold action of International best practice.
Pharm.Ahmed I Yakasai, FPSN, FNIM, FNAPharm, FCPharm
President, Pharmaceutical Society of Nigeria (PSN)
Pharm. Emeka C. Duru
National Secretary
Pharmaceutical Society of Nigeria (PSN)

2 Likes

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by lanxebony(m): 7:00pm On May 26, 2018

#THEY_RUINED_OUR_TEAM
NB: Long post

When we were admitted into the university, some of us were in Nursing Sciences, Optometry, Medical Laboratory Science, Medicine and Surgery, Physiotherapy, Dentistry, Pharmacy, Radiology etc.

We were subjected to general studies (GST,GSS).
We were taught by mathematicians, Education teachers, physicists and philosophers.

Since they knew little or nothing about the slight differences in our course of study, they addressed us by a general name: Medical and Health Sciences.

We made friends amongst one another.

" What's your department? " I'd asked.

" Nursing sciences. "

" Wow! I 'm in Medicine and Surgery. Meet my friend, she's in Pharmacy."

That way, we became bound by the cords of friendship, and we read at the Medical Laboratory Science block.
We had one common goal: to pass our exams.

We put our heads together in solving the past questions for that semester.

Bunmi my Pharmacist friend, was good at Mathematics.
Ekene the Nursing guy, was a wizard in Chemistry.
I loved Biology, and Ahmed my Optometry friend taught us Physics.

Together, we solved the past questions, taught and complimented each other.
Now towards our third Year in school, things started to go sour, and South. Bunmi would pass and just wave. Ekene barely would talk to me, and whenever Ahmed picked my calls, I 'd feel like I owed God a testimony.

Each of us had the key to our respective classes and we locked them against every other student that wasn't in our department. The center could no longer hold - things fell apart:

" They should have considered it a privilege to be associated with me."

" Oh, I didn't tell you? "

Towards our third year in school, we had new lecturers with entirely different mindsets , behaviors and speech. They were our seniors in the profession.
They'd availed themselves so we could be taught.

Pharmacists taught the Pharmacy students.
Doctors taught the student Doctors.
Scientists taught the student Scientists.
Matrons taught the student Nurses.

Every thing went fine, until we were introduced to a strange course; a course not found in the curriculum. But we learnt it. It was injected into us, and it went straight into our heads and our minds absorbed them.
They were injections of words.

We were told to uphold our disciplines with great esteem and never to accept any humiliation from anybody.

They told us that we were superior to other departments. Student laboratory scientists were told that without the laboratory, the hospital is handicapped. The Nursing students were told that they were indispensable. The student Doctors were told that they were general overseers. The Pharmacists assumed the appellation ; Bedrock of Medical Practice.

These may not be entirely false, but the next words injected in us triggered the hatred, ego rise and envy.
We were told of how other departments in the same medical field hated us; of the need to stand up and uphold the fight because other departments are jealous of ours and wants to humiliate us. We were told that medical doctors were arrogant and hence we'd give them no room for such display. We were told that nurses were insulting, hence, all relationships with them should be kept at a highly official level and with great consciousness of our ego; that the medical laboratory scientists were poke - nosing into our territory, so we must annihilate them as possibly as we can.
We were taught to esteem our ego and defend our profession against our 'foes' in the same field.

No wonder we now feel insecure amongst ourselves - the injection really worked.

Sadly, as I bleed in my heart writing this, I recalled our first years, when our minds were like virgins. We were together and we all had one mind and one goal - The Exam.

Now we are faced with a bigger goal - The patient.

But, we aren't together.

So,

How can we Pass?

They've ruined our team.

Written by Isaiah Ugochukwu Obialor (Student Medlab Scientist)
Reviewed by Iruke Kingsley Chuckwuebuka ( student optometrist)
Edited by Wisdom Ngumoha (student doctor)
Forwarded by Ogechi Blessing Godwin (student nurse )
And Ango Wisdom (student pharmacist)

Nigeria medical sector: There is no "I" in a team.

#copied

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Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Dnaz(m): 7:10am On May 27, 2018

ayencoforequity:

A nurse is now made the American surgeon general by Donald Trump

Will nma be ready to build a team where everyone becomes strong and reliable ?

