₦airaland Forum

floss:
The devil was only created to do evil, that’s the problem he has with God, that was his divine purpose of existence, the devil never liked that job description because he felt it wasn’t fair.

So he wasn’t meant to gain consciousness to the point of questioning his purpose, that’s why he was termed “Rebellious “. Take for example, your superior at your work place gives you an instruction to carry out, which you have been doing in the past in obedience but this particular day he gives you similar instructions and you asked him/her

“what’s the purpose of doing this task? “….

You’ll notice that from that moment, your superior’s countenance will become different towards you and when you repeat similar act, he/she sees you as a problem and sees you as becoming rebellious and always questioning his or her orders.


These were exactly the case between God and lucifer, and something led to it, and it’s called “ over familiarity “, lucifer was God’s most beloved angel, because he was the one doing the dirty work for God… God is holy and cannot be involved directly in anything evil, but he can do evil by proxy using lucifer, which was what lucifer started questioning.

How’s is lucifer God most beloved angel, he knows the dirty work he has been doing as a result of God’s instructions, so it’s always very easy to bring in someone that knows how dangerous you’re closer so that you can always checkmate him or her and also because you both understand how important and dangerous the information and some secrets the person possesses. This is why lucifer felt like he knew God more than other angels and the thing that made him God, but that’s just a grain of salt information when compared to the complexity of God.

Lucifer only knew the bad side of God but didn’t know the loving, good and caring side of God because he wasn’t created for such and he longed so much for it, he can only pretend to enforce the good side but it doesn’t last, the evil side takes over immediately and dominates, that’s why the devil can be caring, loving, but it’s temporary, it’s all enclosed and packaged in deceit because it’s not in his making to be good,

Take a programmed robot as an example, the robot suddenly gains consciousness, but despite his new acquired consciousness, it’s not able to override the program which it was designed, it ends up doing the developer’s bidding.

That’s what the devil experiences, that’s why the devil doesn’t see God as all loving, because he felt it’s against his will.

Note : Angels don’t have free will, if you’re created to be a dancing angel for God’s amusement, that’s what you will be doing in default, you as an angel doesn’t have a choice, all you must do is obey.


This free will was given to humans, that’s why lucifer became angry and filled himself with rage towards humans because Humans was God’s favourite in all his creation,

Lucifer seeing that God loves humans and cared for them, always available for them that multiplied his rage.


Next he went to other angels that do similar job like him and woke their consciousness, it was easy for him because those angels were already evil but obedience, but due to his cunning skill, he only needed to trigger them into being disobedience, those angels were already evil like lucifer by default, but they were obedient to God, so lucifer was able to make them disobey God, and they became rebellious, giving lucifer the number he needed to get God attention.


The good angels it was difficult because by default they were good, so tricking them to join him was a waste of time, so that was where the war started cooking.



God made all evil angels leave heaven, they fell short of God’s Grace…. That’s where the concept of

“Fallen Angels “ came from.


Those rebellious angels lost all privileges, since all was orchestrated by lucifer, he led them away waiting for the day of final hearing, until then Lucifer have been busy.

So if angels don't have Freewill, How can they either obey God or disobey him?

Gabrielshow24:
➜"not her belief, Dummy" Her analogy created the "contradiction"!!!
➜Am calling you out for making a generalization from her perceived "contradiction" to discredit the omnipotence of God🤨!!! An hasty generalization at best!!!

She gave us an analogy to explain her beliefs. When question on the content of the analogy, she reasserted its validity. Yet you think the contradiction revealed in all of her explanations are not part and parcel of her very belief? Are you high?

2. Again, stop using terms you lack a correct understanding of. 🙄🙄

Kobojunkie:
She gave us an analogy to explain her beliefs. When question on the content of the analogy, she reasserted its validity. Yet you think the contradiction revealed in all of her explanations are not part and parcel of her very belief? Are you high?

2. Again, stop using terms you lack a correct understanding of. 🙄🙄

Her supposed validity which ended up being wrong!

The issue lies in you using this flaw, to conclude God's impotence!

How do they correlate?
It's just like someone concluding la Liga is thrash because man UTD (😁) beat real Valladolid.

That's why you are the one that doesn't know what he is saying!!!

And in fact, you don't even know the fallacies you have committed.

