udemzyudex:
Chai... We have 4 refineries with over 100b wasted to keep it running yet we still refine crude oil from other countries.

When Atiku talk about selling NNPC some idiots called him names,i mean what's stopping this so called gaint of Africa from refining her own crude oil if not corruption.

Cha,iJesus wept.

Well, Atiku was right, but then he went on to say that fuel should be sold at N90, which means more money poured into subsides...which would negate NNPC privatization

It is not just enough to declare NNPC private, NNPC has to be allowed to sell fuel at the market price, meaning it sells fuel above N300 , but makes a profit that can be used to resusicate refinereis, and build new ones, and attract investment .

oldtruth:


So many gaps. Tomorrow they will come with another epistle. SGS are among their certifiers. Did they certified it at arrival? This country is something else honestly

u still dey call am country,was filling an international form yest..day,in the african section niger,botswana and co were dia but nigeria wasnt.

quentin06:


Dumb argument, if we had refineries crude oil prices won't affect petrol price, a higher crude oil price shud have been an advantage because we have crude.
The logic that higher crude prices equals higher PMS is fraudulent.

Actually, even in countries like the USA, higher crude prices means higher PMS prices

Here in Nigeria, the only way domestic PMS prices could fall is

1.We have enough refineries for them to compete and bring prices down

2.Dollar savings from the removal of subsides means that the value of the naira goes up, meaning that eventually, 'prices go down'.

paparazi232:
why do Nigeria still import fuel !?

Because Nigerians don't want to pay the price at the pump that is needed for domestic refinery to be profitable.

What do they mean by adulterated fuel?
Many vehicles run with fuel containing a percentage of ethanol.
Except say your motor na 1980 or 1990, ethanol mix no suppose worry am.

backbencher:


They would have been if we had run them profitably.

Instead we ran them at a loss, meaning there wasn't enough money to keep them running well, especially for maintenance, and upgrades.

That is why Dangote must be allowed to sell fuel at a high prices....because subsidy would make it difficult for him to earn the profit he needs to keep his refinery working well.

B like say d only thing wey u grab 4rm sch na profit and loss.lol no mind me sha.

Naijanascam:
Sleeping giant....... keep importing with every damn exchange at your disposal...... while your refineries are all monuments.... after promising us 1 refinery a year and we are in the seventh year and nobody is taking responsibility for that

It is happening for the same reason GEJ promised 3 refineries in 2010, and by 2015, not one was built.

Subsidy.

Subsidy means that any refinery built would run at a loss.

If GEJ or Buhari actually built refineries, Nigerians would insist that fuel be sold from those refineries at a low price. The refinereis then won't make enough of a profit, meaning that government has to keep on pumping money into them to prop them up...money that could have been used for education, health, etc....

At the end, they also become monuments, because government money pumped in cannot keep up with their losses.

A refinery has to make a profit so that it can run well. But Nigerians want cheap fuel, and as a result, investors and even government run away from refinereis. At the end, it would just eat money and produce less.

Dangote is building his refinery with lots of loans, which he got because the banks know that if his refinery becomes loss making, they can just simply take over his other lucrative assets and pay themselves back.

Owen247:
B like say d only thing wey u grab 4rm sch na profit and loss.lol no mind me sha.

Would you buy coke at N200 per bottle and sell it at N100 per bottle to 'help the poor'?

You can laugh at me, but if you want to be a successful businessman, run your business at a profit.

We can refine fuel at N300 per liter, sell it at N100 per liter, and people would be 'happy'...meanwhile the refinery won't have profit, and won;t be able to pay staff salaries, salary of companies that maintain the refinery, money to suppliers, etc etc, and break down.

But hey, I'm a joke to you for stating the fact that business loves profit, so keep laughing. It does not concern me really.

backbencher:


Well, Atiku was right, but then he went on to say that fuel should be sold at N90, which means more money poured into subsides...which would negate NNPC privatization

It is not just enough to declare NNPC private, NNPC has to be allowed to sell fuel at the market price, meaning it sells fuel above N300 , but makes a profit that can be used to resusicate refinereis, and build new ones, and attract investment .

If we refine fuel here in Naija don't you think it will be cheaper?it's not as if we are buying the crude oil or shipping it from overseas.

Resuicate refineries after how many years? Despite the Billions been spent every year for it?
These guys don't want to ever make these refineries work because they are benefiting from it.

udemzyudex:


If we refine fuel here in Naija don't you think it will be cheaper?it's not as if we are buying the crude oil or shipping it from overseas.

1.Probably not.

