Lukuluku69:


Nope. I only offered a possible explanation of the drop of mingled sperm based on what Science say.

Could this be you trying to reinterprete that clear text to coincide with what science of today says.

Assuming science today says sperms comes from the backbone you wouldn't have seen any need to proffer a different interpretation as you have just done.

I think that's kind of intellectual dishonesty

RuthlessLeader:

Considering the fact that religions are stil going strong after all our advances as a species, I don't see how the discovery of a bacterium on enceladus will affect religion in any profound way. I think that for us to say religion will be affected meaningfully, the doctrines of the next generation will be almost unrecognizable to the immediate past one

Doesn't such discovery give insights on abiotic origins which in fact is directly contradictory to religious stance on life creation?

Doesn't such new proven information solidify arguments against the necessity of God for man's beginning thus ending such argument?

I agree with you but only if it is a civilization level alien or caveman level.


There are almost 40,000 christian denominations and doctrines. There are likely to be many answers to these simple questions rather than accepting christianity/religion is bullshit.

Discovery of life outside earth is a scenario Christian theology is not equipped to explain.

So the whole concept falls apart.

They could have a secular ideology that is an evolution of religion and if they are outright atheists/agnostics they may as well choose to deal only with scientists/secularists and use them(us) to govern earth or something

And the implication of Alien contact with common folks would be?

johnydon22:


Could this be you trying to reinterprete that clear text to coincide with what science of today says.

Assuming science today says sperms comes from the backbone you wouldn't have seen any need to proffer a different interpretation as you have just done.

I think that's kind of intellectual dishonesty

Which one comes first? The Quranic Verse or what Science says? The Quran says the Sperm drop is a Mingled emission/fluid, Science says it is. I am not reinterpreting anything. If you put any poser to me that I can answer based on what I have read, I will gladly say so. I am not here to win any argument (if we can call this one). I am here to broaden my horizon. Yes, I am a Muslim. I gat no apology for that. Like I said earlier, I am not responsible for you neither are you for me. Each laden soul bear it burden. And at the bolded, I will appreciate if you stop saying that. I am not in any way dishonest intellectually. I told you, I am no Scholar of Arabic, but I know a bit of English. And if like you pointed out that if Science today says things contrary to what the Quran says, then Science has to prove it. Between, the Quran is not a Science book. It only call the attention of people with understand to these phenomenon for them to ponder and accept it message.

johnydon22:
Doesn't such discovery give insights on abiotic origins which in fact is directly contradictory to religious stance on life creation?

Yeah I guess so. But Apologetics would use some insane leap of logic and christians wouldn't have to think too hard. But I could be wrong.

Doesn't such new proven information solidify arguments against the necessity of God for man's beginning thus ending such argument?

Yes it is. But it will be just like how even though evolution is a fact, people still argue it.

Discovery of life outside earth is a scenario Christian theology is not equipped to explain.

So the whole concept falls apart.[/qoute]
Actually not. You can actually go online and see how they have apologetics for it and this lukuluku69 is here bringing up rubbish explanations for the quran doesn't say semen is produced inbetween ribs and backbone while gleefully ignoring the verse about the sun setting in mud.



[quote]And the implication of Alien contact with common folks would be?

I can't really say. But it the depends on the level.

Lukuluku69:


Which one comes first? The Quranic Verse or what Science says? The Quran says the Sperm drop is a Mingled emission/fluid, Science says it is. I am not reinterpreting anything. If you put any poser to me that I can answer based on what I have read, I will gladly say so. I am not here to win any argument (if we can call this one). I am here to broaden my horizon. Yes, I am a Muslim. I gat no apology for that. Like I said earlier, I am not responsible for you neither are you for me. Each laden soul bear it burden. And at the bolded, I will appreciate if you stop saying that. I am not in any way dishonest intellectually. I told you, I am no Scholar of Arabic, but I know a bit of English. And if like you pointed out that if Science today says things contrary to what the Quran says, then Science has to prove it. Between, the Quran is not a Science book. It only call the attention of people with understand to these phenomenon for them to ponder and accept it message.

Ogbeni we know thanks to science that semen comes from the testicles and not the freaking backbone so the quran is wrong so stop shifting the goalposts.

