http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn4uweesQrU

Fellow Nairalanders,

Here i am again. No dark goggles. My Catholic friends will need to convince me why they have nine commandments instead of ten in their Catechism. I have raised the question over and over again yet, they duck it. If there is anyone interested in telling us the rationale behind it, let them come on board to educate us.

The second commandment in the bible says : Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

What do we have in the Catholic Catechism as the second commandment of God? Here we go:

Thou shalt not take the name of they Lord God in vain.

That means the commandments according to the RCC should be short of one since they have removed one. Right? But you are wrong! We now have commandments ten in the bible split into two and taken as one commandment each! They have taken the issue of covetousness and split it into numbers 9 and 10. Amazing i guess.

Catechism has Commandment nine as Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor' wife.
Catechism has Commandment ten as Thou shalt not covet they neighbor' goods.

Its just one verse in Exodus 20:17!

So is some wrong somewhere? Let us dissect this my feofle!

Never mind about the Catholic commandments. Which version of the 10 commandments should one observe: those given in Exodus 20, or those given in Exodus 34?

I would argue that those given in Exodus 34 should take precedence over the Exodus 20 commandments. Ex34 were the replacements of the Ex20 commandments, after Moses had smashed the Ex20 set. God ordered Moses to build the Ark of the Covenant and place the Ex34 commandments therein. So these were the commandments that were observed and revered by the Jews. In fact, Ex34 commandments in the Ark were so "important" that God would strike people dead who so much as touch the Ark.

Now, why are there discrepancies between the Ex20 and Ex34 commandment? Did god forgot what he had given Moses in the first set of commandments? Had he lost his mind?

Remember, never try to cook a baby goat in its mothers milk, or you would be violating one of god's commandments.

@cgift
Shoddy scholarship - inspired by hatred, as usual.

This is taken from the online version of the Cathechism on the Vatican site
(http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm#IV)

CatholicCathechism:
IV. "YOU SHALL NOT MAKE FOR YOURSELF A GRAVEN IMAGE . . ."

2129    The divine injunction included the prohibition of every representation of God by the hand of man. Deuteronomy explains: "Since you saw no form on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb out of the midst of the fire, beware lest you act corruptly by making a graven image for yourselves, in the form of any figure. . . . "66 It is the absolutely transcendent God who revealed himself to Israel. "He is the all," but at the same time "he is greater than all his works."67 He is "the author of beauty."68

2130     Nevertheless, already in the Old Testament, God ordained or permitted the making of images that pointed symbolically toward salvation by the incarnate Word: so it was with the bronze serpent, the ark of the covenant, and the cherubim.69

2131   Basing itself on the mystery of the incarnate Word, the seventh ecumenical council at Nicaea (787) justified against the iconoclasts the veneration of icons - of Christ, but also of the Mother of God, the angels, and all the saints. By becoming incarnate, the Son of God introduced a new "economy" of images.

2132    The Christian veneration of images is not contrary to the first commandment which proscribes idols. Indeed, "the honor rendered to an image passes to its prototype," and "whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it." The honor paid to sacred images is a "respectful veneration," not the adoration due to God alone:


Religious worship is not directed to images in themselves, considered as mere things, but under their distinctive aspect as images leading us on to God incarnate. The movement toward the image does not terminate in it as image, but tends toward that whose image it is.

This is taken from the online version of the Cathechism on the Vatican site
(http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm#IV)

(1) What exactly do those words mean? (2) You're using a catholic site to defend catholicism??

Seun:

And what the mess does it mean?

It is a link to be followed. The contents are to be (deeply) studied before careless statements are made.

Careless statements only serve to expose the ignorance and laziness of the person(s) making the statments.

Seun:

(2) You're using a catholic site to defend catholicism??

Is it ok to use (like cgift) anti-catholic sites to attack catholicism?

He didn't use an anti-catholic site. He used the book of Exodus and some reasonable arguments.

Seun:
He didn't use an anti-catholic site.  He used the book of Exodus and some reasonable arguments.

