ayoku777:


That's because hebrew is an ambiguous language. The same word can mean different things.

The word "malak" can also mean angel or messenger. So when you see malak in scripture, you will have to see the context to determine if the malak is angel, or messenger. Haggai was called, the Lord's malak (Haggai 1v13); that "malak" cannot mean angel.

So if shamayin in Genesis 1v1 can mean universe or heavenly realms or paradise. Then you have to look at the verse to check which one it is referring to in that context.

That was why I gave you the verse that shows that angels were with God singing and shouting for joy when He laid the foundations of the earth and fastened it to corner-stones (Job 38v4-7).

If angels were with God at the creation of the earth, that should therefore tell you that by Genesis 1v1; paradise, the spiritual heavenly realms and angels were already in existence then. Proving that their own beginning was well before the beginning of Genesis 1v1.

So the shamayin created in Genesis 1v1 can only be the universe and the earth. The universe and the earth was the shamayin created in six days (Exodus 20v11). Because angels, paradise, and the heavenly realms where already there when God was laying the foundations of the earth.

That's how you use scripture to explain scripture.

Do you get it now?

Shalom

vooks:
Asalimpo,
Do you believe the bible is the Inspired Word of God?
If you don't, then all the evidence adduced against your claims will ring hollow. Scriptures encourage us to THINK and reason,mbut not caricature God

The circumstances of suicide can also be applied to other things such as prostitution,adultery,homosexuality.... If you are going to wallow in situational ethics your hands are going to be full. But you won't get nowhere.

As you have been told, the sanctity of life is what makes suicide sin.

The earth is 6000 years because Adam, created in the 6th day has finite and known descendants going to Christ.

oyeludef:
Alright i get your point but u still av some questions to answer.
Wen adam and eve were formed, God told them to replenish (refill) the earth and subdue it. He gave dem dominion as well(what were dey supposed to dominate. Was is animals dat were already in their care?).
Also Jeremiah 4:23-28, said
“I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger. For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end. For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black: because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.”
This time Jeremiah saw never happened in bible days and it not gonna happen again but it bears a resemblance with what happened in gen1:2 were d earth became formless and void.
Recently i read a book by Kenneth hagin (thea triumphant church) and he talked about a preadamic race on earth and said dat was d race dat was destroyed b4 God restore the earth and created adam. Dat was d race demons came from as we know they aren't angels but disembodied spirits.
Also, scientific studies has proved dat dinosaurs lived millions of years ago and even if u as a person learn how to do d carbon dating yourself, u will get d same results. There are huge deposits of fossil fuels underneath d earth which are evident of life even in unexplored lands. In science, we are taught d procedures dat are passed by dead organisms to get to d stage of fossil fuels, and it takes aeons to do so.
Thanks for ur patience in answering me and not resorting to jibes as common with nairalanders.

ayoku777:


The study of galaxies, solar systems and planets is a personal hubby of mine. I read extensively and watch online documentaries about the universe, black holes, dark matter, dark energy etc.

I'm a science research lover and I'm also a believer in Christ. I don't know why people have this delusion that christianity is antiscience.

God is the ultimate scientist, and science is the study of God's physical creation and the laws He ordained to order His physical creation. That's why I love science.

But when it comes to the age of things, the true age of things is relative to when they were created by God, not by how they look or by how long you think it should take them to have looked this way.

When God created Adam, He created him as a full grown man, not as a baby. So if you were to look at Adam then, you would say you're looking at a 30year old man, not knowing you're looking at only a day old man.

So when Adam looked 31years old, he was only one year and a day old by creation.

Today, some scientists that don't believe in creation account look at stars and planetary bodies and claim they are billions of years old, because according to them that's how long it should take for a sun to become a white dwarf, or pulser etc.

God can make what He created look any age at the point of creation, like He made Adam look 30years at just a day old.

God created time and it is subject to Him. So when you look up at the universe and everything in it, you must learn to say, "Let God be true". Because the true age of a thing is based on when they were created by God, not by how they look or by how long you think it should have taken it to look this way.

Shalom

asalimpo:

if demons are'nt fallen angels,then what are they/
Another class of beings?
In whose image where they created? they are only 2 class of beings . Ministering spirits (angels etc)
, humans (created in God's images).
too many loopholes and question marks that dont add up.

