₦airaland Forum

ScepticalPyrrho:
I can tell you with every confidence that God(an all-knowing, ever-loving, merciful...) can't talk like a disgruntled man.

Yahweh is a jewish myth like every other god-character.

Yeah? I happen to know a number of myths, but none of them keeps you awake through the night. Why is Yahweh giving you crams?

Anas09:
So, you believe it was actually God who told her to kill those kids?

You mean God will say to us "Thou shall not kill", then turn around and tell a woman to kill in order to give salavation?

Its a shame really that atheists don't reason.
How does one give another salvation by killing them?

Jesus gave us salvation from death to life. But now you believe Andrea gave salavation to her kids from life to death?


Do you even stop to ponder that the devil in your head could be the same devil in her head impersonating God?


Satan has been impersonating God in all the world's religions from time, shd it come as a supprised to hear a person committing the same act God is against but claiming God told them to do them?

Stop being so pathetic pls.

you're the Pathetic one here that can't stay consistent

we are talking about the children's view here, command theory doesn't apply anymore!

you're saying they did nothing wrong to the Canaanite infants because they'll make heaven

this logic is independent of whether they're carrying out instructions or not because those infants would make heaven if they fall in a ditch or get smothered by accidental suffocation brought about by mother or father rolling on top of them while they sleep or suffocate on their mother's booobs

basically, any infant killed or dies makes heaven independent of whether the killing was carried out by Yahweh's orders or not!

common sense states that since all the Canaanite children killed by the Israelites would make heaven which I'm pretty sure not all would've made heaven if they grow up; Herod killing the many children helped the children make heaven!!

Yates killing the children helped them make heaven!!! we are not debating if god asked her to kill or not

if I kill all infants around me, I'm helping them make heaven which they stood a chance of missing if they're allowed to grow up!!!!

ScepticalPyrrho:
I can tell you with every confidence that God(an all-knowing, ever-loving, merciful...) can't talk like a disgruntled man.

Yahweh is a jewish myth like every other god-character.

Its called Anthropomorphism

Anas09:
Aminu, get out of here. Allah is a liar and proud of it. He declared himself the hreatest of decievers who no human can escape.

I have been sounding it out loud here, when humans are talking, let the muslims be quiet.

tekam easy nah! I ain't d one that kill ur God on the cross.
so u do bliv Allah exist ? ALHAMDULILLAH ! u are close to the truth hopefully someday u will b one of Allah' s true worshiper when u already realized your God is dead on the cross..btw RIP to ur God.

Anas09:
Yeah? I happen to know a number of myths, but none of them keeps you awake through the night. Why is Yahweh giving you crams?

Sorry?

Are you trying to prove my argument wrong?


Or ignoring the issue raised like the others?

Anas09:
Yeah? I happen to know a number of myths, but none of them keeps you awake through the night. Why is Yahweh giving you crams?

red herring

rejoinder

hopefulLandlord:
you're the Pathetic one here that can't stay consistent

we are talking about the children's view here, command theory doesn't apply anymore!

you're saying they did nothing wrong to the Canaanite infants because they'll make heaven

this logic is independent of whether they're carrying out instructions or not because those infants would make heaven if they fall in a ditch or get smothered by accidental suffocation brought about by mother or father rolling on top of them while they sleep or suffocate on their mother's booobs

basically, any infant killed or dies makes heaven independent of whether the killing was carried out by Yahweh or not!

common sense states that since all the Canaanite children killed by the Israelites would make heaven which I'm pretty sure not all would've made heaven if they grow up; Herod killing the many children helped the children make heaven!!

Yates killing the children helped them make heaven!!! we are not debating if god asked her to kill or not

if I kill all infants around me, I'm helping them make heaven which they stood a chance of missing if they're allowed to grow up!!!!

Hahahahahahaha. You have no right to kill any infant Mr Atheist. You ve no right to even kill yourself.

No Israelite killed anyone. The ground rejected the evil doers, the Islaelites just carried out cleanning of the land for the Landlord.

And, yes, the kids returns back to their maker. But, she will stand before God to answer for her actions. Whether or not she was possessed or demented won't count. She'll take respinsiblity for her actions.

See, if you have problems with this, then do something about it.

Anas09:
Hahahahahahaha. You have no right to.kill any imfant Mr Atheist. You no.right to even kill yourself.

No Israelite killed anyone. The ground rejected the the evil doers, the Islaelites just carried out cleansing the land for.the Landlord.

And, yes, the kids returns back to their maker. But, she will stand be answer for her actions. Whether or not she was possessed or demented wont count. She'll take respinsiblity for her actions.

