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Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by garfield1: 4:04pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Nowenuse:This is a poor or not even an excuse.during this year polls,they were underage voting in ebonyi.the massive tgumbprinting and writing of results that usually occur in ss/se before 2019 cannot be surpassed by the north.do you know that rivers once produced 2 million votes in 2003? |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by garfield1: 4:18pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Nowenuse:You cannot blow hot and cold at the same time.earlier you claimed that you can use elections to determine which religion dominates a state but in the case of adamawa,you somersaulted.but since religious population is a complex thing,you can use as many factors as possible to measure the population be it which religion the indigenous ethnicities practice or electoral indices and also i use preponderance of inflation people from that state for instance most of the people from adamawa i meet or read about,what is their religion? Other factors are also important.all these factors except one shows that muslim are slightly more than adamawa christians.the indices that gives you the closest answer is electoral dominance.due to the structure of nigeria,a dominant religion or tribe will always dominate a state no matter how slightly and muslim have had more say in adamawa politics than christians.shikena |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 4:37pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
nyamuri garfield1 fk002 grandstar Lastly, you guys keep on talking about muslims being majority in Niger, Kwara, Kogi and Nasarawa hence they cannot be with us. See, i do not care about these places except Nasarawa and parts of Niger. This movement of ours is made only for the smaller minority tribes who speak hausa as a 2nd language. Nupes, Ebiras, e.t.c do not fall here and I don't care about them. We have no cultural similarities with them. Kwara is a majority Yoruba state. They are going along with their fellow yorubas, so they don't even belong to the middlebelt in the first place. As for Nasarawa state. Are you people aware that Buhari lost Nasarawa state in 2011 & 2015 elections? Of course he rigged and won in 2019. Muslims dominate governorship in Nasarawa state because the largest christian tribe in the state (the Eggons) are disliked by people from other tribes and both christians and muslims from other tribes vote against them. Even their cousins (the Madas) who are mostly christian and the 3rd largest tribe in the state vote against them. There are about 30 tribes in Nasarawa state and apart from the Hausa fulani & Kanuri settlers in the state, only the Egbura & Akyekura (Jukun) are predominantly muslim. And these tribes are not even among the top 5 in the state. Eggon, Alago, Mada, Gbagyi, Gwandara, Afo, Migili, Nungu, Akyekura & Tivs. These are most likely the 10 largest tribes in Nasarawa state. Eggon, Mada & Gbagyi are 80% christian or more. Tivs & Migili are over 98% christian, but Tivs are regarded as settlers in the state, but is argued. Alago, Afo, Gwandara & Nungu are a 50/50. While Akyekura (Awe) are over 90% muslims. All the remaining tribes are christians except for Agatu, Ekye, Bassa & Babye who are 50/50 and Egbura who are predominantly muslim. Hausa fulanis and Kanuris in the state are a minority, but if combined together, they should be like number 7, after Afo people. Lastly, Igbos and Southernerns are now very very many in Nasarawa state, because of the development of Abuja (Karu) into Karu (Nasarawa) and both Karu in Abuja and Nasarawa are predominantly christian. So, I don't know where you guys get this your claiming Nasarawa to be against the middlebelt comes from. It is very very strange. Also, let me burst your bubble about Kogi state! Igalas (who are the largest tribe in the state) are 50/50 or now even predominantly christian. The current Attah of Igala (head of the Igalas and Kogi state traditional council) is a christian and he is a strong pro-middlebelter. He supports the middlebelt agitation a lot. He banned the use of Hausa turbans among all Igala kings and royal houses and re-established the connection between his people and the Aku-Uka of Wukari. The former Attah who was a muslim used to tie a turban like an Emir. As for Niger east. David Umaru (their longtime senator) is the most respected leader there. Infact most of the Gbagyi leaders in Niger east are christians. The Gbagyis, Kamukus, Koros & Kadaras of Niger east are 60% christian. The Hausa settlers in the state have been using religion to gain power in the state. Divide Niger state into three Nupe (Niger south), Gbagyi (Niger east) & Kainji (Niger north) and the power of Hausa settlers will disappear. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 6:31pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
garfield1: You are making a big mistake when you define who is a Jukun. Jukun is a cluster of ethnic groups, not just one ethnic group. Everyone who identifies as a Jukun is either a Kpanzo, Wapan, Wanu, Ichen or Kuteb. These 5 Jukun clans speak similar languages and have a similar culture. Then you have the Jibu & Kona. Infact, almost everyone including the Mumuyes in Taraba state are from the old Kwararafa kingdom except the Fulanis. Even Idomas, Igedes, Igalas and most ethnic groups in Nasarawa came from Kwararafa. This is why their languages are similar. Go and read about the history of the old kingdom. The topic of who is a Jukun is not clear. Some Ichen will tell you they are Jukuns, others will tell you they are not. While Konas all the way in Jalingo also claim to be Jukuns too. So it is very wrong for you to say Jukuns have only 2 LGAs. Like I told you earlier, if the Jukun tribes are divided into separate tribes, then Fulanis become the largest in the state, but if you bring Wanu, Wapan, Kpanso, Ichen & Kuteb together, then Jukuns become 35% of the state and the largest. If you add Kona & Jibu, then Jukuns are half of the whole state. That is how it works. You either identify all the tribes in Southern Taraba as Jukuns or nobody becomes a Jukun. Also, the Chambas in Southern Taraba (Donga), have become Jukunized. They no longer speak Chamba language. They have adopted a Jukun tongue as their mother tongue, so they are counted as Jukuns most times because you cannot differentiate them 2ndly, Jibus are the majority in Gashaka & Bali and not fulanis. I repeat. My very close friend is from here. Two-thirds of Jibus are muslims and fulanis have settled with them because of the emirate. This is why they are sometimes seen as fulanis. But most of them are not fulanis. When you go to their rural areas, you find most of them are christians there. Same with the Chamba leko in Bali (where late Danbaba Suntai originally came from). Gassol is where fulani dominate. https://www.ethnologue.com/language/jib Check this link above on ethnologue and you will see what I am telling you. 3rdly, Anybody telling you fulanis dominate Sardauna & Ardo Kola is a foolish liar. Sardauna is divided into 3. Ngoroje, Gembu & Mbamnga constituencies and the 3 have their different kings and house of assembly. It is only Ngoroje that is owned by fulanis. Gembu is owned by the Mambilla. Fulanis have been trying to take it over and