MuttleyLaff:
Acehart, good stuff you spilled out up there, but the two things, OP, Preciousgirl asked were:

1) Lord Of The Sabbath
- What does Jesus mean here by this? (i.e. What specifically does He mean with "Lord Of The Sabbath" and why?). What prompted having Him say this?
2) Why say "the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”. What is the point. What's the significance in saying this?
What is the meaning of "the Son of Man"?

cc: Bodydiialect57

1. I have answered your first question and the first part of your second question in the concluding part of my response to preciousgirl.

2. Ahhh! Let me try to give a brief response - I hope I am not wrong ; The meaning of the expression “Son of” is usually defined within the context it is used because it is an expression with a lot of meaning. If I have to delve a bit into my response, the meaning of “Son of God” means “One of God” (Suggesting that God is Plural). “Son of Man” means “One of Man” (‘Man’ used in the Plural). I don’t think what I have just written makes for good grammar, so, let me make sense with these expressions: “Son of Man” means “One of Mankind” - a member of the human race; and “Son of God” means “One of God-kind” - A member of the God race.

In the context of the reference text, the usage of the expression “Son of Man“ was a pointer that one among them, Christ Himself, is those things I listed in my response to preciousgirl.

MuttleyLaff:
"And Jesus said to him,
"The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air nests;
but the Son of Man has nowhere He might lay the head.""
- Luke 9:58

The title the Son of Man often used by Yahusha Ha Mashiach aka Jesus Christ, as like seen in Luke 9:58 above, is a clever, conscious, calculating and deliberate way of Yahusha Ha Mashiach expressing Himself for the benefit of the audience and/or hearers' understanding, that He, actually is begotten of the Father (i.e. revealing the Divinity and so divine side of Himself) and born of a mother (i.e. acknowledging the humanity and so humane, human being side of Himself)

"For a child is born to us, a son is given to us.
The government will rest on his shoulders. And he will be called:
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace"
- Isaiah 9:6

"A voice cries:
“In the wilderness prepare the way of the Lord;
make straight in the desert a highway for our God."
- Isaiah 40:3

Isaiah 9:6 is in harmony with Isaiah 40:3. Fyi, the voice crying in the wilderness is Jesus' cousin, John the Baptist

PS: You too are warming up to now using "verbatim", smh, yet you couldn't produce verbatim your false allegation levied against me. KMT

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Acehart:
1. I have answered your first question and the first part of your second question in the concluding part of my response to preciousgirl.

You answered "Lord Of The Sabbath - What does Jesus mean here by this?" and "Why say "the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath”. What is the point. What's the significance in saying this?" in a convoluted way

Acehart:
2. Ahhh! Let me try to give a brief response - I hope I am not wrong ; The meaning of the expression “Son of” is usually defined within the context it is used because it is an expression with a lot of meaning. If I have to delve a bit into my response, the meaning of “Son of God” means “One of God” (Suggesting that God is Plural). “Son of Man” means “One of Man” (‘Man’ used in the Plural). I don’t think what I have just written makes for good grammar, so, let me make sense with these expressions: “Son of Man” means “One of Mankind” - a member of the human race; and “Son of God” means “One of God-kind” - A member of the God race.

In the context of the reference text, the usage of the expression “Son of Man“ was a pointer that one among them, Christ Himself, is those things I listed in my response to preciousgirl.

I unreservedly or without demur concur with you that "Son of Man" means "seed, product or offspring, of a human being, human species, humankind et cetera"

Yahshua Ha Mashiah aka Jesus Christ, uses the title, to refer to the humanity side of Him, but why this deliberate and not impulsive statement? What point is He making with habitually referring Himself to be “Son of Man“? Why do we need to appreciate the fact of Him being “Son of Man“? What is the significance in Him being “Son of Man“? Is it relevant that He be the “Son of Man“? If Yes, that it is relevant He be the “Son of Man“ then why? What's the reason that He needs to be “Son of Man“?

