Piyke: How about the American spec of Asian cars? Eg A Honda Accord America spec and the japanese Models. I once went to honda place Abuja and Enugu with my EOD and was told that they only work on the Japanese spec.

Does American specification change anything with regards to reliability and durability?

They are still Japan technology, manufacturing country does not matter but the origin of the product, Japanese autos all the way,

@ Platinumricky,

I like your points and how you state them in this debate. But this your "Euro cars fire thing" no follow at all.

Are you trying to tell us that only Euro or American Cars suffer fire incidents while in motion without any crash? What do you have to say about these below:

http://autos.aol.com/article/toyota-recalls-7-5-million-cars-for-door-fires/

http://www.merchantcircle.com/business/Karl.Malone.Toyota.Albuquerque.NM.505-294-8800/review/read?cid=955390

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/street-experiences/57698-toyota-corolla-flames.html

My Point is, you cant isolate it to a particular brand or region. Even here in Nigeria, we see cars of various brands going up in flames while in motion, which could be caused by parts failure, fuel leak, mechanics mistakes, etc.

So, that point no follow.

Ikenna

Ikenna351: @ Platinumricky,

I like your points and how you state them in this debate. But this your "Euro cars fire thing" no follow at all.

Are you trying to tell us that only Euro or American Cars suffer fire incidents while in motion without any crash? What do you have to say about this below:

http://autos.aol.com/article/toyota-recalls-7-5-million-cars-for-door-fires/

http://www.merchantcircle.com/business/Karl.Malone.Toyota.Albuquerque.NM.505-294-8800/review/read?cid=955390

My Point is, you cant isolate it to a particular brand or region. Even here in Nigeria, we see cars of various brands going up in flames while in motion, which could be caused by parts failure, fuel leak, mechanics mistakes, etc.

So, that point no follow.

Ikenna

L̳̿Ö̤̣̇☺ː̗̀(=)))ː̖́☺Ö̤̣̇L̳̿, am aware that it's not in line with the theme of the debate.... Its for sarcasm.

here in america, american car parts are the cheapest but i must tell you that american cars are at the bottom of the list. when it comes to interior design, they have poor finishing and look so cheap. the interior i dislike the most is usually that of chevrolet cars. ford cars lose value so quickly and their transmissions especially with the taurus, gives up after a while. american cars are horrible when it comes to resale value. its all about mass production and profit margin.

platinumricky:
Ur 'fair comparison' is questionable. There are mass market brands (VW,honda,nissan,chevrolet,ford,toyota) and luxury brands (lexus,bmw,audi,mercedes,jaguar), then there are segments;small,Midsize,large. A 2001 C230k should be compared with a 01 bmw 320i,lexus IS200,acura TL and an audi A4 1.8T. (these are marched for price,size,engine and badge). The rivals of an 07 camry are the VW passat,peugeot 407 ,honda Accord,ford fusion,chevy malibu. All are Front Wheel Drives and have the same target demographic.

My point is Asian/Jap cars don't cum close at all to German cars,...even wen u compare a older model German ride wit a Asian car dt is at least 5-7yrs more recent. And dts y I put a 2001 C-Class 230 by a 2007 Camry. D hype abt Jap cars is just wat it is,...pure hype

yungboss:
''Nuthead'' lol, but dude you sound more retarded for:
1.Turning your eyes away from the parenthesis in my post you referenced- the independent market. 2. You are comparing a Mercedes 190 to a camry up to 2003...what are your measures for comparison, what indices are you looking at? for real, please let us know and speak within the context of the topic, also noting the 14 year gap in technology of both cars you mentioned. So we are looking at a golf 3 vr6 vs 2008 maxima? Have you bothered looking up the stats of both cars, if you talk performance?
3. A 2001 c230k vs a 2007 camry xle what? So in a round trip from abuja to lagos you are talking reliability and durability? What on earth are you about son, ''fuel-wise, reliability-wise, radiator water-wise...'' what has informed such unrealistic assumptions when the topic doesn't call for such?
you thinking process is highly flawed.
In as much as i adore the German cars, and cannot drive any other, i must be objective along the lines of sportsmanship. The camrys you mentioned are very good cars...and they have good reliability and performance especially the 2007 camry v6. It will accelerate to 100km/h in 6secs. It will hit the quarter mile in 14.3secs, it cannot handle well like the benz but it'll take the 1.8 litre compressor on a straight line. When you compare make it fair, and not just picking vehicles of distinct generation if it has to be that, it has to be square...

Guy trust me yor stats don't count on Naija roads. Ask d average Joe in Naija. U cal a C230 1.8L? Discussion et finis!!!

