theplanmaker: pls help us advertise the website. it seems u r on a personal vandetta against witnesses. YOU CAN'T FIGHT JEHOVAH

Yes I can't fight jehovah, but I can expose his imposters.

Paradise163: @op if you want to get news about jw go to http://www.jw.org stop following those fake sites

Pleease kindly point out the "fakeness" in any of the sources I've provided.

Or are you saying its fake because it criticizes your religion?

The Jehovah’s Witnesses official web site logo incorporating JW.ORG has been refused registration by the United States Patent and Trademark Office due to similarity to JW PLAYER.

SECTION 2(d) REFUSAL – LIKELIHOOD OF CONFUSION—CLASS 42
For the reasons set forth below, the refusal under Trademark Act Section 2(d) is now made FINAL with respect to U.S. Registration No(s). 4087283. See 15 U.S.C. §1052(d); 37 C.F.R. §2.64(a). This refusal is limited to the Class 42 services in the application.
Applicant’s mark is JW.ORG & Design, for use with, inter alia, Providing a web site that gives computer users the ability to download audio and video recordings, DVDs, music, digital print publications, online publications, documents, forms and web pages all in the field of religion, in Class 42. The cited mark is JW PLAYER, for use with Downloadable computer software for playing, viewing and streaming audio and video files in Class 09.

RELATED DOCUMENTS

Final Outcome – US TRADEMARK APPLICATION NO. 85896124 – JW.ORG – 06420-T0001A – March 12 2014

Original Application by Watch Tower for JW.ORG logo – April 05 2013

Amendment and Mail Process Complete – February 05 2014

Response to Office Action – February 04 2014

Watch Tower removes in-house Attorney and replaces with Commercial Attorney – January 29 2014

JW.ORG generated XSearch Search Summary – July 20 2013

Email from US Patent and Trademark Office to Watch Tower – April 12 2013

 follow link via

http://jwleaks.org/2014/06/19/jw-org-logo-denied-trademark-status-in-the-united-states/

plaetton:

It is because Pentecostal christianity is a pseudo-religion not founded upon, and does not address itself to anything meaningful, except for fraud, pretense and mild insanity.

IF it looks like a duck, quacks looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, then it surely must be a duck.
lol.

You are the least person to respond to that post, please allow christians quote that post.

Apatheist:
He's atheist...

True. I don't see any point in responding to OP.

The situation amongst Jehovah's Witnesses regarding paedophiles is reminiscent of the Catholic Church. Whilst the majority of Witnesses abhor paedophilia and the Watchtower denounces child abuse, archaic and self-serving policies have facilitated this very practice amongst Jehovah's Witnesses. The result has been the Watchtower Society paying millions of dollars in out of court settlements.

The Watchtower Society actively denounces other religions for their stance on pedophiles.

"First accused of gross indecency in 1979, one priest was recently sentenced to four years in prison after pleading guilty to 36 charges! Usually these cases are hushed up, and no significant disciplinary action is taken. Perhaps a priest is transferred to another parish or duty, where the depravity might start again. On this occasion the archbishop was moved to resign after stating: "We are a sinful church. We are naked. Our anger, our pain, our anguish, our shame are clear to the whole world." And even worse, the church hierarchy failed to act decisively. They were accused of being more concerned about the offending priests than about the victims." Awake! 1990 Nov 8 p.31

"Even Churches that condemn immorality have tolerated religious leaders who have sexually abused children." The End of False Religion is Near! (2006) p.2

Whilst firmly against paedophilia, Watchtower policy has facilitated this very practice amongst Jehovah's Witnesses. There have been several reasons that this is the case.

There must be "two witnesses" to establish scriptural crimes
Reproach must not be bought on Jehovah's name
Everyone must engage in preaching
Witnesses are expected to solve problems within the Organization
silentlambs.com lists numerous examples that highlight the extent of child abuse amongst Jehovah's Witnesses. This extends to prominent elders at Bethel, such as Jesus Cano, who was arrested in June 2006. Cano handed out naked pictures of himself to young males at airports whilst travelling on District Convention speaking assignments. (wcbstv.com)

The Watchtower Society has come in for tremendous criticism globally for its stance on paedophilia and been the subject of numerous media reports. The reason for such a widespread problem is compounded by several factors. 

At the heart of the issue is the attitude of the Watchtower towards the wisdom of the world.

"So God has nothing in common with this world. (John 18:36; 1 John 2:15-17) That is why the Bible speaks of two kinds of wisdom-"the wisdom of God" and "the wisdom of the world."" Watchtower 1992 Sep 15 p.19

Fear of bringing reproach on Jehovah's name is used to dissuade use of legal and court systems.