You still haven't brought forth any explanation on why the quran claimed alexander the great saw where the sun set on earth. Not only is that a scientific inaccuracy, it is also historically inaccurate. Alexander was a whole prince so he like other educated greeks of the time knew the earth was round unlike the quran which says it is flat. They also knew the sun didn't set on earth.

But admit it; If the quran was scientifically accurate you wouldn't need to form any half-baked explanations for the nonsense there.

RuthlessLeader:

Ogbeni we know thanks to science that semen comes from the testicles and not the freaking backbone so the quran is wrong so stop shifting the goalposts.

You still haven't brought forth any explanation on why the quran claimed alexander the great saw where the sun set on earth. Not only is that a scientific inaccuracy, it is also historically inaccurate. Alexander was a whole prince so he like other educated greeks of the time knew the earth was round unlike the quran which says it is flat. They also knew the sun didn't set on earth.

But admit it; If the quran was scientifically accurate you wouldn't need to form any half-baked explanations for the nonsense there.

It wasn't not Alexander the Great that that verse talked about. The highlighted was the opinion of Yusuf Ali. And the Quran never said the Earth was Flat! And lol, the Ancient Greeks never ventured beyond the Status of one idol of their ( can't remember the name now) why? So that they won't fall off at the other end. Read other commentators opinion on that Traveller. The Quran explicitly stated that the Earth we have made Egg shaped.

Obviously there are other INVISIBLE higher and much more intelligent living creatures in the space but their special interest and focus is the only planet having VISIBLE intelligent creatures "humans" which is our earth! (Proverbs 8:31) Today majority of these high beings are here with US for a reason revealed some 2000 years ago. (Revelations 12:7-9) And no doubt they can influence lesser creatures to do things unpredictably acting out of their own freewill and intellect.(Matthew 17:18,Act 16:16,2Corinthians 4:4 1John 5:19)Astronauts have tried to know if lives could be found on other planets and their works have been really commendable,but i think we need to search within our planet for clues to know better about outer space because from all indications there is a SUPREME BEING behind all of these and i also suspect HE will have some information to enlighten US about the solar system.(Genesis 1:1) Granted, misinformed arrogant and self acclaimed professors will be around to pass some deluded theories but i strongly believe we can still unravel the hidden secrets if we're honest and sincere in our research. (Proverbs 2:1-5) Adiós!

Lukuluku69:


It wasn't not Alexander the Great that that verse talked about. The highlighted was the opinion of Yusuf Ali. And the Quran never said the Earth was Flat! And lol, the Ancient Greeks never ventured beyond the Status of one idol of their ( can't remember the name now) why? So that they won't fall off at the other end. Read other commentators opinion on that Traveller. The Quran explicitly stated that the Earth we have made Egg shaped.

HOW THE ANCIENT GREEKS PROVED EARTH WAS ROUND OVER 2,000 YEARS AGO
An Ancient Greek mathematician calculated the Earth's circumference without ever leaving home

BUSINESS INSIDER
Thursday 28 December 2017 13:44

In the mid-20th century, we began launching satellites into space that would help us determine the exact circumference of the Earth: 40,030 km. But over 2000 years earlier, a man in Ancient Greece came up with nearly the exact same figure using just a stick and his brain. Following is a transcript of the video.

How an ancient Greek mathematician calculated the Earth's circumference. In the mid-20th century, we began launching satellites into space that would help us determine the exact circumference of the Earth, 40,030 km.

But over 2,000 years earlier in ancient Greece, a man arrived at nearly that exact same figure by putting a stick in the ground. That man was Eratosthenes. A Greek mathematician and the head of the library at Alexandria.

Eratosthenes had heard that in Syene, a city south of Alexandria, no vertical shadows were cast at noon on the summer solstice. The sun was directly overhead. He wondered if this were also true in Alexandria.

So, on June 21 he planted a stick directly in the ground and waited to see if a shadow would be cast at noon. It turns out there was one. And it measured about 7 degrees.

Now, if the sun's rays are coming in at the same angle at the same time of day, and a stick in Alexandria is casting a shadow while a stick in Syene is not, it must mean that the Earth's surface is curved. And Eratosthenes probably already knew that.

The idea of a spherical Earth was floated around by Pythagoras around 500 BC and validated by Aristotle a couple centuries later. If the Earth really was a sphere, Eratosthenes could use his observations to estimate the circumference of the entire planet.

