₦airaland Forum

tctrills:
I understood everything you wrote; you basically quoted the writings of ancient jews as your reason why a Christian should not support the state of Israel.
You are saying that you wonder why a Christian would support Israel from a religious point because the four Jews you quoted consider is consider to be a form of paganism.

Please let me know if you still think that I misunderstood you.

You can't claim to understand everything I wrote and then process to assert that I basically quoted the writings of ancient jews as my reason for why a Christian should not support the state of Israel.

Firstly, Those aren't Just "Ancient Jews", The second on that list is the Rambam, if you know anything about Judaism, you'd know how great a Scribe, the Rambam (Rabbi Moshe ben Maimon) is. (you can get yourself educated about his works using this link: https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/75991/jewish/Maimonides-His-Life-and-Works.htm)

secondly, I never stated that "christians" in general shouldn't support the state of israel, I was more interested in why the "Righteousness" dude supports the state of Israel, given that he seems to always cite scriptural passages whenever he reports about the state of Israel; everyone has a right to support what pleases them, I was only interest in his reasons and convictions.
Judaism consider christianity as a pegan religion, I provided evidence to that effect, and if you study Judaism further you'd learn that a Jew is to never set foot in a church as it is deemed a place of idolatry.

get yourself educated at the very least before jumping into certain conversations. at least then, you wouldn't refer to the Rambam as some "Ancient Jew".

tctrills:
Your point here is that christians should hate Jews because they don't believe in Christian theology?
And you quoted the words of men who lived hundreds of years ago only to show that Christianity and Judaism are 2 different religions with different believes and both don't agree on a number of subjects.
But then you did not quiote from the thousands of passages of scripture where both religions agree. You did not quote from the hundreds of Jews who have said good and positive things about Christianity.

I'd very much like you to point me where I made the point that anyone or even Christians should hate the jews.

you probably mistook my response for something else or failed to read it clearly, and simply jumped into rebuttals.

Read up on the last question I asked him.

something to the effect of "remind me why you support the state of Israel".

helpee:
Now i respect other reasonable muslims on this forum.

Imagine if i ask you wether your ' Q' contains fabrications? Of course I can point out many but that wil be going into the gutter with you.

Learn to be tolerant. Religion is divisive.

I'll give you the benefit of doubt and assume you didn't read up how the conversation started.

And do go about uttering statements Iike "reasonable muslim" just coz your feelings were hurt.

follow the conversation, he clearly laid claim to "Bible" Being the "Word of God", to which I responded with some refutations to that effect.

helpee:
I read the article you wrote above. I won't go into details with you. I am not going into religious bigotry with you.

You seemed to believe anyone that supports Isreal must be a Christian. Does that mean anyone that supports Palestine must be a Muslim? It is obvious you are a muslim,you support Palestinians. You are angry that soneone else supports isreal based on his religious affiliate. How reasonable is that?

We have many christians all over America and Europe supporting Palestinians.

Finally, even in the Bible, the Jews never supported Jesus. There is no where in the bible where it is predicted that Jesus will be widely accepted by the jews. Infact, it is expressly states that a prophet is not appreciated in his home town.

You seem to think that Christians need validation of the jews first before the religion can be valid simply because the religion originated from there.

Only muslims do that.. That is why it is compulsory for you to visit Mecca but it is not same for a Christian.

By and large, religion is personal. Christians are not looking for jewish validation for their religion. Many South Africans are Christians. They support Palestinians.

Many other people support isreal because they believe Palestinians are terrorists and you cant blame them

This is quite hilarious, None of what I wrote was based off of assumptions.

I had confirmations from him about his religion being Christianity.

secondly, I don't have issues with goyim (non-jews - in hebrew) supporting Israel, I just find it ridiculous when Christians support israel especially for religious reasons; understand the distinction.

Righteousness2:
It is very easy to know a confused person.
Ramblings of the confused.

The dau you Encounter JESUS CHRIST, Your eyes of understanding will be open and you will dump nonessentials and live by the Word of GOD, the Bible.

Secondly, do you approve of the Jewish characterization of Jesus, and His Mother as stated in the Gamara (Talmud)?

Righteousness2:
It is very easy to know a confused person.
Ramblings of the confused.

The dau you Encounter JESUS CHRIST, Your eyes of understanding will be open and you will dump nonessentials and live by the Word of GOD, the Bible.

Can you answer the question

Does your Bible contain Fabrications,
"Yes" or "No"?