Well, he SHOULD have read the Catholic cathechism before making anti-catholic arguments.

He did not study well.

That 'Catholic' site was commenting on this passage, which is the FIRST COMMANDMENT=>

Exodus20:2-5:

I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them

cgift:
The second commandment in the bible says : Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

@cgift
This is NOT the second commandment. Wake up.



This is the second commandment =>

Exodus 20:7
You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain

imhotep:


This is the second commandment =>

Exodus 20:7
You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain

@imhotep, If you are referring to the decalogue, it is very clear that The LORD God Almighty personally wrote it with His own finger in two tables of stone, love toward God and love toward mankind, and are written in this order;

The first table:

Commandments dealing with love towards God;

#1 No other gods Ex 20:3; 34:14; Ps.73:25;81:9;Isa.43:10;Matt.4:10;1John 5:21

This guards against any form of mental or internal idolatry.  Not giving anyone or anything in heaven or in earth that inward affection, worship, veneration or dependence that is due only to the true God.

#2 No graven images Ex 20:4-6; 34:12-17; Rom 1:21-24,32; 1Thess 1:9.

This guards against any form of external idolatry.  Such as when pictures or images of people are being observed as possessing divine powers and are adored, either at churches or places of pagan worship, they  become idols.

#3 Not taking God's name in vain Ex 20:7; Lev. 24:11-16; Matt.5:33-37; James 5:12

This guards against all needless, flippant, profane, blasphemous mention of God's name and word.

#4 Worship and rest on God's holy day Ex 20:8-11; Deut 5:13-15; Acts 20:7; Colossians 2:16-18.

The Christian's day of worship (1st day of the week) We are to be withdrawn from common employment and should be dedicated unto God.  Since we are not under the law but under grace I believe that all necessary work which cannot be postponed, and which could not have been done earlier such as caring for the sick, ministering in God's service and works of mercy and compassion can be done on the Lord's day Matt. 12:1-13; Luke 13:14-16.

The second table:

Commandments dealing with love towards our neighbours;

#5 Honouring parents Ex 20:12; Prov. 1:8; Eph. 6:1-3; Colossians 3:20.

Obedience has to do with action while honour has to do with attitude, but only in the Lord.

#6 Thou shalt not commit murder Ex 20:13; 21:14; Galatians 5:19-21; 1John 3:15.

Life is a man's most prized possession and it is a great sin to deprive someone of his life.  Those who assist, support, consent to, or conceal the sin of murder are all guilty before God.  Suicide is self-murder which is a great sin, abortion is also a sin against God, against the innocent blood and against humanity.

#7 No adultery Ex 20:14; Lev. 20:10-13,17; Matt. 5:27-30; Rom 7:2,3.

This applies to all kinds of sexual immorality such as fornication, adultery, premarital sex, homosexuality, lesbianism, masturbation, uncleanness and anything that excites evil passions and lust of the flesh, such as immodest dressing, immoral speech, pornographic pictures etc.  Jesus made it clear that adultery is in the heart and occurs even before any outward act.  God is pure and He requires us to flee from all unrighteousness.

#8 Thou shalt not steal Ex 20:15; Lev. 19:11-13; Mark 7:21-23; 1Thess. 4:6.

The unjust taking and keeping to ourselves what is lawfully another's.  He is a thief who withholds what ought to be in his neighbour's possession just as much as one who takes his neighbour's property.  We should resist the spirit of selfishness and maintain the virtue of contentment.

#9 No false witness Ex. 20:16; Lev. 19:16; Deut. 19:16-20; Ephesians 4:25; Rev. 21:8.

God forbids false witness, lying, deception and giving of false testimony in court or elsewhere.  A lie consists of three elements; speaking what is not true, deliberately doing so, and doing so with intent to deceive.  A report should never be repeated until the truth is verified.  Those who maliciously invent falshood for the purpose of damaging the reputation of others are guilty of a great sin before God.

#10 Thou shalt not covet Ex 20:17; Isaiah 57:17; Lk. 12:15; 1Tim. 6:6-11.