"Loyalty to Jehovah God will also keep us from doing anything that would bring reproach upon his name and Kingdom. For example, two Christians once got into such difficulty with each other that they improperly resorted to a worldly law court. Certainly, the course of loyalty to Jehovah God is to suffer personal loss rather than bring reproach upon Jehovah and his organization." Watchtower 1996 Mar 15 p.15

Witnesses with problems are encouraged to go to the elders and discouraged from going to worldly experts for fear and being influenced by people that do not understand Watchtower principles. Needless to say, elders have no training in issues such as marriage, addictions and child abuse beyond limited information provided by the Watchtower Society. Watchtower policy lags painfully behind child abuse professionals. In the case of child abuse the environment for children to discuss their abuse is generally in a small kingdom hall room in front of 3 male elders. Quite often the child has been expected to face the accused.

Of more damage was that until the mid 1990's Watchtower policy dictated that two witnesses must be present at the same sexual encounter for the perpetrator to be considered to have committed a scriptural offence. In the case of child molestation, there are almost never two witnesses. This meant that even when several children made an accusation against the same brother the elders were to do nothing. Without two witnesses the only time action could be taken was when the accused confessed.

When a serial offender was found to have been a child molester, elders kept information discussed in judicial committees confidential under 'ecclesial privilege'. This included not reporting such matters to the police. Witnesses have regularly been discouraged from going to the police for fear of bringing reproach on Jehovah's name. In legal cases Watchtower lawyers have made the claim that the Bible says elders must keep information they know in regards to crime confidential. This mimics the Catholic ideas on confessionals. 

"Elders in the Christian congregation are responsible to handle violations of divine law, such as stealing, murder, and immorality. But God did not require congregation elders to enforce Caesar's laws and codes. Hence, Paul did not feel compelled to turn over to Roman authorities Onesimus, who was a fugitive under Roman law. (Philemon 10, 15) Of course, if someone flagrantly violates secular law, gaining the reputation of being a lawbreaker, he would not be a good example and might even be disfellowshipped." Watchtower 1986 Oct 1 p.31 

It was not until the late 1990's, and as a result of bad media publicity globally that Watchtower policy changes on child abuse finally started to come into effect. For a person to be considered to have acted inappropriately scripturally collaborative evidence such as photos, or two children making a similar accusation in a short period of time can now be regarded as "two witnesses". 

Elders are now to go to the secular authorities, though still only in States where they are legally required to. Prior to contacting the police elders are expected to seek advice from the Watchtower legal department. The following proviso is stated in an October 10 2002 Confidential "Body of Elders" Letter sent to all elders in Australia;

"If, after contacting the Society, it is determined that the elders should report a matter such as child abuse to the authorities, it would not be considered to be a breach of confidentiality to make such a report. Elders should always contact the Society before providing any information on confidential matters to secular authorities."

In the Watchtower 1997 Jan 1 it became policy that scripturally convicted child molesters were never to hold the position of elders. Yet even if convicted in court, such conviction is not considered valid unless the elders can find the person guilty under 'Scriptural' principles. As such, a convicted paedophile may at times continue to have privileges, such as being an elder.

In 2002 NBC aired on Dateline a program explaining that a householder had no way of knowing if the Witness on their doorstep is a child molester. In May 2002, and only in response to this show the Watchtower has recommended that confessed child molesters not to go preaching house-to-house when alone, though they are still expected to preach with a partner. 

An indication that the main concern of the Watchtower Society has been to avoid legal liability is page 143 of the elder's handbook, Pay Attention To Yourselves and to All the Flock. This page is left blank, with elders filling in dictated notes. In regards to child abuse the following paragraph is scribed. "Child Abuse. Ref Letters: A.B.E Aug 29th 1989 pg 3; LLA 10/10/2002; 28/8/02. Legal ramifications.

In cases of either accusation or allegations of child abuse, immediately contact the society. Do not talk to anyone else.
If a brother or a sister confesses to child abuse, ask them not to speak to anyone else till you get back to them, and contact the society immediately. In contacting the society simply state "Matter involving Child Abuse" and the switchboard will put you through.
If interviewed by the police, tell them you are not prepared to make a statement until you have sought legal advice. Contact society immediately or a local barrister if necessary.
If presented with a search warrant or a subpoena, the last resort is to hand over any material. (Cong file) Find out exactly what is wanted and hand over only that. Preferably seek legal advice first. (stall) Read the warrant. Write on envelope "Ecclesiastical privilege claimed, not to be opened until matter is determined by court."
The Watchtower Society is in damage mode regarding pedophile accusations. The Watchtower Public Relations site jw-media.org (May 26 2007) released the following quote, seemingly as justification for prior indiscretions;

"People didn't have the body of knowledge 18 or 20 years ago to say that this is something that will harm your child emotionally, if you don't address it. Parents didn't know the seriousness ... and the long-term effects." 

Obvious false propaganda, particularly when compared with statements appearing in the Watchtower at least 25 years ago.

