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| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by CANTICLES: 11:03am On Jan 10, 2015 |
NEWBIN: Interestingly, Verse 7 shows that THE ALMIGHTY ,Most High GOD is speaking , while in vrs 8 which you quoted, d person been adressed is a worshipper of that God ! That clearly illustrate that Jesus is not the Almighty God , Infact , JESUS was annointed by the Almighty God . until u read for urselve and confirm the proper construction of the sentence from psalm 45:6 which was originally addressed to a human king in isreal that is gettin married to the princess of tyre . Am sure the psalmist is not callin that human king gettin married, a God ? RS: " your divine throne" !Ps 45:6. Luk 1:32 " and Jehovah God WILL GIVE HIM ( Jesus) the throne of David his father"..Shows that Jehovah God is d person who confers the authority of kingship to Christ |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by NEWBIN: 11:17am On Jan 10, 2015 |
CANTICLES: Now, Father, bring me into the glory we shared before the world began. John 17:5 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by Nobody: 11:41am On Jan 10, 2015 |
CANTICLES: plz, who is d word that became flesh dat dweleth amongst us in Genesis. In d beginning was d word, and d word was with God and d word was God dat became flesh to dwell among us. plz, try and stick to d above point when explaining. thanks 1 Like |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by Nobody: 11:48am On Jan 10, 2015 |
NEWBIN: I just pity them. dey just refer to Jesus as if he came as a God. forgetting dat he came wholly as a man like everyone else, and serve God as such. he didn't come to earth with his heavenly thrown. therefore, if we must understand d true nature of Jesus, we must study his pre coming and not wen he became flesh. |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by Nobody: 11:55am On Jan 10, 2015 |
Pr0ton: Jesus was tempted as a flesh, remember dat Jesus did not come as a spirit but as a mere man like u, so he couldn't be above temptation |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by theorbiters: 12:26pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
From what I have been reading, I think we are all going about it the wrong way, that is why there seem to be so much disputes. Now, wen Jesus says He is God, and then goes again to say, I and my Father are one and then goes again to say, 'I can of my own do nothing', he means the same thing, it is we who are thinking from a complete different angle, remember he says, 'My ways are different from yours and my thoughts are far higher than yours', hence, we mortal beings can't be perfect in our thoughts concerning him. Now, He says, 'I and my Father are one.' Look at it like this, if u have a son, and I meet him on the road one day, just from his character, I should be able to tell a bit if not all about the way the father behaves. Now ur son's character (mature son) would mirror the character of the father, telling me how his father would act, speak and react to certain things. That was why Jesus says 'He who has seen me, has seen the father' and another scripture says, 'Jesus is the express image of the father.' This talks about the same personalities He and His Father shares. Now you Jesus is not the Almighty God, because He refers to another as Father and Himself as the Son. Now, the scriptures says, 'Father, glorify me, with the glory we once SHARED at the beginning.' This clearly states that He and God were equal and they both were of the same class. But u ask, why did He refer himself as the Son? Remember, the scriptures also says that 'Who, being in the form of God, He thought it not robbery to be equal with God, but made himself of no reputation and took upon himself the form of a servant and was made in the likeness of men. And being found in the fashion as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient umto death, even the death of the cross.'. You can see that it is clearly stated that He is God, but because he wanted to teach principality and powers what it means to be obedient and for the redemption of man, he became humble and became even lower than the angles, Ps 8 tells us that. So, Yes, Jesus is the almighty God and the Father is also the almighty God, and the Holy spirit is also God. The 3 three that bare record. The mystery of the TRINITY. Now if Jesus says, 'No man has seen the Father, nor hear His voice at anytime.', you may wonder, who then appeared on mount Sinai, or who did Moses talk with or see the backside? Or who created everything? Now, if the scriptures refers Jesus Christ as the Lord of lords, then we can say that Rev. 4:11 was referring to the Lord Jesus Christ, 'Thou art worthy O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for THOU HAST CREATED ALL THINGS, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.' Okay, I have so many to say, but suffice this to be so for now. God Bless. |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by An2elect2(f): 12:41pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
Yes i believe and know that Jesus is God. You have to be completely blind to not believe Jesus is the Almighty God. Some people doubt this because what the only see is the humanity of Christ and if there is any work of Deity attached to His ministry it is ascribed to someone who is God. Do they know that they are denying God. What were the expecting God to look like when He willed to come to this fallen world to save mankind. To save the man, you come like the man. Men were made with blood in them and blood was required for the remission of our sins. Do you expect God to come as the Spirit He is? How will His work on earth be feasible? Before Abraham, before David there was Christ. If this was an ordinary man there was no way he would have preexisted. Only God can claim that. If you fail to see that Jesus' deity was clouded by the flesh He had on Him, then you are without knowledge of the true God. When it comes to debating Jesus deity i will readily stand with the trinitarians though am not one than stand with bold-faced liars who deny explicit scripture. Damn! this is so clear but this people rather turn a blind eye and hold on to scriptures that "seem to say" what they want to believe. 1 Like |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 2:43pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
