₦airaland Forum

jedisco:
This reversal captivates the dilemma every government has faced for the last 2 decades and it's the reason why many unsustainable bits of society cant be touched.

I can vividly remember the chap telling me of his plan to sell houses 4 bed house for over 500k, buy a bungalow and then use the remnant for a holiday house in France. Thesame breath he used in telling me how 'cheap' properties in France were was same he used to lament how this government wants to 'kill off all pensioners' because they took away winter fuel payments.

😂 you never sabi these people they are one of the most deceptive humans you can ever come across, forming posh and victims at the same time! It’s the same way the afrikaaners in SA who owns over 70% of the land in SA will tell you that how the govt is impoverishing and killing them

jedisco:
Saw you post on the mortgage thread and I see why you asked.
While its possible, I dont think its worth it especially for a first time buyer.

Most mortgage advisors would not charge you an extra fee for a residential property. The lenders pay them and for the most part, you don't get a discount if you go to the lenders directly. It's still thesame rate so why not let someone do the hardwork at no cost to you?

To me, except your application is straightforward, a good mortgage advisor can be very helpful. For renewals, it's a different thing

Thanks boss. Baba Lexus dropped a link too for L&C mortgages.

If you work in the UK health sector, please don't kiss your patients..... E get why o... 💋🙄🤣


https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/25231524.ex-york-hospital-worker-jailed-sexually-assaulting-patient/

https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/25231524.ex-york-hospital-worker-jailed-sexually-assaulting-patient/[/quote]

Lexusgs430:
If you work in the UK health sector, please don't kiss your patients..... E get why o... 💋🙄🤣


https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/25231524.ex-york-hospital-worker-jailed-sexually-assaulting-patient/

Please anybody applied for Australia visit visa while on tier 2 from Uk.

Please share summary of the process and how to get it easily?

Thank you

Lexusgs430:
If you work in the UK health sector, please don't kiss your patients..... E get why o... 💋🙄🤣


https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/25231524.ex-york-hospital-worker-jailed-sexually-assaulting-patient/

na wetin we go call this one bayi; Kiss and die may our mouth not put us for wahala o!

Goke7:
na wetin we go call this one bayi; Kiss and die may our mouth not put us for wahala o!

Nah real wa o..... It's the new mantra for.... KISS & JAIL..... 💋👄💋👄

[quote author=Globalshaper post=135723015]Please anybody applied for Australia visit visa while on tier 2 from Uk.

Please share summary of the process and how to get it easily?

Thank you[Everything is done online. You would be require to provide Yellow fever vaccination cert which you upload to your online profile. You are also required to scan used pages of your passport. They issue e-visa]

Goke7:
na wetin we go call this one bayi; Kiss and die may our mouth not put us for wahala o!

The thinking process of some humans is amazing...

Greetings leaders in the house!

Please I need your wise counsel...
I am about to apply for my UK Student Visa, and intend to stay with my kid sister who lives with her husband and two children, but I don't want to show that I have family members in the UK so it doesn't raise a red flag that I might not want to return after my studies.

So I plan to book two nights hotel reservation, while I also book for apartment viewing upon arrival.

Note: I am a first time applicant without any travel history, but my home ties is strong (wife, 3 children, employment and inherited house).

Thank you

milekhuoba7:
Greetings leaders in the house!

Please I need your wise counsel...
I am about to apply for my UK Student Visa, and intend to stay with my kid sister who lives with her husband and two children, but I don't want to show that I have family members in the UK so it doesn't raise a red flag that I might not want to return after my studies.

So I plan to book two nights hotel reservation, while I also book for apartment viewing upon arrival.

Note: I am a first time applicant without any travel history, but my home ties is strong (wife, 3 children, employment and inherited house).

Thank you

Home tiers got nothing to do with the UK student visa application. It’s not a factor, requirements are straightforward because it’s a PBS.

milekhuoba7:
Greetings leaders in the house!

Please I need your wise counsel...
I am about to apply for my UK Student Visa, and intend to stay with my kid sister who lives with her husband and two children, but I don't want to show that I have family members in the UK so it doesn't raise a red flag that I might not want to return after my studies.

So I plan to book two nights hotel reservation, while I also book for apartment viewing upon arrival.