I am not necessarily a japanese car fan, i luv the 3 pointed star (mercedes) with a passion. There was once upon a time when mercedes was the standard bearer for reliability/durability, when their cars were built without compromise...the W201 series(190) and W124 (v boot) are good examples - the w201 was launched in 1982 ,31yrs ago, its platform was the basis of the w124. Many examples of these two can be found running in pristine order. Everything changed when the 'accountants' started making boardroom decisions and decided that their cars were overengineered and started cutting corners- the first car to reflect this change was the W210 E-class in 96 (the rust bucket on wheels). Every other model launched between this dark era (1996-2004) in mb history suffered from shoddy build quality . MB has been making a lot of effort since 2007 to improve their reliability/build quality - and their newer offerings reflect this. The japanese brands have come a long way and should be commended...its only a matter of tym b4 the south koreans catch up (their interior fit/finish still has question marks).

Gods-Son:
This Post came in timely because i have been contemplating getting between a baby boy1999/2000 model and a mercedes C Class 1998-2000 model but from the reviews i've read so far its quite clear i should get a Mercedes C class because it even has a better fuel economy, stronger and is more durable than the Baby Boy my only problem with the ride is the shape its like a match box but thats no problem i'd sure go for it and i pray God's blessings to Enjoy it Amen!! or do u guys think other wise? ya comments will be helpful thanks

My advise,...go for a C-Class 230 (2000 or 2001). A 230 is usually a Kompressor (a C180,C220 aint),...a Honda Baby boy is child's play beside a C230 in every sense.

Frankie9ice:

Guy trust me yor stats don't count on Naija roads. Ask d average Joe in Naija. U cal a C230 1.8L? Discussion et finis!!!

Frankie9ice,
The C230k is a 1.8 litre engine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_C-Class#Second_generation_.28W203:_2000.E2.80.932006.29

platinumricky: I am not necessarily a japanese car fan, i luv the 3 pointed star (mercedes) with a passion. There was once upon a time when mercedes was the standard bearer for reliability/durability, when their cars were built without compromise...the W201 series(190) and W124 (v boot) are good examples - the w201 was launched in 1982 ,31yrs ago, its platform was the basis of the w124. Many examples of these two can be found running in pristine order. Everything changed when the 'accountants' started making boardroom decisions and decided that their cars were overengineered and started cutting corners- the first car to reflect this change was the W210 E-class in 96 (the rust bucket on wheels). Every other model launched between this dark era (1996-2004) in mb history suffered from shoddy build quality . MB has been making a lot of effort since 2007 to improve their reliability/build quality - and their newer offerings reflect this. The japanese brands have come a long way and should be commended...its only a matter of tym b4 the south koreans catch up (their interior fit/finish still has question marks).

Not just Benz. Everyother brand has lost it. Every one of them was after reduction of cost of production against the qualities known for. Some left the drive configuration (RWD) they are known for, like Peugeot and Volvo, and switched to FWD that cost less to design and produce. Ask most of the old Peugeot fans why they left that brand, they will tell you because they switched from RWD to FWD full time, after 505 production stopped.

But then, they acted according to the market demands: more toys. Market/people prefers cars with gadgets/toys allover than reliability and durability. So they gave us what we wanted and everyone was happy, and they kept it going. Meaning, more toys, more plastics. And more toys would require complex electrics to function, hence, electric nightmares in newer cars.

So, i dont really blame the car manufacturers. Its what the market wanted that they are producing for us. Check out the car journalist articles or reviews on new cars. They compare newly lauched cars with another with the one that has more or better toys than the other. Any car with better or more toys wins the best car. So what do you expect the manufacturers to do, since people choose cars to buy from such reviews.

Very few brands are trying to maintain some of the few qualities they were known for, back in the '70s & '80s in the midst of the plastic competition.

Ikenna.

i do not abhor other brands, i recognize them for the love of motoring. but i do not see myself driving a Toyota or a Honda in the near future.

I love the Nissan GT-R, R38...there was once Toyota Supra,i do not mind the Subaru Imprezza WRX...the Lexus and the Infiniti G37. Now these are good cars.

Ikenna351:

Not just Benz. Everyother brand has lost it. Every one of them were after reduction of cost of production against the qualities known for. Some left the drive configuration (RWD) they are known for, like Peugeot and Volvo, and switched to FWD that cost less to design and produce. Ask most of the old Peugeot fans why they left that brand, they will tell you because they switched from RWD to FWD full time, after 505 production stopped.

But then, they acted according to the market demands: more toys. Market/people prefers cars with gadgets/toys allover than reliability and durability. So gave us what we wanted and everyone was happy, so they kept it going. Meaning, more toys, more plastics. And more toys would require complex electrics to function, hence, electric nightmares in newer cars.

So, i dont really blame the car manufacturers. Its what the market wanted that they are producing for us. Check out the car journalist articles or reviews on new cars. They compare newly lauched cars with another with the one that has more or better toys than the car. Anyone with better or more toys wins the best car. So what do you expect the manufacturers to do, since people buy choose cars to buy from such reviews.

Very few brands are trying to maintain some of the few qualities they were known for, back in the '70s & '80s in the midst of the plastic competition.

Ikenna.