Since the difference in shadow length is 7 degrees in Alexandria and Syene, that means the two cities are 7 degrees apart on Earth's 360-degrees surface. Eratosthenes hired a man to pace the distance between the two cities and learned they were 5,000 stadia apart, which is about 800 kilometres.

He could then use simple proportions to find the Earth's circumference — 7.2 degrees is 1/50 of 360 degrees, so 800 times 50 equals 40,000 kilometers. And just like that, a man 2200 years ago found the circumference of our entire planet with just a stick and his brain.

Lukuluku69:


It wasn't not Alexander the Great that that verse talked about. The highlighted was the opinion of Yusuf Ali. And the Quran never said the Earth was Flat! And lol, the Ancient Greeks never ventured beyond the Status of one idol of their ( can't remember the name now) why? So that they won't fall off at the other end. Read other commentators opinion on that Traveller. The Quran explicitly stated that the Earth we have made Egg shaped.

Oga my previous post has proven that either you don't do research before making a claim or you are lying for Allah. Let me even tell you what you will do now; you will focus on one small part of my post to make another foolish claim to defend your rubbish quran.

This link I will provide has a detailed list of every scientific error in the quran.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

Riofidelio:
Obviously there are other INVISIBLE higher and much more intelligent living creatures in the space but their special interest and focus is the only planet having VISIBLE intelligent creatures "humans" which is our earth! (Proverbs 8:31) Today majority of these high beings are here with US for a reason revealed some 2000 years ago. (Revelations 12:7-9) And no doubt they can influence lesser creatures to do things unpredictably acting out of their own freewill and intellect.(Matthew 17:18,Act 16:16,2Corinthians 4:4 1John 5:19)Astronauts have tried to know if lives could be found on other planets and their works have been really commendable,but i think we need to search within our planet for clues to know better about outer space because from all indications there is a SUPREME BEING behind all of these and i also suspect HE will have some information to enlighten US about the solar system.(Genesis 1:1) Granted, misinformed arrogant and self acclaimed professors will be around to pass some deluded theories but i strongly believe we can still unravel the hidden secrets if we're honest and sincere in our research. (Proverbs 2:1-5) Adiós!

How do you know the supreme being isn't Brahma or Ra, or could there even be a council of supreme beings like the greek gods. Afterall they are older than the bible and christianity and the civilizations that worshipped them were more advanced than the israelites.

Lukuluku69:


It wasn't not Alexander the Great that that verse talked about. The highlighted was the opinion of Yusuf Ali. And the Quran never said the Earth was Flat! And lol, the Ancient Greeks never ventured beyond the Status of one idol of their ( can't remember the name now) why? So that they won't fall off at the other end. Read other commentators opinion on that Traveller. The Quran explicitly stated that the Earth we have made Egg shaped.

Oga you are wrong. It was an ancient Greek, Erastosene that first figured out the earth was round.

I don't know where you get your own information from oo

johnydon22:


Oga you are wrong. It was an ancient Greek, Erastosene that first figured out the earth was round.

I don't know where you get your own information from oo

Oga you assume too much. In my post did I ever suggest that it was the Quran that pioneered the claimed that the Earth was round? So this Erastosene, when he made this discovery, did you read that the whole of Ancient Greek believed him and accept his findings? Have you not read about people in the Ancient not venturing far from their land for the Fear of falling off the Earth. I can understand if you believe nothing save those you can see, touch and feel. These Ancients Greeks are also students to the Hindus and Egyptians. What they learnt from the they only amplified.

RuthlessLeader:

How do you know the supreme being isn't Brahma or Ra, or could there even be a council of supreme beings like the greek gods. Afterall they are older than the bible and christianity and the civilizations that worshipped them were more advanced than the israelites.