See the attachment

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Dnaz(m): 7:11am On May 27, 2018

ayencoforequity:

A nurse is now made the American surgeon general by Donald Trump

Will nma be ready to build a team where everyone becomes strong and reliable ?

See the attachment

She was just Acting for like 2months before Trump appointed the Substantive Surgeon general who is a Doctor and she dropped back to assists

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by AlphaT1(m): 1:22pm On May 27, 2018

funmisticqueen:
that is a lie

This is praise abi? What was the truth?

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by AlphaT1(m): 1:23pm On May 27, 2018

funmisticqueen:
i won't bicker with you, it is as degrading as jumping from your massive ego to your mentally retarded IQ

This is another praise!

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Thanks18(m): 2:25pm On May 27, 2018

Dnaz:

She was just Acting for like 2months before Trump appointed the Substantive Surgeon general who is a Doctor and she dropped back to assists

she was not the only non physician to be appointed as surgeon general in US.It is a fact that her name is in the list of Surgeon General of US. Even a veterinarian and one other nurse had attained such positions. but can this happen in Nigeria? all the past and current ministers of health and ministers of state of health from 80s till date are all physicians with the resultant decay and rot in the sector. I repeat till Nigeria start appointing capable and competent hands drawn from all stakeholders(- JOHESU and NMA) with rich resume and track records to manage and lead our health sector from primary to tertiary level, we will still be witnessing a gigantic failed health system in the whole wide world.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Dnaz(m): 3:17pm On May 27, 2018

Thanks18:

she was not the only non physician to be appointed as surgeon general in US.It is a fact that her name is in the list of Surgeon General of US. Even a veterinarian and one other nurse had attained such positions. but can this happen in Nigeria? all the past and current ministers of health and ministers of state of health from 80s till date are all physicians with the resultant decay and rot in the sector. I repeat till Nigeria start appointing capable and competent hands drawn from all stakeholders(- JOHESU and NMA) with rich resume and track records to manage and lead our health sector from primary to tertiary level, we will still be witnessing a gigantic failed health system in the whole wide world.

The nurse who attained the position before had a degree in nursing and then another in medicine. In other words it was a nurse turned physician

1 Like

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 4:44pm On May 27, 2018

Dnaz:

The nurse who attained the position before had a degree in nursing and then another in medicine. In other words it was a nurse turned physician

am sure that guy will b dump and disappointed with this ..

he's busy researching on how a nurse/Johesu are leaders/director in medical Field where doctors are still on sit..
grin

wen people lost their Senses, they start dreaming infinite dream

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Thanks18(m): 5:25pm On May 27, 2018

danilmo:

am sure that guy will b dump and disappointed with this ..

he's busy researching on how a nurse/Johesu are leaders/director in medical Field where doctors are still on sit..

wen people lost their Senses, they start dreaming infinite dream

You are daft. I am not here for secondary school debate and I must not be responding to all comments much especially ones that are full of bias. Once I made my point, I will not keep repeating and gesticulating it. I also made mention of a veterinary Dr becoming US Surgeon general. Kwara state has appointed a nurse to be the substantive commissioner of health. Leadership of health sector should be open to competent administrators drawn from all stakeholders. I am done with you. If you like keep pursuing shadow and reactive to the positive dawn coming to Nigeria's health sector.

Dnaz:

The nurse who attained the position before had a degree in nursing and then another in medicine. In other words it was a nurse turned physician

danilmo:

am sure that guy will b dump and disappointed with this ..

he's busy researching on how a nurse/Johesu are leaders/director in medical Field where doctors are still on sit..

wen people lost their Senses, they start dreaming infinite dream

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Nobody: 8:59pm On May 27, 2018

AlphaT1:

This is another praise!

it is only a dunce that doesnt recognise an insult when he sees one

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 10:52pm On May 27, 2018

Thanks18:

You are daft. I am not here for secondary school debate and I must not be responding to all comments much especially ones that are full of bias. Once I made my point, I will not keep repeating and gesticulating it. I also made mention of a veterinary Dr becoming US Surgeon general. Kwara state has appointed a nurse to be the substantive commissioner of health. Leadership of health sector should be open to competent administrators drawn from all stakeholders. I am done with you. If you like keep pursuing shadow and reactive to the positive dawn coming to Nigeria's health sector.