Note: I am a first time applicant without any travel history, but my home ties is strong (wife, 3 children, employment and inherited house).

Thank you

I don't think all the above is necessary as it's fairly common knowledge now that most masters students do not intend on returning home afterwards, regardless of what they promise during the application process lol

milekhuoba7:
Greetings leaders in the house!

Please I need your wise counsel...
I am about to apply for my UK Student Visa, and intend to stay with my kid sister who lives with her husband and two children, but I don't want to show that I have family members in the UK so it doesn't raise a red flag that I might not want to return after my studies.

So I plan to book two nights hotel reservation, while I also book for apartment viewing upon arrival.

Note: I am a first time applicant without any travel history, but my home ties is strong (wife, 3 children, employment and inherited house).

Thank you

You need to think of your track record for future visa applications. Once it's discovered that you lied intentionally, things become more complicated in the future. I understand how you feel, but it's better and safer to be truthful. Remember, at the end of the application, you're making a declaration that all the information you have filled in is the truth to the best of your knowledge. Your home ties and your immediate family back home are already a strong factor in your application going through. I'll only suggest you indicate you have made some reservations on where you'll be staying, and not at your sister's place.

domin8:
Long post alert

Hi Guys,

My car broke down recently (a Peugeot), and after a lot of back and forth with the mechanic, I got tired and ended up buying a used 2012 Toyota Avensis from a dealer on April 1st. It was advertised on AutoTrader as being in great condition. I did the usual checks — HPI, MOT history, visual inspection — but looking back, I think my mistake was not bringing a diagnostic tool on the day.

Two weeks later, on April 15th, the steering failed completely. A diagnostic scan showed serious issues, including faults with the power steering module and the car’s main control unit. The car is now unroadworthy and just sitting in front of my house.

I tried to resolve it directly with the dealer. Phone calls were cut short, and I was basically told off for asking about a refund. Even my mechanic, who called to explain the fault, was shouted at. The dealer then followed up with an email claiming I accepted the fault because I test-drove the car and got a small discount — but the faults were never mentioned at any point before the sale.

I was advised by Citizens Advice that, under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, I’m entitled to a full refund if a fault appears within 30 days of purchase, especially when the item is not of satisfactory quality or fit for purpose. They also confirmed this should be reported to Trading Standards — which they’ve done — and suggested I raise a Section 75 claim with my credit card provider.

I paid part of the amount on my NatWest Mastercard and the rest via bank transfer. The Section 75 claim is now underway, but what’s frustrating is the timeline. Two weeks for the bank to start the chargeback, 45 days for the seller to respond, and then potentially another 8 weeks for investigation. Meanwhile, I’m without a working car, relying on expensive alternative transport, and struggling to manage work and school runs.

If anyone’s been through something similar or has any advice on how to speed things up or handle the situation more effectively, I’d really appreciate it.

Update on this:

So the bank has now reversed the part payment (55%) made with the Credit Card and charged back the Car Seller with a caveat that if the car seller contests this within 45 days, they will reverse it. The seller will have to prove with documentary evidence that I was aware of the faults at the time of purchase. Obviously, this was not the case at the time of purchase as the car was advertised as without any issues (I have the Auto trader advert),

The Bank also decided to refund the other part payment (45%) done via bank transfer as a gesture of goodwill with this message "This offer is made in full and final settlement of any claim you may have against the Bank or any of its subsidiary companies arising out of this matter. It is also made on a without prejudice basis and is not to be referred to in any legal proceedings that may follow."

From my understanding, this 45% is not coming from the seller's own account as a refund. Does this imply I can still hold on to the vehicle? Appreciate any experience on this.

I don’t know if anyone has mentioned this before, but you can earn extra cash by checking out this subreddit r/beermoneyuk and also using an app called TopCashBack. There are others, but I use TopCashBack

Between October 2024 and present, I have earned about £611.00 from cash back.

ISA cash back from shepherds friendly, purchase from curry’s and switching to first direct. Apart from the £611.00 I have received, I still have £100.00 pending from Scottish friendly, £30.00 pending from chip and another £70 from Charles Stanley Direct.

Except for my purchase from curry’s and switch to first direct, the rest is just opening ISA account with monthly direct debit and waiting for the cashback to track to payable.