"Pedophiles see no harm in "kiddie porn," only because they are blinded by their own lust. But the children used in it are harmed, often ending up peddling sex on the streets and having trouble seeing themselves as desirable in any way other than as a commodity, a sex object with a price tag." Awake! 1982 Jun 22 p.8

2007 Settlements
Highly condemning has been the settlement of 16 child abuse cases in 2007. A number of abuse victims filed court cases against the Watchtower Society through Attorney Kim Norris at Law firm Love & Norris. These were for up to $4 million per victim. Some were regarding Rick McLean, who molested many JW kids over a twenty year period. Many Witness victims went to the elders but no action was taken due to the "two witness" rule. Neither were the authorities contacted. watchtowerdocuments.com contains over 5000 pages of court transcripts regarding this case.

If the Watchtower believed itself innocent they would have welcomed the opportunity to prove in court that their policies were not responsible for hiding pedophiles within congregations. In an indication of guilt the Watchtower Society chose not to allow these cases to go to trial; to do so would have been devastating to their reputation. Rather they have settled out of court with nondisclosure agreements also known as gag orders, which mean the victims receipt of compensation is dependant on them not speaking about the court cases. The settlements have been printed in newspapers around the world.

Due to negative publicity, legal risk and financial ramifications the Watchtower Society is beginning to act on pedophilia. This was not instigated under the guidance of Holy Spirit, but pressure from outside sources. Stubborn adherence to archaic Watchtower tradition rather than common sense has put children at unnecessary risk.

It is common for a Jehovah's Witness to say that this is no longer an issue as it has now been sorted out. But this response begs the question, "If Jehovah was behind the Watchtower Society would he have allowed these atrocities to continue unabated until brought to attention by the world's media?"

Latest Instructions

With ongoing legal and media pressure, the Watchtower has gradually updated its advice regarding child abuse. The 2010 elder's manual, Shepherd the Flock of God, outlines quite extensively how to deal with child abusers. However, it still falls far short of the mark. Elders are now told not to discourage victims from going to the police, but there is no advice to proactively go to police. When elders become aware of situations, there are told to seek advice from Bethel first. The response is usually not to go to the police unless the state requires it. In Australia elders are told not to report cases as it is not a legal requirement.

..

Yooguyz:

What are you saying? How does this relate to the OP?

??

gamesgiven:
Muhammad(pbuh) have died and they'll not Rise again...Believers will meet Him In hereafter...Everything Can die except Allah...Jesus(PBUH) will Come before Judgement Day to End the evil(dajjal) and There'll be peace everywhere.

If you heard two different versions of accounts from a prophet who died and rose again, and from a prophet who is long dead, which would you believe?

CANTICLES: ..... The World Was So Bad In Noahs Day , So D Flood Was Used To Clear Dem All , for our time Am Happy To Tell U Dat Armageddon Is Designed By GOD thru his son Jesus to clear d wicked beings of dis system of things .... It will cleanse d earth for the promised " new earth" 1 pet 3:13 where righteousness will prevail , bro " the righteous shall possess d earth, and dey shall live foreva on it" psalm 37:9-11 , matt 5:5 ! Will u be there?

You didn't answer my question neither did you address it.

CANTICLES: I Also Smiled When Some Preachers Teach Pple Dat God Is So Merciless And Worst Dan Hitler Bcoz He Will Burn Pple In A Lake Of Fire ........ No Human As Wicked As Our Nature Is, Can Throw His Children In An Incinerator For Stealing, Can U? U Cant Bcoz God Create Us In His Fine Image ! Dat Makes Us Ask, What Den Is D Meaning Of D Lake Of Fire In Revelation ? The Bible Itself Explains dat revelation is written in symbols or signs ( rev 1:1) concerning the symbol lake of fire, bible said " This means the second DEATH" REV 20:14 .... To show further dat its plainly symbolic, Death was said to be thrown into it ( rev 20:14) its clear dat death cannot be literally burned , an angel also explain d meaning of d torments to apostle John In Rev 18: 9,10 And He Explained It Dat Such Ones Will Cease To Exist As If Thrown Into D Sea ( Rev 18:21) ! So Also Death Will Cease To Exist As If Thrown Into D Sea ( Rev 21:4) ! It Symbolize Eternal Death Or Destruction ! " The Wages Of Sin Is Death"rom6:23, Gen3:19, Gen 2:17

Which is more worse?
God burning unrepentant sinners in hell

Or

God killing billions of people in armaggedon, most of whom haven't heard Jehovahs witnesses teaching?

Image123: i'm wondering why windowsx or what's the name is following Gnoni, trustm and candor. Not to mention that he just opened this new account yesterday and is dedicated to one goal. Are you not one hell of a suspect? As a christian, have you taken anytime no matter how little to pray or do anything christian for this couple than to glory in others' trials?

I smell Drummaboy.

What do the critics have to say about the New World Translation Of The Holy Scriptures?

