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Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by ikupakuti(m): 10:18am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: What albaqir failed or refused to grasp here is that abnormality or deformity in nature @ birth is an entirely different issue from the act of sodomy. Once he agrees that there is no excuse under the shari‘a for a man to penetrate a man/woman through the anus then this issue would be solved. #Whatever therapy (out of necessity) you want to seek for those whose nature are epicene in either sexes must incline towards the type of sex organ they came with or that which is paramount in the case of those hermaphroditic. There is no harm to seek hormonal treatment for a man with a male sex organ who feels less manly in order to feel more manly. In sofar whatever is responsible for your confused mentality didnt deem it fit to provide you, as a man, with a v-jay, then your fate is already sealed with the sex organ you came with. 4 Likes |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 10:28am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti:I don't tell am now. Me and him don discussed this on another platform. I cited examples too. This aint gay thing. Homosexual is something they invented for themselves and voluntarily engage in. Fortunately though, albaqir recognized homosexual, gay, sodomy and whatever it is called to be haram. That's seals it. 1 Like |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by ikupakuti(m): 10:46am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: but Albaqir is pushing for therapeutic measures for convicted homos & abolition of the capital punishment. He said he used to believe in stoning/beheading but not anymore & thats whats putting him @ loggerheads with people here. Ask him or go through his posts. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 11:01am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti: # You guys are the ones mixing things up or perhaps my statements are not clear enough. But I believe it is crystal clear. Here's it once again: AlBaqir: # In fact at the beginning of this chain of dialogue, I made it clear that I am more concern about those with "these genetic disorder" (here I meant effeminates) because it is never their wish they get attracted to "same sex", not those that develop being "gay" by whatever means. 1 Like |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 11:08am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti: # First did I ever and ever say the act of homosexuality is okay? Did I? # Second, I wonder how you come back to the bold because you have never centre any of your comment there. All what you've been commenting on is the sex.ual act of homosexuality. # Is it Allah that made those effeminates or Hermaphrodites like that? Please don't let us go there. That's gonna be another hell of a debate and probably chain of misunderstanding. 1 Like |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 11:11am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree:You were simply a kid then. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 11:13am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Kaytixy:Mumu is giving advice. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 11:19am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti: # You are the one that need to reread my comments. As per what we labeled homos (I am not talking about their sexual acts), I grouped them thus: * Those with genetic disorder (if truly the scientific findings are true). Here Empiree insisted its all lies. Then, I challenge his evidence? Then I asked where were Muslim scientists to counter those findings. * Those that developed being "homo" via habits * Those that were initiated into it for rituals. I focused specifically on the first group and how they can get cure medically, psychologically and spiritually. # Yeah, I don't believe in stoning to death and beheading. Wherever you find it in the Qur'an, kindly bring it out. Today, countries like Jordan, Kuwait, Iran etc have modified their stoning to death law to imprisonment. In Kuwait, a woman who committed adultery was sentenced to prison instead of the traditional stoning (I can't remember how many years per se). This woman became repentant in prison after years she was in there. She memorised the whole of Qur'an, and through her many inmates became better Muslim. She was later set free. This is the rahma of God I know. Punishments are for the perverse individuals, criminals that are not ready to change. Quran/Islam made establishment of punishment difficult by applying conditions that are hard to meet. # Unfortunately, all you want is "kill, kill, kill". 1 Like |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 11:20am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti:This another question Muslims and Christians failed to answer. Why did God created the devil, Satan, demon, jin etc? Sometimes when I try to put all these together it just not making any f*cking sense. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 11:20am On Jul 16, 2017 |
ikupakuti:well, he needs to understand that homosexual is fasad and we know punishment for fasad in the Quran even though there is no direct punishment for gay. Someone doing gay thing in his or her privacy is one thing but legalizing it and issuing marriage certificate is another thing entirely. This is like overruling Allah's Law. This is making halal what Allah has made haram. This is kufr. A convicted gay in country where homosexual is outlawed is punishable offence regardless of whether the adults consented or not. It is up to authority to decide to rehab them or give them second chance or not. But to push for eradication of penalty just not gonna work. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by udatso: 11:25am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Demmzy15:lol . Be careful of what you wish for oooo. 4 Likes 4 Shares
