@Sagamite
Ah.
I haven't gone searching for your position on forced child marriages. But your proud declaration that immorality of that magnitude would never get a foothold in Nigeria leaves no doubt that you've never spared a thought for that particular brand of immorality.

As for the assumption concerning my moniker, even if you associated 'texazz' with the state of Texas, it still doesn't mean i LIVE there, does it?

For the record, there's a character called Texas Pete in 'Superted'. Someone called me that once and it stuck.


Let's bury the hatchet, ok?

it's not to so hard to say i'm a supporter of freedom of choice, not necessarily a gay supporter. Irony? nah. it's like you claiming you're an extremely liberal feller

It is Hypocritical for Africans to shun gays. Unless you have a complete understanding the complexities of the brain then nobody should judge. Why is it hard to accept some people are just born gay while it is possible to accept others are born hermaphrodites. Also why should anybody care what two consenting adult do behind closed doors. Africans should accept gays and cease from being homophobic.

If the gay want to get married, let them be. After all, America is the land of the free.

Abegi, gay people are the least of our problems! California has been full of gay people since the 1920s. There is an actual tribe in Papua New Guinea (around Australia I think) that has been have "unnatural friendships" aka gay guys for centuries. Homosexuality is not new in so many cultures around the globe. Naija get bigger issues to confront than that nonsense. If d next question na if na my family nko? Eh-hen and so? DHL d relation abroad where dem go dey very free to do wetin dem want focus on d issues wey dey face naija! Haba. all d way to California. Na dis b our problem - deviation from the goal and lack of cohesion. Who cares if gay people can now marry? There are worse things - like "transgenders" around!

Mutegi:

It is Hypocritical for Africans to shun gays. Unless you have a complete understanding the complexities of the brain then nobody should judge. Why is it hard to accept some people are just born gay while it is possible to accept others are born hermaphrodites. Also why should anybody care what two consenting adult do behind closed doors. Africans should accept gays and cease from being homophobic.

Wow, gaddamit!!!

I have never seen such intellectual insight into a topic.

Since we don't understand the complexity of the human brain and hence should not judge why don't we just close down all our court houses and law enforcement arms.

What a progressive society we would have emerging from the mould.

Since incest normally involves 2 consenting adults, it should also be OK I guess.

SeanT21:

If the gay want to get married, let them be. After all, America is the land of the free.

If you don't understand the concept of freedom, you might do well by just keeping quiet.

omoovie:

Abegi, gay people are the least of our problems! California has been full of gay people since the 1920s. There is an actual tribe in Papua New Guinea (around Australia I think) that has been have "unnatural friendships" aka gay guys for centuries. Homosexuality is not new in so many cultures around the globe. Naija get bigger issues to confront than that nonsense. If d next question na if na my family nko? Eh-hen and so? DHL d relation abroad where them go dey very free to do wetin them want focus on d issues wey dey face naija! Haba. all d way to California. Na this b our problem - deviation from the goal and lack of cohesion. Who cares if gay people can now marry? There are worse things - like "transgenders" around!

Don't really know what to say to you because I don't know where to start.

texazzpete:

@Sagamite
Ah.
I haven't gone searching for your position on forced child marriages. But your proud declaration that immorality of that magnitude would never get a foothold in Nigeria leaves no doubt that you've never spared a thought for that particular brand of immorality.

As for the assumption concerning my moniker, even if you associated 'texazz' with the state of Texas, it still doesn't mean i LIVE there, does it?

For the record, there's a character called Texas Pete in 'Superted'. Someone called me that once and it stuck.


Let's bury the hatchet, ok?

it's not to so hard to say i'm a supporter of freedom of choice, not necessarily a gay supporter. Irony? nah. it's like you claiming you're an extremely liberal feller

No problem.

I develop my liberality in conjunction with a filter. Or else it would be useless liberality.

omoovie:

Abegi, gay people are the least of our problems! California has been full of gay people since the 1920s. There is an actual tribe in Papua New Guinea (around Australia I think) that has been have "unnatural friendships" aka gay guys for centuries. Homosexuality is not new in so many cultures around the globe. Naija get bigger issues to confront than that nonsense. If d next question na if na my family nko? Eh-hen and so? DHL d relation abroad where them go dey very free to do wetin them want focus on d issues wey dey face naija! Haba. all d way to California. Na this b our problem - deviation from the goal and lack of cohesion. Who cares if gay people can now marry? There are worse things - like "transgenders" around!