I dont believe in the pre adamic race story.
That's another shoe horning there.
But i do believe that the earth predates adam.

oyeludef:
demons are quite different from angels. Demons are disembodied spirits roaming and seeking where(bodies) to rest and perpetrate their evil. Angels do not need bodies cos dey av d ability to take any form dey want. D Bible makes us to know dat some even appear to us unknowingly. D devil took d form of a serpent to tempt eve.

asalimpo:



The creation of adam and the creation of the earth are two distinct events.

There's no biblical evidence that Adam and the earth were created on the same day , or time period.

In Fact, looking closer at it, It couldnt be. The day God created the earth is'nt the day God created Adam.

There most likely an elapse of time after when God created the earth and

This is what i call shoe horning. Like i said there's no scriptural data backing up a 6000 year old earth.

"Do i believe the bible is the inspired word of God"- this question is condescending and irrelevant.

Taking another person's life and taking one's own life are two different things entirely.
The bible speaks a lot on murder - of another person.
The motive for such are usually done out of hate.
In the case of suicide - i gave copious examples when one may be driven to take his life.
The motive under which one may take his life is completely different from that which one may take anothers and i explained copiously.

People take their lives because they want peace and freedom from torment (the tormenting situation they are in).
This doesn't mean they dont respect their lives or view it as sacred but because,
right or wrong, they see no way out of their own personal hell.
(this is the class of suicides i'm thinking of).
If they live, the life is torment.
day by day. Death makes sense. Ending it makes sense.

Their lives give God no glory ,if they continue living it.
If they dont end it, they pray for it to end. They have a death wish.

I am not justifying suicide or trying to excuse it. But ,like i said, it would be twisting it to say,
things the bible didnt say.

vooks:

Of course they are; Adam was created the last day, the earth the first day

Again Adam was created the sixth day, the earth the first day

You don't need to look 'closer', Adam was created the 6th day, the earth the first day

And what??

Nonsense, there is no evidence the earth is older than 6000 yrs


It is very relevant and if you can't see fit then you are unworthy my time. If you doubt it's claims, then discussing its claims is a waste of time

Why do you care what the bible speaks?
Why is it a reference point?


Nobody needs lectures on suicide motives. It don't make you clever in any way, the motives are well known.
Any motive behind suicide can equally apply to murder. Would that make murder more palatable?

Any mindset of a suicidal person can apply to a murderer. Would it make murder palatable?

asalimpo:

Gen 1.1 "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth ".
2. "Now the earth was without formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God ws hovering over the waters"

3. "And God said let there be light," etc..

The bible says, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth"
The heavenly realm and the earth.
But on the first day, he created light. separating it from darkness which was on the earth.

There is a subtle but clear demarcation of what events took place on the first day and what took place in the beginning.

In the beginning, God created his Abode, and the heavenly realm and the earth realm.

That's all the bible says on that. Its apparent in that verse. He would have had to have created
the heavenly realm before creating earth and its unlikely looking at those verses that He,
created the heavenly realm , the earth realm, left it voidless and formless, (i.e created chaos)
then recreated order.

The more plausible explanation is that "In the beginning" God created the heavens and earth,
then had to recreate the earth , it was the recreation of the earth that is depicted in genesis 1:3 .

Again, creating the heavens, would entail creating the heavenly hosts - the angels, the dominions etc.
That would have taken a lot of time.

The bible says the angels rejoiced when God created man.
Did God do all those in the first day? Most unlikely.
Very unlikely.

The first day of gen 1.3 is not the beginning.

"... if i doubt its claims then discussing its claims is a waste of time "
- Your question was irrelevant because you could deduce my stance from my previous comments.

- And by that you mean the bible has a clear cut stance of suicide?
You equate it to murder?

"why do i care what it speaks . Why is it a reference points "
Again, you only needed to read my comments to deduce my stand.
This statement is unnecessary.

"Nobody needs a lecture on suicide motives . .... "
Maybe you dont. But for you and those who hastily classify suicide and murder as one,
motive makes a difference and affects how God would judge it.

The motives for murder are usually different than those for suicide.
This makes the assessment of suicide as a one-way ticket to hell, a subjective statement.

