shadeyinka:

Which of these two statements did I offend you with

1. All atheists naturally gravitate toward Nihilism
2. All atheists are Nihilists

Why do you, sir, allow yourself to be bullied so much on faceless forum?

Long time.

aadoiza:

Whatever is wrong with the use of 'should' in this instance by shadeyinka? He merely used 'should' to convey a probabilistic inclination, and you went on to unfairly denigrate him with all sorts of labels. Haba!

Mechanics should, but not definitely, be better drivers than most.

You will have to read the entire conversation aadozia to understand he meant "must" and "are" despite being told to the contrary by atheists who ought to know better since they must at least know themselves.

Its like mechanics come on here and say they cannot drive at all and you insist they should and must and do.

Hear him below in the atheist mind!

shadeyinka:
I know that the OP, HellVictorinho, LordReed are not comfortable with (and reject) the label Nihilist even though the position of atheism naturally gravitate towards it. It's like me rejecting the thought of me dieing someday. It must happen, my refection not withstanding!

When you look the totality of existence from an atheists mind, Nihilism is the conclusion. However, when you narrow existence down to the microlevel of day to day choices, an atheist like you want to see it as meaningful, purposeful.

If unfortunately, it's like winning the small battles but ultimately loosing the war. I will rather loose 1000 battles but win the war.

That's why I said:
Even if you don't like the idea (and ultimately it's a paradox), shouldn't all men be Nihilists?


I like to define Nihilism as:
The basic idea of nihilism is that life ultimately has no purpose or meaning.

I see it like playing an indefinite Russian Roulette were with each round of success, you are paid $1 million. If perchance you survive till the 100th round (with $100 million credit) and the 101th bullet is live, is such a game of any advantage to the player!

Of course, no intellegent person likes the idea of Nihilism. Would I have missed anything in life if shadeyinka died at 1year 2 months? So what am I gaining that I have lived into adulthood?

I understand you position:
An atheist like you would not want to allow the Nihilist philosophy from defining your total living existence (it is fatalistic): but separate day today positive choices you make as meaningful

aadoiza:

Why do you, sir, allow yourself to be bullied so much on faceless forum?

Long time.

Please know that not only does he put up with it, he specifically goes and opens threads to invite it.

https://www.nairaland.com/6404876/waging-bet-against-impossible-statistical#98858986

budaatum:


Its like mechanics come on here and say they cannot drive at all and you insist they should and must and do.

We're talking probability here. Besides the non-essential clause in the commas already covers this scenario you presented .

You will have to read the entire conversation aadozia to understand he meant "must" and "are" despite being told to the contrary by atheists who ought to know better since they must at least know themselves.


Hear him below in the atheist mind!

In the real sense of his argument, I doubt he's projecting Nihilism on those above-mentioned atheists but rather inferring that submission of his from the "everything is a result of chemical reaction and speck of dust" argument used mostly by atheists. So his inference is valid.

budaatum:


Please know that not only does he put up with it, he specifically goes and opens threads to invite it.

https://www.nairaland.com/6404876/waging-bet-against-impossible-statistical#98858986

People would only bully you, whether you invite it or not, if they think you're weak. Shadeyinka does not deserve bullying because he's a gentleman.

aadoiza:


We're talking probability here. Besides the non-essential clause in the commas already covers this scenario you presented .


In the real sense of his argument, I doubt he's projecting Nihilism on those above-mentioned atheists but rather inferring that submission of his from the "everything is a result of chemical reaction and speck of dust" argument used mostly by atheists. So his inference is valid.

Valid to you. Others obviously have different opinions. But we shall see if they bully you for having the same opinion as Shade, or if Shade is being bullied, as you claim, for other reasons.

aadoiza:


People would only bully you, whether you invite it or not, if they think you're weak. Shadeyinka does not deserve bullying because he's a gentleman.

"A gentleman" who is dishonest?

