budaatum:

If I can't believe God created heaven and earth in six days and rested on the seventh, I should steal and murder and not love my neighbour?

And what if I understand the Bible instead of just believing and trembling like a demon?

budaatum:

No delkuf, you are wrong.

I have to understand what I believe or I might ignorantly be believing what I do not understand.

delkuf:
yeah, but not with the Bible. You cannot understand the Bible without believing in it. you must believe then understand.


And sorry for tagging you as an atheist

Gaggii:


The point remains Bible did not condemn slavery...even quran

delkuf:
Is it possible to understand something that you don't believe. if I tell you that the earth is round and believe it without you going round the earth, will you say you understand what I told you without necessary evidence or you believed it

Gaggii:


How can a sane human believe that God rested?... Was he tired? Since he created everything with word

budaatum:

No need to apologise. I was an atheist.

I am afraid that you are just regurgitating what you have been told to believe. And as I said, it is how we are taught in Nigeria, to believe, even if we never go on to understand.

A study of the Gospels however shows that Jesus was about understanding rather than for one to just believe. A very good example of this is the Parable of the Good Samaritan. The Priest and the Levite were believers, but Christ said "Go and do like the unbelieving pagan worshipping Samaritan".

budaatum:

No need to apologise. I was an atheist.

I am afraid that you are just regurgitating what you have been told to believe. And as I said, it is how we are taught in Nigeria, to believe, even if we never go on to understand.

A study of the Gospels however shows that Jesus was about understanding rather than for one to just believe. A very good example of this is the Parable of the Good Samaritan. The Priest and the Levite were believers, but Christ said "Go and do like the unbelieving pagan worshipping Samaritan".

delkuf:
Yeah the Samaritan may be an unbeliever, but that is a different case study.

budaatum:

Yes, it is possible to understand something and not believe it.

If you told me the earth is round and I believed you without checking any evidence to see if it is true, then I am stupid, and your sheepie, and if you told me to put my hand in the fire, I just might believe you and put my hand in the fire.

If Jesus did not understand his Bible, he would have [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+4%3A1-11&version=NIV]made bread out of stones to relieve his own hunger, and jumped from a pinnacle and rely on angels to break his fall, and worship Satan in return for all the kingdoms of the world[/url]. After all, Satan was quoting from the Bible that you claim must be believed, so why didn't Christ believe when it was quoted to him?

budaatum:

In what way is it different?

Jesus clearly did say 'go and behave like the unbelieving Samaritan and not like the believing Priest and Levite', who both sinned because they believed!

delkuf:
because the Lord Jesus Christ told us to behave like the unbelieving Samaritan, doesn't mean we should behave like the Samaritan.

delkuf:
You should know more than this. The Lord Jesus Christ was only telling us examplify what the Samaritan did by helping the man that was Rob by the harmed robbers. that was the Lord Jesus Christ was trying to say Stop misinterpreting the Bible

delkuf:
mind you the Bible wasn't written when Jesus was on earth. The Lord Jesus Christ was a believer. He believed what the heavenly Father told him. If he didn't believe, he won't have lay down his life. Do you know the difference between the Lord Jesus Christ and the devil. The Lord Jesus Christ is a believer and devil uses logic.

gbami:
Ephesians 6:5
Colossians 3:22
Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
Tell me how? How is it possible?
To sincerely obey someone that's Enslaving you ...that believes you are a shit in the site of human, that you are a second class human...
Many things just don't sit well...

Maximus69:


Christianity is about submission to those superior to you!

budaatum:

No it certainly is not! At least, a proper understanding of Christianity is not "submission to those superior to you"!

If Christainity was "submission to those superior to you", 12 year old Jesus would have submitted to his superiors in the temple, and to the learned Pharisees and Sadducees he kept arguing with, and to Caesar too, all who held superior positions to Christ. But he didn't! He called them serpents, he said they were evil, "Woe to you hypocrites," he said. "You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. How will you escape being condemned to hell?"

