airsaylongcome:


It's the most widely used LMS especially in higher education. I think there are other more interesting LMS but yeah Moodle and WordPress are ensuring that PHP is going no where

I don't understand your grammer but as a php dev, using laravel framework i guess your mistaking. Wordpress is different thing entirely. Wordpress dont build APIs for mobile app and fintech app but php does.

tollyboy5:

I don't understand your grammer but as a php dev, using laravel framework i guess your mistaking. Wordpress is different thing entirely. Wordpress dont build APIs for mobile app and fintech app but php does.

WordPress is PHP, so yes it can do API for mobile and Fintech APP, API is just REST, Laravel is PHP, Moodle is PHP

iMalyk:
I'd like to talk to you more about this, i'm also on the devops path. how do I join these communities?

I'd say reddit, but given the mess it's in, I'll say you join the forums of each package and tools you plan to use.

Plus check out r/selfhosted, you get to checkout new self-hosted packages, and discover new tools and packages that might be right for the task you want to do. The repo used is https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted, also check out their weekly newsletter, some packages don't make it to the repo, but the ones there should be enough.
There's sysadmin mentioned there, but some of the tools there not for beginners, but explore and use at your own risk.

There's this one too, but I don't use it anymore since I joined r/selfhosted and already know what I'd be using https://github.com/wmariuss/awesome-devops

Make una just dey play

niel63:


Devops is definitely NOT and entty level role. Just know this and know peace.
All these CI/CD verbs... who you think say dey use them... Still, it isn't enough to make you a competent devops engineer. It's a combination of both practices and tools for applications and services.

And you know how tedious it can be to master one.
So, devops can never ever be an entry role.

I agree with you. There’s a lot to cover to get the “entry roles” you see around for DevOps and they are not that easy to grasp for entry level devs.

airsaylongcome you mentioned going through AWS cloud computing courses but sincerely that still wouldn’t make it easier for anyone getting into DevOps. I got the AWS Cloud Developer Associate sometime last year and afterwards I was considering switching to DevOps, bro it was just a scratch on the surface for DevOps even though experience with cloud tools is usually a requirement.

There’s a lot to cover and grasp and you have to be hands-on forget the non-programming thing. To actually get a lot done you need to be on CLI and Text Editors. You need a lot of Linux, be comfortable with Python, YAML and so on.

Millerules:


I agree with you. There’s a lot to cover to get the “entry roles” you see around for DevOps and they are not that easy to grasp for entry level devs.

airsaylongcome you mentioned going through AWS cloud computing courses but sincerely that still wouldn’t make it easier for anyone getting into DevOps. I got the AWS Cloud Developer Associate sometime last year and afterwards I was considering switching to DevOps, bro it was just a scratch on the surface for DevOps even though experience with cloud tools is usually a requirement.

There’s a lot to cover and grasp and you have to be hands-on forget the non-programming thing. To actually get a lot done you need to be on CLI and Text Editors. You need a lot of Linux, be comfortable with Python, YAML and so on.

And someone with absolute zero idea is saying devops is entry level.
These automation tools are being rolled out on daily basis as singleton tools and are making the killing in the market.
CLI is not entry level.
YAML is not entry level even though it is very readable.
Wait until something fails in your pipeline as an entry level dev.

niel63:


And someone with absolute zero idea is saying devops is entry level.
These automation tools are being rolled out on daily basis as singleton tools and are making the killing in the market.
CLI is not entry level.
YAML is not entry level even though it is very readable.
Wait until something fails in your pipeline as an entry level dev.

You do know that entry level is 0-3years experience right? And that in an entry level devops role you are mostly working building lab setups and rarely do you even get to touch staging or testing setups.

And that businesses hire people into entry level devops role purely to train them on their devops tools and processes. If someone with an AWS Cloud Associate program cannot hold down an entry level DevOps role I strongly doubt their drive. I would expect that such person has his small homelab where they are basically messing about with all of their knowledge and all. I can tell you the last time I worked with windows. Or even a GUI. Not because I have to work with CLI, but because I know my competence and muscle memory would increase if I stick with CLI. I tell you straight up that there are entry level roles for Devops

airsaylongcome:


You do know that entry level is 0-3years experience right? And that in an entry level devops role you are mostly working building lab setups and rarely do you even get to touch staging or testing setups.