2.A refinery has to earn a profit to pay for staff salaries, welfare, maintenance costs, upgrades, insurance (yes, insurance) , taxes, etc etc...and all that adds up.

3.Niger has a refinery (the country, not the state), and fuel is sold for N350 per liter. The refinery runs well, and is exporting too.

4. Cost of business in Nigeria is high anyways....plus transport costs too are high (building a rail ,and reactivating NNPC's pipeline network could help cut prices.

Resuicate refineries after how many years? Despite the Billions been spent every year for it?
These guys don't want to ever make these refineries work because they are benefiting from it.

Actually they do,which is why they are all backing Dangote's refinery (GEJ helped him get the loans he needed, and APC Buhari even provided more funding via CBN )

The problem is, Nigerians think we must have cheap fuel, so government over time has, long story short, run refinereis at a loss, to keep subsidy costs low. By 2011, we had lost most of our refining capacity.

Even the belgian refinery...Belgium has standard refineries where we can refine our crude....but it means paying much higher to do so...and thus much higher subsidy costs...so we use their bad refineries (and not only us, a lot of African countries do the same.)

tit:
What do they mean by adulterated fuel?
Many vehicles run with fuel containing a percentage of ethanol.
Except say your motor na 1980 or 1990, ethanol mix no suppose worry am.

1.It's methanol

2.No problem with methanol. but the batch in question had more methanol than normal.

backbencher:


Would you buy coke at N200 per bottle and sell it at N100 per bottle to 'help the poor'?

You can laugh at me, but if you want to be a successful businessman, run your business at a profit.

We can refine fuel at N300 per liter, sell it at N100 per liter, and people would be 'happy'...meanwhile the refinery won't have profit, and won;t be able to pay staff salaries, salary of companies that maintain the refinery, money to suppliers, etc etc, and break down.

But hey, I'm a joke to you for stating the fact that business loves profit, so keep laughing. It does not concern me really.

Kobo 4 ur thots,i said NO MIND ME SHA,but hell no,u want to get furious 8 over a joke.

Basicend:
Oil is your major economic pillar.

Yet you export all your crude oil. . This demanding forex.

Yet you export your own crude oil that is meant for public consumption. . Still searching for forex. .

Yet you ultimately import your crude oil. . Still paying and searching for forex. .

Why won't naira continue to depreciate.

Why can't they be truthful to themselves and build refineries within the country. .

Useless and dumb leaders we have.

Good words, but the refineries have to be run profitably, meaning the price of fuel sold from the refinereis has to be done at an amount that would enable them make a profit to run well.

Meaning, subsidy has to go, or it has to be paid for from taxing the 70% of taxable Nigerians who do not pay taxes because they are from the informal sector...in addition to the 30% already paying taxes.

Owen247:
Kobo 4 ur thots,i said NO MIND ME SHA,but hell no,u want to get furious 8 over a joke.

Good evening, and good luck.

Kingpele:
Nawa this government should know that ,we all are going to resist any increase in pump prices of pms ,it is foolishness to import what u have under the ground, which you could have refined with less cumbersome and less funds ,so the best thing is to try to shop importation of pms, the government can't ban rice we are less sufficient in producing and import fuel that we have all it takes to refined, we should make sure they even stop importation of fuel

We can stop importing fuel, if we are willing to pay the price that people who would refine fuel at home demand .

Rawtruth1:
Why is Africa always the destination of all dregs of the world?

Because it is cheaper to refine fuel in the Belgian substandard refinery, than it is to set up a company at home, and refine it at home.

If we refined fuel at home, it would be expensive. Taxes, repair and maintenance costs, transport costs, and staff salaries as well as insurance, would make it so. (A standard refinery costs money to maintain, run and repair and upgrade). Also, the company needs money to build more refineries.

(And then most of the components have to be imported too...yuk. But even if they were made at home, the people making them want a profit too)

See the car industry. A made in Nigeria car is more expensive than a tokumbo 2006 toyota...because of manufacturing costs at home.

backbencher:


Probably not possible. We all think that we must buy fuel cheap....

The thing is, as harsh as it sounds, Nigerians have to realize that profits are needed for any business to run. If a refinery is not making a profit, because we want to buy petrol at cheap prices, we would get substandard products.

Thanks.

" Probably not possible"

Well, we hope things get better someday broda

pacespot:
Does this adulterated fuel imported to the country have anything to do with Dangote refinery?

Nothing. The arrangement predates Dangote going into the oil business..and has been on for over 10 years.

These White people are really racist towards the Black, they might be angry that Nigeria will soon start to refine its own crude oil, hence, they want to flood Nigerian market with all sorts of fuel to complicate the process of the refinery taking off.