Are you baseing this on fact  beacause you have been there or hear say?

I think the world has still not woken up to the fact that a slow wind is blowing, starting vigorously from the western world. Homosexuality has gone from being an abominable act banished by the state to be defined as a "deviant" behavior with psycho- analysis of it to the present day acceptance of gay rights and gay communities.
I drive very often across Boylestown in Chicago with friends and we all can stand the "crazy" behavior manifested in that gay neighborhood- that however does not brush off the fact that these men and women are people like everyone- they deserve the same rights and freedom as everyone.

I think gays should be allowed to marry, adopt, do whatever it is they do or want to do provided it does not infringe on the rights of others. I think the gay issue will over time become a normal fabric of society. 100 years ago, some men were more equal than others, a woman had no say and issues such as heresy, adultery, fornication etc were all not accepted. Now look at where we have come a 100 years later- a black man and a woman are aspiring to be president, abortion is legal and people can worship or believe on whatever the hell they want to.

Gays are here to stay, I think what society should do at the moment is not what we must do to contain them, but what must be done to accept them.

Finally, anyone who says that Africa or Africans will never accept gays or gay relationships is simply ignoring history and time and pandering to sentiments. Gays are in Africa, will come out and will become a fabric of it -----with time!

Very long time by the grace of god.

NUSO OR NUZO, PLEASE WHY DON'T YOU ASK YOUR PARENTS, HOW IT FEELS TO BE GAY, I GUESS YOU ARE JUST THERE DECEIVING YOUR SELF AND THINKING THAT YOUR SINS WONT FIND YOU OUT. PLEASE DO GO THE SHOPS AND GETS SOME PAMPERS, I KNOW BY NOW SOMETHING MUST HAVE BEEN HAPPENING DOWN YOUS A SXXXXXXXXXXXX. BIG FOOL. SMELLY THING

A temporary victory for the gay rights groups. Within a year, this decision will come to nought.

Danmasani:

I think the world has still not woken up to the fact that a slow wind is blowing, starting vigorously from the western world. Homosexuality has gone from being an abominable act banished by the state to be defined as a "deviant" behavior with psycho- analysis of it to the present day acceptance of gay rights and gay communities.
I drive very often across Boylestown in Chicago with friends and we all can stand the "crazy" behavior manifested in that gay neighborhood- that however does not brush off the fact that these men and women are people like everyone- they deserve the same rights and freedom as everyone.

I think gays should be allowed to marry, adopt, do whatever it is they do or want to do provided it does not infringe on the rights of others. I think the gay issue will over time become a normal fabric of society. 100 years ago, some men were more equal than others, a woman had no say and issues such as heresy, adultery, fornication etc were all not accepted. Now look at where we have come a 100 years later- a black man and a woman are aspiring to be president, abortion is legal and people can worship or believe on whatever the hell they want to.

Gays are here to stay, I think what society should do at the moment is not what we must do to contain them, but what must be done to accept them.

Finally, anyone who says that Africa or Africans will never accept gays or gay relationships is simply ignoring history and time and pandering to sentiments. Gays are in Africa, will come out and will become a fabric of it -----with time!

Gays are not like anyone, just as paedophiles are not like everyone. We must contain them as much as we try to contain paedophiles.

Imagine in the UK, they claim gays are born that way and hence should be left alone but they send paedophiles for treatment. What makes them think they can give treatment to paedophiles but yet they feel they can not give one to gays when they have similar deviant disorders.

And for your information, it does infringe on a child's right to be brought up in an unnatural and deviant relationship irrespective of the presence of love or not. It does not serve their best interest. If I am correct, I thought laws were devised based on the best interest of a child?

@ Sagamite, you're wasting your precious time with the 'politically correct' crew. People can no longer disapprove the act of homosexuality without being labeled 'racist' or 'homophobic'. They won't pass the opportunity to compare the 'homosexual movement' to the civil rights movement. If you like, explain from Kabul to Kafanchan, they will never acknowledge that these are two parallel lines.

Sagamite:



Don't really know what to say to you because I don't know where to start.

