₦airaland Forum

Ranchhoddas:
I don't believe our minds are equipped to fathom the reasons behind the Creator's interference or lack of it in various scenarios. We can only hope for such interventions when we require them.

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Something that would ordinarily not be expected to happen. Those things doubters like to call 'coincidence'.

i dont think beings of this universe are equipped to be able to comprehend,speak,gisk,and ask of favours from the great authors..let alone ask ''him'' to help us find our car keys.

English is a human language..made by humans..and for humans.

Ranchhoddas:
The atheist position is one of logic mixed with a great deal of courage. I admire it. The big bang could have been spontaneous; unless you have DEFINITIVE CONTRARY evidence.

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The agnostic position is one of cowardice, a reluctance to pick for fear of being wrong. It's usually transitive, as people tend to move on from it.

Agnosticism a position of cowardice? Although I see agnostics as representatives of ignorance, how does honesty become cowardice?

QuietHammer:
Agnosticism a position of cowardice? Although I see agnostics as representatives of ignorance, how does honesty become cowardice?

The theist, agnostic, atheist etc. are all honest about what they believe. The agnostic position stems from a fear of being wrong.

MrMontella:
i dont think beings of this universe are equipped to be able to comprehend,speak,gisk,and ask of favours from the great authors..let alone ask ''him'' to help us find our car keys.

English is a human language..made by humans..and for humans.

You are assuming that this interventions are as a result of human supplication. It doesn't necessarily have to be so. The interventions may be as a result of the Creator's will and not necessarily human pleas. This would explain why miracles are not unique to any group of people.

Ranchhoddas:
The theist, agnostic, atheist etc. are all honest about what they believe. The agnostic position stems from a fear of being wrong.

The fear of being wrong would most likely make an agnostic become a theist.

I know what you mean. But the fear I mean is an intellectual one, not that of an angry God.

QuietHammer:
The fear of being wrong would most likely make an agnostic become a theist.

Ranchhoddas:
I know what you mean. But the fear I mean is an intellectual one, not that of an angry God.

I don't think fear is the appropriate word then since there is no danger or threat attached to being wrong

Ranchhoddas:
The atheist position is one of logic mixed with a great deal of courage. I admire it. The big bang could have been spontaneous; unless you have DEFINITIVE CONTRARY evidence.

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The agnostic position is one of cowardice, a reluctance to pick for fear of being wrong. It's usually transitive, as people tend to move on from it.

a spontaneous system is impossible bro. the second law of thermodynamic states so(it states that a perpetual motion machine(in this case, the universe) of the first kind is impossible).

for a lay man, "it is impossible for a system to release energy without corresponding expenditure of energy......we physicist now know that the universe is not spontaneous(that settles the spontaneity issue)


as per atheist, I admire them too, cos of the intelligence they demonstrate.

Ranchhoddas:
I believe in an interventionist causeless cause. I also believe in Jesus Christ and the power in His name.

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Freethought is my methodology.

I like you sir for the intelligence you've display so far. as opposed to most xtain I've interacted with( most would rather become defensive when their belief is been questioned)


but I have just some problems with xtains beliefs

1. if it turns out that there are systems of worlds and not ours only, will Jesus then have to be moving from one world to another just to die for their sins.

2. the bible claims that god created heaven and earth, but now we know that, there is not just heaven and earth but a far more complex system. I shows that the bible was written by some old folks who do not understand the workings of the universe

3.why does it reflect the culture and tradition of that era?

4. and many more questions

this are some of the questions that moved me towards deism........


I'd be delighted if you can treat them to the best of your knowledge.

There's a Supreme Spirit which in English language is God, The Omnipotent!!!

Ranchhoddas:
You are assuming that this interventions are as a result of human supplication. It doesn't necessarily have to be so. The interventions may be as a result of the Creator's will and not necessarily human pleas. This would explain why miracles are not unique to any group of people.

then doctrines are annulled..

Also the ''intervention'' is not exclusively ''human'' too..

niyihawking:
I like you sir for the intelligence you've display so far. as opposed to most xtain I've interacted with( most would rather become defensive when their belief is been questioned)


but I have just some problems with xtains beliefs

1. if it turns out that there are systems of worlds and not ours only, will Jesus then have to be moving from one world to another just to die for their sins.

2. the bible claims that god created heaven and earth, but now we know that, there is not just heaven and earth but a far more complex system. I shows that the bible was written by some old folks who do not understand the workings of the universe

3.why does it reflect the culture and tradition of that era?

4. and many more questions

this are some of the questions that moved me towards deism........


I'd be delighted if you can treat them to the best of your knowledge.

he is a free thinker!

MrMontella:
he is a free thinker!

but he said he believe in Jesus and the power of his name ......hence my questions

niyihawking:
but he said he believe in Jesus and the power of his name ......hence my questions

maybe the psychological workings of his name,seriously I didn't get him too

niyihawking:
I like you sir for the intelligence you've display so far. as opposed to most xtain I've interacted with( most would rather become defensive when their belief is been questioned)


but I have just some problems with xtains beliefs

1. if it turns out that there are systems of worlds and not ours only, will Jesus then have to be moving from one world to another just to die for their sins.

2. the bible claims that god created heaven and earth, but now we know that, there is not just heaven and earth but a far more complex system. I shows that the bible was written by some old folks who do not understand the workings of the universe

3.why does it reflect the culture and tradition of that era?

4. and many more questions

this are some of the questions that moved me towards deism........


I'd be delighted if you can treat them to the best of your knowledge.