Actually, no

1.Foreign governments have been rather cross about the substandard oil being used in Nigeria...it worsens the environment, and environment concerns are big in the West .

2.Many African countries refine their crude in Belgian bad refinereis to keep costs down. (If they used an environmentally frendly and standard refinery in the same Belgium, the cost of fuel would have been above N600 per liter)

3.But since it keeps the cost of fuel low, many African countries use the refinery.

Right now, landing cost of fuel is N282, if not at N290 for Nigeria, whil we sell it at N163. Meaning we pay at least N120 per liter in subsidy.

If we went to a standard belgian refinery, and got standard fuel, the landing cost would be around N800 or above, and subsidy costs would rise accordingly.

4.We can stop this by building a refinery at home. But Nigerians want cheap fuel..and would insist on the refinery selling fuel at N40 or less per liter, meaning we run into losses, and the refinery breaks down. That's why if we want to stop this, we not only build a refinery at home, but we pay them the price they want for the fuel they refine. Not set it at N40 and pay a subsidy that does not cover losses at all.

BigDawsNet:



" Probably not possible"

Well, we hope things get better someday broda

Hopefully.

I agree with you totally

backbencher:


Because it is cheaper to refine fuel in the Belgian substandard refinery, than it is to set up a company at home, and refine it at home.

If we refined fuel at home, it would be expensive. Taxes, repair and maintenance costs, transport costs, and staff salaries as well as insurance, would make it so. (A standard refinery costs money to maintain, run and repair and upgrade). Also, the company needs money to build more refineries.

(And then most of the components have to be imported too...yuk. But even if they were made at home, the people making them want a profit too)

See the car industry. A made in Nigeria car is more expensive than a tokumbo 2006 toyota...because of manufacturing costs at home.

backbencher:


Well, the pms from the mushroom refinereis is cleaner than the 'belgium' petrol, but the mushroom refinereis still

1.Produce substandard PMS, it just happens to be better than the belgium refinery product.

2.Have a negative impact on the environment while doing so.

I suppose government can invest in equipping them with training and modern equipment...but that means the cost of production would shoot up, and at the end of the day, fuel from the mushroom refineres would still be above N300 per liter.

All these problems exist because Nigerians do not want to pay high for standard fuel. We want cheap fuel. And it is cheap, but substandard fuel we are getting.

I know a riff raff when I meet one.


Price will shoot up if we produce locally but government is encouraging dangote to build refinery. Same government gave license to other companies to build.



When we were relying on local production before corruption we were buying it cheaper because we don't pay freight neither do we pay for import duties.


It is a useful idiot like you that they use to deceive the gullible.

tenpipsperday:




I know a riff raff when I meet one.

I know the heir to the throne of Scotland when I see him, your highness...

Price will shoot up if we produce locally but government is encouraging dangote to build refinery. Same government gave license to other companies to build.

Well, yes they did, but without subsidy you would, presumably, pay more for your fuel.

Because anyone building a refinery at home has to recoup his investment, meaning they are not going to sell fuel at a price below N200 per liter. Nor are they going to accept government setting their prices...because they have banks to pay, salaries to pay, and suppliers, and so forth to pay, as well as loans to pay.

That's why private universities cost more than government universities (as one private university owner said..the only help he got from government was land at a cheaper price, the rest of the money he had to find himself. )...because they have to find money for all the above. Government is going to give licence to refineries, they aren't going to pay your loans, maintenance costs, staff salaries, insurance, certainly not your taxes!

When we were relying on local production before corruption we were buying it cheaper because we don't pay freight neither do we pay for import duties.

No, government made the refinereis and NNPC sell at a price below the cost of refining fuel per liter (eg, if it cost the local refinery N100 to produce one liter, Government made NNPC sell it at N60, and paid them a subsidy of N40 to 'cover the loss' which worked, until production costs rose to N130 the following year, and subsidy costs did not rise. Several years of that, and the refineries eventually collapsed...which is why we don't have refinereis.)

And government did that to keep subsidy costs low....by forcing the refineries to run at a loss. Runs at a loss= loss of profit= not being able to pay for maintenance, upgrades, etc, even more refinereis=why we don't have refineries.


I mean, if you were a graphic designer, and I came to you asking to pay for one of your designs, and you charged me N10000 per design, and I refused and paid you N3000, and each and everyone of your customers did that (and government paid you N1000 in addition) so that instead of getting your full N10000, you get N4000, and lose N6000, where in god's own earth are you going to eventually get money for supplies, repair your laptop, buy a new laptop to do better designs, etc etc.