BMW is an example...

Gods-Son:
This Post came in timely because i have been contemplating getting between a baby boy1999/2000 model and a mercedes C Class 1998-2000 model but from the reviews i've read so far its quite clear i should get a Mercedes C class because it even has a better fuel economy, stronger and is more durable than the Baby Boy my only problem with the ride is the shape its like a match box but thats no problem i'd sure go for it and i pray God's blessings to Enjoy it Amen!! or do u guys think other wise? ya comments will be helpful thanks

My main beef with the C-class (W202) U̶̲̥̅̊ have in mind is the front impact rating (it got 2 over 5!), i saw one which had a head on collision with a W124 (v boot) and the damage was excessive (the impact almost reached the c-pillar of the c class while the damage to the V didn't go beyond the A-pillar), after seeing the wreckage of the C class, i did a lil research and saw it's crash score. Besides, the parts are a lil expensive (a friend of mine used to hv one). U̶̲̥̅̊ Я better off with the accord, just make sure U̶̲̥̅̊ get one with a manual gearbox.

I still see a 1982 mercedes benz all ova d place but can't find a japanese of dat same year on d streets? What happened to dem? Comparing german cars wit japanese is like comparing a 5 star hotel wit a chalet.

yungboss:
BMW is an example...

Yes, like BMW & Benz, you can say that, including some other Euro cars. They value their loyal fans, by not giving up on some good qualities the fans enjoy in their products (which other brands lack), thereby retaining them.

Ikenna.

platinumricky:
My main beef with the C-class (W202) U̶̲̥̅̊ have in mind is the front impact rating (it got 2 over 5!), i saw one which had a head on collision with a W124 (v boot) and the damage was excessive (its impact almost reached the c-pillar of the c class while the damage to the V didn't go beyond the A-pillar), after seeing the wreckage of the C class, i did a lil research and saw it's crash score. Besides, the parts are a lil expensive (a friend of mine used to hv one). U̶̲̥̅̊ Я better off with the accord, just make sure U̶̲̥̅̊ get one with a manual gearbox.

are you serious, up to the c pillar, as compared to the A of the 124? I dont think it could be that bad for the w202 ricky!

yungboss:
are you serious, up to the c pillar, as compared to the A of the 124? I dont think it could be that bad for the w202 ricky!

i saw it, dat's why i did the subsequent research. My initial assumption was dat a tractor head rammed the c class.

Frankie9ice:

My advise,...go for a C-Class 230 (2000 or 2001). A 230 is usually a Kompressor (a C180,C220 aint),...a Honda Baby boy is child's play beside a C230 in every sense.

I'll just assumed you were under the influence of Sapele water when you said that.
If you say 2002 C-class then I can buy your idea but 98 - 2002 Honda Accord beats 98 - 2001 C-class hands down,whether na kompressor or not.

elviszzz: I still see a 1982 mercedes benz all ova d place but can't find a japanese of dat same year on d streets? What happened to dem? Comparing german cars wit japanese is like comparing a 5 star hotel wit a chalet.

Guy but some big boys still dey drive their Honda halla with pride na,abi Halla na 2013 model again,

Now my own turn.

From what I have gathered here, I think reliability, durability & performance of Euro/American vs Asian cars depends on the car owner or the driver.

RELIABILITY:
A Euro car owner may see his car as a reliable one, while a japs or Asian car owner sees it as a nightmare that must be avoided at all cost. A Euro car owner, who may have to order a part from outside to replace a failed component, may not see it as an issue or termed it unreliable, even if it takes it days or weeks to put the car back on the road and continue the fun where it stopped, as long as he is certain that it will take him years or decades to replace that part again. But he may see a Jap car that visits clown workshop every now and then, for a particular part to be changed over and over again, for failing every week, a month or every quarter, as unreliable. The same way, a Japs owner would find it an omen to have a car that stays in a garage a week or more before it get fixed; would prefer a car that he/she would have to spend a penny to replace a particular constant failing part, even if he/she has to be resuming work at clowns/mechanics workshop every day to replace one failed part or the other before ending up at office. So to him or her, as long as he/she is always behind the wheels and the car is always moving, whether from home to mechanic every day or weekend, he regards it "A reliable car".

For someone like me, I would find a car I don't get to be opening the bonnet to do something once in a while, as a boring one. I cant live with such a car. Even when nothing is wrong, I would always want to check to see if I must find something that needed attention. I just love working on my car. So, any car that refuses to give me a reason to open the hood will definitely seize to me mine soon. Its not for me.

PERFORMANCE:
There was this 2006 Toyota Corolla, Sports model "S" (American spec) of a cousin I used to drive then in Abuja. A nice car. Average quickness for its engine and body size. It was supposed to be a sports version of the Corolla of that model year. Unfortunately, the car lacks 4 wheel disc brake. The rear brake is drum. Who in his right senses would install a drum brake in a car and call it sports version? How would I push such a car hard as I do with mine since it lacked a matching brake? Why cant they just get something right? So I never bothered to push it hard on Abuja expressways, since I wont like to miss my next birthday.

