nku5:

I've heard about how the influx of people into Lagos is a burden on state infrastructure. Its a bit of a grey area for me. Could any one shed more light on this?

Imagine a family of 4 leaving in a three bedroom house. Then the mother's 4 brothers move in. 6 months later, the father's 5 sisters move in. Do you see how 13 people leaving a house meant for no more than 5 could hasten the house's deterioration?

aletheia:
...suggestions on a differential tax regime are impractical, discriminatory and run counter to the rights of Nigerians to reside anywhere in Nigeria.

Scenarios:

Mr A. just completed primary school and decided to come to Lagos after months of urging by his brother who's living in Lagos this past 5 years. Mr A. arrives and takes up work as a shoe-shiner/porter. According to the proposed tax regimen, being a new "immigrant", he ought to pay for instance an income tax of 35%. Several problems immediately arise:
a) How on earth, is the LASG going to assess his daily income for tax purposes?
b) No doubt Mr A. belongs to the lowest income band, and by progressive taxation principles ought to even be exempt from tax!

Mr B. a top company executive is newly redeployed to Lagos by his company. Since his income is readily traceable, the LASG is able to skim 35% off his pay. On Fridays, he likes to go clubbing...but the problem is how on earth he is going to pay the 17% VAT on the beer he drinks as a newly arrived "immigrant" to Lagos...since the bar man doesn't ask for his duly stamped passport showing the date he crossed Lagos state's borders.

Mr C. has been in Lagos for 15 years now. All his children were born in Lagos and attend Lagos schools. Since he works in Alausa as a civil servant, every month, regular as clockwork, LASG takes off income tax of 25% as a "longstanding" resident. Brother J. arrives from village to stay with him while learning "trade". I wonder how LASG is going to tax Brother J. for the privilege of being newly arrived in Lagos.

If only, Mr A. and Brother J. had stayed back in their states and not come to Lagos to increase the population without engaging in taxable economic activities. Perhaps if there were more economic opportunities back home in their states...

talktimi: This topic has been bandied around in different flavors on NL for some time now & i believe the main goal is to kick igbo's out of the state no matter how our amiable op decides to disguise her reasons. So for peace to reign, lets support OP to push for the creation of the federal republic of Lagos state. Abi wetin una want make i talk ?

As soon as i saw thread title and creator of it, I already knew her intentions even if disguised. Poor soul. smh

The problem with those that come up with such lofty ideas is that they've lived overseas for so long and thus the reality of what is happening back home is seen "on the surface"...

I don't know if he thought through how possible his suggestion was, but as usual... (happens on here a lot) ... he spews all his stuff so eloquently and his supporters will come pat him on his back... taking all he said hook line and sinker whether they understand what he said or not, talk less of seeing the challenges such suggestions will pose or its impractitality.

(reminds me of Wole... blow all his grammer and his villagers hail him ...

aletheia:

Scenarios:

Mr A. just completed primary school and decided to come to Lagos after months of urging by his brother who's living in Lagos this past 5 years. Mr A. arrives and takes up work as a shoe-shiner/porter. According to the proposed tax regimen, being a new "immigrant", he ought to pay for instance an income tax of 35%. Several problems immediately arise:
a) How on earth, is the LASG going to assess his daily income for tax purposes?
b) No doubt Mr A. belongs to the lowest income band, and by progressive taxation principles ought to even be exempt from tax!

Mr B. a top company executive is newly redeployed to Lagos by his company. Since his income is readily traceable, the LASG is able to skim 35% off his pay. On Fridays, he likes to go clubbing...but the problem is how on earth he is going to pay the 17% VAT on the beer he drinks as a newly arrived "immigrant" to Lagos...since the bar man doesn't ask for his duly stamped passport showing the date he crossed Lagos state's borders.

Mr C. has been in Lagos for 15 years now. All his children were born in Lagos and attend Lagos schools. Since he works in Alausa as a civil servant, every month, regular as clockwork, LASG takes off income tax of 25% as a "longstanding" resident. Brother J. arrives from village to stay with him while learning "trade". I wonder how LASG is going to tax Brother J. for the privilege of being newly arrived in Lagos.