See, if you have problems with this, then do.something about it.

oh blood of FSM!

I'm not talking about rights here

I don't support killing of infants but your excuse for the killing of the infants and William Laine Craig's is too unreasonable

if you and Craig straight up defended this purely by Command Theory, I wouldn't have this issue but your defense that they'll make heaven anyways open a can of worms which you're dodging now that the emptiness is laid bare for you

Logic 1: Any infant that dies make heaven

Logic 2: Israelites didn't really do anything wrong to the innocent infants because they'll make heaven; their dying gives automatic salvation to them

that salvation stood a very high chance of being missed if they had grown up in a "sinful" Canaan

Logic 3: Yates and Herod did nothing wrong "from the perspective of the infants" because they'll make heaven!!

of course Herod and probably Yates would be judged later but that's not the discussion here

killing infants gives them AUTOMATIC SALVATION

hopefulLandlord:
oh blood of FSM!

I'm not talking about rights here

I don't support killing of infants but your excuse for the killing of the infants and William Laine Craig's is too unreasonable

if you and Craig straight up defended this purely by Command Theory, I wouldn't have this issue but your defense that they'll make heaven anyways open a can of worms which you're dodging now that the emptiness is laid bare for you

Logic 1: Any infant that dies make heaven

Logic 2: Israelites didn't really do anything wrong to the innocent infants because they'll make heaven; their dying gives automatic salvation to them

that salvation stood a very high chance of being missed if they had grown up in a "sinful" Canaan

Logic 3: Yates and Herod did nothing wrong "from the perspective of the infants" because they'll make heaven!!

of course Herod and probably Yates would be judged later but that's not the discussion here

killing infants gives them AUTOMATIC SALVATION

Define salvation Hopefullandlord. While at it, state why you think kids below the age of accountability needs salvation.

ScepticalPyrrho:
Sorry?

Are you trying to prove my argument wrong?


Or ignoring the issue raised like the others?

Did you not.say Yahweh is a myth?

Anas09:
Define salvation Hopefullandlord. While at it, state why you think kids below the age of accountability needs salavation.

hmmm maybe you should be the one to answer this because

William Laine Craig said the below

"If we believe, as I do, that God’s grace is extended to those who die in infancy or as small children, the death of these (Canaanite) children was actually their salvation."

you buttressed this by saying the below

Anas09:
Any kid below the age of accountability returns back to God

or is there something I'm missing?

randomperson:
Oh... Gladly...
Well... If we are to go with my own correct calculations, and totally discard the utter rubbish u did and called maths,... The percentage of atheists that are in prison is 0.13% while that of Christians is 0.74% percent. See?? Or should I come again??

This kid is very funny. *lol@his own correct calculations*. Clown.

noillebnoj:
infact from that William Craig statement killing kids has no repercussions cuz they'll make heaven
Intact there should be no problem of evil since Yahweh likes wiping out bad guys
Modern philosopher my arse!

You never listened to anything they said in church while you were there. Congregation's money afforded you the luxery of Computer games, you played them during church service and missed everthing. Shame.

noillebnoj:
lol that oga Samuel sef.....

Guy, if you go after him, i will come after you. You know nah. Maintain your space.

randomperson:
Guys... I need to go. Vigil is about to start in my church and am playing guitar for praises.... Will reply all mentions tho... Hope we'll continue tomorrow though.

May the Holy spirit locate you there.

aminusanti:
tekam easy nah! I ain't d one that kill ur God on the cross.
so u do bliv Allah exist ? ALHAMDULILLAH ! u are close to the truth hopefully someday u will b one of Allah' s true worshiper when u already realized your God is dead on the cross..btw RIP to ur God.

I never said he never existed. He is satan and Muhammed was his messenger.

Hey, gerraway from here.

hopefulLandlord:
hmmm maybe you should be the one to answer this because

William Laine Craig said the below

"If we believe, as I do, that God’s grace is extended to those who die in infancy or as small children, the death of these (Canaanite) children was actually their salvation."

you buttressed this by saying the below



or is there something I'm missing?

Yes. Salvation Craig's conyext, is God keeping the kids from committing the sins their parents commit. Taking them back to himself, in this context means salvation.

But salvation in the context of 'From sin to rigjteoumess' is different from that of preserving the kids from sin.

Anas09:
Yes. Salvation Craig's conyext, is God keeping the kids from committing the sins their parents commit. Taking them back to himself, in this context means salvation.