And that businesses hire people into entry level devops role purely to train them on their devops tools and processes. If someone with an AWS Cloud Associate program cannot hold down an entry level DevOps role I strongly doubt their drive. I would expect that such person has his small homelab where they are basically messing about with all of their knowledge and all. I can tell you the last time I worked with windows. Or even a GUI. Not because I have to work with CLI, but because I know my competence and muscle memory would increase if I stick with CLI. I tell you straight up that there are entry level roles for Devops

I don't know if you know but Cloud Computing is totally different from DevOps. AWS Cloud Developer Associate certification can give you a heads up as per being comfortable with cloud tools but bro DevOps goes beyond. There are other AWS Certifications that are more DevOps focus but it's a ladder you need to climb gradually, and mind you AWS certifications are tough ask anyone in you circle who has written one. AWS Cloud Practitioner na child's play.

About the drive, thanks bro I am comfortable where I am atm. I was only considering DevOps (Lol!). I'm a full-time Mobile Dev and I delve into new stuffs every now and then, it was a scholarship and I couldn't say no. But yet, all my resources are now hosted on AWS, thats where the knowledge came handy, and AWS or is not what you can just jump on even with a practitioner certification.

So back to the discussion, I only quoted you to point out DevOps go way beyond Cloud computing certifications, though it's a good starting point doesn't mean it's easy going forward. You can't even make a Docker container if you don't know how Front-end and Backend work LoL! say less automating testing and building to deploy. I delved in a bit but really I am comfortable where I am atm, drive or no drive.

Millerules:


I don't know if you know but Cloud Computing is totally different from DevOps. AWS Cloud Developer Associate certification can give you a heads up as per being comfortable with cloud tools but bro DevOps goes beyond. There are other AWS Certifications that are more DevOps focus but it's a ladder you need to climb gradually, and mind you AWS certifications are tough ask anyone in you circle who has written one. AWS Cloud Practitioner na child's play.

About the drive, thanks bro I am comfortable where I am atm. I was only considering DevOps (Lol!). I'm a full-time Mobile Dev and I delve into new stuffs every now and then, it was a scholarship and I couldn't say no. But yet, all my resources are now hosted on AWS, thats where the knowledge came handy, and AWS or is not what you can just jump on even with a practitioner certification.

So back to the discussion, I only quoted you to point out DevOps go way beyond Cloud computing certifications, though it's a good starting point doesn't mean it's easy going forward. You can't even make a Docker container if you don't know how Front-end and Backend work LoL! say less automating testing and building to deploy. I delved in a bit but really I am comfortable where I am atm, drive or no drive.

So don’t get me wrong, I understand Devops and Cloud Computing are two different sometimes overlapping field. I am talking from my own experience where my employers have hired Cloud Associates with the aim of training them into Devops folks. The Ghanaian infact had absolutely no clue what he wanted to do but had gone ahead at his cost to get AWS certified. Management saw that as someone trainable and hired him real quick. I’m not a Devops guy but if I had to make a switch, I’m not sure I need more than 6 months of self training.

And you seemed to take my comment about “drive” as an insult. I will illustrate with an example. I’m December 2020, the Nigerian company I was working with folded up and I was out of job. March 2021 a medical practice was starting up and needed a telephony solution. The owner was coming from the US and while I had played around with VOIP, I had absolutely no idea what it took to install and manage one. There was ₦2m on the table for this project. And I had just very minimal telephony frontend knowledge. In three weeks, I had gone from almost no knowledge to intermediate knowledge planning, deploying and configuring a business telephony system. Was I an expert in that short time? No. But I had enough competence to get the phones reliably working to the point they started asking for.some fancy setups. Hunger was my drive. I was looking at the prospect of being fed by other people or "die there" while trying to feed myself.

airsaylongcome:


So don’t get me wrong, I understand Devops and Cloud Computing are two different sometimes overlapping field. I am talking from my own experience where my employers have hired Cloud Associates with the aim of training them into Devops folks. The Ghanaian infact had absolutely no clue what he wanted to do but had gone ahead at his cost to get AWS certified. Management saw that as someone trainable and hired him real quick. I’m not a Devops guy but if I had to make a switch, I’m not sure I need more than 6 months of self training.