There was this Lexus of a colleague of mine (not sure of the model year, but it was the '90s model). A V6 one. Whenever I was the one driving, the car would feel heavy, meaning good for highway. Good steering wheel feedback. But then, the most boring car I have ever driven! Am not joking. Couldn't tell if it was because it was auto tranny or just because the car lacked soul. To a point, I was like "no thank you". I preferred sitting as a passenger than driving some tortoise. A durable car though, since the odometer was more than 300k miles, still on the original engine and the body still intact, no rust.

Toyota Camry 2003 I4 (Big for Nothing). I have driven the car twice. Not too quick, but ok. Very roomy. Enough leg room space. Unfortunately, the most uninspiring dashboard I have ever seen.

Have driven a lot of Nissan cars. The most quickest Japs I have ever driven. Even their smaller cars are quick too. But when it comes to putting stunts on their wheels, they start misbehaving. Typical japs! But I believe Skyline would be the best of them. I respect Nissan for producing that Beast.

Benz W124 (V-boot). Mehnn! Am not a Benz fan, but the very first day I drove that car, I was so impressed, even though it was an I4 (facelifted), very sluggish in movement though (thanks to auto transmission). But the car was awesome. The stability of the car on high speed was something else. The steering feel? Ahhh! Love the smoothness as it steered the wheel. Even though it was an old school; even though it wasn't a quick car, but I enjoyed every bit of moment I was behind that wheel. Well engineered car!

Its obvious that a V6 Benz, Audi, Peugeot or BMW its never the same with a V6 Toyota, Honda or Nissan of the same model year cars. A japs I4 & V6 usually have the same simple electrics and mechanicals, except the engines of course. But for the 4 mentioned Euro cars, their V6s or V8s have different more complex electrics and mechanicals with their I4 counterparts: Different suspensions (electronically controlled, etc), different Power assisted steering, advanced complex electronics to enhance the performance, etc.



DURABILITY:
Every car can last as long as the owner wants it. Japs car can last for 40 years and above, with the original engine. Likewise the Euro or American ride. It all depends on how good the owner is with maintenance, style of driving and abuse.

Though, an Asian car cannot be driven or pushed as hard as most Euro cars, if the owner wants it to last that long. Make that mistake and her days will be numbered. They are deigned to be softly handled or driven

It appears most Nigerians do not know when there vehicles are faulty or not. You hear everyday "this brand is reliable, this brand drives forever". But then I come out everyday, see people's cars puffing out all kinds of colors of smoke from their exhaust. As long as its moving and its not stalling or jerking, the car is fine.




So, there you have mine.

Ikenna

Gods-Son:
This Post came in timely because i have been contemplating getting between a baby boy1999/2000 model and a mercedes C Class 1998-2000 model but from the reviews i've read so far its quite clear i should get a Mercedes C class because it even has a better fuel economy, stronger and is more durable than the Baby Boy my only problem with the ride is the shape its like a match box but thats no problem i'd sure go for it and i pray God's blessings to Enjoy it Amen!! or do u guys think other wise? ya comments will be helpful thanks

this post make me laugh imagine hear your self you pray that means its not reliable simple

The main factor you people should consider 1st is weather, type of fuel and quality used, how often the car is maintained and servicing interval.

well I love europe cars and I believe Japanese car, europe car in Nigeria is show off, but jap cars on Niger road means bubbling the town.

ikenna

Not just Benz. Everyother brand has lost it. Every one of them was after reduction of cost of production against the qualities known for. Some left the drive configuration (RWD) they are known for, like Peugeot and Volvo, and switched to FWD that cost less to design and produce. Ask most of the old Peugeot fans why they left that brand, they will tell you because they switched from RWD to FWD full time, after 505 production stopped.

But then, they acted according to the market demands: more toys. Market/people prefers cars with gadgets/toys allover than reliability and durability. So they gave us what we wanted and everyone was happy, and they kept it going. Meaning, more toys, more plastics. And more toys would require complex electrics to function, hence, electric nightmares in newer cars.

So, i dont really blame the car manufacturers. Its what the market wanted that they are producing for us. Check out the car journalist articles or reviews on new cars. They compare newly lauched cars with another with the one that has more or better toys than the other. Any car with better or more toys wins the best car. So what do you expect the manufacturers to do, since people choose cars to buy from such reviews.

Very few brands are trying to maintain some of the few qualities they were known for, back in the '70s & '80s in the midst of the plastic competition.

Ikenna.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
| My Phone no.: 08052811236 | | My email: ikenna351@gmail.com | | Abuja, Nigeria.
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by yungboss(m): 9:02pm On Feb 17
i do not abhor other brands, i recognize them for the love of motoring. but i do not see myself driving a Toyota or a Honda in the near future.