This commandment forbids us to covet anything that is our neighbours, neither their spouses nor their goods.  It forbids the inward desire to possess what belongs to others.  All sins begin in the heart and God condemns evil desires in the heart.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria?topic=14450.msg1376205#msg1376205

I will appreciate it if you can explain to us how you interposed  the third commandment with the second

Some more important commandments from Exodus 34;

24 I will drive out nations before you and enlarge your territory, and no one will covet your land when you go up three times each year to appear before the LORD your God.

25 "Do not offer the blood of a sacrifice to me along with anything containing yeast, and do not let any of the sacrifice from the Passover Feast remain until morning.

26 "Bring the best of the firstfruits of your soil to the house of the LORD your God. "Do not cook a young goat in its mother's milk."

27 Then the LORD said to Moses, "Write down these words, for in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel."

OLAADEGBU:

@imhotep, If you are referring to the decalogue, it is very clear that The LORD God Almighty personally wrote it with His own finger in two table of stones, and are written in this order;

The first table:

Commandments dealing with love towards God;

#1 No other gods Ex 20:3; 34:14; Ps.73:25;81:9;Isa.43:10;Matt.4:10;1John 5:21

This guards against any form of mental or internal idolatry. Not giving anyone or anything in heaven or in earth that inward affection, worship, veneration or dependence that is due only to the true God.

#2 No graven images Ex 20:4-6; 34:12-17; Rom 1:21-24,32; 1Thess 1:9.

This guards against any form of external idolatry. Such as when pictures or images of people are being observed as possessing divine powers and are adored, either at churches or places of pagan worship, they become idols.

#3 Not taking God's name in vain Ex 20:7; Lev. 24:11-16; Matt.5:33-37; James 5:12

This guards against all needless, flippant, profane, blasphemous mention of God's name and word.

#4 Worship and rest on God's holy day Ex 20:8-11; Deut 5:13-15; Acts 20:7; Colossians 2:16-18.

The Christian's day of worship (1st day of the week) We are to be withdrawn from common employment and should be dedicated unto God. Since we are not under the law but under grace I believe that all necessary work which cannot be postponed, and which could not have been done earlier such as caring for the sick, ministering in God's service and works of mercy and compassion can be done on the Lord's day Matt. 12:1-13; Luke 13:14-16.

The second table:

Commandments dealing with love towards our neighbours;

#5 Honouring parents Ex 20:12; Prov. 1:8; Eph. 6:1-3; Colossians 3:20.

Obedience has to do with action while honour has to do with attitude, but only in the Lord.

#6 Thou shalt not commit murder Ex 20:13; 21:14; Galatians 5:19-21; 1John 3:15.

Life is a man's most prized possession and it is a great sin to deprive someone of his life. Those who assist, support, consent to, or conceal the sin of murder are all guilty before God. Suicide is self-murder which is a great sin, abortion is also a sin against God, against the innocent blood and against humanity.

#7 No adultery Ex 20:14; Lev. 20:10-13,17; Matt. 5:27-30; Rom 7:2,3.

This applies to all kinds of sexual immorality such as fornication, adultery, premarital sex, homosexuality, lesbianism, masturbation, uncleanness and anything that excites evil passions and lust of the flesh, such as immodest dressing, immoral speech, pornographic pictures etc. Jesus made it clear that adultery is in the heart and occurs even before any outward act. God is pure and He requires us to flee from all unrighteousness.

#8 Thou shalt not steal Ex 20:15; Lev. 19:11-13; Mark 7:21-23; 1Thess. 4:6.

The unjust taking and keeping to ourselves what is lawfully another's. He is a thief who withholds what ought to be in his neighbour's possession just as much as one who takes his neighbour's property. We should resist the spirit of selfishness and maintain the virtue of contentment.

#9 No false witness Ex. 20:16; Lev. 19:16; Deut. 19:16-20; Ephesians 4:25; Rev. 21:8.

