Gombs:


Oga image...

Paul it's legibly not eligibly... English sha o

Nora, I'm here now... can you show me one scripture where we are encouraged not to be prosperous? Is poverty the will of God for those His Son died for?

Thank you!

Zechariah 1:13-17 MSG
13-15God reassured the Angel-Messenger—good words, comforting words —who then addressed me: "Tell them this. Tell them that God-of-the-Angel-Armies has spoken. This is God's Message: 'I care deeply for Jerusalem and Zion. I feel very possessive of them. But I'm thoroughly angry with the godless nations that act as if they own the whole world. I was only moderately angry earlier, but now they've gone too far. I'm going into action.

16-17"'I've come back to Jerusalem, but with compassion this time.'

This is God speaking.

From tbe above, God was pissed unbelivers were richer than His chosen ones...and He acted

The Scripture you quoted above was speaking about God's compassion for His people in exile and the fact that the godless nations with whom He had punished His people for their sins, were getting comfortable with the thought that they held Israel captive solely by their military might and prowess and not by God's design and permission - hence their acting as if they owned the whole world. They were in essence denying God's sovereignty and taking the glory to themselves for this 'accomplishment'.

His promised action was to return them to their own land.

As for encouraging people to be prosperous, if we can be honest with ourselves, we usually mean (usually before and above other things) material possessions and riches when we use the word 'prosperity' - money as a matter of fact. The moment we can admit this fact, the easier it is to see the situation much clearer. Here's what the Scripture admonishes.

'But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 1Tim. 6:9-10
'Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;'
(1Ti 6:17-18 KJV)

So there are more worthy causes in life than making lots of money. There is only one worthy cause - the quest to become like Jesus, if you could even call that a quest for which one can take the credit for, since God works in us both to will and do according to His good pleasure.
In Jesus, the abundance of or lack of riches and material goods is inconsequential to fulfillment in life.

'And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.' Luke 12:15 KJV

nuwell:



The Scripture you quoted above was speaking about God's compassion for His people in exile and the fact that the godless nations with whom He had punished His people for their sins, were getting comfortable with the thought that they held Israel captive solely by their military might and prowess and not by God's design and permission - hence their acting as if they owned the whole world. They were in essence denying God's sovereignty and taking the glory to themselves for this 'accomplishment'.

His promised action was to return them to their own land.

As for encouraging people to be prosperous, if we can be honest with ourselves, we usually mean (usually before and above other things) material possessions and riches when we use the word 'prosperity' - money as a matter of fact. The moment we can admit this fact, the easier it is to see the situation much clearer. Here's what the Scripture admonishes.

'But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 1Tim. 6:9-10
'Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;'
(1Ti 6:17-18 KJV)

So there are more worthy causes in life than making lots of money. There is only one worthy cause - the quest to become like Jesus, if you could even call that a quest for which one can take the credit for, since God works in us both to will and do according to His good pleasure.
In Jesus, the abundance of or lack of riches and material goods is inconsequential to fulfillment in life.

'And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.' Luke 12:15 KJV

God bless yyu plentY. Only fraudsters and their promoters will refuse to accept this truth.

nuwell:



The Scripture you quoted above was speaking about God's compassion for His people in exile and the fact that the godless nations with whom He had punished His people for their sins, were getting comfortable with the thought that they held Israel captive solely by their military might and prowess and not by God's design and permission - hence their acting as if they owned the whole world. They were in essence denying God's sovereignty and taking the glory to themselves for this 'accomplishment'.

His promised action was to return them to their own land.

As for encouraging people to be prosperous, if we can be honest with ourselves, we usually mean (usually before and above other things) material possessions and riches when we use the word 'prosperity' - money as a matter of fact. The moment we can admit this fact, the easier it is to see the situation much clearer. Here's what the Scripture admonishes.

'But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 1Tim. 6:9-10
'Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;'
(1Ti 6:17-18 KJV)

So there are more worthy causes in life than making lots of money. There is only one worthy cause - the quest to become like Jesus, if you could even call that a quest for which one can take the credit for, since God works in us both to will and do according to His good pleasure.
In Jesus, the abundance of or lack of riches and material goods is inconsequential to fulfillment in life.

'And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.' Luke 12:15 KJV

 Zac 1:17  Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.

[Psa 35:27
 27  Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.



Can you also explain the above for me too? Thanks

Maybe you should do more study on the book of Zechariah

Gombs:


 Zac 1:17  Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.

[Psa 35:27
 27  Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.



Can you also explain the above for me too? Thanks

Maybe you should do more study on the book of Zechariah

I certainly will, again. But off the cuff now, all you need to do is to continue reading through the entire book yourself to realize what was paramount on the mind of the Prophet, as inspired by God during this time. The Jews were in exile. They needed to return home after more than 70 years of captivity, to regain their sovereignty as a nation and build again the Temple - establish again the worship of the one, true God.

The entire book has the same theme but you can find a summary of what their idea of prosperity was in the 8th chapter. There all the aspects of this prosperity were outlined. If it wouldn't make this post unnecesarily voluminous, I would have posted the entire chapter. However, let me highlight a verse that interpretes the one you quoted from Chapter 1, verse 17.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:
And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the LORD, and to seek the LORD of hosts: I will go also.Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.'
(Zechariah 8:20-23)

How else do you think that the cities of the Lord would be spread abroad? By a vibrant economy and trading system that would outclass every other that had existed? Yes, that would have been one of the natural results of the fear of God in every man's heart. There wouldn't be need for needless wars to establish the supremacy of Israel because the world having recognized Israel as God's people and Jerusalem, His headquarters would naturally submit to Him, and by extension the instruction of the Jew, in the fear of the Lord.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.' (Zechariah 8:23)

For Psalm 35:27, the entire chapter explains the context in which David speaks of 'prosperity', and there's not one allusion to material acquisition aka plenty money. He speaks in that psalm of how he believed God to rescue him from his enemies. It is a record of triumph over the natural reaction to hate his enemy when he says in verses 12 - 14.

'They rewarded me evil for good to the spoiling of my soul.
But as for me, when they were sick, my clothing was sackcloth: I humbled my soul with fasting; and my prayer returned into mine own bosom.
I behaved myself as though he had been my friend or brother: I bowed down heavily, as one that mourneth for his mother.'