Righteousness2:
I am not a so called Christian by mere religion or by birth
I am not a so called Christian because I attend church in sundays.
I am not a christian because my name is Paul mary , Elijah, peter or Martha.

By the Grace of GOD, I am a Born-again christian, who Believes and lives by the Word of GOD, the Holy bible.

Speaking of the "Holy bible", what part is the word of GOD?

The Old Testament (Tanakh) or the 27 books of the new testament, all of which Athanasius of Alexandria detailed in his Thirty-Ninth Festal Letter of 367, deeming them as canonical[https://christianhistoryinstitute.org/magazine/article/athanasius-defines-new-testament, https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2806039.htm]?

And futhermore, I'd like to inquire about the "Word of GOD" you boldly lay claim to, if the Bible, which has fabricated verses, notably the

1 John 5:7–8 (Comma Johanneum), which has seen criticisms from the following scholars:

Bruce M. Metzger [a scholar of the New Testament](1914 - 2007)
An eminent modern textual critic, Metzger asserted that the Comma is spurious, unsupported in early Greek manuscripts or patristic citations. He wrote: "That these words are spurious and have no right to stand in the New Testament is certain." - https://choosinghats.org/2010/12/the-comma-johanneum-a-critical-evaluation-of-the-text-of-1-john-5-7-8/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

Daniel B. Wallace [an American professor of New Testament Studies at Dallas Theological Seminary](b. 1952)
Wallace emphasizes that no Greek manuscripts before the 16th century include the text, and it is absent from citations by early Church Fathers—making it a clear interpolation introduced in the Latin tradition.

Not to mention the John 7:53–8:11 (Pericope Adulterae, the woman caught in adultery), which is missing from early Gospel manuscripts like Pᶜ⁶⁶, Pᶜ⁷⁵, Sinaiticus, and Vaticanus.

Is this what you call the "Word of GOD"?

Righteousness2:
I am not a so called Christian by mere religion or by birth
I am not a so called Christian because I attend church in sundays.
I am not a christian because my name is Paul mary , Elijah, peter or Martha.

By the Grace of GOD, I am a Born-again christian, who Believes and lives by the Word of GOD, the Holy bible.

it's even more fascinating how you seem to support the state of israel, more so from a religious point of view.
Given that christianity is considered to be a form of paganism (Avodah Zarah, עֲבוֹדָה זָרָה) due to its "corrupt" Trinitarian beliefs and deification of Jesus (whom you endlessly proclaim to be god, and on that note I'll invite you to study extensively on how Yesh'ua is characterized in Judaism most especially from the Gemara 'Talmud'), according to the Rambam and other Jewish Sages, below are some references.

1. Rabbi Saadia Gaon (882-942 CE)
One of the earliest major Jewish philosophers and Geonim.
In his work "Book of Beliefs and Opinions" (ספר האמונות והדעות), Saadia Gaon criticizes Christian Trinitarian theology and considers the idea of God becoming man to be blasphemous and idolatrous.
Reference: The Book of Beliefs and Opinions, Trans. Samuel Rosenblatt, Yale University Press (1948), especially in the chapters on Unity of God (Oneness).

2. Rabbi Maimonides (Rambam, 1135-1204 CE)
In his halakhic magnum opus, the Mishneh Torah, particularly in the section Hilchot Avodat Kochavim (Laws of Idolatry), Rambam writes that:
"The Christians are idol worshipers, and Sunday is their day of idolatry." - Mishneh Torah, Hilchot Avodat Kochavim 9:4
He also discusses in his Responsa (Teshuvot ha-Rambam) that Christianity is considered idolatry for Jews because of the belief in the divinity of Jesus, the use of graven images, and the Trinity, which contradict the strict monotheism of Judaism.

3. Rabbi Avraham ben HaRambam (c. 1186-1237 CE)
The son of Maimonides.
He followed his father's line of thought and also viewed Christian theology - particularly its anthropomorphism - as a deviation from true monotheism.

4. Rabbi Meir of Rothenburg (1215-1293 CE)
A major Ashkenazi authority during the medieval period.
In his responsa, he clearly defines Christian beliefs as idolatrous, and ruled that Jews must not enter churches due to the presence of icons and statues.
Responsa of Rabbi Meir of Rothenburg, Teshuvot Maharam, siman 193.





Remind me again, why you support the State of Israel?