If only, Mr A. and Brother J. had stayed back in their states and not come to Lagos to increase the population without engaging in taxable economic activities. Perhaps if there were more economic opportunities back home in their states...

When did Lagos remove "Ibo indigenes"?

Show me one "removed Ibo" and I will show you 10 removed Yorubas...

(The bus that offloaded "deportees" in Onitsha that made you happy, we later realized when a sample of the names were published that they were mostly your fellow yubas being ejected....

...

Desola:

Is it, really? Isn't Lagos equally a sovereign state? If it has power to remove unproductive non-indigenes like it did some ibo indigenes then surely, it can be suggested that it possesses the power to control it's borders, non?

@ Desola: I'm sorry, but your topic is absolute trash. Lagos, as others have stated, is NOT a SOVEREIGN nation; hence there is no need to control any 'border'.

Katsumoto:

Imagine a family of 4 leaving in a three bedroom house. Then the mother's 4 brothers move in. 6 months later, the father's 5 sisters move in. Do you see how 13 people leaving a house meant for no more than 5 could hasten the house's deterioration?

Sure I can understand that but note that the example you gave is of a privately owned house being let for profit. I am interested in knowing the STATE OWNED infrastructure as stated by the OP that is under pressure by the influx of ppl to Lagos. Besides maybe use of the roads to get to and fro I can't actually think of any.

nku5:

Sure I can understand that but note that the example you gave is of a privately owned house being let for profit. I am interested in knowing the STATE OWNED infrastructure as stated by the OP that is under pressure by the influx of ppl to Lagos. Besides maybe use of the roads to get to and fro I can't actually think of any.

sorry to come in but i think that scenario sums up everything.. he didnt say the house was private/public owned . HOUSE is HOUSE in the hypothetical explanation

The unfortunate thing is that Lagos needs to be scrapped as a State and given a special status.

For the fact that Lagos host most multi-nationals who do business in other part of the Country should not be under estimated. The Lagos ports will be a grave yards if the citizens of 35 states of the Federation were to abandon it.

Lagos is nothing without it's population density.

To my learned friend that was talking about the introduction of a peculiar tax regime, my question based on your different analyses is "Will you tax human body or just income as no income, no tax. What of VAT?

Lagos State is not synonymous with Yoruba Confederation and can never be in this 21st century.

Katsumoto: I am for controlling the growing population in Lagos but not along ethnic lines. The best way to accomplish this task is along economic lines. Lagos has to reduce the size of the underground economy; Fashola has made good progress in this regard.

Then it should introduce taxes intended to discourage immigration to it's borders. For instance, residents who have been paying taxes for 10 years should pay 25% income taxes while new immigrants should pay 35%. This can also be applied to all other consumer and business taxes. The additional revenue can be used to maintain recurrent expenditure, which would be higher given the burden on infrastructure by new immigrants. Mind you, this tax would apply to all, including those from other SW states. Residents can also be issued cards which can be used to consumers at source. Again 10 plus year residents can pay 12% VAT while new immigrants pay 17%.

Lagos can also enter into a partnership with Ogun to build residential estates in Ogun and provide rail between Ogun and commercial centers in Lagos. Businesses can also relocate plants and industrial parks to Ogun leaving Lagos with just office space.

as usual you are spot on.

Ngwakwe: The unfortunate thing is that Lagos needs to be scrapped as a State and given a special status.

For the fact that Lagos host most multi-nationals who do business in other part of the Country should not be under estimated. The Lagos ports will be a grave yards if the citizens of 35 states of the Federation were to abandon it.

Lagos is nothing without it's population density.

To my learned friend that was talking about the introduction of a peculiar tax regime, my question based on your different analyses is "Will you tax human body or just income as no income, no tax. What of VAT?

Lagos State is not synonymous with Yoruba Confederation and can never be in this 21st century.

Are you really asking this question?

Funny topic

aletheia:

Scenarios:

Mr A. just completed primary school and decided to come to Lagos after months of urging by his brother who's living in Lagos this past 5 years. Mr A. arrives and takes up work as a shoe-shiner/porter. According to the proposed tax regimen, being a new "immigrant", he ought to pay for instance an income tax of 35%. Several problems immediately arise:
a) How on earth, is the LASG going to assess his daily income for tax purposes?
b) No doubt Mr A. belongs to the lowest income band, and by progressive taxation principles ought to even be exempt from tax!