His statement in verse 27 which you quoted is a resolve from an understanding that the way of righteousness triumphs eventually over the hatred of men, and his conviction that God is indeed enthusiastic about helping anyone who trusts in Him, out of tough situations.

The Lord does indeed have pleasure in the prosperity of his servants. Praise the Lord!

There's so much more we can gleam from that Scripture but I hope this summary is sufficiently insightful.

nuwell:


I certainly will, again. But off the cuff now, all you need to do is to continue reading through the entire book yourself to realize what was paramount on the mind of the Prophet, as inspired by God during this time. The Jews were in exile. They needed to return home after more than 70 years of captivity, to regain their sovereignty as a nation and build again the Temple - establish again the worship of the one, true God.

The entire book has the same theme but you can find a summary of what their idea of prosperity was in the 8th chapter. There all the aspects of this prosperity were outlined. If it wouldn't make this post unnecesarily voluminous, I would have posted the entire chapter. However, let me highlight a verse that interpretes the one you quoted from Chapter 1, verse 17.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:
And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the LORD, and to seek the LORD of hosts: I will go also.Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.'
(Zechariah 8:20-23)

How else do you think that the cities of the Lord would be spread abroad? By a vibrant economy and trading system that would outclass every other that had existed? Yes, that would have been one of the natural results of the fear of God in every man's heart. There wouldn't be need for needless wars to establish the supremacy of Israel because the world having recognized Israel as God's people and Jerusalem, His headquarters would naturally submit to Him, and by extension the instruction of the Jew, in the fear of the Lord.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.' (Zechariah 8:23)

For Psalm 35:27, the entire chapter explains the context in which David speaks of 'prosperity', and there's not one allusion to material acquisition aka plenty money. He speaks in that psalm of how he believed God to rescue him from his enemies. It is a record of triumph over the natural reaction to hate his enemy when he says in verses 12 - 14.

'They rewarded me evil for good to the spoiling of my soul.
But as for me, when they were sick, my clothing was sackcloth: I humbled my soul with fasting; and my prayer returned into mine own bosom.
I behaved myself as though he had been my friend or brother: I bowed down heavily, as one that mourneth for his mother.'

His statement in verse 27 which you quoted is a resolve from an understanding that the way of righteousness triumphs eventually over the hatred of men, and his conviction that God is indeed enthusiastic about helping anyone who trusts in Him, out of tough situations.

[size=20pt]The Lord does indeed have pleasure in the prosperity of his servants. Praise the Lord![/size]

There's so much more we can gleam from that Scripture but I hope this summary is sufficiently insightful.

Case closed!

nuwell:


I certainly will, again. But off the cuff now, all you need to do is to continue reading through the entire book yourself to realize what was paramount on the mind of the Prophet, as inspired by God during this time. The Jews were in exile. They needed to return home after more than 70 years of captivity, to regain their sovereignty as a nation and build again the Temple - establish again the worship of the one, true God.

The entire book has the same theme but you can find a summary of what their idea of prosperity was in the 8th chapter. There all the aspects of this prosperity were outlined. If it wouldn't make this post unnecesarily voluminous, I would have posted the entire chapter. However, let me highlight a verse that interpretes the one you quoted from Chapter 1, verse 17.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:
And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the LORD, and to seek the LORD of hosts: I will go also.Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.'
(Zechariah 8:20-23)

How else do you think that the cities of the Lord would be spread abroad? By a vibrant economy and trading system that would outclass every other that had existed? Yes, that would have been one of the natural results of the fear of God in every man's heart. There wouldn't be need for needless wars to establish the supremacy of Israel because the world having recognized Israel as God's people and Jerusalem, His headquarters would naturally submit to Him, and by extension the instruction of the Jew, in the fear of the Lord.

'Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.' (Zechariah 8:23)

For Psalm 35:27, the entire chapter explains the context in which David speaks of 'prosperity', and there's not one allusion to material acquisition aka plenty money. He speaks in that psalm of how he believed God to rescue him from his enemies. It is a record of triumph over the natural reaction to hate his enemy when he says in verses 12 - 14.

'They rewarded me evil for good to the spoiling of my soul.
But as for me, when they were sick, my clothing was sackcloth: I humbled my soul with fasting; and my prayer returned into mine own bosom.
I behaved myself as though he had been my friend or brother: I bowed down heavily, as one that mourneth for his mother.'

His statement in verse 27 which you quoted is a resolve from an understanding that the way of righteousness triumphs eventually over the hatred of men, and his conviction that God is indeed enthusiastic about helping anyone who trusts in Him, out of tough situations.

The Lord does indeed have pleasure in the prosperity of his servants. Praise the Lord!

There's so much more we can gleam from that Scripture but I hope this summary is sufficiently insightful.

Very well written.

God bless you

Gombs:


 Zac 1:17  Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.

[Psa 35:27
 27  Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.



Can you also explain the above for me too? Thanks

Maybe you should do more study on the book of Zechariah

Thanks for the scripture. We can do nothing against the truth but for the truth. Truth does not change. The scripture applies to All believers since everything is written for our learning and all scripture is profitable for doctrine....Romans 10:12 captures it very well. Thanks.

Gombs:


 Zac 1:17  Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.

[Psa 35:27
 27  Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.



Can you also explain the above for me too? Thanks

Maybe you should do more study on the book of Zechariah

Mark 10:17-22

17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth
21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.




the verses you quoted has to be studied in the context it was used in & not just lifted to buttress prosperity in the present day

God directly & explicitly promised & gave wealth/riches to the Jews in the OT BUT we find no such direct promises to the present day Christian

The OT is filled with examples of people who were mega rich but how many of such examples can you find in the NT(that has better promises)

Paul talked about the Macedonian church & those at Philippians who gave out of their needs/poverty, he never stated that they will become rich as a result of their giving neither did Paul ever talked down on the saints that were poor(he never stated that they were poor by choice or that they were mocking Christianity)

The gentile world knew nothing about Jesus, the gospel was introduced to them by Paul(Paul knew the in & out of the law & the Jewish custom)

Paul never taught the gentile world about earthly riches or tithe,

Q1. how could he have missed such?

all the admonition about riches & wealth in the NT, we are told to be careful about riches, no where do we find Christians being admonish to go For wealth


Q2. Why didn't Jesus ask the rich man in the above verse, to be his partner in ministry, to be his financier??

