₦airaland Forum

Wisfem:
No this does not clearly show that they hear or know the word of God, You can only argue that Christ lives in their heart even when they do not know or have not heard about him, Because of the Will to know Good and Bad.

Don't confuse yourself.

There are 2 issues the op jumbled together and they cannot be properly settled without first identifying the issues and it's corresponding effects.

And the first issue you need resolved is the Word of God. And what is The Word of God? The simple answer is The Word of God is LAW or COMMANDMENT Dictating what things are good or evil which it is settled that people even in the time of Sodom and Gomorrah before Isreal even went to Egypt even knew about.

And with this you can see that nations already knew The Word of God. Why do you think everyone in the whole world says "God would judge you?"

Why not be concerned on the fate of you who heard the word of God .are the ancestors complaining they didn't get justice

Pearl1910:
You have a point.
For those who died before Christ, God may use conscience , works or relationship with him to Judge.
But for those who died after Christ came to die and establish his covenant, its going to be diecy for God to accept men into heaven without them confessing Jesus and accepting Him as savior while demanding same from some other people.
Scripture is clear about how to enter into the Kingdom of God, so He will not be consistent with His words if He allows another way into heaven outside of Jesus.
That's d reason I strongly believe those souls who left without hearing about Christ will be given another shot until they hear. Remember Jesus will not return until everyone on earth has the opportunity to hear about Him.

if that were to be the case, probably the world would have ceased since all should have heard the Lord's word either in this life or in previous lives🤨. Also, what shall we say of twins bearing the same body but are independently different 🤔? Are they concurrent reincarnation of the same person or different people? When your theory comes under intense scrutiny it falls flat. God doesn't need to keep sending others over and over again with most of them making the same mistakes over and over again since they don't carry over experiences🤨. If your theory were true by now this present iteration should be free of sins or perfect since most will have learnt from their mistakes but the inverse is seen🤔. In fact from scriptures, immorality will increase does that mean that those who have God now will renounce him in the future 🤔?

Hence, Jesus deciding who to save from those who didn't hear about him doesn't diminish the fact that he is the way, the truth and the life! It only buttresses the point that he and only he decides/judges who is to make it!

The only uncertainty in this, is the standard/model of judgement he will employ! No man knows, we can only speculate through Logic that "standing with God" is the notable criteria as God will not forsake his own!

LordBillionz:
You guys keep making God look wicked.

In what way🤨?

tctrills:
Let me ask a question to understand you. If someone did not hear the gospel but was very good at keeping natural revelation as you call it. These are good and just men but they did not know Christ, what would be their fate?

The best of man is still flawed, no one is good except God. Jesus came to rectify that which is believe in Him earns you His righteousness. Now to the ancestors before Christ, from the place he quoted, Christ preached to them within that 3days in the grave and as many that believed His message were saved from death (Matt 27:51). Don't worry about your ancestors, I can assure you they've heard the same you're hearing now. You worry should be about those who hears the gospel nowband reject it because there won't be an opportunity for repentance in the gave for them. Your righteousness or good works can't guarantee you a place in the world to come if it's not based on faith in Jesus Christ. Don't allow anyone deceive you into thinking that you don't need Jesus, the Gospel of Jesus Christ is what saves. The thing is if you don't acknowledge Jesus Christ here (and receive His salvation) , you will definitely acknowledge Him when you go over to the other side (but then He won't be able to save and nothing else can save there) no two ways about it.
Acts 17:29 "Therefore since we are God's offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by human design and skill. In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."

Shalom Shalom

tctrills:
I am sure that you see how your answer complicates things. Firstz you are saying that they don't need the gospel of Jesus Christ to know the right way to follow. Then let me ask, what is the purpose of the gospel if those that have not heard it still know the word of God?

Also what was the purpose of Jesus Christ sacrifice if without it some people could still be saved?
Remember Paul said
Romans 1:16-
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

But you seem to be saying that these people who did not have the opportunity to hear the gospel of Jesus Christ somehow they still have the power of salvation? Then I ask what's the need of the gospel if people can be saved without it?

The purpose of his death was to defeat death and bring salvation unto mankind. So, after death, anyone that hears the word and refuses to follow is condemned. We don't need jesus to know what's good or bad. God judged the Noah's generation from a moral code inherent to us all.

Pearl1910:
Whatever happened to the people that lived before Jesus Christ came.
That is why reincarnation is strongly believed to be true. Because God will not be unjust to judge men for a law that never even existed or to use different scales to judge humans.

That's why it's good to get saved and study the Bible.

The book of Romans is very clear on the fate of those who lived before Christ came.

So, embrace the free gift of new Life given by God in Christ Jesus.

Become joint-heir with Jesus and you'll appreciate the beauty and power of the word of God.

Those people will be judged by their conscience and the natural laws as could be seen in the natural creations of God.

MrGerald:
John 15 vs 22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin.

15 vs 24 If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father.