Edmund C. Gruss, Professor of History and Apologetics at Los Angeles Baptist College, offers five main criticisms of the book: 20 a) The use of paraphrasing in contradiction to the stated purpose. b) The unwarranted insertion of words not found in the Greek. Alexander Thomson makes a similar comment in a statement quoted earlier. c) Erroneous rendering of Greek words. d) Deceptive and misleading footnotes and appendix. e) Arbitrary use and misuse of capitals when dealing with the divine name. (For details of criticisms see footnote 20.) Gruss concludes that the New World Translation Of The Christian Greek Scriptures, "although outwardly scholarly, is plainly in many cases, just the opposite. Its purpose is to bring the errors of the Witnesses into the Word of God. This translation carries no authority except to its originators and their faithful followers, and should be rejected as a perversion of the Word of God." 21

Ray C. Stedman (internationally known author, Bible teacher, pastor, evangelist)

"A close examination, which gets beneath the outward veneer of scholarship, reveals a veritable shambles of bigotry, prejudice, and bias which violates every rule of Biblical criticism and every standard of scholarly integrity." 22

Walter Martin and Norman Klann (The late Dr. Martin was a leading Christian apologist, known internationally for his studies of the Jehovah's Witnesses and other groups.)

"Once it is perceived that Jehovah's Witnesses are only interested in what they can make the scriptures say, and not in what the Holy Spirit has already perfectly revealed, then the careful student will reject entirely Jehovah's Witnesses and the Watchtower translation." 23

These authors claim that the New World Translation lacks scholarship, and, in fact, reflects scholastic dishonesty.

Anthony Hoekema:

"Their New World Translation of the Bible is by no means an objective rendering of the sacred text into modern English, but is a biased translation in which many of the peculiar teachings of the Watchtower Society are smuggled into the text of the Bible itself." 24

Dr. Hoekema was Professor of Systematic Theology, Calvin Theological Seminary, Grand Rapids, U.S.A., and the author of one of the most highly regarded reference works on the Jehovah's Witnesses.

F. F. Bruce: (Dr. Bruce is Professor of Biblical Criticism and Exegesis Emeritus, University of Manchester, England. He is a world renowned Biblical exegete who has issued his own translation of the the New Testament, and a number of scholarly works on New Testament themes. The Jehovah's Witnesses have quoted him as an authority on the New Testament on a number of occasions.)

"Some of its distinctive renderings reflect the Biblical interpretations which we have come to associate with Jehovah's Witnesses....Some of the renderings which are free from a theological tendency strike one as quite good..." 25

Bruce M. Metzger, Professor of New Testament Language and Literature at Princeton Theological Seminary, one of the world's leading authorities on the Greek language, and recognized as such by the Jehovah's Witnesses who quote him on occasion in a favorable way, wrote an article in 1950 pointing out the errors in many Christological passages in the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures. 26

H. H. Rowley, an eminent Old Testament scholar from England, wrote regarding the first volume of the New World Translation Of The Hebrew Scriptures. His comments should be compared to those of Dr. Goodspeed quoted earlier:

"The translation is marked by a wooden literalism which will only exasperate any intelligent reader -if such it finds -and instead of showing reverence for the Bible which the trans lators profess, it is an insult to the Word of God.... "...this volume is a shining example of how the Bible should not be translated." 27

The comments quoted above are but a sample of the many that have been written over the years. Many more are available in reference to specific details of the translation, especially the translation "...and the Word was a god." which appears in John 1:1c in the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures. Space precludes their inclusion in this paper.

Brother Goshen is back.

Mynd44:

Thanks a million you are the best

WinsomeX:

Enough threads have been opened on Nairaland discussing their doctrine; I need not add to it. The purpose of this thread is well dictated in the OP. But the doctrine that permits men to behave like devils is a doctrine of demons.

I was hoping I would find a CEC member to come and prove me wrong. I accept their silence as proof of culpability. If however you have something to say in that regard, I am listening. What you have said so far is not compatible with reason.

Am not a CEC member, neither do I support immoral behaviour, but if you are expecting CEC members to change their doctrinal stance because of the scandal ( that is if its true), you may be expecting too much. They would just dissociate his persona from his doctrine, and then the argument goes on.

If my request is not attended to before tomorrow morning, am afraid I would take my complaint to the administrator of this site.


On a second thought am begining to have suspicions that the Mods may be biased in their work




Re: Religion Complaints Thread (sticky) by Yooguyz(m): 9:05am On Aug 12
Mods why was my thread removed?

https://www.nairaland.com/1853481/jehovahs-witnesses-link-occultism-exposed#25408100
(Modify) (Quote) (Report)
Until you need a miracle, you'll never believe in miracles.