Rather he asked him to go sell all wealth & give to the poor( by the way some present day Christians now say that: giving to the poor is just lending to God, that God will pay back but without interest, i.e its more profitable to give to ministers/church than the poor)

Note: the rich man had kept the law since the days of his youth yet Jesus asked him to forgo all

The question that still begs answering to is, why do most of these 'prosperity preachers' get declared bankrupt in their ministry?

Why aren't they practicing what they preach to their members?

feedthenation:
The question that still begs answering to is, why do most of these 'prosperity preachers' get declared bankrupt in their ministry?

Why aren't they practicing what they preach to their members?

what they preach is fraud, it can not stand d test of time. Why their Nigerian counterparts appears to be succeeding is bc naija sustains fraud, but its a matter of time.

nannymcphee:


Mark 10:17-22

17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth
21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.

Hello ma'am!

the verses you quoted has to be studied in the context it was used in & not just lifted to buttress prosperity in the present day

God directly & explicitly promised & gave wealth/riches to the Jews in the OT BUT we find no such [size=20pt]direct [/size]promises to the present day Christian

if He did that for those who did not have the Holy Spirit in them, how much more those who have? i thought the NT was far better that the OT? no?

is see what you did there in the above enlarged. it was a strategy, a clever one i must confess, you used to sit on the fence. Shol i take away the word 'direct'?

The OT is filled with examples of people who were mega rich but how many of such examples can you find in the NT(that has better promises)

in other words, the NT is not in support of riches? Did Jesus die to raise paupers? if the NT is of better promises, it means what the OT folks enjoyed was kindergarten level compared to what we now have in Christ.

Paul talked about the Macedonian church & those at Philippians who gave out of their needs/poverty, he never stated that they will become rich as a result of their giving neither did Paul ever talked down on the saints that were poor(he never stated that they were poor by choice or that they were mocking Christianity)

Jesus spoke on the principle of giving and receiving, ma'am, the only principle of receiving in the bible is giving. Check all those who were celebrated in the bible...they gave...some massively eg David, Abraham, Paul etc

The gentile world knew nothing about Jesus, the gospel was introduced to them by Paul(Paul knew the in & out of the law & the Jewish custom)

false... the jews in the Jerusalem church already started the gentile church before Paul was sent there to Pastor them...i know you meant Paul was specifically sent to the Gentiles by Christ Himself, but my dear, he wasn't the one who introduced the gospel to them, though he planted many churches amongst the gentiles.

Paul never taught the gentile world about earthly riches or tithe,

really?
can you explain 2 Corinthians 8:9 please?
Paul had used the Macedonians' example of generosity to provoke the Corinthians in their giving. Here, he turned to the supreme example of giving; that is, Christ Himself.

God didn't just give us something that He had; He gave Himself. What was God's motive for giving? It wasn't because of His need, but ours. He was motivated out of love for us (Joh 3:16). In the same way, Paul was encouraging these Corinthians to give unselfishly to the poor saints in Jerusalem. That's why God wants us rich...so that we can give!

Q1. how could he have missed such?

all the admonition about riches & wealth in the NT, we are told to be careful about riches, no where do we find Christians being admonish to go For wealth

you don't have a bible ni?
in 2Co 8:9: Jesus did have money. He even designated one of His disciples to be the treasurer (Joh 13:29). However, Jesus was poor compared to what He had before coming to earth. He was also poor in the same way that Paul was poor at times; i.e., He voluntarily did without things in order to reach others. He said, "The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head" (Mt 8:20). That line does in no way mean Jesus was homeless, does it?

Again, 2Co 8:9: Some people have tried to spiritualize this verse to apply only to spiritual or emotional poverty and wealth, but the context of this verse is definitely speaking about physical poverty and wealth; that is, money (see 2Co 8:1).

It is a true statement that Jesus made Himself poor spiritually and emotionally so that we could become wealthy in those areas. However, it is also a true statement that Jesus became poor monetarily for us so that we could become wealthy in finances. That's what this verse is saying.

The Greek word that was used in the first part of this verse to describe Jesus as being rich is "PLOUSIOS," and it means "wealthy; figuratively, abounding with" (Strong's Concordance). This is the same word that was translated "rich" in Mr 12:41, which says, "And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much" (emphasis mine).

The Greek word that was translated "rich" in the last part of this verse, describing us, is "PLOUTEO," and it means "to be (or become) wealthy (literally or figuratively)" (Strong's Concordance). This is the same word that was translated "rich" in 1Ti 6:9, which says, "But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition" (emphasis mine).

So, both Greek words used for "rich" in this verse are speaking of material wealth. This is further proof that this verse is teaching that our Lord Jesus provided prosperity for us in His atonement (Acts 2:21). Jesus wills for us, His children, to have our needs met abundantly (3John 2).

Q2. Why didn't Jesus ask the rich man in the above verse, to be his partner in ministry, to be his financier??

Jesus had partners, you want proof where folks gave to support His ministry?

Rather he asked him to go sell all wealth & give to the poor

if that was what Jesus meant, why haven't you?

( by the way some present day Christians now say that: giving to the poor is just lending to God,

that verse means, God will pay for the one who couldn't pay back, not that the borrower is lending to God.

that God will pay back but without interest

Does the above make sense to you?

i.e its more profitable to give to ministers/church than the poor)

you are funny ma'am... thanks for the laugh

Note: the rich man had kept the law since the days of his youth yet Jesus asked him to forgo all

ma'am, what Jesus wanted to point out is that, the man, though he SAID he has done all those, yet he had not faith that what he will lose or lost will be replenished by God. The rich man still have value of money over God. Jesus was in no way encouraging poverty, for Jesus himself was NOT a broke guy when he walked the streets of Galilee... He had everything He needed, and was NEVER IN LACK. Ever wondered why the roman centurions (centurions were not broke guys o) cast lots on who'd own the clothes Jesus wore? You think those clothes He wore were rags, yet rich centurions cast lots for them?

[size=20pt]Note[/size]
The Scriptures warn us against the pitfalls of riches (1Ti 6:9 and Pr 13:11), yet it is the love of money that is the root of all evil (1Ti 6:10), not money itself.

