odogwux:


There is nothing great about the so called bloodthirsty occult infested empires that you all called kingdoms. Unlike other kingdoms like those in Arabia and Europe that contributed to science and engineering the only thing that the Yoyo and Benin empires did was it enslaved weaker ppl and sacrifice many men, women and children to idols. Today cars still drive on roads built by the Romans. For una place na shrines and idols be the only legacy

The great Igbo race was the first to develop a system of town-hall democracy and hardly fought ourselves in major conflicts. We were generally at peace in our agrarian communities minding our business and our metalworking and Art was as advanced anything in Africa at the time. We lived in mudhuts like people in the so called kingdoms. Despite our superior numbers we never thought of conquering our neighbours because we were too busy trading and farming

The great Igbo race is the only one in Nigeria that visitors are safe. You can never hear that Igbos formed mobs and went from house to house in Igbo land killing innocent people like yoruba and hausa/fulani are known for. Upon all the empire talk you people are just savages and it's all down to your history

Thrash. Haven't you ever read it in any book that the same Europeans whose empires you so eulogize declared that they met civilization in Benin? Could they say same of your thrashy Igbo race?

Dedetwo:



Was Zik the final arbiter on which clause should be included in the constitution or not?

You mean you didn't read his own self confession in which he revealed that the British came to his aid and threatened the proponents of secession clause with treason charges and from then on the proponents had to capitulate?

obynzo:


Bros it is either you are senseless or incredibly stupid. How in God's name are you tormenting me. Why can't you answer a simple question what was Zik's role in Biafra? you have attempted to shift goal posts and say bad thing about the igbo in a bid to avoid answering the question because it is clear you have no clue. You are scared that your lies will be brought to the open.

I see your penchant for abusive language as a symptom of some history of lunacy in your life. Else how can a supposedly normal and emotionally stable human being keep throwing insults without provocation?
You need to see your psychiatrist as soon as possible.
It is you that is not answering the real question which is this: Was the position of envoy not an administrative one?

obynzo:


Oga you are clearly a novice when it comes to miltary strategies. even you argument is so banal and childish. The there was already a functioning Biafran Navy in the creeks under Pascal Odu and Azuatalam. Also the westward thrust to Benin was done by the army. The detachments was to prevent a flanking or counter attack. Again the Navy was still young in Nigeria and most of the boats were in Biafran hands, so Oga try harder to look for means to discredit the igbo.

You are actually a crass ignoramus. How do all these answer the question I asked you? Were the naval bases not under the command of Nigeria actually, moreso that the riverine areas were not in support of Biafra considering the fact that Isaac Boro and his men were on the side of Gowon? Are you this dubious in your narratives? Can you show me a picture of the Biafran naval officers the way you had those of the Biafran army officers? Manipulator in Chief.

obynzo:


Bros let us look at Ironsi's speech again. He abolished regions right but he still kept the Military governors and had them control a collection of provinces so technically he didn't even destroy regionalism. What i feel he wanted to do was to remove that overt power that the regional premiers had which was the cause of the problem, and the mistake was the unification of the civil service which though in good faith because he wanted a central command structure similar to the military, but was misunderstood to be an attempt at Igbo domination especially by the north because their civil servant could not compete with their counterparts from the south.

It seems you don't even have any understanding of the difference between Unitary system and federalism. You think the mere existence of regions automatically translates to federalism.
Federalism is a measure of the degree to which regions or subnational units have autonomy and not just their mere existence. Do you get it now? Under Ironsi, did his groups of provinces enjoy autonomy like the former regions? A big NO. He rather directed the governors to be taking orders from him. Were Okpara, Akintola and Ahmadu Bello taking orders from Balewa in the truly regional federalism prior to Ironsi's coming. This is the long and short of this whole argument.