LOL, I don't know whether to take that as a compliment (i.e. my logic is so flawless you can't break it) or as an insult (i.e. My logic is so flawed there is no hope). Either way I feel what I am saying is true. I don't want any gay people in my life don't want any as my offspring. I've discussed this with my sis and I told her I will have to become Jesus b4 I can accept a child of mine as gay - and since I am neither male, nor the Messiah---you get the picture. But I have met a lot of them and they are generally cool people. I don't believe they were born that way. A person is the result of their environment. The capacity is there but the definity is shaped/nurtured. I believe in live and let live so long as no one is hurting or infringing on anybody else. We as a nation have bigger fish to fry than who's gay or who isn't and who accepts it or doesn't. The Messiah of the world was a carpenter's son who hung out with tax collectors, lepers, fishermen and whores. You don't know where Naija's saviour is going to come from. If it's Denrele Egun will your reject him because he's bi-ish or gay? However, on the issue of pedophiles, I will not hesitate to lamblast them or even react in the same way as the mother in "Running Scared" because they ARE infringing on a person's right - the children's.

eiete:

Are you baseing this on fact beacause you have been there or hear say?

It could be hearsay, it could be fact. I haven't been there so I can't 100% state that I've seen them or met them. I'm basing it on a documentary of Papua New Guinea's tribes and another documentary called Women of the World in which the issue of gayness is explored and the hibitos (I know I'm spelling this wrong) came up as a tribe that fosters gayness in men.

omoovie:

LOL, I don't know whether to take that as a compliment (i.e. my logic is so flawless you can't break it) or as an insult (i.e. My logic is so flawed there is no hope). Either way I feel what I am saying is true. I don't want any gay people in my life don't want any as my offspring. I've discussed this with my sis and I told her I will have to become Jesus before I can accept a child of mine as gay - and since I am neither male, nor the Messiah---you get the picture. But I have met a lot of them and they are generally cool people. I don't believe they were born that way. A person is the result of their environment. The capacity is there but the definity is shaped/nurtured. I believe in live and let live so long as no one is hurting or infringing on anybody else. We as a nation have bigger fish to fry than who's gay or who isn't and who accepts it or doesn't. The Messiah of the world was a carpenter's son who hung out with tax collectors, lepers, fishermen and whores. You don't know where Naija's saviour is going to come from. If it's Denrele Egun will your reject him because he's bi-ish or gay? However, on the issue of pedophiles, I will not hesitate to lamblast them or even react in the same way as the mother in "Running Scared" because they ARE infringing on a person's right - the children's.

Omoovie, please stop.  You are going to make me crack a rib.

God, you made me laugh when you said "I don't want any gay people in my life".

You don't want them in your life but you are comfortable for them to run and promote unchecked in your society? I take it you don't count your society as part of your life. 

So when you have two men or women showing erotic affections to each other when you are taking your child to a destination and you child is asking for the explanation, that is not part of your life?

When the government includes in school curricullum that your offspring should be indoctrinated that being gay is a normal and functional way of life and anyone that objects to it is a bigot, that is not part of your life?

If, god forbid, something happens to you and your husband, then public officials have to choose between a straight and a gay couple to adopt you child, and based on their crazy assessment (based on acceptance of the gay lifestyle) judges that your offsprings are better of with the gay couple, that is not part of your life?

Well, I guess seeing the wider perspective is a rare skill.

You also said: "But I have met a lot of them and they are generally cool people." So are a lot of dysfunctional people. I even know a guy that is a friend of a friend, who all of us in my crew agree we will never leave our daughter with based on the types of girls he had shown sexual interest in when drunk at the Notting Hill carnival. He is also an extremely cool guy in my eyes until I saw that. He is a cool guy with tendencies I don't agree with and would never accept. People in incestious relationships can also be cool does that mean you have to accept their act.

As I live in the UK, I have inevitably worked with people that are openly gay. Because they are gay does not mean they would have a nasty personality, even a necrophilic does not necessarily have a nasty personality. Gay people even over-compensate with nicessities to counter their gayness. I generally am nice back but that does NOT MEAN I HAVE TO ACCEPT THE GAY ACTS. So, I hate it when people (especially women) turn around and say "but he is a nice person".

