₦airaland Forum

lexy2014:
Am not saying Nigerians should stop paying tax cos of corruption. I was only responding 2 ur assertion that what is in govt coffers isn't enough 4 govt 2 provide social services. D problem has never been whether Nigerians pay tax or not. its about what has been done with d tax. Nigerians are some of d most taxed population in d world yet we are grossly shortchanged by those in govt. Where u live its easy 2 associate tax with development but not in this part of d world.

Actually we pay far less in tax in Nigeria. I pay 30% in tax here.

olaboy1:
Actually we pay far less in tax in Nigeria. I pay 30% in tax here.

do u use gen?do u buy fuel 4 gen?do u sink ur own borehole? Do u pay security dues on ur street?do u have agberos collecting monies from market women and taxi drivers were u live without good roads?do u no how many times a day an okada man or keke operator has to settle b4 he can work? pls don't compare Nigeria with were u are.

HomeOfMe:
The first picture looks Photoshoped. It looks like 90s photo,but the cars there àre like cars of the 60s and 70s.

True, here is a picture of Tinubu square in 1960

matrixme:
so sad. almost all those men strolling in the first picture must have been dead by now. Especially the one nearest to the car

You are very wrong, that man nearest to the car is still alive and kicking well, I saw him in Yaba just some few hours ago on my way to Akoka, I was so surprised to believe he is still on earth, but I have to accept the reality because the Biblical Jesus Christ said that "some men who witnessed his time on earth will still be around when he returns."

lexy2014:
do u use gen?do u buy fuel 4 gen?do u sink ur own borehole? Do u pay security dues on ur street?do u have agberos collecting monies from market women and taxi drivers were u live without good roads?do u no how many times a day an okada man or keke operator has to settle b4 he can work? pls don't compare Nigeria with were u are.

We are saying the same thing. Are you prepared to pay 30% in tax from your salary every month and enjoy all what you just listed?

olaboy1:
We are saying the same thing. Are you prepared to pay 30% in tax from your salary every month and enjoy all what you just listed?

its not d amount of yam u give 2a goat that determines how much yam porridge u will eat.even if Nigerians are paying 100% tax, it will never b like where u are cos tax money is stolen. That's where u dont get it. Development isn't just about money. Its a mindset which our leaders don't have. Is it because nigerians arent paying 30% that our refineries arent working?some time ago, $16b was pumped into NEPA with nothing to show 4 it. Give a quarter of that 2 china, they will b exporting light. How much taxes do people pay in d UAE and Qatar. How did they put themselves on d world map?was it tax money?do u have snake in d monkey shadow were u live?do snakes and monkeys eat money were u are?do u have politicians in d country u live living palatially and ostentatiously and turning millionaires over night after getting into office?u just think everything is about money. Nigeria has never had a money problem. We have always had a management problem

matrixme:
so sad. almost all those men strolling in the first picture must have been dead by now. Especially the one nearest to the car

Same thing Will be said about us in many years to come when our great great grandkids come on this platform to read comment

lexy2014:
its not d amount of yam u give 2a goat that determines how much yam porridge u will eat.even if Nigerians are paying 100% tax, it will never b like where u are cos tax money is stolen. That's where u dont get it. Development isn't just about money. Its a mindset which our leaders don't have. Is it because nigerians arent paying 30% that our refineries arent working?some time ago, $16b was pumped into NEPA with nothing to show 4 it. Give a quarter of that 2 china, they will b exporting light. How much taxes do people pay in d UAE and Qatar. How did they put themselves on d world map?was it tax money?do u have snake in d monkey shadow were u live?do snakes and monkeys eat money were u are?do u have politicians in d country u live living palatially and ostentatiously and turning millionaires over night after getting into office?u just think everything is about money. Nigeria has never had a money problem. We have always had a management problem

Thank you for this your great respond to the guy, let agreed with him that Nigerians are not paying enough tax I would be happy if he can tell us what they have done with the one collected so far?