First Nigerian mayor in money laundering scandal
https://x.com/abiodunborisade/status/1933526799885250664?s=46&t=rMlYNgPE3MCufQnJWhgznw

Good evening elders in the house. IMy cousin is to apply for spousal visa, with couple encounters. He has ILR. But worried about meeting the accommodation requirement. Where he presently lives is a one bed but there is no tenancy agreement. As the apartment used to be run as airbnb but nephew can only get receipts as the manager firbthe house says they can't give him letter. No other proof of address apart from bank statement. I newly moved into a one bed can I give him a letter to stay the couple can stay in my house or must I collect letter from my landlord. My room is very big as well as the parlour on different floors. Does my landlord need to give me letter for this?

Elder justwise and elder lexusgx430 your attention is needed as well as other elders.

domin8:
Update on this:

So the bank has now reversed the part payment (55%) made with the Credit Card and charged back the Car Seller with a caveat that if the car seller contests this within 45 days, they will reverse it. The seller will have to prove with documentary evidence that I was aware of the faults at the time of purchase. Obviously, this was not the case at the time of purchase as the car was advertised as without any issues (I have the Auto trader advert),

The Bank also decided to refund the other part payment (45%) done via bank transfer as a gesture of goodwill with this message "This offer is made in full and final settlement of any claim you may have against the Bank or any of its subsidiary companies arising out of this matter. It is also made on a without prejudice basis and is not to be referred to in any legal proceedings that may follow."

From my understanding, this 45% is not coming from the seller's own account as a refund. Does this imply I can still hold on to the vehicle? Appreciate any experience on this.

It lies on the dealership to come lift thier car. Whatever you do, do not drive the vehicle anymore. Take out any personal effects from the car, lock it and let it gather dust and curve webs.

I believe by now, you already told them to come get their car in the earlier emails? If not, no need.

Cease all correspondence with the dealership unless they're reaching out to collect the car. Air any other request.

domin8:
Update on this:

So the bank has now reversed the part payment (55%) made with the Credit Card and charged back the Car Seller with a caveat that if the car seller contests this within 45 days, they will reverse it. The seller will have to prove with documentary evidence that I was aware of the faults at the time of purchase. Obviously, this was not the case at the time of purchase as the car was advertised as without any issues (I have the Auto trader advert),

The Bank also decided to refund the other part payment (45%) done via bank transfer as a gesture of goodwill with this message "This offer is made in full and final settlement of any claim you may have against the Bank or any of its subsidiary companies arising out of this matter. It is also made on a without prejudice basis and is not to be referred to in any legal proceedings that may follow."

From my understanding, this 45% is not coming from the seller's own account as a refund. Does this imply I can still hold on to the vehicle? Appreciate any experience on this.

Nope. Hold on to the vehicle till the grace period is over.....

After the grace period is over, send a message to the dealer to make arrangements to collect their vehicle. DON'T BE TEMPTED TO KEEP THE VEHICLE!!! 🙄😂

Keeping the vehicle after a full refund could lead to legal issues, such as claims of trespass to goods or conversion........ (Unless the seller sends you an email or letter, telling you to keep vehicle) (but why would they)...... 🙄😂🤔

NB : One of the only benefits of credit card ownership..... 😂💳

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/06/11/reform-meant-to-be-trusted-on-immigration/

Lol. The ever-confused Farage Inc. party strikes again.

Goke7:
😂 you never sabi these people they are one of the most deceptive humans you can ever come across, forming posh and victims at the same time! It’s the same way the afrikaaners in SA who owns over 70% of the land in SA will tell you that how the govt is impoverishing and killing them

Hehe... humans are selfish but the UK has thought me that in developed societies, when you hear news of one group crying, you have to stop and think about alot of variables before responding. E.g why is the media reporting it this way e.t.c

Infact, manytimes the cry of the most impoverished goes unnoticed while the rich make the loudest noise. Wealthy farmers would protest paying a trumped down version of inheritance taxes, young people outside work would say 'the NHS has done nothing for me' forgetting they are in one of the most privileged societies in the world. Migrants have had it demonstrably tougher with each passing year but someone listening to the media would think we're loafing around all day leaching on the NHS with our many untreated diseases.

Lexusgs430:
[/b]

Nope. Hold on to the vehicle till the grace period is over.....