When gay colleagues invite me to an event they are organising out of work, I always make an excuse that it is my mum's, nephew's, girlfriend's birthday.

Denrele Egun can do whatever he wants to do as long as he is not using his position to leverage the gay cause.

Sagamite:



Omoovie, please stop.  You are going to make me crack a rib.

God, you made me laugh when you said "I don't want any gay people in my life".

You don't want them in your life but you are comfortable for them to run and promote unchecked in your society? I take it you don't count your society as part of your life. 

So when you have two men or women showing erotic affections to each other when you are taking your child to a destination and you child is asking for the explanation, that is not part of your life?

When the government includes in school curricullums that your offspring should be indoctrinated that being gay is a normal and functional way of life and anyone that objects to it is a bigot, that is not part of your life?

If, god forbid, something happens to you and your husband, then public officials have to choose between a straight and a gay couple to adopt you child, and based on their crazy assessment (based on acceptance of the gay lifestyle) judges that your offsprings are better of with the gay couple, that is not part of your life?

Well, I guess seeing the wider perspective is a rare skill.

You also said: "But I have met a lot of them and they are generally cool people." So are a lot of dysfunctional people. I even know a guy that is a friend of a friend, who all of us in my crew agree we will never leave our daughter with based on the types of girls he had shown sexual interest in when drunk at the Notting Hill carnival. He is also an extremely cool guy in my eyes until I saw that. He is a cool guy with tendencies I don't agree with and would never accept. People in incestious relationships can also be cool does that mean you have to accept their act.

As I live in the UK, I have inevitably worked with people that are openly gay. Because they are gay does not mean they would have a nasty personality, even a necrophilic does not necessarily have a nasty personality. Gay people even over-compensate with nicessities to counter their gayness. I generally am nice back but that does NOT MEAN I HAVE TO ACCEPT THE GAY ACTS. So, I hate it when people (especially women) turn around and say "but he is a nice person".

When gay colleagues invite me to an event they are organising out of work, I always make an excuse that it is my mum's, nephew's, girlfriend's birthday.

Denrele Egun can do whatever he wants to do as long as he is not using his position to leverage the gay cause.

You too please stop. You knew exactly what I meant/implied when I used that statement. I didn't mean life in a broader or social sense but life in a more personal close to home/familial sense. As you state later on you are civil and nice back to them doesn't mean you condone their acts. I have expressed the same my only addition being we have more important things to deal with that the issue of gayness. I may like them or be nice to them doesn't mean I support whatever they do behind closed doors or in public.

This statement:

"Well, I guess seeing the wider perspective is a rare skill"

and this:

"So, I hate it when people (especially women) turn around and say "but he is a nice person""

is elitist in nature. Please refrain from that next time you try to put a point across. I did NOT say let us accept all gay people with wide open arms because they are nice. I said let's live and let live because we have bigger fish to fry; let's not shut off all communication or interaction with them because we don't know where help or salvation will come from. In essence, we are of quite similar opinion on this issue.  It's either you are not reading through my entire post or you are getting stuck on the semantics of my speech. If you disagree that we have more important issues than gayness to discuss then address that rather than reiterating what I've already said in a manner which is more comprehensive to you.

Ok, I get your point.

I disagree that the second statement is elitist. It is reality, I have heard it several times.

Also, I think with the power the gay movement has built up of recent to the point we are having "Brokeback Mountain" as a movie hit, to me gay penetration is one of the big fish and important issues to address

Sagamite:

Ok, I get your point.

I disagree that the second statement is elitist. It is reality, I have heard it several times.

Also, I think with the power the gay movement has built up of recent to the point we are having "Brokeback Mountain" as a movie hit, to me gay penetration is one of the big fish and important issues to address

Define movie hit. Do you consider a movie that makes the numbers below as of December 2007 a hit??
Total US gross: $83,025,853
Total Worldwide gross: $180, 343, 761

@Danmansani,

I think gays should be allowed to marry, adopt, do whatever it is they do or want to do provided it does not infringe on the rights of others.

A society must always watch out for its self-interests. Actions that jeopardises the continued existence of a society must be jettisoned at all costs. Gay marriage falls in the category of such actions.