Why does ""Son of God” means “One of God-kind” - A member of the God race" need to become "a member of the human race"?

If the usage of the expression “Son of Man“ was a pointer that one among them, Christ Himself, is those things listed in your response to preciousgirl, then what is the reason why Christ Himself, had to be one among them?

MuttleyLaff:

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<sup>You answered "Lord Of The Sabbath - What does Jesus mean here by this?" and "Why say "the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath”. What is the point. What's the significance in saying this?" in a convoluted way

I unreservedly or without demur concur with you that "Son of Man" means "seed, product or offspring, of a human being, human species, humankind et cetera"

Yahshua Ha Mashiah aka Jesus Christ, uses the title, to refer to the humanity side of Him, but why this deliberate and not impulsive statement? What point is He making with habitually referring Himself to be “Son of Man“? Why do we need to appreciate the fact of Him being “Son of Man“? What is the significance in Him being “Son of Man“? Is it relevant that He be the “Son of Man“? If Yes, that it is relevant He be the “Son of Man“ then why? What's the reason that He needs to be “Son of Man“?

Why does ""Son of God” means “One of God-kind” - A member of the God race" need to become "a member of the human race"?

If the usage of the expression “Son of Man“ was a pointer that one among them, Christ Himself, is those things listed in your response to preciousgirl, then what is the reason why Christ Himself, had to be one among them?</sup>

I would have answered but I don’t think the owner of this thread is interested -It would be a waste of energy.

Acehart:
I would have answered but I don’t think the owner of this thread is interested
- It would be a waste of energy.

Please do. Please answer in two to three sentences, if you do not want to, in one sentence

The owner of this thread is interested and is the reason for opening the thought-provoking thread

MuttleyLaff:
Please do. Please answer in two to three sentences, if you do not want to, in one sentence

The owner of this thread is interested and is the reason for opening the thought-provoking thread

Because in Mega City...
I AM THE LAW!!!
You won't f**k around no more!
I AM THE LAW!!!
I judge the rich, I judge the poor
I AM THE LAW!!!
Commit a crime I'll lock the door
I AM THE LAW!!!
Because in Mega City...
I AM THE LAW!!!

- Judge Dredd

[img]https://media1./images/4b76d5b2d43086cc67572478f8a0600b/tenor.gif?itemid=3486058[/img]

Acehart:
Because in Mega City...
I AM THE LAW!!!
You won't f**k around no more!
I AM THE LAW!!!
I judge the rich, I judge the poor
I AM THE LAW!!!
Commit a crime I'll lock the door
I AM THE LAW!!!
Because in Mega City...
I AM THE LAW!!!

- Judge Dredd

"... I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion"
- Exodus 33:19b

He is Our Father. He is Abba Father and not for us, Judge Dredd, to dread.

You with that quote, took me back to my Judge Dredd comic reading memory lane

Thanks for the mention, MuttleyLaff.

Jesus Christ made it clear especially to the hypocritical and legalistic Pharisees, that He was greater and above the law of Moses that instituted the Sabbath. He is Lord over all things created, in heaven, on earth and even beneath the earth. As creator, Jesus Christ was the Lord of the Sabbath and the creator is always and above His creation.

MuttleyLaff:
Acehart, good stuff you spilled out up there, but the two things, OP, Preciousgirl asked were:

1) Lord Of The Sabbath
- What does Jesus mean here by this? (i.e. What specifically does He mean with "Lord Of The Sabbath" and why?). What prompted having Him say this?
2) Why say "the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”. What is the point. What's the significance in saying this?
What is the meaning of "the Son of Man"?

cc: Bodydiialect57

Dtruthspeaker:


Yes, that is what He said and that is why He raised No Objection to His children's (Disciples) action, but rather defended them and Showing us that He is Indeed The Same Lord Who Spake unto Moses.

Same Reason He Healed on the Sabbath!

He is The Lord Over All, whether sickness, demons, hell, death, Law!