abbeyty:
Thank you for this your great respond to the guy, let agreed with him that Nigerians are not paying enough tax I would be happy if he can tell us what they have done with the one collected so far?

tnx boss. I appreciate

olaboy1:
We are saying the same thing. Are you prepared to pay 30% in tax from your salary every month and enjoy all what you just listed?

what happened 2d aluminium smelting company of Nigeria (ALSCON) and d national fertilizer company of Nigeria (NAFCON) both in port Harcourt that was built with taxpayers money?what happened 2 d national theatre and national stadiums in Lagos and abuja that are wasting away?what happened to delta steel company ovwian-aladja and ajaokuta steel company that are dead?is it because Nigerians aren't paying enough tax?

lexy2014:
what happened 2d aluminium smelting company of Nigeria (ALSCON) and d national fertilizer company of Nigeria (NAFCON) both in port Harcourt that was built with taxpayers money?what happened 2 d national theatre and national stadiums in Lagos and abuja that are wasting away?what happened to delta steel company ovwian-aladja and ajaokuta steel company that are dead?is it because Nigerians aren't paying enough tax?

Exactly. Now with all the listed companies you can see for yourself it cost money to maintain but not much to build.

The question is are you willing to pay 30% in tax and get the whole system revitalize.

Here in Europe many countries make more money than our crude oil in automobile e.g Benz, Volvo, Peugeot, in selling of war weapons, all home applieances like Electrolux washing machines and dish washers, furniture like IKEA and many many many others and yet some people still have to pay as high as 50% in tax.

Every good thing comes at a cost.

are you kidding or what??

Ayatullah:
You are very wrong, that man nearest to the car is still alive and kicking well, I saw him in Yaba just some few hours ago on my way to Akoka, I was so surprised to believe he is still on earth, but I have to accept the reality because the Biblical Jesus Christ said that "some men who witnessed his time on earth will still be around when he returns."

olaboy1:
Exactly. Now with all the listed companies you can see for yourself it cost money to maintain but not much to build.

The question is are you willing to pay 30% in tax and get the whole system revitalize.

Here in Europe many countries make more money than our crude oil in automobile e.g Benz, Volvo, Peugeot, in selling of war weapons, all home applieances like Electrolux washing machines and dish washers, furniture like IKEA and many many many others and yet some people still have to pay as high as 50% in tax.

Every good thing comes at a cost.

where in d world have u seen governments using taxes 2 maintain companies?where have u seen that it cost more 2 maintain than to build? So it will cost u more 2 maintain a 3 bedroom flat than 2 build it?were did u get ur own economic theory? D companies u mentioned is it with taxes that they make profits or by having good management?

lexy2014:
where in d world have u seen governments using taxes 2 maintain companies?where have u seen that it cost more 2 maintain than to build? So it will cost u more 2 maintain a 3 bedroom flat than 2 build it?were did u get ur own economic theory? D companies u mentioned is it with taxes that they make profits or by having good management?

Maintenance is the running cost of an establishment. It’s expensive to pay qualified doctors/nurses, drugs and service hospital equipment , and using a 3 bedroom apartment as a case study is too shallow. Maintenance is not just about changing the light bulbs in a decent hospital.

We are not talking about private companies here in case you mixed up the argument and yes I’ve seen government bailing out private companies with tax payers money to avoid recession and loss of jobs.

I listed those companies because the government gets very high revenue from them and we still pay 30% tax just like Nigerian government gets almost all his revenue from crude oil. Do you still need more clarification or we good?

.

olaboy1:
Maintenance is the running cost of an establishment. It’s expensive to pay qualified doctors/nurses, drugs and service hospital equipment , and using a 3 bedroom apartment as a case study is too shallow. Maintenance is not just about changing the light bulbs in a decent hospital.

We are not talking about private companies here in case you mixed up the argument and yes I’ve seen government bailing out private companies with tax payers money to avoid recession and loss of jobs.