Why don't you let's do an experiment. Take Nigeria for example. Let us legislate against union between a man and a woman. From now on, let's make it alaw that only gays and lesbians can marry and no two individuals of the different sex must be allowed to have sex. I can guarantee that in 100 years, Nigerians will only be refered to as we do the ten lost tribes of Isreal.

My point? marriage is the building block of the society. Gay marriage builds nothing. It is a self-serving arrangement designed to cater for the sexual lifestyle of a few.

Don't get me wrong, they can have sex with themselves as much as they want. heck, they can even have with animals, but when it comes to marriage, it must only be between a man and a woman.

Sagamite:

Ok, I get your point.

I disagree that the second statement is elitist. It is reality, I have heard it several times.

Also, I think with the power the gay movement has built up of recent to the point we are having "Brokeback Mountain" as a movie hit, to me gay penetration is one of the big fish and important issues to address

I won't lie. I was also flabbergasted when Brokeback Mountain won because even if it weren't a story about two gay men's relationship there was nothing moving or new or fantastic about the story to warrant the awards it received besides Ang Lee's copious use of grand vistas and gorgeous locales and even then - I've seen it all before in his movie Crouching Tiger.  At the same time I wasn't too surprised. The whole industry of theatre, art and film is chock full of gay people.  That year too, TransAmerica was a hit with the Academy and they had guest appearances by many gay celebrities with Dolly Parton's song winning best song in a movie score something like that for her song in TransAmerica. She even performed it that night. Wasn't Ellen Degeneres even the host of a major awards show that year (I may be wrong on this)? It's called marketing and customer engendering. All that year every single show on TV had at least 1 gay character introduced. It's a marketing strategy --- catering to a new or different marketbase by expressing issues that are relevant to them of which gay rights and acceptance would be the major one 4 gay people. If it has penetrated the American consciousness I don't think it has penetrated that of Nigeria (even though we have an enormous proclivity to copy America) because we do not have that large a gay base to market products to and it's still very much taboo. My point - bigger fish to fry like say --- hmmmm --- Access to Basic Amenities? Women's and everyday Nigerians' rights? End of the strife in the Niger Delta? CORRUPTION?

You dey feel me now?

Man omoovie you lost me when you said BB wasnt worthy of its wawards, deserved way more awards than that useless Crash

and TransAmerica was ALSO a good movie.

Darn gays get their way yet again!

Tayo-D:

@Danmansani,
A society must always watch out for its self-interests. Actions that jeopardises the continued existence of a society must be jettisoned at all costs. Gay marriage falls in the category of such actions.

How does it?  Is this an opinion or a statement of fact?  Couldn't it also have been argued by the whites that liberation of black slaves would depress the American economy?  It's not about what society prefers, it's about doing right.  Or, as someone mentioned earlier, allowing freedom in the land of the free. Righteousness has a way of preventing marginalization.  As much as you and I may disagree with the, in my opnion, barbarism that is faggotry, we should still be open-minded to the established laws of America.

Don't get me wrong, they can have sex with themselves as much as they want. heck, they can even have with animals, but when it comes to marriage, it must only be between a man and a woman.

That's because you've been told, or taught, that marriage should only be between man and woman.  What if gays were told that marriage between a man and his [i]F[/i]uck buddy, who happens to be another dude, is acceptable? Or as most gays are led to be believe, that homosexuality is sometimes a natural biological phenomenon.

In a civilized and continually changing nation like America, people will continue to change, and civility allows for this change and welcomes it.

I won't lie. I was also flabbergasted when Brokeback Mountain won because even if it weren't a story about two gay men's relationship there was nothing moving or new or fantastic about the story to warrant the awards it received besides Ang Lee's copious use of grand vistas and gorgeous locales and even then - I've seen it all before in his movie Crouching Tiger.

I don't understand how you fail to see that the storyline about two gay men's relationship is what makes it new and perhaps fantastic. The movie brought homosexuality into people's homes, into the limelight, mainstream. It was the talk on radio shows, TV, in the newspapers for quite sometime; it addressed reality.

All I know is, gays have arrived and are here to stay. Unfortunately, we have to learn to deal with it.

NA WOOO

jesus i need your say on this one.

I guess it a free world, some people can believe what they believe, dwell on their phylosopy, and might as well forced it on other people. i guess thats life for you

For some people arrange marraige will  alway be wrong while to some gay marraige is new one that preluded in the modern age !