Mr B. a top company executive is newly redeployed to Lagos by his company. Since his income is readily traceable, the LASG is able to skim 35% off his pay. On Fridays, he likes to go clubbing...but the problem is how on earth he is going to pay the 17% VAT on the beer he drinks as a newly arrived "immigrant" to Lagos...since the bar man doesn't ask for his duly stamped passport showing the date he crossed Lagos state's borders.

Mr C. has been in Lagos for 15 years now. All his children were born in Lagos and attend Lagos schools. Since he works in Alausa as a civil servant, every month, regular as clockwork, LASG takes off income tax of 25% as a "longstanding" resident. Brother J. arrives from village to stay with him while learning "trade". I wonder how LASG is going to tax Brother J. for the privilege of being newly arrived in Lagos.

If only, Mr A. and Brother J. had stayed back in their states and not come to Lagos to increase the population without engaging in taxable economic activities. Perhaps if there were more economic opportunities back home in their states...

Mr A – You miss the obvious intent of the policy. The government is not encouraging immigration for folks like Mr A. There are millions of people with similar skill-set; isn’t it better to protect their already low wages from becoming lower with increased supply? By introducing a harsh policy, Mr A will not bother to travel to Lagos and if he does, it won’t take long before he is back on the bus. Assessing what Mr A pays is simple – in the absence of concrete data, tax assessors will make assumptions. The cost of a shoe shine is easily ascertainable. What you want to know is how many shines does he give in a day? Before implementing the policy, a special unit will stand in a popular spot and observe all kinds of labour over the course of say a week, a month, etc. Once you have that, you can estimate the monthly revenue, and then apply say 20% for those who have been in Lagos for over ten years and say 30% for those with lower number of years.

Mr B. This is very easily dealt with. The state government levies the higher tax rates on all consumers, those who want to pay the lower rate will produce their proof – tax certificate, Lagos registration card, resident cards, etc. So Mr B will pay the higher rate regardless.

Mr J is not the problem of Lagos state as long as he isn’t earning an income. If he is living with his brother rent-free, eating free, his brother will ensure he picks up a trade soon enough. While he is learning, he pays no income tax but as soon as he enters a bar or pepper soup joint, he pays the higher consumption tax rate of 17% as against the 12% his brother will pay or he gets his brother to buy his drinks.
In any case, the law can be circumvented at times but not always and the state government will realize increased revenue to deal with the effects of excessive immigration on its infrastructure. In most western nations, you will find speed limits on roads. Most people abide by these limits but there are times when a few don’t abide. Can police men catch everyone who breaks the speed limit? No, but the police will surely catch some and those caught will face the law. The prospect of facing the law is what makes most people to conform. The seriousness with which a government enforces a policy will determine its success or failure. If Lagos implements these policies without dedicating resources to enforce its implementation will surely lead to failure and ridicule.

Yes perhaps they had more opportunities back home but how can Lagos affect the policies in their home states?
BTW, thanks for the apology.

phantom: as usual you are spot on.

Thanks

remark D: The problem with those that come up with such lofty ideas is that they've lived overseas for so long and thus the reality of what is happening back home is seen "on the surface"...

I don't know if he thought through how possible his suggestion was, but as usual... (happens on here a lot) ... he spews all his stuff so eloquently and his supporters will come pat him on his back... taking all he said hook line and sinker whether they understand what he said or not, talk less of seeing the challenges such suggestions will pose or its impractitality.

(reminds me of Wole... blow all his grammer and his villagers hail him ...

It must be a bi.t.ch to have low self-esteem issues. Who goes on to an anonymous forum seeking supporters? Is Nairaland a political party? Get a life and don’t let that hate/bad belle weigh you down.

Ngwakwe: The unfortunate thing is that Lagos needs to be scrapped as a State and given a special status.

For the fact that Lagos host most multi-nationals who do business in other part of the Country should not be under estimated. The Lagos ports will be a grave yards if the citizens of 35 states of the Federation were to abandon it.

Lagos is nothing without it's population density.

To my learned friend that was talking about the introduction of a peculiar tax regime, my question based on your different analyses is "Will you tax human body or just income as no income, no tax. What of VAT?