I listed those companies because the government gets very high revenue from them and we still pay 30% tax just like Nigerian government gets almost all his revenue from crude oil. Do you still need more clarification or we good?

when u use d word maintenance, u talking about a recurrent activity. Handing out bail outs isnt a recurrent activity. Its occasional and done only in extreme circumstances.I don't need clarification from u cos u are far away thinking that money and not management is d solution 2 nigeria's problems. D likes of DSC aladja, ALSCON that I mentioned were all built with oil money and were run aground by incompetence and mismanagement not because of lack of funds 4 "maintenance". U think a successful hospital is all about paying doctors & nurses?sorry dude. Its about proper management. My analogy with a 3 bedroom is apt if u understand what an asset is and what an investor expects it 2do 4 him. According 2 ur last comment, source of revenue 4 European countries is tax cos they don't have natural resources same way our source of revenue 4 Nigeria is oil. So if they live by tax and we live by oil, y do u now think d way to development here is by imposing d same tax regime used by those who don't have natural resources? U c were u refuse 2 understand that every country has its peculiar needs hence d Europeans use tax 2 meet theirs. We use revenue from oil. D difference is that European leaders have a mindset 2 use public office to serve. Our leaders use theirs to enrich themselves hence u think tax is d solution. Its unfortunate that u associate tax to development and not how d tax or oil revenue is being managed. Tax doesn't manage itself. Its people that manage taxes that's y u can c its benefits

lexy2014:
when u use d word maintenance, u talking about a recurrent activity. Handing out bail outs isnt a recurrent activity. Its occasional and done only in extreme circumstances.I don't need clarification from u cos u are far away thinking that money and not management is d solution 2 nigeria's problems. D likes of DSC aladja, ALSCON that I mentioned were all built with oil money and were run aground by incompetence and mismanagement not because of lack of funds 4 "maintenance". U think a successful hospital is all about paying doctors & nurses?sorry dude. Its about proper management. My analogy with a 3 bedroom is apt if u understand what an asset is and what an investor expects it 2do 4 him. According 2 ur last comment, source of revenue 4 European countries is tax cos they don't have natural resources same way our source of revenue 4 Nigeria is oil. So if they live by tax and we live by oil, y do u now think d way to development here is by imposing d same tax regime used by those who don't have natural resources? U c were u refuse 2 understand that every country has its peculiar needs hence d Europeans use tax 2 meet theirs. We use revenue from oil. D difference is that European leaders have a mindset 2 use public office to serve. Our leaders use theirs to enrich themselves hence u think tax is d solution. Its unfortunate that u associate tax to development and not how d tax or oil revenue is being managed. Tax doesn't manage itself. Its people that manage taxes that's y u can c its benefits

Germany does not export crude oil and they make more money than Nigeria through other derivatives apart from tax. Just like we have oil revenue they too have revenues from car manufacturing, biotechnology, house hold equipment, farming equipment production etc.

Our national budget is a meager amount to meet our needs. Either we tax ourselves more and build industries that can produce all we need locally so we don’t spend a large chunk of our national budget buying expensive equipment in dollars.

To fight corruption we need billions of dollars to automate the system. How much do you think Microsoft will charge us to integrate all our sectors. Oil is not enough and with Nigeria sitting on just 3.1% of OPEC world oil reserves, it’s not a particular bright future for Nigeria on total reliance on oil.

Remember we have the Niger Delta militants that could half our 2.3m bpd with just one uprising. We need to think outside of the box and no I’m not advocating for a higher tax margin for the common man. Those who earn 1m monthly should pay around 30% tax and those who earn lower could pay 25%, 20%, 15%, 10%, 5%.

We elected some of our corrupt leaders, maybe next time we should look well before we leap.

olaboy1:
Germany does not export crude oil and they make more money than Nigeria through other derivatives apart from tax. Just like we have oil revenue they too have revenues from car manufacturing, biotechnology, house hold equipment, farming equipment production etc.

