RikoduoSennin:


If you really mean it then.

Isaiah 9:6 "... his name will be called wonderful counsellor, MIGHTY GOD, EVERLASTING FATHER...."

Yes, this scripture relates to Jesus ( a child is born) and he is a mighty God "but it did not say Almighty God". Note that difference. Before you say Jesus is the Same as the one Called "The Father" , Note Everything Jesus said about the Father from Matthew to John.

Romans 9:5 "to them belong the Patriach and of their race, according to the flesh, is the christ[b].[/b] God who is over all be blessed for Ever. Amen. "

I don't know your intentions for quoting this scripture, but don't tell me you did not notice the FULL STOP sign between the word "Christ" and "God". That is not a coma, mind you. Q: So what do will use full stop sign for? A: to seperate two sentence/ thoughts/ ideas.

Yes Jesus is a Mighty God but he is not God the Almighty/Jehovah, if you claim to believe in Jesus then also believe him when he said "he has a God he answers to- John 20:17).

Q: How does a God have a God?
IF Jesus has a GOD (Jehovah) what does that say about him?
Where in the bible is the Holy spirit called a god or God or even equated to God?

winner01:
www.nairaland.com/1939388/man-trinity-god-trinity-created#26990237

RikoduoSennin:


Why do you refer me to your half baked thread. It does not relate to my previous post rather it points to other flaws in your argument.

The RCC did not want the bible to be translated in common languages and widely distributed to common folks because they want to hold people in false teachings. Seeing intelligent people to still falling prey is so sad.

Tell me, Thomas called Jesus God, yes that you believe very easily because it suits you. Good, you claim to be a christian- which means follow of christ not Thomas (Jesus' words have more weight/authority than thomas).

Now Tell me, John 20:17 - Jesus called someone his God (Mind you than is not the only place he mentioned having a God). In what way did Jesus have a God?. What is the name/identity of the one Jesus called his God?. In Thomas' God-Jesus has a God whom he answers to, Who then is the ALMIGHTY GOD (Note: that title cannot be held by two equal beings- reason "ALL".

Your God- Jesus is under someone- My God-Jehovah. So my God is superior to yours.

How many Holy spirit are there? Luke 11:13 " if ye then being evil know how to give good gifts unto your children:how much more shall YOUR HEAVENLY FATHER GIVE the HOLY SPIRIT to them that ask him?"

So if 1 million christians ask the Father for Holy spirit and as a loving Father he gives all of them just like he gave 120 at the penticost 33CE, how many holy spirit are their? Holy many God are there?

There are Gods, but to us there is only one true one, the Almighty.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your logic, we are made in God's image : Spirit, body and Soul.

I tell you, human can not leave without their spirit/soul seperate from them, but apperently your 3 in 1 God can: yet we made in his image.

RikoduoSennin:


Why do you refer me to your half baked thread. It does not relate to my previous post rather it points to other flaws in your argument.

The RCC did not want the bible to be translated in common languages and widely distributed to common folks because they want to hold people in false teachings. Seeing intelligent people to still falling prey is so sad.

Tell me, Thomas called Jesus God, yes that you believe very easily because it suits you. Good, you claim to be a christian- which means follow of christ not Thomas (Jesus' words have more weight/authority than thomas).

Now Tell me, John 20:17 - Jesus called someone his God (Mind you than is not the only place he mentioned having a God). In what way did Jesus have a God?. What is the name/identity of the one Jesus called his God?. In Thomas' God-Jesus has a God whom he answers to, Who then is the ALMIGHTY GOD (Note: that title cannot be held by two equal beings- reason "ALL".

Your God- Jesus is under someone- My God-Jehovah. So my God is superior to yours.

How many Holy spirit are there? Luke 11:13 " if ye then being evil know how to give good gifts unto your children:how much more shall YOUR HEAVENLY FATHER GIVE the HOLY SPIRIT to them that ask him?"

So if 1 million christians ask the Father for Holy spirit and as a loving Father he gives all of them just like he gave 120 at the penticost 33CE, how many holy spirit are their? Holy many God are there?

There are Gods, but to us there is only one true one, the Almighty.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your logic, we are made in God's image : Spirit, body and Soul.

I tell you, human can not leave without their spirit/soul seperate from them, but apperently your 3 in 1 God can: yet we made in his image.

RikoduoSennin:


Why do you refer me to your half baked thread. It does not relate to my previous post rather it points to other flaws in your argument.