that is why they have been fighting in this town. Where were you when hundreds of fulanis were killed in the town last year to the extent that the Sardauna of Sokoto started threatening fire & brimstone? Mambilla people are 50/50 but Mambilla muslims never take sides with fulanis based on religion. They rather support a Mambilla christian over a fulani. Fulanis have tried all their efforts to divide Mambillas based on religion, but it has never worked. (Mambilla muslims are one of a kind. I have never seen tribal muslims like them in the whole middlebelt. They are rare). Mbamnga is dominated by Cameroonian tribes and they are all christians. The current speaker of Taraba state house of assembly is from here. Peter Abel Diah. Ardo-Kola is shared by Kona (Jukun), Yandang & Fulanis. Fulanis have like 40% here, but Kona & Yandang are united as one. So, fulanis are treated as a minority there. So they loose elections and do not produce the house of assembly member for the constituency. How can anyone say Taraba north is muslim majority? If we use your political suggestion. There are 8 house of assembly seats in this area and christians produce 5, muslims 3. Muslims would have produced only 2, but Mumuyes elected a muslim Mumuye for Yorro Lga. This is why I also tell you that the use of politics doesn't always work. Judge with the tribe. Now, will you or anyone say Yorro have muslim majority? No. Muslims in Yorro are like 25%, but Mumuyes do not play religious politics among themselves. Some foolish people use the fact that a muslim produced senator for Taraba north to judge that it is a muslim majority, what ignorance. Like I told your friend nyamuri. In 1999 & 2003, the senator for Taraba south was a muslim. This is a zone with 90% christian. How did that happen? The last senator for Adamawa south was a muslim. This is a zone with 75% christian. Plateau central elected Ibrahim Mantu as their senator for 8 years. Is Plateau central muslim dominated? Among christians, politics is not always religion! Anywhere you see a christian ruling in the north (outside Kogi & Kwara), that place must be majority christian or at least 50/50 because a muslim majority will never vote a christian. And I have dared you or any other northern muslim to prove me wrong. However, anywhere you see a muslim ruling in the north, that place may not be muslim majority because overwhelming christian majority areas have elected muslims times without number as I have proven. Chikena! |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 7:38pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
garfield1: See, do not use the number of people you meet from a place to judge the people from that place. For instance, if you go to Europe or America, 90% of the Nigerians you see there are christians. Does this make Nigeria 90% christian? 80% of Gombe people I have come across are christians. I have also asked these same Gombe christians to tell me the divisions in their state. These people tell me that Gombe is 50/50. However, I would be stupid to judge and conclude Gombe based on this. I have to do my research. I have to know every tribe in every LGA of Gombe state and how they are before I can conclude. If you live in the north and you are a muslim, it is most likely that the people you come across are mostly muslims. Hence you are most likely to meet more muslims from Gombe than you meet christians from Gombe. However, for a christian who lives in Jos or the South for instance, most Gombe people you will meet are christians. This is the way it is. Let me help you guys with the breakdown of Adamawa. Adamawa south is 75-80% christian. This is where you have the strongest christian stronghold in the state. The Bwatiyes (Bachama & Mbula) who are over 95% christian. There are 7 LGAs in this zone. (3 of them) Numan, Demsa & Lamurde belong to the Bwatiyes and related tribes. Then you have the Chambas in Toungo, Jada & Ganye. Chambas are 60% christian, but many fulani settlers have settled with them (e.g Atiku's family). So it is more like a 50/50. Then you have Mayo Belwa, 40% fulani, 60% Yandang who are christians. Adamawa north is 60-65% christian. There are 5 LGAs. Michika is for the Higgis (the largest tribe here) who are over 90% christian. Madagali is for the Marghis who are like 70% christian. While Mubi north, Mubi south and Maiha are a 50/50 combined. It is owned by the Gude, Fali & Nzanyi, and other smaller tribes, they are related. Adamawa central is 50/50. This is the fulani stronghold of the state. Fulanis and muslims are very powerful here because of the decade long system of indirect rule where tribes who were never conquered by Yola were forcefully placed under Yola emirate. There are 9 LGAs here. Fulanis dominate Yola south, Yola north, Fufore & Girei LGAs, however, 40% of Girei are the Battas (Bwatiye cousins of the Bachamas) who are christians. This is why they were never under Yola emirate and have their own first class king in Girei. There are also tribes like Daka, Verre e.t.c in Yola south & Fufore who share these places with the fulanis. Some are 50/50 others are christian majority. Yola north where you have the state capital is very cosmopolitan and all tribes have migrated to stay here, hence fulanis do not have strong power over this place as such. It is like a 50/50. Song LGA is owned by the Yungurrs with a significant fulani minority. It is 70% christian. Gombi LGA is owned by the Gandas & Baburrs (Bura) with significant fulani settlers. It is 80% christian. Hong LGA is owned by the Kilbas, it is heavily populated and is 70% christian. Shelleng LGA is owned by the Kanakurus and it is a 50/50. Guyuk LGA is owned by the Longudas. It is under the Numan federation. It is over 95% christian. Now, when you look at this. How on earth can Adamawa be predominantly muslim? It is impossible. Muslims dominate politics in Adamawa cos 60% of muslims in the state are fulanis. This helps them to easily vote in one direction, meanwhile the christian votes are easily divided among tribes. 2ndly, many towns in Adamawa are 50/50 or slightly muslim majority. You could be in Mubi town for instance, you will see that it is a 50/50 or muslims are slightly more, but as soon as you enter the rural areas in that same Mubi, you will see that many villages do not even have a mosque. Hausa fulanis and muslims in general prefer trade and commerce, they live by the roadsides hence prefer urban areas, unlike the christian indigenes, many of who live in very interior villages. This phenomenon is observed all over the north! This is why I always tell people to desist from judging the population of a LGA based on the town. It is very wrong. The population of a town is not more than the dozens of villages surrounding that same town. This was the same way Hausa fulani muslim settlers thought they were the majority in Tafawa Balewa (Bauchi) and Zangon Kataf towns until crisis came and by the time all the indigenous christians from the dozens of surrounding villages descended on the town, all the settlers fled. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 7:48pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Nowenuse: what's the basis and moral of ur argument, that Christians are majority in Niger state? |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 8:45pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