I guess some have a different opinion of him to the one you have of him. Perhaps one's experience of him is different to your's, unless you want to claim others are just bullies, of course.

budaatum:


Valid to you. Others obviously have different opinions. But we shall see if they bully you for having the same opinion as Shade, or if Shade is being bullied, as you claim, for other reasons.

Ain't that the beauty of opinions? You're not obliged to agree with them nor is anyone else. So you move on if you don't agree with them, e no go change price of garri for market.

Even The Rock couldn't bully me in the flesh; how could anyone then bully me on a faceless forum

budaatum:


"A gentleman" who is dishonest?

I guess some have a different opinion of him to the one you have of him. Perhaps one's experience of him is different to your's, unless you want to claim others are just bullies, of course.

He's dishonest because he has a different perspective on a subject from yours?
Actually, the atheists have been graceful in their responses to shadeyinka thus far. The only bully here is you, buda.

aadoiza:

Ain't that the beauty of opinions? You're not obliged to agree with them nor is anyone else. So you move on if you don't agree with them, e no go change price of garri for market.

Even The Rock couldn't bully me in the flesh; how could anyone then bully me on a faceless forum

I agree aadozia. And if you recall, you and I did exactly what you say should be done here; we both moved whether you like it or not.Yet, isn't it amazing that the next time you and I meet it just so happens to be in a discussion that began with the problem of believing. The Gods must have plans.

This conversation did not start with opinions, aadozia, but with a text we could both objectively check and say what we saw, and which you can consider for yourself instead of stating your opinion and thinking it would be accepted as fact as Shade did, which is what is being opposed and that you have formed the opinion constitutes bullying.

https://www.nairaland.com/6404876/waging-bet-against-impossible-statistical

Yes, I am the only one arguing vehemently with shade. But then, I am the only non-atheist who disagrees with him too.

aadoiza:

He's dishonest because he has a different perspective on a subject from yours.

Did I bully you when your view about me as a believer differed to mine?

He is not dishonest because "he has a different perspective on a subject from yours". One did not arrive here today, so one knows many have different views and they are not bullied for it or accused of being dishonest for it. In fact it shows they are able to use their own minds which most commend!

Go and check the evidence before doing exactly what he did that was strongly resisted and that you insist on claiming is bullying.

shadeyinka:

I wasn't defining you sir. I was only putting it down the way I understand it. If I misrepresented you, I am sorry - you may correct me if my impression is wrong.

Can we get back at the issue at stake.

Is a war meaningful or purposeful if I am guaranteed victory in the the first hundred battles but assured of ultimately loosing the war!?

First off the finality of death has nothing to do with the nihilistic position. The Nihilistic position negates meaning, purpose and value, the finality of death does not negate any of the 3.

Yes war can be meaningful even if the outcome is a guaranteed loss. Remember the Alamo.

budaatum:


That is not true, Hell. People are not just born. You were not just born! I definitely was not just born! Mummy and daddy first had to find each other and decide to born us after setting up nest and dedicating to keep us alive. You might of course not know this yet, but you will not just born your own children if you ever decide to have any.

And neither do people just die! In fact, quite a lot of effort and resource is put in to ensure people do not just die, and I bet you will not just die neither, but rush to the doctor and spend lots of money to ensure you definitely do not just die.

Please let me know if I am incorrect.

Mommy and Daddy just met.
Then mommy just conceived.
I will just die no matter how much I spend.

shadeyinka:

Life is conscious existence!

These are just l innocent questions:
If life has no purpose, does it have a meaning?

Who defines the "meaning" for life?

There is no reason why there is consciousness.

budaatum:


That is not true, Hell. People are not just born. You were not just born! I definitely was not just born! Mummy and daddy first had to find each other and decide to born us after setting up nest and dedicating to keep us alive. You might of course not know this yet, but you will not just born your own children if you ever decide to have any.

And neither do people just die! In fact, quite a lot of effort and resource is put in to ensure people do not just die, and I bet you will not just die neither, but rush to the doctor and spend lots of money to ensure you definitely do not just die.