Before we can be the blessing to others that God intended us to be, we have to be blessed ourselves (Ge 12:2). Prosperity is not just for ourselves (Jas 4:3); it's so that we "may abound to every good work" (2Co 9:8 ). God gives seed to the sower (2Co 9:10); i.e., He provides riches to those of us who will let them flow to others and not hoard them for ourselves.

thank you so much for letting me teach others who will grace this thread. God bless you

@Gombs

Hello sire!

it's only 2corinthian8:9, that you can point out for the NT support for prosperity

I ask again show me where prosperity was promised for the NT believer apart from 2corithians8:9(which by btw isn't about physical riches or wealth)

Romans15:26

26 For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem

why did Paul not teach these poor saints to give sacrificially or to connect to the grace/anointing upon his life so that they can experience the "prosperity that God has given to them"

Pls also show me individuals(notice the 's') in the NT testament that gave massively

Also show me individuals who attributed his wealth source to the death of Jesus or to God(the OT is replete with examples)


In the first few paragraph of your response to my post, you talked about how the NT was better than the OT, but you couldn't list several bible verse to show how wealth was given to the Christian

let me ask you, which has more blessing giving to the pastor, giving to the church(ministry needs) & to the poor?

Becos some Christians will say some grounds are more fertile than others!!

nannymcphee:
@Gombs
Hello sire!

it's only 2corinthian8:9, that you can point out for the NT support for prosperity

Morning Ma'am. If you really read my post, you'd fetch other scriptures about prosperity in the NT. BBut, for records sake, I'd give you more

3 John 1:2: "Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in ALL (not some) things and be in health, just as your soul prospers."

Eph 3:20: "Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than ALL (not somethings) we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us,"

2 Cor 9:8: "And God is able to bless you abundantly, so that in ALL (not some) things at ALL (not some)times, having ALL (not somethings) that you need, you will abound in every good work."

2 Cor 9:6: "Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."


Acts 20:35
In everything I showed you that by working hard in this manner you must help the weak and remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He Himself said, ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.'

should i go on?

I ask again show me where prosperity was promised for the NT believer apart from 2corithians8:9(which by btw isn't about physical riches or wealth)

i just showed you above ma'am. It's good to see you shift stand now from

Paul never taught the gentile world about earthly riches or tithe,

to "apart from 2 Corinth 8:9"....

Romans15:26
26 For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem

why did Paul not teach these poor saints to give sacrificially or to connect to the grace/anointing upon his life so that they can experience the "prosperity that God has given to them"

oh he did! He taught that giving is the ONLY way of receiving from God...You want proof? You know he'd have to support them, while teaching them on the principles of receiving. let me just quote only one...holla if you need more

Romans 12:8
…Or he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.

Pls also show me individuals(notice the 's') in the NT testament that gave massively

i love this question. When studying on the churches Paul Pastored, i noticed the Philippian church were crazy givers..they gave massively

Philippians 4:15-17
And you yourselves also know, Philippians, that at the first preaching of the gospel, after I departed from Macedonia, no church shared with me in the matter of giving and receiving but you alone; for even in Thessalonica you send a gift [size=20pt]more than once [/size] for my needs. Not that I seek the gift itself, but I seek for the profit which increases to your account.

yes, i saw the plural...they whole church gave massively... holla if you need another scripture

Also show me individuals who attributed his wealth source to the death of Jesus or to God(the OT is replete with examples)

na wa o
na devil give them before? What did you think James meant when he said ALL (not some) good and perfect gifts are from God? sha, refer to the verse in the book of acts i quoted.

In the first few paragraph of your response to my post, you talked about how the NT was better than the OT, but you couldn't list several bible verse to show how wealth was given to the Christian

really? wealth wasn't? please provide scriptures

let me ask you, which has more blessing giving to the pastor, giving to the church(ministry needs) & to the poor?

giving generally is a blessing... simple. tithing is a form of giving too... seeds.. alms etc

Becos some Christians will say some grounds are more fertile than others!!

relate to Judas thought of selling a perfume and Jesus' answer...was Jesus mean to the poor?


[/quote]

[size=20pt]Understanding Prosperity[/size]

Throughout the Word, God plainly shows that His will is for His covenant people to have a surplus of prosperity. He promised to make Abraham rich, and the promise of Abraham is ours today (Galatians 3:13-14; Genesis 17:6). God’s will is prosperity for you—spirit, soul and body.

We want to share with you what true Bible prosperity is and how to apply it to your own life. We encourage you to look up each of the following scriptures as a basis for your own study.

What Is Prosperity?
Matthew 6:33; James 2:14-17; John 14:21; II Corinthians 9:9

True prosperity is the ability to use God’s ability and power to meet the needs of mankind—regardless of what those needs may be.

Spiritual Prosperity
Romans 8:2; Luke 4:18, 6:27-38

Spiritual prosperity is freedom from the law of sin and death. To be born again and filled with the Holy Spirit puts you in the position to receive from God all the things promised in His word.

Mental Prosperity
II Corinthians 10:5; III John 1; Philippians 4:7; I Thessalonians 5:14

To prosper mentally (in your soul), you must be able to control your mind, your will and your emotions. Prosperity of the mind comes when you use the knowledge you have accumulated from the Word of God—when you are controlling your mind, instead of allowing your mind to control you.

Physical Prosperity
I Peter 2:24; Mark 16:15-20; Luke 6:38; II Corinthians 9:8

Physical prosperity is twofold—health and wealth. Jesus redeemed us from the curse of the law—sickness, poverty and death (Deuteronomy 28:15-61). Health and wealth belong to the believer. Meditation on the Word and acting on the Word will bring results (Joshua 1:. When you act on the Word, mix your faith with it and do not doubt in your heart, the Word will work for you.

What produces spiritual, mental and physical prosperity? What brings all these areas together? The Word of God.

Hebrews 4:12 says the Word is alive, powerful and sharper than any two-edged sword. It divides the soul and the spirit, the joints and the marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. When you are walking in the Word of God, you will prosper and be in health.

We cannot settle for prosperity in the physical or mental realm only, just as we cannot settle for spiritual prosperity alone. We can’t afford to be lazy and to discount physical and mental prosperity simply because we are saved and filled with the Holy Spirit. It is God’s will for us to be made whole—spirit, soul and body—and to be kept that way until the return of our Lord Jesus Christ (I Thessalonians 5:23).