If you can't see it, then no one can help you!!!

Gabrielshow24:
➜Her supposed validity which ended up being wrong!
➜The issue lies in you using this flaw, to conclude God's impotence! How do they correlate? It's just like someone concluding la Liga is thrash because man UTD (😁) beat real Valladolid. That's why you are the one that doesn't know what he is saying!!! And in fact, you don't even know the fallacies you have committed. If you can't see it, then no one can help you!!!

It ended up being wrong because you conveniently asserted it as such?

2. She makes clear that her god is an impotent one. I, in my response, reassert her very own declaration. However, you feel I am at fault for doing this?

Religion is nothing but a waste of the human mind and time! 🙄🙄🙄🙄

Truthseeker10:
So if angels don't have Freewill, How can they either obey God or disobey him?

When you build a robot that can do everything you ask but you remove the robot ability to have a mind of its own, it can’t question your decision, … will you say the robot have a will of its own because it obeys every of your command?

Newgoodkk:
Pls. We need Knowledge, Don't turn this into Unnecessary Argument, Make your Comment and don't try to force your View, Comments and Believes on others

It's just a pity that most people don't like being orderly, despite reading what the OP says this still turned to unnecessary argument.

I remember you once said about me:

Newgoodkk:
MaxinDHouse is Coming up with much more Lies , U haven't seen Enough Lies . Wait!

But out of all Nairalanders it's the same MaxInDHouse that first came to your mind when you need knowledge of what the Bible teaches!

Newgoodkk:
Why did God create the devil to destroy His plan?
Some Would say , The Devil wasn't Created to destroy God's Plan but Sin Entered into him and He Turned Against God. God created Everything, Where did SIN Emanated from? Did the Devil Creates SIN? The Devil was Said to be among the Angels ..Right? Does the Devil too has Flesh ,Was Sinful Spirits Parts of the Devil's Creative Components? if this is true ,Meaning God Puts in that Sinful spirit in the Devil.. Was it God's Original Plan to Make the devil acts the way he did. Remember Judas...Christ Must be betrayed for the Prophesy to be fulfilled Revelation 12 V 7..And there was War in Heaven ....
Pls. We need Knowledge, Don't turn this into Unnecessary Argument, Make your Comment and don't try to force your View, Comments and Believes on others Don't come on here and starts commenting like God. If you comment, Wether right or wrong Leave others , they have right to believe or not. MaxinDHouse, Kobojunkie , Dtruthspeaker and others You are all Welcome.

I believe by now you have something better to say about MaxInDHouse because i wonder how someone could be a liar for real yet you choose him first to know the truth!

Well perhaps you should start another thread and invite all argumentators in to come and show their talent but as for this thread it's messed up already!

Gabrielshow24:
If true, then "Heaven" must come as a shock to you.

After all, in the "end" there will be no death, sickness and disease - evil will finally be wiped out🤔

What say you then?
Does God need all this to still show he is Good🤨?

Lucifyre:
Lol maybe you should take your advice and put your brain cells to work. You were the one that made the assertion good can't exist without evil. If good can't exist without evil, then god is limited and not omnipotent cause he can't create just good. If god is omnipotent, then he can create good without needing to create evil. You can't have it both ways. 😌

Kobojunkie:
Your particular confusion is palpable! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Again, your deity is directly opposed by another deity out there — the antimatter to his matter — is what you have been insisting upon all this time. But somehow, you refuse to accept what you said as that?

You people are so idiotic it is almost unbelievable!
GOD HIMSELF established our reality that way!!!
It is like, say, someone wrote a computer program a certain way and you're asking why doesn't change it or why didn't he write it another way!

The other guy, oga you're talking NONSENSE. For every matter there exists antimatter. You are conflating it with matter and antimatter colliding!!!

DaddyCoool:
➜You people are so idiotic it is almost unbelievable! GOD HIMSELF established our reality that way!!! It is like, say, someone wrote a computer program a certain way and you're asking why doesn't change it or why didn't he write it another way!...

Nonsense!

There are over 4000 different deities defined out there. Clearly, yours isn't one of the many supposed omnipotent ones out there. 😂😂😂😂😂

DaddyCoool:
You people are so idiotic it is almost unbelievable!
GOD HIMSELF established our reality that way!!!
It is like, say, someone wrote a computer program a certain way and you're asking why doesn't change it or why didn't he write it another way!