That's how we damaged our refineries

It is a useful idiot like you that they use to deceive the gullible.

Praise from your mouth, your highness,the future soverign of Scotland, is music to my ears. Long life.

Why are we still importing PETROL!??

tizteezy:
Why are we still importing PETROL!??

Because we want to pay N162 for a product that costs above N200 to produce.

Unless you have the kind of collateral to get loans like Dangote,building such a refinery is going to be a loss making enterprise. Better to be like T.Y Danjuma AND sell extracted crude oil from thy rig in the sea....

sureboykris:
It's time to utilize the skills of the so called illegal refineries in the Niger Delta.
What becomes of this country if these people refuse to send us fuel

1.So that the people of Port Harcourt can continue to enjoy soot...no thank you

2.Even if government pays for the upgrades so that the soot can no longer be produced...and they refine fuel to standard, their cost of refining crude to PMS also goes up....because government is not going to pay for maintenance, experienced staff to run the thing, etc etc.

backbencher:


1.So that the people of Port Harcourt can continue to enjoy soot...no thank you

2.Even if government pays for the upgrades so that the soot can no longer be produced...and they refine fuel to standard, their cost of refining crude to PMS also goes up....because government is not going to pay for maintenance, experienced staff to run the thing, etc etc.

..

Don't you think you're being negative?
Of course they should be supported to do their refining in a better way.
It's better than this importing we are doing

sureboykris:
..

Don't you think you're being negative?
Of course they should be supported to do their refining in a better way.
It's better than this importing we are doing

Yes they should, and they should also have the right to make a profit doing so...so that they can have money to pay for maintenance and upgrades, and staff salaries...and even build new small refinery

Meaning any fuel coming from the upgraded refinery won't cost less than N200 , or even , horrors, may cost more than N300.

georgeakins:
Why can't a state like Lagos build a refinery?

And people from a certain geographical area to starting crying marginalization?

Lagos will build a refinery soon. Somewhere in Badagry..

One step at a time.

backbencher:


Yes they should, and they should also have the right to make a profit doing so...so that they can have money to pay for maintenance and upgrades, and staff salaries...and even build new small refinery

Meaning any fuel coming from the upgraded refinery won't cost less than N200 , or even , horrors, may cost more than N300.

No problem. Are we not importing now, wasting foreign exchange subsidizing plus all the corruption. Let's subsidize or support the local refinery rather than this scam going on. I would rather pay N300 to support the local industry than pay same to a cabal

sureboykris:


No problem. Are we not importing now, wasting foreign exchange subsidizing plus all the corruption. Let's subsidize or support the local refinery rather than this scam going on. I would rather pay N300 to support the local industry than pay same to a cabal

Well if we want local refineries to succed, then we have to stop paying subsides and allow them set their price and pay their price.

Whether it is Dangote or minor refiner.

backbencher:


Probably not possible. We all think that we must buy fuel cheap....

The thing is, as harsh as it sounds, Nigerians have to realize that profits are needed for any business to run. If a refinery is not making a profit, because we want to buy petrol at cheap prices, we would get substandard products.

Thanks.

Now, let's be bold enough to lay the blame at the feet of the government who were so unwise to introduce the subsidy then, probably because they felt Nigeria was making more than enough money then.

Looking forward now, the present administration has claimed to remove this subsidy three times, and it is still there. Can't they just be sincere and remove it once?

backbencher:


Nothing. The arrangement predates Dangote going into the oil business..and has been on for over 10 years.




Actually, no

1.Foreign governments have been rather cross about the substandard oil being used in Nigeria...it worsens the environment, and environment concerns are big in the West .

2.Many African countries refine their crude in Belgian bad refinereis to keep costs down. (If they used an environmentally frendly and standard refinery in the same Belgium, the cost of fuel would have been above N600 per liter)

3.But since it keeps the cost of fuel low, many African countries use the refinery.

Right now, landing cost of fuel is N282, if not at N290 for Nigeria, whil we sell it at N163. Meaning we pay at least N120 per liter in subsidy.

If we went to a standard belgian refinery, and got standard fuel, the landing cost would be around N800 or above, and subsidy costs would rise accordingly.

4.We can stop this by building a refinery at home. But Nigerians want cheap fuel..and would insist on the refinery selling fuel at N40 or less per liter, meaning we run into losses, and the refinery breaks down. That's why if we want to stop this, we not only build a refinery at home, but we pay them the price they want for the fuel they refine. Not set it at N40 and pay a subsidy that does not cover losses at all.

Okay, thanks for the explanation.