The RCC did not want the bible to be translated in common languages and widely distributed to common folks because they want to hold people in false teachings. Seeing intelligent people to still falling prey is so sad.

Tell me, Thomas called Jesus God, yes that you believe very easily because it suits you. Good, you claim to be a christian- which means follow of christ not Thomas (Jesus' words have more weight/authority than thomas).

Now Tell me, John 20:17 - Jesus called someone his God (Mind you than is not the only place he mentioned having a God). In what way did Jesus have a God?. What is the name/identity of the one Jesus called his God?. In Thomas' God-Jesus has a God whom he answers to, Who then is the ALMIGHTY GOD (Note: that title cannot be held by two equal beings- reason "ALL".

Your God- Jesus is under someone- My God-Jehovah. So my God is superior to yours.

How many Holy spirit are there? Luke 11:13 " if ye then being evil know how to give good gifts unto your children:how much more shall YOUR HEAVENLY FATHER GIVE the HOLY SPIRIT to them that ask him?"

So if 1 million christians ask the Father for Holy spirit and as a loving Father he gives all of them just like he gave 120 at the penticost 33CE, how many holy spirit are their? Holy many God are there?

There are Gods, but to us there is only one true one, the Almighty.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your logic, we are made in God's image : Spirit, body and Soul.

I tell you, human can not leave without their spirit/soul seperate from them, but apperently your 3 in 1 God can: yet we made in his image.

winner01:


There are several biblical scriptures pointing to this truth in the article I referred you to, even the Almighty God said this of the Son

Hebrews 1:8
But about the Son he
says, "Your throne, O
God, will last for ever
and ever; a scepter of
justice will be the
scepter of your
kingdom.

.

winner01:
And concerning the issue of the spirit, soul and body...I doubt you are a christian, if you are then you would know that those three forms can exist independently, at least on the subject of life after death.,maybe you should just read the article again, this time with open mindedness, God bless

RikoduoSennin:


In your hurry to prove yourself you forgot verse 9: "You have loved righteousness and hated iniquity; THEREFORE GOD, EVEN YOUR GOD has anionted you with the oil of gladness ABOVE YOUR PARTNERS/FELLOWS".

Please interpret that for me.

RikoduoSennin:


Not all christian believe what you believe. Prove to me from the Bible that the Body, Spirit and Soul can exist independently from one another. Note: Body without spirit is dead, both need each other for the being to be called a living soul.

winner01:

Hebrews chapter1
Verse1. God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake
in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom
he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he
made the worlds;

winner01:

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express
image of his person, and upholding all things by the word
of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins,
sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

winner01:

4[b] Being made[/b] so much better than the angels, as he hath
by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than
they.

winner01:

5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou
art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I
will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

winner01:

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the
world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels
spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

winner01:

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever
and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy
kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity;
therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the
oil of gladness above thy fellows

winner01:

Of course, Jesus called God the Father GOD in several scriptures in the bible, God the Father also calls Jesus Christ God as we can see here.....
.

winner01:


Ecclesiastes 12:7 - Then shall the dust return to the earth
as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. Note; the spirit returns

winner01:

Genesis 2:7 - And the LORD God formed man [of] the dust
of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of
life; and man became a living soul. Note: God gave the form of man a soul

winner01:

Matthew 16:26 - For what is a man profited, if he shall
gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall
a man give in exchange for his soul?

winner01:

Genesis 1:27 - So God created man in his [own] image, in
the image of God created he him; male and female
created he them. Note of course: Gods image

winner01:

Genesis 1:26-27 - And God said, Let us make man in our
image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion
over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and
over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every
creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

winner01:

John 14:1-3 - Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in
God, believe also in me.

winner01:

Genesis 3:19 - In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat
bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast
thou taken: for dust thou [art], and unto dust shalt thou
return. Note where the body returns to

winner01:

Revelation 6:9-11 - And when he had opened the fifth
seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were
slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which
they held, Note : souls were seen

winner01:

Luke 1:46-47 - And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the
Lord, my spirit rejoices in God my saviour. Note: her soul magnifies, her spirit rejoices

winner01:

The independent existence of the body, soul and spirit must be understood else, life after death makes no sense...God bless

RikoduoSennin:


God spoke Through "the Prophets" just like he spoke through "the son", proving the Son is not the Same as God Almighty, he his just a servant like "the Prophet" with a Special position - God's only begotten son.

See the bolded section: Jesus was appointed heir to God, just like a human Father does through his Last will and testament.

"BY WHOM ALSO he made the worlds"- Jesus his the architect God used to make the world.