Re: Religion Complaints Thread (sticky) by Mynd44: 10:53am On Aug 12

Yooguyz: : Mods why was my thread removed?

https://www.nairaland.com/1853481/jehovahs-witnesses-link-occultism-exposed#25408100

It violates our rules on religious tolerance. Go preach your hate somewhere else sir.
(Quote) (Report) 3 Likes (Like) (Share)
Do not die for Nigeria. Go to Atan Cemetery, Yaba, Lagos, check the ECOMONG section then compare to Arlington

Re: Religion Complaints Thread (sticky) by sonOfLucifer: 11:20am On Aug 12
Hoohoo, big summer blowout.
(Quote) (Report) (Like) (Share)
Great Lucifer, Unholy of the Holies, have mercy on thy children

Re: Religion Complaints Thread (sticky) by Yooguyz(m): 1:52pm On Aug 12

Mynd44: :
It violates our rules on religious tolerance. Go preach your hate somewhere else sir

.

Please can you kindly point out the hate in the thread?
I opened a similar thread this year and it was not hidden. Though it wipped off when nairaland was hacked.

Or is one not allowed to expose hypocrisy or are you a Jehovah's Witness?

*edited*

Oh the thread was even opened last year
https://www.nairaland.com/1571918/watchtower-links-occultism-exposed-hardcore

So can you explain to me your real motive for hidding the thread?
(Modify) (Quote) (Report)
Until you need a miracle, you'll never believe in miracles.

https://www.nairaland.com/1447917/religion-complaints-thread-sticky/94

Please prove to me that my suspisions are wrong.

feedthenation: At OP,

Homosexuality is a sin like any other sin mentioned in the bible, it is a perverted lifestyle.


1 Cor 6:9-10:
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality;
10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Rom 1:26-27:
26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature;
27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

Even without using bible passages as reference, it is still a lifestyle that is unnatural to the human existence.

Read the OP well, you are basicly saying the same thing it said.

^^^ when you are ready to accept my marriage proposal, reply me.

WinsomeX:

Both.

The alleged incidence, adultery, that can lead to divorce is enough grounds for CEC people to question the doctrines they've believed all their lives.

Do you have any answers?

As par doctrine, why not open a new thread on any of her doctrine that borders you. Oyakhilome commited adultery or not, does not change the gospel truth. The only thing we should be concerned about is if his teachings are bible based.

Mods I would like to know why nothing has been done about these topics which clearly violates rules 2 and 8 of nairaland?

https://www.nairaland.com/1882500/gay-pastor-yooguyz-claims-miracle

https://www.nairaland.com/1881512/controversial-gay-pastor-yooguyz-fails

https://www.nairaland.com/1877993/yooguyz-confirm-atheist-status-n

Thanks in anticipation of your response.

Happy new month.

WinsomeX: Are the questions asked too difficult to answer?

This Oyhakilome quagmire is a blessing to Christ Embassy. It is opportunity for their members to think through the doctrines of that church.

I am still waiting...

Are you opening this thread to ask opinions of Oyaks divorce or you are trying to question the church doctrine?

Emusan:

Why attacking Yooguyz and not the OP?

Truthislight/loveroftruth/Bernimore/Barristers/........? Is undergoing the climax of his watchtower withdrawal stage. He is experiencing an inner struggle between what watchtower told him and the truth, and it so unfortunately turns out the messenger is the target and not the message.

Its just a matter of time he'll get over it.

1. The Holy Spirit wages war with Christians’ sinful human nature. Paul writes, "For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other." (Gal. 5:17) Ask the Lord to help you fight the good fight of faith in overcoming your sinful desires that oppose God’s purposes, plans and priorities.

2. The Holy Spirit helps us equip ourselves with all of the spiritual weapons of war. Paul writes, "Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms." (Eph. 6:11,12) Ask the Lord to let the Spirit guide you in strengthening, replenishing, or fortifying any aspect of your spiritual armament so you are not vulnerable in any area.

3. The Holy Spirit teaches us the truth that we need to be protected from any false accusations or insinuations. Paul wrote, "Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist." (Eph. 6:14) Truth is essential if we are going to be exposed to all kinds of attacks from the world, the flesh and the devil. Many criticisms will be hurled at forward moving Christians who are engaged in ministries that are advancing the kingdom of God and His righteousness. Ask the Lord to help you let the word of Christ dwell in you richly so that you do not entertain any doubts, fears or insecurities about God’s promises.

4. The Holy Spirit imputes Christ’s righteousness to us and assures us with the righteousness we acquire through His fruits. Paul writes, "With the breastplate of righteousness in place." (Eph. 6:14b) Ask the Lord to help you be more thankful for all aspects of His imputed righteousness and seek to live a more holy life that is evidenced by the Spirit’s fruits

Daniel's Prophetic Days

Scripture
Daniel 12:7 Rev. 11:3-

Prophecy
61260 days538 A.D. - 1799 A.D.

Original interpretation
The period of Papal rule1914 - 1918

Current interpretation
Rutherford's imprisonment

Scripture
Daniel 12:11

Prophecy
1290 days538 A.D. - 1829 A.D.