But salvation in the context of 'From sin to rigjteoumess' is different from that of preserving the kids from sin.

exactly!

so anyone that kills an infant is "keeping kids from committing sins their parents committed"

which is "salvation"

the second paragraph of your post isn't needed because we are talking infants here who haven't committed any sin

do we have an agreement?

hopefulLandlord:
exactly!

so anyone that kills an infant is "keeping kids from committing sins their parents committed"

which is "salvation"

do we have an agreement?

No one except God has the prerequisite power to kill anyone. If anyone does it, it is sin.

THOU SALL NOT KILL IS THE LAW. EXCEPT THE LAW MANDATES YOU.

Anas09:
No one except God has the prerequisite power to kill anyone. If anyone does it, it is sin.

THOU SALL NOT KILL IS THE LAW. EXCEPT THE LAW MANDATES YOU.

you're still popping "command theory" which I've shown has NO effect from the perspective of the children!

we are looking at things from the "children's view" not from general world view here; I'm not judging the action or motivation of the killer but the effect on the "killed" (infants)

the question WLC is answering was "what did the Canaanite infants do to deserve being killed?"

which is what WLC was also arguing, he didn't pop up Command Theory when it came to the infants and I'm simply using this simple logic here

his logic goes thus

"any infant that dies receives salvation"

therefore....

"the Canaanite infants got automatic salvation"

the first logic, which is where it all started, is what I'm using here

if I commit infanticide I've given every infant I kill salvation, my motivation or reasons don't apply here, Salvation is the point

Yates even though you might disagree with her reasons actually gave the infants SALVATION!

Herod even though you might disagree with his motivation and reasons still gave the infants SALVATION!!

Herod and Yates unwittingly gave all the children they killed "salvation"

have we reached an agreement?

I'm heading somewhere with this discussion

hopefulLandlord:
the question WLC is answering was "what did the Canaanite infants do to deserve being killed?"

which is what WLC was also arguing, he didn't pop up Command Theory when it came to the infants and I'm simply using this simple logic here

his logic goes thus

"any infant that dies receives salvation"

"when god kills an infant, its salvation"

"the Canaanite infants got automatic salvation"

the first logic, which is where it all started, is what I'm using here

if I commit infanticide I've given every infant I kill salvation, my motivation or reasons don't apply here, Salvation is the point

Yates even though you might disagree with her reasons actually gave the infants SALVATION!

Herod even though you might disagree with his motivation and reasons still gave the infants SALVATION!!

have we reached an agreement?

I'm heading somewhere with this discussion

Man cannot "give" salvation.

Oya continue.

DoctorAlien:
Man cannot "give" salvation.

Oya continue.

oh blood of FSM, where in my post did I say man gave salvation?

I said every infant that dies, no matter the reason for the death gets automatic salvation

do you agree with this?

KingEbukasBlog:
Its called Anthropomorphism

You just keep throwing words you learn like a toddler. When the writer of the bible say God told a prophet with a loud voice go and so so and so. Did it really happen or did the prophet make it up using these elusive anthropomorphism of yours?

hopefulLandlord:
oh blood of FSM, where in my post did I say man gave salvation?

I said every infant that dies, no matter the reason for the death gets automatic salvation

do you agree with this logic?

I guess my eye really deceived me when I saw "Herod...gave the infants salvation."

Or maybe you suddenly became blind to the part of your post I bolded.

Anyways, yes: when infants die, they are saved, because they have committed no sin.

DoctorAlien:
I guess my eye really deceived me when I saw "Herod...gave the infants salvation."

Or maybe you suddenly became blind to the part of your post I bolded.

Anyways, yes: when infants die, they are saved, because they have committed no sin.

you chose one part while ignoring the context of what I'm saying but would be quick to say we quoted a verse out of context

moving on

when infants die, they are saved, because they have committed no sin

good!

WLC's justification of infanticide by the Israelites was that the Israelites did no wrong to the infants because they (Canaanite infants) were automatically saved!

that annuls any command theory because the infants get salvation anyways even if god didn't command the killings

do you agree so far?

----(-1)------0------(1)-----

-1= Satan, death and other non-existent things

0= God, Purest Spirit, absolute Nothingness, beyond imagination, time and space

1= Christ, manifestation, infinite time and space, eternal life and happiness

The destruction of Satan is the elimination of those negative concepts, first in the mind through the light of Christ, and in reality. He that believeth shall never be disappointed, for Christ is the end of the law for righteouness to everyone that believeth, therefore we do not abolish the law through faith, on the contrary, we establish the fact that the law is fulfilled in Christ and by Christ, the only foundation which is acceptable before God.

Behold, I lay a stumbling stone in Zion and a rock of offence, but whosoever believeth in Him shall never die, for as many as rely on His sacrifice, grace and free gift are the sons of God.