Per the bolded: the problem you Igbos had and still have till today is the assumption that only you people meant well for Nigeria while all others had bad intentions when in actual fact it is the other way round.
If you ask a Hausafulanis man he too will argue that all their kinsmen who ruled had good intentions but we're misunderstood. Same with Yorubas, Ijaws, etc. So if all our past and present leaders meant well and governed correctly, then who messed Nigeria up?
The remote cause of the crisis which Ironsi met on ground was the abuse of power by Tafawa Balewa at the center by way of his undue interference with the supposedly purely intra-Regional affairs of the West. Balewa also rigged the 1962 census and re-rigged the rerun in addition to his blatant rigging of the 1965 elections especially in the South. Now common sense dictated that the solution to all that was for the center to be further weakened to forestall such Balewa kind of abuse of power by all future prime ministers and presidents. But Ironsi came and did the exact opposite by way of making decrees which even further strengthened the center and weakened the regions thus laying a more fertile ground for a repeat of Balewa kind of abuse of power. And you say Ironsi acted in good faith but was only misunderstood? Such a claim is very illogical to the situation on ground back then. Ironsi simply had Igbo domination agenda and that was the truth.

nku5:


How can a video of Awo reading a speech at the constitutional conference and another speech at the opening of a t.v. station indicate that the British were just "observers" in our early constitutional process

So you expect the colonial officer to bring koboko to the conference to show he is in charge. Lol

Stop being evasive and tell us where the colonial officers made any input in the Independence Constitution. I don't even believe you have ever taken the pain to read that constitution because Nnamdi Kanu's propaganda has made you believe that the British just sat down one day, drafted it all by themselves with an anti-Igbo bias, and then handed it to Balewa to start using.

Deadlytruth:


You mean you didn't read his own self confession in which he revealed that the British came to his aid and threatened the proponents of secession clause with treason charges and from then on the proponents had to capitulate?

Are you insinuating British, aid and Azikiwe are one entity? I guess from your level of intellect, the alleged threat of treason by the British to proponents of secession was ordered by Azikiwe. Most Nigerians cannot think.

Dedetwo:


Are you insinuating British, aid and Azikiwe are one entity? I guess from your level of intellect, the alleged threat of treason by the British to proponents of secession was ordered by Azikiwe. Most Nigerians cannot think.

It is obvious that your level of intellect doesn't even carry the logic in this debate. Are you suggesting you don't know how heavy the British might was? Didn't Azikiwe himself once fear British might when he refused to appear on the D-day for anti-colonialism symposium for which he had promised to deliver the keynote address?
If British desires were not laws, then why did he abscond that day?

Deadlytruth:

It is obvious that your level of intellect doesn't even carry the logic in this debate. Are you suggesting you don't know how heavy the British might was? Didn't Azikiwe himself once feared British might when he refused to appear on the D-day for anti-colonialism symposium for which he had promised to deliver the keynote address?
If British desires were not laws, then why did he abscond that day?

You just made my point with the bolded. It was the British not Azikiwe were the final arbiter to what retained in colonial constitution handed to Nigeria. Zik could wish all he could, what either retained or not retained in the 1960 Nigerian constitution was stage-managed by British. I suggest to you and ilk to leave Zik out of your craziness.

Dedetwo:


You just made my point with the bolded. It was the British not Azikiwe were the final arbiter to what retained in colonial constitution handed to Nigeria. Zik could wish all he could, what either retained or not retained in the 1960 Nigerian constitution was stage-managed by British. I suggest to you and ilk to leave Zik out of your craziness.

Zik purposely courted and got the backing of the British to prevent secession clause. All that the British needed was just one voice of dissent which they always found in the East. I guess this should sink into your block head this time around.

Deadlytruth:


It seems you don't even have any understanding of the difference between Unitary system and federalism. You think the mere existence of regions automatically translates to federalism.
Federalism is a measure of the degree to which regions or subnational units have autonomy and not just their mere existence. Do you get it now? Under Ironsi, did his groups of provinces enjoy autonomy like the former regions? A big NO. He rather directed the governors to be taking orders from him. Were Okpara, Akintola and Ahmadu Bello taking orders from Balewa in the truly regional federalism prior to Ironsi's coming. This is the long and short of this whole argument.