Maybe in time to come people might start to look for sexual satisfaction from animals not just for pet


My friend forget all these precipitations time turns out to be, nevermind some of the jumbo jargons i see every now and then in the name of language ha,(preponderance and stuff) just remember who you are, where you are and where you intend to reach!

Therefore using someone precedence and norms to dictate your life style as a way of living in the name of modernization will surely leave a lot of people out there uncomfortable i believe.

Hey man! Now translate what you just wrote in English.

A NIGERIAN and AFRICAN has spoken in the MODERN times

no time for gay language

sorry about that fellow! ha

MyTempID,

Darn gays get their way yet again!

How does it?  Is this an opinion or a statement of fact?  Couldn't it also have been argued by the whites that liberation of black slaves would depress the American economy?  It's not about what society prefers, it's about doing right.  Or, as someone mentioned earlier, allowing freedom in the land of the free. Righteousness has a way of preventing marginalization.  As much as you and I may disagree with the, in my opnion, barbarism that is faggotry, we should still be open-minded to the established laws of America.

How could you compare the two. The argument about slavery has only economic impact on the society. Gay marriage on the other hand has an existensial impact on that society. Why have you avoided the scenario I creates?

That's because you've been told, or taught, that marriage should only be between man and woman.  What if gays were told that marriage between a man and his Bleep buddy, who happens to be another dude, is acceptable? Or as most gays are led to be believe, that homosexuality is sometimes a natural biological phenomenon.

It's not what I've been told, it's common sense. What's the end product of gay sex? Only self-gratification. Sex between a man and a woman on the other hand provides a means for the society to preserve itself in the next genreation.  Don't be deceived by all this biological nonsense they are talking about. Let's consider Darwin's postulation for instance. Why would a biological being develop a trait that will cause it to cease to exist? Isn't the weak supposed to displace the strong? Why would the strong now mutate to weakness?

In a civilized and continually changing nation like America, people will continue to change, and civility allows for this change and welcomes it.

Of course change is welcome, but not at the expense of the society at large. Armed Robbery was and will continually be a crime in any society. Are we to accept it as a product of change? Not all changes are good, and gay marriage is one of those.

i think the post above can only solidify this superman position

thanks tayo-d

assimilated quite well.

Tayo-D:

MyTempID,

Oopsie? What can I say. . . it slipped.

How could you compare the two. The argument about slavery has only economic impact on the society. Gay marriage on the other hand has an existensial impact on that society. Why have you avoided the scenario I creates?

What matters is that is had an effect on society. Whether economic, or existential, gays in America could care less about that.  As I opined earlier, whites might have believed at the time, that it would have an existential impact on their society.
American society for the most part is highly civilized.  In fact, they're not so concerned that slavery only had an economic impact on society.

It's not what I've been told, it's common sense. What's the end product of gay sex? Only self-gratification.

As a result it should be banned? Ask yourself then why oh why do so many people engage in sexual intercourse for the purpose of self-gratification?

Sex between a man and a woman on the other hand provides a means for the society to preserve itself in the next genreation.

Again, that's your common sense and your belief leading you to that conclusion.  Not all pepole believe in the notion that sex is only beneficial, or should only be had when it allows for propagation.  When, or where, were you taught that the sole purpose of sex is to preserve the human race?  In that case, some might argue that why does it feel so good? Would people care that it feels good? Or why would they enjoy the pleasures of sex without being in a marriage?
Sexual intercourse can also be seen as an expression of your love for your spouse.  Why do you think most women prefer to 'make love' and not '[i]f[/i]uck or have sex'.
The idea that sex should be had for procreation is a bible-thumper, and I must say it is something I agree with.  But hey, I can't change, or control what people do.

Of course change is welcome, but not at the expense of the society at large. Armed Robbery was and will continually be a crime in any society. Are we to accept it as a product of change? Not all changes are good, and gay marriage is one of those.

Change will always/usually occur at the expense of society, and society as a whole must adapt to change and learn do deal with it.  Society has been doing that and there's no reason to think it can't do it now.  Armed robbery is not a consequence of change and one can especially argue that it's been in existence since the beginning of time.  You should not disqualify gay marriage as being a bad change without being able to support your dismissal of it using a wholistic perspective.