It is clear whatever life they lived before Christ is or can't be used against them, that's why Jesus when he died didn't ascend to heaven immediately but had to descent into hell to preach to souls in prison for them to be saved through his mercy - these were the first people who did not believe Noah and his arch before God destroy them

You are quite wrong, the original sin suggest otherwise. The original sin is imputed upon us all, it's through Christ we will get salvation! Hence God's Mercy or rather put relation with God is the saving grace! Abraham might not have met Jesus(physically) but he is God's friend same goes with Enoch 🤔. It doesn't matter, the criteria is God!

tctrills:
Romans 2:14-15
For when OUR ANCESTORS, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves.
Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their CONSCIENCE also bearing witness, and their THOUGHTS the mean, while accusing or else excusing one another.
16: This is what will happen on the day when God judges people's secrets through Christ Jesus.

Your question is fully answered here.
There's no other portion of the bible that will answer your question better than this.
I purposely changed Gentiles to Ancestors for clarity, because Gentiles there refers to all those who didn't have the chance to hear the word of God.

If you can't see the answer there, then you have comprehension problem, and I'll advise that you find someone that has deep knowledge of biblical exegesis to explain it for you.

AntiChristian:
So na Gospel go save everybody?

How many people did Jesus not preached the Gospel to during his life time?

The Canaanite woman!
The blind man!
Even Lazarus and the "Thalita Lum" girl!
Lepers!
Demon possesor!
The lame man!
The woman that touched Jesus's garment!

Muhammad did not preach to everyone in his lifetime as well
So what will become of such persons according to Islam

alabo1:
What criteria does death and waiting for judgement meet? What is the criteria for even a belief in the afterlife?. All these are man made constructs. Believe what you will and try to live a moral life. The dead are dead. Why worry about them?

The dead are not dead, if that were so then there is no hope for resurrection!

The Dead live on in a different state and plane! Else God won't be called the God of the living nor the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob since they have been long dead! Hence These three live on but in a different state and place!

Pearl1910:
Their relationship with God, asin is it the one true God or any god like Baal, d hindu god, Buddha, Sango, Amadioha etc
I am just curious

I believe you are a Christian hence I speak from a Christian standpoint! Yes, the one True God is the God I reference there; not Mohammed's god not Krishna not Zeus not Enki not Odin but Yahweh!

They will.be judged by their works

chimex38:
But God still wants us
(the gentiles) to hear his word and believe even if you seem to be righteous.. It surely has its advantages.
Acts 10
Peter preaches and coverts an already righteous Cornelius(gentile)

Well...we are at a time of the word & the spirit made manifest ....soooo

All this 8 pages long of utter trash over a Fabricated non-existent white He-Goat the colonialists claimed was your “saviour”.

You people are totally lost.

No our Ancestors absolutely do Not and Never needed any white invaders and mass murdering white thieves and looters to show them any “Lord” to “save” them.

All humans are immortal beings and do Not need any fake white “saviour” to transcend to the Afterlife.

Live a good life and treat your neighbour as you would yourself. Anything else is a frivolity. The afterlife, if it exists, will take care of itself.

tctrills:
For no fault of theirs, our ancestors did not hear about Christ or Christianity would they be punished for that or would they be given a second chance?

It is written
Timothy 2.3-4
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Also
Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

No one preached to our ancestors so is it the will of God that they also be saved and come to a knowledge of Him?

1 Peter 3:18–20 (KJV)
"For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing..."

✅ Explanation:
After His death, Jesus' spirit was alive ("quickened by the Spirit", and during that time He preached to the "spirits in prison."

These "spirits in prison" are understood to be souls of those who died in disobedience, possibly during Noah’s time or even more broadly, those who died before Christ came.

The "prison" is often interpreted as a spiritual realm (not the grave physically), sometimes called Hades or Sheol.

tctrills:
For no fault of theirs, our ancestors did not hear about Christ or Christianity would they be punished for that or would they be given a second chance?

It is written
Timothy 2.3-4
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Also
Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

No one preached to our ancestors so is it the will of God that they also be saved and come to a knowledge of Him?

Those that lived by the law are judge by the law

According to AI ChatGPT, Britain owes Nigeria $50 Trillion for its exploitation, from slavery to colonialism to neo-colonialism.

They brought you “jesus” and called him “your saviour”.

And you accept?

Why did Mr “jesus” not stop them from robbing us blind?

Spit.

You better leave this in God's hand!
Focus on yourself and take up salvation in and from Christ Jesus in this dispensation ...It is an Emergency....to avoid Hell.

Pearl1910:
Whatever happened to the people that lived before Jesus Christ came.
That is why reincarnation is strongly believed to be true. Because God will not be unjust to judge men for a law that never even existed or to use different scales to judge humans.

How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?

Romans 10:14

At Caesarea there was a man named Cornelius, a centurion in what was known as the Italian Regiment. 2 He and all his family were devout and God-fearing; he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly.

Acts 10:1-2

Cornelius answered: “Three days ago I was in my house praying at this hour, at three in the afternoon. Suddenly a man in shining clothes stood before me 31 and said, ‘Cornelius, God has heard your prayer and remembered your gifts to the poor

Acts 10:30

Everything in life will happen to everyone according their beliefs,.believing in heaven Because whitemen said so? There's such thing as heaven tbh,it's a state of mind.

femi4:
Those that lived by the law are judge by the law

Throw more light please

DRKRIZ:
1 Peter 3:18–20 (KJV)
"For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing..."

