AbdH:
Not only were they catwalking bro, they were actually being judged and watched by men in the audience!!! What happened to 'cast down your gaze?'
Can you imagine a mumeenun leaving his house for the main purpose of going to watch mumeenats catwalking?
Seriously, what happened to cast down your gaze?

vivacious vivi: I am sorry, but with the current level of sensitivities raging in the world now - whether the recent happenings in Kenya or the current insurgency closer home by the Boko Haram dudes, I think this thread is very ill-timed and offensive. I have nothing agaist Islam but there is a time and place for such threads to get to the front page. Now is NOT the time. #my2cents.

tbaba1234: I think the idea in the article is simple.

It is not about demonizing any ideology, it simply asserts that western principles are currently held as 'universal and neutral' even though in reality, they sometimes conflict with many of the original cultures of people including the Islamic world view. The results of colonialism is that we have imbibed many of these worldviews which in reality conflict with our original world view.

For instance, A muslim believes that all sovereignty belongs to God but the term democracy from demo kratos gives ultimate sovereignty to the people. Hence when muslim coin the term 'Islamic Democracy', it is contradictory based simply on the meaning of the words.

Also, Islam gives gender roles to both men and women but feminism is a concept that negates all gender roles and assert absolute equality to men and women something that is alien to many world cultures. It does not just mean 'rights for women'. So coining a term 'Islamic feminism' is contradictory based on the actual meanings of the words.

SimplySEA:
DAT's wat happens wen pple who are held down in an ancient ideological prison get a little bit of freedom. worshipin God should not be a as a result of "coercion", but free will.

maclatunji: LOL at some of the comments on this thread. So if you don't follow western ideology, you are a terrorist?

That must mean that the Chinese and Russians are terrorists for not following Western dogma, add the Japanese to that least.

#LOL

tbaba1234: The biggest lie the West ever created, was convincing the world that its values were universal and 'neutral'. But unbeknownst to most people, its values are based upon its own particular worldview, which is quite distinct and antithetical to most of the world's (original) belief/law systems. Thus like how the U.S. promotes the dollar, the West printed out its intellectual currency, and asked everyone to use it as a universal standard for moral and intellectual transactions. But like how the dollar is linked to US economy, so Western values are linked to their beliefs and worldview. And if ones fails, so does the other.

It is for this reason that, the 'values' of (the Western conception of) 'Human Right's', 'Freedom', 'Democracy', 'Democratic legitimacy' [unless you vote for an Islamic party], and (the Western concept of) 'Equality' - are so ubiquitous in global usage. Now anywhere you travel, you can intone these 'sacred' and 'holy' words, and instantly gain some moral currency.

After the ravages of colonialism upon the Muslim mind, many Muslims have taken to dangerously using this currency to explain Islam and demand justice for themselves.

This is because the Western worldview [or intellectual bank] highly esteems those words, and many Muslims have succumbed to the use of them, in order to placate the demands of Western societies. So we see Muslims use words like Democracy, Secularism, Feminism, Humanism and Freedom, not only to demand justice for themselves, but also as descriptions for aspects of Islam!

Such Muslims obliviously and naively use words impregnated with foreign and blatantly un-Islamic concepts, with the excuse (they tell themselves) that if they assign them a different meaning to the patiently obvious meanings they have, they will somehow be 'ok' to use.

Some even pre-fix the words with 'Islamic' in order to render them some how acceptable, like 'Islamic Democracy', or 'Islamic Feminism'. As the American saying goes, 'You can clean up a pig, put a ribbon on it's tail, spray it with perfume, but it is still a pig."

The Prophet Muhammed (saaw) is narrated to have ordered Muslims not to drink using wine cups, even if Muslims were to drink water by them. This is simply because of the connotations that wine cups have. Yet some Muslims are happy to use words that have connotations antithetical to Islam! This would be the equivalent of not just using wine cups, but drinking wine along with it - but calling it 'not-wine' [The Prophet Muhammed (saaw) is narrated to also have prophesied that some Muslims would literally do that too!].