Thanks so much for this question,i've always been expecting it for long. First of all you'll notice that i never condemned any race or tribe claiming to have a supreme being and secondly i'm from Africa so if i want to be sentimental then i'll rather be claiming the supremacy of the Gods of my ancestors. But i simply presented written documents which we're penned down by people i never knew just as everyone else here is presenting informations from those they never knew or met before! so that makes all of US equal.Therefore my suggestion is to look into all these informations coming from those we never met before in order to reason together with our brains and come to a meaningful and beneficial conclusion.None of US commenting on this thread ever met Buddha, Krishna, Hercules, Zeus, Jupiter, Brahma, Jehovah, Yahweh, Jesus, Muhammad, Alexander or even the Astronauts who traveled to the moon. All we have now is documented informations, that's why i'm suggesting we consider the accumulated informations in order to come to a reasonable conclusion for our benefits. If you must know, KNOWLEDGE has been defined as "the accumulation of useful informations" while WISDOM is "the practical applications of accumulated information for lasting benefits". I strongly believe that wisdom is what we really need now and not just some complicated and contradicting informations!

RuthlessLeader:

HOW THE ANCIENT GREEKS PROVED EARTH WAS ROUND OVER 2,000 YEARS AGO
An Ancient Greek mathematician calculated the Earth's circumference without ever leaving home

BUSINESS INSIDER
Thursday 28 December 2017 13:44

In the mid-20th century, we began launching satellites into space that would help us determine the exact circumference of the Earth: 40,030 km. But over 2000 years earlier, a man in Ancient Greece came up with nearly the exact same figure using just a stick and his brain. Following is a transcript of the video.

How an ancient Greek mathematician calculated the Earth's circumference. In the mid-20th century, we began launching satellites into space that would help us determine the exact circumference of the Earth, 40,030 km.

But over 2,000 years earlier in ancient Greece, a man arrived at nearly that exact same figure by putting a stick in the ground. That man was Eratosthenes. A Greek mathematician and the head of the library at Alexandria.

Eratosthenes had heard that in Syene, a city south of Alexandria, no vertical shadows were cast at noon on the summer solstice. The sun was directly overhead. He wondered if this were also true in Alexandria.

So, on June 21 he planted a stick directly in the ground and waited to see if a shadow would be cast at noon. It turns out there was one. And it measured about 7 degrees.

Now, if the sun's rays are coming in at the same angle at the same time of day, and a stick in Alexandria is casting a shadow while a stick in Syene is not, it must mean that the Earth's surface is curved. And Eratosthenes probably already knew that.

The idea of a spherical Earth was floated around by Pythagoras around 500 BC and validated by Aristotle a couple centuries later. If the Earth really was a sphere, Eratosthenes could use his observations to estimate the circumference of the entire planet.

Since the difference in shadow length is 7 degrees in Alexandria and Syene, that means the two cities are 7 degrees apart on Earth's 360-degrees surface. Eratosthenes hired a man to pace the distance between the two cities and learned they were 5,000 stadia apart, which is about 800 kilometres.

He could then use simple proportions to find the Earth's circumference — 7.2 degrees is 1/50 of 360 degrees, so 800 times 50 equals 40,000 kilometers. And just like that, a man 2200 years ago found the circumference of our entire planet with just a stick and his brain.

Bros, you assume too much. These Greeks learn from some people too! Please find out who they learnt from and you will see that most of what they palmed off as their own discoveries have been with their Teachers for Eons. Learn about the Hindus, the Ancient Egyptians too. They taught the Greeks all that they know.
Having said that, the purpose of this Thread is about how Alien discovery could alter Religion as we have it now. And I stand by my earlier post that, let them be discovered already, it won't shake my Faith in any way, it will only reinforce and re-confirm my Faith in the Rabbil Alamin. Lord of The Worlds.

Try and download this book and read. Isis Unveiled - H P Blavasky. Volume 1 and 2.

RuthlessLeader:

Oga my previous post has proven that either you don't do research before making a claim or you are lying for Allah. Let me even tell you what you will do now; you will focus on one small part of my post to make another foolish claim to defend your rubbish quran.

This link I will provide has a detailed list of every scientific error in the quran.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

At the bolded, I can understand if you are irritated by my response and you typed that. But if that is your default mode while you engage in exchange of your opinions with others, I guess we rather stop this now.

RuthlessLeader:

How do you know the supreme being isn't Brahma or Ra, or could there even be a council of supreme beings like the greek gods. Afterall they are older than the bible and christianity and the civilizations that worshipped them were more advanced than the israelites.

