₦airaland Forum

Truthseeker10:
Baba go and argue with meta ai and Wikipedia. Convince them about the truth about the Trinity and come back to me

I want reason on how the equality exists in Trinity.

Truthseeker10:
So without them being born again, can they see the kingdom of God according to John 3:3?

They would see the kingdom of God as a result of the high priest sacrifices for their atonement.

Bfly:
They would see the kingdom of God as a result of the high priest sacrifices for their atonement.

Is that what Jesus said in John 3:3? If no, biblical reference please.

Bfly:
I want reason on how the equality exists in Trinity.

You can ask Wikipedia or meta ai. I have given you two sources that do not contradicts.

Truthseeker10:
Is that what Jesus said in John 3:3? If no, biblical reference please.

The statement did not apply to them in its similitude.
They were long gone before the statement was made.

Truthseeker10:
You can ask Wikipedia or meta ai. I have given you two sources that do not contradicts.

Give me reason that make them equal?

Pausing here

Bfly:
Give me reason that make them equal?

Pausing here

ask meta ai and Wikipedia. Go and change the Trinity doctrine there.

Bfly:
The statement did not apply to them in its similitude.
They were long gone before the statement was made.

So are you implying that David and Enoch went to heaven when they died?

Truthseeker10:
ask meta ai and Wikipedia. Go and change the Trinity doctrine there.

Obviously; you have found the truth you seek in Meta Ai and wiki; hence truthseer.

Truthseeker10:
So are you implying that David and Enoch went to heaven when they died?

I’m on the fact that they had renewed life and were acceptable unto God and would reign with him in heaven.

If you believe otherwise let me know.

Bfly:
I’m on the fact that they had renewed life and were acceptable unto God and would reign with him in heaven.

If you believe otherwise let me know.

Did they go to heaven when they died?

Bfly:
Obviously; you have found the truth you seek in Meta Ai and wiki; hence truthseer.

😂😂😂your trinity doctrine is there. Go and enlighten yourself. You don't know what you believe in. Stop disgracing yourself.

Truthseeker10:
😂😂😂your trinity doctrine is there. Go and enlighten yourself. You don't know what you believe in. Stop disgracing yourself.

Is Trinity doctrine from wiki or Metal Ai?

Truthseeker10:
Did they go to heaven when they died?

David was buried when he died
God took Enoch

Bfly:
The Bible emphasizes Enoch was no more. David was buried when he died.

Enoch died!

MaxInDHouse:
Enoch died!

‘No more’ could means death; but Elijah experience is a turning point.

Yet, those of David and Enoch are referenced in the Bible

Bfly:
‘No more’ could means death; but Elijah experience is a turning point.
Yet, those of David and Enoch are referenced in the Bible

Elijah died too he wasn't taken to heaven rather he was transported to another location on the planet.
He later sent a letter to an Israelite king from where he was taken {2Chronicles 21:12} and according to Jesus no man has reached heaven before Jesus came to the earth! John 3:13

So Elijah grew old and died in his location just like any other human as God's word said that all humans are sinners and so death is inevitable! Romans 5:12

MaxInDHouse:
Elijah died too he wasn't taken to heaven rather he was transported to another location on the planet.
He later sent a letter to an Israelite king from where he was taken {2Chronicles 21:12} and according to Jesus no man has reached heaven before Jesus came to the earth! John 3:13

So Elijah grew old and died in his location just like any other human as God's word said that all humans are sinners and so death is inevitable! Romans 5:12

He sent a letter to the king through who? Who knew his abode then?

Elijah As prophet who has possibly prophesied about the wicked reign of the king; such prophecy could’ve been delivered as a letter by Elisha who could have been told the prophecy by Elijah while he was still a servant.

Bfly:
David was buried when he died
God took Enoch

Did they go to heaven? Simple question.

Bfly:
Is Trinity doctrine from wiki or Metal Ai?

Baba ask them.

3nity7:
ok, so one can just get baptized without believing and confessing Jesus as Lord and be saved? Because that is where your argument seems to be pointing to and this i disagree. Because you will always hear the people believed and were baptized. And you even don't seem to believe in the Holy Ghost baptism which is the real thing but the water is just a symbol. Please Baptism itself does not save, I guess you are Catholic.

You may disagree, but I’ve stated early Church teaching, supported by patterns within Scripture as per refs in my previous post. In cases where children cannot profess faith themselves, the Church entrusts this responsibility to parents/ godparents, who then commit to raising the child in the faith.
The Holy Spirit is present and active in a valid baptism and this has been taught since the early church. Water and Spirit baptism are connected deeply.
You seem to be going against scriptures regarding baptisimal regeneration when you you state that baptism doesn't save -
Peter speaks directly to this in1 Peter 3:18–21, where he compares baptism to the waters of the flood.
“.......Baptism which corresponds to this ,now saves you not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.”

Bfly:
He sent a letter to the king through who? Who knew his abode then?
Elijah As prophet who has possibly prophesied about the wicked reign of the king; such prophecy could’ve been delivered as a letter by Elisha who could have been told the prophecy by Elijah while he was still a servant.

Sorry God's word said "a letter", Jesus said no man has been to heaven before his coming and according to God's word all humans (including Elijah) must die.