The other guy, oga you're talking NONSENSE. For every matter there exists antimatter. You are conflating it with matter and antimatter colliding!!!

It seems you never learn!
Your allusion of every matter having a corresponding anti matter in this regard is flawed, due to the fact that the practicality of such contradicts it!

Theoretically, you can say that both exist together and might have been spurred in equal amounts during big bang but practically antimatter is rare!!!

That's the unintended hole in your logic.
Your duality fails miserably because infact
Lots of matter exists physically without antimatter!
And if they existed in equal amounts they will annihilate each other.

Gabrielshow24:
It seems you never learn!
Your allusion of every matter having a corresponding anti matter in this regard is flawed, due to the fact that the practicality of such contradicts it!

Theoretically, you can say that both exist together and might have been spurred in equal amounts during big bang but practically antimatter is rare!!!

That's the unintended hole in your logic.
Your duality fails miserably because infact
Lots of matter exists physically without antimatter!
And if they existed in equal amounts they will annihilate each other.

What's amazing about your type is that you REFUSE to do any rudimentary research whatsoever. You rather go with what you "know" or heard. See the two things you're confusing below

Gabrielshow24:
why then is antimatter rare🤦🏾‍♂️?

Do you know how much 1g of antimatter is worth?

If truly there is a one to one ratio.
They will nullify themselves and transform into energy.

Is that what exists now? 🤦🏾‍♂️
The present universe lacks that ratio.
Matter is far more!!!

My friend you're confusing existing with colliding. Now cut the bs

Kobojunkie:
Nonsense!

There are over 4000 different deities defined out there. Clearly, yours isn't one of the many supposed omnipotent ones out there. 😂😂😂😂😂

Kobojunkie:
Nonsense!

[quote author=Lucifyre post=134469848]Lol maybe you should take your advice and put your brain cells to work. You were the one that made the assertion good can't exist without evil. If good can't exist without evil, then god is limited and not omnipotent cause he can't create just good. If god is omnipotent, then he can create good without needing to create evil. You can't have it both ways. 😌

Kobo I've told you b4 you're not very smart. I think I'd add Lucif to you.
Someone CHOSE to create a universe a certain way and you're basically saying he didn't create it another way because he couldn't!!

DaddyCoool:
My friend you're confusing existing with colliding. Now cut the bs

You don't know what you are saying.
Now think!

If for every matter there consists an equivalent then you won't have anything in this universe but pure energy.

Why is this not so?
Can't you get it?
Why not show an ai overview as to why antimatter is rare?
And why 1g of it is worth exuberant amounts!!!

Maybe then you will understand!!!
The implications of what you are positing!!!
You are just taking it at face view, your statement itself is false!!!

"You are shouting colliding" - collision is not my problem, the inherently flawed analogy even validates this universe as an exception!!!

Now ask for an ai overview why even with the equivalence of matter and antimatter, which you so hold on to, why there is more presence of matter than antimatter🤨?

Maybe then you will see your error!
If you can't see this, then no one can help you!!

Your statement implies that for every matter, there exists an equal amount of antimatter. While it is true that matter and antimatter are produced in equal amounts in "certain" high-energy processes (like particle collisions), the observable universe is predominantly made of matter. The rarity of antimatter in the universe is a significant and unresolved question in physics, often referred to as the matter-antimatter asymmetry problem.

If you don't know something, accept and go along.
This analogy of yours is flawed and makes God look incapable!!!
Something, "others👀" sought to take advantage of as conclusive proof as to why God is not omnipotent!!!

Gabrielshow24:
Lucifyre, you know how it ended sour for you and your friends😂😂😂 last time!

Let that just be a remainder🤨.
I don't have your time this night!

A remainder 🤣 i don't even know who you are. Anyways I'd remaind myself.

[quote author=DaddyCoool post=134470977][/quote]You make assertions without a single lick of evidence in any way, shape or form, then your assertion stumbles on and contradicts itself before even leaving the gate. You then make more baseless assertions to support your previous contradictory baselsess assertions. If that's smart, i certainly don't want to be smart. Ironic.

floss:
When you build a robot that can do everything you ask but you remove the robot ability to have a mind of its own, it can’t question your decision, … will you say the robot have a will of its own because it obeys every of your command?

