Religion and spirituality are often mistakenly understood as synonymous terms. This has really made people lost the real conception of Ifa and draw line on their misunderstanding. Lets review spirituality, religion and Ifa.....we can judge from there.


WHAT IS SPIRITUALITY?

Spirituality is the search for the sacred, for that which is set apart from the ordinary and worthy of veneration, "a transcendent dimension within human experience...discovered in moments in which the individual questions the meaning of personal existence and attempts to place the self within a broader ontological context."

• is an internal process of seeking personal authenticity, genuineness, and wholeness as an aspect of identity development;

• is the process of continually transcending one's current locus of centricity;

• is the development of a greater connectedness to self and others through relationships and union with community;

• is the process of deriving meaning, purpose, and direction in one's life; and

• involves an increasing openness to exploring a relationship with an intangible and pervasive power or essence or center of value that exists beyond human existence and rational human knowing.

Conclusively, spirituality is considered a more personal quality, and is sometimes described as a feeling of connection with everything. Spiritual people are generally open to just about anything as long as it gives them the emotional lift they are looking for, and it tends to be thought of as internal and personal, a 'to each his own' affair. It deals with universal questions of origin, purpose, ethical behavior and destiny. The answers to these questions may take us into other areas of thought, such as science or philosophy or religion. But the questions about what it means to be human — why we are here, how we should act toward self and other, what will eventually become of us and the universe.


WHAT IS RELIGION?

Religion is a system of social coherence based on a common group of beliefs or attitudes concerning an object, person, unseen being, or system of thought considered to be supernatural, sacred, divine or highest truth, and the moral codes, practices, values, institutions, traditions, and rituals associated with such belief or system of thought.

• is a concern over what exists beyond the visible world (operating through faith and intuition);

• generally includes the idea of the existence of a single being, a group of beings, an eternal principle, or transcendental spiritual entity that has created the world, that governs it, that controls its destinies, or that intervenes occasionally in the natural course of its history;

• is a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects; and

• is the idea that ritual, prayer, spiritual exercises, or certain principles and conduct.

Religion deals with specific beliefs, faith, doctrines, practices, rituals and morality. There is a correct way to think, speak, believe and act. Religions have religious practitioners who specialize in their specific religion, denomination or sect. Their role is to guide, govern and preside over the gathering or otherwise aid the individual seeking to become or already professing to be an adherent to that religion. Religion is a formal set of beliefs contained in a statement or confession of faith. It is often sustained by a defined organization who hands down the beliefs and practices and authorizes ministers to lead people gathered together to worship as a body or group. Religion simply is a subset of spirituality.


WHAT IS IFA?

There is no literal translation for the word Ifa. Ifa refers to the system of divination and the verses of the literary corpus known as the Odu Ifa. It is a spiritual tradition, and understanding of ethics, a process of spiritual transformation and a set of corpus of texts (odu) that are the basis for a complex system of divination.

Ifa is an indigenous, earth centered African spiritual tradition which was conceptualized by the Yoruba people and also practised by the African diaspora in the Americas and the Caribbean. Ifa practitioners do not regard their spirituality as a 'religion' in the Western sense. It is instead a way of relating to spiritual energy that helps individuals discover and stay on their path. The tradition is based on staying in balance with our community and with the world itself, with our ancestors and our personal spiritual energies. It a body of knowledge or source of a particular kind of social and spiritual knowledge that is all encompassing philosophy and science; it extends to metaphysics and spiritual enquiry of past, present and future. Practitioners are encouraged to employ common sense and personal responsibility, to appreciate the sacred everyday life, and to integrate all aspects of being, namely the physical, the emotional, the mental and the spiritual.



Is Ifa practise a religion or spirituality?

ok, according to your first subtopic, it can be right for me as an atheist to say i am spiritual about something i am so committed to? That's John Lennon's position...

#your question: I think Ifa practice is spirituality

Hi FOLYKAZE,

Is this the new religion you embracing?

This is the second thread of yours I will be seeing along this theme.

Well, to answer your question, Ifa is a religion.