You are daft. I am not here for secondary school debate and I must not be responding to all comments much especially ones that are full of bias. Once I made my point, I will not keep repeating and gesticulating it. I also made mention of a veterinary Dr becoming US Surgeon general. Kwara state has appointed a nurse to be the substantive commissioner of health. Leadership of health sector should be open to competent administrators drawn from all stakeholders. I am done with you. If you like keep pursuing shadow and reactive to the positive dawn coming to Nigeria's health sector.

I guess ure a male nurse grin

Pele..

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Thanks18(m): 11:17pm On May 27, 2018

danilmo:

I guess ure a male nurse
Pele..

No I am not a nurse. I am a Physiotherapist.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 11:26pm On May 27, 2018

Thanks18:

No I am not a nurse. I am a Physiotherapist.

u graduated from OAU I think

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by Penboy: 9:41am On Jul 03, 2019

Mrvalent:
Some of JOHESU'S demands are reasonable but some are far from being reasonable . You want to become consultants, then no problem.Take the UK for instance, there are consultant nurses in the UK who after 1-2 years of further studies become consultants in their fields. To say you want to earn the same salary or even close to the doctors' is far from reasonable. Just talk based on facts, check up the average salary of a consultant Physician and that of a Consultant nurse in the UK and you see that they are far apart. In fact the average salary of a junior doctor,even though lower, comes close to the average salary of a consultant nurse . Same applies to other paramedical professions. In fact such obtains in most parts of the world. Google is your very dear friend. Use it.
To think pharmacists who I venerate so much involve themselves with these people and try to chide the work of a Physician baffles me. Sometimes in life to try to prove your worth is an insult. So I won't scatter ground with examples but understand that the physician's knowledge in diseases, interpretation of lab results,diagnosis, treatment plan and management of complications can't be paralleled by any paramedic. I am not even talking about a surgeon now. To tie these things needs deep understanding of sometimes complex concepts which is not acquired by the years of study alone but majorly by the content. I know there are medical schools in Nigeria that produce half baked doctors but that is the same for most other courses including paramedical courses so do not individualize medicine in Nigeria as the only source of half baked graduates.
Sometimes (not everytime) people that blame doctors for the death of their relatives are actually the ones to blame for their nonchalant attitude towards health cos some of these patients are as good as dead. I have seen examples of paramedics even on this thread who claim to be able to manage patients only to kill these patients or to even refer to the physician after its too late. Mind you, the unsuspecting public take these people as medical doctors so all the blame goes to the medical doctors after an unfortunate eventuality. I say with experience that most doctors out there are not actually mbbs graduates. I know a ND holder that now performs appendectomy after years of watching a doctor perform it. He has killed two patients and he is still practising. The unsuspecting public will blame a doctor ''mbbs holder'' for these deaths. Such occurs only in Nigeria.
Now, I am not saying there are no quack medical doctors but so also are half baked graduates in other paramedical courses.
Also, blaming the decadence of the health sector on the leadership of the hospitals being doctors is absolutely misguided in a nation with multisystemic decline. Name a sector in Nigeria doing well in recent times. Education? Defence? God help this country !
I am a graduate of the University of Ibadan and I have written and passed my PLAB 1 exam ,hoping to write PLAB 2 and move to UK in the next two years and leave all these rubbish behind. My fellow medical doctors, I challenge you to take an International exam if you have the capability and leave this country for the wannabe physicians.
P. S .. I support some of JOHESU'S demand and I respect the paramedics. But this envy and not knowing one's place tend to tilt me to the other side.
If you need information on the PLAB process, you can contact me.

Hello.. My Chief

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by laserpen: 8:02pm On May 01, 2020

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Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 12:44am On Nov 08, 2021

TempoJames:

Davido remix: Johesu think say dem bad pass us but nobody badder ku

Joshesu if no get money hide ur face...fire burn them.

Johesu strike has already failed in Lagos....
Some workers have start returning
NMA is boss
pathologists are bosses
Radiologists are bosses.
Johesu bhad but doctors bhaddest.....