Righteousness2:
GOD BLESS The Apple of HIS Eyes.

We know the tactics of the haters of GOD'S Chosen nation.
They dont care about the church or anything about it .
They are looking for ways to Deceive those that can be Deceived.

As for me and My Household, we are with ISRAEL Now and Forever.

this "Righteousness" dude, you're quite a fascinating individual.
perhaps I should ask the question: are you a christian?

For the sincere ones.

firstly the hadith provided has the grade: Isnād Hasan (Zubair `Aliza'i).

Secondly, There's an authentic Hadith that shows that Bilāl ibn Rabāḥ(RA) who was a black companion of the Prophetﷺ, is in Jannah:

Sahih al-Bukhari 1149
Narrated Abu Huraira:

At the time of the Fajr prayer the Prophet (ﷺ) asked Bilal, "Tell me of the best deed you did after embracing Islam, for I heard your footsteps in front of me in Paradise." Bilal replied, "I did not do anything worth mentioning except that whenever I performed ablution during the day or night, I prayed after that ablution as much as was written for me."


When it comes to the color of the offspring in the Hadith you provided, it is NOT speaking about the color that comes from GENES inherited from your parents.

When the Messenger of Allah (saw) actually did speak on this subject (color of race) it went a little something this:

Abu Musa al-Ash’ari (May Allah be pleased with him) reported the Messenger of Allah (May peace be upon him) as saying: Allah created Adam from a handful which he took from the whole of the earth; so, the children of Adam are in accordance with the earth: some red, some white, some black, some a mixture, also smooth and rough, bad and good.

From Quran (3:106) Allah says On the Day [of Judgment] when some faces will shine [with happiness] and some faces will be dark [with grief]. And as for those with faces darkened, [they shall be told:] “Did you deny the truth after having attained to faith? Taste, then, this suffering for having denied the truth!”

Allah tells us who will have blackened faces on the day of judgement. It is the one who rejected truth after having faith. So, you see that according to Allah the ones with blackened faces are the ones who fall into this category.

In conclusion, Here's a Hadith Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in as-Saheehah (6/199) which addresses the issue of racism in Islam.

Musnad Ahmad (22978) narrated from Abu Nadrah: Someone who heard the khutbah of the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) on the second of the days of at-Tashreeq told me that he said: “O people, verily your Lord is One and your father is one. Verily there is no superiority of an Arab over a non-Arab or of a non-Arab over an Arab, or of a red man over a black man, or of a black man over a red man, except in terms of taqwa. Have I conveyed the message?” They said: The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) has conveyed the message.

atheistandproud:
See guy, it is not my business whether you buy Xiaomi or not. I couldn't care less. I'm not convincing you to do anything.

But the fact that you're seeking for my opinion, then questioning it over and over, then comparing a 2017 Flagship to a modern Flagship killer offends me. It offend me alot especially after I had told you that it's child's play and gave you a link to see the same phone handling Warzone Mobile which is far superior to CoDM. As though I don't know what I'm talking about.

So I'll not be replying you again after this.

Hey man, do you have any idea or suggestion regarding the feasibility of replacing Google Discover with App Vault on Xiaomi's Redmi?
Apparently, Redmi Users have also been inquiring about this particular subject.
Would appreciate your insight.

After watching an Ad this morning, I literally came over to see if you've done a review on it.
The phone's pretty decent, for Itel's standards.

However, it's still not there yet, it's lacking in some vital areas.

atheistandproud:
I just came back from a two month ban. Honestly I hate NL.

Ban?
What happened?

Your contents are mostly associated with technology at large.

Stellar360:
Well, I have been using a smart 5 for a while, and I wish to upgrade it to something that would suit my needs.

atheistandproud , your response would be appreciated.

Jacku:
just avoid that brand loke a plague

Why is that?

Jacku:
TECNO SPARK 20 is your best bet

I'm not interested in getting a Transsion device.
But thanks for the suggestion.

atheistandproud:
I was talking about your previous phone. What is the name of the specific model?

Well, I have been using a smart 5 for a while, and I wish to upgrade it to something that would suit my needs.

atheistandproud:
Be more specific

I enjoy playing Football and First Person Shooter Games, I also watch movies too.
I like to multi-talk with multiple apps all at once.
I enjoy taking good photographs as well, among others.

atheistandproud:
What's your previous device?

An Infinix Smartphone.

I'm a heavy-user, if that's what you're asking?