You keep going in the same circle, rotating on the same point time without numbers!! U seem to be in a maze that has u confused . I'm not debunking or contradicting the fact that there are minority ethnic tribes in any of the same you listed, of course there is!! What I'm saying is that, all these minority tribes from those specific states, don't have the influence, clout and strenght to successfully agitate for their course The majority of tribe in Kebbi state are hausa/fulani, who are Muslims The majority of tribes in kaduna state are hausa/fulani, who are Muslims The majority tribes in Niger state are nupe/hausa, who are Muslims The majority of tribes in bauchi, adamawa and gombe are hausa/fulani, who are Muslims So, I wonder how you will get the numeric number or influence to help your course, no state will foolish look at you while you do that.. I always alight when I see middle belt elders issue empty propaganda that MB is not part of the north.. You simple don't have the population to effect that! Nowenuse: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by emmamajesty: 8:52pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Nowenuse:i think Sule Lamido did better |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 9:15pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Have u been to jigawa state before? emmamajesty: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 11:34pm On Oct 21, 2019 |
Nyamuri: In your small mind, You think because someone belongs to a state, then their destinies are tied to people of that state? You must be very myopic to think this way. In Kogi state for instance, the Okun (Yoruba) people of Kogi west are not culturally tied to the Ebira & Igalas. They belong and participate in different national Yoruba groups. OPC has their branch in Kogi west. Go and declare war against them and watch all the Yorubas from the Southwest come in to defend their own. If Yorubas are going for a referendum today, do you think they will leave the Okuns behind because Igalas & Ebiras don't want a referendum? It's like you don't know that in Nigeria, most people owe their loyalties to their ethnic groups before their states ba? If the Gbagyis, Kamukus & Kadaras of Niger east decide that they want to form one national sociocultural body, a political party or a national pressure group with Southern Kaduna and Plateau tribes. What then is the business of Nupe or Zaria people? If they decide that they now want to identify under one identity and jointly fight for a cause nationally, will Zaria people go and stop them? You are talking like a child. When John Danfulani went to meet Nnamdi Kanu in Igbo land and told him that if Nigeria divides, Southern Kaduna will go with Biafra, can someone from Zaria come out to shut him up? Of course not, because he never said Kaduna state will go with Biafra, he said Southern Kaduna and this has no business with the Hausa fulanis of Zaria. How does an agitation of Zuru people in Kebbi south affect the Hausa fulanis of Kebbi north? Will the Hausas leave their villages to go and meet the Zuru people in their villages and tell them not to agitate? I just don't understand your point. In Nigeria, people's hearts lie with their ethnic groups and affiliations and not some stupid states. If it ever comes to a referendum with our people, it will be based on ethnic groups. Every ethnic group will decide where they belong and this is not going to be the business of Hausa or fulani people or Yorubas or anyone else. Everybody knows his or her ethnic group and homeland. Nobody from another tribe can decide what people from another tribe want. If you cannot get this into your thick skull, then I give up. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 12:14am On Oct 22, 2019 |
@ Nyamuri For the last time. The group I belong to does not care about anybody's state or religion. Your ethnic group is what matters and your desire to choose your own destiny. Whether you think Niger, Nasarawa or Adamawa is a muslim state is your own business and not ours. It belongs to your pocket only. Every smaller northern minority ethnic group who speaks hausa as a 2nd language and has a desire to establish it's identity is by default part of us. Take Bauchi state for instance, it is an 80% muslim state with Hausas & fulanis and many dozen tribes. Most of the minority tribes in the state have sold their identities to the caliphate and no longer care. However, you have the Sayawa (Zar) people of Tafawa Balewa/Bogoro who have mainted their unique identity. These people share a boundary with Plateau state. They are part and parcel of us. Now, can Hausas leave Bauchi town or Azare and go to Zar land to tell them not to join such a progressive movement? Hell no. Zar people are Zar. They have no business with hausa fulanis or the other hausanized tribes of Bauchi state on the views they decide for themselves. They are not an enclave in Hausa land. As simple as ABC. Every tribe knows his or her boundaries and what he/she decide for themselves. The only people's support I think my people should care about are the Tivs & Idomas of Benue state, because without them, we have no direct land boundary to Southern Nigeria, unless through Cameroon. And here is your final blow. The overwhelming majority of ethnic groups in the areas I mentioned that are circled in red will be very glad to belong to a regional movement as such. Of course, the only people that will be against it are the Hausa fulani and Kanuri settlers in our midst. But sadly for them, they are not even part of the union and they are very insignificant as far as the union is concerned. Of course there will be agents of the caliphate from some ethnic groups who based on religion will want to reject membership. Sadly for them, 98% of the ethnic groups within the geographical area are predominantly christian or a 50/50. An Alago muslim for example cannot come out and speak against it because his own fellow Alago christians will come out to challenge him. So, definitely, the use of religion to manipulate things will fail. Alagos may have the highest muslim population in Nasarawa state for instance, but half of them are christians and the christians from that ethnic group will not stand to watch agents of the caliphate distract them from such a lovely union. The Kanuri settlers of Lafia will have their say in the matter, but it will not count because it does not concern them |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 9:34am On Oct 22, 2019 |
garfield1: It was in 2011 that Rivers produced such huge votes. Go and check what Kano produced that same year. And what was the number of their registered voters for that year? Many people seem to underrate the population in Rivers state, forgetting that Port harcourt is the most populated and largest city in the South after Lagos. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 10:06am On Oct 22, 2019 |