Our national budget is a meager amount to meet our needs. Either we tax ourselves more and build industries that can produce all we need locally so we don’t spend a large chunk of our national budget buying expensive equipment in dollars.

To fight corruption we need billions of dollars to automate the system. How much do you think Microsoft will charge us to integrate all our sectors. Oil is not enough and with Nigeria sitting on just 3.1% of OPEC world oil reserves, it’s not a particular bright future for Nigeria on total reliance on oil.

Remember we have the Niger Delta militants that could half our 2.3m bpd with just one uprising. We need to think outside of the box and no I’m not advocating for a higher tax margin for the common man. Those who earn 1m monthly should pay around 30% tax and those who earn lower could pay 25%, 20%, 15%, 10%, 5%.

We elected some of our corrupt leaders, maybe next time we should look well before we leap.

there's nothing wrong with Nigeria's budget. Its not meager. its still boils down 2 proper management and not more money. U still don't get it. Nigeria doesn't have a money problem but a management problem. U sound as if taxing is a magic formula. d countries in Europe u make reference to didn't succeed cos they collect high taxes, they succeeded cos they have better management mentality. That's what makes money. That's y they can reap from industrialisation and we failed with d likes of DSC and co. Tax all u want in Nigeria without proper management, it will only end up at ground zero. Y do we have ND militants in d first place? So if u tax with d same skewed mentality that produced Niger delta militants, what kind of militants will u produce without proper management of taxes? is it automation that fights corruption? who will manage d system? Is it not human beings?u are very funny. D story of japam, germany,qatar and UAE is a story of leadership, vision and good management. Not tax or oil. Its not d resource u have that is d issue. Its what u do with it and that's what u failed to understand. Its management 101

lexy2014:
there's nothing wrong with Nigeria's budget. Its not meager. its still boils down 2 proper management and not more money. U still don't get it. Nigeria doesn't have a money problem but a management problem. U sound as if taxing is a magic formula. d countries in Europe u make reference to didn't succeed cos they collect high taxes, they succeeded cos they have better management mentality. That's what makes money. That's y they can reap from industrialisation and we failed with d likes of DSC and co. Tax all u want in Nigeria without proper management, it will only end up at ground zero. Y do we have ND militants in d first place? So if u tax with d same skewed mentality that produced Niger delta militants, what kind of militants will u produce without proper management of taxes? is it automation that fights corruption? who will manage d system? Is it not human beings?u are very funny. D story of japam, germany,qatar and UAE is a story of leadership, vision and good management. Not tax or oil. Its not d resource u have that is d issue. Its what u do with it and that's what u failed to understand. Its management 101

Management or no management, give those western countries our budget to work with and they will all be in penury. Check those countries budget and divide it by the exchange rate of Naira and prepare a table of budget and population and you would quickly realize we need around 10-20 times more of the budget we have today.

It doesn’t matter how much managerial skills you have, if your resources are so limited then you can’t do much.

olaboy1:
Management or no management, give those western countries our budget to work with and they will all be in penury. Check those countries budget and divide it by the exchange rate of Naira and prepare a table of budget and population and you would quickly realize we need around 10-20 times more of the budget we have today.

It doesn’t matter how much managerial skills you have, if your resources are so limited then you can’t do much.

didn't u do economics in secondary school? ur basic economics teaches u that wants exceed d resources 2 meet them. D greatest resource available 2 anyone in d world is time, 24hours per day. But is it enough. There's no country in d world that has enough resources 2 meet its needs. that's where management comes in. western countries invested. Nigeria didnt. Thats y we all want 2go 2 dubai cos they are investing. u left nigeria to europe cause they invested. Its d investment they made in time past that u went 2 europe to enjoy.when Gowon was head of state, he once said Nigeria has so much money that we don't no what to spend it on. No matter how much wealth u have if not properly managed u will end up in penury. am surprised u say u are a business man yet u don't believe in management principles

lexy2014:
didn't u do economics in secondary school? ur basic economics teaches u that wants exceed d resources 2 meet them. D greatest resource available 2 anyone in d world is time, 24hours per day. But is it enough. There's no country in d world that has enough resources 2 meet its needs. that's where management comes in. western countries invested. Nigeria didnt. Thats y we all want 2go 2 dubai cos they are investing. u left nigeria to europe cause they invested. Its d investment they made in time past that u went 2 europe to enjoy.when Gowon was head of state, he once said Nigeria has so much money that we don't no what to spend it on. No matter how much wealth u have if not properly managed u will end up in penury. am surprised u say u are a business man yet u don't believe in management principles