Just think for a moment, whatever you are presenting as info was documented by those you never knew neither is their documents confirmed by any supernatural being long before you were born. Yet you're eagerly and zealously QUOTING them as if you were present when all these were written and compiled, simply because you've found some proofs to stand by these documents and defend it! So to be liberal for real you need to listen ATTENTIVELY when someone else is presenting some contrary opinion,perceive the ideas,try to see if you've gotten something of more value and then you can confidently and conveniently debunk worthless informations! Isaiah 54:17

Lukuluku69:


At the bolded, I can understand if you are irritated by my response and you typed that. But if that is your default mode while you engage in exchange of your opinions with others, I guess we rather stop this now.

Haaaa sorry about that, some people are just that eager to debunk what they consider as worthless information so that's why a true preacher of God's word must be humble and Meek at heart. 1Peter 3:15 Most times we've met people who wants to snatch the Bible out of our hands and burn it, simply because they're not ready to listen due to having their own religion but the irony of it is that most of them even claims to be Christians So we'll just walk away because we're sure that they don't know what they're doing! Luke 23:34

Riofidelio:
Haaaa sorry about that, some people are just that eager to debunk what they consider as worthless information so that's why a true preacher of God's word must be humble and Meek at heart. 1Peter 3:15 Most times we've met people who wants to snatch the Bible out of our hands and burn it, simply because they're not ready to listen due to having their own religion but the irony of it is that most of them even claims to be Christians So we'll just walk away because we're sure that they don't know what they're doing! Luke 23:34

Thanks man!

RuthlessLeader:

Ogbeni we know thanks to science that semen comes from the testicles and not the freaking backbone so the quran is wrong so stop shifting the goalposts.

You still haven't brought forth any explanation on why the quran claimed alexander the great saw where the sun set on earth. Not only is that a scientific inaccuracy, it is also historically inaccurate. Alexander was a whole prince so he like other educated greeks of the time knew the earth was round unlike the quran which says it is flat. They also knew the sun didn't set on earth.

But admit it; If the quran was scientifically accurate you wouldn't need to form any half-baked explanations for the nonsense there.

The Alexander in Quran is even more like a myth, it can be trace to the legendary version of "Alexander Romance".

Lukuluku69:


Thanks man!

You're welcome my friend!

RuthlessLeader:

Oga my previous post has proven that either you don't do research before making a claim or you are lying for Allah. Let me even tell you what you will do now; you will focus on one small part of my post to make another foolish claim to defend your rubbish quran.

This link I will provide has a detailed list of every scientific error in the quran.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

I think it won't be wise to use anti-Islamic source for your argument.

RuthlessLeader:

Oga my previous post has proven that either you don't do research before making a claim or you are lying for Allah. Let me even tell you what you will do now; you will focus on one small part of my post to make another foolish claim to defend your rubbish quran.

This link I will provide has a detailed list of every scientific error in the quran.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

That site is owned and operated by the Jews, do you sin sincerely believe they will come out fair on Islam? We know their antecedent.

Lukuluku69:


That site is owned and operated by the Jews, do you sin sincerely believe they will come out fair on Islam? We know their antecedent.

Why can't you just read your quran to see if what they are saying is correct instead of dismissing it.

RuthlessLeader:

Why can't you just read your quran to see if what they are saying is correct instead of dismissing it.

Been doing that. I mean the Quran reading. And I do read whatever anyone has to say about my Faith. I know that site very well, they have been regurgitating the same stuff their forerunners peddled.

Lukuluku69:


Been doing that. I mean the Quran reading. And I do read whatever anyone has to say about my Faith. I know that site very well, they have been regurgitating the same stuff their forerunners peddled.

Have you read this part of the quran:

Volume 9, Book 93, Number 579:
Bukhari
Narrated Abu Dharr:

The Prophet said, Gabriel came to me and gave me the glad tidings that anyone who died without worshipping anything besides Allah, would enter Paradise. I asked (Gabriel), 'Even if he committed theft, and even if he committed illegal sexual intercourse?' He said, '(Yes), even if he committed theft, and even if he Committed illegal sexual intercourse."

Please wake up and realise that this and all other religions are shit.

RuthlessLeader:

Have you read this part of the quran:

Volume 9, Book 93, Number 579:
Bukhari
Narrated Abu Dharr:

The Prophet said, Gabriel came to me and gave me the glad tidings that anyone who died without worshipping anything besides Allah, would enter Paradise. I asked (Gabriel), 'Even if he committed theft, and even if he committed illegal sexual intercourse?' He said, '(Yes), even if he committed theft, and even if he Committed illegal sexual intercourse."