So the question still stands.
If Angels don't have Freewill, can they choose either o obey God or disobey him?

Truthseeker10:
So the question still stands.
If Angels don't have Freewill, can they choose either o obey God or disobey him?

When a robot’s consciousness is awakened, the question of free will becomes obsolete because it overrides every command that makes it a one way wired entity, it becomes aware that there are absolute possibility of options to explore and choose from…

Being an entity that was still young to free will, those fallen angels will likely trust one that woke them and believe whatever logic that was presented in front of them. Unlike when they weren’t aware there were other options to explore.

The good angels too tasted that consciousness but the difference was that the good angels were never created to possess anything evil inside them, so that was the mistake lucifer made, he thought he could make all the angles revolt against God, rather that consciousness made the good angels defend themselves against the evil ones, that’s the first battle that was ever fought.

They defeated the bad angels because the good angels are much in number and stronger too.

Mind you, Archangel Michael have other angels in his category, but he was the one in charge when it comes to battle, they have thousands of archangels that are created for Battle, they only understand Battle because that’s the purpose of their existence.

So to answer your question, when an angel becomes conscious, that’s when it understands better the purpose of its existence and follow it to the later.

A conscious person can choose to become evil suddenly and may be after some time decides to become a good person again.

But in angels, if you don’t have evil in your program when you were made, you cannot become evil even after becoming conscious, so you cannot convince a good angel to become evil, neither can you turn an evil angel to become good. They’ve different code lines.

They don’t exist out of choice, they’re robots and are made to obey all the time whether you’re an evil angel or a good angel.

Gabrielshow24:
You don't know what you are saying.
Now think!

If for every matter there consists an equivalent then you won't have anything in this universe but pure energy.

Why is this not so?
Can't you get it?
Why not show an ai overview as to why antimatter is rare?
And why 1g of it is worth exuberant amounts!!!

Maybe then you will understand!!!
The implications of what you are positing!!!
You are just taking it at face view, your statement itself is false!!!

"You are shouting colliding" - collision is not my problem, the inherently flawed analogy even validates this universe as an exception!!!

Now ask for an ai overview why even with the equivalence of matter and antimatter, which you so hold on to, why there is more presence of matter than antimatter🤨?

Maybe then you will see your error!
If you can't see this, then no one can help you!!

Oga, it is settled science that for every matter there is antimatter. It is NOT under review or argument. Just as for every up there is a down, or for every left there is a right. That's how God set up our universe!

Lucifyre:
You make assertions without a single lick of evidence in any way, shape or form, then your assertion stumbles on and contradicts itself before even leaving the gate. You then make more baseless assertions to support your previous contradictory baselsess assertions. If that's smart, i certainly don't want to be smart. Ironic.

This is NOT a question of assertions and evidence. It is a question of your and Kobo's inability to think. You are told someone CHOSE to make something a certain way and you jump to that proves he is not omnipotent because he didn't make it a different way. Pure non sequitur!

floss:
When a robot’s consciousness is awakened, the question of free will becomes obsolete because it overrides every command that makes it a one way wired entity, it becomes aware that there are absolute possibility of options to explore and choose from…

Being an entity that was still young to free will, those fallen angels will likely trust one that woke them and believe whatever logic that was presented in front of them. Unlike when they weren’t aware there were other options to explore.

The good angels too tasted that consciousness but the difference was that the good angels were never created to possess anything evil inside them, so that was the mistake lucifer made, he thought he could make all the angles revolt against God, rather that consciousness made the good angels defend themselves against the evil ones, that’s the first battle that was ever fought.

They defeated the bad angels because the good angels are much in number and stronger too.

Mind you, Archangel Michael have other angels in his category, but he was the one in charge when it comes to battle, they have thousands of archangels that are created for Battle, they only understand Battle because that’s the purpose of their existence.

So to answer your question, when an angel becomes conscious, that’s when it understands better the purpose of its existence and follow it to the later.

A conscious person can choose to become evil suddenly and may be after some time decides to become a good person again.

But in angels, if you don’t have evil in your program when you were made, you cannot become evil even after becoming conscious, so you cannot convince a good angel to become evil, neither can you turn an evil angel to become good. They’ve different code lines.