In fact, "submission to those superior to you" is the doctrine of the antichrist! As in, the doctrine of those who want to use the Word of God to enslave. And, despite all the threads about slavery currently on here, God does not want slaves, God wants co-workers!

I know you would argue this Max, but I will try really hard not to engage in this with you because I know it will profit not. But I do put it to you that all those who accept Christ into their lifes, receive the Comforter, the Holy Ghost that Christ sent down to minister to each and everyone of us who is willing to accept it. And those in whom the Spirit of God dwells are slaves to no one and nothing!

Maximus69:

So those people in the temple aren't superior to any Jew, they can only shun you from their temple but the Romans can arrest and punish a Jew who rebel against their orders!

budaatum:

I'm certain you are not suggesting the Romans were in any way superior to Christ.

We can clearly see that Jesus did not submit to any Roman. For despite them killing his flesh, they could not touch his soul. Hence, we sing, "He lives"!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbhTT4xqneg

Below is him specifically telling you not to submit to anyone, for any reason whatsoever, except God!

Maximus69:


But they had the power to stop him from further preaching publicly, when they killed him!

Maximus69:


But they had the power to stop him from further preaching publicly, when they killed him!

gbami:
Ephesians 6:5
Colossians 3:22
Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
Tell me how? How is it possible?
To sincerely obey someone that's Enslaving you ...that believes you are a shit in the site of human, that you are a second class human...
Many things just don't sit well...

Kobojunkie:

Slavery was still very much legal even 2000 years ago, with some born into slavery... it was even considered by some an economic pathway. So, since Paul was not running some underground to free slaves -- doubt he even could if he had tried back then since even if he was a citizen of Rome, what I don't understand is your particular issue with the advice given. Would you rather he had advised the "Christian" slaves to revolt against their masters?

Note: I don't advocate people believe everything that is written in that book either.

gbami:

Let me tell you a little history of some of the igbos(I am not an Igbo)...When some of them were being taken to the US via the Atlantic...They rebelled, killed their masters, some even decided to die before they take them to America.. Believe me...I will choose to die a free man any day, any time than to be slaved by someone...

budaatum:

Oh! And they obviously did not stop him preaching publicly. For when you go door to door preaching, "Christ is risen", It is not you who speaks, but the Spirit of your Father [and the living unkillable Christ the Son] speaking through you.

Maximus69:


The Roman authority killed Jesus and that was the end of his public appearance, only his closest confidants saw him later, the Jewish community never saw him again!

So superior authority is anyone having the power to determine whether you live or die!

For instance, if the Boko Haram catches a Christian, they become the superior authority over him with the guns in their hands so whatever they command him he must do except if such command go against Godly principles, that's when he can say "NO!"!

Jesus will obey the superior authority just as he admonished us to pay whatever due those ruling us demands, a slave belongs to his master so as long as he lives he must OBEY the person who bought him!

budaatum:
Ok Max, if you say so. You hopefully understand that my own understanding of Christ is that despite all the guns in the world , and their ability to kill my flesh, they are still in no way superior to me.

A current example would be George Floyd, who was killed, but is turning out to be even much more powerful, as in, effective, dead.

Kobojunkie:
Good for them, but let's get back to the story here.
Paul wrote that line to slaves who obviously did not choose death but instead wondered, maybe, what Christianity required of them as concerns the relationship with their masters. If not all slaves chose death over a life of servitude and some of those who lived became Christians somewhere down the line, what message would you have expected of Christ to such?

Maximus69:

Jesus will obey the superior authority ...

Maximus69:


HE IS DEAD! all the protests in the world can't bring him back to his wife and kids!

gbami:
Go back to your history....Masters( human)rape slaves, beats them etc...And you expect a slave to open her legs in obedience when the master says so...
I am done with this...
I am not a slave to anyone...no matter how it is phrased....