"Any mindset of a suicidal person can also apply to a murderer"
- That's a long stretch. More often the mindsets are entirely different.
The palatability of the act isnt an issue. Both are gross.

simplex2:
@ vooks, when you say "there's no evidence to show that the earth is 6000 yrs old", do you mean religious/biblical evidence or scientific evidence?

asalimpo:

Another view is that demons are fallen angels too.
Their forms became gnarled and heidous as they were cast out of the Heaven and the presence of God.
Not all of the fallen angels got warped and hideous in appearance.

vooks:

ALL evidence, scriptural and physical/scientific point to a young earth of under 7K years

simplex2:


another one bites the dust!

Was thinking you were even smart with the way you tore that tb Joshua prophesy into shreds.

No need to try and educate you, someday, just maybe someday, you will learn that the earth is well over millions of years old.

Oluwaseytiano:
6000year old earth? com on vooks, you are smarter than this. But then, the wonders or religious brainwashing

oyeludef:
not true bro. The bible tells us about fallen angels taking on the form of man and getting married to daughters of men. Angels are very different from demons. A thousand demons can conveniently recide in an individual. Angels can take any natural form dey want to because dey av a body with dat ability. Remember satan had fallen already before he took d form of a serpent.
According to the order of creation check colossians 1
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Colossians 1:15-17 KJV

vooks:


He created heaven and earth and light on DAY 1

It doesnt add up.
It's the heavens. The first,second,third.
Then the host to help him, Angels.
Then the earth.
from the rest of genesis, you can see the substructure of the earth:
land, animals, light, etc.
Similarly, the heavens would contain more substructures and so on.
The heavens are greater than the earth in scope and magnitude,
while God can do all things, He could have created planet earth in a minute,
but he chose to work in 6 days.
By the same vein, it would be out of form for Him to operate at a blistering pace
on the first day and take a lesser stride on subsequent days.
It doesnt add up.
The work of creating the heavens, the angels, and all its structure, could very well have taken
anoda 7 days or more. If he did such in one day, then why space himself evenly subsequently?

2) creating the heavenly hosts in day one, and immediately proceeding with earth creation on day two,
gives little or no room for the angels to learn and know their creator.
It still doesnt add up.
Notice in the creation of adam, God could have created man and woman on the very first day.
But you see Him spacing Himself. He also established a relationship with man, before He created woman. It took time to build this relationship.
Why? because man is not omniscient, he has to grow in wisdom and intellect and get accustomed
through repetitions and exposure.
In the same way, the angels of God , wouldnt be omniscient from day of creation, they too would have
to grow through repetition and exposure.
And God would've space Himself as He did with man.

By implication God also created Hell on the first day.


The 'subtle' demarcation is ONLY clear to the biased mind already looking for one. Once you remove punctuation and verses, this is all too clear

Or a thinking mind reasoning from deduction.



The author is describing creation in progress...starts with nothing, darkness and disorder, and then order

The description of the earth God created on the first day is one of disorder and chaos.
That is not God's modus.
There was an earth, but it was in Chaos, its apparent from the verse.
Why would God create unnecessary chaos and disorder before creating His main intention-an orderly earth?
Makes no sense.
But it makes sense that He was re-creating a disorganized place . Bringing it back into form.


It is not 'more plausible', it is a case of inventing your own things and then embarking on a fishing expedition to vindicate yourself

We all conjecture when there no clear cut statement of fact on an issue. But
how logical and aligned our conjectures are is what differentiates them from magical fishing.



These are your wild baseless and certainly unscriptural assumptions. Creation could have taken an instant or a trillion years, it took 6 days. Period

the bases are the scriptures. Again, it makes absolute sense.
God revealed his pattern , in how He created the earth, it makes sense therefore to
reason within His pattern of operation.
Creation could have taken a second, but it didnt. It could've taken a day but it didnt.
God paced Himself. If He paced Himself and only engaged in day long work loads,
why would be out of turn to think He did a days work on the first day and not a week /weeks on it?
If He created the heavens, hell, earth, angels, the spiritual realms, light and darkness on the first day,
He clearly broke pace.
Why didnt He continue at such blistering pace and create all of the the earth in a day afterwards?
why did He slow His pace?

There's nothing baseless about this conjecture. You only need to think.


It does, if you doubt the integrity of scriptures, then that's your problem

There's no integrity here. There's a gaping hole, that the scriptures is silent on.
It's left open to the reader to fill it in.
And the opposing view to yours is based on reasoning from scriptures too.


No I can't, and I don't make assumptions over what I can easily verify. So once again, do you believe scriptures are inspired word of God?