The Jews (religious and self righteous) want to see a miracle, and the greeks (atheists) want logical explanation, but we preach that whosoever believes that Christ paid for all his sins shall be declared righteous by God, irrespective of any other consideration, and sin and death will no longer have punitive power over him, for the strength of death is sin, and the strenght of sin is the law of commandements and rules which no man can ever obey, because to disobey one is to disobey all, and without perfection godliness is futile. Only Christ could obey all, which he did by his full divine nature, and in his mercy paid the penalty, and rose again by the power of his divine nature, to examplify the victory over sin and death that will be inherited by those who believe in him.

This gift of righteouness and eternal life is so free that it will not cost you your lifestyle or anything else apart from faith in the sacrifice and finished work of Christ. Those who preach another gospel are blind, ignorant and workers of iniquity, whose hearts are covered with darkness and hence unable to comprehend the immeasurable grace and love of God. They are the self-righteous who preach everlasting suffering for sinners, of whom they are chief. God is love, and I am fully convinced of his everlasting mercy even upon those who wish or think the worst for others.

However, everyone will not receive the same reward in the world to come, and in many cases the first shall be the last. Not a bad thing though to be last in the Kingdom of God. Ask Satan, oh, I almost forgot, he is just a fading shadow!

Freely have I received from the Father, freely I give to whosoever believeth. It is more blessed to give than to receive, therefore I am blessed more abundantly, as will be those who spread the good news of God's love in a world about to be overtaken by darkness before the dawn of the new creation of God.

Jesus Christ is Lord!

hopefulLandlord:
you chose one part while ignoring the context of what I'm saying but would be quick to say we quoted a verse out of context

moving on

No matter the context, it can never be true that man gave salvation to anybody. Salvation comes from GOD alone.

good!

WLC's justification of infanticide by the Israelites was that the Israelites did no wrong to the infants because they (Canaanite infants) were automatically saved!

that annuls any command theory because the infants get salvation anyways even if god didn't command the killings

do you agree so far?

Sorry, I'm not here to agree or disagree with WLC.

However, I suppose it would be much more worse for an infant if his/her parents were slaughtered, and s/he was left alone an orphan.

On what the infants did to deserve death: answer is nothing! GOD gives and takes. Moreover, evil come to just people for no just cause too.

DoctorAlien:
No matter the context, it can never be true that man gave salvation to anybody. Salvation comes from GOD alone.



Sorry, I'm not here to agree or disagree with WLC.

However, I suppose it would be much more worse for an infant if his/her parents were slaughtered, and s/he was left alone an orphan.

On what the infants did to deserve death: answer is nothing! GOD gives and takes. Moreover, evil come to just people for no just cause too.

I believe WLC was clear enough in his explanation, if you disagree kindly tell me why

let me ask you a question

if I kill an infant, do they get saved?

Mind you, I'm not asking if what I did is wrong/right

felixomor:
Quiet, dont be in a hurry.

Now, if u make a robot to follow your instructions and then it starts to follow other instructions, what will u do to the robot?

Asides that, do you know many of the people that were killed by God in the OT were using their kids as human rituals to baal?

Are u aware?
Is that how God designed man to function?
Besides, u just said sentencing a murder criminal is not murder.
So what is your problem?

Aaaaaactually, speaking from a pure computer/robotics perspective, if you programmed a robot and it starts following other instructions, it could mean two things: there was an unforseen side-effect from the code you wrote that you overlooked while programming the robot OR there is some external or alternate body tampering with the source code. Neither outcome lets you off the hook though. In the case of the first outcome, it shows you were not careful enough to make sure that the robot acts as programmed. In the case of the second outcome it tells that you did not do enough to protect the program the robot runs on from external influence - like making sure there are no backdoors or loopholes and possibly installing anti-malware.

If a robot you programmed is not acting the way you expected, the choice is on you to reprogram the robot or destroy it. Neither would, however, mean the robot is at fault for it's malfunction.

hopefulLandlord:
I believe WLC was clear enough in his explanation, if you disagree kindly tell me why

let me ask you a question

if I kill an infant, do they get saved?

Mind you, I'm not asking if what I did is wrong/right

Yes, they get saved.

DoctorAlien:
Yes, they get saved.

so did Herod and Yates not unwittingly save the infants by killing them?

take note of the word "unwittingly"

hopefulLandlord:
so did Herod and Yates not unwittingly save the infants by killing them?

No. They did not save the infants. They only deprived them of life on this earth which was meant to be enjoyed in a holy way, and after which an unending life would be enjoyed with GOD. The infants now sleep in their graves, awaiting resurrection to life, because they have no sin in them.