God forbids false witness, lying, deception and giving of false testimony in court or elsewhere. A lie consists of three elements; speaking what is not true, deliberately doing so, and doing so with intent to deceive. A report should never be repeated until the truth is verified. Those who maliciously invent falshood for the purpose of damaging the reputation of others are guilty of a great sin before God.

#10 Thou shalt not covet Ex 20:17; Isaiah 57:17; Lk. 12:15; 1Tim. 6:6-11.

This commandment forbids us to covet anything that is our neighbours, neither their spouses nor their goods. It forbids the inward desire to possess what belongs to others. All sins begin in the heart and God condemns evil desires in the heart.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria?topic=14450.msg1376205#msg1376205

I will appreciate it if you can explain to us how you interposed the fourth commandment with the second

I suggest you go and study the Catholic cathechism. The treatment of the Ten commandments starts here => http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2.htm

imhotep:

I suggest you go and study the Catholic catechism. The treatment of the Ten commandments starts here => http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2.htm

I think i am beginning to know where you belong imhotep. Its obvious you are being mischievous and untruthful to yourself. If someone is deceiving you, i think it is better than you deceiving yourself. I think my challenge was lucid enough. The topic is very direct; talking about the ten commandments. Do you have the balls to list them accordingly? Show us the direct links in that same Vatican site that has all the ten commandments they are teaching you.

You use all sorts of names but you yourself are docking and not being truthful to yourself. The question remains: why did the Catholic Church redefine the ten commandments? Why? Why would God write with His finger on a tablet and some mortals alter the content and order and give it to you to follow and yet you come here saying all sorts of things that dont sound convincing even to you!

Are you in a cult where even if an error or serious heresy is discovered, you still prefer to go on with it like that? Is it to justify your worship of mary of the apparitions not of the bible) that they removed the second commandments as it relates directly to your veneration of mary? We are listening. Help our"shallow reasoning?" we want to know.

I have not lost anyone in the crusades, neither did i loose anything to any catholic, so why should i hate? Forget that your attempt to draw sympathy by labeling us haters. Face the issues that stare you in the face my bro. Must you stick to an error? Admit error in your doctrines or Catechism and we move on! Simple!!! Why did they split commandment ten into two?

Can you be bold enough bro to alter what God has written? Is that not removing from the scriptures? Do you know what that means? This is it: Re 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

cgift:

I think i am beginning to know where you belong imhotep. Its obvious you are being mischievous and untruthful to yourself. If someone is deceiving you, i think it is better than you deceiving yourself. I think my challenge was lucid enough. The topic is very direct; talking about the ten commandments. Do you have the balls to list them accordingly? Show us the direct links in that same Vatican site that has all the ten commandments they are teaching you.

You use all sorts of names but you yourself are docking and not being truthful to yourself. The question remains: why did the Catholic Church redefine the ten commandments? Why? Why would God write with His finger on a tablet and some mortals alter the content and order and give it to you to follow and yet you come here saying all sorts of things that don't sound convincing even to you!

Are you in a cult where even if an error or serious heresy is discovered, you still prefer to go on with it like that? Is it to justify your worship of mary of the apparitions not of the bible) that they removed the second commandments as it relates directly to your veneration of mary? We are listening. Help our"shallow reasoning?" we want to know.

I have not lost anyone in the crusades, neither did i loose anything to any catholic, so why should i hate? Forget that your attempt to draw sympathy by labeling us haters. Face the issues that stare you in the face my bro. Must you stick to an error? Admit error in your doctrines or Catechism and we move on! Simple!!! Why did they split commandment ten into two?

Can you be bold enough bro to alter what God has written? Is that not removing from the scriptures? Do you know what that means? This is it: Re 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

@cgift
Go and study. Stop recycling ignorance in the information age.