The same court that passed Judgement in favour of Johesu has now order suspension of strike.
Johesu wake up to the reality of Nigeria!
Population is nonsense.
A single authority speaks louder than noises made by population of recalcitrants.
Doctor is senate president, minister of labour and will always be minister of health. Johesu what is your stronghold? Strike and noise?
It is a pity that the noble pharmacists had to join the mediocres.
Doctors have never interefered with the activities of the pharmaceutical firms afterall we are not licensed and to be frank a doctor , myself included by training is a total novice in drug production(pharmacognosy) so it wouldn't be proper thinking of heading a pharmaceutical firm....But in the Hospital environment doctors are even superior in knowledge of drug use(pharmacology/therapeutics)pathology, radiology, and overalll patient care. Doctor automatically owns the hospital and lab therein by virtue of training.
I know pharmacists in the house will want to argue. A pharmacist will know drugs used for empirical tx but a doctor by his deep knowledge of pathology knows u shouldn't start a px on a drug yet untill u get samples for investigations as it can influence d results.
A doctor with deep knowledge of pathology(morbid,chemical n hematology) not just microbiology knows better use of drugs. A pharmacist/ other health professions may never understand why a doctor refuses to give hematinics or transfuse a child with acute febrile illness that is pale with even s/s of anemia n mild to moderate low Hb conc.
Others may never understand why a doc refuses to give paracetamol to a child with fever due to a viral infection.
Only radiographers think that once there is fluid in the rectouterine pouch of douglas it signifies PID. Ofcourse it is a total fallacy. Someone with PID with no s/s no pain? Ofcourse it can be a normal ultrasound finding. Radiologists know that.
Doctors can't be replaced by any other profession.
The earlier each profession recognizes its limitations the better for us all.

I can see your quakery Paracetamol for fever ofcourse why not. Have you treated witlow before?

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 12:58am On Nov 08, 2021

TempoJames:

I am sure you don't understand why a medical doctor has no license to start a pharmaceutical company and why a pharmacist can't start a hospital.
Your question of why a medical doctor is in better position to head others will only be answered if u do an indept study of course contents of each field. Only then would you know a medical doctor has superior knowledge in all allied-fields as regard patient management. The hospital setting is not concerned about drug production but its use of which doctors have superior knowledge.
The same pharmacology a pharmacist studies for 3yrs(3l to 5l) is what a med doc studied in a year.
In UNN I studied pharmacology for 6months indepth no topic left out with true/false and negative marking and close marking applied with tendency to repeat or fail out if you fail. I exhuasted Tripathi text of pharmacology. Some times Lecturers finished by 9pm and you come back so exhuasted and tired and still have to read against the next day or accumulate work to your detriment.
Medical doctors are trained to carry knowledge in bulk. The same course others spread out and write semester by semester for 3 years is what a med doc exhausts under stress within a year or less and write exams across(not in parts). Those in medlab,medrehab,medradio, nursing will attest to the fact that their semester exams were used as continous assessment for medsurg students. They never wrote Mb. Last time I went to UNTH as visiting pathologist, the above academic regulations still holds true. Go and confirm and check the pass rate of their last 2nd mb and proof me wrong. Last year I heard only 12 out of 60 passed in dentistry others either failed out or repeated. currently they are 150(against 15 qouta) dentistry students and 325 (against 150 quota)medsurg students in YR1 my 2 kid bros are in pharmacy 500L and medsurg 400L UNN. I have first hand info from my colleagues over there too.
I remember in 2nd mb only 141(+resits) out of 335(including dentistry) passed . Abt 102 repeated 3rd yr and 98 failed out. I remember what happened that night the result was pasted around 9pm after 11hr long meeting by faculty boards. Many cried that day. A colleague that failed out even wanted to commit suicide.Tell which other health fields are subject to such truama. Yet you want to be doctors through the backyard without being test/baptized by the fire and ego of MBBS
Idiots!

Lol u study Pharmacology in what ?