garfield1: Nyamuri, can you see what your fellow abokii did? See how he is breaking down Taraba quite well, just because he met 2 people from there. Now imagine if he had met at least 20 people of different religions and tribes who gave him their different pictures of the makeup of the state, he would be able to juxtapose everything together and come to a better point. Don't be a foôl to ask for references backing up the ethno-religious demography of a place. The core north rejected the inclusion of ethnicity and religion in our 2006 census because they do not want to be exposed. If you truly want to know the ethno-religious demography of a place, you can ask multiple natives of that place who are knowledgeable to help you out. In a place that is mixed with different tribes and religion, make sure you ask people from different tribes and religions, unless you may get a skewed picture, because everyone will try to glorify his own ethnic group and religion over the others. Secondly, use google, facebook, youtube! Search for news events from that LGA, search for the name of the ethnic group and events surrounding them, check for their traditional rulers. Check for the political leaders and political contenders of elections in that place. Use the names of their traditional/political leaders to search on facebook for people who have such similar names and check their affiliations. You can also use foreign sources like ethnologue. Although ethnologue has very outdated figures. However it will tell you the names of LGAs that tribe are found. It will also give you the alternative names. Also, you can travel a lot. For example, I used to think that Afo people in Nasarawa state were overwhelmingly muslims, until I was able to follow the 'Afo national union day' and I saw the huge number of christians in the crowd. And not just that alone, also, for every Afo muslim person that was mentioned and honored, there was a christian too. Also, I used to think the Babye people of Nasarawa were mostly christians, not until I joined their facebook group and I saw huge numbers of muslims who were proud to be Babye. Look at this video below. This is a dance from the women of Rindre (Nungu) who are the majority tribe in Wambai LGA, Nasarawa state and minority in Sanga LGA (Gwantu) of Southern Kaduna. This is the tribe that the female deputy governor of Kaduna came from. From their dressing, you can see that about half of them are muslims and about half are not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyWnBf55QhY Do not be foolish enough to wait for anybody to spoonfeed you with references especially when it comes to the demographic makeup of middlebelt areas or any other part of Nigeria you don't know. If you want to know, you can know. 1 Like |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by garfield1: 1:38pm On Oct 22, 2019 |
Nowenuse:It was in 2003.in 2011,it was 1.8 million.the 2015 and 2019 polls really exposed the true voting strength of ss/se.rivers has the largest amount of registered voters in nigeria but in all honesty,most of the election figures are false.only few people come out to vote.majority of those in port hangout are non indigenes.i base in rivers,its like my 2nd home so dont argue this one.even majority of the people here have admitted times without number that elections do not take place down south.its only in the west that a semblance of voting takes place.in the rural areas of cross river,the chiefs simply decide on a consensus to allocate votes to pdp,i can even provide a video about elections in my village.my analysis of elections shows that its in the west and north central that real elections happen. By the way,i like your ethnic and demographic analysis and views.its top notch.i know christians are more than muslim in nigeria but i wont like to go into that.my anger with you is that you are channelling your work into hate,evil,controversy and to cause confusion.forget about religion and buhari,use your work to advance societal progress not to spread hate please |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 7:56pm On Oct 22, 2019 |
Your clearly delusional to say the least!! There is know difference in the way ur projecting and making your analysis, your just using a different tactics and nomenclature to propagate your argument.. your not making any sense and logic in this debate, what's the difference you and him when you keep attaching base lead numbers and percentage? How do you expect a layman to verify and ascertain your claims? Again with the myopic and imbecilic bullshit meant for the birds!! your obvious hate for the north will soon drive you to the market, when did the north "reject the inclusion of ethnic and religion in our census..this profound proclamation is not far from bear parlour gist, deprived from too much Alomo intake.. do you have any reference to it, or is it part of ur concocted and fabricated stories? Central Intelligence Agency(CIA), has hausa/fulani and Islam as the dominant tribe and religion in Nigeria, so what's the essence of rejecting a census when the truth and reality is out there for all to see, or did the CIA rigged for the north too? https://www.cia.gov/Library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/ni.html this is the fourth time I'm providing a link and evidence to verify my claims, I expect you to do that too.. but u rather through some incoherent tribes and attach baseless numbers and percentages to it.. You make an argument, you should provide cogent evidence and authenticity , I'm not the one that is supposed to do that for you You want me to use Google to get a bigger picture of ur skewed analysis, but you have failed to use the same Google to provide any link or evudence since we started this debate to vindicate yourself Using Facebook is not an authentic avenue or perimeter to deduce and attest the "ethno-religious demography" of a place, I just disproved that in the other debate we had.. for example, the MB group your in that analyzed buhari will lose, had a 80% Christians participants, base on ur logic to use Facebook, then one would have thought 80% of inhabitants of MB are Christians, which we all know its not true and legit info! Another example, if an American uses Facebook to examine and study the population of Nigeria, he might think Yoruba or Igbo are the majority, since they are the ones using Facebook the most, but we all know this is not true.. so your reference to Google and Facebook is DOA and stupidity, bcuz it can't be reliable Time without number, you have failed to understand the genesis and moral of my argument!! it has nothing to do with taraba, adamawa or minority groups.. our debate started base on what I confirm as hausa/fulani and Islam being the dominant tribe and religion in MB.. can you disprove that? I don't know the debate ur having with other monikers, but ours was base on MB Nowenuse: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 8:41pm On Oct 22, 2019 |