Be talking in the rubbish.

Jesus didn't speak to Moses.

Preciousgirl:

Mark 2:23-24,27-28

[23]Now it happened that He went through the grainfields on the Sabbath; and as they went His disciples began to pluck the heads of grain.

[24]And the Pharisees said to Him, “Look, why do they do what is not lawful on the Sabbath?”

[27]And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.

[28]Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”

What did Jesus mean by this? Thank you

SON OF MAN
SON OF MARY
SON OF GOD. ABEG WHICH ONE WE GO BELIEVE. EVEN RENO OMOKRI EYES DON DEY CLEAR SMALL SMALL FOR TWITTER

CalliDora1:
What he meant there was, He is above the Sabbath that the men were trying to honor more than Him. Which was why he said, the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. In other words, man has control over the Sabbath hence can choose to treat it however he wants but the Sabbath has no control over man and shouldn't determine man's behavior or activities.

The bolded is not what that passage means. It simply means that the Sabbath was made for the benefit of man and not the other way round. Man has no control over the Sabbath and their is no where in the Bible God said man can treat the Sabbath however he wants. The Sabbath is sacred and holy. The only issue then was that Jews were so strict about the Sabbath to the point of stopping humanitarian acts just to keep the Sabbath. That is what Christ explained there. The Sabbath is made for the benefit of man and shouldn't stop any humanitarian act.

He means God rules all hours. .

A second counts with God...

He said i know your every steps..
Job31:4
Does he not see my ways and count my every step?

Everyday is Gods day...
People give birth and die both on Sabbath and non Sabbath day

You can be big or small but when God gets ready
Which can be any minute. .you must move

You must bow..

You must be wowed.

He comes like lightning
And nothing is faster than light
Even sound is slow compared to light
He just strike you with blessings or punishment
Whichever you deserve.

Bodydiialect57:
Thanks for the mention, MuttleyLaff.

Jesus Christ made it clear especially to the hypocritical and legalistic Pharisees, that He was greater and above the law of Moses that instituted the Sabbath. He is Lord over all things created, in heaven, on earth and even beneath the earth. As creator, Jesus Christ was the Lord of the Sabbath and the creator is always and above His creation.

The law of Moses didn't institute the Sabbath. The Sabbath was instituted by God after creation. God rested on the seventh day and blessed it.

Preciousgirl:

Mark 2:23-24,27-28

[23]Now it happened that He went through the grainfields on the Sabbath; and as they went His disciples began to pluck the heads of grain.

[24]And the Pharisees said to Him, “Look, why do they do what is not lawful on the Sabbath?”

[27]And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.

[28]Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”

What did Jesus mean by this? Thank you

If man has power over Sabbath because it was made for him, then, the Lord Jesus has more power to perform miracles on Sabbath day

Thank you,


Jesus.... ❤❤❤

He is reminding us that it was he who created the world and rested on the 7th day. Jesus instituted the sabbath.
Genesis 2.2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created.
Hence he is Lord of the sabbath

From the foregoing, I surprisingly observe that you people just freely interpret the Bible the way you feel like, with no clear agreement on the actual statement. Its means the words of Jesus are highly misunderstood or he never made such statement!

Preciousgirl:

Mark 2:23-24,27-28

[23]Now it happened that He went through the grainfields on the Sabbath; and as they went His disciples began to pluck the heads of grain.

[24]And the Pharisees said to Him, “Look, why do they do what is not lawful on the Sabbath?”

[27]And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.

[28]Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”

What did Jesus mean by this? Thank you

As for me, I find no justification for plundering of peoples farm, whether it is on sabbath or not. It is THEFT and no moral teacher will support that from his followers. Unless you want us to believe Jesus support stealing and plundering of peoples properties!

see how peaceful this tread is going with no muslim intruder trying to insult christianity.
but If it were muslim related tread now ehhn. we would have seen people who would still take oath to come and insult islam

In simple terms ,it means that the Sabbath was created for man and not the other way round within the context of that scripture.Again, Jesus is saying-as the Creative Agency-through which God created everything, He's in charge of the Sabbath.(cf.Proverbs 8:22f).