Lagos State is not synonymous with Yoruba Confederation and can never be in this 21st century.

I understand your position. You have your eyes on what doesn’t belong to you. Special status ko, UN status ni. Lagos is a Yoruba state and will always be one. You can take that to the bank. Instead of giving Lagos special status, why don’t you demand more from the incompetent governors you vote for in your father’s state? No one asked citizens of the other states to go back, the discussion is about slowing down the pace of immigration to Lagos and perhaps some emigration from it.

Whether you like it or not, Lagos was a commercial center even before Lugard amalgamated North and South Nigeria. If you folks think Lagos won’t survive, why don’t you organize a movement for everyone to leave? Switzerland must be a poor country with the low levels of immigration it has. As for the ridiculous question you asked about taxation, if you need it explained to you, just ask.

nku5:

Sure I can understand that but note that the example you gave is of a privately owned house being let for profit. I am interested in knowing the STATE OWNED infrastructure as stated by the OP that is under pressure by the influx of ppl to Lagos. Besides maybe use of the roads to get to and fro I can't actually think of any.

Roads – Have to repaired more often as a result of increased use by private cars and buses (increased demand will be met by more buses on the road)
Schools – many immigrants will enroll their kids in public schools. Requiring the state government to employ more teachers, buy more books, furniture. Where this isn’t done, the quality of education for ALL the children will suffer
Public Hospitals & Morgues – Same as schools
Waste – increased human and household waste. Government has more of that to deal with.
Pollution
Policing - Lagos has to contribute more to the police so as to increase the presence of police in the state.

There are other consequences of unrestricted immigration

Lagos gives more to the federal account than it takes from it

iykak47: Rubbish. Op(nairaland number one bigot), [b]don't forget also to tell 'your' Lagos state to stop going cap in hand to Abuja for monthly allocation which mainly comes from oil.
[/b]Anyway i don't blame you, wise men speak because they have something to say but f00ls speak because they have to say something.

The funny thing here is that most if the people posting on this thread seem not to understand the demographics of the so called immigrants.

Looking at it objectively, a sane and unbiased mind will see that at least 90% of the immigrants from. East of the Niger do not come to Lagos looking for jobs but fact is that they actually create employment both directly and indirectly.

Apart from corporate organisations that have their offices located in Lagos, the next major subset is commerce of which the immigrants from the East control. These traders are actually self employed and most of them have people working for them. Most if the immigrants from the East are able to pay exorbitant rents for shops and residential accommodations for years in advance which the indigenes can't thereby boosting the real estate sector of the Lagos economy. Commercial activities carried out by this people is the main reason you have bank branches at every nook and cranny of Lagos thereby creating employment in the banking and other related institutions.

Their presence in Lagos attracts foreigners from other West and Central African countries who come to Lagos to purchase their goods thereby boosting local economy.

All in all, I think Lagos state has gained more from the immigrants from across the Niger. If Lagos wants to control it's borders, they sure know where to look. Certainly not in the direction of the wise men from the East as a mass exodus of the men from the East will only spell doom for the local economy.

Everyone knows the tribes that constitute the destitute population of Lagos and besides, the Igbo population in public primary and secondary schools in Lagos is insignificant as most Igbo people in Lagos send their kids to private schools. I do not know what pressure the people from the East put on infrastructures in Lagos. We know those who live in slums in Lagos. Certainly not the Igbos.

A word is enough for the wise.

Sunny_bobo: The funny thing here is that most if the people posting on this thread seem not to understand the demographics of the so called immigrants.

Looking at it objectively, a sane and unbiased mind will see that at least 90% of the immigrants from. East of the Niger do not come to Lagos looking for jobs but fact is that they actually create employment both directly and indirectly.

Apart from corporate organisations that have their offices located in Lagos, the next major subset is commerce of which the immigrants from the East control. These traders are actually self employed and most of them have people working for them. Most if the immigrants from the East are able to pay exorbitant rents for shops and residential accommodations for years in advance which the indigenes can't thereby boosting the real estate sector of the Lagos economy. Commercial activities carried out by this people is the main reason you have bank branches at every nook and cranny of Lagos thereby creating employment in the banking and other related institutions.