Hashanah your literally in an illusion and hallucinating in another dimension far from reality, if you think religion is not the main motive, reason and cause in people aligning and merging with different tribes and ethnicity to protect their interest Why is the rotation of presidency base on religion not tribe? Why did APC reject the potential Muslim/Muslim ticket of Buhari and Tinubu if not of religion? Why most the president and VP be from different religion? Why do nupe, igala, ebira, kanuri, align with the core north even tho they have different tribe and culture, if not cause of religion? The more we delve into our discussion, the more I deduce your clearly ignorant and lossing steam.. I feel like its more of a class in session, giving u free lesson.. count any minority tribe dominated by Muslims out of ur equation, bcuz they will always side with the core north bcuz of religious aspect Tafawa Balewa/Bogoro, is a Christian dominated area, that for certain I know, I think that's where Yakubu Dagora comes from.. hausas don't need to go to Zar to dictate to them whether to join MB agitators or not, bcuz that's not how its done.. they can only join you base on referendum, not alignment.. Why I said that is bcuz, alignment will be impossible bcuz they are the minority group in bauchi state, so any attempt will automatically be shout down by the larger tribe and group, which is hausa/fulani e.g gubernatorial and preaidential election as case study referendums, are only done base on geographical region e.g. USSR, brexit, Czechoslovakia, S/Sudan..not on a specific area in a country or state, that's why Catalunya, Checenya, Alaska, S/Cameroon etc are founding it very hard to seceed is bcuz they are the minority in their region and found it hard to vote agaisnt the overall majority in the region.. they are in the same predicament like the MB! This is why the minority tribes you keep calling and mentioning can never be a threat to the core north, from any angle u come from, its DOA. . I know you hate to admit it but this is the truth Nowenuse: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 9:20pm On Oct 22, 2019 |
Definitely!! If you belong to a state then your destiny belongs that specific state, unless you move and leave to another state, why do you think there are political asylum and exile seekers? That's bcuz they can't change the political realities, constitution, rules and regulation governing a country or state they belong to, hence they have to leave.. this is the scenario the minority MB find themselves in you can't change a situation if your the minority by force or coercion, you can only do it through dialogue.. MB agitators are minority in tribe and religion, hence it will be very hard for them to ever have their way..unless through mutual understanding Tiv, Berom, junkun etc will not have a problem aligning with the south and MB agitators, bcuz they are the majority and rule their respective state, both religiously and ethnicity.. we can even use the presidential and gubernatorial election as case study, but remove kwarra, Kogi, Niger and maybe Nasarawa out of ur equation, bcuz these states are bound by religion It will be easy for Yoruba to get kwarra, bcuz the state is ruled and cultured Yoruba, so they have everything in common, but they will never join the MB agitators bcuz they don't share anything in common Who the Bleep is John Danfulani!!! Mtswws!! How is he relevant in the scheme of things, what influence and clout those he have? Bcuz he said Sk will join Biafra doesn't mean anything to us, referendum will be done on geographical or state-to-state basis, the likes of SK and Danfulani don't have the numbers and population to defeat hausa/fulani in kaduna state, using presidential and gubernatorial election as case study " Nobody from another tribe can decide what people from another tribe want", its true, bcuz referendum will be done on state-to-state basis, not tribe-to-tribe.. I dare you mention one country that got their independence base on tribe? the core north has very little influence on minority tribe like tiv, berom etc in MB bcuz these tribes are the majority in their state and rule it, hence they can wish to align with whomever they feel like, but minority tribes in kebbi, SK, gombe, bauchi, adamawa etc, don't have a say bcuz they are the minority in their respective state, so any of their agitation will be defeated and DOA Nowenuse: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by nigeriaschoolne(f): 1:05pm On Oct 23, 2019 |
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Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by nigeriaschoolne(f): 8:37am On Oct 24, 2019 |
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Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by nigeriaschoolne(f): 8:38am On Oct 24, 2019 |
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Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 6:51pm On Oct 24, 2019 |
garfield1: Kano & Lagos always produce larger registered voters than Rivers. Rivers should be 3rd. Can you please provide a link for the 2 million votes from Rivers in 2003? Also, how many registered voters did the state have that year? Yes, Rigging happens everywhere most times, even the core-north rigs too. However the desperation of elections among the locals of the core-north shows from the fact that children are registered and allowed to vote. Southern locals and other Nigerian christians comparatively are not desperate for elections and that is why the rigging is mostly done by their leaders, this is the point I am trying to make. Thank you for commending how I analyze the demography of states. People like Nyamuri who know nothing cannot wrap their heads around the fact that people like us give him a 'go to sleep' in matters like this hence he keeps asking for a link of reference to this demohraphy analysis in order to cover his shame and ignorance. Imagine him claiming that there are Kanuri indigenes of Plateau & Taraba states I let him know that there are no Kanuri indigenes in Adamawa and even parts of Borno state itself and he is still arguing. I also admire how you were able to respond to me in a challenge to the demography of Taraba, unlike people like Nyamuri who keep crying for reference links. You agree that christians are more than muslims in Nigeria? Hmm, this strange coming from a muslim. Where are you from pls if I may ask? Are you a hausa-fulani? See, bro. Years ago, I was in support of Nigeria's unity and I was even a proud Arewa person. However the reality of things have made me rethink my decision and sentiments. Peace, equity and tranquility can never come in a society where injustice is the order of the day. Do you think people just like being agitators for no reason? You see, white people never talk about the need for unity among the people of their nations as such, rather what they talk and stress about is justice. Cos when there is justice, peace and unity comes naturally. Thanks. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 7:22pm On Oct 24, 2019 |
Nyamuri: Any other source on the demography of Nigeria that is not from a census is as good as useless including that CIA report of yours, cause it is also based on estimation. It is no different from mine. Do you have a block for a head or what? Didn't I just agree with you that you cannot use 'The middlebelt facebook group' as a means of using facebook to understand the demography of a place? And I told you why. You also know why. The middlebelt is an agitation and as such, there are people from the North central who do not agree with this. Hence people from those areas did/do not join such facebook groups. Most Kwara people do not believe in anything called middlebelt, they are yoruba as long as they are concerned hence they don't join such. Many Niger state muslims left that facebook group cos they were not happy with the name and how the group was dominated by christians. They opened their own group called NORTH CENTRAL, but their group died a natural death and could not compete with ours, because of course the heart of the majority of NorthCentral people lies with the MIDDLEBELT tag. Now, only a fool will compare this with a tribal forum becos among middlebelt tribes, the christians and muslims go to school as equally as each other and are equally exposed as each other. The