Is the Satan in Christianity the same as Lucifer?

Here comes again . . . What is your point? You love to change your name?

coolruler:

Is the Satan in Christianity the same as Lucifer?

_{never knew the religion section was this funny}


@ topic

na wah , but of course yes !

detruth:

Here comes again . . . What is your point? You love to change your name?

@detruth
Christianity is not a secret cult!
Its only in cults of darkness that you are forbidden to ask questions. I asked a simple question. If you cannot enlighten me, then please don't insult my intelligence.

ikamefa:



@ topic

na wah , but of course yes !

Actually, It might suprise you to know that Lucifer is not the same as Satan.

Lucifer(bringer of light, star of the morning, e.t.c) was a human being, as records have it, a king in ancient Babylonia.

I was shocked when I discovered this. I am still shocked!

coolruler:

@detruth
Christianity is not a secret cult!
Its only in cults of darkness that you are forbidden to ask questions. I asked a simple question. If you cannot enlighten me, then please don't insult my intelligence.

coolruler:

Actually, It might suprise you to know that Lucifer is not the same as Satan.

Lucifer(bringer of light, star of the morning, e.t.c) was a human being, as records have it, a king in ancient Babylonia.

I was shocked when I discovered this. I am still shocked!

coolruler:

Actually, It might suprise you to know that Lucifer is not the same as Satan.

Lucifer(bringer of light, star of the morning, e.t.c) was a human being, as records have it, a king in ancient Babylonia.

I was shocked when I discovered this. I am still shocked!

i wonder how intelligent u are?

u choose to discredit the claims of one record (the bible), believed by over a billion people against an ancient record which we can hardly make refrence to.

Isaiah 14:12:

12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (KJV)

@noetic
The poster is actually right the above quoted passage is the only place in the bible were the word lucifer was used and it was refering to the king of babylon. To confirm read the whole chapter of Isaiah 14

KunleOshob:

Isaiah 14:12:

   12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (KJV)

@noetic
The poster is actually right the above quoted passage is the only place in the bible were the word lucifer was used and it was refering to the king of babylon. To confirm read the whole chapter of Isaiah 14

In summary?

_{is lucifer and satan d same?}

noetic:

i wonder how intelligent u are?

u choose to discredit the claims of one record (the bible), believed by over a billion people against an ancient record which we can hardly make refrence to.

@noetic
Pay attention! I never discredited anything. When does asking questions translate to discrediting?
In the olden days, billions of people believed the earth was flat. Does that make it true?

Education is all about asking questions you hear?

KunleOshob:

@noetic
The poster is actually right the above quoted passage is the only place in the bible were the word lucifer was used and it was refering to the king of babylon. To confirm read the whole chapter of Isaiah 14

so was the supposed earthly or historical king of babylon also the one refered to in verses 13 and 14?

You said in your heart,
      "I will ascend to heaven;
      I will raise my throne
      above the stars of God;
      I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly,
      on the utmost heights of the sacred mountain. [c]

14 I will ascend above the tops of the clouds;
      I will make myself like the Most High."


you can only overthrow or rebel against what u c.  so did your presumed king of babylon ever live with, see or saw God to have developed these thoughts?. . . .  . . My take is NO.

and the poster never said the source of his misinformation was d bible. . .  . . he laid credence to another historical source, which is d basis of my disagreement with his opinion.

Missy B:

In summary?

_{is lucifer and satan d same?}

In summary there is NO biblical evidence that Lucifer and Satan are the same.

coolruler:

@noetic
Pay attention! I never discredited anything. When does asking questions translate to discrediting?
In the olden days, billions of people believed the earth was flat. Does that make it true?

what r u talking about?

u made a categorical statement and not a guess, u said,

coolruler:

Actually, It might suprise you to know that Lucifer is not the same as Satan.

u had a definite opinion that satan n lucifer r not the same and u unfortunately butressed it with a nihilant historical source.

do u want to share with us why u believe the version of this history book n not the bible?

[Quote]
Education is all about asking questions you hear?
[/quote]
not so, my dear.
its about asking questions with the intention to learn and be informed.

@noetic
Have you ever head of the story of the tower of babylon? What do you think the king of babylon was trying to achieve with that tower?

@noetic
Quote your own biblical source that suggests that satn and lucifer are one and the same.

KunleOshob:

@noetic
Quote your own biblical source that suggests that satn and lucifer are one and the same.

in isaiah 14  :12. Lucifer was described as having fallen from heaven and cast down to the earth.

How you have fallen from heaven,
       O morning star, son of the dawn!
       You have been cast down to the earth,
       you who once laid low the nations!

was the king of babylon human, he could not have been to heaven not to talk of being cast down from heaven.
this truth is butressed in Rev 12: 7-9

7And there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

and also the lucifer in Isaiah 14 was described as the morning star and light bringer. this corroborates what Jesus said in luke 10:18
18He replied, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Satan and lucifer are one and the same, they represent the enemies of God.
Lucifer was his name when he was the morning star, shining in the glory of God, he became satan (which means enemy of God) when he rebbeled against God.