And you seemed to take my comment about “drive” as an insult. I will illustrate with an example. I’m December 2020, the Nigerian company I was working with folded up and I was out of job. March 2021 a medical practice was starting up and needed a telephony solution. The owner was coming from the US and while I had played around with VOIP, I had absolutely no idea what it took to install and manage one. There was ₦2m on the table for this project. And I had just very minimal telephony frontend knowledge. In three weeks, I had gone from almost no knowledge to intermediate knowledge planning, deploying and configuring a business telephony system. Was I an expert in that short time? No. But I had enough competence to get the phones reliably working to the point they started asking for.some fancy setups. Hunger was my drive. I was looking at the prospect of being fed by other people or "die there" while trying to feed myself.

I get your point and really didnt't take the "drive" part of your comment as an insult. I was only trying to make a point out, and like I said it's a starting point have a cloud certification, and I may not be the HR who hired the Ghanaian, but I am sure he had more to bring to the table than just the certification.

I work on my own, not everyone gets to work for an organization. Anything I need to run for my business or for a client, I self-learn. It's simply in the context of the discussion I had to point out it goes way beyond just the certification, drive yea maybe, but also what you have been able to gather from months to years of working with other stacks.

The OP was saying why don't people consider other tech fields aside from programming, especially non-programming ones e.g DevOps, there was an argument about how entry-level friendly it may be, and I still insist on the fact that DevOps is not entry-level friendly. You may say you can take up DevOps in six months or less, would you say the same for someone who has never written a line of code before? Or someone who just started out learning HTML+CSS? It's possible yes, but if I have to employ such persons I would decline. Even AWS recommends taking each certification exams after a year of hands-on and familiarizing with the tools, still does not mean people go by that. I had 3 AWS certifications in 2 months highest of them was the Cloud Dev Associate. Not like it's what I wanted at the time, yet the knowledge has been very helpful lately.

In summary I am saying DevOps is not what you can jump on because they say it's non-programming which practically it is. I had severally time self-learning DevOps and I can say for a fact it is not entry-level friendly, but very possible with a year plus of learning. Didnt learn to get employed full-time, but as knowledge I can apply in my day-to-day.

airsaylongcome:


You do know that entry level is 0-3years experience right? And that in an entry level devops role you are mostly working building lab setups and rarely do you even get to touch staging or testing setups.

And that businesses hire people into entry level devops role purely to train them on their devops tools and processes. If someone with an AWS Cloud Associate program cannot hold down an entry level DevOps role I strongly doubt their drive. I would expect that such person has his small homelab where they are basically messing about with all of their knowledge and all. I can tell you the last time I worked with windows. Or even a GUI. Not because I have to work with CLI, but because I know my competence and muscle memory would increase if I stick with CLI. I tell you straight up that there are entry level roles for Devops

Bro, that one na different case o. I understand for every role, there's an entry level.

Someone said Devops itself is an entry level stack! You get the difference? I am not even arguing your point because it is the truth, but sayun deveps is an entry level shii isn't right mehn.

niel63:


Bro, that one na different case o. I understand for every role, there's an entry level.

Someone said Devops itself is an entry level stack! You get the difference? I am not even arguing your point because it is the truth, but sayun deveps is an entry level shii isn't right mehn.

Okay let's even agree that DevOps has a very high entry level barrier. Many people don't consider other low barrier roles like tech support or Sys Admin roles. Stuff that many of them already do without knowing. They already know how to figure out how to solve basic issues like "my printer is not working". Or I cannot connect to the Internet.