You dont need to assume (reach a conclusion from unsupported data), but you could infer.


Both entail taking away life that God gave

Yes.


They may be different but they surely can overlap.


Yes they may be different but they can overlap.

Suicide and murder have common ground. The motives may overlap,
but they are often vastly different.

To prove this, name ANY suicide motive and try and give me a reason why it can't be a possible motive for murder

I dont need to spell it out for you. The dominant motive for suicide and murder are vastly different.
Spelling it out for your with cases and examples would be over extending myself.
I'm talking about norm here not possibility. They're two different things.
possibility is a feasible but wild stretch, while norm is the occurence with highest frequency.
It's possible to have a conversation by snail mail. but chat/social apps is the norm.

asalimpo:



It just doesnt add up.
If there was a pre-adamic civilisation, then many question arise.
Why didnt God save them , like he saved the human race?
if God chose to destroy them then He showed bias?
Spirits can occupy space, they are not limited by the laws of physics?
Satan was a cherub, He was a high ranking angel, so when he fell, God
still let him retain some of his powers.
The lesser angels, could be the demons and they are.
Even in the satanic kingdom, you see that the fallen beings maintain their heirarchy
according to their pre fall standing. e.g
princes (principalities), powers , rulers , then wicked spirits.

2) A lot of angels fell. if all of them retained their pre fall form, then they'd be no or little
distinction between those locked up in pits for the last day and those let lose.

3) God respects authority and works through one.
Notice, that when the Angel that went to retrieve Moses body was countered by satan,
the Angel respected satan because of his last office in God's kingdom.
So it stands to reason, that God still let the high ranking angels that fell to maintain, some
of their power and authority and gifts (though they'll all be perverted)
The rest as they left God's present, became hideous warped forms and developed vile cravings.

4) if demons are a pre-adamic generation,
then they wouldnt all be more intelligent than man or stronger than man .
The reason for this is that,
all human like spirits had to learn and grow.
and all human spirits are at different levels of intelligence and physical strenght - depending
on how motivated,gifted the human spirit is.
But demons are pound for pound, above man in all aspects.
Meaning, that either God created them with superlative intellect and strength or they all acquired it
in their life time. Eitherway, it doesnt add up. God creates seeds not full grown full capacity beings.
The exception are angels, and this is so because angels are ministering spirits - to minister to
God's babies (human spirits).
So the superlative intellect, strength of demons points again to their angelic roots.

5) Angels took on human form and mated with human females.
They did so because they wanted to enjoy sensual pleasures like humans.
After the flood they wanted to return to their first estate but were rejected,
if all angels cast out of heaven remained angels, with their angelic form,
then they could easily take on human form as they will but otherwise,
they'd still desire the benefits of being in a human body.
Note also, that when satan was cast out of heaven, his form changed.
He became a serpent, the dragon. Both his name and form changed.
But he could still revert back to his earlier form as an angel of light.
So,its equally likely that others experienced deformation too.

asalimpo:
1) Suicide is a sin?
-----------------------------
says who?

2) The earth is 6000 years old?
-------------------------------------
provide scriptures please.


Christians too are guilty of spewing a whole lot of crap without scriptural evidence.
And want to force it on you.

penisilin:
Number 1: Suicide
Do not be a fool–why die before your time? Ecclesiastes 7:17b

For you are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
1 Corinthians 6:20

Number 2: Earth
No one said the earth is 6,000 years old na.
I personally believe that the generation of the people that built the tower of babel took a lot of years if not thousands of years to reach that height of technological advancement. It's not explicitly written but between the lines, some infos takes shape in an inquisitive mind.

asalimpo:

Do you have any biblical backing enumerating and computing the 6000 year old earth?
And the bible doesnt clearly flat out say, God created the heaven and earth in the period when he created man. He couldve created heaven and earth, with no man in it. Then recreated the heaven and earth later
to accomodate man.
If so, then the earth would be older than 6000 years.

if Jesus was coming in the 6000th year as you conjecture, then His coming is known,
it is no more suprise. God and Jesus are predictable. They wait for 6 days,years,millenia,
then show up in the 7th year and do their thing.
That goes against the biblical injunction to be ready. And that Jesus knows not the hour or time when He will come.
Again, this kind of conjecture is typical christian tradition. Note, how the millenial reign is tied to rest.
Besides, to make it look plausible, the 6000 year old earth assumption must be made.