After the grace period is over, send a message to the dealer to make arrangements to collect their vehicle. DON'T BE TEMPTED TO KEEP THE VEHICLE!!! 🙄😂

Keeping the vehicle after a full refund could lead to legal issues, such as claims of trespass to goods or conversion........ (Unless the seller sends you an email or letter, telling you to keep vehicle) (but why would they)...... 🙄😂🤔

NB : One of the only benefits of credit card ownership..... 😂💳

So it's actually better to pay for goods with a credit card and then credit the card account afterwards? Instead of doing a cash transfer or using debit card payment?

ehizario2012:
So it's actually better to pay for goods with a credit card and then credit the card account afterwards? Instead of doing a cash transfer or using debit card payment?

1000%.......

Once you make a part payment of above £100.01, to a total of about £30,000...... Your credit card company, is jointly liable........ 😂🤣

The beauty of Section 75....... 🙄😂

Although with a debit card, you can still do a chargeback (but it's time bound)........

With cash transfer, you would need a calabash + proper juju baba....... 🤣😂

Gerrard59:
The pension system can be revamped in the following ways:

- Citizens handle their pensions
- Retirement ages should be increased to 75
- At a certain age, people should receive less pension.
- Unmarried people should be taxed THRICE as married people. Married people with no children should be taxed twice. Married persons with children should be taxed far less than any other group.

The core issue about low birth rates is not necessarily the costs (Niger Republic has a high birth rate), but modern day women who have deliberately refused to have more children or even marry at all. In East Asia, women are not marrying, and culturally, marriage comes before bearing children. The government should tax unmarried persons very high.

All these policies will fail and fail woefully with the exception of a phased increment in retirement age
And laying the blame on "modern women" pardon my French, is NOT a serious argument to make at all

Gerrard59:
I remember when Sukkot (had to mention his moniker) stated he knows many Black Brits (born and bred in England) who moved to the Caribbean, and they became happier ever since. Psychological happiness is so underrated. People in Nigeria wouldn't fully grasp it. I was once like them, so I can understand. Nothing beats being in your dominant society. Chinese bred in the US are now realising it. Good for them, though they have many options to replicate or even surpass living standards.

There are pros and cons to living abroad, but all things being equal, nothing beats a relatively functioning and prosperous sub-Saharan Africa.

You are still on this thing @ the bolded lol
How then do you explain White Africans in the South (South Africa, Namibia and Botswana) living at the top of the food chain there and NOT being in their "dominant society"

I think what it is, is that nothing beats BEING A SERIOUS ETHNIC GROUP, and it pains me to say, that as black people. we ARE NOT a serious ethnic group, so whether home and abroad, the outcome will still remain the same.

The Chinese people you referenced here are better off with an American kpali and (relatively) independent economic base (and as an added bonus, enjoy more freedoms relatively) than their counterparts in China.
They are not subject to any restrictions to study anything because when they fill their forms, they are American. That aside...

All these right wing media ppl are picking on us here in Britain PRIMARILY because we don't appear to be a serious people to be taken seriously
No community cohesion, no organised interests, nothing

RodgersAkpafu:
All these policies will fail and fail woefully with the exception of a phased increment in retirement age
And laying the blame on "modern women" pardon my French, is NOT a serious argument to make at all

The stats so far - across the world - show that modern day women are not interested in childbearing at least to hit replacement levels. Should we now force women to have children when they clearly don't want to have children?

Gerrard59:
The stats so far - across the world - show that modern day women are not interested in childbearing at least to hit replacement levels. Should we now force women to have children when they clearly don't want to have children?

You know it takes two to make a baby right ?
This is a decision that both the young men and women are making
The undertone to this post and the preceding post to which I mentioned is "red pill" vibes, and while you are an adult who can believe whatever, I admonish that you don't subscribe to such world views

And BTW, my controversial view is that falling birth rates is a good thing, and that more men and women are not choosing to have kids.

Why governments and oligarchs are complaining is because of HOW they structured the current world order. around exploitative capitalism where you need an endless supply of economic agents that keep grinding themselves to feed into a wasteful consumerist system, which in turn makes more and more wealth for the oligarchs at the top.

But that's an argument to expand another day.

RodgersAkpafu:
You are still on this thing @ the bolded lol
How then do you explain White Africans in the South (South Africa, Namibia and Botswana) living at the top of the food chain there and NOT being in their "dominant society"

Their cousins in North America and Europe are equally rich and top of the global chain. It rubs off them.