Satan and Lucipher no be the same?

Satan and Lucifer are not the same.

Satan = The Devil - Force of Evil.
Lucifer = Babylonian Prince - Man

The fact that we think Lucifer is Satan is down to a misinterpretation when the Bible was translated into Latin (the Vulgate Bible) by a scholar named Jerome. The mistake was later compounded by an English poet named Milton in his book "Paradise Lost" where he constantly refers to Lucifer as the Devil. From there, the whole thing snowballed and the mistake was never rectified.

The Isiaiah passage refers to a prince of Babylon whose hold over the Jews was crumbling. The Jews were enslaved by the Babylonians and the author of Isiaiah was merely stating that what goes around comes around.

The word "Lucifer" in Isaiah 14:12 presents a minor problem to mainstream Christianity. It becomes a much larger problem to Bible literalists, and becomes a huge obstacle for the claims of Mormonism.
John J. Robinson in A Pilgrim's Path, pp. 47-48 explains:


"Lucifer makes his appearance in the fourteenth chapter of the Old Testament book of Isaiah, at the twelfth verse, and nowhere else: "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!"

The first problem is that Lucifer is a Latin name. So how did it find its way into a Hebrew manuscript, written before there was a Roman language? To find the answer, I consulted a scholar at the library of the Hebrew Union College in Cincinnati. What Hebrew name, I asked, was Satan given in this chapter of Isaiah, which describes the angel who fell to become the ruler of hell?


The answer was a surprise. In the original Hebrew text, the fourteenth chapter of Isaiah is not about a fallen angel, but about a fallen Babylonian king, who during his lifetime had persecuted the children of Israel.
It contains no mention of Satan, either by name or reference. The Hebrew scholar could only speculate that some early Christian scribes, writing in the Latin tongue used by the Church, had decided for themselves that they wanted the story to be about a fallen angel, a creature not even mentioned in the original Hebrew text, and to whom they gave the name "Lucifer."

Why Lucifer? In Roman astronomy, Lucifer was the name given to the morning star (the star we now know by another Roman name, Venus). The morning star appears in the heavens just before dawn, heralding the rising sun.
The name derives from the Latin term lucem ferre, bringer, or bearer, of light." In the Hebrew text the expression used to describe the Babylonian king before his death is Helal, son of Shahar, which can best be translated as "Day star, son of the Dawn."
The name evokes the golden glitter of a proud king's dress and court (much as his personal splendor earned for King Louis XIV of France the appellation, "The Sun King".

The scholars authorized by , King James I to translate the Bible into current English did not use the original Hebrew texts, but used versions translated , largely by St. Jerome in the fourth century. Jerome had mistranslated the Hebraic metaphor, "Day star, son of the Dawn," as "Lucifer," and over the centuries a metamorphosis took place. Lucifer the morning star became a disobedient angel, cast out of heaven to rule eternally in hell. Theologians, writers, and poets interwove the myth with the doctrine of the Fall, and in Christian tradition Lucifer is now the same as Satan, the Devil, and --- ironically --- the Prince of Darkness.

So "Lucifer" is nothing more than an ancient Latin name for the morning star, the bringer of light.

That can be confusing for Christians who identify Christ himself as the morning star, a term used as a central theme in many Christian sermons. Jesus refers to himself as the morning star in Revelation 22:16: "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star."
And so there are those who do not read beyond the King James version of the Bible, who say 'Lucifer is Satan: so says the Word of God', "

Henry Neufeld (a Christian who comments on Biblical sticky issues) went on to say,
"this passage is often related to Satan, and a similar thought is expressed in Luke 10:18 by Jesus, that was not its first meaning. It's primary meaning is given in Isaiah 14:4 which says that when Israel is restored they will "take up this taunt against the king of Babylon . . ." Verse 12 is a part of this taunt song. This passage refers first to the fall of that earthly king,

How does the confusion in translating this verse arise? The Hebrew of this passage reads: "heleyl, ben shachar" which can be literally translated "shining one, son of dawn." This phrase means, again literally, the planet Venus when it appears as a morning star. In the Septuagint, a 3rd century BC translation of the Hebrew scriptures into Greek, it is translated as "heosphoros" which also means Venus as a morning star.

How did the translation "lucifer" arise? This word comes from Jerome's Latin Vulgate. Was Jerome in error? Not at all. In Latin at the time, "lucifer" actually meant Venus as a morning star. Isaiah is using this metaphor for a bright light, though not the greatest light to illustrate the apparent power of the Babylonian king which then faded."

@noetic
I wouldn't bother to respond to your posts anymore, more than enough posts a have been pasted here which explains things in better perspective. You can choose to learn from it or stick to what you assume is true.