Note the bolded section, Jesus is the "express IMAGE of God", not the Almighty himself. The use of the word "image" denotes Jesus is not the Original.

Jesus sat down at the right hand of the "Majestic on high", meaning he is not the Majesty on high. He is just his right hand man. No mention of the Holy spirit. Try compare other translation of this verse.




Did you notice the bolded section, Was God Almighty MADE/CREATED ? Here the Son was MADE/CREATED (not my words please).

Jesus obtain a more excellent name, How? A: By INHERITANCE, same way a firstborn son inherits things from his father. Does an ALMIGHTY GOD needs inheritance or inherits anything from anyone?




The relation of God and Jesus explained in common terms man can understand eg "a Father and a son"- they are not equal and not the same.

Did you not the mention of " this day" by God himself.



Why is Jesus called the First begotten? What does that expression me.

Did this verse mean, "Let all the angels of Jesus worship Jesus" or "Let all the angels of God (who is seperate from Jesus) worship Jesus".

Someone gave the command or go ahead for the angels to worship Jesus before they did. It was not just voluntary.



Look closely at the bolded section. Did you see the Father telling Jesus something there, reminding him and you reading that scripture that Jesus has a God above him.

Tell me, who are Jesus "Fellows" whom he was anointed or elevated over?


Jesus called the Father- "My God"-John 20:17.
The Father has never called Jesus such. You still don't see any difference in that.
Please show me where either Jesus or the Father call the Holy spirit God.

The point: Jesus has a God he answers to, so he can't be the ALMIGHTY but the Father on the other hand, has no one above him, not even one like him.

RikoduoSennin:


Eccl 3:19-21 " Animals have Spirits too" are they created in God's image too. After all they have body, Spirit and are refer to as "souls" in the bible a good number of times.

What makes human special- in that same way we reflect God's image not the composition of our body.



Yes, Man his a soul, with only body he was a dead soul. Man only became a "Living" soul when he has breath of life in him- just like electricity powers a radio. Note the bolded section.




The man and his soul is not seperate, what happens to one affects the other. Man himself is a soul.



Man has facial hairs and women have breast, do God have any of these? You need to ask yourself, in what way is man/woman created in the image of God.



Jesus exist in the "image of God", so if man is made in that same "image", we are like them. It does not prove anything. A father can have several children who inherits his traits and features.



Jesus knew the disciples believe in God, the closing statement he is asking them to BELIEVE IN HIM "ALSO". The use of the word also means they are different beings not the same.



Eccl 3:19,20 -" Man and beast (animals) go to the same place, they die and turn to dust. Same eventuality.



Eze 18:20 " The soul that sinneth Shall die...." Soul dies with the Body. The book of Revelation is giving in "Signs", everything is symbolic-figurative language not literal.


Now, Can Mary seperate are Soul or her spirit from her self. Was it really are Soul or Spirit that was speaking what was written down here? How can her Spirit or Soul speak/praise/rejoice? Where is her spirit/ soul located?

The Father was in Heaven, Jesus was in Heaven and the Holy spirit was on earth- filling upward of 120 persons at a time. You get, not to mention, the Son was on earth existing seperately I might add.



If the Spirit leaves the body, one die, is that so. How then is the body "independent" of the spirit. So if the holy spirit leaves Jehovah God, Jehovah or Jesus dies- is that it?

RikoduoSennin:


Eccl 3:19-21 " Animals have Spirits too" are they created in God's image too. After all they have body, Spirit and are refer to as "souls" in the bible a good number of times.

What makes human special- in that same way we reflect God's image not the composition of our body.



Yes, Man his a soul, with only body he was a dead soul. Man only became a "Living" soul when he has breath of life in him- just like electricity powers a radio. Note the bolded section.




The man and his soul is not seperate, what happens to one affects the other. Man himself is a soul.



Man has facial hairs and women have breast, do God have any of these? You need to ask yourself, in what way is man/woman created in the image of God.



Jesus exist in the "image of God", so if man is made in that same "image", we are like them. It does not prove anything. A father can have several children who inherits his traits and features.



Jesus knew the disciples believe in God, the closing statement he is asking them to BELIEVE IN HIM "ALSO". The use of the word also means they are different beings not the same.



Eccl 3:19,20 -" Man and beast (animals) go to the same place, they die and turn to dust. Same eventuality.



Eze 18:20 " The soul that sinneth Shall die...." Soul dies with the Body. The book of Revelation is giving in "Signs", everything is symbolic-figurative language not literal.