Per the bolded: the problem you Igbos had and still have till today is the assumption that only you people meant well for Nigeria while all others had bad intentions when in actual fact it is the other way round.
If you ask a Hausafulanis man he too will argue that all their kinsmen who ruled had good intentions but we're misunderstood. Same with Yorubas, Ijaws, etc. So if all our past and present leaders meant well and governed correctly, then who messed Nigeria up?
The remote cause of the crisis which Ironsi met on ground was the abuse of power by Tafawa Balewa at the center by way of his undue interference with the supposedly purely intra-Regional affairs of the West. Balewa also rigged the 1962 census and re-rigged the rerun in addition to his blatant rigging of the 1965 elections especially in the South. Now common sense dictated that the solution to all that was for the center to be further weakened to forestall such Balewa kind of abuse of power by all future prime ministers and presidents. But Ironsi came and did the exact opposite by way of making decrees which even further strengthened the center and weakened the regions thus laying a more fertile ground for a repeat of Balewa kind of abuse of power. And you say Ironsi acted in good faith but was only misunderstood? Such a claim is very illogical to the situation on ground back then. Ironsi simply had Igbo domination agenda and that was the truth.

You are still lying your ass off . Oga whether you like it or not Ironsi was never the cause of the federal structure we have now. It was Gowon even the same man repealed the unitary decree and the irony is that the unitary decree was never practiced.
The unitary decree removed regions in name only and the governors administered the regions as collections of provinces like provincial administrators. The civil service was unified similar to the command structure of the military the north saw it as igbo denomination because they felt scared of competition from civil servants in the south and the igbos dominated the civil service, so in all the unitary decree was misunderstood. so Oga you see you need counselling by a psychologist on how unconscious bias is not letting you reason properly.

Deadlytruth:

It is obvious that your level of intellect doesn't even carry the logic in this debate. Are you suggesting you don't know how heavy the British might was? Didn't Azikiwe himself once fear British might when he refused to appear on the D-day for anti-colonialism symposium for which he had promised to deliver the keynote address?
If British desires were not laws, then why did he abscond that day?

Oga shut up. show us where Zik refused to appear for the symposium

Deadlytruth:


You are actually a crass ignoramus. How do all these answer the question I asked you? Were the naval bases not under the command of Nigeria actually, moreso that the riverine areas were not in support of Biafra considering the fact that Isaac Boro and his men were on the side of Gowon? Are you this dubious in your narratives? Can you show me a picture of the Biafran naval officers the way you had those of the Biafran army officers? Manipulator in Chief.

From our discussion i see that your unconscious bias has made you degenerate into something of a maniac and you are not reasoning properly of course they knew that boro's men were on Gowon's side, Kobani an ogoni man and his supporters were on Biafran side so the riverine support in the war was split between Biafra and Nigeria, but then my response to you was based on military tactics which is clear you have no understanding of. The naval base in PH during the war was never under Nigeria's command until PH fell get that into perspective. The Biafran naval commander was Pascal Odu. But once again your unconscious bias is not making you reason appropriately.

Deadlytruth:


I see your penchant for abusive language as a symptom of some history of lunacy in your life. Else how can a supposedly normal and emotionally stable human being keep throwing insults without provocation?
You need to see your psychiatrist as soon as possible.
It is you that is not answering the real question which is this: Was the position of envoy not an administrative one?

You are the one that is rather insulting i am only responding to you to show you that i am above your level of reasoning to start spreading tribal hate, but rather i am above your level of reasoning to expose your lies in this forum.

Deadlytruth:

Thrash. Haven't you ever read it in any book that the same Europeans whose empires you so eulogize declared that they met civilization in Benin? Could they say same of your thrashy Igbo race?

