@ Drusilla

Bobby,

Thank you.

I have asked about that verse before because some Christians teach some type of "rebuilt temple with sacrifices in Jerusalem" but there is no mention of any temple in the end times, unless you include that one.

However those verses calls it God's temple, which contradicts the idea of the 3rd temple they claim because the 3rd temple they talk about is supposed to be built by and for those opposed to God.

Its unfortunate that they look for a kingdom to be built by men, when the bible says that "Abraham looked for a city whose builder and maker is God"

The words temple, city, Jerusalem, are used in context in whatever sections of the bible they are found. What persons tend to do is use a particular word that has a particular context for when it was first spoken to mean something totally different.

Most of the OT prophetic books, including Zhaccariah, make mention of the restoration of Israel, but as to what Israel it is stressing is quite a different matter. I am of the view that any mentin of a restoration can only take place when Jesus comes and not before. I am saying that to say, that I cannot see the logics or purpose for such a thing, and especially in the light of the NT and what is said about the soon return of Jesus.

Why would Jesus allow men on earth to build a temple in accordance with whatever purpose they are trying to attach to such significance, and see that same temple destroyed at His second coming? The advocates of such a teaching implies that Jesus will rule from that city on earth, in contrast to the one from which He will rule from in heaven where presently His throne is, and where He will be coronated as King of Kings, and Lord of Lords in.

Lets assume this temple is going to be built by men in Jerusalem. At what point will Jesus rule from this earthly city? They say during the millenium, but if you examine the scriptures carefully, it says that during that time Satan will be bound. There will be no human life on earth during that period, so I wonder who is it that will rule who on planet earth.

They totally ignore those OT prophetic passages that say that the 2nd coming of Christ will completly devastate the earth, leaving it in a state of emptiness and chaos. The only beings remaining will be Satan and his hosts of demons who will be forced to remain on earth to contemplate their future punishment.

Look at what Peter says about Jesus' return:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare.

Listen to John as he describes the return of Jesus:

Revelation 6:14-17
14 The sky receded like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. 15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?"

If they say that Christ will rule on earth then what this text is saying is that after such a rule Christ would have to have gone back to heaven to return again in power and great glory.

Bear in mind that Jesus is supposed to have secretly taken up the christians in heaven already. For the first 7 years there will be a so-called tribulation upon the earth as part of the wider period of 1000 years. After this tribulation Christ is suppoosed to come back and take up His rightful rule.

My question is at the end of the 1000 years what will happen to that earthly temple from which Christ ruled? How does one explain that John sees the Holy City of God descending form heaven as recorded in Revelation 21?

When God reigns fire and brimstone from heaven on earth where will God's people be, in the descending city that is prepared for His bride, or the earthly temple supposedly made by men on earth?

Do you begin to see the loop holes in such a teaching?

Bobby,

Of course. We are in total agreement.

Your right it is the restoration of Israel that they invented the "sinful earthly Millenium Kingdom" they think Jesus is going to come rule over.

They reply that the promises in the OT to the Israelites have not been fulfilled about getting the land and living in peace with Jesus as their king.

Eze 37:11 And He said to me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel. Behold, they say, Our bones are dried and our hope is lost; we are cut off by ourselves.

Eze 37:12 Therefore prophesy and say to them, So says the Lord Jehovah: Behold, O My people, I will open your graves and cause you to come up out of your graves, and will bring you into the land of Israel.

The bible is very clear, when the Israelites will get their promises fulfilled. In the resurrection.

There is no need to invent a sinner filled earthly Millenium Kingdom that you think Jesus is going to come and rule over.

@TV01, 
Words of wisdom.  Well appreciated!

@Bobbyaf,

In every dispensation there are only two sets of people as far as God is concerned. Those who hear the salvation message and respond to it, and those who don't. God doesn't care about who is who in the plan of salvation. Listen to what Jesus said about the gospel and who it is intended to reach.
Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

I am amused by your assertion about the kinds of people on the earth when the Bible clearly says otherwise.  See 1Corinthians 10:32 "Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:"    The scripture you quoted above, I insist, is directed at the Jews who will be God's witness to the nations then when the church must have left thescene.  But I jump a little, let me back track.

I will begin my submission by quoting first from the Book of Acts, chapter 1 and verse 6: When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?   From the disciples' question, you get the understanding that they were expecting a literal manifestation of God's Kingdom on earth with the Jews as His client nation.  Jesus did not tell them they were wrong for expecting the kingdom, but He made them realise that there is a timing to it.