So we see Muslims saying 'well, when I use the word democracy, I mean choosing the leaders, not denying God's right to rule'. This is despite the fact that the term 'demos kratos' means ultimate sovereignty and law making by the people, not from God. The simple response is to tell these Muslims that insist upon using the word, 'ok - but then EQUALLY you should be also happy to call for 'Theocracy 'too, since it means rule by God, which is something you claim you don't deny'. Only the truly innocent of mind, and sincere of heart would agree with you.

Muslims say 'Feminism just means rights for women' - despite the fact that all legal systems have given rights for women [the disputes are only in what those rights are]. Of course, Feminism actually [claims to] mean the absolute equality and identicality of the legal treatment of men and women (negating all gender roles), the independence of women from all responsibility and duty by dint of their gender, and gender sectarianism. The simple response is to tell these Muslims that insist upon using the word, 'ok - but then EQUALLY you should be also happy to call for 'Masculinism' too, since it means 'rights for men', which you surely believe in too right? Only the truly innocent of mind, and sincere of heart would agree with you.

Some Muslims say that 'Secularism' just means 'politics in the material world like building roads, making taps, education and schools etc'. They then claim that the historical Islamic Caliphate was 'secular', and the Prophet (saaw)'s rule was secular!!. However, Secularism actually means the separation of religious concerns, beliefs and worldviews from politics. This means the negation of all laws based upon morality that isn't rooted in physical considerations like physical harm/benefit. This means, infidelity, publicly insulting religious beliefs, dealing in interest banking, sexual exploitation of women, and drinking of alcohol all become legal.

No Secularist would accept or call for a Secular constitution that says 'if any fall into dispute, refer it to Allah and his messenger for judgment', yet this was the constitution of Madinah!

Building roads, taps, schools etc, are not neutral acts, or non-religious acts, but are based upon the motivation of the ideology that demands these things to be built. If a government built a road because it believed it is God's Will, then THAT IS NOT A SECULAR ACTION.

Besides, no government builds a road just because it is natural to do so. For thousands and thousands of years, most governments never built roads [except being states like the Romans, or the Islamic Caliphate]. A government would build a road either because they possess a worldview (e.g. like Communism, Liberalism, or Islam) that demands the state should ensure people's safety and efficiency of travel that would maximise some value the ideology reveres. Although a government may build a road, because everyone else is doing it [i.e. 'its the modern thing to do'], or to facilitate its own Army to travel quickly [i.e. as the romans did]. The simple response is to tell these Muslims that insist upon using the word, 'ok - but then EQUALLY you should be also happy to call for, and use the phrase, 'Religious government', because according to you, Religious government would surely call for the same things e.g. roads, taps, schools, bridges etc wouldn't it? Again, Only the truly innocent of mind, and sincere of heart would agree with you.

Some Muslims call for Humanism claiming it means 'only look after the rights of Humans'. But this too is naive and false. For Humanism refers to a human centric worldview, where Humans and 'this life' are the primary concern of thought, and not anything else, including God. That's why virtually all Humanists today are Atheists. If Atheism is their creed (aqeedah), then Humanism is the religion (deen) of this creed. The simple response is to tell these Muslims that insist upon using the word, 'ok - but then EQUALLY you should be also happy to use the word 'Divine Law' since it would also call for rights for humans, albeit under a God centred worldview. Again, Only the truly innocent of mind, and sincere of heart would agree with you.