And religion is spiritual.

ooman: ok, according to your first subtopic, it can be right for me as an atheist to say i am spiritual about something i am so committed to? That's John Lennon's position...

#your question: I think Ifa practice is spirituality

YES. I have been trying to explain spirituality to some atheist here.... It got nothing to do with belief in God or deity.

Im proudly spiritual atheist

Tgirl4real: Hi FOLYKAZE,

Is this the new religion you embracing?

This is the second thread of yours I will be seeing along this theme.

I dont do religion. Im on to spirituality.

A step after atheism....good been an evolving mind

Tgirl4real: Well, to answer your question, Ifa is a religion.

And religion is spiritual.

I said it clearly....religion is the subset of spirituality.

How is Ifa a religion?

Tgirl4real: Well, to answer your question, Ifa is a religion.

And religion is spiritual.

Ifa is not a religion.
It is only part of some religions

macof:

Ifa is not a religion.
It is only part of some religions

which religion? Santeria or lukumi or Afa in togo voodoo?

FOLYKAZE:

which religion? Santeria or lukumi or Afa in togo voodoo?

i think all

ooman:

i think all

Especially Santeria and lukumi.....it well known religiously infected Ifa spirituality. Ogun is called saint george. It more like ifa-catholism. Much like anglican-ogboni. Stone is stone no matter how you cave it.

FOLYKAZE:

I said it clearly....religion is the subset of spirituality.

How is Ifa a religion?

I guess you answered your question here...

FOLYKAZE:

I said it clearly....religion is the subset of spirituality.

How is Ifa a religion?

OK. I just digested your OP.

I have never practised Ifa, but I have witnessed some stuff around it on TV and in class and I just read what you had to post on it. Coming from there, I believe Ifa, alludes to some form of divinity which u called spiritual energy; except you are gonna tell me the predictions are a product of forecasting and smart calculations. I.e. adding 1+1 + 11. I hope you get the angle I am coming from.

I know some have said the Ifa process is scientific and you can actually reason it out. I wanna believe it's more of a spiritual process than science. If you have more info on this, I would be glad if you can share.

FOLYKAZE:

which religion? Santeria or lukumi or Afa in togo voodoo?

all of the above, that is why some people refer to the collective combination of all these beliefs as Aborisha

@ Tgirl4real


The truth be told, I dont practise Ifa.....I only experienced it and studying it. Anyway, through the study process, im seeing some some and body of intelligence embedded in it. Also, I dont know much as im not initiated....the periphery sides really is amazing though.

Let me start by saying Nollywood is doing more evil to yoruba spirituality. Babalawo (person who knows the secret) are depicted as evil and pastors or Alfa are depicted as good folks. Though we have some movies coming up and it really making lot of senses.

Ifa is scientifical, philosophical, logical, mathematical, metaphysical and spiritual ways of understanding our world, our self and relating with the world around us. According to Ifa, everything in the universe is alive and conscious. So relationship with our world makes us path our way physically and spiritually.

PERMIT ME TO EXPLAIN IT SCIENTIFIC AND SPIRITUAL SIDES

NOTE: Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it profound source of spirituality- carl sagan.

The Scientific Essence of Ifa deals with the power of observation, axiomatic, astronomy, cosmology, cognitive and pre-cognitive experience, astral science, physical and biological sciences, logic, philosophy mathematics, statistics and computer science. Ifa here is a devised computer compatible binary coding system, thousands of years before the emergence of computer consciousness in so-called modern man! So, Ifa is preserved in binary coded format and is output Parable - Format.

Ifa is coded within 256 Odus or Corpus, each Odu representing an esoteric pigeonhole, itself divisible into 256 sub-holes. Within each of the 256 Odus, there are 1,680 Sacred Verses all presented in Parable - Format. Thus, the body of Ifa consists of 430,080 messages for mankind. Huh! I always wish to know all this.....still waiting till the time I get out of here and get initiated.