Don't whine yourself

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 1:01am On Nov 08, 2021

danilmo:

pls which other dept pass thru this pls,

u seems not to understand what the guy is saying ,

couple with the letter by Dr OBAFemi as regards how medical practixe is been done in international country where we got it from,

u guys should just sit and chill..

Enough if this Jor.
so many things taken for granted in this country .

Lol you use trauma to qualify payment.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 1:11am On Nov 08, 2021

TempoJames:

That is what differentiate a doc from others. What you see as impossible is possible to a med doc. A medical doc is superior in knowledge of pharmacology to a pharmacist. I Understood my pharmacology to the core . You can't cram and pass true/false with negative marking. When last did u write a true/false exam with minus 1 negative marking applied?
Which means you need to score 75 to get 50 on the dot. If you tick 75 correct and fail 25. 25 will cancel out 25 and u have 50. You see why distinction is harder in medicine than in pharmacy?
Go and sleep if I take you deep into pharmacology you won't survive.
Take home an assignment why you shouldn't give hematinics to a child with mild to moderate anemia with an acute febrile illness?
Why you shouldn't administer digoxin in heart failure secondary to ischemic heart disease?
Why you shouldn't start a px with previous thrombotic event on warfarin alone.
why you shouldn't give paracetamol to a child with fever untill you are sure it is not a viral infection?
You think my knowledge of pharmacology ends with knowing only drug use,moa n sideeffects?
you will be surprised how deficient you are in presence of a medical doctor.

Boy!

Lol I write Pharmacology Theory + True and False.

Theory where you are given 6 pages booklet to fill per question.

3 Questions answer All, so what's your justification..

I wrote like mad in exam.

Lol.

Immunosuppressant and drug restance.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 1:13am On Nov 08, 2021

danilmo:

u see, u feel its impossible, no wonder they set high cut off mark before u gain admission into MBBS coz its made for people who can pressurise their brain to bring out the best in it,

lol, remembered my lecturer telling us in year 2 to get ready for brain percussion, and its not joke mehn..hmmn.

FYI , I have graduate pharmacist in my MBBS class like 3 of them,matured guys o, those guys are dangling in the heat already with low C.A ..
u can never see a doctor stupp so low to study pharmacy after his MBBS degree. but plenty pharmacist in practice are still applyingvbut been denied yearly into MBBS direct entry..

U think say MBBS na Eba and Beans ni..

Lol see your MBBS guys in Clinical Pharmacy doing masters Lol. You this People una no know anything oo.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 1:15am On Nov 08, 2021

TempoJames:

googles won't answer those question. I asked only what a doctor can answer. You won't even see in a texbook of pharmacology. Only a physician that knows in toto how a drug can affect modify the course of a pathology. Boy I'm not here to exchange words.
google out the answers let me plain out your deficiency. I studied pharmacology as a course and again studied its clinical applications in "medicine" as a course too. And a pharmacists thinks he/she would be better.
You won't survive if I take u deeper. First of all bring out your google answers let me put you in place.
Oh you are still a student and want to argue with me? Kid you have a long way to go.
I took oath 9yrs ago and proudly a pathologist.
My 2 kid bros r in UNN medsurg 400L and pharm 500L. I know the limitations in pharmacy.
I want to show you how deficient you are even with google and textbook at your disposal.
If you don't have a solid knowledge of morbid pathology your knowledge of pharmacology is just as shaky as a chemist. Even chemists know the use of drugs.
What differentiate a med doc is how the drug can modify, alleviate or even worsen the pathology.
Just go and pass your exams. Kid!

You should have take it out on a Chief Clinical Pharmacy consultant not on the poor boy.

Guess what does guys are too busy for narialand, they are on LinkedIn.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 1:18am On Nov 08, 2021

optm:
in our various trainings, we hv areas dt are given more attention because it is more relevant to our primary job spec. there re areas of pharmacology a pharmacist ll do better dan u as well as areas u wld do better due to d attention given in training based on its relevance to carrying out primary duties. a newly grad pharmacist is nt all grounded in evry areas that's why there re consultancy areas to mk dem authority in their chosen area of interest. i think a clinical pharmacologist shld be able to giv answers to ur questions. we all had diff trainings to enable us carry out our specific duties. it's childish trying to mk comparison in order to find out who is better. let's learn to hv respect fr one anoda.