I love the Nissan GT-R, R38...there was once Toyota Supra,i do not mind the Subaru Imprezza WRX...the Lexus and the Infiniti G37. Now these are good cars.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
BMW E36, 320i | BMW E46 323ci
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by yungboss(m): 9:04pm On Feb 17
Ikenna351:

Not just Benz. Everyother brand has lost it. Every one of them were after reduction of cost of production against the qualities known for. Some left the drive configuration (RWD) they are known for, like Peugeot and Volvo, and switched to FWD that cost less to design and produce. Ask most of the old Peugeot fans why they left that brand, they will tell you because they switched from RWD to FWD full time, after 505 production stopped.

But then, they acted according to the market demands: more toys. Market/people prefers cars with gadgets/toys allover than reliability and durability. So gave us what we wanted and everyone was happy, so they kept it going. Meaning, more toys, more plastics. And more toys would require complex electrics to function, hence, electric nightmares in newer cars.

So, i dont really blame the car manufacturers. Its what the market wanted that they are producing for us. Check out the car journalist articles or reviews on new cars. They compare newly lauched cars with another with the one that has more or better toys than the car. Anyone with better or more toys wins the best car. So what do you expect the manufacturers to do, since people buy choose cars to buy from such reviews.

Very few brands are trying to maintain some of the few qualities they were known for, back in the '70s & '80s in the midst of the plastic competition.

Ikenna.
BMW is an example...
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
BMW E36, 320i | BMW E46 323ci
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by platinumricky(m): 9:07pm On Feb 17
Gods-Son:
This Post came in timely because i have been contemplating getting between a baby boy1999/2000 model and a mercedes C Class 1998-2000 model but from the reviews i've read so far its quite clear i should get a Mercedes C class because it even has a better fuel economy, stronger and is more durable than the Baby Boy my only problem with the ride is the shape its like a match box but thats no problem i'd sure go for it and i pray God's blessings to Enjoy it Amen!! or do u guys think other wise? ya comments will be helpful thanks

My main beef with the C-class (W202) U̶̲̥̅̊ have in mind is the front impact rating (it got 2 over 5!), i saw one which had a head on collision with a W124 (v boot) and the damage was excessive (the impact almost reached the c-pillar of the c class while the damage to the V didn't go beyond the A-pillar), after seeing the wreckage of the C class, i did a lil research and saw it's crash score. Besides, the parts are a lil expensive (a friend of mine used to hv one). U̶̲̥̅̊ Я better off with the accord, just make sure U̶̲̥̅̊ get one with a manual gearbox.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
Ambition is a dream with a V8- Elvis Presley
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by elviszzz: 9:09pm On Feb 17
I still see a 1982 mercedes benz all ova d place but can't find a japanese of dat same year on d streets? What happened to dem? Comparing german cars wit japanese is like comparing a 5 star hotel wit a chalet.
(Quote) (Report) 1 Like (Like)
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by Ikenna351(m): 9:17pm On Feb 17
yungboss:
BMW is an example...

Yes, like BMW & Benz, you can say that, including some other Euro cars. They value their loyal fans, by not giving up on some good qualities the fans enjoy in their products (which other brands lack), thereby retaining them.

Ikenna.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
| My Phone no.: 08052811236 | | My email: ikenna351@gmail.com | | Abuja, Nigeria.
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by yungboss(m): 9:17pm On Feb 17
platinumricky:
My main beef with the C-class (W202) U̶̲̥̅̊ have in mind is the front impact rating (it got 2 over 5!), i saw one which had a head on collision with a W124 (v boot) and the damage was excessive (its impact almost reached the c-pillar of the c class while the damage to the V didn't go beyond the A-pillar), after seeing the wreckage of the C class, i did a lil research and saw it's crash score. Besides, the parts are a lil expensive (a friend of mine used to hv one). U̶̲̥̅̊ Я better off with the accord, just make sure U̶̲̥̅̊ get one with a manual gearbox.
are you serious, up to the c pillar, as compared to the A of the 124? I dont think it could be that bad for the w202 ricky!
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
BMW E36, 320i | BMW E46 323ci
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by platinumricky(m): 9:23pm On Feb 17
yungboss:
are you serious, up to the c pillar, as compared to the A of the 124? I dont think it could be that bad for the w202 ricky!
i saw it, dat's why i did the subsequent research. My initial assumption was dat a tractor head rammed the c class.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
Ambition is a dream with a V8- Elvis Presley
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by chucky234(m): 10:12pm On Feb 17
Frankie9ice:

My advise,...go for a C-Class 230 (2000 or 2001). A 230 is usually a Kompressor (a C180,C220 aint),...a Honda Baby boy is child's play beside a C230 in every sense.
I'll just assumed you were under the influence of Sapele water when you said that.
If you say 2002 C-class then I can buy your idea but 98 - 2002 Honda Accord beats 98 - 2001 C-class hands down,whether na kompressor or not.
(Quote) (Report) (Like)
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by chucky234(m): 10:15pm On Feb 17
elviszzz: I still see a 1982 mercedes benz all ova d place but can't find a japanese of dat same year on d streets? What happened to dem? Comparing german cars wit japanese is like comparing a 5 star hotel wit a chalet.
Guy but some big boys still dey drive their Honda halla with pride na,abi Halla na 2013 model again,
(Quote) (Report) 1 Like (Like)
Re: Euro/American Vs Asian Cars (Reliability, Durability & Performance) by Ikenna351(m): 11:17pm On Feb 17
Now my own turn.