Of course, if these Muslims were truly sincere in their use of these terms, 'as long as they give them an 'acceptable' meaning', then lets see if they would also be happy to use the following terms, along with their new 'meanings' [i.e. excuses]:

Islamic Polytheism - 'it just means' belief in a God, with many names

'Islamic' Fascism - 'it just means' strength through unity'

'Islamic' Communism - 'It just means' respecting community values

'Islamic' Atheism - 'It just means' negating false idols, not negating the One transcendent God

'Islamic' Idolatry - 'It just means' honouring Muslim heroes from the present and past, as role models and celebrity 'idols', but not in the literal sense

'Islamic' Racism - 'It just means' that we honour the the race of Adam (as)

'Islamic' Satanism - 'It just means' that we believe in a concept of the Devil, and guard against his works'

'Islamic' Trinitarianism - 'Is just means' that we believe in three aspects of God, the Tawheed al Rububiyah, Tawheed Uluhiyyah and Asma' wa siffat.

Of course, all these new terms are absurd, and we'd laugh at anyone who'd be so foolish as to use them, despite attributing to them seemingly benign explanations. But this are no different then using 'Islamic Feminism', 'Islamic Secularism', 'Islamic Democracy' and 'Islamic Humanism' - which are all equally absurd for a Muslim to use, and equally derisory.

As Muslims, we must reject the false intellectual currency we are told to use. We should not use borrowed words which have a widely understood, and unIslamic meaning, but rather we should use words which are supplied to us from Islam itself, or at the very least (for non-Arabic speakers) the best translations of linguistic equivalents in foreign languages e.g. Deen = 'worldview/Ideology', Aqeedah = 'Creed'. This is because if Muslims use Western words which are loaded with a particular meaning, these then become a prelude to believing in Western concepts. This is how the West spreads its ideology. It is equivalent of teaching Arab Christians to use the word 'Tawheed' to describe their monotheism. After a generation or two, none of them would believe in the Trinity was literal anymore!

So let us give back to the West their intellectual currency, for surely it bares the stamp of their own worldview upon it, and we should keep for ourselves our own intellectual currency supplied to us by God in the Quran and Sunnah. This is the key to keeping our beliefs pure, and ensuring we derive correct intellectual conceptions from our own worldview without distortion.

As famously (allegedly) narrated of Jesus in the New Testament (Mark 12:15-17):

'Should we pay or shouldn't we?" But Jesus knew their hypocrisy. "Why are you trying to trap me?" he asked. "Bring me a denarius and let me look at it."They brought the coin, and he asked them, "Whose image is this? And whose inscription?" "Caesar's," they replied. Then Jesus said to them, "Give back to Caesar what is Caesar's and to God what is God's." And they were amazed at him'.

-Abdullah Al Andalusi
https://www.facebook.com/abdullah.andalusi/posts/10151887975277517

tbaba1234: I think the idea in the article is simple.

It is not about demonizing any ideology, it simply asserts that western principles are currently held as 'universal and neutral' even though in reality, they sometimes conflict with many of the original cultures of people including the Islamic world view. The results of colonialism is that we have imbibed many of these worldviews which in reality conflict with our original world view.

For instance, A muslim believes that all sovereignty belongs to God but the term democracy from demo kratos gives ultimate sovereignty to the people. Hence when muslim coin the term 'Islamic Democracy', it is contradictory based simply on the meaning of the words.

Also, Islam gives gender roles to both men and women but feminism is a concept that negates all gender roles and assert absolute equality to men and women something that is alien to many world cultures. It does not just mean 'rights for women'. So coining a term 'Islamic feminism' is contradictory based on the actual meanings of the words.

Kairoseki77:

There is a Muslim man who is being hailed as a hero around the world for saving people in Kenya. His name is Abdul Haji.

You should go put his story on the front page and leave this nonsense.

None of the things the author mentioned are western inventions. The author is obviously poorly educated and ignorant. Preaching that Muslims should reject democracy and embrace religious theocracy is traitorous during these trying times in Nigeria.

Maclatunji, millions of Muslims would disagree with the nonsense you posted. You really need to sit down and ask yourself if you are becoming radicalized, because there is so much wrong with your mindset if you saw fit to promote this as FP material. ESPECIALLY right now.