christians and muslims also identify with their tribes as equally as each other. So there is no way you will see a tribal forum on facebook for a tribe that is 50/50 religiously and you find mostly christians there. It is impossible. For example, my tribe in Plateau state is almost 50/50 and if you come to our largest facebook group, this is the exact reflection there. Infact, the founder of the facebook group was a muslim. Whenever we have our Abuja meeting, the representation is almost 50/50 too. Our national president is a muslim. Our king is a christian. Just like that, equally divided. This is the same situation among most tribes in the region. This is why you cannot disprove facebook as a means of checking affiliations when it comes to the tribal level. Igbos & Hausas are 2 completely different tribes with different value systems and cultures, one is far far more educated, westernized and travelled than the other, so, if Igbos have a higher representation on social media than Hausas, it is very understandable. However, this is not the case among middlebelt tribes. We may have different religion in one tribe, however, our value system remains the same within that tribe. It is impossible for you to observe that for instance Alago christians go to school and are more exposed than Alago muslims. Very impossible! It's just like the Yorubas. If you cannot understand this fact, then I give up. Just suit yourself with whatever you believe. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 8:16pm On Oct 24, 2019 |
Nyamuri:You are very wrong and ignorant. In 2011 elections and many more past elections, Yoruba & some middlebelt muslims do not allign. GEJ won Kwara & Kogi state in 2011 with a wide margin, while Buhari won all core-northern areas. Now, tell me, how did this happen if all muslims shared same sentiments? Also, let me bring it to your blockhead! In 2001 during the Sharia fracas, core-northern leaders urged Yoruba & Middlebelt muslims to enact Sharia law in their states too. What was their response? A big resounding NO! They told the core-northernerns that cultural cohesiveness matters to them more than religion! The governors of Nasarawa, Kwara & Kogi by that time were muslims, but did they accept Sharia and allign with the core-north? Only Niger state accepted. You are a small boy. You know nothing. And this was the reason I asked you to list the number of muslim majority tribes in that red circle for me but you couldn't. Most middlebelt + Northeast tribes are either 50/50 or predominantly christian.
Hahaha. Why did Bauchi state muslims not use their majority status to stop Sayawa from sacking and evicting muslims from Tafawa Balewa town? The christian half of Southern Kaduna today can wake up and decide to eradicate Hausa fulanis and Islam from their part of Kaduna state and the so called Hausa majority cannot do shît about it. They can decide not to pay tax to Kaduna state govt and the state govt cannot do anything about it. So many things they can do. During the Biafran war of seccession, some Eastern minorities like the Ijaws & Ogonis took the side of Nigeria against their Igbo majority and this aided the quick fall of Biafra. While some Western minorities on the other hand (the Igbo speaking Aniomas) took the side of Biafra and were helping their fellow Igbos in the eastern region against their Yoruba majority. Had it been Igbos won that war, or even if it was a tie, do you think they will leave the Aniomas behind for Nigeria? Of course they will annex that area. A breakup of Nigeria can never be a peaceful thing. Referendum is for white people who are civilized. The black man only understands violence. The only African countries to have seceded (South Sudan & Eriterea) gained their independence in war. This is why I want to ask you, in a situation where the Igbos, Niger deltans and my people unite to fight for secession, do you think Hausa-fulanis can stop us? As it stands, no yoruba man will shed his blood for one Nigeria. Let us even ignore a secession war first. See the way IPOB are agitating. If the Niger deltans and my people join them on a massive protest and civil disobedience across 18 states of Nigeria and Abuja, do you think this country can withstand it? If we form a political party with a common agenda and we elect our political leaders from that party, do you think Nigeria can stop us? No country in this world with all it's military might can suppress/silence half of it's population. It is impossible. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 9:17pm On Oct 24, 2019 |
Nyamuri: What you are saying is absolute rubbish. First of all, most white nations accept referendum by political blocks simply because they have always been forming political units and nations based on ethnicity. This is not the case in Nigeria. First of all, are you aware that Nigerian states and regions were all created forcefully by the military? Infact, if it ever gets to the extent of tabling this issue before an international court of justice, you guys will loose woefully. Nigerian tribes and peoples were not consulted before these states of today were created, they were created against the people's wish in a military regime. This alone counters every validity of states being used as a criteria for a referendum (if it will be supervised by the UN). So, there you have it. Secondly, we also have LGAs which are also a tier of government. We can also insist on LGAs to be used as the criteria for a referendum if need be. Let me burst your useless generalizations above. USSR. The minority nations of USSR broke up at a period when communism fell and the soviet state was weak. They would not have been able to do that before then. Czechoslovakia. It broke up more mutually. No bloodshed. Both the Czech & Slovaks have always had their boundaries for centuries. Nothing like referendum along states. South Sudan forced North Sudan into accepting a referendum after over 30 years of war. Putting Brexit in something like this analogy is a joke. Infact, you don't just know anything. Catalonia is an autonomous region of it's own. Majority of it's ppl will vote for independence anyday and any time, but Spain doesn't want to give it to them no matter what. Sadly, Europeans will hardly take up arms and most sadly, none of their neighbours or any Superpower will support them. Same thing with Chechnya. English speaking Cameroonians voted in a referendum to join Cameroon. They have 2 states they own and dominate in Cameroon, so they have very strong constitutional backing and majority status if it ever comes to a referendum. However, Paul Biya the dictator will never give it to them just like that. He needs to see stronger power and fire! As a black man that he is Sadly for them, they are a minority and have no neighboring country or Superpower on their side. Yes, none of the tribes I mention is big enough to make much impact, but by the time you combine all of them together, they are massive (30 million strong). See, if a war begins, within a few days, all Hausa fulanis and their muslim allies can be sent packing from the entirety of Benue, Plateau, Taraba, Southern Kaduna, Southern Gombe/Borno, FCT & most of Adamawa & Nasarawa within a few days. Most hausa fulanis and muslims in these places live within the towns and do not know the villages and forests unlike the christian indigenes that dominate and surround all these