From what I have gathered here, I think reliability, durability & performance of Euro/American vs Asian cars depends on the car owner or the driver.

RELIABILITY:
A Euro car owner may see his car as a reliable one, while a japs or Asian car owner sees it as a nightmare that must be avoided at all cost. A Euro car owner, who may have to order a part from outside to replace a failed component, may not see it as an issue or termed it unreliable, even if it takes it days or weeks to put the car back on the road and continue the fun where it stopped, as long as he is certain that it will take him years or decades to replace that part again. But he may see a Jap car that visits clown workshop every now and then, for a particular part to be changed over and over again, for failing every week, a month or every quarter, as unreliable. The same way, a Japs owner would find it an omen to have a car that stays in a garage a week or more before it get fixed; would prefer a car that he/she would have to spend a penny to replace a particular constant failing part, even if he/she has to be resuming work at clowns/mechanics workshop every day to replace one failed part or the other before ending up at office. So to him or her, as long as he/she is always behind the wheels and the car is always moving, whether from home to mechanic every day or weekend, he regards it "A reliable car".

For someone like me, I would find a car I don't get to be opening the bonnet to do something once in a while, as a boring one. I cant live with such a car. Even when nothing is wrong, I would always want to check to see if I must find something that needed attention. I just love working on my car. So, any car that refuses to give me a reason to open the hood will definitely seize to me mine soon. Its not for me.

PERFORMANCE:
There was this 2006 Toyota Corolla, Sports model "S" (American spec) of a cousin I used to drive then in Abuja. A nice car. Average quickness for its engine and body size. It was supposed to be a sports version of the Corolla of that model year. Unfortunately, the car lacks 4 wheel disc brake. The rear brake is drum. Who in his right senses would install a drum brake in a car and call it sports version? How would I push such a car hard as I do with mine since it lacked a matching brake? Why cant they just get something right? So I never bothered to push it hard on Abuja expressways, since I wont like to miss my next birthday.

There was this Lexus of a colleague of mine (not sure of the model year, but late '90s or early '00, I think). A V6 one. Whenever I was the one driving, the car would feel heavy, meaning good for highway. Good steering wheel feedback. But then, the most boring car I have ever driven! Am not joking. Couldn't tell if it was because it was auto tranny or just because the car lacked soul. To a point, I was like "no thank you". I preferred sitting as a passenger than driving some tortoise. A durable car though, since the odometer was more than 300k miles, still on the original engine.

Toyota Camry 2003 I4 (Big for Nothing). I have driven the car twice. Not too quick, but ok. Very roomy. Enough leg room space. Unfortunately, the most uninspiring dashboard I have ever seen.

Have driven a lot of Nissan cars. The most quickest Japs I have ever driven. Even their smaller cars are quick too. But when it comes to putting stunts on their wheels, they start misbehaving. Typical japs! But I believe Skyline would be the best of them. I respect Nissan for producing that Beast.

Benz W124 (V-boot). Mehnn! Am not a Benz fan, but the very first day I drove that car, I was so impressed, even though it was an I4 (facelifted), very sluggish in movement though (thanks to auto transmission). But the car was awesome. The stability of the car on high speed was something else. The steering feel? Ahhh! Love the smoothness as it steered the wheel. Even though it was an old school; even though it wasn't a quick car, but I enjoyed every bit of moment I was behind that wheel. Well engineered car!

Its obvious that a V6 Benz, Audi, Peugeot or BMW its never the same with a V6 Toyota, Honda or Nissan of the same model year cars. A japs I4 & V6 usually have the same simple electrics and mechanicals, except the engines of course. But for the 4 mentioned Euro cars, their V6s or V8s have different more complex electrics and mechanicals with their I4 counterparts: Different suspensions (electronically controlled, etc), different Power assisted steering, advanced complex electronics to enhance the performance, etc.



DURABILITY:
Every car can last as long as the owner wants it. Japs car can last for 40 years and above, with the original engine. Likewise the Euro or American ride. It all depends on how good the owner is with maintenance, style of driving and abuse.

Though, an Asian car cannot be driven or pushed as hard as most Euro cars, if the owner wants it to last that long. Make that mistake and her days will be numbered. They are deigned to be softly handled or driven

It appears most Nigerians do not know when there vehicles are faulty or not. You hear everyday "this brand is reliable, this brand drives forever". But then I come out everyday, see people's cars puffing out all kinds of colors of smoke from their exhaust. As long as its moving and its not stalling or jerking, the car is fine.