Don't mind him, its like a small honey badger standing up and giving a Lion tough time.

I admire my NYSC pharmacist courage to compete with a consultant Physician

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 12:27am On Dec 15, 2021

nurain150:

Lol see your MBBS guys in Clinical Pharmacy doing masters Lol. You this People una no know anything oo.

Oga pharmacist. Dey ur dey..

Wetin come happen to people doing Masters in clinical pharmacy undecided

oh.. abi can u come and do residency in medicine then maybe ? grin

We have Doctor's doing Masters in public health too.. Does that make them not to mellow wen grouped with student who av 1st degrees in Epideiology ni?

Meanwhile , how come u rejuvenated this thread of how many years ago.

U dug it out. Mehn..

Meanwhile, nobody is saying they have knowledge not drug more than pharmacist, afterall u guys produce it. But common, the application of the drug and using it to manage patient is where u LL have to hands up..don't come and bore us with some rare clinically irrelevant secret they bore u with in ur school..

I'm the one managing patient illness, I know what is wrong and what give for my patient to be fine, We've been doing that for long..

Study ur ready made formulas of making drug , read them and produce the drug in ur company , dispense and explain how to use the drug to my patient and dey he day..

If I need a pharmacist knowledge abt a drug, it's to ask for different brand or fake product advise. If u know drug usage better u would have been the one managing patient ke shocked

,

Afterall in my day clinic, I've never heard any taught of asking pharmacist to come and review our patient as regard drug grin

say wetin happen kwa shocked

Wetin concern pharmacist with how I want to manage a neonate having hyperbilirubinemia, or patient having immune reconstitution infalmatory syndrome.

Biko avoid me with ur useless talk.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 2:59am On Dec 15, 2021

danilmo:

Oga pharmacist. Dey ur dey..

Wetin come happen to people doing Masters in clinical pharmacy oh.. abi can u come and do residency in medicine then maybe ?

We have Doctor's doing Masters in public health too.. Does that make them not to mellow wen grouped with student who av 1st degrees in Epideiology ni?

Meanwhile , how come u rejuvenated this thread of how many years ago.

U dug it out. Mehn..

Meanwhile, nobody is saying they have knowledge not drug more than pharmacist, afterall u guys produce it. But common, the application of the drug and using it to manage patient is where u LL have to hands up..don't come and bore us with some rare clinically irrelevant secret they bore u with in ur school..

I'm the one managing patient illness, I know what is wrong and what give for my patient to be fine, We've been doing that for long..

Study ur ready made formulas of making drug , read them and produce the drug in ur company , dispense and explain how to use the drug to my patient and dey he day..

If I need a pharmacist knowledge abt a drug, it's to ask for different brand or fake product advise. If u know drug usage better u would have been the one managing patient ke ,

Afterall in my day clinic, I've never heard any taught of asking pharmacist to come and review our patient as regard drug say wetin happen kwa

Wetin concern pharmacist with how I want to manage a neonate having hyperbilirubinemia, or patient having immune reconstitution infalmatory syndrome.

Biko avoid me with ur useless talk.

Lol Maybe you never hear say clinical Pharmacy dey. You wey no fit mention two formulation for the disease you diagonse lol .

Well I won't say don't manage patient. Manage them when you write out drug interactions I would send the patient back to you. Then sense will come into your head.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 3:01am On Dec 15, 2021

danilmo:

Oga pharmacist. Dey ur dey..

Wetin come happen to people doing Masters in clinical pharmacy oh.. abi can u come and do residency in medicine then maybe ?

We have Doctor's doing Masters in public health too.. Does that make them not to mellow wen grouped with student who av 1st degrees in Epideiology ni?

Meanwhile , how come u rejuvenated this thread of how many years ago.

U dug it out. Mehn..

Meanwhile, nobody is saying they have knowledge not drug more than pharmacist, afterall u guys produce it. But common, the application of the drug and using it to manage patient is where u LL have to hands up..don't come and bore us with some rare clinically irrelevant secret they bore u with in ur school..

I'm the one managing patient illness, I know what is wrong and what give for my patient to be fine, We've been doing that for long..