Kairoseki77:

There is a Muslim man who is being hailed as a hero around the world for saving people in Kenya. His name is Abdul Haji.

You should go put his story on the front page and leave this nonsense.

None of the things the author mentioned are western inventions. The author is obviously poorly educated and ignorant. Preaching that Muslims should reject democracy and embrace religious theocracy is traitorous during these trying times in Nigeria.

Maclatunji, millions of Muslims would disagree with the nonsense you posted. You really need to sit down and ask yourself if you are becoming radicalized, because there is so much wrong with your mindset if you saw fit to promote this as FP material. ESPECIALLY right now.

Nairatalks: [size=18pt]Eveybody reading this, beware! The author of the article is a well known apologist and sharia law supporter in the UK. Andalusi even claimed in a youtube debate that Boko Haram is a result of colonial division of north and southern Nigeria
[/size]

maclatunji:

And he exposes his bigotry. So supporting sharia law is something you want to make "uncool".

Sharia is a guide for all Muslims and one of the sources of the Nigerian constitution. It is something we are proud of.

maclatunji:

And he exposes his bigotry. So supporting sharia law is something you want to make "uncool".

Sharia is a guide for all Muslims and one of the sources of the Nigerian constitution. It is something we are proud of.

shymexx:

Thanks for the bolded. Like they say, "people perish because for the lack of knowledge." It seems the writer doesn't understand what western ideals and western civilisation is about, hence why he wrote this silly write-up about doing things that Muhammed talked about in his era.

To understand how stupid the writer is, we need to explain what western civilisation is. A lot of the so-called "western ideals" were borrowed from early Islamic scholars during the middle ages, after Europe lost its civilisation. Perhaps, the writer needs to explain to us what western ideals/civilisation means to him.

Nairatalks:


Stop lying. The article demonises the Western values in order to promote islam. How can human rights be colonialism??

One can promote islam without lying about the West.

Nairatalks:



Yes, I am a muslim. So, how can I be a bigot against islam.

I am against islamists who want to force islam in the UK.


How can a muslim claim to be law abiding when he wants to be against the laws of a country (a country mostly made up with non-muslims)?


Do you think that it makes sense for there to be sharia law in britain when majority would not even understand it?

Kairoseki77: This is the scariest thing I have EVER READ, and I am sure that millions of Muslims will disagree with this nonsense.

Any author that says that Human Rights, Freedom, and Equality are un-Islamic should be ignored. An author that compares those things with Satanism should be jailed!

Is this a Boko Haram pamphlet, or am I on NL?

What kind of person thinks the concept of freedom is "from the West"? It is a basic human concept that has existed long before Western Civilization. The same with Human Rights and Democracy. Right here in Naija, there are tribes like the Igbo that were democratic before ever setting eyes on a white person.

Treating women well is also not a western idea. It is called civilization and common human decency. In many African cultures women were leaders, warriors (Dahomey), and respected members of the community long before we met the West.

If anything, this nutjob is trying to impose ARAB VALUES on modern Muslims. In Saudi Arabia women are protesting right now to get the right to drive. They cannot leave the house without a male chaperone. If they are raped, they are punished. NONE OF THAT is African in any way.

The fact that Maclatunji would directly support something that is almost word for word what Boko Haram says is their reason for killing (rejection of democracy for Muslims, and that Western values are "haram" ) is very, very troubling.

What I have just read is the kind of thing that someone will SAY Muslims believe, before you call them a bigot.

Most NL'ers won't read the orignal post, just these comments. I beg you, read the passage, even though it is long. It will open your eyes to the Islamic mentality.

This mindset is what leads to extremism.

Note - Today we learned that the Kenyan hostages were tortured before being killed. Children were found stuffed in refrigerators with knives still inside them. Men were hanging from hooks in the ceiling. Women were brutalized and strangled.

Instead of Muslims standing up to REJECT that psychotic behavior, you are here preaching against democracy and freedom. Very scary times we live in.

AbdH:

That's all