J

UsmanBabaIdris:

As for me, I find no justification for plundering of peoples farm, whether it is on sabbath or not. It is THEFT and no moral teacher will support that from his followers. Unless you want us to believe Jesus support stealing and plundering of peoples properties!

Actually it was not a case of stealing. In Jewish and other oriental cultures, people are allow to enter a farm and eat as long as they do not take anything out of the farm. This is still in practice in many places in the middle east till today

Acehart:


It signifies that, amid and in addition to his other lordships, the Son of man possesses this also—that he is Lord of the sabbath day. He is Lord of angels, for they worship him; he is the Lord from heaven, and all its hosts do acknowledge him; he is Lord of earth, for by him it was made, and through him it is upheld; he is the Lord of all creation, for he is the firstborn of every creature, that in all things he should have the pre-eminence; "he is Lord also of the sabbath."

The Sabbath observance pre-dates Abraham. Concerning the Seventh day of the creation account, it is written: “They heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day”. (Gen. 3:8).

I’d like us to see the meaning of these keywords from the verse:

¹. Sound (voice) of the Lord God
². The cool of the day.

Sound (voice) of the Lord God.

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The word “voice” translated in the Hebrew as qôl has several meanings: cry, yell, thundering, deep sound, lowering (dark and threatening), proclamation, herald etc. What the proclamation was, we may never know; but we know that throughout the scriptures, when Christ, the Lord God, was to make an entrance into the world, a proclamation always preceded Him.

The Cool of the Day.

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In simple terms, the ‘Cool of the Day’ means evening. In the OT, from the time of Noah to the times when the Jewish temple still stood, the sacrifice made to God on the Sabbaths were done in the evening. The most notable evening sacrifice that elicited thunderings, darkness, and the terrifying sound of an earthquake was that of the Son of Man on Calvary on the day of Yom Kippur, also known as the Day of Atonement, the holiest day of the year in Judaism.

The word “Cool” in Hebrew is translated “rûach” meaning: the spirit, to breathe, the wind, the mind etc. This word’s etymology means: ‘to smell’ (the savor of a sacrifice) and ‘make of quick understanding’. The word “day” in Hebrew is translated “Yom” meaning: season, period, appointed time, span of time, as long as one lives, etc.

Regarding the root of the word “cool” - make of quick understanding, the Hebrew word for “Sabbath” comes from the root of the verb: “to sit to study and get knowledge”.

This is closely related to the meaning of “day”; “day” represents: “a source of knowledge”, which is not complex for us to comprehend since nowadays many of us have this saying: “I learn something new every day” and, traditionally, “old age” (i.e. the passing of time) is almost always associated with: “wisdom”. Is there a biblical support to the conclusion?

I’d say, yes. In the interpretation of the dreams of the steward and the baker of Pharaoh, Joseph explains: “the three branches”, as well as, the dream of “the three baskets”, represent: “three days”. Branches of trees provide fruit, and baskets, traditionally, are used to serve bread.

In the scriptures, bread is a figurative expression for knowledge or teaching (John 6:48-63). (Even in tertiary institutions, the word “branch” in respect to any subject is used to refer to a specific field of knowledge). With regards to the figurative meaning of the word ‘fruit’, we have to go back to the same Garden of Eden where there is the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil; Adam and Eve didn’t eat the tree, they ate the fruit from the tree to obtain knowledge; so it is the fruit itself which contains the knowledge; and the tree should be seen as a source of knowledge as a teacher is a source of knowledge. (But their source of Knowledge was to be from the Tree of Life).