Study ur ready made formulas of making drug , read them and produce the drug in ur company , dispense and explain how to use the drug to my patient and dey he day..

If I need a pharmacist knowledge abt a drug, it's to ask for different brand or fake product advise. If u know drug usage better u would have been the one managing patient ke ,

Afterall in my day clinic, I've never heard any taught of asking pharmacist to come and review our patient as regard drug say wetin happen kwa

Wetin concern pharmacist with how I want to manage a neonate having hyperbilirubinemia, or patient having immune reconstitution infalmatory syndrome.

Biko avoid me with ur useless talk.

Ofe shey masters clinical Pharmacy ole.

Lol he thinks the faculty would allow that. Have you ever heard a Pharmacist doing masters in surgery.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 5:29am On Dec 15, 2021

nurain150:

Lol Maybe you never hear say clinical Pharmacy dey. You wey no fit mention two formulation for the disease you diagonse lol .

Well I won't say don't manage patient. Manage them when you write out drug interactions I would send the patient back to you. Then sense will come into your head.

Lol. Why won't i know formulation as regard my diagnosis cheesy

The scenerio I gave u have excess breakdown of blood cells to heme and globin by heme oxygenase while NADP reductase convert biliverdin to bilirubin, ligadins convert unconjugated to conjugated bilirubin and I'm fully aware of the effect of glucoronidase complicating the effect.
The said above formulation is what is needed which u don't know, and if u know u would have been been in the position of managing the patient.. comot body bro. Na we Sabi the physiology of the body, Sabi the needed drug.. cheesy

Those who produce Jet fuel, does that make them know about building and flying a Jet? , Jet building are the Surgeons, Pilots are the Internal Medicine. Jet fuel producers/supplier/dispenser only need to tell aviation industry to buy jet fuel that has no lead, and can produce more powerful outcome. Wetin concern them with how they build the engine and piloting a jet.. cool

The illustration I gave u is the exact different between Doctors and pharmacist.

And the way u say drug interaction, u so much talk it like it's d order of the day, like Medics are mumu and novice of pharmacology that write prescription anyhow without considering their counter interaction.. shocked

Many of us exhausted Katzung Pharmacology as mandated ke.. Or u feel spending 12 Month in year 4 to study Pathology and Pharmacology is a joke in Medical sch??

I'm very sure uv loaded ur head with some funny rare drug interaction, rest bro.. its not the order of the day as u painted it .. How many drug prescription u don return this month grin

I will one day set up some of u pharmacist up one day with prescription. grin

Be like u just graduated self, the thing dey shark u..

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by danilmo: 5:40am On Dec 15, 2021

nurain150:

Ofe shey masters clinical Pharmacy ole.

Lol he thinks the faculty would allow that. Have you ever heard a Pharmacist doing masters in surgery.

Taught u said u have Medics doing it before ni maybe na why u said Demn no know anything, was wondering why would medic wanted clinical pharmacy in the first place too,..

Beside oya tell us the job of clinical pharmacist consultant.. Are we expecting something new apart from what's going in the health/hospital settings? No b to just bear consultant pharmacist and dispense insulin, una must come ward come follow manage the Diabeticketoacidotic infant o. Let's watch the display and note of our latest titled clinical pharmacist consultant. cheesy

Dnt mind my talks but what's the special job of a clinical pharmacist/consultant.

Re: NMA Threatens To Embark On Strike If FG Yield To The Demands Of JOHESU by nurain150(m): 8:21am On Dec 15, 2021

danilmo:

Taught u said u have Medics doing it before ni maybe na why u said Demn no know anything, was wondering why would medic wanted clinical pharmacy in the first place too,..

Beside oya tell us the job of clinical pharmacist consultant.. Are we expecting something new apart from what's going in the health/hospital settings? No b to just bear consultant pharmacist and dispense insulin, una must come ward come follow manage the Diabeticketoacidotic infant o. Let's watch the display and note of our latest titled clinical pharmacist consultant.

Dnt mind my talks but what's the special job of a clinical pharmacist/consultant.

Google can be your help line. SAPA no suppose hold you reach that level abi na free mode u dey use for nairaland.

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