Please let me know if I am incorrect.

Mummy and Daddy were just born and they will just die or they were just born and they just died.
You were just born and you will just die.
Your thoughts just happen,too.

HellVictorinho:

There is no reason why there is consciousness.

It means that consciousness spontaneously appeared with no reason, life then is meaningless and achieve no purpose. Isn't this Nihilism?

If life has no purpose, does it have a meaning?

Who defines the "meaning" for life?

LordReed:


First off the finality of death has nothing to do with the nihilistic position. The Nihilistic position negates meaning, purpose and value, the finality of death does not negate any of the 3.

Yes war can be meaningful even if the outcome is a guaranteed loss. Remember the Alamo.

The case of Alamo is a massacre, I do not see any meaningful outcome to those who died horrible deaths in the hands of the Mexicans.

I agree that the finality of death has nothing to do with the nihilistic position. The Nihilist position comprises both when a man is alive and after he dies. The Nihilist doesn't separate between the state of living or dying.

In other words, The Nihilistic position negates meaning, purpose and value both when alive or dead.

I will like to digress a bit
I know that the universe is so big that we can't even quantify enough how big it is.

but is this picture for real? are there really stars that are bigger than the sun? like the size of the sun is insignificant compared to this stars?
lol

shadeyinka:

The case of Alamo is a massacre, I do not see any meaningful outcome to those who died horrible deaths in the hands of the Mexicans.

I agree that the finality of death has nothing to do with the nihilistic position. The Nihilist position comprises both when a man is alive and after he dies. The Nihilist doesn't separate between the state of living or dying.

In other words, The Nihilistic position negates meaning, purpose and value both when alive or dead.

The battle of the Alamo was not a straight up massacre. The Alamo defenders even though out numbered 6 to 1 repelled 2 attacks and killed 600 of their opponents over the course of under 2weeks while surrounded and cut off from retreat or reinforcement. You asked me if there was any reason to fight even when defeat is guaranteed, the Alamo defenders saw a reason to do so.

Dotez:
I will like to digress a bit
I know that the universe is so big that we can't even quantify enough how big it is.

but is this picture for real? are there really stars that are bigger than the sun? like the size of the sun is insignificant compared to this stars?
lol

This is why the wonder of the universe is enough to silence the arrogance of thinking this universe was made for mankind.

budaatum:


I agree aadozia. And if you recall, you and I did exactly what you say should be done here; we both moved whether you like it or not.Yet, isn't it amazing that the next time you and I meet it just so happens to be in a discussion that began with the problem of believing. The Gods must have plans.

This conversation did not start with opinions, aadozia, but with a text we could both objectively check and say what we saw, and which you can consider for yourself instead of stating your opinion and thinking it would be accepted as fact as Shade did, which is what is being opposed and that you have formed the opinion constitutes bullying.

https://www.nairaland.com/6404876/waging-bet-against-impossible-statistical

Please tell me what you called fact out of all the humbug you've written. So your fact is: to live is the purpose of man.
I'm not sure you know what fact is madam. If your opinions were based on facts, no-one would argue with you.

Yes, I am the only one arguing vehemently with shade. But then, I am the only non-atheist who disagrees with him too.

Your word play won't save you here. You are the only arguing vehemently bitterly, the only one whose argument is continually riddled with considerable bile. And you only do so 'cos your interlocutor would not reply you in kind, which is a sign of maturity.

budaatum:


Did I bully you when your view about me as a believer differed to mine?

He is not dishonest because "he has a different perspective on a subject from yours". One did not arrive here today, so one knows many have different views and they are not bullied for it or accused of being dishonest for it. In fact it shows they are able to use their own minds which most commend!

Go and check the evidence before doing exactly what he did that was strongly resisted and that you insist on claiming is bullying.

There's not one evidence left for me to check. Shaa change your online bulling ways.