areas. Our region is not like Igbo land that is very small and highly urbanized where thousands of soldiers can surround and occupy within a short time from city to city and town to town. There are mountains everywhere and large swathes of difficult terrain that a core-northern army will never understand. Now, if with all this, we have the Igbos & Niger deltans backing us with all their money, large fighting population, access to the sea, large diaspora population with a lot of money, sophistication and international influence. My brother, just forget it. It is a lost battle. War and crisis does no one good. However, if the core north continues pushing us to the wall as they are doing even with the Igbos too. We will have no other option than to allign and mark my words, this will be the end of Nigeria. Igbos are already tired of Nigeria as you can see, but they cannot fight Nigeria and win on their own because they are a minority. But whenever the Niger deltans and my own people join them, it is finished. Niger deltans are afraid to join Igbos to fight for a country simply because they are afraid that Igbos will dominate them in one country. However, my people have the power to change this notion in the minds of Niger deltans if we ourselves join in and they see that Igbos will no longer be an absolute majority in the new country. A short story to demonstrate what I am saying to you. Are you aware that Napoleon was the one who united Germany? Germanic kingdoms were always divided and never one, not until they saw the rise of the French Napoleon who was out to conquer and enslave them all. This forced German kingdoms to unite. Till date, Germans are the most powerful force and nation in Europe. So, powerful that they almost conquered and enslaved the whole of Europe, if not for the intervention of Russia & America. Within a few days of war, Germany crushed and occupied France in the 2nd world war. French people have finally reaped the seed of Napoleon |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by garfield1: 10:57pm On Oct 24, 2019 |
Nowenuse:https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.electoralgeography.com/new/en/countries/n/nigeria/nigeria-presidential-election-2003.html&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjStNK677XlAhXDDOwKHaGXDFUQFjAAegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw1h0_ga1HOUQyoaAXW9vaPa Thats the link to the rivers polls.lagos has the highest number of voters yet produces low votes,that is how rivers is its just that the pdp leaders in rivers usually inflatethe figures to counter that of kano,this is common knowledge.you are correct about political leaders doing the rigging in the south while the masses dont care.majority of people im the ss,se dont vote and are not interested in elections or politics allowing the few elites to take advantage unlike the north whereby the masses are interested and rigging is a consensus so that of the north is humane and realistic.turnout never exceeds 60%, unlike the south where in places like ogun,abia,anambra where they abhor voting recording over 80%. Anyway,am a liberal christian from cross river.i love and desire united and developed nigerian.if it cant work,then so be it |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 2:54pm On Oct 26, 2019 |
You are right that kwarra, kogi other SW state voted for GEJ in 2011 presidential election.. this is the only logical and tangible argument you have made since we started this debate! however, you should be observant and heedful with the phrase "main motive, reason and cause", I didn't use the word "only", I didn't specify "religion" was solely the reason at any point, I just indicated that its the main factor and motivation in people's voting pattern in Nigeria.. I'm very careful with my words, unlike you that makes an argument that contradicts and goes contrary at ample times Now, on why kwarra, kogi and other state voted for GEJ? That I can't tell for certainty, as they most have their reasons, purpose and objective that is beyond my comprehension in doing it.. but you cant proof your/a point using this attestation, why? Bcoz it's obviously and evidently that they didn't vote for him also bcoz tribe/ethnicity(after all, these 2 stated don't have anything in common with GEJ), you failed to validate ur own argument, all you tried to do was to debunk my point of view without justifying yours.. lol. You refuted my evidence, without proofing yours, who does that? Hahahaha you said "In 2001 during the Sharia fracas, core-northern leaders urged Yoruba & Middlebelt muslims to enact Sharia law in their states too", this is another fabrication, fiction and deliberate falsehood that had been part of ur signature and MO since we started this debate, your stories are full of concoction and interpolation hoping to escape my prying eyes.. can you show me evidence they met southern leaders [b]“Wanting not to be seen as acting in isolation, he instigated imams in other Islamic states in the north to agitate for a full sharia law declaration. In all, 12 states out of the 19 in the north promulgated full sharia law.” Olusegun Obadanjo https://www.google.com/amp/s/dailypost.ng/2017/08/11/sharia-nearly-consumed-nigeria-obasanjo/amp/ You even said "They told the core-northernerns that cultural cohesiveness matters to them more than religion!", from this point, I officially now I'm debating with a delusional dimwit and dunce of a boy..how do you think shariah makes u lose your culture and identity beats my imagination!! So the likes of northern Nigeria, Indonesia, Iran, Sudan, Pakistan etc have alk lost their cultural cohesiveness to Arabs right? .. have u noticed how stupid you sound Hahahhaha did you just say "southern KD can just eradicate Muslims if they feel like", and what do you think will happen to Christains in other parts of KD? .. will just hail them and congratulate them abi, nawoo!, ur a funny kid I swear.. remove emotions aside and stop watching a lot of movies and cartoons As long as SK indigenes are within the state, the constitution officially dictates the compulsory payment of taxes and other government dues, its even shocking this point and statement you made is coming from a supposed educated and literate person like you.. how do you even stop paying taxes in a state you do your business, work and hustle in... do you expect government to provide amenities, services and facilities while they don't pay their taxes I feel like ur lossing steam, wit, intelligence, acuity and sharpness in some of the arguments ur making.. it's more of an emotional rollercoaster your engaging in now! The earlier you stop grouping the Igbo, MB and Niger Delta together, the better for you!! You guys don't have anything in common Igbo are agitating for Biafra MB are agitating for their own republic Niger Drlta wants resource control So i don't see how your agitation correlates at all, you can't come on the same banner bcoz you don't collaborate on the same page, nobody will fight someone else's battle, you should know thay.. if it was the case, Nigeria would have separated a long time agi, bcoz the Hausa/ fulani won't have the capacity and capability to withstand the pressure from all sides, but unfortunately its not the case for you guys.. that's why your still finding it hard to secede, bcoz you don't have the same agenda in common Yoruba will never side with the agitators, bcoz unlike you guys.. they are just being hypocritical and playing politics, watch them keep quite once they get the presidency , we know them perfectly like the back of our hands That'd why I and other northern elites want the presidency rotated between the north and SW, so as to keep the south in check, do you understand the logic now Your talking about protest, ur clearly having an illusion!! Your far from reality! You keep having a pipe dream, you better wake up from your slumber.. protest is the hardest thing to achieve in Nigeria bcoz if religious, ethnic, corruption etc that comes along with it, there will always be a sellout and deep down u perfectly know it.. why do you think the likes of Sowore, Adebanjo, Abiola etc all failed in this regard Protest can happen overseas and in western countries, but certainly not here.. if it was that easy, why havnt you guys done it? [/b] Nowenuse: |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by QuotaSystem: 4:58pm On Oct 26, 2019 |