When we see the effect of eating the fruit of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, Adam and Eve begin to focus on their flesh; this indicates that before eating from that tree, the Lord God was the only source of knowledge that they had; and if by definition, God is good, evil is the flesh. Then, “evil” is anyone who considers themselves “a source of knowledge about God” -this was Paul’s postulation to the Corinthian church who used sensuality as a means of getting the knowledge of who God is.

As a result, Adam becomes a source of knowledge besides God and we see Lord God saying this: "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil.”

So far, we see that the Sabbath day was a day set aside for man to learn about the goodness of the Lord God; and that man was to sit before the Lord to acquire this knowledge. In contrast to the expression of the Pharisees who exercised evil on that day - in thoughts and action (Luke 6:9). Jesus drew their attention to the initial purpose of the constitution of the Sabbath - Goodness alone, in that question: “I ask you, is it lawful to do good or to do harm on the Sabbath, to save a life or to destroy it?"

Jesus claiming to be the Lord of the Sabbath is drawing our attention to the following:

1. He is the source of eternal life.
2. He is the sole source of the knowledge of God.
3. He created the worlds and man; He is the one who rested.
4. He is the one that was heralded in the Garden of Eden; and in essence, He is God.
5. He is the one that took the decision to expel man from the Garden of Eden.
6. He is the one that instituted the sacrifice of atonement, and appointed the Sabbaths from the Garden to the time of Abel to the time of Moses.
7. He is the one that caused the Mount Sinai to smoke.
8. He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; including Moses.
9. He is Jehovah.

I hope I wasn’t too complex in my explanation. Please, feel free to ask any question in any part you have found to be incomprehensible.

Cc: MuttleyLaff

Your type give us the belief that an average christian knew nothing about God, and could not differentiate between God and Jesus. Simply put, THE GOD OF CHRISTIANITY IS NOT DEFINED!

If Jesus is the God Almighty (Jehovah) as you claim, Who was Jesus worshipping throughout his life on earth?;
Who was Jesus referring to God and Father, as found in many places of the Bible?;
Who was in control of the universe for the three days that Jesus is supposed to be dead in the tomb?

You are just in clear confusion! Even the Jehovah witness cult don't believe Jesus is the Jehovah!
Better read the bible with a clear eye and mind, and stop being a fool in this century, or you will just make Christianity an object of mockery!

Please i need help brothers, I was born into a christian home but lately i dont want to hear about God or jesus or anything preaching, i stop going to church about 8 years ago, when ever i want to reconcile with God i will be doubting my self if this God really exist

Tcwork:

Actually it was not a case of stealing. In Jewish and other oriental cultures, people are allow to enter a farm and eat as long as they do not take anything out of the farm. This is still in practice in many places in the middle east till today

Is there a biblical evidence for that?
A number of people (12 or more) invading a farm, is enough to depreciate the farm even if they didn't take anything away!

Beside, what made you people to ignore such a good custom, and see burning of thieves as something normal?

massalati:
Please i need help brothers, I was born into a christian home but lately i dont want to hear about God or jesus or anything preaching, i stop going to church about 8 years ago, when ever i want to reconcile with God i will be doubting my self if this God really exist

Sorry for your state brother!
God actually exist, but you have been made to perceive it from a wrong direction. Christianity has turned many peoples to Atheism and Secularism, because its doctrines and the bible has failed ordinary reasons and humanity! Remember that the west only start advancing when it forcefully separate itself from the church.

My only advice to you is to be bold and studied other religions as well. Go and search for God in other religions until you find satisfaction. I know many people of blind faith will try to pull you back, but don't be discouraged.

I pray may God, in his infinite mercy, guide you to the right path!

Dtruthspeaker:


Yes, that is what He said and that is why He raised No Objection to His children's (Disciples) action, but rather defended them and Showing us that He is Indeed The Same Lord Who Spake unto Moses.

Same Reason He Healed on the Sabbath!

He is The Lord Over All, whether sickness, demons, hell, death, Law!