Original interpretation
Start of Papal rule to start of Miller movement1918 - 1922

Current interpretation
Formation of League of Nations to the Cedar Point Convention

Scripture
Daniel 12:12

Prophecy
1335 days539 A.D. - 1874 A.D,

Original interpretation
Start of Papal rule to the Lord's second presence1922 - 1926

Current interpretation
Cedar Point Convention to the English Convention

Scripture
Daniel 8:14

Prophecy
2300 days 454 B.C. - 1846 A.D.

Original interpretation
Rebuilding of the temple to modern cleansing of the sanctuary1938 - 1944

Current interpretation
Reinvigoration of theocratic order after World War II


Scipture
Daniel

Prophecy
42520 days - 7 times

Original interpretation
End of the Last Days

Current interpretation
Beginning of the Last Days

A number of the prophetic interpretations for Daniel show another classic struggle of attempting to find a modern day fulfilment that does not exist, resulting in contradiction, changes, inconsistencies and little hint of divine guidance. The current understanding is often quite amusing. The prophecies discussed here are;

1260 days
1290 days
1335 days
2300 days
2520 days - Seven Times

During the 1800's Russell taught that the 1260, 1290 and 1335 days all started at the beginning of papal rule in 539 A.D. With 539, 1799 and 1874 no longer being considered relevant the explanation for these prophecies also have changed.

1260 days

At Daniel 12:7 and Revelation 11:3-6 it discusses a period of 3 ½ years, or 1260 days. During the 1800's the Watchtower claimed this was prophetic of 1260 years. Now it is said to be a period of days that roughly correspond to 1260 literal days. There have been at least 11 changes, spanning 9 different periods of time.

1260 Days

Source
1.Zion’s Watch Tower Apr 1880

Begins
538 AD

Ends
1798 AD

Source
2.Zion’s Watch Tower 1898

Begins
Sep 1 and 15539AD

Ends
1799 AD

Source
3.Zion’s Watch Tower 1915

Aug 1325 AD or 539 AD1585 AD or 1799 AD

Source
4.Watchtower 1929 Dec 15

Begins
1 Oct 1914

Ends
1 Apr 1918


Source
5.Light 1 (1930)

Begins
7 Nov 1914

Ends
7 May 1918

Source
6.Watchtower 1951

Begins
1 Oct 1914

Ends
1 Apr 1918

Source
7.Finished Mystery (1969)

Begins
4 Oct 1914

Ends
26 Mar 1918

Source
8.Incoming World Government (1977)

Begins
28 Dec 1914

Ends
21 Jun 1918

Source
9.Revelation Climax (1988)

Begins
28 Jul 1914

Ends
Early 1918


Source
10.Watchtower 1993 Nov 1 pp.9-10

Begins
Dec 1914

Ends
21 June 1918

Source
11.Kingdom Ministry Sep 2006

Begins
Dec 1914

Ends
Jun 1918

Source
12.Watchtower 2014 Nov 15 p.30

Begins
1914

Ends
early 1919 (1260 days plus 3 1/2 days included)


As the 1260 days do not line up exactly with any relevant, literal time period of importance to the Watchtower, numerous adjustments have been made; none compelling, most not even 1260 days. These have related to:

>Papal Rule
>World War One
>The End of the Gentile Times
>The arrest of Rutherford
>The sentencing of Rutherford

1800's

Originally, the Watchtower used the principal of "a day for a year" to conclude the 1260 days were representative of 1260 years. The 1260 days were explained to be a 1260 year period of power for the Papal Church. At first this was 538 A.D. - 1798 A.D. states:

"If a prophecy clearly belongs to a certain power, and its measure is given in "days," and yet it required just that many years to fulfill it, we are clearly justified in understanding a "day" in that case, to symbolize a year. And that the people of Rome and Italy acknowledged and submitted to the supremacy of the papal church, from A. D. 538 to 1798, is clearly supported by the facts of history." Three Worlds (1877) p.112

"The prophecy, both in Daniel and Revelation, demands that this power should continue to hold, "times and laws," 1260 days, or a "time, times, and half a time," or "forty-two months;" all of which are used in Rev. 12: and 13:, as one and the same. In 1798 the time expired, the 1260 years were ended." Ibid p.114

"The exact day on which that 1260 year period ended, was February 15th, 1798. That was the day the papal civil power ended, and the republic was declared from the capitol in Rome." Ibid p.117
(See also Zion's Watch Tower 1881 Dec p.7)

When Russell realised that papal rule started in 539 A.D., he adjusted the period to 539 A.D. - 1799 A.D., despite this conflicting with his previous statements that Papal rule ended in 1798.

"Literally in the three and one half years in Elijah's day in which there was no rain (James 5:17) and spiritually in the three and one half times, or 1260 years, from A. D. 539 to 1799 in which the showers of blessing were withheld from the world" Studies in the Scriptures VII - Finished Mystery p.173

1900's

In the 1900's, the 1260 days were changed from prophetic years to literal days.