alhassanyusuf29: My apologies, just seeing this, took a brief break from the forum. I think most Governors in the North have underperformed generally considering the potentials of their states, but Kwankwaso deserves commendation for his strides as governor. I'm yet to be impressed by Mutawalle considering his pedigree which prompted great expectations, hopefully he consolidates in his final tenure. Bafarawa in my opinion is rather undercelebrated considering the visible transformation of the Sokoto metropolis that was the hallmark of his tenures as Governor. Katsina Governors (Masari et al.) have been "just there". |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nowenuse: 5:54pm On Oct 26, 2019 |
Nyamuri: Why will you know the reason Yoruba muslims, Kwara & Kogi muslims did not vote for Buhari when people like you cannot see outside religion? Simple. Yoruba & Igala muslims do not play politics based on religion like northern muslims do. They are mostly progressive people who prefer development over religion, unlike northern muslims who prefer religion over development. You can see Oyo state that has a slight muslim majority, yet they elected a christian governor. Yoruba and Igala muslims felt that GEJ will bring them more progress, hence the reason they voted him.
Yoruba & Igala muslims believe tribe comes first before religion and this is the reason why they and their christians can never fight each other based on religion. They prefer the cultural cohesiveness they share with their fellow christian tribesmen over their religious similarity with the core-north. So they could never accept Sharia. This was the meaning of CULTURAL COHESIVENESS here. Block head. And mind you, Indonesia is not a sharia country. That country has the most liberal muslim population in Asia and one of the most liberal in the world. Religion is not included in their constitution even though they are 90% muslim. Indonesians are very proud of their Hindu ancestry and traditions hence their national symbols are Hindu figures. They still celebrate their Hindu values & culture UNLIKE Pakistanis who murdered their own kinsmen in the partition of India. Pakistanis have allowed religion brainwash them and they have become self hating people. Many of them hate and deny their Hindu origins & cultures and claim to be Arab & Persian by origin and descendants of the prophet Same with Somalis & Sudanese who will tell you they are not black people, rather they are Arabs and descendants of the prophet. Sudanese went as far as eradicating their native tongues in favour of Arabic. This is a similar stupidity seem among Hausa fulanis today. You people no longer answer your tribal names rather you will see Hamisu Abdulkadir Mustapha & Aisha Mohammed Ibrahim. And to worsen it all many Hausas will argue with you that these islamic names are their native names . Same Hausas will argue with you that hijab is a part of their culture. When I was in camp and native Hausa culture dance was performed, many Hausa fulanis were arguing that the dance was not Hausa culture. What a shame! Yes Zaria people can send everybody out of their land, just as SK people can. This is the point I am buttressing. Why can't Zaria use their majority status according to you to dictate who lives in Southern Kaduna since they are the majority in the state? This is just to let you know that sometimes your majority belongs to your pocket. Do you know what is called civil disobedience? Yes, SK can tell Kaduna state govt to hell with their amenities and state govt salaries. They can form their own tax group and collect taxes from themselves by themselves in order to develop thier land and provide amenities for themselves. Afterall they only get a tiny portion from the state govt's money, yet the same state govt collects their taxes! If they make a decision like this, can a Hausa man working for the KD state govt tax force go to Zangon Kataf town in the name of collecting tax for the state and come out with his head intact? This is my point. Hahahaha. Who are you to decide and tell other people who to allign with and who not to allign with? You must be a big joker. Oh, have you not seen enemies fought side by side with each other just to defeat a mutual enemy? The US & Japan are friends today because they have the same threat (CHINA), but wasn't it the same US who nuked 250,000 Japanese to death some decades ago? The West & Turkey are friends today because of who? RUSSIA, but it was the same West who ensured the fall of the Ottoman (Turkish) empire some decades ago. Or is it the husband and wife relationship betwen muslim persecuting China & Islamic terrorism sponsoring Pakistan, just because they have a common threatening neighbour (INDIA)? Nothing will stop the Igbos, Niger deltans & my people from uniting if we want to, as long as we have a common threat and similar interests. You need to grow up and get more wisdom. 2 Likes |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Gunayo(m): 7:47pm On Oct 26, 2019 |
sarrki:Its Dankwambo no doubt about that. |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by Nyamuri: 1:22am On Oct 27, 2019 |
Nowenuse: lol. Your assertion and my rebuttal don't correlate and correspond at all! They are poles apart!! I'm talking about regions in a country that are looking for independence which differ on common grounds and you are here talking about sovereign countries who are totally independent off each other. Lol who cursed |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by myobjective: 6:23am On Oct 27, 2019 |
Kyase: Yaradua of katsina was the best governor, he work tirelessly to open up katsina during his time. Kure of Niger state was the worst governor, he fail to lay any good foundation and brought religious sentiments to the state |
Re: Who Is The Best Governor In The North Since 1999? by myobjective: 6:31am On Oct 27, 2019 |
alhassanyusuf29: Elr-Rufai is an hypocrite, he is playing to the gallery of conservative northern Kaduna people by marginalising the people of southern Kaduna. Most of his anti southern Kaduna in the state are not needed, he is just subtly preparing for the presidency and he knows religious sentiments is one sure way to win the heart of core northern people. Elr-Rufai himself is smart and liberal but being too ambitious will use any trick in the book to get the top job. 1 Like |
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