The sixteen principal Odu are binary codes. Now compare with the binary figure you were thought in the school. It’s the understanding of the binary figure that allows Microsoft developed the Excel spread sheet. Excel maintains 15 figures in its numbers, but they are not always accurate: the bottom line should be the same as the top line. Of course, 1 x − 1 = x. The discrepancy indicates the error. All errors but the last are beyond the 15-th decimal. Whereas the Odu Ifa makes a perfect ordering of 16 figures. The top line is 4 and the bottomline is 16. Can you see the amazing intelligence of an African man?

Ifa also explained how universe came about, how earth came about and how man got here. It symbolic and more like parable....which is very scientifical. Though this is very short, I think it because the quest is not necessary....our life is more essential.

Obatala symbolically mean light.... In Ifa story, he stated the creation processes....in science, light brought the universe through massive explosion....big bang thang.

Ogun symbolically is Iron. In Ifa story, he cut through the bush in earth....in science, chemical element Iron filled everything on earth both in space and crust. It Ogun that made chain which Obatala (light) climb to earth.

Olokun mean sea....science stated that the earth ice melt when light comes in. Ifa story depict Olokun as mother of all life with long breast... Science says life erupt from water.

The chain Ogun made for Orunmila is scientific DNA. If you look at DNA under microscope....it like chain.

If you digest this critically, it sound like primordia soup right? This is black man intelligence.

More and more lot of this. Pls I might not sound accurately like scientist cuz im not one.... All the way I dont call for believing but experiencing and knowledge and always advise we all to take time to study few research works on Ifa to know where we got it wrong and why we are lagging behind in science and technology. We should try and free our mind from straight jacket colonial brain washing that believes everything about Africa is evil.


The Spirituality Essence relates to the methods of Divination and accessing of esoteric information; the mechanics of Divination and the systematics of Divine Message collection, processing and interpretation. I personally define this as the metaphysical sides. It relates to the place of man (as a spirit) in the cosmos, the powers of matter and all aspects of ontological evolution and development.

This is the real face of Ifa... It involve rituals, divination and spiritual connectedness/relation with the world around us. Erm, the truth be told, Im not much into this really...as I dont understand most of it but I believe continual investigation and research will give me room for knowing one day.

Let me simply put : we need to light up the dark, cursing it is stupidity

Arabirin, oro po ninu iwe kobo.

lol

Thanks for the post.

Well, I guess nollywood didn't do any justice to it, but they usually distinguish between the evil priests and the good one. The good ones are light bearers.

In a nutshell, there is no form of deity worship in Ifa? Is that what you saying. Cos doing incantations, the names of these deities are chanted.

If there is a form of deity worship, then it is a religion.

macof: all of the above, that is why some people refer to the collective combination of all these beliefs as Aborisha

Bros, i so much respect your intellectual awakeners and exploration of Yoruba spirituality. But I found out that you are westernenizing Yoruba terminologies and it seem it corrupting, degrading each terms.

Lets start from the myth tag. This is problematical as it cut down the symbolic and metaphoric meaning. This brought problem into translating terms like 'Eku ile'.....even though we force meaning like 'welcome' to it, it lost it core meaning there henceforth.

Like you said ABORISA is religion. Lets analyse it

Aborisa = A + Ebo + Orisa

A = Person (like afoju....it plural pronoun use for respect for personalities. You cant call elder 'o' but 'e' or 'a'. E.g awon daddy lo so ~ this doesn't implies many daddy)

Ebo = Nourishment (wife bo husband ~ wife nourishing husband..)

Orisa = selected consciousness

Therefore, Aborisa is the person who nourish consciousness. I dont see how this relate with religion.

Tgirl4real: lol

Thanks for the post.

Well, I guess nollywood didn't do any justice to it, but they usually distinguish between the evil priests and the good one. The good ones are light bearers.

In a nutshell, there is no form of deity worship in Ifa? Is that what you saying. Cos doing incantations, the names of these deities are chanted.

If there is a form of deity worship, then it is a religion.

The problem will have is English translation.

Deity is problematical and not cone. We have Orisa.