In 1930, Light I explained the 1260 days extended from the November 7 1914 release of a specific Watch Tower article, to the May 7th 1918 date of issue of an arrest order on Rutherford and the Watchtower board members. This is a period of 1277 days.

"The article published in the November 1 issue of The Watch Tower would be in the hands of its readers by the end of the first week or about the seventh day of November, 1914. Forty-two months of thirty days each, or 1260 days, which is equivalent to three and one-half years solar time, beginning the first week in November, to wit, November 7, 1914, would end on the 7th day of May, 1918. Exactly forty-two months after the publication of the forementioned "sackcloth" article in The Watch Tower, to wit, on the 7th day of May, 1918, all the officers of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, and who were then the publishers of The Watch Tower, were "overcome", in this, that they were arrested under warrant charging a violation of the espionage law and trading with the enemy, and their work stopped." Light I pp.198,199

In 1969, the start of the 1260 days was changed to extend from the end of Gentile Times (October 4th 1914) to the memorial of March 26th 1918. (See Then is Finished the Mystery of God, pp.261-263) This is a period of 1269 days.

In 1977, the start of the 1260 days was changed to Dec 28th 1914, ending June 21st 1918. December 28th was an arbitrary date, supposedly representing the period from when the Bible Students expected to be persecuted, until Rutherford's prison sentencing. This is a period of 1271 days.

"The "finishing of the dashing of the power of the holy people to pieces" evidently occurred on June 21, 1918. On that day the American federal court sentenced the president and the secretary-treasurer of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society and five of their headquarters associates to long prison terms, amounting to a total of 140 years. Well, June 21, 1918, fell, according to the Biblical lunar calendar, on Tammuz 11, 1918. Three lunar years back from that, or Tammuz 11, 1915, fell on June 23, 1915. Then the half of a lunar year, or six lunar months, back from that would be Tebeth 11, 1914, which coincided with December 28, 1914. That date, December 28, 1914, was very appropriate. During the year from early in January the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society had been showing the famous Photo-Drama of Creation." Our Incoming World Government - God's Kingdom pp.128-129

In 1988, the Revelation book went back to the 1969 interpretation.

"Additionally, at the beginning of the Lord's day, there was a marked period of three and a half years when the hard experiences of God's people matched the events prophesied here-starting from the outbreak of the first world war in the latter part of 1914 and continuing to the early part of 1918." Revelation - It's Great Climax is at Hand! p.164

In 1993, the Watchtower returned to the 1977 interpretation.

"Since January 1914 they had been showing the Photo-Drama of Creation, a Biblical presentation that drew attention to Daniel's prophecies. In the summer of that year in the Northern Hemisphere, war broke out. In October, the appointed times ended. By the end of the year, the anointed remnant were expecting persecution, as seen from the fact that the year text chosen for 1915 was Jesus' question to his disciples, "Are ye able to drink of my cup?" based on Matthew 20:22, King James Version. Hence, from December 1914, this small band of witnesses 'preached in sackcloth,' humbly enduring as they announced Jehovah's judgments. Finally, on June 21, 1918, J. F. Rutherford, the new president, together with the directors of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, was sentenced on false charges to a long term in prison. Thus, at the end of the prophetic period, the "little horn" killed the organized public preaching work." Watchtower 1993 Nov 1 pp.9-10

In 2007, Jehovah's Witnesses once more reviewed the 1993 Revelation book at their Book Study. The September 2006 Kingdom Ministry insert made the following change regarding the 1260 days. The period of December 1914 to Jun 21st 1918 could be anywhere between 1268 and 1298 days.



Amusingly, a Witness will consider this "new light", when in actual fact it was old light from 1977, re-replacing incorrect new light.

It is interesting that from December 28th to June 21st is not 1260 days, but 1271 days. Additionally, why start December 1914? World War 1 started in August and the Gentile times apparently ended in October. The Watchtower simply decided the event of June 21st 1918 to have been an auspicious date, worthy of prophecy, and then counted back roughly 1260 solar days to a non-eventful month in 1914. In fact, counting back 1260 days from June 21 1918 arrives at January 8th 1915. However, the Watchtower has no interest in 1915 and a significant amount in 1914. If the 1260 days are to be taken as a literal prophecy, it would make sense that they relate exactly to a 1260 day period. Each of the Watchtower interpretations are irrelevant and poorly contrived.

From 2013, 1918 seemed to be phased out.

"Footnote to Paragraph 6: This is an adjustment in understanding. Previously, we thought that Jesus’ inspection took place in 1918." (Watchtower 2013 Jul 15 p.11)

This removes some of the meaning of the 1260 days, as the 1260 days is now conjoined with the 3 1/2 days to arrive at 1919.

"How long did this inspection and cleansing take place. It extended from 1914 to the early part of 1919. This period of time includes both the 1,260 days (42 months) and the symbolic three and a half days referred to in Revelation chapter 11." Watchtower 2014 Nov 15 p.30

The timeline provides no specific start and end date for the 1260 days, removing the ability to identify that the numbers to not add up.