I am not going to argue with you base on sentiment. Germany is having 36b euros excess budget, they are not borrowing or relying on foreign aids. That excess budget is coming from external and internal generated revenue with tax bracket between 20-50%, why have they not reduced taxation with the excess budget.

You need to look at this from a wider perspective, the rich people who travel to Dubai and fly private jet around the world are doing so because they are paying meager tax, tax them properly and use the money to develop our country and their trips abroad will reduce.
With taxation we can create more middle class and not some overfed billionaires who are thriving because of little or no taxation.
When I worked in Nigeria I had more disposable income that I was able to do 2 UK vacations in a year, if I paid 30% I would do maybe 1 and other poor citizens could have free healthcare.
Nigeria needs to borrow every year to meet up our poor budget, have you asked yourself why. If your Gowon argument holds true then we don’t need to borrow a kobo. Go back and take a good look at our budget breakdown and see how much was budgeted for education, so in hindsight you don’t need to talk about management.
World bank says we feed on $2 per day, while here in Europe we feed on $10-$20per day, I bet you can use this simple information to agree to my previous comment that we need 10-20 times more money than we have today.

olaboy1:
I am not going to argue with you base on sentiment. Germany is having 36b euros excess budget, they are not borrowing or relying on foreign aids. That excess budget is coming from external and internal generated revenue with tax bracket between 20-50%, why have they not reduced taxation with the excess budget.

You need to look at this from a wider perspective, the rich people who travel to Dubai and fly private jet around the world are doing so because they are paying meager tax, tax them properly and use the money to develop our country and their trips abroad will reduce.
With taxation we can create more middle class and not some overfed billionaires who are thriving because of little or no taxation.
When I worked in Nigeria I had more disposable income that I was able to do 2 UK vacations in a year, if I paid 30% I would do maybe 1 and other poor citizens could have free healthcare.
Nigeria needs to borrow every year to meet up our poor budget, have you asked yourself why. If your Gowon argument holds true then we don’t need to borrow a kobo. Go back and take a good look at our budget breakdown and see how much was budgeted for education, so in hindsight you don’t need to talk about management.
World bank says we feed on $2 per day, while here in Europe we feed on $10-$20per day, I bet you can use this simple information to agree to my previous comment that we need 10-20 times more money than we have today.

u are very funny. when a country achieves a surplus budget, it means its income exceeded its expenses. this is usually determined after a financial year. According to www.investopedia.com, "a surplus is an indication that the government is being effectively MANAGED". Pls take note of d word " manage". A surplus doesn't mean a govt has all d money it needs to solve its problems. It just means, it was able to meet its financial obligations 4a financial year and has some change to spare which it will still use to offset other financial obligations not captured in d budget. Dude, u say u don't want to argue sentimentally but u are arguing sentimentally.ur argument that we don't need management, just taxes, defies every known economic, management and common sense logic on planet earth.
D reason I talked about Dubai is because it is a destination of choice. D question is y? Y does it attract so many people every year? Is it because of taxes or good leadership/astute management?
When Gowon made d statement I said he made, Nigeria was having surplus budget. Nigeria had so much that it was assisting other countries in paying salaries instead of investing in its people and their future. That's d difference with Germany. Its leaders went about investing its revenue that's y d world bank can talk about $10-20 per day 4 Germany. Taxes or revenue are of no value in themselves except someone uses them 2 create value. Again, ur basic economics teaches about capital(input)being a factor of production. Taxes/revenue in d hands of d mangers of d German economy is capital. Pls try ur hands on a few economics and management texts to help broaden ur horizon