I posit that the earth is older than 6000 years.

If a christian soldier is being dragged to a torture chamber in war,
where his fingers will be pulled out, his eyes gouged out, and his toes beaten to pulp with a hammer,
would he be commiting a sin by biting a cyanide pill?

Many people commit suicide out of hopelessness. A a sight of no future.
Yes, they could live but it would be a half life. They'd be living in hell.
In pain and turtore for the rest of their lives. How is such a life, an unlivable toxic existence benefitting anyone? It is neither giving God glory or even having any sign of respite for the live-r.
Many others are simply waiting to die. They've resigned from life.
Just waiting their time. How are they different from those who pull the plug on themselves?

Here are some reasons why people might take their life.
In retirement, all your earnings and what you've worked for have been wiped out.
Maybe a faulty investment or a scam.
You're old. You cant afford to pay for bills, health care, etc.
Who'll give you a job?
You know "God will make a way" is empty talk.
Yes, God can rain mannah from heaven, but even your church folks know that its over for you.
Your friends , children relations withdraw , leaving you to stew.
The grief alone and pain and hopelessness will drive one to contemplate suicide.

You've lost limbs during an accident.
You're fiance /fiancee leaves you cuz you look like a monster.
You are dependent on people for your sustenance-going to the bathroom, toilet,bathing etc
You will be a beggar all your life. Your employers have let you go.
You see your family treat you like dirt, after a while.
What stops such a one from ending it all- is that thing he is living really life?
Tell, me God will make his limbs grow back and his eyes pop out and he'll be back to living whole again.
Reassure him with that.


Your bf/gf that you sacrificed so much to help . believing that you'll live together as spouse one day.
On making it, he /she abandons you for some one else.
You see their photo on facebook etc.
The pain is stabbing.
Ok- you can preach on this, there's hope . You'll find another. But the pain is real and hurting.
some will yield to it.

You worked in a prestigious company. Your post was high and lofty.
One day you became framed for a thing you didnt do.
You lost your job. You're covered in shame. The neighbuors boo you.
You have to drive a cab around the city , doing menial work.
The pain - the shame - oooh. Ok this one well, can be recovered from.

They're some problems people can't recover from. The pain and despair is too ernomous.

oyeludef:

Alright so wat period did d fall of lucifer occur ad we know he was already fallen wen he tempted man in d garden? Wen was hell created cos we know it was created for the devil and his angels? If all this happened within a short time frame as y supposed, wen did all d drama in d heavenlies occur and d devil fall with those angels?

analice107:

Brother, the gall of lucifer had happened before man was created, hence; the staking of Adam (son of God) against his father (God).

analice107:


Bros you sef reason na. If I kill you na murder. If I kill myself na weytin? Why do the government arrests and prosecutes anyone who attempts suicide? What do they charge the person for, is it not attempted murder?
Gal 3:13 says, "Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law... For it is written cursed is any man who hangs on the tree

analice107:

Why not also bring out scriptures which supports all you posited as plausible reasons for suicide?

asalimpo:

And God judges by motives.

Murder is usually premeditated and with selfish interest (please dont start debating what 'selfish interest' means)
Suicides however, are usually pressed beyond measure - they driven by despair, shame,
temporary insanity, hopelessness, some pride, some times physical pain. They want out of a hellish situation.
While they're alive, they're in torment.

Not everybody has the backbone for torment and pressure. Some have fickle backbone so when the storm of life hits, without intervention of some sorts, they could take their lives in one rash second
because of the anguish of their heart.
It is in this light that i wonder if they'll end up in hell.

vooks:


Really?
Does this apply to beastiality? Are there some valid motives behind beastiality?

Yes really.
How is bestiality related to the topic under discussion - suicide?

One wise man said there is nothing new under the sun. The question of suicide has been debated for probably centuries, and I'm very familiar with just about every objection you may throw.

Then i guess your viewpoints are not yours but borrowed opinions on the matter.


This idea of probabilities is not helping you. 'Usually' bla de bla.
So I asked you a simple question; do motives for suicide and murder EVER overlap?