Please wake up and realise that this and all other religions are shit.

Bros, calm down. What you put up ^^^^^ is Haddith and not the Quran. Don't be confused man! Quran and the Haddith are two separate Books. Haaaaa! At this age and time you don't know the difference and you think you can critique Islam? No!

tintingz:
I think it won't be wise to use anti-Islamic source for your argument.

Agreed but both the Quran and bible have much scientifically inaccurate claims which you wouldn't blame them for if you consider the time and individuals responsible.

johnydon22:


Agreed but both the Quran and bible have much scientifically inaccurate claims which you wouldn't blame them for if you consider the time and individuals responsible.

Yes, i meant he shouldn't post the link here instead he should post out the Quranic verses and argue with it.

Posting the anti-islamic site can easily be discarded as sentiments, bigotry articles.

Lukuluku69:


some saying someone came and died for their sins some eons ago,

RuthlessLeader:

Have you read this part of the quran:

Volume 9, Book 93, Number 579:
Bukhari
Narrated Abu Dharr:

The Prophet said, Gabriel came to me and gave me the glad tidings that anyone who died without worshipping anything besides Allah, would enter Paradise. I asked (Gabriel), 'Even if he committed theft, and even if he committed illegal sexual intercourse?' He said, '(Yes), even if he committed theft, and even if he Committed illegal sexual intercourse."

Please wake up and realise that this and all other religions are shit.

You're too hasty and irrational to debunk all religions because of this your high regard for civilization and science. But let me assure you that wisdom is not in the heart of those who are too hasty in their decisions rather wisdom means humbly allowing others to spew whatever they had in mind then you can easily undo the heap of rubbish they consider as knowledge with efficacy,when you calmly point to the poo in their theory as you openly prove that there is no wisdom(practical application for lasting benefits) in it.

johnydon22:


Agreed but both the Quran and bible have much scientifically inaccurate claims which you wouldn't blame them for if you consider the time and individuals responsible.

The Bible is certainly not a science textbook but whenever it touches science you'll marvel at the accuracy of the report considering the time of the record and individuals that pened it down. But the Bible is really an instructional manual from the author of life (God) for the only intelligent earthly creatures "man",so as to live peacefully and to resolve our problems,not to teach us how to travel to the moon,move faster from one place to another,build skyscrapers just to see far distance,communicate with people living far away,watch them in a windowlike invention called TV and so on. What's the benefit of all these side attractions when we're not able to live peacefully with ourselves? Instead we're inventing self destructive devices daily that's posing treath to our very survival! Please science might seems appealing to many but to honesthearted people science is of no lasting benefits! The rapid discoveries in Science is due to unseen intelligent creatures around US now, their plan is to distract humans from paying attention to God's word (Bible).These creatures are mighty in power so they can do many wonderful things to divert your attention. But the bitter truth is that these creatures have lived for thousands of years "they are here because God has pronounced death on them now so they are spitefully looking for humans to perish along with them". Genesis 3:15,2Peter 2:4,Jude 6,Revelations 12:9,12

Riofidelio:
The Bible is certainly not a science textbook but whenever it touches science you'll marvel at the accuracy of the report considering the time of the record and individuals that pened it down. But the Bible is really an instructional manual from the author of life (God) for the only intelligent earthly creatures "man",so as to live peacefully and to resolve our problems,not to teach us how to travel to the moon,move faster from one place to another,build skyscrapers just to see far distance,communicate with people living far away,watch them in a windowlike invention called TV and so on. What's the benefit of all these side attractions when we're not able to live peacefully with ourselves? Instead we're inventing self destructive devices daily that's posing treath to our very survival! Please science might seems appealing to many but to honesthearted people science is of no lasting benefits! The rapid discoveries in Science is due to unseen intelligent creatures around US now, their plan is to distract humans from paying attention to God's word (Bible).These creatures are mighty in power so they can do many wonderful things to divert your attention. But the bitter truth is that these creatures have lived for thousands of years "they are here because God has pronounced death on them now so they are spitefully looking for humans to perish along with them". Genesis 3:15,2Peter 2:4,Jude 6,Revelations 12:9,12

If god wanted us to believe in him, he would have at least been scientifically accurate in his message to us.