lexy2014:
u are very funny. when a country achieves a surplus budget, it means its income exceeded its expenses. this is usually determined after a financial year. According to www.investopedia.com, "a surplus is an indication that the government is being effectively MANAGED". Pls take note of d word " manage". A surplus doesn't mean a govt has all d money it needs to solve its problems. It just means, it was able to meet its financial obligations 4a financial year and has some change to spare which it will still use to offset other financial obligations not captured in d budget. Dude, u say u don't want to argue sentimentally but u are arguing sentimentally.ur argument that we don't need management, just taxes, defies every known economic, management and common sense logic on planet earth.
D reason I talked about Dubai is because it is a destination of choice. D question is y? Y does it attract so many people every year? Is it because of taxes or good leadership/astute management?
When Gowon made d statement I said he made, Nigeria was having surplus budget. Nigeria had so much that it was assisting other countries in paying salaries instead of investing in its people and their future. That's d difference with Germany. Its leaders went about investing its revenue that's y d world bank can talk about $10-20 per day 4 Germany. Taxes or revenue are of no value in themselves except someone uses them 2 create value. Again, ur basic economics teaches about capital(input)being a factor of production. Taxes/revenue in d hands of d mangers of d German economy is capital. Pls try ur hands on a few economics and management texts to help broaden ur horizon

Read this article and you would understand all developed countries thrive on taxation. See how many times tax comes up in the article.
I have not anytime dispute the importance of good management.

Pay attention to this quote “Germany—currently running a budget surplus—has no plans to cut taxes, according to Chancellor Angela Merkel’s government. And Singapore—running a surplus this year and looking at a roughly balanced budget next year—is proposing a significant tax increase“.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2018/02/22/what-singapore-and-germany-can-teach-the-us-about-fiscal-policy/#5552b60a65df

olaboy1:
Read this article and you would understand all developed countries thrive on taxation. See how many times tax comes up in the article.
I have not anytime dispute the importance of good management.

Pay attention to this quote “Germany—currently running a budget surplus—has no plans to cut taxes, according to Chancellor Angela Merkel’s government. And Singapore—running a surplus this year and looking at a roughly balanced budget next year—is proposing a significant tax increase“.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2018/02/22/what-singapore-and-germany-can-teach-the-us-about-fiscal-policy/#5552b60a65df

first of all, what is a budget? A budget is a PLAN, a PROJECTION, an ESTIMATE of how an individual, an organization or a government intends 2 meet its financial obligations in terms of expenditure and income usually 4a financial year. In other cases, its also called a guideline. So that means, its not concrete until d end of d financial year. So its at d end of d year d individual, govt or organization will now determine if its plan worked. When d budget is released marking d beginning of d financial year, that's when works starts in raising income to settle d things that are meant to b settled in d budget. In d end, they will ask themselves did we achieve what we set out to achieve?

lexy2014:
first of all, what is a budget? A budget is a PLAN, a PROJECTION, an ESTIMATE of how an individual, an organization or a government intends 2 meet its financial obligations in terms of expenditure and income usually 4a financial year. In other cases, its also called a guideline. So that means, its not concrete until d end of d financial year. So its at d end of d year d individual, govt or organization will now determine if its plan worked. When d budget is released marking d beginning of d financial year, that's when works starts in raising income to settle d things that are meant to b settled in d budget. In d end, they will ask themselves did we achieve what we set out to achieve?

My point is they are making more revenues than Nigeria and still plan to increase taxes.

olaboy1:
My point is they are making more revenues than Nigeria and still plan to increase taxes.

I didn't tell u that they aren't making more revenue than Nigeria. D question is what are they doing with their revenue? How are they managing it?d answer to that question is d difference between Germany and Nigeria, between prosperity and poverty