Now, Can Mary seperate are Soul or her spirit from her self. Was it really are Soul or Spirit that was speaking what was written down here? How can her Spirit or Soul speak/praise/rejoice? Where is her spirit/ soul located?

The Father was in Heaven, Jesus was in Heaven and the Holy spirit was on earth- filling upward of 120 persons at a time. You get, not to mention, the Son was on earth existing seperately I might add.



If the Spirit leaves the body, one die, is that so. How then is the body "independent" of the spirit. So if the holy spirit leaves Jehovah God, Jehovah or Jesus dies- is that it?

winner01:
Carefully slotting in the heresy huh. Simple Logic does not work with the things of God....Jesus Christ did claim to have a Father, cried out to the Father, prayed to the Father e.t.c and also claimed divinity....I don't see your point because no true christian claims that Jesus is God the father, the bible clearly shows us that they exist as different divine Beings....However, many who claimed christians will agree with you that Jesus is God the son, the bible will forever point to that fact.......

phil 2:6 who, although He
existed in the form of
God, did not regard
equality with God a
thing to be grasped,
7 but emptied Himself,
taking the form of a
bond-servant, and
being made in the
likeness of men.
8 Being found in
appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself
by becoming obedient
to the point of death,
even death on a cross

I know it does not agree with human logic and wisdom, that what it is when it comes to the things of God (our Creator).
I think I now get where you are driving at likening Jesus to a prophet, try hardest and you are still the created..

winner01:
Carefully slotting in the heresy huh. Simple Logic does not work with the things of God....Jesus Christ did claim to have a Father, cried out to the Father, prayed to the Father e.t.c and also claimed divinity....I don't see your point because no true christian claims that Jesus is God the father, the bible clearly shows us that they exist as different divine Beings....However, many christians will agree with you that Jesus is God the son, the bible will forever point to that fact.......

phil 2:6 who, although He
existed in the form of
God, did not regard
equality with God a
thing to be grasped,
7 but emptied Himself,
taking the form of a
bond-servant, and
being made in the
likeness of men.
8 Being found in
appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself
by becoming obedient
to the point of death,
even death on a cross

I know it does not agree with human logic and wisdom, that what it is when it comes to the things of God (our Creator).
I think I now get where you are driving at likening Jesus to a prophet, try hardest and you are still the created..

winner01:
Bravo, A "christian" who does not believe in the manifestation of the spirit, John 4:24..Even the physical manifestation of the spirit....You can even tell me that there are no such thing as evil spirits,...I see no sense in many of your points up there, man is not a soul, he is an embodiment of the body,soul and spirit and in the spiritual realm, the spirit exists and functions,.....God and Jesus in heaven, Holy spirit on earth, well that is why he is God.....oh yes,spirits do speak, rejoice and act...its hard for you to comprehend, I know, but its about God and you are just as human....its His Word, and it is settled...God bless

RikoduoSennin:


Obviously, you did not read the scriptures quoted. I did not speak of my originality but what is in the scriptures I told you.

Man and beast/animals are the same (flesh, blood, bones, spirit etc) even Science says so. Na because of people like you na make Atheist dey talk wetin dem dey talk.

Paul said there is a physical body and a Spiritual body also. They are different. Man cannot possess both at the same time.

God is spirit according to John you quoted, Jesus is a life giving spirit where is the different form you speak of?

RikoduoSennin:


Reading through your post. It seems your mind is made up and closed to Reasoning upon other ideas. In a nutshell, one sided reasoning. There is no need for me to continue this discussion then.

Show me in the bible the phrase "God the Son"

Is there any difference between the phrase "Son of God", "God's son" and "God the Son"?

Phil 2:6 above - see the bolded section, ponder over it.

You carefully omitted Phil 2:9 for your convenience. Did Paul call Jesus God there. "Therefore God has highly exalted him (Jesus).....", Did you notice verse 11:"...God the Father".

Did Paul see Jesus as his God?
Eph 1:17- "that the God of our Lord Jesus christ, the Father of glory....."


-------------------------------------------------------------------
Here oh Isreal, our lord our God is "ONE" not "Three".
He is not three headed or three-faced.

italo:


Because Jesus was God, but also the Son of God. Jesus was divine, but also human.

None of those passages prove that "Jesus is not God." They only show that Jesus was the Son of God and human. They don't show that Jesus show that Jesus being the Son of God and human means that he cannot be God.

Rather, there is a passage that proves that Jesus was both God and Man.

John 1
New International Version (NIV)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.