Millerules:


I get your point and really didnt't take the "drive" part of your comment as an insult. I was only trying to make a point out, and like I said it's a starting point have a cloud certification, and I may not be the HR who hired the Ghanaian, but I am sure he had more to bring to the table than just the certification.

I work on my own, not everyone gets to work for an organization. Anything I need to run for my business or for a client, I self-learn. It's simply in the context of the discussion I had to point out it goes way beyond just the certification, drive yea maybe, but also what you have been able to gather from months to years of working with other stacks.

The OP was saying why don't people consider other tech fields aside from programming, especially non-programming ones e.g DevOps, there was an argument about how entry-level friendly it may be, and I still insist on the fact that DevOps is not entry-level friendly. You may say you can take up DevOps in six months or less, would you say the same for someone who has never written a line of code before? Or someone who just started out learning HTML+CSS? It's possible yes, but if I have to employ such persons I would decline. Even AWS recommends taking each certification exams after a year of hands-on and familiarizing with the tools, still does not mean people go by that. I had 3 AWS certifications in 2 months highest of them was the Cloud Dev Associate. Not like it's what I wanted at the time, yet the knowledge has been very helpful lately.

In summary I am saying DevOps is not what you can jump on because they say it's non-programming which practically it is. I had severally time self-learning DevOps and I can say for a fact it is not entry-level friendly, but very possible with a year plus of learning. Didnt learn to get employed full-time, but as knowledge I can apply in my day-to-day.

Fair point if you are saying it's not an entry role for someone picking up tech for the first time. I completely agree with that line of argument. But someone who has started learning Cloud or System Administration has already shown some desire that can be built on. I think the OP was referencing that part of learning non-programming skills that can open up their horizon.

airsaylongcome:


Okay let's even agree that DevOps has a very high entry level barrier. Many people don't consider other low barrier roles like tech support or Sys Admin roles. Stuff that ma y of them already do without know. They already know how to figure out how to solve basic issues like "my printer is not working". Or I cannot connect to the Internet.

Lol. True sha.

niel63:


Lol. True sha.

Those low barrier roles are very critical. Today there enough tools for people to learn. You can download Virtualbox, setup a couple of virtual servers and run crazy learning how to ssh into them, how to remotely update them and all. Can host mysql on one, Apache/PHP on another VM and get both "talking". The opportunities are endless really. Even if one just decides to focus on DB Admin. Deploy Postgres or Maria and start learning SQL on both. It doesn't have to be programming programming all the time

DSA is also a great venture.

I'm still doing JS. But I can see it's more about data in the long run for a newbie and intermediate JS/Python programmer.

I ventured small into DevOps thing. Tried setting Vitualbox, alpine and docker to deploy my node apps with git to remote servers. The rigor I passed thru no be here before I could setup what now seems easy. While DevOps is not beans, it is what a venture.

airsaylongcome:


Those low barrier roles are very critical. Today there enough tools for people to learn. You can download Virtualbox, setup a couple of virtual servers and run crazy learning how to ssh into them, how to remotely update them and all. Can host mysql on one, Apache/PHP on another VM and get both "talking". The opportunities are endless really. Even if one just decides to focus on DB Admin. Deploy Postgres or Maria and start learning SQL on both. It doesn't have to be programming programming all the time

Agreed I even picked up Instructional designing again, there's cash there and it's not tech also but only have to prove with a great portfolio.

Thank you

KrazyDave16:

I'd say reddit, but given the mess it's in, I'll say you join the forums of each package and tools you plan to use.

Plus check out r/selfhosted, you get to checkout new self-hosted packages, and discover new tools and packages that might be right for the task you want to do. The repo used is https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted, also check out their weekly newsletter, some packages don't make it to the repo, but the ones there should be enough.
There's sysadmin mentioned there, but some of the tools there not for beginners, but explore and use at your own risk.

There's this one too, but I don't use it anymore since I joined r/selfhosted and already know what I'd be using https://github.com/wmariuss/awesome-devops