Dotez:
I will like to digress a bit
I know that the universe is so big that we can't even quantify enough how big it is.

but is this picture for real? are there really stars that are bigger than the sun? like the size of the sun is insignificant compared to this stars?
lol

Scam alert. CGI at work

Budaatum says to use your brain.

aadoiza:

Why do you, sir, allow yourself to be bullied so much on faceless forum?

Long time.

Thank you for being so kindly minded.
The Christian in me wouldn't allow "a tooth for a tooth!".

I've grown some very thick skin when dealing with (especially ) Atheists. It's their normal Modus operandi only that the dimension of Buda is a little different. He's like a brother with a short fuse. I used to engage him when he was a full blown Atheist and I probably was among the first to notice his transition to a form of "theistic atheism" for want of words to describe him. For Buda, I seem to have a very very long rope.

I can easily stop replying and the thread will die a natural death.

Thank you!

aadoiza:

There's not one evidence left for me to check. Shaa change your online bulling ways.

I am going to try really hard to take your advise.
Thank you.

However, I already failed, and will fail very often.
https://www.nairaland.com/6432955/things-every-lady-should-know#99418427

Shadeyinka, forgive buda for bullying you. What I attempt to think about you is here.
https://www.nairaland.com/5505236/attempted-response-shadeyinkas-practical-question

budaatum:


Neither! But there, of course do you go again creating crap inside your head as if you can not see!



Your blindness angers me and I want you to be saved from it.

Buda want me to adopt his philosophy!
LOL!

budaatum:


Hear yourself!

Spiritual Death: Probably!

Now hear the god of shadeyinka:

"but you shall not eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. For in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die spiritual death probably".

Like I said, lie to yourself by twisting what is in front of your eyes to the crap that you want to believe in your head. Just do not expect sensible people like me who can read to be so easily brainwashed like you are.

In the Mighty Name of the Lord God and Messiah Jesus Christ the Saviour, get thee behind me Shade!

Can a spiritual corpse feel/experience anything spiritual?

That's why I can't blame you!

shadeyinka:

It means that consciousness spontaneously appeared with no reason, life then is meaningless and achieve no purpose. Isn't this Nihilism?

If life has no purpose, does it have a meaning?

Who defines the "meaning" for life?

The word has a meaning.
It means something (an occurrence or event) that has no purpose.
But that is not Nihilism.

shadeyinka:

Buda want me to adopt his philosophy!
LOL!

No, Shadeyinka. I do not want you to adopt my philosophy. You can not adopt my philosophy no matter how much I try. And it is the fact you misunderstand that and make false claims about me that annoys me.

In order to adopt my philosophy, you will have to have travelled the path I travelled to get it. And to be honest with you, I would not wish my travelled path on my worst enemy because it is a very harrowing path that involves physically dying at least 3 times and spiritually being dead for longer than you've likely lived, so why would I want to wish such a path on you.

Anyway, I have told you what annoys me and why. Jesus was an optician who worked on peoples' eyes even more than he raised the dead, so blindness should not be the curse of those in whom he dwells. The threads are here as a record for those who see.

Peace.

HellVictorinho:


The word has a meaning.
It means something (an occurrence or event) that has no purpose.
But that is not Nihilism.

Actually the question is a tutology:

Rephrased!
If life has no purpose, does it have a meaning purpose?

shadeyinka:

Actually the question is a tutology:

Rephrased!
If life has no purpose, does it have a meaning purpose?

The meaning of a word is not the purpose of the word.

budaatum:

I am going to try really hard to take your advise.
Thank you.

However, I already failed, and will fail very often.
https://www.nairaland.com/6432955/things-every-lady-should-know#99418427

Shadeyinka, forgive buda for bullying you. What I attempt to think about you is here.
https://www.nairaland.com/5505236/attempted-response-shadeyinkas-practical-question

I have already given him an indulgence, he is set free even without asking!

The quoted link probably summarises one of the reasons why I have a very very soft spot for Buda!