Do you know that as they stole artefacts from Benin they also stole from Arochukwu? You habe just shown to me that you have no understanding of history at all you are just forming smart to justify your paymasters wgo have paid you to spread hate against the igbo. Oga go and read the british write up on Arochukwu how much of a developed society they were and the efficiency of the democratic system they practiced and how astutue they were in trade. Oga your unconscious bias has failed just throw in the towel and tell your pay masters that there are igbo men here that have facts to counter you

Christistruth00:


Go and do your research yourself start with the British declassified documents you will find it

Stop denying the Truth

Show us the official gazette and thw write up that said Ironsi denied Katsina leave to attend Balewa's burial. how hard is it? Unless such document doesn't exist and as usual is just one of the lies designed to twist history against the igbos

Deadlytruth:


You obviously have run out of cock and bull story responses.
The question again: Why was nothing said let alone agreed in Aburi on time to resume political activities towards elections if the genuine objective of the summit was about returning Nigeria to the pre-Ironsi status quo?

You are the one that is frustrated as it is showing in all your responses. The frustration and the desperation shows how much you are in the back foot. you are simply struggling to save face not that you even understand Nigeria's history in the first place.

My guy a piece of advice to you. Don't let your quest to spread hate make you psych case or a nut job because the plan is not working for you.

Deadlytruth:


At the time the UPGA alliance was being proposed between AG and NCNC with the objective of correcting Zik's blunder of aligning Igbos with the North against his fellow other Southern tribes, wasn't it from the East that Michael Okpara the leader of NCNC and other leading NCNC members were sent to Ibadan to meet with the wife of incarcerated Awolowo as the leader of the remnants of the AG? With this do you still need further evidence that the NCNC headquarters was shifted from Lagos to the East by Zik?

Oga the headquarters was not shifted to the east. Zik was the leader of NCNC and hos country home was in Onitsha and he happened to be there when they came to see him. The same thing plays out when people come to Tinubu's house as the national leader of APC for meetings. Oga nice try look for something else you are making yourself appear stupid at this. Bring any NCNC official document that showed their HQ to be in the east then i will believe you, but for now you are desperately lying your ass off to push the revision of history to make the igbo appear bad.

OROSUNBOLB:


Look at this shameless Faecal-Oha drinking OSU blockhead ! Don't you realise that when a sane man begins to argue too much with a mentally deranged person like you,people may not know the difference between the two of them again !

Kudos must be given to all those people,like my humble self,who endured a lunatic like you till this moment with the hope that perhaps, you could be saved from yourself ! You have never made any sense right from the beginning of the discourse. You've only been barking and shouting "Oga,Oga,Oga " up and down like you need a cure for some rabies infections. A useless emotional cretin like you.

In your deluded mind now,you have won this argument because reasonable people know when to stop arguing with a sick mind and have decided to stop honoring your stupidity any further. You seriously need some growing ups to catch. You must still be sucking your mama's breast going by some of your comments here.

Osu,now that you have been able to "convince" us with your "excellent" arguments that were devoid of insults about the innocence of those criminals from your evil axis, what's next ? Has it changed the third class citizenship status of your people ? Has it earned you the trust and respect of other Nigerians ? Do we now see Igbo people from an entirely different perspective ?

Definitely,you've shouted in futility and all your noise here amounts to nothing because we,other Nigerians still regard Igbo people as treacherous and we still hold them for all the woes of the country as being witnessed today.

Common sense is far from you if you don't realise that you've only succeeded in creating more enmities for your people with your toxic arguments. I know you don't care but you guys won't stop crying being marginalised. Such a stupid people !

Now go home and continue sucking your mama's breast as your putrid mouth reeks still of its stale milk.

OSU from Aro !

Oga you are simply a waste of sperm. A simple condom would have prevented a poor excuse of a human being like you from being born. Someone that can make spiteful and hatred inciting comments like this is nothing short of a mental case. I simply laugh at you because intellectually you are already a zero case.

Deadlytruth:

Who told you I have gone silent? Are you suggesting that you live on NL and have nothing else to do each day?