So Elijah was taken to another location on planet earth not heaven!

btoks:
You may disagree, but I’ve stated early Church teaching, supported by patterns within Scripture as per refs in my previous post. In cases where children cannot profess faith themselves, the Church entrusts this responsibility to parents/ godparents, who then commit to raising the child in the faith.
The Holy Spirit is present and active in a valid baptism and this has been taught since the early church. Water and Spirit baptism are connected deeply.
You seem to be going against scriptures regarding baptisimal regeneration when you you state that baptism doesn't save -
Peter speaks directly to this in1 Peter 3:18–21, where he compares baptism to the waters of the flood.
“.......Baptism which corresponds to this ,now saves you not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.”

so one can be saved without believing and confessing Jesus but by baptism alone, Yes or no? Secondly, were in the scriptures is infant or children baptism illustrated or supported? Don't tell me church leaders because church leaders can be wrong.

Truthseeker10:
Did they go to heaven? Simple question.

David has his place in heaven.
So also is Enoch.

Yet, they don’t live there for now.

Bfly:
David has his place in heaven.
So also is Enoch.
Yet, they don’t live there for now.

Can you back the highlighted with Bible quotations?

Because this is God's promise that David himself penned down with his own hands:

The righteous (David inclusive) will possess the earth, And they will live forever on it. Psalms 37:29

MaxInDHouse:
Can you back the highlighted with Bible quotations?

Because this is God's promise that David himself penned down with his own hands:

The righteous (David inclusive) will possess the earth, And they will live forever on it. Psalms 37:29

They will live forever. yes, even you too; if you are as righteous. Yet wait till then.
The day is coming when that shall be; The Judgement day.

MaxInDHouse:
Sorry God's word said "a letter", Jesus said no man has been to heaven before his coming and according to God's word all humans (including Elijah) must die.

So Elijah was taken to another location on planet earth not heaven!

Check Hebrew 11:5

3nity7:
so one can be saved without believing and confessing Jesus but by baptism alone, Yes or no? Secondly, were in the scriptures is infant or children baptism illustrated or supported? Don't tell me church leaders because church leaders can be wrong.

No, it's faith and works. baptism apart from faith does not save. In the case of infants, the faith of the parents/ godparents stands in until the child can profess their own faith just as in the old covenant, infants were included through circumcision.Paul links to baptism in Col 2:11–12.

While there’s no verse that explicitly says “baptise infants,” we see strong clues here:

Acts 2:38–39 – “The promise is for you and your children.”

Acts 16:15,33 and 1 Cor 1:16 – Entire households were baptised. a typical jewish household would naturally include children

Mark10:14 Jesus welcomed children into God's Kingdom with no age limit.


Early Christians practiced infant baptism with no issues, in fact the main debate was whether to wait gor 8 days or not before baptism. While individual church leaders can be wrong, the entire church guided by the holy spirit cant be wrong. Early church affirmed infant bsptism.

Some qoutes from early church fathers:
Origen (c. 185–254 AD)

“The Church received from the apostles the tradition of giving baptism even to infants.”
– Commentary on Romans 5:9


Hippolytus of Rome (c. 170–235 AD)

“Baptize first the children; and if they can speak for themselves, let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them.”

Cyprian of Carthage (c. 200–258 AD)

“As to what pertains to the case of infants: You [Fidus] said that they ought not to be baptized within the second or third day after their birth... We all thought otherwise…that the mercy and grace of God should be denied to no person born.”
– Letter to Fidus, Epistle 64(59)

btoks:
No, it's faith and works. baptism apart from faith does not save. In the case of infants, the faith of the parents/ godparents stands in until the child can profess their own faith just as in the old covenant, infants were included through circumcision.Paul links to baptism in Col 2:11–12.

While there’s no verse that explicitly says “baptise infants,” we see strong clues here:

Acts 2:38–39 – “The promise is for you and your children.”

Acts 16:15,33 and 1 Cor 1:16 – Entire households were baptised. a typical jewish household would naturally include children

Mark10:14 Jesus welcomed children into God's Kingdom with no age limit.


Early Christians practiced infant baptism with no issues, in fact the main debate was whether to wait gor 8 days or not before baptism. While individual church leaders can be wrong, the entire church guided by the holy spirit cant be wrong. Early church affirmed infant bsptism.

Some qoutes from early church fathers:
Origen (c. 185–254 AD)

“The Church received from the apostles the tradition of giving baptism even to infants.”
– Commentary on Romans 5:9


Hippolytus of Rome (c. 170–235 AD)

“Baptize first the children; and if they can speak for themselves, let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them.”

Cyprian of Carthage (c. 200–258 AD)

“As to what pertains to the case of infants: You [Fidus] said that they ought not to be baptized within the second or third day after their birth... We all thought otherwise…that the mercy and grace of God should be denied to no person born.”
– Letter to Fidus, Epistle 64(59)

well, am going to leave you to your believe. though the scriptures you listed doesn't support infants being baptized because it has to be a conscious decision as there are no records of infants or children baptized.

3nity7:
well, am going to leave you to your believe. though the scriptures you listed doesn't support infants being baptized because it has to be a conscious decision as there are no records of infants or children baptized.

This is why scripture also has to be viewed within the context of church sacred tradition. Scripture doesn't record everything that happened in the early church.

Early church taught infant baptism.Even main protestant reformers agreenwith infant baptism. Opposition to this teaching started in the 16th century by the Anabaptists.

Thank you

Bfly:
They will live forever. yes, even you too; if you are as righteous. Yet wait till then.
The day is coming when that shall be; The Judgement day.

Nowhere did the Bible promised that David is going to heaven!