I think what it is, is that nothing beats BEING A SERIOUS ETHNIC GROUP, and it pains me to say, that as black people. we ARE NOT a serious ethnic group, so whether home and abroad, the outcome will still remain the same.

That would be done from sub-Saharan Africa, not in the UK.

The Chinese people you referenced here are better off with an American kpali and (relatively) independent economic base (and as an added bonus, enjoy more freedoms relatively) than their counterparts in China.
They are not subject to any restrictions to study anything because when they fill their forms, they are American. That aside...

They did not have much leverage or outward influence when Mainland China was poor. How come their influence is overstated or exaggerated now? Why not during the '80s or '90s? How come many are willing to pack their bags back to China or neighbouring countries? The stats are there. Renowned ethnic Chinese academics are leaving the US gradually for China. How many Nigerian academics in the UK have done the same for Nigeria?

Talking about restrictions, I follow r/Biotech and posts there state that many Chinese are being prevented from accessing certain laboratories or positions in universities and companies. These Chinese know it as well. So, it is untrue to state that they don't experience restrictions simply because their big brother is advancing as well and their adopted land is vehemently against it.

All these right wing media ppl are picking on us here in Britain PRIMARILY because we don't appear to be a serious people to be taken seriously. No community cohesion, no organised interests, nothing

Again, you do this from sub-Saharan Africa, not in the UK. Respect comes from the level of advancement in one's ancestral homelands, not the adopted home.

See the book, "It is not about Whiteness, it is about wealth" by Remi Adekoya, a Nigerian-Polish professor in the UK.

RodgersAkpafu:
You know it takes two to make a baby right ?
This is a decision that both the young men and women are making. The undertone to this post and the preceding post to which I mentioned is "red pill" vibes, and while you are an adult who can believe whatever, I admonish that you don't subscribe to such world views

Bros, while we agree to disagree, as long as women, with all the economic opportunities and reproductive rights they possess, are not WILLING to have more children, there is nothing that can be done. Women are the sole bearers of children, and so far and across the globe, they are staying off childbearing whether in gender equal societies or culturally repressive ones. Governments have provided all sorts of benefits from Norway to South Korea to Singapore to Hungary to the UK, yet birth rates are dwindling, not increasing. In fact, marriage rates are receding, not climbing.

And BTW, my controversial view is that falling birth rates is a good thing, and that more men and women are not choosing to have kids.

I am also an advocate for fewer children, especially from a Nigerian perspective. But how do you solve a world with fewer consumers? Fewer productive demographics? A collapsing pension system? Fewer hands to build and maintain infrastructure?

Why governments and oligarchs are complaining is because of HOW they structured the current world order. around exploitative capitalism where you need an endless supply of economic agents that keep grinding themselves to feed into a wasteful consumerist system, which in turn makes more and more wealth for the oligarchs at the top. But that's an argument to expand another day.

Obviously a matter for another day.

@Gerrard59

Their cousins in North America and Europe are equally rich and top of the global chain. It rubs off them.

Not sure I'll totally agree with this, but okay 👌


That would be done from sub-Saharan Africa, not in the UK.

Wrong
This can absolutely be done in the UK, or anywhere in the world. Jewish people have shown the blueprint and other groups of people can adopt same seriousness

Of course it's a bonus when it comes from your "homeland" (using your reference)
But it's more about the people than the geography. An unserious bunch of people are unserious anywhere in the world.



They did not have much leverage or outward influence when Mainland China was poor. How come their influence is overstated or exaggerated now? Why not during the '80s or '90s? How come many are willing to pack their bags back to China or neighbouring countries? The stats are there. Renowned ethnic Chinese academics are leaving the US gradually for China. How many Nigerian academics in the UK have done the same for Nigeria?

Talking about restrictions, I follow r/Biotech and posts there state that many Chinese are being prevented from accessing certain laboratories or positions in universities and companies. These Chinese know it as well. So, it is untrue to state that they don't experience restrictions simply because their big brother is advancing as well and their adopted land is vehemently against it.