To save you guys some time, I have taken the liberty to list them here:

The REAL Ten Commandments (Exodus 34) are ,




1. "For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:" (Exodus 34:14)

2. "Thou shalt make thee no molten gods." (Exodus 34:17)

3. "The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep. Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread, as I commanded thee, in the time of the month Abib: for in the month Abib thou camest out from Egypt." (Exodus 34:18)

4a. "All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male." (Exodus 34:19)

4b. "But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty." (Exodus 34:20)

5. "Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest." (Exodus 34:21)

6. "And thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end." (Exodus 34:22)

7. "Thrice in the year shall all your menchildren appear before the LORD God, the God of Israel." (Exodus 34:23)

8. "Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven; neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning." (Exodus 34:25)

9. "The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God." (Exodus 34:26)

10. "Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk." (Exodus 34:26)

@huxley
Thanks for the contribution.

The Cathechism of the Catholic church commented EXHAUSTIVELY on this passage=>
Exodus20:1-17

Exodus20:1-17:

1 Then God delivered all these commandments:

2 "I, the LORD, am your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery.

3 You shall not have other gods besides me.

4 You shall not carve idols for yourselves in the shape of anything in the sky above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth;

5 you shall not bow down before them or worship them. For I, the LORD, your God, am a jealous God, inflicting punishment for their fathers' wickedness on the children of those who hate me, down to the third and fourth generation;

6 but bestowing mercy down to the thousandth generation, on the children of those who love me and keep my commandments.

7 "You shall not take the name of the LORD, your God, in vain. For the LORD will not leave unpunished him who takes his name in vain.

8 "Remember to keep holy the sabbath day.

9 Six days you may labor and do all your work,

10 but the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD, your God. No work may be done then either by you, or your son or daughter, or your male or female slave, or your beast, or by the alien who lives with you.

11 In six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them; but on the seventh day he rested. That is why the LORD has blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.

12 "Honor your father and your mother, that you may have a long life in the land which the LORD, your God, is giving you.

13 "You shall not kill.

14 "You shall not commit adultery.

15 "You shall not steal.

16 "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

17 "You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his male or female slave, nor his ox or ass, nor anything else that belongs to him."

cgift appears to be blinded by hatred. That may be why he keeps looking for someone to argue with.

@cgift

Again, this is for your consumption =>

Martin_Israel:
There are some religious groups who wage a constant war on what they regard as the demonic powers that influence the world. These people are usually unaware that most of the demonic forces originate from within themselves and are then projected on to any person or group to whom they feel antagonistic. In the end all those who disagree with them are identified with the devil and his works.

Many such deluded people are in fact abnormally sensitive psychically, but have not come to terms with their own condition or analysed their impressions dispassionately. If they had the courage and the intelligence to do this, they would realise that most of the demonic forces they encountered were part of the spirit of fear and ignorance that pervades the world and is dominating their own consciousness.

Source ["Smouldering Fire: The work of the Holy Spirit" ] => http://www.martinisrael.u-net.com/fire/chapter13.html

In other words, from the arguments presented so far above, we see that the Children of Israel have not lived up to the Commandments  of God who specifically chosen them and brought them out of great trials in Egypt and on to safety. Please can such a people still continue to be the chosen, over all others who have not even been tested for worthiness? I mean there has not been a proof that the Chinese or some Subsahara African tribes have been tested for chosen worthiness like the Tribes of the Children of Israel. Has there been?  Deity that will continue to cling to these people while rejecting the others, without ever given them a chance will have no single reason to throw anybody in fire, except the Children of Israel!

But ironically, the Christians fail the same test of commandments, which are in the Bible. Or has Jesus abrogated every last one of them? Think people! The last days of Jesus' ministry all the way to him being deitified by those who claim to be Christians, regardless of the sects, are the very opposite of true obedience to God! How is it that you believe in a part of Book, and yet disbelieving other part of what you call your religious book? Is that true belief?

@CGift: Which of the 10 commandments is missing from the Catholic Bible? And do the Protestants obey everyone of them, or they have reasons to disobey any: Like where it concerns the Unity of God?

Can any of these two groups above truly say that it believes? And Jesus picture all over the places? When was Pinhole camera developed, again? I think all mankind needs a jolt of reality! There is only One God and He is indivisible! He is unseen. There is none like unto Him. And He is unlike to anyone, in every respect and meaning of the words!