As you walk in the light of God’s Word, you will become prosperous in every area of your life.

http://www.kcm.org/real-help/article/understanding-prosperity


work calls... i believe i've dealt with the problem 'Prosperity', if anyone has an objction, please post them here. I'd Be back. Again, nannymcphee, thanks or availing me the opportunity to teach others. God bless you.

i continue to find it strange and near mysterious that people kick against God blessing people materially or financially, yet they themselves hope and pray for material and financial blessings. Abi provision no be blessing again? Folks are barking the wrong tree, seriously.

Image123:
i continue to find it strange and near mysterious that people kick against God blessing people materially or financially, yet they themselves hope and pray for material and financial blessings. Abi provision no be blessing again? Folks are barking the wrong tree, seriously.

You're missing the point.

Gombs:


3 John 1:2: "Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in ALL (not some) things and be in health, just as your soul prospers."

Be in health, yet Timothy had stomach issues!!

yes it's a good prayer but its God that will determine the extent to which you prosper in every facet of your endeavor

Since the death of Jesus with all the prosperity you keeping saying he has given to Christians, one would have thought that by now, the world's richest would be Christians


The world would have setup schools/studies to look into the wealth of Christians but the reverse is the case.

One would have thought by now, since there is much poverty in the world people would have been turning to Jesus for prosperity

My bro, Jesus came to give us eternal life!!! c'est fini

Eph 3:20: "Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than ALL (not somethings) we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us,"

This is generic & not Solely tied to prosperity, we cannot conclude based on this that this is the premise on which the Christian has been great wealth

2 Cor 9:8: "And God is able to bless you abundantly, so that in ALL (not some) things at ALL (not some)times, having ALL (not somethings) that you need, you will abound in every good work."

"All things, at all times and having all that you need"

How many times have u experienced this in your life, even Paul said he was content to be with & without(those days he was without, what happened-he didn't have faith?)

2 Cor 9:6: "Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."

This also is generic & applies to every facet in life, even amongst unbelievers

so this also does not show how God gave the NT Christian wealth

Acts 20:35
In everything I showed you that by working hard in this manner you must help the weak and remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He Himself said, ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.'

Nobody is disputing that it is more blessed to give than to receive but how does this verse show that the NT Christian has been given wealth or prosperity?

oh he did! He taught that giving is the ONLY way of receiving from God...You want proof? You know he'd have to support them, while teaching them on the principles of receiving. let me just quote only one...holla if you need more

Pls I need more, show me where he told christians to sow/connect upon the anointing on his life so that they can have more

Also show me where he told them to give so that they will no longer have to be poor



Romans 12:8
…Or he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.

Again, this talks about giving but doesn't show how it meant that wealth has been given to the Christian

i love this question. When studying on the churches Paul Pastored, i noticed the Philippian church were crazy givers..they gave massively

Philippians 4:15-17
And you yourselves also know, Philippians, that at the first preaching of the gospel, after I departed from Macedonia, no church shared with me in the matter of giving and receiving but you alone; for even in Thessalonica you send a gift [size=20pt]more than once [/size] for my needs. Not that I seek the gift itself, but I seek for the profit which increases to your account.

The bible didn't call them crazy givers , neither was it stated that they gave massively

they were only compared to other churches and besides Paul told them that God will supply them all their needs(not wants, check the meaning of needs)

he didn't tell them that they will become billionaires or become rich but that the thing they need for daily survival will be given to them

yes, i saw the plural...they whole church gave massively... holla if you need another scripture

Show me another scripture pls

na devil give them before? What did you think James meant when he said ALL (not some) good and perfect gifts are from God? sha, refer to the verse in the book of acts i quoted

Not what James meant!! List names

In the OT, I can list abraham, issac, joseph, David, Solomon, job etc men whose records showed that their wealth was gotten from God

kindly list names for me in the NT? the James you quoted was he rich? Does good & perfect gift now translate to wealth & prosperity

giving generally is a blessing... simple. tithing is a form of giving too... seeds.. alms etc

the NT teaches giving & that it is indeed a blessing to give but it is to meet a need be it ministry need or poor or the minister

BUT it doesn't teach giving to get, it doesn't emphasize on giving to get rich

I'm in no way saying I can't pray to God to bless the work of my hands or to prosper me, it is his sovereignty to answer me

but to now teach that it is God will or design that ALL Christians MUST/SHOULD/OUGHT TO be rich is not consistent with the scriptures

show me where the poor in the NT was admonish to give their way into prosperity

Show me where the poor was told that poverty was a bad thing

What you have is the Christian that has being taught to give to the one that doesn't have

It was said that St Francis of Asisi, paid a visit to Rome & the pope took him round & showed him the opulence of the Vatican City.

The pope was quoted to have said "we no longer say silver & gold have we none" to which St Francis replied "neither do you say rise up & walk"

we are back to those era again

trustman:


You're missing the point.

What is the point?

If the love of money is the root of all evil then the lack of it is even worse.

What seems to confuse God's children is the fact that they see "sinners" wealthy, while some of them wallow in poverty. So they wonder if God's promise of Material prosperity is not true or has ceased to exist.

The bible says there is profit in all labor. Which means that if an atheists works hard to get wealth (albeit away from God's provision) he/she will still find some success. The caveat there is that it will only be for a time. David said "I saw the wicked (the Ungodly) rise like a green bay tree but then after a while I looked and he was cut down".

The Christian is not the one trying to get rich for he has been reborn into riches. What we are told to do from scriptures is to discover our inheritance. That's why when people hear some christians say "I am rich" they want to check his bank account to see if he has more money than Bill Gates for him to aver such but that is not the law of faith. Faith speaks in agreement with God. If God says Abrahams blessings are yours (and we know the Abrahamic blessings included wealth) I can in the same token say I am wealthy. Regardless of if I am a taxi driver. In fact, being a taxi driver will only be for a while because as one walks in the law of faith, your life experiences begin to measure up with your confessions.

If Bill Gates has a foster child somewhere that we are oblivious of but this child grows up in penury does he stop being wealthy (if a tangible portion of Bills wealth is willed to him even without his knowledge?). That's the same way with all Christians. Many just don't know this truth and so they find themselves chasing after things that God already said would follow his kids- the same things that unbelievers chase after. And when they don't see the same 'instant' results they conclude that God's word didn't say so even in the face of barefaced scriptures.