I don't understand why you've asked this question. The Bible's position though is that the Earth is the pinnacle of creation, until definitive proof of life outside Earth is observed, I think this question is best left alone. Funny enough, I remember reading a book long ago 'The planet Mars and its inhabitants', the name Jesus factored greatly(can't remember the details now). I also remember reading the 'The law of one' by Ra (claimed to be an ET), the person of Jesus was also greatly acknowledged. There is something about that guy

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The Bible is a compilation of books mostly of Jewish origin by different authors at different periods in history. It was compiled by influential humans who chose which books to add and which not to. I don't believe it's inerrant. Some of the stories make zero sense. They are allegories at best and made-up stories at worst.

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If the Bible was written by Yorubas, it would reflect Yoruba culture. It's not inerrant.

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Deism is illogical in my own opinion.

Godgay:
maybe the psychological workings of his name,seriously I didn't get him too

I don't believe those workings are psychological. If a crippled man on a wheel chair is prayed for in the name of Jesus and he gets up, would call that psychological?

MrMontella:
then doctrines are annulled..

Also the ''intervention'' is not exclusively ''human'' too..

A lot of the doctrines, if not all, are man-made.

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Intervention is intervention, my point is that the Creator's hand is felt is one way or the other even if we don't know or acknowledge it.

notjonbellion:
this is why I'm cool with agnosticism

They are agnostic theist also so what is your point?

niyihawking:
I like you sir for the intelligence you've display so far. as opposed to most xtain I've interacted with( most would rather become defensive when their belief is been questioned)

i am a Christian... similar to r.ochandass but i admire the deistic and somehow pantheistic position of God

1. if it turns out that there are systems of worlds and not ours only, will Jesus then have to be moving from one world to another just to die for their sins.

many people have asked the question... its quite hard to think we are alone in the universe... if aliens do exist, then its not compulsory their story would be the same as ours... cuz we both know that the Christian view of sin was from the devil who was cast down to earth... not to other planets

2. the bible claims that god created heaven and earth, but now we know that, there is not just heaven and earth but a far more complex system. I shows that the bible was written by some old folks who do not understand the workings of the universe

3.why does it reflect the culture and tradition of that era?

4. and many more questions

my answers to the remaining questions would be the same as that of r.ochandass

this are some of the questions that moved me towards deism........


I'd be delighted if you can treat them to the best of your knowledge.

i do admire deism and i find their view of God far more logical than that of the atheists

QuietHammer:
The deistic God is so poorly defined, it id untestable, unfalsifiable. It is a 'nothing '.

What possible justification could you have for believing that "oh, there is something, but I don't know what it is". Aren't you at that point claiming to detect the undetectable?

I hope deism goes beyond "well, I just can't believe that there is nothing, so there must be something ".

you don't seem to get the basic concept of deism...deist see the naturalistic aspect of life as a sign of a higher power and don't subscribe to religious dogmatism propelled by organized religion.
deism is based on reason and most importantly evidence, this evidence can only be found in nature so what's illogical about that?

ScepticalPyrrho:
Deism provides no answers but further speculations.

It isn't a position backed up with facts either. It fails the same test of provision proofs as other theistical arguments.

Is see nothing wrong in admitting that we do not know anything yet.

WE DONT KNOW!

If there must be an intelligent Designer, is our reality the only universe?
There could also be zillions of parallel reality with their designers. The Designers may also need a supreme designer too who in turn needs a designer.
Where do we end this speculations?
Our mind can keep trying to make sense of the universe no doubt. But until we are certain of our claims, we can make up reasons for the existence of an intelligent Designer. None would count as knowledge.

WE SINCERELY DON'T KNOW!

I'm good with this.

Our self-consciousness is our greatest burden. I've learnt to live with that.

That right there is our only problem, I always say Bleep the first hominid that asked why are we here. We should never have asked.

Ranchhoddas:
A lot of the doctrines, if not all, are man-made.

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Intervention is intervention, my point is that the Creator's hand is felt is one way or the other even if we don't know or acknowledge it.

all i see are just natural occurences...its all part of nature

Thats why unambiguous instances are much better for evaluation

Ruq:
That right there is our only problem, I always say Bleep the first hominid that asked why are we here. We should never have asked.

Lol.

QuietHammer:
The deistic God is so poorly defined, it id untestable, unfalsifiable. It is a 'nothing '.

What possible justification could you have for believing that "oh, there is something, but I don't know what it is". Aren't you at that point claiming to detect the undetectable?

I hope deism goes beyond "well, I just can't believe that there is nothing, so there must be something ".

Have you tried Pantheism ? You seem to be on the search, especially if you discuss so much about you do not believe means there is a part of you listening in for feelers that science will discover there is something there ? That hunger to know further truth about God (a corrupt name for a nameless thing) is something I help people ponder on. Go through my profile and threads and see if there is anything that can guide you on your search. If this messages sounds annoying to you, sincerely it is not, it might be the impulsive action of the sub-conscious mind modulated by the right hemisphere of the brain, that is the part controls impulses, intuition, consciousness soul etc. From our years of research, highly intelligent atheists who have proven within reasonable doubts that there is no God seem to have a dysfunction right hemisphere of the brain, when scanned the activities on that part of the brain is quite little or absent, which means the faculty that controls impulses, intuition, consciousness etc dont function optimally. But the good news is, there are questions, when asked can help trigger the sensors on the neurotransmitters when an atheist is being asked. The atheist will ponder on the answers and then it will trigger questions in them and then gradually, it opens up and the school of thought that will make a little sense to the converted atheist is pantheism, then you graduate to where I am now. Knowing God. Being God.