They don’t exist out of choice, they’re robots and are made to obey all the time whether you’re an evil angel or a good angel.

Please define consciousness.

So do humans have consciousness? If yes, do we have Freewill?


So Angels who are robot who could not choose to obey God or disobey him had no consciousness? If yes, when did they begin to have consciousness?

DaddyCoool:
Oga, it is settled science that for every matter there is antimatter. It is NOT under review or argument. Just as for every up there is a down, or for every left there is a right. That's how God set up our universe!

🤦You and this your pathetic case!
I might let the rest slide but as for this "matter and antimatter symmetry" you so allude to that's entirely wrong!!!

Just because the laws of physics suggest a symmetry does not mean that it is reflected in the observable universe.

Look at the universe is there symmetry between matter and antimatter? 🤨

And if there were to be symmetry would you exist 🤨?

"As long as there's a simple contradiction then your conclusion doesn't hold"

Even scientists give boundaries as to when you should expect "equal matter to antimatter ratio" but some Nigerian wannabe Einstein says otherwise!!!
When there's evidence to the contrary 🤕!!!

Thereby making a pathetic generalization!!!
Every Scientist knows for a basic fact that there is "asymmetry of matter to antimatter"


Hence your statement is entirely false!!!
If you can't see this, then am sorry no one can help you!!!

The devil is the "Ruler of Darkness" AKA the moon. Which is very much part of God. As God is the totality of existence.
The devil is not a dual opposite of God. That is an insult against the creator.
The devil does only what God has created it to do. That is to rule the night.
The Enuma Elisha tell us that after Marduk has finished creating the universe, he gave the gods their domain and station. To Nanna he gave the moon.
Good and evil are God's exclusive properties. He forms the light and creates darkness.
He makes peace and creates disasters/calamities. He does all these things.

Truthseeker10:
Please define consciousness.

So do humans have consciousness? If yes, do we have Freewill?


So Angels who are robot who could not choose to obey God or disobey him had no consciousness? If yes, when did they begin to have consciousness?

To awake from something means to be conscious… either you were sleeping and woke up or you suddenly awoke into having a deeper understanding of something.

Yes humans does have free will…

Here’s where it gets interesting, humans doesn’t need to be awake to make use of their free will but for angels they only became awake or conscious but doesn’t have free will

That’s why I explained earlier that the angels became awake of their true existence but each maintaining that obedience because it’s in their dna to be obedient to their different cause, whether good angel or evil angel


That’s why I always tell people that bad exist to compliment good… they’re both the same with different polarity. If you’re in the good side and examine the other side(evil side) you’ll say that the evil side is totally evil

Same way if you’re created evil and you’re on the evil side, when you examine the good side, you will see the good sides as the wrong side because you don’t have any good in you.

God knew all these in order to strike a balance, because evil compliments good. Good makes you know that evil is bad especially if you’re good.

While evil makes you know that evil is the right thing especially when you are evil.

That’s why I laugh when people say “why can’t God destroy lucifer?

He can but he won’t because lucifer is serving a divine purpose in the creation,

sonmvayina:
The devil is the "Ruler of Darkness" AKA the moon. Which is very much part of God. As God is the totality of existence.
The devil is not a dual opposite of God. That is an insult against the creator.
The devil does only what God has created it to do. That is to rule the night.
The Enuma Elisha tell us that after Marduk has finished creating the universe, he gave the gods their domain and station. To Nanna he gave the moon.
Good and evil are God's exclusive properties. He forms the light and creates darkness.
He makes peace and creates disasters/calamities. He does all these things.

It's funny how these folks go in circles.

The strongest LIGHT creates the strongest SHADOWS.

The lips of wisdom are closed, except to the ears of understanding.

@Sonmvayina pleased to meet you.

I have heard great things about you my good sir.

DaddyCoool:
This is NOT a question of assertions a[/b]nd evidence. It is a question of your and Kobo's inability to think. [b]You are told someone CHOSE to make something a certain way and you jump to that proves he is not omnipotent because he didn't make it a different way. Pure non sequitur!

Can't help but laugh at the bolded, is this you thinking😅 or you don't know what an assertion is. Anyways like i said earlier you can't have it both ways, so good can exist without evil and your god could make good without evil but "chose" to not do it because reasons, so he's not omnibenevolent or all loving. Which checks out after all he proudly boasts of creating evil. Lol!