Image123:


What is the point?

You're missing the point of the OP.
Go back and read carefully.

trustman:

You're missing the point of the OP.
Go back and read carefully.

What is the point, you that has read carefully?

nannymcphee:


Be in health, yet Timothy had stomach issues!!

ma'am... a little study wont kill you. Ephesus was a town by the sea port, and at that time, they had water issues due to sanitary wahala. The MOG kept getting ill from the water, Paul simply told him to take wine instead, and stop getting ill. this episode in no way means God could not protect the MOG.

yes it's a good prayer but its God that will determine the extent to which you prosper in every facet of your endeavor

Since the death of Jesus with all the prosperity you keeping saying he has given to Christians, one would have thought that by now, the world's richest would be Christians

I am ashamed of your testimony.

later you'd sing "Abraham's blessings are mine"

The world would have setup schools/studies to look into the wealth of Christians but the reverse is the case.

in your case... i can understand, yet you cannot understand how MOG are rich, you sorely concluded it's tithing and collections. Shame!

One would have thought by now, since there is much poverty in the world people would have been turning to Jesus for prosperity

i can understand your mindset at this point.... atheism aint far off though

My bro, Jesus came to give us eternal life!!! c'est fini

you have no idea what He brought us.

This is generic & not Solely tied to prosperity, we cannot conclude based on this that this is the premise on which the Christian has been great wealth

at least you implied it could be based on it..

"All things, at all times and having all that you need"

How many times have u experienced this in your life, even Paul said he was content to be with & without (those days he was without, what happened-he didn't have faith?)

so Paul lied or he assumed?

This also is generic & applies to every facet in life, even amongst unbelievers

so this also does not show how God gave the NT Christian wealth

very convenient, huh?

Nobody is disputing that it is more blessed to give than to receive but how does this verse show that the NT Christian has been given wealth or prosperity?

yet you pray for wealth and ask God to make your way prosperous...why ask Him for what He didnt want you to have in the first place?

Pls I need more, show me where he told christians to sow/connect upon the anointing on his life so that they can have more

quit this your antic..you said he didnt teach giving, i provided verses, now you asking another totally different thing. No, i will not provide any further.

Also show me where he told them to give so that they will no longer have to be poor

see you trying to be side step in a discussion you know you've faulted alot.

Romans 12:8
…Or he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.

Again, this talks about giving but doesn't show how it meant that wealth has been given to the Christian

Dear Lord Jesus!

The bible didn't call them crazy givers , neither was it stated that they gave massively

believe what you may...they gave, and gave like mad! And about the "crazy" givings, if you read properly, you'd see i wrote "i noticed" not "the bible said"

they were only compared to other churches and besides Paul told them that God will supply them all their needs(not wants, check the meaning of needs)

They were only compared? HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA... needs is far important than wants na...money is a need, a necessity, abi na lie? The gospel aint gonna move no where without cash...I wont be here preaching if not for cash

he didn't tell them that they will become billionaires or become rich but that the thing they need for daily survival will be given to them

like cash abi?
or is cash not needed for daily survival?

Show me another scripture pls

no need!

Not what James meant!! List names

In the OT, I can list abraham, issac, joseph, David, Solomon, job etc men whose records showed that their wealth was gotten from God

kindly list names for me in the NT? the James you quoted was he rich? Does good & perfect gift now translate to wealth & prosperity

Jesu mi o! in the NT, the bible declares that if you are in Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, hence heir according to the promise. Why do you still need me to name names? Abraham's blessings (including riches) are mine today... if you like agree, if you like don't.


So, in the NT wealth is not from God? James must have been drunk when he was writing... i Know the good life is a goood thing, God therefore gives good life...but anyways, i hope you don't plan on living a rich life...if you are, shame on your hypocrisy then

the NT teaches giving & that it is indeed a blessing to give but it is to meet a need be it ministry need or poor or the minister

BUT it doesn't teach giving to get, it doesn't emphasize on giving to get rich

I'm in no way saying I can't pray to God to bless the work of my hands or to prosper me, it is his sovereignty to answer me

see sense na... you dont believe He wants us rich in the NT, yet you want to pray so that His sovereignty would prevail? abeg, save your theory for the gods.

but to now teach that it is God will or design that ALL Christians MUST/SHOULD/OUGHT TO be rich is not consistent with the scriptures

Jesus died to raise poor folks then!

show me where the poor in the NT was admonish to give their way into prosperity

I gave you the book of Acts...yet, you wan show sense...oya na, languish in wants, my Jesus never lacked or was in want...i'm not about to be different.

Show me where the poor was told that poverty was a bad thing

Poverty is not of God o!...
if it is not a bad thing, i wish you the best forms of it. Amen

What you have is the Christian that has being taught to give to the one that doesn't have

It was said that St Francis of Asisi, paid a visit to Rome & the pope took him round & showed him the opulence of the Vatican City.

The pope was quoted to have said "we no longer say silver & gold have we none" to which St Francis replied "neither do you say rise up & walk"

we are back to those era again

i could not comprehend the above.

mbaemeka:
If the love of money is the root of all evil then the lack of it is even worse.

What seems to confuse God's children is the fact that they see "sinners" wealthy, while some of them wallow in poverty. So they wonder if God's promise of Material prosperity is not true or has ceased to exist.

The bible says there is profit in all labor. Which means that if an atheists works hard to get wealth (albeit away from God's provision) he/she will still find some success. The caveat there is that it will only be for a time. David said "I saw the wicked (the Ungodly) rise like a green bay tree but then after a while I looked and he was cut down".

The Christian is not the one trying to get rich for he has been reborn into riches. What we are told to do from scriptures is to discover our inheritance. That's why when people hear some christians say "I am rich" they want to check his bank account to see if he has more money than Bill Gates for him to aver such but that is not the law of faith. Faith speaks in agreement with God. If God says Abrahams blessings are yours (and we know the Abrahamic blessings included wealth) I can in the same token say I am wealthy. Regardless of if I am a taxi driver. In fact, being a taxi driver will only be for a while because as one walks in the law of faith, your life experiences begin to measure up with your confessions.

