₦airaland Forum

Weah96:
So that's what it is then. Find a comfortable place, erect a shrine, and call the place Mecca. You just use your mouth to say that something is outside time and then everything else falls into place. That's the epitome of laziness in my book.

Just for laughter, how possible is it that there are multiple people outside time, as in, your God is from a village where all the people are outside time? How do you know that it was one person outside this time and not a whole country? Since we're waving hands and declaring things, let's embellish the story even more.

Weah96:
You should be ashamed of yourself. Let there be light is what a lazy person writes when he's faced with an insurmountable problem. Do tell me, 6000 years ago, what was the Sun doing?

KingEbukasBlog:
Functioning . Reconstruct your sentence .

KingEbukasBlog:
This should be exciting if dalaman accepts this "challenge " . Grabs pop corn with winner01

Weah96:
So in order to solve this problem of disappearing energy, you wave your hand and declare that there is a humanoid being who isn't subject to any of that rubbish? That's called hand waving, not problem solving. It's the enterprise of weak minded people who hate to spend long periods trying to solve a problem. Wishy washy people.

Weak-minded people, ignorant people, wishy-washy people, deluded people, lazy people, illiterates, otherwise free-thinkers, hand-wavers , illogical people, irrational people. What other adjectives do you people use. Y'all need to really think when yhu make use of these words. I didnt just "wave my hands", My inference is solidly logical. As a matter of fact, you are the one waving your hands in an illogical claim "that the universe and man came from nowhere for no reason".

Anas09:
I want the Nl atheist to explain Conciousness to me. If there's no God, meaning there's no supernatural, and no afterlife, how can u explain a situation where someone dies, i mean clinically dead. Doctors confirms him dead. No pulse, no brain activites for hours, only for the person to jeck back to life to tell about his/her experience in the other world? They meet a relative or friend who had died long ago, who gives them information for his/her living folk, when he jerks back, when verified the info is found to be true? How was the dead guy able to retain that info wen his brian activities had stopped? This happened to my elder sister. She had etopic pregnancy that killed her, but she jerked back to life abt two or three hrs later to tell us abt our uncle who died months back pursuing her with a cane to go back, and he told her something for his immidiate family which was verified.
Secondly, I personally dream events before they happen. I mean, vivdly, clearly detailed before they happen. This is not a case of what you saw or experienced before. I mean future.
Early last month I dreamed, a contract am handling got terminated, because in real life here, the project manager had inflated the amount, I knew abt it, but said nothing. Last week, it was discovered, the guy is fired and my contract terminated.
Pls explain this to me.

dalaman:
Therr are a thousand and one cases yet you can't provide the name of one verifiable hospital that pronounced a person dead and was resurrected by being prayed upon? Are you trolling?

ekemini606:
So you can go verify? You get his point. Can you deny that such supernatural experience don't occur time after time.

Weah96:
Science is open to discussion. Theories are discussed over and over and over and many other scientists often suggest opposing ideas. That's the point.

You say that this invisible person you call God communicated with humans long ago and the result of that interaction is the immutable transcript you call the bible. No one sees the God person for confirmation. There are no extant relatives of any of the supposed authors. The book itself is riddled with foolishness and malice, and punctuated by brief moments of wise words.

You love to bring up scientific theories as if the refutation of one somehow VALIDATES your own "let there be light" story. "Let there be light, and there was light" has nothing to do with abiogenesis. Scientific theories could all be refuted and your story will still remain kiddish.

winner01:
Abi oo. The writings are on the wall, they can see it but they have hardened their hearts.

dalaman should visit this thread www.nairaland.com/2602223/90-minutes-heaven-how-don

Countless people have experienced miracles, me and my family have experienced miracles. I dont think atheists should use the word open-mindedness ever again.

timonski:
sir, what do you mean by supernatural

dalaman:
So stop clock exist in heaven? A man wants to write a book and sell cos he wants to make money, you bought into the scam and decided to promote it. Which miracle did you and your family experience? Did an6 of your family member walk on water, raise from the dead after 3 days or raise any body that was dead for days? Did they heal any amputee ? Remember according to the biblical stories Jesus said that does that believe in him will perform more wonders than him. Until the day I see you or any christian walk on water or raise any body that has been dead for days. I'll just assume you guys are jokers.

winner01:
[b]If the universe is infinite, then it is a supernatural phenomenon because it cannot be explained logically. This is actually the atheists best argument against God’s existence – that the universe is infinite and in no need of a creator. But I don’t know of any evidence that supports an infinite universe theory neither have i seen any atheist that does. There is solid finite universe evidence (laws of thermodynamics for one), but it isn’t 100% conclusive.

Either way, something supernatural exists. If the universe is finite , then the following is the rational conclusion to draw . There is no logical way out of it unless you’re willing to lie to yourself.

Science tries to determine the age of the universe, but we’re still left with the question of what was first. What started our finite universe? The answer is very simple – something finite or something infinite.

Now finite and infinite are mutually exclusive and there is no middle ground. You can’t be kind of finite or kind of infinite. It’s one or the other – black and white. Finite things have a beginning and end and infinite things have no beginning and no end (deliciously supernatural ).

The problem with something finite being the beginning source is that it requires a beginning source itself in order to begin (and that keeps looping ). If you think finite matter appeared out of nothingness without cause, not only do you believe in something supernatural, but you’re completely delusional about it. In a universe nothing of nothing, something can’t happen because there is no matter, air, space or anything! There’s nothing and no catalyst to activate that nothing.