Ori = consciousness

sa = selected

therefore orisa mean selected consciousness. This body of consciousness are bodies of force and energy together with it manifestation. Monster not attached.

Have you ever heard that ' ori eni labo, aba fi orisa sile' meaning we should nourish our consciousness and not any Orisa (what you call deity). Yoruba people are naturalistic pantheist. They venerate everything in nature and see it scared. They praise eye, ear and even toes....everything is God

Still not religion. Any counter?

FOLYKAZE:

The problem will have is English translation.

Deity is problematical and not cone. We have Orisa.

Ori = consciousness

sa = selected

therefore orisa mean selected consciousness. This body of consciousness are bodies of force and energy together with it manifestation. Monster not attached.

Have you ever heard that ' ori eni labo, aba fi orisa sile' meaning we should nourish our consciousness and not any Orisa (what you call deity). Yoruba people are naturalistic pantheist. They venerate everything in nature and see it scared. They praise eye, ear and even toes....everything is God

Still not religion. Any counter?

Sincerely, I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject to provide a counter.

Well, I see where you are coming from. I see Orisa as deities and aborisa will be someone who worships idols. Thatz the badic concept I have no thanks to primary school education and home video.

I still believe Ifa is a religion sha.

Don't they have rituals, a belief system and a kinda structure?

FOLYKAZE:

The problem will have is English translation.

Deity is problematical and not cone. We have Orisa.

Ori = consciousness

sa = selected

therefore orisa mean selected consciousness. This body of consciousness are bodies of force and energy together with it manifestation. Monster not attached.

Have you ever heard that ' ori eni labo, aba fi orisa sile' meaning we should nourish our consciousness and not any Orisa (what you call deity). Yoruba people are naturalistic pantheist. They venerate everything in nature and see it scared. They praise eye, ear and even toes....everything is God

Still not religion. Any counter?

Sincerely, I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject to provide a counter.

Well, I see where you are coming from. I see Orisa as deities and aborisa will be someone who worships idols. Thatz the badic concept I have no thanks to primary school education and home video.

I still believe Ifa is a religion sha.

Don't they have rituals, a belief system and a kinda structure?

FOLYKAZE:

which religion? Santeria or lukumi or Afa in togo voodoo?

Ifa is not a religion in itself. It is a part of Yoruba religion.


I do not consider all these new South AMerican variants as pure religion.

PAGAN 9JA:



Ifa is not a religion in itself. It is a part of Yoruba religion.


I do not consider all these new South AMerican variants as pure religion.

Yes. Santeria, candomble and the rest are not genuine. Not only have they mixed with catholism but they have little difference in the characterization of the orishas.

But these religions were established by Yorubas, and they are very into Ifa as much as the original Yoruba

I know you to be a man who supports pure paganism and I expect you to debunk santeria and the other South American variants as nt being pagan but the truth is where ever a man stays and worships the gods of his fathers he would still be referred as pagan. It's now left to the non-Yoruba origin South Americans to decided if they join in the worship and embrace Yoruba beliefs.

Tgirl4real:

Sincerely, I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject to provide a counter.

Well, I see where you are coming from. I see Orisa as deities and aborisa will be someone who worships idols. Thatz the badic concept I have no thanks to primary school education and home video.

I still believe Ifa is a religion sha.

Don't they have rituals, a belief system and a kinda structure?

Primary schools education is fake knowledge they are feeding us with. Imagine we were taught that Odua came from mecca bla bla bla.

So I encourage further researching and digging out of the coded mystery.

I dont know much about ritual though. But to my little understanding, it nourishing and reboosting energetic force. I dont know more than this but reading through this article will explain.... http://ofunmeji.com/2012/10/04/the-hows-and-whys-of-animal-sacrifice-in-traditional-ifa/

what belief exactly are you refering to? Ifa tell you to know not belief

Sorry to disturb your thread Foly but hope you are aware of this: https://www.nairaland.com/1476542/religion-section-awards-night-sticky/6#18803795

FOLYKAZE:

Bros, i so much respect your intellectual awakeners and exploration of Yoruba spirituality. But I found out that you are westernenizing Yoruba terminologies and it seem it corrupting, degrading each terms.