A Chinese American or a Chinese Brit (born, raised and socialised) is NOT subject to ATAS or the American equivalent. I get your sinophilic bias (you are don't deny lol) ; but it doesn't apply to them



Again, you do this from sub-Saharan Africa, not in the UK. Respect comes from the level of advancement in one's ancestral homelands, not the adopted home.

Again, not Applicable
Lemme paint this scenario for you
Imagine a decently developed country having dregs in its diaspora
What sort of image do you think the people in these countries will have about such people?

You really think these guys know where most countries are on the map?
Let's be real nau for goodness sakes

The people here are the first point of contact for the larger society. If they don't build or are not serious here, and they have the optics of being the bottom feeders, does it matter the state of the "homeland"?

Mexico has a higher GDP per capita and doing much better than almost every baltic state jn Europe, but have a worse image in America than those who came from the baltics. e get why.

See the book, "It is not about Whiteness, it is about wealth" by Remi Adekoya, a Nigerian-Polish professor in the UK.

You know what's funny
Me and Remi have had pleasant exchanges on twitter, both in some of his tweets, and in other ways too.
I only read the subscript of the book and not the full book itself

@Gerrard59
Bros, while we agree to disagree, as long as women, with all the economic opportunities and reproductive rights they possess, are not WILLING to have more children, there is nothing that can be done. Women are the sole bearers of children, and so far and across the globe, they are staying off childbearing whether in gender equal societies or culturally repressive ones. Governments have provided all sorts of benefits from Norway to South Korea to Singapore to Hungary to the UK, yet birth rates are dwindling, not increasing. In fact, marriage rates are receding, not climbing

Again, this is not correct for the following anecdotal reasons

1. More women in the corporate world have kids than don't have kids. So it's not about education or empowerment per se. I have met teachers, lecturers, business owners, etc that have AT LEAST two kids in this country, so that narrative that "women" are the ones not deciding to have kids is right wing, red pill nonsense laced with misogyny.
We now live in a world where choices are more respected, therefore women (and men) who would have hitherto had to be forced into traditional marriage and kids are now opting to not have the kids

2. Men just like women are increasingly NOT wanting to commit to marriage or have kids either. Here in Britain, the men will tell you that the cost of living is crushing and as such, don't have any plan at least in the interim to have kids
It will be interesting to do a study to this effect, but psychology/sociology is not my field of study, so maybe not.

3. Marriage rates is dropping not due to a particular gender but a general societal phenomenon. If anything, it's the women crying out that they are no good men out there to marry than vice versa. In Jaoan they even had the MGTOW thing. Shey you will blame women for that as well?

4. Even in the gulf states, birth rates have essentially collapsed. Will you say that it is the women alone? or its a generation OF PEOPLE, male and female alike buying into the idea of having less kids to have more time for other things
Like i said in my preceding point
It's a case of living in a world where choice is a thing, and no longer having to do things under obligation

I am also an advocate for fewer children, especially from a Nigerian perspective. But how do you solve a world with fewer consumers? Fewer productive demographics? A collapsing pension system? Fewer hands to build and maintain infrastructure?

We need to rethink the foundations to which we built and structured economic knowledge around.
It was doomed to fail from the beginning because endless growth in a world with relatively finite resources doesn't work and is not sensible

But oligarchs wanna line their pockets so....
Karl Marx was right and in future, he will be vindicated.
I should do an entire thread on this.


Obviously a matter for another day.

In order not to further derail this thread
I will probably do a full post somewhere about this topic when i have the time AND inspiration to, and tag you to it

jedisco:
Hehe... humans are selfish but the UK has thought me that in developed societies, when you hear news of one group crying, you have to stop and think about alot of variables before responding. E.g why is the media reporting it this way e.t.c

Infact, manytimes the cry of the most impoverished goes unnoticed while the rich make the loudest noise. Wealthy farmers would protest paying a trumped down version of inheritance taxes, young people outside work would say 'the NHS has done nothing for me' forgetting they are in one of the most privileged societies in the world. Migrants have had it demonstrably tougher with each passing year but someone listening to the media would think we're loafing around all day leaching on the NHS with our many untreated diseases.

Very true o, just look at the way ICE is clamping on people all in the name of going after criminals to deport them, at end the farmers and hoteliers are the ones crying now that their workers are being targeted 😂 so tey baba Trump had to complain too. That’s when you’ll know how deceptive these rubbish they do are.