How do we have a relationship with God: It is not tribe like the Jews/Children of Israel who cling to supremacy by tribal bloodlines. Or like the Christians who divide God Almighty into parts, whereby a part is beginning another part before he dies through the hands of ordinary man. While all along another part is just sitting there, being very inactive. Yet all of these parts are coequal and still one? Is there any logic and good thinking about it?

The only way to have a relationship with Him, is not like the atheist or the agnostics who disregard His Lordship and His existence even. But in the same way that He had instructed all the human Prophets, from Adam onward, ending up with Mu/hammad: There is no God save Him, God the Almighty Creator. Worship Him alone and associate no partner(s) with Him, in any form. Reject all other gods and worships. Follow the way of the prophet of your time! This is the right guidance.

1 THEN GOD spoke all these words:
    2 I am the Lord your God, Who has brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

    3 You shall have no other gods before or besides Me.

    4 You shall not make yourself any graven image [to worship it] or any likeness of anything that is in the heavens above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth;

    5 You shall not bow down yourself to them or serve them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate Me,

    6 But showing mercy and steadfast love to a thousand generations of those who love Me and keep My commandments.

    7 You shall not use or repeat the name of the Lord your God in vain [that is, lightly or frivolously, in false affirmations or profanely]; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

    8 [Earnestly] remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy (withdrawn from common employment and dedicated to God).

    9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work,
    10 But the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, your daughter, your manservant, your maidservant, your domestic animals, or the sojourner within your gates.

    11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. That is why the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it [set it apart for His purposes].

    12 Regard (treat with honor, due obedience, and courtesy) your father and mother, that your days may be long in the land the Lord your God gives you.

    13 You shall not commit murder.

    14 You shall not commit adultery.

    15 You shall not steal.

    16 You shall not witness falsely against your neighbor.

    17 You shall not covet your neighbor's house, your neighbor's wife, or his manservant, or his maidservant, or his ox, or his donkey, or anything that is your neighbor's.   Exodus 20:1-17  Amplified Bible.

@imhotep,
I have read your church traditions that you directed me to but I did not find the explanation why they decided to omit the second commandment (verses 4-6) from the decalogue.  It was omitted completely! while the tenth (verse 17) was duplicated.  http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s1c3a3.htm
Scroll down to the 10 commandments just after #2051

This passage =>

Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

is well discussed in the Cathechism here => http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm

How did cgift manage to conclude that Ex20:4 is missing in the Cathechism

This is a very interesting paragraph quoted above:
Quote from: Martin_Israel
There are some religious groups who wage a constant war on what they regard as the demonic powers that influence the world. These people are usually unaware that most of the demonic forces originate from within themselves and are then projected on to any person or group to whom they feel antagonistic. In the end all those who disagree with them are identified with the devil and his works.

Many such deluded people are in fact abnormally sensitive psychically, but have not come to terms with their own condition or analysed their impressions dispassionately. If they had the courage and the intelligence to do this, they would realise that most of the demonic forces they encountered were part of the spirit of fear and ignorance that pervades the world and is dominating their own consciousness.


I wonder how this applies to a situation whereby one party presents historical facts in the course of a discussion and straight away the other party hurls accusations of hate, vilification and persecution. As well as accusing the initial party of being protestant when in fact the initial party couldn't give a flying monkeys about either catholicism or protestantism or any of the innumerable sects that make claim to the name christian.

Could it be that the 2nd party is in fact afflicted by to the extent of being 'deluded people' who 'are in fact abnormally sensitive psychically but have not come to terms with their own condition or analysed their impressions dispassionately.'

PastorAIO:
I wonder how this applies to a situation whereby one party presents historical facts in the course of a discussion and straight away the other party hurls accusations of hate, vilification and persecution.  As well as accusing the initial party of being protestant when in fact the initial party couldn't give a flying monkeys about either catholicism or protestantism or any of the innumerable sects that make claim to the name christian. 

Could it be that the 2nd party is in fact afflicted by to the extent of  being 'deluded people' who 'are in fact abnormally sensitive psychically but have not come to terms with their own condition or analysed their impressions dispassionately.'