Bring it on. I am ready for you so far you have avoided to answer the question what was Zik's post in Biafra?

Deadlytruth:

Who told you I have gone silent? Are you suggesting that you live on NL and have nothing else to do each day?

But bros you live on NL naaa!!!!!!! you have been desperately trying to bring facts. I just sit comfortably to answer them.

Deadlytruth:


So a coup which killed the cream de la cream of Northern leaders and left their Igbo counterparts untouched for running a corruption ridden government needed the British propaganda to make Northerners feel disgusted with such a coup? I guess it was also the British propaganda it took for Ojukwu to get disgruntled with the killings of Igbos in the North hence he declared Biafra?

And how really developed today are your Greece and Argentina where military thrived till the eighties compared with the US, Germany, UK, Japan etc

1. The northerners celebrated the news of the overthrow of the Balewa government until propagandists began to do their work. The south was ecstatic until the counter coup. You are obviously not well read or exposed so these facts will be strange to you. The terrorised people of the west were the happiest. Gabriel Fagbure the yoruba journalist in that video celebrating the coup is simple evidence of the mood of the nation after the coup. If I have to keep teaching you I will need to send you an invoice

2. I thought you were just dishonest but you seem to have a learning disability as well. Coups were very common because the world was a different place. Germany you are using as an example had a Nazi coup just three decades before 1966 so your example is also DOA.

Deadlytruth:

And did these other people ever denounce the account when both Akinjide and Shagari gave it?

Did they ever agree that what these two men said was the truth?

Deadlytruth:

Zik purposely courted and got the backing of the British to prevent secession clause. All that the British needed was just one voice of dissent which they always found in the East. I guess this should sink into your block head this time around.

Do you mean the same British which did everything humanly possible to imprison Zik while giving flowery tributes to Awo? Awo was an agent of British.

Deadlytruth:

You seem to have forgotten that as at the time Ojukwu was opposing Gowon in the capacity of regional governor, Gowon had reversed some of Ironsi's centripetal Decrees and restored the regions back to a semi-autonomous status.

I take this as an admission from you that Gowon reversed Ironsi's unitary decree. So you can see that Ironsi didn't put us into the quasi federal structure today. It was Gowon that started it by splitting the regions to states

Dedetwo:


Do you mean the same British which did everything humanly possible to imprison Zik while giving flowery tributes to Awo? Awo was an agent of British.

Awo was recruited by Sir Cummins-Bruce while he was studying in London. The British encouraged him to form Egbe Omo Oduduwa as a means of fomenting tribal politics in the south to stoke division and it worked.

The British were cunning devils and they noticed that Awo was very bigoted and extremely insecure of Zik's influence in the south of the soon to be independent country. Awo and the British had one thing in common, they both were very scared of Zik

Deadlytruth:

Thrash. Haven't you ever read it in any book that the same Europeans whose empires you so eulogize declared that they met civilization in Benin? Could they say same of your thrashy Igbo race?

What is civilisation bikonu? Burying people alive because a despot aka king dies? Ritual murder and enslaving weaker people? The great Igbo race was too advanced to allow such barbaric societies to spring up. We had a system whereby the entire community was represented in a townhall democracy system. You guys were sheep but we were and will always be republicans.

Name one legacy of your Benin kingdom besides occultism and fetish practices that have kept you all where you are today. We no be mate o

nku5:


Awo was recruited by Sir Cummins-Bruce while he was studying in London. The British encouraged him to form Egbe Omo Oduduwa as a means of fomenting tribal politics in the south to stoke division and it worked.

The British were cunning devils and they noticed that Awo was very bigoted and extremely insecure of Zik's influence in the south of the soon to be independent country. Awo and the British had one thing in common, they both were very scared of Zik

Bro there are many loudmouths in Nigeria and they the most revisionists due to cheap and free education from Awo's program. Awo could not afford air ticket from London to Nigeria suddenly became land owner and newspaper operator. Awo was only premier of western region for three (3) years and suddenly became a magician who achieved wonders in a short period. While in the other, Zik was being chased by British with a threat of imprisonment because of the formation of ACB.