Natural law cannot produce a viable theory or concept that agrees with logic for the initial instance of matter – and our universe is very likely finite, disagree with this and you already believe in the supernatural.
This is a problem that Naturalists will never resolve logically.

Many atheists refuse or hesitate to accept the “ infinite thing” because we live with finite , tangible things. But if we broadly consider existence using logic, there is no other explanation. The first cause has to be independent of any other cause, and there must be a first cause because nothing can’t produce something.

Many have questioned what makes the first cause exempt from needing a cause, why the first cause exists, and so on. These questions have an unknowable supernatural answer, and this is where atheists turn around and run.

The existence of the universe breaks the laws of nature and everything we understand. If it is deemed logical that something supernatural exists, our observations and logic about that something are rendered useless to understand how it works otherwise it wouldn’t be supernatural. I hope you've been able to catch a glimpse of the supernatural. [/b]

winner01:
I've advised you people not to make use of the word open-mindedness ever again, let me add free-thinking to the list of words you'll should never ever use. Cos clearly your thinking is myopic and sealed. He wanted to make money?, the hospital and its doctors too wanted to make money?, the medical reports too were for profit? How much has he made since then? Why are you people like this? How do you live your life having to believe in a lie?.

My family is a testimony, I have tasted and seen that God is good. Does it matter if i tell you anymore testimonies, especially considering the fact that you've decided to close your heart.

timonski:
...
* since EVENT always precede time, it implies that matter precedes time. Thus no beginning, since a beginning is still "time" which requires two or more events(which in turn require objects aka matter lol)
Thus "Matter is eternal" is the default position.

dalaman:
Will you stop telling lies. Where did he state the name pf the hospital and the name of any doctor? A guy claimed he died for 90 minutes 25 years ago and wrote a best selling book about it to make money from it. You on the other hand are trying to lie and say things he never claimed. He never mentioned tye namemof any hospital or doctor. Stop saying what he didn't say just because you want to promote an urban legend.

Has any body in your family whonis an amputee recieved healing?

winner01:
Dont be lazy, my post emphasized his book and film and not his life. Google is ur friend na.

No, but death has been overcome in my family, all glory to God.

Weah96:
Apparently not, if there wasn't any light. The sun provides life, indirectly. Do you have any idea when darkness was created, or is darkness as old as the outside time person?

I don't bother to press people like you too hard because unlike scientists, you already have an escape route. After a while you'll tell me that the spirit must occupy my body before I can understand the common English words

winner01:
[b] Removing God from the equation, you have dragged me back to causation/causality and ive explained that earlier on. We will relate two events, a first and a second. i.e a cause and an effect, where the first event is understood to be responsible for the second. I explained sufficient and adequate causes. other causes you might wanna argue include;

Necessary causes:
If x is a necessary cause of y, then the presence of y necessarily implies the presence of x. The presence of x, however, does not imply that y will occur.
Contributory causes:
A cause may be classified as a "contributory cause", if the presumed cause precedes the effect, and altering the cause alters the effect, regardless of whether either the cause or the effect appears only in the presence of the other.
Probabilistic causation
Interpreting causation as a deterministic relation means that if A causes B, then A must always be followed by B. In this sense, war does not cause deaths, nor does smoking cause cancer.
Causal calculus
When experimental interventions are infeasible or illegal, the derivation of cause effect relationship from observational studies must rest on some qualitative theoretical assumptions.
None of the other causes refute the God cause claim.

Saying events preceeds time is synonymous to effects preceeding cause. It then automatically requires another cause. In simple words, the initial existence of matter still requires a cause. You said it yourself, A begining requires events, a cause . So please dont say matter is eternal, you contradict yourself. For how i arrived at God being the cause, you can refer to my earlier posts. [/b]

KingEbukasBlog:
Your difficulty to understand the absence of time is that God's world/realm/universe is not physical/material . He is in a different dimension . [size=20pt]So describing something above my perception literally needs more - the Holy Spirit .[/size]

timonski:
sir, what do you mean by supernatural

timonski:
@winner01.
Just think of it this way. If TIME precedes matter, then at a period in time, there was no matter. Then the question is:
what was time used to differentiate between? Events? If yes, then what takes part in the event, God or matter? If God, does God now operate within time? If not, can matter exists before the beginning of matter? C'mon, give me answers.

winner01:
[b]What exactly dont you understand.
-that cause began time?
-that time serves as a distinction for effect?
-that time measures the durations of events (cause and effect in this case) and the intervals between them?
-that time itself is an effect of a cause?

Your argument is all in favour of an infinite universe. Be more precise pls. Let me take your questions.
Time is used as a starting point for an effect/response in the case of a finite universe.
Stephen Hawking in particular has addressed that even if time did not begin with the Big Bang (an infinite universe like you have proposed) and there were another time frame before the Big Bang, no information from events then would be accessible to "us" (you), and nothing that happened then would have any effect upon the present time-frame. Time preceeds matter, yeah. At a period in time, there was no matter, yeah. What was time used to differentiate between? Simple. TIME STARTED. I mean, since there was no matter before time, what difference could time measure but the begining of matter.
I see your infinite matter theory as nothing but speculative physics. Employ validity, provide a sufficient cause for your infinite matter theory. [/b]

ekemini606:
I see so many few atheist littering everywhere with their gospel of non_ existence of an almighty being. For some reason this few enlightened, seem to believe that everyone across time and space who have somehow believe in an all powerfull being are fools/ irrational. Forgetting that some of the most rational men ( Isaac newton for instance) believed in God.

Anyhow, my question for them this morning is_ how do one project so much hate and dislike towards something that does not exist?