Ezeifeduba:
For this budget I'll strictly recommend Spark 20 pro or Spark 20 pro plus, Camon 30, Pova 6

I'm afraid, Transsion devices would not be considered.
Albeit, thanks for the recommendation.

Scientheosopher:
Absolutely!
If you multi-task, go for at least the 6GB RAM variant.

Alright, Noted.

Scientheosopher:
On "... falling of", what atheistandproud meant is that compared to previous Redmi phones of the same series, there hasn't been any significant upgrade in the latest models. For example, Redmi Note 10 vs Redmi Note 11 https://m.gsmarena.com/compare.php3?idPhone1=10247&idPhone2=11336.
This means that if you have a previous model that's still serving you, don't buy a new one because it's not a significant upgrade, if any.

oh, I see.
Would you recommend the Redmi Note 12?

GanagiBitrus:
That budget won't get you Samsung a24.
For good value for money, go for RN12 or add money & buy RN13.

Redmi Note 12 is currently my favorite.
Although I heard it has a shitty camera, but performs exceeding well computational wise, especially at Gaming.

I also came across atheistandproud 's topic on how Redmi has lately been falling off.
Which is why i'm seeking for more insights.

Niel77:
Stellar360

Then go for the A24/25

I heard it's around 270k

Niel77:
Galaxy A3x Series

A34 seems way above my budget

Sirmwill:
Buy that latest Itel

I want to check something 😁

Lol

Hey guys, I am looking to purchase a smartphone, and my budget is currently capped at 200-220k.

I initially took a liking to the samsung a24, although I was deterred by the lack of an ideal body protection (Gorillla).
Lately I've been looking at Redmi Note 12s and 13.

I would appreciate some insights and recommendations from the OGs: [atheistandproud , sunshineV , skywalker240]
Thanks.

Edit: I would like to state that Transsion Smartphones are not up for consideration.

Great job, man.
Your contents are always enlightening.
I would certainly love to see a 'Mid-Range' version of this.

MaxInDHouse:
It's OK.
So can you quote anywhere in your Tanakh where the Israelites God asked them to go and preach to people of other nations?

Please tell me how you got in contact with Jews if you're not one by birth because the only people that came to my house to preach are JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES supposedly obeying the order given by Jesus of Nazareth.

So tell me who preached Judaism to you!

Jews don't go around looking for who to convert.
Still waiting on you to mention the inconsistencies.

MaxInDHouse:
This is the lies Judaists are spreading because they stubbornly refused to believe the Torah!

According to the Torah there are just two prophets sent to establish the two covenants from God: Moses is the first prophet given the supernatural powers to perform SIGNS like a God in their midst {Exodus 7:1} and their God promised to send another prophet from among them who will come in the same manner {Deuteronomy 18:18} and just like Moses this prophet will also serve as God in their midst {Isaiah 9:6} performing great signs to prove his authenticity as the messenger of the new covenant! Malachi 3:1

So why two covenants?

The first covenant was to fulfil what God told Abraham about his descendants being God's people so Moses was the messenger of that covenant to establish it. Exodus 19:5
The second covenant will be to open the way for people of all other nations to benefit from priestly nation (Israel) Zechariah 8:23

The Israelites proved to be unfaithful towards that first covenant {Jeremiah 31:31-33} but God kept His own side of the covenant until the messenger of that second covenant appeared in their midst as Jesus of Nazareth.

This prophet was speaking to them in the name of the same God who established the first covenant with them using the Torah {John 17:6, 26} he made them realize that they don't need to keep malice with nations around them if they must welcome the second covenant {Matthew 5:44-48} otherwise they will not be able to fulfil the assignment given to them as a means of salvation for all other nations! Genesis 12:1-3

The Jews knew very well that Jesus surely proved to be that promised messenger of the new covenant {John 7:31} but the problem they had with him is their malicious intent to avenge all the errors of the surrounding nations most especially the Romans who were forcefully ruling over them. So when Jesus of Nazareth spoke about love for neighbours {Mark 12:31} they specifically wanted to know what he meant by that word "NEIGHBOUR" Luke 10:29

Jesus proved to them that anyone can be their neighbour it depends on how they treat others {Luke 10:30-37} this really got on their nerves because by that time the Jews (three southern tribes of Israel) has harbored resentment against Samaritans (ten Northern tribes of Israel) for centuries. So for Jesus to illustrate that a Samaritan can be their neighbour is something unacceptable to the Jews!