You see, the early church were so convinced of this earthly kingdom of Jews that they will not even preach unto the Gentiles.  God's revelation to Peter changed that, and Paul was the one who explained to them what was going on.  If you go through Paul's letter to the Romans , he made it abundantly clear that God will still establish that kingdom but only after the fullness of the Gentiles have come in. 

A study of the book of Daniel 9 (chapter 9 particulalrly) reveals that from the time that the temple in Jerusalem was to be rebuilt to the time of the end will be 70 weeks.  Within these 70 weeks, temple sacrifices must continue and Isreal will still keep their covenant with God.  Christ (and by implication, the church) came into the picture after 69 weeks, which means there is still one more week left for the Jewish covenant and sacrifices.  This is one of the mysteries that Peter mentioned that the Prophets of old were diligently searching but not knowing the details of God's plan.  The only person who had the information was Paul, who made it known that God had inserted a new dispensation of the church between the time alloted to the Jews.  This is the reason why the rapture must take place, so that the last 7 years of the Jews might be fulfilled.  Remember that Paul mentioned that ones the fullness of the Gentiles have come in, then all Isreal will be saved in keeping with God's covenant and election of them.

May I also bring to your attention the fact that the ones refered to as the servants of God during the tribulation period are actually the Jews.  Revelation 7 talks about God sealing 144,000 of them in anticipation of the great tribulations that was coming upon the earth.  Are you going to tell me these 144,000 refer to the church?  We have imbibed the doctrine of substitution in the church where we claim God has no dealings with the Jews anymore and that the Church has replaced the Jews as God's people.  That is so far from the truth.  The end-time actually revolves around them.

Anyway, I pray we all get more enlightement as we discuss this issue and I wait for your response with great anticiapation.

TayoD,

I will begin my submission by quoting first from the Book of Acts, chapter 1 and verse 6: When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? From the disciples' question, you get the understanding that they were expecting a literal manifestation of God's Kingdom on earth with the Jews as His client nation. Jesus did not tell them they were wrong for expecting the kingdom, but He made them realise that there is a timing to it.

Since you accept that a doctrine can be built upon the questions of the disciples. Then don't you also accept Jesus answer?

Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

How is it for you to know when a literal physical kingdom will be but not for the disciples to know?

Good question Dru! If Jesus didn't say to His disciples why would anyone even attempt to say? And notice that the word kingdom was used here in Acts 1, and not temple. Like Judas the disciples were only interested in seeing the Romans vanish. They desired dominion and control and longed for freedom.

Judas was the only forthright person to actually set up Jesus by betrayal thinking he could force Jesus to free them, and become king, not knowing that his act was ordained.

How many times did the disciples ask as to who will be the greatest in the kingdom, only to be met with disapproval from Jesus.

Bobbyaf, Dru,

You two have systematically dodged the issues I raised in my response. As Bobbyaf mentioned, Jesus is never the one to shy away from disapproving what his disiples questioned and intended when there is the need for it. So why didn't He do the same in this case? If they had been wrong, He would have told them plainly. The only thing He said was the timing sholdn't be an issue with them. They should just wait for the Holy Spirit to usher in the new dispensation of the church.

And Bobbyaf, you just mix so many things up. No where was I insinuating that the Kingdom and the temple were the same. So I wonder how you came about that conclusion.

As for Dru, the Disciple's questions were based on the information revealed to them from the scriptures. So I really don't understand why you think it is irrelevant. If Jesus doesn't want us to have an idea of timing, why would we have so many hints from the scriptures? The exact time and hour is what the Disciples wanted to know and I'm sure Jesus would not tell them more than what has been revealed already.

I am still waiting for you to provide adequate responses to my submisions especially as related to the Jews and the en-times as well as the 144,000 mentioned in Revelation.

I must say I ve had plenty of fun here. Am trilled to see that there r youths who r so much into the word of God. Thank you TAYO.D, D, Drusilla, although u were not so correct in some areas, but am happy David and Tayo where there to put us striaght. AND, what was the muslims saying? U guys have nofin to d with rapture. So, hush. Tayo.D, pls be my personal pastor. I love the word.

This goes to Tayo.D. I need help. How do I post a topic on Nairaland? Am kinda new here. Tayo, if u Can help me post it. What I want to post is. What are the differences between the Isa of the Quran and Jesus of the Bible?