✅ Explanation:
After His death, Jesus' spirit was alive ("quickened by the Spirit", and during that time He preached to the "spirits in prison."

These "spirits in prison" are understood to be souls of those who died in disobedience, possibly during Noah’s time or even more broadly, those who died before Christ came.

The "prison" is often interpreted as a spiritual realm (not the grave physically), sometimes called Hades or Sheol.

Hmm,
A different perspective.

gentlegenius:
Your question is fully answered here.
There's no other portion of the bible that will answer your question better than this.
I purposely changed Gentiles to Ancestors for clarity, because Gentiles there refers to all those who didn't have the chance to hear the word of God.

If you can't see the answer there, then you have comprehension problem, and I'll advise that you find someone that has deep knowledge of biblical exegesis to explain it for you.

Oga explain your answer and stop hiding behind a passage.

Both Earth and heaven are civilizations and spirits get incarnated on Earth to obtain food to sustain them in heaven. As a spirit you can only incarnate among your children. There is no hell but a spirit can get knocked out of existence. This happens when they lose a debate with another spirit while at the lowest empathy rank of six. A debate loss will mean a drop in empathy rank. If you are at the highest empathy rank you will have ten times the normal appetite for food as a spirit.
I got all these and more by using IFA the Yoruba divination system to research.

justli:
The purpose of his death was to defeat death and bring salvation unto mankind. So, after death, anyone that hears the word and refuses to follow is condemned. We don't need jesus to know what's good or bad. God judged the Noah's generation from a moral code inherent to us all.

You just said his purpose is to bring salvation to mankind, does that include those who did not hear about him on earth? Again, what is the purpose of preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ, since the moral code is inherent to us, and according to you, salvation comes by obedience to the moral code?

tctrills:
Lol
I understand you think my post is based on falsehood.
But now we have given you the privilege to correct the falsehood with your understanding of history.
Please don't give me a book to read. This is a forum where we share and sharpen ideas. Put forth your ideas and let everyone discuss them.
I could send you 20 books but that not the purpose of a forum.
This is a place to discuss. It's not all about you or I some other person's would love to contribute so don't be shy, share your history knowledge and your opinion. We are waiting.

Be informed that I was once a Christian like you, believing everything you believe when I was a fool until I did my research.

When you're ready to seek knowledge, you'll step outside Nairaland to get further information. That's how it's done, indeed, that's how I came to realize that Jesus is a fraud.

The topic of Jesus's existence has already been over-discussed here on Nairaland so many times in many other threads even on some of my threads. When you're ready begin from there.

The Jesus fraud is intertwined with history, it's just like someone writing that in 1998 when Abacha was head of state, spider man came to Lagos and was jumping from one tall building to another in Lagos Island.

Someone who doesn't know the history, can easily conclude that the above must be true because Abacha was head of state in 1998, Lagos is a real place, Lagos Island is a real place and there are many tall buildings there. This is why many people like you, uninterested in research still believe in Jesus.

You're participating in an ancient fraud! Jesus is a deepfake fraud! Again, that's why many people are unaware of the fraud.

No amount of post on Nairaland will convince you. It requires your independent research starting with the information you've been given, in fact, it could take you about 5-8 years of research to uncover the fraud called Jesus.

sekeyso:
The best of man is still flawed, no one is good except God. Jesus came to rectify that which is believe in Him earns you His righteousness. Now to the ancestors before Christ, from the place he quoted, Christ preached to them within that 3days in the grave and as many that believed His message were saved from death (Matt 27:51). Don't worry about your ancestors, I can assure you they've heard the same you're hearing now. You worry should be about those who hears the gospel nowband reject it because there won't be an opportunity for repentance in the gave for them. Your righteousness or good works can't guarantee you a place in the world to come if it's not based on faith in Jesus Christ. Don't allow anyone deceive you into thinking that you don't need Jesus, the Gospel of Jesus Christ is what saves. The thing is if you don't acknowledge Jesus Christ here (and receive His salvation) , you will definitely acknowledge Him when you go over to the other side (but then He won't be able to save and nothing else can save there) no two ways about it.
Acts 17:29 "Therefore since we are God's offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by human design and skill. In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."

Shalom Shalom

Christ preached to the ancestors 2000 years ago. Since then till now, hundreds of millions have died without hearing about Christ, how do they hear the gospel?

tctrills:
You have a strong point. But then, what was the purpose of sending them into the world only to keep sending them again and again. Wouldn't it be more efficient to give them the opportunity of hearing the gospel in their first life so there is no need to keep repeating the process?
Again there is a possibility of even worse outcomes each time a person is reborn.

nothing like reincarnation bro, Let me clear you, during the time Jesus died bible said he resurrected the righteous one, there are those who avoided wickedness even without hearing the gospel and the same thing is going to happen again in the future according to revelation, revelation said devil will be imprisoned for 1000years and these period those who did not hear the word of God will hear it so after the 1000years is over then the devil will be released again to deceive the nation one more time, so those who will follow devil again will be permanently condemned together with the devil ok