Their presence in Lagos attracts foreigners from other West and Central African countries who come to Lagos to purchase their goods thereby boosting local economy.

All in all, I think Lagos state has gained more from the immigrants from across the Niger. If Lagos wants to control it's borders, they sure know where to look. Certainly not in the direction of the wise men from the East as a mass exodus of the men from the East will only spell doom for the local economy.

Everyone knows the tribes that constitute the destitute population of Lagos and besides, the Igbo population in public primary and secondary schools in Lagos is insignificant as most Igbo people in Lagos send their kids to private schools. I do not know what pressure the people from the East put on infrastructures in Lagos. We know those who live in slums in Lagos. Certainly not the Igbos.

A word is enough for the wise.

Bla bla bla same ppl that want Abokis out of Southeast.

Keep making up nonsense. Im sure you've verified your opinion abi?

Lol @ they dont come looking for jobs.........dude is a class Bytch clown

Lagos state does not need to tax more than they are already doing. Let the federal government today declared lagos a special status and more money to lagos and lagos to create or demand more tax, this problem will persist.

The problem is not the people rushing in on daily basis but corruption on the part of those at the helm of affair and their attitude to duty.

Tackle this problem and everything will fall into place.

Texas.Cowgirl:


Bla bla bla same ppl that want Abokis out of Southeast.

Keep making up nonsense. Im sure you've verified your opinion abi?

Lol @ they dont come looking for jobs.........dude is a class Bytch clown

I wonder where you got that from. Hope you are not high on 'Monkey tail'

The South East is the only region where nobody cares where you come from. Everyone is welcome as long as you can compete with the locals.

Sunny_bobo:
I wonder where you got that from. Hope you are not high on 'Monkey tail'

The South East is the only region where nobody cares where you come from. Everyone is welcome as long as you can compete with the locals.

Yepppp keep lying to yourself. Everyone is welcome indeed.

When you're done with your story, give me the name of this Nollywood movie.

enm: Lagos state does not need to tax more than they are already doing. Let the federal government today declared lagos a special status and more money to lagos and lagos to create or demand more tax, this problem will persist.

The problem is not the people rushing in on daily basis but corruption on the part of those at the helm of affair and their attitude to duty.

Tackle this problem and everything will fall into place.

It has clearly gone beyond more money now.

I don't want more money, I just want a check on immigration and string deterrence measures to be put in place so that these people can stay in their region and demand more from their government.

Enough is enough!

^^^^^^
Am i surprised? Just as i thought, your REAL intention. The real indigenous Lagosians wounldn't have time for such crap.

Lagos has to be decongested one way or the other. However deporting productive non-yorubas isn't the answer.

Yeske!:
^^^^^^
Am i surprised? Just as i thought, your REAL intention. The real indigenous Lagosians wounldn't have time for such crap.

You reckon?

Perhaps I'm from umiahia

Desola:

You reckon?

Perhaps I'm from umiahia

Darling, dont curse yourself

Sunny_bobo:
I wonder where you got that from. Hope you are not high on 'Monkey tail'

The South East is the only region where nobody cares where you come from. Everyone is welcome as long as you can compete with the locals.

should I burst this lie. you know I know alaigbo like the back of my palm. a land where you are not allowed to own landed properties and gross insecurity where the street boys waiting to rob your small change. oga make we hear word joke.

eggheaders:


should I burst this lie. you know I know alaigbo like the back of my palm. a land where you are not allowed to own landed properties and gross insecurity where the street boys waiting to rob your small change. oga make we hear word joke.

No mind am

Im just never chop apku this morning.

Desola:

You reckon?

Perhaps I'm from umiahia

So much for geography class! Nigerian education has really gone to the dogs. smh once again.

kelvincoll:

U probably should have titled it "controlling southwest borders" since the victims of ur concern as those "from the other part of the niger"... SMH

After we complain how Naijans are treated bad in other countries like South africa etc when we share same -ve attitude towards pple from a different tribe here. Recall the said influx of persons has increased the IGR via taxation etc which provides funds for better infrastructure in the same lagos

betterstill U could also help drum support for their long agitation for seperation from the nigerian state.

I was gonna say this then i realised you stole my words.
When re we actually gonna start living in harmony. With this kinda thinking, how can we have a true state of Nigeria?