So don't allow them deceive you anymore Jesus never claimed to be their God rather he consistently told them that he was a messenger from their God! John 3:16

I saw their misconstrued rendering of Isaiah 9:6 where they changed the writings from what Isaiah wrote regarding the coming Messiah who will prove to be a wonderful counselor, mighty God, everlasting father and Prince of Peace in their midst. This was a way to divert the attention of interested individuals away from thinking about Jesus being the promised Messiah.

Please when next you find a professed Jews or Judaist ask him or her to quote any verse in the Tanakh where God asked the Jews to go preaching and teaching people of other nations about their Torah.
They have missed the mark!
If they reject Jesus of Nazareth then they have nothing to prove that their God actually sent them to convert people of other nations, Jesus is the one and only connection between them and other nations that's why he commanded the few Jews that accepted him as the promised Messiah saying:

“All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you. And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things" Matthew 28:18-20

The Jews are malicious LIARS all they are doing after rejecting Jesus of Nazareth was to look for support from anyone who will not accept Jesus as the promised Messiah (son of God) that's why they embraced Islam but they short themselves in the foot because Muslims can't reject Jesus completed due to the fact that it's through Jesus' establishment of a group who were preaching and teaching that Muslims got the idea of preaching and teaching to other nations but instead of them to follow Jesus' instructions which says his disciples must be harmless as doves {Matthew 10:16} Muslims kept waging wars against those that resist their politically oriented religion.

I have a lot to tell you but if you want to know more please welcome a free home Bible study with Jehovah's Witnesses. We are not worshiping Jesus rather Jesus is also a worshiper of our God! John 20:17

Thanks, God bless you and may you have PEACE!

Well, I like that you ended your erroneous speculations with "We don't worship Jesus".
I remember asking you to point out the inconsistencies you mentioned in your previous response, which you didn't.
And that means you're telling lies. I'll forgive that. I don't appreciate condescendingly calling people with deferring views and beliefs names, I never called you any since the beginning of our discourse.

Stop quoting the new testaments whose authors aren't known, to prove your point.
And if you say the Torah is corrupted, why have it in your bible?
There's something you still don't get or are choosing not to understand. Jesus was a Jew, He live as one and died as one.

And did you just say the book of isaiah was changed? You must be extremely delusional to even come up with such an absurd claim. I remember posting something about that scripture, and just to be clear that was gotten from the tanakh, where you christians got your old testament from, before the whole translation spree began.

MaxInDHouse:
This is a lie!

Judaism isn't the religion Moses handed over to the Israelites, Jewish returnees from Babylon interpreted what Moses wrote and misconstrued it by mixing it up with Babylonian mythology hence Judaism became a problem even for the Jews themselves.
That's what led to contradictions among those claiming Judaists so that several rival sects emerged with conflicting doctrines.

So by the time Jesus of Nazareth walked the earth the Jews themselves were tired of their religious leaders who were contradicting themselves regarding how to worship their God acceptably.

Ọmọ Christianity started on a clean slate having nothing to do with Judaism but because Jesus and those Judaists were quoting the same books most of you think Christianity stem from Judaism. The only thing there is the Judaists started their religion centuries before Jesus arrived but as for beliefs NO that's what led to his persecution and assassination!

I'd like you to mention a contradiction from the Tanakh (Tanakh is the Hebrew Bible/Scripture) or The 613 MITZVOT.

Also, it appears you're not aware that Jesus lived and died a Jew.
Christianity has always been about the Divinity of Jesus, while exceedingly being influenced The Roman Catholic Mission.
Jews and Muslims Worship One True G-d, and share no further belief in extra doctrines such as the trinity.

[quote author=tctrills post=125359932][/quote]perhaps you think I'm merely casting aspersions.

If Judaism is truly a religion of error, The very religion Jesus was born into, then you are utterly delusional for believing and worshipping someone who lived his whole life a Jew.

Islam and Judaism both have their roots in the faith of Abraham.
Christianity doesn't, it came long after Jesus died.

Christians don't believe in the Old Testament, at least I'm led to believe so.
Because if they remotely do, they'd know their wrongs and turn away from falsehood.
Now, assuming you're an exception, and you do believe in the Old Testament, I encourage you to read Isaiah 43:10.

There G-d spoke directly and in an unambiguous manner, not what you lot do with the New Testament where you making awful inferences Just to prove Jesus' Divinity.