Note: The 1260 days of Revelation 11:3 are not to be confused with the 1260 days of Revelation 12:6. This second period is described as "extending in the Northern Hemisphere from the spring of 1919 to the autumn of 1922. This was a period of refreshing recuperation and reorganization for the restored John class." Revelation - It's Great Climax is at Hand! p.184

Michael the Archangel is described in Daniel 10:13 as "Mi´cha·el, one of the foremost princes" and at Revelation 12:7 it says " Mi´cha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled." In the fifty years between 1880 and 1930 there were five changes as to who Michael was.

1. An Angel that worships Jesus

"Hence it is said, "Let all the angels of God worship him;" [that must include Michael, the chief angel, hence Michael is not the Son of God] and the reason is, because He has "by inheritance obtained a more excellent Name than they."" Zion's Watch Tower 1879 Nov p.4

2. The Pope and Antichrist

"Michael and his angels"--the papacy and its supporters--fought against the dragon--pagan rulers, etc.,-- and the great dragon was cast out of heaven. Zion's Watch Tower 1879 December p.6

3. Michael was the pre-human Jesus Christ

"Can it be that he who was called Michael--Jehovah's chief-messenger--was none other than our Lord in his pre-human condition? we conclude that HE must have been "chief messenger." " Zion's Watch Tower 1883 June p.3

4. The Pope again

"Michael.--- "Who as God," the Pope." The Finished Mystery 1917 p.188

5. Jesus in heaven

Since the 1930's Michael is explained to be the heavenly name for Jesus.

"For many years Jehovah's Witnesses have taught that Michael is a heavenly name for the only-begotten Son of God, who was named Jesus while on earth." Watchtower 1984 December 15 p.26

The Governing Body of the Watchtower Society demonstrate that they have no idea as to how to interpret Revelation.

Revelation 8:10-11
"And the third angel blew his trumpet. And a great star burning as a lamp fell from heaven, and it fell upon a third of the rivers and upon the fountains of waters. 11[b] And the name of the star is called Wormwood. And a third of the waters turned into wormwood,[/b] and many of the men died from the waters, because these had been made bitter."

There have been three different versions of "God given light" regarding wormwood in Watchtower publications so far:

1. Calvin

"Calvin is entitled to the honor of having at one time been a papal star .... Is called Wormwood. -- What an ideal name for the doctrine which has caused more bitterness against God than any other doctrine ever taught, and for the man who roasted Servetus at the stake" Studies in the Scriptures Series VII- The Finished Mystery p.151

2. Satan

"The 'great star' falling from heaven as a burning lamp was Satan .... The name of this star is called 'Wormwood', which means bitter. Being cast out of heaven Satan is in the 'gall of bitterness'" Light I pp.126, 127

3. Clergy of Christedom

"In view of these features about it. what religious class of people could this blazing, falling 'great star' picture but the apostate Christian clergy of Christendom, Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant and otherwise sectarian? . . . But what should have been spiritual 'water' to sustain the spiritual life of the peoples, the apostate Christian clergy have turned into undrinkable, deadly, bitter wormwood waters false, pagan, unchristian, unbiblical doctrines" Then is Finished the Mystery of God pp.224,225

honeychild: yooguyz d homosexual pastor ! You have not yet tire?!

You that used church funds to rent hotel room in South Africa so you can have homosexual affairs with a fellow pastor?

Is it because you haven't been taken to court for misappropriation of funds?!

Hafa na loooong time! Haw ya side?

My marriage proposal of that day still stands oh

Quickly accept it before I change my mind.
Am just doing it to help single desperate old ladies like you. Since husband scarce for ya side

HezronLorraine: Yes bro,you definitely are right.

Yup

theplanmaker:



Is he still serving as an elder? do you even know if he has been disfellowshiped? Jehovah's witnesses are not perfect people, we do have serious sinners like this, but there is something we do to them, its called "disfellowship" . that is why the congregation will never shield a wrongdoer. I'm sure you already know that. Jw have high moral biblical standards that they live by, and are knwn for. that is why a case like this is sensational

but then, you can go on hating....

Am sure he has been disfellowshiped, but the point am trying to make this thread is, there is no such thing as a perfect Christian leader. Like I said earlier JW's are quick to use things like this to generalize and categorize other christian groups as false religion.

theplanmaker: how is Watsonville congregation involved in the fraud?
op, I don't know what your intentions are, but if you are trying to malign Jehovah's witnesses, this is a very weak attempt. A member of a congregation commited fraud, and you had to indict the entire congregation of Jehovah's witnesses?

He was an Elder for crying out loud! Who defrauded his own congregation. JW's are always quick to point out stuffs like this in other christian groups as signs of a false religion when in fact they are not different from the "false religions"