Lets start from the myth tag. This is problematical as it cut down the symbolic and metaphoric meaning. This brought problem into translating terms like 'Eku ile'.....even though we force meaning like 'welcome' to it, it lost it core meaning there henceforth.

Like you said ABORISA is religion. Lets analyse it

Aborisa = A + Ebo + Orisa

A = Person (like afoju....it plural pronoun use for respect for personalities. You cant call elder 'o' but 'e' or 'a'. E.g awon daddy lo so ~ this doesn't implies many daddy)

Ebo = Nourishment (wife bo husband ~ wife nourishing husband..)

Orisa = selected consciousness

Therefore, Aborisa is the person who nourish consciousness. I dont see how this relate with religion.

The reason why I try to modernize the Yoruba belief is for non-Yoruba to understand and make sense out of it. It isn't as if am trying to perform some kind of Evangelism or westernize it.

I didn't create the term "aborisha"- high leveled babalawos did so as to make the world understand that the Orisha and Ifa is nt just Yoruba.but about the world. We have catholic, orthodox, pentecostal, Jehovah witness, Anglican Christians. But they all worship Jesus.

In that same sense Santeria, candomble and the rest are refered to as Aborisha. Because we all worship The Orishas.

It is left for the individual to have a good relationship with the Orisha of his choice, however in santeria, the orisha is the one dat makes the choice. But of course it has never been a must to honor any orisha. You choice to out of free will.

macof:

Yes. Santeria, candomble and the rest are not genuine. Not only have they mixed with catholism but they have little difference in the characterization of the orishas.

But these religions were established by Yorubas, and they are very into Ifa as much as the original Yoruba

I know you to be a man who supports pure paganism and I expect you to debunk santeria and the other South American variants as nt being pagan but the truth is where ever a man stays and worships the gods of his fathers he would still be referred as pagan. It's now left to the non-Yoruba origin South Americans to decided if they join in the worship and embrace Yoruba beliefs.

I consider only tribals as Pagans.

What I mean by belief system is precepts, pattern, ideas that form ur thoughts, words n actions. It doesn't have to be about religion.

macof:

The reason why I try to modernize the Yoruba belief is for non-Yoruba to understand and make sense out of it. It isn't as if am trying to perform some kind of Evangelism or westernize it.

I didn't create the term "aborisha"- high leveled babalawos did so as to make the world understand that the Orisha and Ifa is nt just Yoruba.but about the world. We have catholic, orthodox, pentecostal, Jehovah witness, Anglican Christians. But they all worship Jesus.

In that same sense Santeria, candomble and the rest are refered to as Aborisha. Because we all worship The Orishas.

It is left for the individual to have a good relationship with the Orisha of his choice, however in santeria, the orisha is the one dat makes the choice. But of course it has never been a must to honor any orisha. You choice to out of free will.

I dont have problem with your style bro. Just trying to check in....like I did on your thread, im make some little corrections we can easily make to avoid destabilizing whole concept.

Ori wa a gbe wa o. Ase

PAGAN 9JA:



I consider only tribals as Pagans.

localization and constructive degrading term.

I love calling African spirituality naturalistic pantheism (scientific pantieism)

FOLYKAZE:

localization and constructive degrading term.

I love calling African spirituality naturalistic pantheism (scientific pantieism)

as you wish..

PAGAN 9JA:


as you wish..

What ya saying about this monster and demonization of African Gods?

Evolution is generally needed.....it must start within me and you.

Light the candle bra

FOLYKAZE:

What ya saying about this monster and demonization of African Gods?

Evolution is generally needed.....it must start within me and you.

Light the candle bra

monster

PAGAN 9JA:


monster

here is philfearon spilling trash on this thread https://www.nairaland.com/1463158/aborisa-yoruba-religion/3#18772261 .

Most people think African Gods are monsters.......we need to light up the dark and educate people.

Localizing and degrading value is a big push back. Lets stop it