Jesus is Lord over death and he was killed according to your bible and believe, that is contradictory, well...what Jesus is saying is very simple, it means Sabbath is created for HUMANS and not otherwise, so do not attach important to such day as if they are deities

UsmanBabaIdris:

Is there a biblical evidence for that?
A number of people (12 or more) invading a farm, is enough to depreciate the farm even if they didn't take anything away!

Beside, what made you people to ignore such a good custom, and see burning of thieves as something normal?

The bible is not about seeking evidence. The bible was not written to teach Jewish culture and custom so if you are looking for evidence you wouldn't use the bible rather, you would research on Jewish culture.
And 12 cobs of maize would not be enough to bankrupt a farmer.
You have to note that incidents in the scripture took place over 2000 years ago. The culture and environment was a lot different from today. The laws in society were so different from today.

It's not good to answer Bible question using the Bible.
.it's too much Bible. Christ himself did not use too much scriptures. He used the everyday interplay between us to suggest what in truth the kingdom means.
.
If I tell you to take a day off. Am acknowledging that too much work can be harmfull to your overall mental health.

Hence the people who wrote the scripture were not high pitch spiritual men like we always want to lead ourselves to think. They were men of common Sense who knew rest was important to the overall well being of man. Hence the Sabbath was promugated as a law..i.e you must take a day off. The laws were the Constitution of their days.

Your modern companies still take Saturdays off till this day.

But here is the twist. Nobody should fix a day for you to rest. It's your choice if you not under any restrains. It's actually the first sign you not bound by anything.

If you are bound by your company rules. You will have to wait till Saturdays or write to be granted permission before you can take rest leave or wait till end of yr when it's done almost uniformly. This are the narratives or instructions of "laws".

If am not under any working establishment. I can rest in Monday without apologising to anyone.

Christ can go into the wilderness when others are working. That's his own rest days. He needs not follow the pack mode. He has its own freedom to represent. He is free to be free.

Therefore if the laws are meant serve man.christ has already serve himself the laws. He has done his own rest.

He knows to rest. Which is what the Sabbath means. Those who accuse him had Lost the true meaning of Sabbath. Which is a day of rest. Anyone can fix their own day of rest and day to work. It's not about a particular day.

The foundations of Heaven were built upon fear And upon the blindness of faith, Taught by the blows of a rod. The Elohim bowed to God For they knew to do nothing else And they knelt before him because they feared him. But I saw that the only power of God Was this power of fear And he that could conquer fear And illumine the blindness taught by God Could conquer God himself. Thus did I break the spell of Adonai Yahweh

MaxInDHouse:
Lord means Owner!
So what led to this statement?
Because the context will help us a lot to grasp why Jesus uttered the statement.
Jesus is the promised Messiah that all Israelites have been expecting right from the day Moses told them that God will raise up another prophet like himself amongst the Israelites and they must listen to him! Deuteronomy 18:15-18
Moses was the mediator of the covenant which brought about the Sabbath day so Jesus is the mediator that will bring about another covenant that's different from the one God established with the Israelites in the wilderness! Jeremiah 31:31-34
The Jews were trying to teach Jesus how the Sabbath should be kept holy whereas Jesus is the promised Messiah Moses warned them not to argue with!
Jesus' comment here means You people want to keep the Sabbath which was established to help you worship God acceptably, but i am the promised Messiah that will lead you to God without all those laws that you're carrying like loads of burden. Matthew 11:28-30 compared to Romans 10:1-4

So Jesus is the owner or master (Lord) of the subject "Pure Worship or Way to God" {John 14:6} the main reason why the Sabbath was established!
No matter what form of worship this people hold so dear before his arrival, Jesus is the chosen one to teach them the PRACTICAL APPLICATION of all what the prophets and laws have been teaching them right from Moses till John the baptist! Matthew 22:40
May you have PEACE!

base on your explanation,is Jesus the prophet Moses was talking about.
Jesus was also telling the people,he is the one that will lead to God,whereas someone explain earlier that Jesus was talking about himself that he is the God.
can you explain better?