If Bill Gates has a foster child somewhere that we are oblivious of but this child grows up in penury does he stop being wealthy (if a tangible portion of Bills wealth is willed to him even without his knowledge?). That's the same way with all Christians. Many just don't know this truth and so they find themselves chasing after things that God already said would follow his kids- the same things that unbelievers chase after. And when they don't see the same 'instant' results they conclude that God's word didn't say so even in the face of barefaced scriptures.

meeeeehn!... Thanks for this! Remember we are not here to convince Nannymcphee, but lay facts side by side. How have you been na?

Gombs:


http://www.kcm.org/real-help/article/understanding-prosperity


work calls... i believe i've dealt with the problem 'Prosperity', if anyone has an objction, please post them here. I'd Be back. Again, nannymcphee, thanks or availing me the opportunity to teach others. God bless you.

An article copied from Kenneth Copeland. A twice divorced, WOF, prosperity preacher. It glaringly obvious where you got your knowledge about prosperity gospel from.

Did Jesus Christ in any of his sermon of the mount - Matthew chapters 5-7, taught about prosperity gospel?

Did any of the disciples and Paul taught about prosperity gospel?

Did any of the early christians Acts chapters 1-7, lived their lives according to any prosperity gospel they have heard?

Jesus Christ taught that serving God & money don't mix together.

Apostle Paul taught about contentment & godliness been a great gain.

Sir, there is no doubt that money is very essential to everyone. But the teaching, preaching & love of money is dangerous for our spiritual development.

This thinking is the ruse used to keep charlatans in business and givers perpetually waiting.

1. Broke Christians are those speaking 'in agreement' as they await manifestation of their speaking.
2. Rich Christians are those who have spoken 'in agreement' and are already manifesting their speak

So you can never be wrong with this nonsense whether you have or not. Of course you don't want to stop offering BEFORE you start manifesting,and after manifesting you don't want to stop lest you 'lose' your miracle not to mention to manifest even more

mbaemeka:

The Christian is not the one trying to get rich for he has been reborn into riches. What we are told to do from scriptures is to discover our inheritance. That's why when people hear some christians say "I am rich" they want to check his bank account to see if he has more money than Bill Gates for him to aver such but that is not the law of faith. Faith speaks in agreement with God. If God says Abrahams blessings are yours (and we know the Abrahamic blessings included wealth) I can in the same token say I am wealthy. Regardless of if I am a taxi driver. In fact, being a taxi driver will only be for a while because as one walks in the law of faith, your life experiences begin to measure up with your confessions.

And here lies the ruse effectively by charlatans to clean your pockets;
1.Both the haves and have-nots are 'rich'
2.The haves in the congregation are those who have spoken 'in agreement with God' and are manifesting whatever they spoke
3. The have-nots are those who should or are speaking and have yet to manifest whatever they are speaking

So you can never get it wrong with this doctrine regardless of your state.
The have-nots would be damned to stop giving to (man of) God BEFORE you manifest your speak
The haves would be damned to stop giving lest they 'lose' their miracle not to mention miss opportunity to have even more

mbaemeka:
If the love of money is the root of all evil then the lack of it is even worse.

The Christian is not the one trying to get rich for he has been reborn into riches. What we are told to do from scriptures is to discover our inheritance. That's why when people hear some christians say "I am rich" they want to check his bank account to see if he has more money than Bill Gates for him to aver such but that is not the law of faith. Faith speaks in agreement with God. If God says Abrahams blessings are yours (and we know the Abrahamic blessings included wealth) I can in the same token say I am wealthy. Regardless of if I am a taxi driver. In fact, being a taxi driver will only be for a while because as one walks in the law of faith, your life experiences begin to measure up with your confessions.

TheShopKeeper:

An article copied from Kenneth Copeland. A twice divorced, WOF, prosperity preacher. It glaringly obvious where you got your knowledge about prosperity gospel from.

don't attack the messenger...did you get the message? The pharisees attacked Jesus, they didn't get the message.

Did Jesus Christ in any of his sermon of the mount - Matthew chapters 5-7, taught about prosperity gospel?

no such thing as prosperity gospel.. the gospel is a complete package... Jesus said he was sent to give good news to the poor.. my friend what is good news to any poor person? ... you can't answer this one shey?

Did any of the disciples and Paul taught about prosperity gospel giving?

Yes they did

Did any of the early christians Acts chapters 1-7, lived their lives according to any prosperity gospel giving they have heard?

Beni sir

Jesus Christ taught that serving God & money don't mix together.

lies... can one preach the gospel without money? Those who brought us the gospel... google it, they spent a hell lotta cash.

Apostle Paul taught about contentment & godliness been a great gain.

Was he broke? Was any of the apostle a broke man? Scriptures please.

Sir, there is no doubt that money is very essential to everyone. But the teaching, preaching & love of money is dangerous for our spiritual development.

exactly...Love of money is dangerous, not money itself

For a study into the Prosperity Gospel, see trustman, DrummaBoy and BabaGnoni work here:

www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/2#24470530

Enjoy this nugget:

DrummaBoy:
[size=16pt]THE RISE AND FALL OF JIM BAKKER[/size]

Remember Jim Bakker? Countless people do. However, if you are too young to know about Bakker and the scandal that befell him (not so different from Tiger Woods), you really need to inform yourself. A good place to start is the Wikipedia article which can be found at this link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Bakker

As a teenager, I was an occasional viewer of the Praise the Lord broadcast during the 1970s and as a college student in early 1980s. Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker were the first televangelists I can really remember, although they did follow in the footsteps of Oral Roberts and others.

I grew up in a town just three hours from Heritage USA — the Bakker’s massive complex. Here’s an excerpt from the Wikipedia article that describes it:

By the early 1980s the Bakkers had built Heritage USA in Fort Mill, South Carolina (south of Charlotte), then the third most successful theme park in the U.S., and a satellite system to distribute their network 24 hours a day across the country. Contributions requested from viewers were estimated to exceed $1 million a week, with proceeds to go to expanding the theme park and mission of PTL.