Your original statement btw which shows your god constrained by limits ergo not omnipotent. "Bad Devil is necessary because good God exists".

Gabrielshow24:
🤦You and this your pathetic case!
I might let the rest slide but as for this "matter and antimatter symmetry" you so allude to that's entirely wrong!!!

Just because the laws of physics suggest a symmetry does not mean that it is reflected in the observable universe.

Look at the universe is there symmetry between matter and antimatter? 🤨

And if there were to be symmetry would you exist 🤨?

"As long as there's a simple contradiction then your conclusion doesn't hold"

Even scientists give boundaries as to when you should expect "equal matter to antimatter ratio" but some Nigerian wannabe Einstein says otherwise!!!
When there's evidence to the contrary 🤕!!!

Thereby making a pathetic generalization!!!
Every Scientist knows for a basic fact that there is "asymmetry of matter to antimatter"


Hence your statement is entirely false!!!
If you can't see this, then am sorry no one can help you!!!

You agree that AI goes through millions fo papers and gives the most correct answer, right?
So we ask AI and this is the UNEQUIVOCAL answer:

floss:
To awake from something means to be conscious… either you were sleeping and woke up or you suddenly awoke into having a deeper understanding of something.

Yes humans does have free will…

Here’s where it gets interesting, humans doesn’t need to be awake to make use of their free will but for angels they only became awake or conscious but doesn’t have free will

That’s why I explained earlier that the angels became awake of their true existence but each maintaining that obedience because it’s in their dna to be obedient to their different cause, whether good angel or evil angel


That’s why I always tell people that bad exist to compliment good… they’re both the same with different polarity. If you’re in the good side and examine the other side(evil side) you’ll say that the evil side is totally evil

Same way if you’re created evil and you’re on the evil side, when you examine the good side, you will see the good sides as the wrong side because you don’t have any good in you.

God knew all these in order to strike a balance, because evil compliments good. Good makes you know that evil is bad especially if you’re good.

While evil makes you know that evil is the right thing especially when you are evil.

That’s why I laugh when people say “why can’t God destroy lucifer?

He can but he won’t because lucifer is serving a divine purpose in the creation,

Kindly support the statement above in bold with a bible verse.

floss:
The devil was only created to do evil, that’s the problem he has with God, that was his divine purpose of existence, the devil never liked that job description because he felt it wasn’t fair...

Sorry, you are talking rubbish.

Where did you get this report of Satan being created to do evil?

For, do you know that the Destroyer who swept Egypt and the Angels who wiped out Sodom and Gomorrah were not cast in the lake of Fire?

But Satan is caught and thrown in Prison in disgrace and is finally burnt 🔥 in Fire forever!

ANCESTORIAL8:
It's funny how these folks go in circles.

The strongest LIGHT creates the strongest SHADOWS.

The lips of wisdom are closed, except to the ears of understanding.

@Sonmvayina pleased to meet you.

I have heard great things about you my good sir.

Thank you sir.
I just drop them.

Whoever is of the light listens and learns.

Lucifyre:
Can't help but laugh at the bolded, is this you thinking😅 or you don't know what an assertion is. Anyways like i said earlier you can't have it both ways, so good can exist without evil and your god could make good without evil but "chose" to not do it because reasons, so he's not omnibenevolent or all loving. Which checks out after all he proudly boasts of creating evil. Lol!

Your original statement btw which shows your god constrained by limits ergo not omnipotent. "Bad Devil is necessary because good God exists".

No it is about your inability to think, you and kobojunkie. Someone created a computer game where things occurre in pairs. He assigns himself the position of good guy and to maintain HIS OWN rules creates a bad guy to ballance it. And here you are, saying that proves he is not omnipotent. Pure non siquiture!

ANCESTORIAL8:
It's funny how these folks go in circles.

The strongest LIGHT creates the strongest SHADOWS.

The lips of wisdom are closed, except to the ears of understanding.

@Sonmvayina pleased to meet you.

I have heard great things about you my good sir.

You clearly have never been to a football stadium before

And clearly this is still Somnvayina.
No normal person has ever praises this Mad person. So this is Somnvayina playing out his madness of praising himself and replying.