Same old tactic =>  Whenever you are cornered, dodge the issue.

imhotep:

Same old tactic =>  Whenever you are cornered, dodge the issue.

oh, so I'm cornered now. I never woulda guessed. I'm getting more and more certain that you are delusional with every post you put up.

Pastor AIO:

oh, so I'm cornered now. I never woulda guessed. I'm getting more and more certain that you are delusional with every post you put up.

Stop trying to divert the thread.

Which commandments should we be debating about; those in Exodus 20 or those in Exodus 34? I think it is most important to establish this first before we can move the debate forward.

Cgift,
I also am waiting to see a scholarly response to your challenge . . .but I am 100% sure they have no answers.

Imhotep,
this can all be very simple if you'll just simply list in order from 1 - 10 the 10 commandments as taught in the cathechism here instead of posting links to hundreds of pages and asking the poster to go and study. And you like playing the "victim card" too much. Cgift is simply challenging you, he put forth his evidence, why not engage and respond and rebutt, instead of accusing him of hatred, etc?

huxley,
we all know who you really are. . . christians know what the 10 commandments are, OLAADEGBU already posted them, so stop trying to disrupt the thread. If you're still confused here's wikipedia, even they know what the ten commandments are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Commandments

JeSoul:

huxley,
we all know who you really are. . . christians know what the 10 commandments are, OLAADEGBU already posted them, so stop trying to disrupt the thread. If you're still confused here's wikipedia, even they know what the ten commandments are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Commandments

What should we do with those commandments in Exodus 34 then? Disregard them? Mind you, these were the commandments in the Holy of Holies.

huxley:

What should we do with those commandments in Exodus 34 then? Disregard them? Mind you, these were the commandments in the Holy of Holies.

Dude, I think you should disregard them. After all everyone else is!

huxley:

What should we do with those commandments in Exodus 34 then? Disregard them? Mind you, these were the commandments in the Holy of Holies.

 *shaking my head*
you don't have to pretend with me and act like you actually and really care and want to know. The 10 commandments and plain and obvious for all to see. As I said, even the secular minds at wikipedia did a great job of listing them and giving the history behind it. There is no controversy anywhere so stop trying to fan a fire that was never lit.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Commandments

I'd rather be silent because small time now the Catholics would find offence in my comment.
May the LORD forgive them because they know not what they are doing.Afterall the bible says
that no one should either add or remove anything from the book but then ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Pastor AIO:

Dude, I think you should disregard them. After all everyone else is!

What is the criteria for disregarding one rather than the other? Are you saying that those people who god killed for touching the Ark of the Covenant would have lost their lives over something that would later be disregarded by subsequent generations? What a waste?

JeSoul:

*shaking my head*
you don't have to pretend with me and act like you actually and really care and want to know. The 10 commandments and plain and obvious for all to see. As I said, even the secular minds at wikipedia did a great job of listing them and giving the history behind it. There is no controversy anywhere so stop trying to fan a fire that was never lit.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Commandments

I am NOT pretending, far from it. You know my other pseudonyms(therationa, tpaine).

What we now generally accept as the 10C have essentially been established by tradition rather than analysis. So it is no surprise the Ex20 is given preference over Ex34. The question I am asking is why this is so, when clearly Ex34 are a replacement of Ex20. Did the people who lost their lives over the Ark do so in vain. What was the purpose of securing the Ex34 10C in the Ark and in the Holy of Holies, if it would only be ignored by modern day believers?

@Kola Oloye:

I'd rather be silent because small time now the Catholics would find offence in my comment.
May the LORD forgive them because they know not what they are doing.Afterall the bible says
that no one should either add or remove anything from the book but then ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Who was the speaker? Was that speaker saying that Paul and the original apostles statements incluisive or not? (Paul and the Original apostles; It kinda sounds like a musical group, doesn't it?)

I wonder if the Speaker, would accept the opinions of Paul, which are clearly different from "inspired."

@JeSoul: How was the marathon, yesterday?