Dedetwo:


Bro there are many loudmouths in Nigeria and they the most revisionists due to cheap and free education from Awo's program. Awo could not afford air ticket from London to Nigeria suddenly became land owner and newspaper operator. Awo was only premier of western region for three (3) years and suddenly became a magician who achieved wonders in a short period. While in the other, Zik was being chased by British with a threat of imprisonment because of the formation of ACB.

Awo is a hero to such because he introduced the tribalism and bitter politics without which they would be lost today.

Ezeama400:


The bolded is not true.. Gowon abolished regional government and created 12 states.. Your lies and propaganda can never be true despite repeating it million times..

[b]Before Gowon became head of state in August 1966, Nigeria was a federation of

1) 4 semi-autonomous Regions
2) Each Region had resource control
3)Each Region kept 50% of whatever accrued within it, paid the Federal Government 25% and the rest 25% went into a General account that all the Regions including the Federal Government could use for developmental purpose.
4)Because the 4 Regions were semi-autonomous, it made the centre week and prevented any Region from dominating another

Today, we have

1)36 states that have little or no resource control
2) A powerful Federal government that now pays the states
3)Fiscal federalism is dead

How did we get here? It was Gowons promulgation of Decree 14 on the 27th of May 1967 that caused it all. It was this same decree that forced Ojukwu to declare the Eastern Region a seperate country called Biafra 3 days later and this led to the war. It should also be added that decree 14 was a violation of the Aburi agreement that both Gowon and Ojukwu signed in Ghana.


Decree 14, abolished the 4 Regions, replaced them with 12 states, took away resource control, reversed fiscal responsibility and made the federal government all powerful

It was seen for what it was by Ojukwu and the Eastern Region, a calculated attempt by Gowon and his Northern cohorts to dominate everyone.

Suddenly, the North that was one Region, had 6 states while the South that was 3 Regions had to share 6 states between them. This effectively made the North the dominant partner[/b]


Subsequent military administration's led by Northerners subdivided the 12 states Gowon created, and gave the North more states and local governments than the south

Today, the North that was one Region has overwhelming advantage over the South that was 3 Regions

1) The North has 19 states while the south has 17

2)Of the 109 Senators in Nigeria, the North has 59 while the south has 50

3) Of the 360 house of rep members, the North has 191 while the South has 169

4) Of the 774 Local Governments in Nigeria, the North has 419 while the South has 355

This undue advantage given to the North, starting with Gowons decree 14 which changed the structure of Nigeria, is what led to war and created the mess Nigeria is in today

Know your history..

I am done with you.. Bye

Its good to know our history, and how the north benefited more on the abolition of resource control.

In one post this liar says colonial officers had no input and throws Nnamdi Kanu in to sound smart

Deadlytruth:


Stop being evasive and tell us where the colonial officers made any input in the Independence Constitution. I don't even believe you have ever taken the pain to read that constitution because Nnamdi Kanu's propaganda has made you believe that the British just sat down one day, drafted it all by themselves with an anti-Igbo bias, and then handed it to Balewa to start using.

In another post he says Zik colluded with the colonia authorities. The same British that this liar agrees did not like Zik. See as you have tied yourself up in sophistry

Deadlytruth:

Zik purposely courted and got the backing of the British to prevent secession clause. All that the British needed was just one voice of dissent which they always found in the East. I guess this should sink into your block head this time around.

nku5:
In one post this liar says colonial officers had no input and throws Nnamdi Kanu in to sound smart



In another post he says Zik colluded with the colonia authorities. The same British that this liar agrees did not like Zik. See as you have tied yourself up in sophistry

It is obvious you are not conversant with the issues. Before Independence the British was lording it over Nigeria but the fight for independence became successful and the British had to loosen their grip. If they didn't loosen their grip would independence have been granted? Is this too difficult for you to understand?