Lucifer, the light bringer was an epithet of the King of Babylon.  In actual fact it was the planet Venus which rose shortly before the sun in the morning which is why it is called the light bringer, or the herald.  Many others have also taken on the epithet of the morning star as herald of light.  Including Jesus. http://www.acts17-11.com/dialogs_morningstar.html

Even as far as in South America the native indians had a diety called Quetzalcoatl who was also the bright morning star. http://weber.ucsd.edu/~anthclub/quetzalcoatl/quetzal.htm

I more cases than not it signifies hope.  After the darkness of the night when lucifer is spotted we know that the daybreak is nigh.

Either of the ways; agents of satan will love to justify the man Lucifer!

^^^ Lucifer was probably an asshole but being an asshole doesn't make you Satan!!!

Both Lucifer and Satan are the same being. Satan was first called Lucifer which was a covering cherub, or what is known as a special angel who stood in the immediate presence of God.

In Ezekiel 28: 12-14 we read:

12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.


The king of Tyrus mentioned here was a being used by Satan to resist the people of God, but the description used by the prophet was directed at Lucifer.

In Daniel 10 we read, But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.

Here the term "prince of the kingdom of Persia" is used to represent Satan's attempt to frustrate Daniel. It took Christ Himself, who is called Michael, to assist Daniel. Michael is called one of the chief princes, or rulers in heaven.

13:Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.

Here the prophet further describes the beauty of Lucifer before he fell. To the prophet he appeared to be covered with beautiful and precious stones, but in reality those were actual colors glowing from Lucifer.

14:Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

The expression "cherub that covereth" can only be attributed to angels; not humans.

KunleOshob:

@noetic
I wouldn't bother to respond to your posts anymore, more than enough posts a have been pasted here which explains things in better perspective. You can choose to learn from it or stick to what you assume is true.

i like ur conclusion, its typical nigerian.

people responded sayin all sorts of tins about wat they heared or read in storybooks, but yet refuse to produce sources.
they all claim to have read from an historical book, whats the title of the book? the source?

I refuse to be religiously or intellectually stupid. if anyone has any good reason to suggest that lucifer is not satan, then bring ur opinion on board and state sources. and if ur source is d bible, make an effort to make an analysis.

dont just type and tink u r speakin to kindergarten pupils who r expected to take ur word without reasoning.
what evidences or refrences suggest that lucifer aint satan?

people responded sayin all sorts of tins about what they heared or read in storybooks, but yet refuse to produce sources.

LOL. Isn't that what you've done bro? Read the word Lucifer once in a book and thought "Oh shit. Dats gotta be true den!!!".

OK. Here's a list of links to sites on the internet that will prove to you that we were telling the truth and you're believing in a mere misinterpretation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

http://www.demonbuster.com/lucifer.html

http://www.apostolic.net/biblicalstudies/isaiah1412.htm

http://www.lds-mormon.com/lucifer.shtml

http://jesuschristsonofgodsavior..com/2008/01/satan-is-not-actually-lucifer.html

http://www.s8int.com/lucifer.html


I could give you a thousand more links but you may as well Google yourself.

detruth:

Either of the ways; agents of satan will love to justify the man Lucifer!

@detruth

when does asking simple Biblical questions translate into being agents of Satan? Why did God give you a brain?
Why do you have the ability to think? or question things?

How many people have wondered how Satan could have been God's annointed cherub when Jesus said satan was a liar from the beginning? Annointed to lie or what? We all grew up to know Lucifer as Satan, but it does not mean we are correct,  Please take time to read the article linked here. It will shed more light on this topic ,

http://www.identitynetwork.net/apps/articles/default.asp?articleid=22937&columnid=2093

Satan being a liar from the beginning doesn't mean he wasn't pure from the beginning either. God certainly didn't create Satan, so where did he come from? Isn't Satan an angel? And if he was an angel what was his name? Why would two major prophets indicate that Lucifer fell from heaven?

What did they mean by falling from heaven? Revelation 12 speaks of Satan falling from heaven. Notice two prophets used his original name, Lucifer, while John used Satan, the devil to describe a being that was kicked out of heaven, and who took with him a third of God's angels.

The question is, if Lucifer fell where is he? Can you account for him?

@coolruler
u said

@detruth
Christianity is not a secret cult!
Its only in cults of darkness that you are forbidden to ask questions. I asked a simple question. If you cannot enlighten me, then please don't insult my intelligence.

The truth is that Christianity is a Secret cult.

Jesus is called the Son of Man
The Day star

Satan is the morning star

However this descriptive name are simmilar never forget that Jesus was the one that Made Lucifer before Lucifer turned himself againt God.

they are the same thing

the difference is in heaven he was refered to as lucifer and on earth satan

same as jesus, in heaven he was know as the word of God, john 1:3 ''and the word of God became flesh",

anyy futher questions ask me.