So, there you have mine.

Ikenna

right
i have not driven those car u quoted on ur post so i m not in the position to speak against of course! But then i sure there are lots of euro models that doesnt add up anyway!

but one thing i know for sure is honda Accord steering touches and handing is still far much better than most of ur so called euro cars models

still on it, with all that u mention on ur post one still try so hard to figure out the reason Japan alone sale more cars worldwide relatively to ur combine countries european french;germany and all that

ur so called German machine is not that far elitist from Japanese ones as the japs has long moved into premium state so the reason they still manage to push the euro cars to the egde!

so there u go!

@ Ikeyman00,

Honda is another good Japs i forgot to mention. I have driven Accord V6 2001 (Babyboy) & Accord V6 2004 (EOD). Very quick cars, except if one can live with their front swivel/ball joint and auto transmission issues.

If i were to choose between Honda Accord and Toyota Camry of any model year, I would pick Accord without a blink. But then, considering how hard i push my car on highway, i wouldnt want to end up with a car that its wheel ball joint will give up on high speed while jumping potholes on our highways.

The truth is, Japs cars are reliable cars, when carefully handled or used and when well maintained. When used as daily driver, they hardly give the owners headaches. But once you start pushing them around anyhow like one can do to a Euro car and get away with it, they will start falling apart very quickly. They are just everyday car for non petrolheads who are after point A to point B. But may God help you when the follow come parts starts failing, the mechanics and parts sellers will now be the people to enjoys your salary or monthly income, since you will have to be replacing those parts every now and then. You can ask Toyota owners how many times they replace their shock absorbers in a year. Some dont even bother replacing them anymore.

Ikenna.

@@@@
ikenna

how hard i push my car on highway, i wouldnt want to end up with a car that its wheel ball joint will give up on high speed while jumping potholes on our highways.

well the only reason u get to see cv wahala a lot in naija is i put it down to bad used parts and knowning the sensitivity of these area an average driver doesnt care when the rubber boots breaks which get contaminated with debris and rust

this is what u get then!

and mind u as for ur everyday drive thing mind u honda halla still kick around in the country; i still remember seeing one in lokoja high way flying like a saucer in 2011

From personal experience, there is no comparism. The japanese cars are better built, more durable. Performance wise in terms of speed etc, you could give that to the europeans.
In the 90s i bought a 740i bmw. Same year just months between i bought a lexus ls400, both v8. Till date i still have both cars, i have only changed break pads and the regular oil change on the lexus. With the bmw, i had to almost monthy buy fuel pump from coscharis. Fews days after changing the pump it starts a wining sound until it packs up. While tthe bmw was more interesting and macho to drive, the lexus has probably covered 10 times the milage my bmw did.
The picture i am attqching should explain the rest.

ikeyman00: @@@@
ikenna


well the only reason u get to see cv wahala a lot in naija is i put it down to bad used parts and knowning the sensitive of these area an average driver doesnt care when the rubber boots breaks which get contaminated with debris and rust

this is what u get then!

and mind u as for ur everyday drive thing mind u honda halla still kick around in the country; i still remember seeing one in lokoja high way flying like a saucer in 2011

I wasnt referring to the CV (constant velocity) joint, but what Peugeot calls front wheel swivel. Generally, its called ball joint, whicle Nigerian mechanics call it bore joint.

The ball joint Honda issue is peculiar to Accord 2001 (Babyboy) & Accord 2004 (EOD). If they could pull out on a smooth road, what happens then when am on highspeed with one and jump a deep pothole and it decides to pull out at that time? No be mortuary be dat? I want and need a car that will be strong and rugged enough to withstand the condition of our highways, no matter how hard i push them on such roads. Of course, you cant swerve out of all the potholes on highspeed. Some, you will have no option than to drive on them on such speed. What happens when you jump them depends on the car and probably how good you are behind the wheels. But if your ball joint pulls out, even James Bond cannot stop the car from swerving into the bush. What happens after depends on how good your God loves you or still wants you to live.

Ikenna.

bendike: From personal experience, there is no comparism. The japanese cars are better built, more durable. Performance wise in terms of speed etc, you could give that to the europeans.
In the 90s i bought a 740i bmw. Same year just months between i bought a lexus ls400, both v8. Till date i still have both cars, i have only changed break pads and the regular oil change on the lexus. With the bmw, i had to almost monthy buy fuel pump from coscharis. Fews days after changing the pump it starts a wining sound until it packs up. While tthe bmw was more interesting and macho to drive, the lexus has probably covered 10 times the milage my bmw did.
The picture i am attqching should explain the rest.