I must admit that I was skeptical about the Bakkers at the time. It seemed to be only about MONEY, MONEY, MONEY!!! Interestingly, Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker were co-founders of the Trinity Broadcasting Network, (TBN), along with Paul and Jan Crouch. Who knew that TBN would team up with charismatic preachers to promote what would become known as “The Prosperity Gospel”…

Here’s what I consider to be the most important information in the Wiki article on Jim Bakker:

Bakker has renounced his past teachings on prosperity theology, they were wrong. In his 1996 book, I Was Wrong, he admitted that the first time he actually read the Bible all the way through was in prison, and that it made him realize he had taken certain passages out of context – passages which he had used as “proof texts” to back up his prosperity teachings. He wrote:

“The more I studied the Bible, however, I had to admit that the prosperity message did not line up with the tenor of Scripture. My heart was crushd to think that I led so many people astray. I was appalled that I could have been so wrong, and I was deeply grateful that God had not struck me dead as a false prophet.”

It’s fascinating to listen to today’s prosperity preachers and remember that Jim Bakker was probably more prominent and more respected than they. Oh, how the mighty can fall!!!

At the age of 49, Jim Bakker was sentenced to a 45 year prison term. He was truly a broken man. As the Wiki article explains, Bakker served a five year prison term and then was released. It seems God used those difficult years to teach Jim Bakker about “true Christianity”.

Jim Bakker Reveals the Truth About the Prosperity Gospel! Part 2:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYb6umBZxZA

http://thewartburgwatch.com/2010/01/14/jim-bakker-renounces-the-prosperity-gospel-as-a-lie/

Image123:

What is the point, you that has read carefully?

For starters:

Just over one hundred years ago, the renowned pastor and statesman Charles H. Spurgeon spoke these words to the then-largest congregation in all Christendom:

I believe that it is anti-Christian and unholy for any Christian to live with the object of accumulating wealth. You will say, “Are we not to strive all we can to get all the money we can?” You may do so. I cannot doubt but what, in so doing, you may do service to the cause of God. But what I said was that to live with the object of accumulating wealth is anti-Christian.1

Over the years, however, the message being preached in some of the largest churches in the world has changed. Due, in part, to the rise of several ungodly philosophies and movements,2 a new gospel is being taught today. This gospel has been ascribed many names, such as the “name it and claim it” gospel, the “blab it and grab it” gospel, the “health and wealth” gospel, the “word of faith” movement, the “gospel of success,” the “prosperity gospel,” and “positive confession theology.”3

No matter what name is used, though, the teaching is the same. Simply put, this egocentric gospel teaches that God wants believers to be materially wealthy. Listen to the words of Robert Tilton, one of the prosperity gospel’s most well-known spokesmen: “I believe that it is the will of God for all to prosper because I see it in the Word [of God], not because it has worked mightily for someone else. I do not put my eyes on men, but on God who gives me the power to get wealth.”4

Teachers of the prosperity gospel encourage their followers to pray, and even demand, of God “everything from modes of transportation (cars, vans, trucks, even two-seat planes), [to] homes, furniture, and large bank accounts.”5 By closely examining the faulty theology and errant biblical interpretation of the teachers of this movement, this study will prove that the prosperity gospel teachings regarding the acquisition and accumulation of wealth are ethically incorrect.

Then this:

nora544:
Conclusion

Through this study of the theology and the biblical interpretation of the prosperity gospel, one may discern five clear reasons why this movement’s teachings concerning wealth are incorrect:

1. The prosperity gospel is built upon a faulty understanding of the Abrahamic covenant.

2. The prosperity gospel is built upon a faulty understanding of the Atonement.

3. The prosperity gospel is based upon a faulty understanding of the biblical tachings on giving.

4. The prosperity gospel is based upon a faulty understanding of the biblical teachings on faith.

5. The prosperity gospel, in general, has been constructed upon faulty biblical interpretation.

Aside from these five specific theological and biblical arguments against the prosperity gospel, and without even considering the practical implications of this movement,41 there is perhaps one general, summary reason why the prosperity gospel is a wayward gospel: its faulty view of the relationship between God and man. Simply put, if the prosperity gospel is correct, grace becomes obsolete, God becomes irrelevant, and man is the measure of all things. Whether it is the Abrahamic covenant, the Atonement, giving, faith, or the biblical interpretation of any given verse, the prosperity teacher seeks to turn the relationship between God and man into a financial quid pro quo transaction. As scholar James R. Goff noted, God is “reduced to a kind of ‘cosmic bellhop’ attending to the needs and desires of his creation.”42 This is a wholly inadequate and unbiblical view of the relationship between God and man and the stewardship of wealth.

https://bible.org/article/bankruptcy-prosperity-gospel-exercise-biblical-and-theological-ethics

Matthew 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

I keep wondering why it was the matter of DECEIT Jesus was concerned with when his apostles asked him about signs of the end. They didn't say: Master how do we avoid deceit? They asked about the end and Jesus is here speaking of deceit. He will go on to talk of false prophets later in the chapter.

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; ... 4:6 If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained... 4:11 These things command and teach... 4:15 Meditate upon these things; give thyself wholly to them; that thy profiting may appear to all. 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

Forgive my next statement but it is necessary:

The ministry of the following men in Nigeria: David Oyedepo, Chris Oyakhilome, Enoch Adeboye, and others like them have come to be known as Prosperity Teaching ministries. Among Pentecostals in this country, these men command more than half the following. If, and I am using these word very circumspectly, if the prosperity gospel is a false gospel as many allege, I want readers to know that a great number of so called Christians are heading to hell, along with the Pastors aforementioned.

It will be good for all of us, in the light of Jesus and Paul's words, to know what we believe. What a man preaches is able to save or damn him and his hearers.

vooks:
And here lies the ruse effectively by charlatans to clean your pockets;
1.Both the haves and have-nots are 'rich'
2.The haves in the congregation are those who have spoken 'in agreement with God' and are manifesting whatever they spoke
3. The have-nots are those who should or are speaking and have yet to manifest whatever they are speaking

So you can never get it wrong with this doctrine regardless of your state.
The have-nots would be damned to stop giving to (man of) God BEFORE you manifest your speak
The haves would be damned to stop giving lest they 'lose' their miracle not to mention miss opportunity to have even more

When Paul made his statement to the Corinthians about Christ being poor for their sakes so that they would be made rich, did he not know about the Macedonians and how "deeply" poor they were?

Notice: I ignored the nit-wittedness you tried to introduce by injecting 'giving' into my post. If you are looking for verses concerning Homologia in the NT you may ask politely and I would oblige you.