The idea of probability was a distinguishing factor. If you have objections to it,
point it out logically. You've not done so.
I dont want to repeat myself.
Like i said before,
you were stretching the context out of proportion to fit your opinion ,
and i summarily said, you should keep within the bounds of reason, i.e within
the bound of normalcy . Where normalcy would be the typical expected norm on
the matter.
let me explain: If you fall from a ten story building, could you survive(yes)
but will you survive (no).
the yes relates to possibility (1 in 1000 or 10000 etc could survive)
but for most of the cases most would be goners.

What are the typical motives for suicide vs murder.
keep your answer within the bounds of the typical.
Because that's the context i'm speaking from.



The same can be said of murder. To help you with context, do you think the person who assists the tormented and pressured person end his life guilty of murder?

You are introducing more variables to the question than is necessary.
Getting into these side holes could lead to more un necessary wrangling.
Not to talk of them being besides the point.
Issues, like guilty before whom (God or the law of the land) arises.
etc.
Also there's a subtle twist here - "pressured and tormented person end his life guilty of MURDER".
You've categorised suicide as murder?
While i've not. kudos for the leading question.
So stop putting words in my mouth.
If before the law of the land, its another ball game - besides that'snot my focus.



What about the mother who when the 'storms of life hit' their 'fickle' backbone caves in and they smash their newborn to escape pressure and torment say of motherhood and the 'anguish of their heart' at their new status?
A mother killing her baby and a person taking their life are two different things.
In the example you give, though highly contrived, she shares the same motive as a suicide may,
this does not conversely put the act of the suicide on the same pedestal as the act of the mother who murdered the baby.
Lets examine this situation.
After the mother has done the deed, she's still alive, left to face the law of the land.
She's hoping that though she has taken another person's life, the law ,in modern society will be lenient ont her and spare hers.
But the suicide has taken his/her life and is gone forever. he/she is facing God who doesnt judge as man judges.
The issue is will the suicide be banished to hell or not!
The mother could trigger under less pressure hoping that things will blow over over a few years and she'll be free. In short she could be banking on that.
For the suicide, the pressure may be more intense. They know, that the act is irreversible.
Yet driven to take their life, the pressure must have been greater , at least percieved so, at the moment
the made the decision to end it all.
This complicates the matter and makes the judgement of it , not so clear cut as black and white murder.

Back to the mother's case, even at that it is still not clear cut black and white murder.
by clear cut i mean , pre meditated.
In the eyes of the law, she could be viewed as psychotic and mentally unstable or insane.
Medically and psychologically, it could be proved that her stress levels were so high that
she was temporarily out of control of her faculties and so did it.

Look at a suicide case:
You've worked all night , slept in the office, trying to get work done to meet some bosses deadline.
Your relationship is in disarray. Your health is a mess due to corporate pressure.
Coming in from hour long traffic jam, you fall in straight into a result only driven work place.
You've worked hard and tried hard to do professional work, only be called into the boss's office ang get
chewed out by him. your week long work is trivialized. Your sleepless night is not even considered.
The bosses poor assessment on you will reflect on your appraisal slip.
You may be passed on again for promotion -
The boss rants on you and dismisses you like a fly.
Like scum.
You've been subjected to this kind of dehumanising degrading insults for year on year, all so that
you could build a career and make a name for yourself in life.
That day as he , blows you away, something snaps.
You respond in anger while receiving a glaring stare from him. You know, your days are numbered.
in a daze, you walk back to your office.
a) sit down, let it blow off. drive home in a daze, his insults echoing at the back of your head.
b) blast him and slam things, get arrested , lose your job , say to hell with it and give him to the tongue
lash of your life. You lose your job but your respect is intact.
c) get a gun, plan a shoot out carefully. continue taking insults and poke, then one day,
unleash mayhem on the office.. Eventually, get gunned down by a team of swat team police men.
d) go the the office window punch a hole in the wall glass and jump down to your death.

e) take the pressure, like a chicken in hot water but grow a thick skin to it- eventually.

here is one action, but different reactions.
The pain was real, the anger was real, the hurt was real. Some people handled it well,
but some blew it. But what was the driving force behind it?
could the person, be in hell for that?
He's born again. saved but he didnt take the pressure well. and capitulated.
Often, when these people are rescued, they may regret their actions.
It's not about not valueing life, some of these folks would have acted differently,
but the torment they were living in was a daily thing and they want to escape it.
That's why they shouldnt be classed together as cold blooded murderers.

asalimpo:
.

asalimpo:

I was not justifying suicide . But citing situations where it would be compelling.
And distinguishing it from cold blooded murder.