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Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 11:31am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: # Its unfortunate you are not consistent. If you say, "he needs to understand that homosexual is fasad", obviously you are saying I am campaigning it is not. Please try to be consistent. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 11:32am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Read a report yesterday published in 2015 says there is no "homo gene". Another one came up this yr said there is homo gene and it complicated their findings and research by given irrational explainations to covington folks. I repeat that it is a scam and am attempt to make us believe that gay were born gay. I don't even want to give them excuses. If there are truly Pele born with such defect but have no sodom tendency, one of the solutions to their problem is to lock them up with opposite sex to call their brains to order Weer should be able to make clear difference from people born with the defect from those taking advantage of it. Those taking advantage are most common today. You heat them say " I have always have this feelings that I'm attracted to same sex for yrs but I'm afraid to say this in the open". |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 11:34am On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir:Well said at bolded. No Muslims against homos(anti-gays) here have provide evidence from Muslim scientists(am yet to see experiments done by Muslim scientists), even scientific evidence from their religious manuscripts. All what they are posting are from their imagination, bias, lack of empathy and barbarism that's written in their hadiths. They are more concern about the sexual act not concern on what makes them do the act. Empiree is yet to answer why there are homos in Saudi Arabia and among animals. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 11:37am On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir:that was a response to his claim that u prefer therapeutic measures for convicted gay. Maybe I should ask, in a country where homo sexual is outlawed, if a gay man or woman is cut by law, tried and convicted, what should punishment be? |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 11:45am On Jul 16, 2017 |
tintingz:I already told albaqir this on another platform and thank God, I see someone who shares same view. So clearly, most homos in Saudi are as a result of extreme separation from both sexes not gene. I don't believe in extreme separations of males and females.. there should be some levels of moderation. I also gave albaqir example of a friend''s friends in America whose parents were too strict. She was not allowed to see males and they are not even muslim. The lady becomes gay bcus of this. Nothing like gene
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Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 11:56am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Answering tintingz, with respect to gays in saudi. Writer says further. So clearly, they don't even talk about "homogene" bcus it doesn't seem to exist. Homosexual in Arabia is caused as a result of EXTREME SEPARATION. Got this? .
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Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 11:59am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree:Go and know what science and experiments means. Science update, evolve in research, in 2015-2016 the only psychiatrists going about that there is no gay gene is Dr. Paul R. McHugh a fanatic Christian crusader who is know to be anti-LGBT, he has been debunked by other scientists. Now we are seeing scientists coming out to have found the gay gene with experiments, if Muslims want to prove there is no gey gene, they should also conduct their experiments instead of killing and punishing innocent people in the name of whatever it is. Like Albaqir said, homos should be given cure, psychological therapy and surgery and in my own support they should be given rights, they are humans and they should be treated like humans. Arabs have the highest in genetic disorder breedingbin the world due to high practice of incest, consanguinity, is it justifiable for them to be wiped out from the surface of the earth? |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 12:01pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
tintingz:And what makes you think those scientists are not pro gay just as much as the Christian is accused of being anti LGBT? |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 12:02pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
tintingz: # That's another topic on its own. However, in my view, here's it: * God and His actions is all good completely. * Evil does not exist as an entity. What we term evil is the rejection of good which the entire universe centre on. For example, if you keep by the law of gravity, you continue to enjoy good. The moment you break that law (rejected it), you break yourself or die. * Quran says, "God do not wrong man, it is man who (used to) wrong himself". In another ayah, it is said, " corruption on the earth and sea is as a result of man's handiwork, and they shall taste from their handiwork ". Studies have shown that 75% of death are man's handiwork. Here we might ask about flood, tsunami, earthquake etc. While these are natural " disasters" as we termed it, man trigger it sometimes by trying to break the laws of nature. * Satan: You think if there is no Satan, man cannot commit sins or evil? Man is capable to commit whatever by his freewill. Satan is like man with intellect and freewill. He decided to go against his Lord. However, Satan can only invite to what is bad but cannot compel to do the act. # Trials and tests: these are not evil. They are designed to make us good better, outward and inward. # Like I said its surely another topic on its own. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 12:11pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: @Excellent. I agree with that, and its not only in Saudi o. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 12:15pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: # Islam don't apply law like you guys and ISIS et al are. That is "once caught, kill, stone, behead". There are conditions to it, one of which is " why did the criminal committed the crime". Unfortunately, you have an hadith which says "once you caught them, kill them". |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by sino(m): 12:18pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir:Nobody has passed fatwa on killing effeminates, and it seems we are all overlooking that we have lesbians too. Anyways, if you were not trying to smuggle homosexuals into the Qur'an, what then are you trying to interpret the verse in question to mean?! I asked you for clarification, but you didn't respond. You keep saying it is open to interpretation. And it is even good you had done some research, at least you can see what interpretation that was given and said to be what the salafs to understood the verse to mean. Secondly, homosexuality is already established as a sin in the Qur'an, and was the reason for the destruction of the people of Lut (as). Considering this singular issue, makes the verse in question to be sealed! And for the avoidance of doubt, Allah (SWT) states in the Qur'an: And [We had sent] Lot when he said to his people, "Do you commit such immorality as no one has preceded you with from among the worlds? Indeed, you approach men with desire, instead of women. Rather, you are a transgressing people." (Q 7:80-81) Again: "Do you approach males among the worlds. And leave what your Lord has created for you as mates? But you are a people transgressing."( Q 26:165-166) Also: "Do you indeed approach men with desire instead of women? Rather, you are a people behaving ignorantly." (Q 27: 55) These verses above makes it crystal clear that it is impossible for the verse in question be interpreted to anything relating to men desiring only men sexually! This thread is about Muslim gay getting married, a clearly sinful and punishable act which is being celebrated, and you are here going back and forth, looking for open interpretation and all what not. Thirdly, with regards fatwas, there is another thread were the adverse effect of such fatwa as passed by Khomeini was revealed, you should go watch the videos on the thread. Lastly, homosexual and wanting a sex change are two different things entirely, gays are men who want to have sex with men with their genitals and anus, which is haram! 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by ikupakuti(m): 12:20pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir: Check my very second post on this thread. # Is it Allah that made those effeminates or Hermaphrodites like that? Please don't let us go there. That's gonna be another hell of a debate and probably chain of misunderstanding. who did ? Me ? Q3:6 Q82:7-8 Q42:49-50 |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Empiree: 12:22pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir:You make it sound like this. In western world, dont they have law in place where it says something like "anyone caught with mortgage fraud would face wrath of law". Does that mean they dont go through due process? |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Demmzy15(m): 12:28pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 12:29pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
sino: # All those salafs interpretations are their own understanding. None of them quoted Nabi. And they did that based on what they know and what they see. That's why they themselves do not have a uniform interpretations. Unfortunately, none of them made mention of effeminates (male) which I made mention of. You don't see them attracted to women. These people have tendency of becoming gay. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by AlBaqir(m): 12:31pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: # That's western law not God's. Allah give conditions to His before implementation of punishment. Don't overlook that. |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by Demmzy15(m): 12:35pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree:If that's the case, all Saudi men should be gays then! |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by ikupakuti(m): 12:40pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
AlBaqir: The OP was about gay wedding right ? Like I stated from the very first page of this thread, no one cares about what you are attracted to! #The OP isnt about what or not you are attracted to but sodomy & thats what everybody has being condemning! #Nobody is condemning the effeminates here, sofar your effeminacy is not going to make you submitting your anus for another man to drill, nobody cares! #Men get attracted to women but still, GOD said LEAVE HER ANUS ALONE!!! #Can you show me a post here advocating punishment for the effeminates?! #So far you come with a phallus whether it is working or not is your buisness. You are not a woman. Period! |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by ikupakuti(m): 12:48pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree: Yeah! Extreme segregation is one of the major factor. There is an hadith (I‘ll find it) where the holy prophet (saw) related the story of a certain people to that effect. Thats why its so rampant in boarding schools, prisons etc. 1 Like |
Re: First Ever Muslim Gay Wedding In Uk Holds by tintingz(m): 12:53pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
Empiree:Lol, yes it might be caused by extreme separation of males and females but there is no evidence according science because the brain e.g the male should still have signal attraction to female so hereby making them drop the gay act and go for female since early marriage is well practiced in Saudi. There are straight people that indulge in gay act in prison, that doesn't mean they are gays, give them a lady and see how they will *******. Secondly, Saudi does not condone it and the punishment is death, there are a lot of gays killed in Saudi, so since if is an habit developed why can't they help them psychologically instead of killing them? Why can't they find girls for them to marry? Even here in Nigeria where there are only boys/girls schools they practice homosexuality, but many of them drop the act the moment they graduate since Africa 95% Africa parents don't condone homos while few still indulge in it, the few that indulge in it should be having gender dysphoria making them bisexuals, homos. Well, I'm not excluding that environment, social, up bringings does not make people gay(it is part of the factors) but it does not have scientific evidence yet, sexual behavior is different from sexual orientation. |
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