bendike,
i respect your taste, this is exactly what alot of us meant here, the euro cars need more attention...i will purchase the 740i ten times over the lexus...that car is awesome, i test-drove one sometime ago. Did you eventually uncover the underlying cause of the frequent failure of the pump?
I had a similar case with my bmw, that cost me about 5 fuel pumps. The so called BMW mechanics around me couldn't unravel the mystery behind a never-before experienced problem i had. Anytime i filled up my fuel tank, the idle operation of my car changes, it begins to hunt pathologically, and it puffs dark fumes from the exhaust tail. Over the period of this existing situation, i changed 5 pumps...to cut the story, earlier in the day, i had read up something about evaprator canister in the engine, it is an item in the fuel line that douses excessive gas in the fuel tank... just back home from work, i decided to unplug the vacuum lines that fed into the canister,to my amazement the hunting ceased....and it has ceased forever. Now i need to replace the canister cylinder, though i haven't found the right one, been driving the car like that (i also read that it isnt harmful driving the car this way), i m waitng to fit a new one to the car. Sometimes, you need that extra mile dedication in order for thes autos to run well...they are luxury cars hence delicately poised for ruggedity

platinumricky: European luxury cars tend to become nightmarish to own when they start ageing- the more electronics U̶̲̥̅̊ load in a vehicle, the more likely the number of issues that will arise as the age increases. Let's look @​ the 9yr+ examples of these luxury cars :
1. 2002 mercedes S500 (W220)
2. 2002 Bmw 745i (E65)
3. 2003 Audi A8 4.2 quattro (D3,
Typ 4E).
4. 2003 Lexus LS430 (XF30)
5. 2004 Maserati Quattroporte (quattroporte V)

All 5 are full size V8-luxury cars. The first 3 are german, the 4th is japanese while the fifth is italian. The four europeans were praised for their driving dynamics and technological features then, the favourite of the automotive press was the S-class during that era. It was praised for its 'magic carpet' ride. The chris bangle-designed 7series wasn't far behind..the Audi A8 was praised for it torque-vectoring AWD and its interior (the styling,fit & finish won awards then) . The lexus was labelled 'dull and boring' and bland to look at/drive. The pininfarina designed-maserati was hailed for its italian flavour and ferrari-sourced powertrains. Fastforward to the present day; of all these luxury cars, only the lexus has stood the test of time reliability-wise. it has the least amount of problems per 100 vehicles. The w220 was panned for its reliability and build quality (engine,transmission/suspension failures were rampant on vehicles with less than 20k miles on the odometer). The e65 7series is also problematic- its ZF transmission has had a lot of failures, in addition to cooling/electrical gremlins. The others have their issues too (their case files are long)..and their repair bills are outrageously expensive.

that puts this discussion to bed. The simpler it is, the more reliable.

Frankie9ice:

...Now dis is d grouse I av with some nutheads on dis site,u want contributions frm an average Nigerian and of all cars on our roads 2day u single out a 2012 Benz S-Class 63 AMG vs a 2012 Toyota Lexus LS 600H. Dude r u resident in Naija at all? D average Nigerian has not driven a 2006 Benz talkless a 2012 model! Truth is if u want a review for those 2 cars u mentioned u do av to go to d National Assembly to interview d likes of Farouk Lawan et al. If we truly want to compare Euro/American vs Asia/Jap cars,let's do it wit vehichles like Benz 190/V-Boot vs Camry,Corolla,(up to 2003 models). Golf 3,Golf 4,Peguot 406,Opel Vectra vs Optima,Rio,Cerrato (up to 2008 models),Sienna,Maxima,Previa etc. Hia's a fair challenge; put a Benz C-Class 23O (Kompressor,2001) vs a Camry xle 2007, Abuja to Lagos back to Abuja same day and see which car wud outperform d other. I bet u,d benz wud do better fuel wise,reliability wise,radiator water wise,...and in every way. And dts for a 2001 Benz against a 2007 Toyota. Dia is simply no way u can compare a German ride wit a Jap one year for year

have u ever wondered why benz and bmw cars arent used as taxis and transport vehicles? Wake up and smell the coffee bro. Toyota is the highest selling car maker in the world and it is no fluke. there is a reason why they are trusted more than any other brand.

[quote author=Ikenna351]Now my own turn.





PERFORMANCE:
There was this 2006 Toyota Corolla, Sports model "S" (American spec) of a cousin I used to drive then in Abuja. A nice car. Average quickness for its engine and body size. It was supposed to be a sports version of the Corolla of that model year. Unfortunately, the car lacks 4 wheel disc brake. The rear brake is drum. Who in his right senses would install a drum brake in a car and call it sports version? How would I push such a car hard as I do with mine since it lacked a matching brake? Why cant they just get something right? So I never bothered to push it hard on Abuja expressways, since I wont like to miss my next birthday.

!


Go online and check the stopping/braking distance of that corolla and you will be amazed. The lining in the drum grios as much surface area as the pad on a disk and probably more. the only problem with it is that it is prone to overheating if punished excessively. that corolla sport is a wonderful car to drive. handles well too.