And the dam just got busted , but I believe the scriptures will help close it up. 1)First , is jesus the father? 2)Who is the father ? 3)What is the relationship between jesus and the father? If you want to quote My posts , pls make sure u explain the bible verse I quoted o. As I will endeavor to explain urs if you quote any. |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 3:39pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
An2elect2: 1)what/who is a God.? 2)who is God almighty? 3)who sent jesus and anointed him ? 4)does jesus not have a God? 5)who is jehovah? |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by CANTICLES: 7:15pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
NEWBIN: U got me laughing , wait ... Dont u see that Jesus was praying to someone higher than him , He was praying to the FATHER ! He request to the Father, whom he also called " The ONLY TRUE GOD" in verse 3 ! Once again ... He reffered to the father as " THE, ONLY, TRUE , GOD !!! JOH 17:3 ! ONLY, ONLY, ONLY ... Uhm . According to his request in John 17:5 , God exalt Jesus to a higher position , and at dis moment " Christ seat " NOT ON THE THRONE OF GOD, BUT "at the right hand of God" Colosian 3:1 |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by CANTICLES: 7:23pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
An2elect2: DO YOU AGREE THAT JESUS HAVE " A GOD AND FATHER" ?? |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by johnw74: 12:38am On Jan 11, 2015 |
CANTICLES: The Greek word written for God in that verse is: "theos", it means "a diety, especially the supreme Divinity". KJV 1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. Many modern translations say "God". 1 Like |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by bingbagbo(m): 8:46am On Jan 11, 2015 |
CANTICLES: YES, AND DO YOU AGREE HIM AND THE FATHER ARE ONE? |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by bingbagbo(m): 8:47am On Jan 11, 2015 |
CANTICLES: GOD DOES NOT SHARE HIS GLORY WITH NO ONE |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 12:32pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
Can someone answer my questions pls |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by An2elect2(f): 12:44pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
CANTICLES: Hello, God called the Son God, does He have a God  |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by Pr0ton: 1:31pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
correctguy0900: Then lets say the real Jesus wasn't tempted. It was His flesh. Therefore the real Jesus never suffered for our sins. It was just His flesh, as a man. And if He never suffered for sins... guess your going to hell  3 Likes |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 1:59pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
johnw74: An explanation on 1ti 3:16 The Trinitarian Claim Trinitarians claim this verse identifies Jesus as "God" because it says "God was manifested in the flesh." Examination of the Evidence Modern translations do not read, "God" at 1 Timothy 3:16. Trinitarians make this particular claim by quoting mostly or only from the King James Version reading of this verse. Despite the fact that scholars agree that the KJV reading is a certain corruption, Trinitarians, even those who normally do not read the KJV, continue to cherry-pick this verse from the KJV. When the Christological controversies were occurring in the fourth century, we do not see even one solitary person making a reference to the "God was manifested in the flesh" version of this verse as evidence for identifying Jesus as "God." This fact does itself undeniably demonstrate it was unknown to them. If indeed 1 Timothy 3:16 really said "God was manifest in the flesh," we can most definitely be sure this passage would have most been brought forward as "Exhibit A." Yet, not one soul mentions it even though this passage more than any other would have supported the teaching that the incarnate Christ was "God." But the facts remain as they are and it was never mentioned once in the myriads of documentation that exist illustrating what was argued in these debates. There is a good reason that no one in the fourth century church ever mentioned the passage. The word "God" did not appear in 1 Timothy 3:16 until much later. It first appeared in manuscripts after Trinitarian dogma was developed and canonized and is an obvious later alteration. The oldest and best manuscripts do not have the word "God" (theos) in 1 Timothy 3:16 which is why modern Bible translations do not have the word "God" at 1 Timothy 3:16 either. 1. Contemporary Trinitarian Translation Scholars. Now because this verse is known to be a scribal error, contemporary Trinitarian Greek scholars, who have access to numerous manuscripts, have not been able to perpetuate this error any longer into English translations, despite the passions of some who desire the word "God" to appear in this verse at the expense of truth. Let us look at some of the major translations of this passage and note how Trinitarian Greek scholars themselves acknowledged the scribal error: "He appeared in a body" (NIV) "He who was manifested in the flesh" (ASV) "He who was revealed in the flesh" (NASB) "He was manifested in the flesh" (RSV) "Which was manifested in the flesh" (Douey- Rheims) "Who was manifested in the flesh" (NAB)" Quite plainly, Trinitarian translation scholars are admitting this version of the verse is not authentic. One then wonders why Trinitarians so often continue to appeal to it. 2. Ho, Hos & Theos If we entertain all possibilities, the remote and the more certain, there are actually three possibilities in this text: ho ("which"  , hos ("who", and "theos ("God/deity". The first two are attested in early manuscripts. Thus one must look elsewhere to find which one is the one Paul originally wrote.3. One Small Pen Stroke We actually have a pretty likely idea how this corruption happened. Scribal copyists routinely used a contracted form of the Greek word for "God" called a "nomina sacra" that was used at a very early date in Christian history for sacred names(a wrong move by those who wanted to hide the Name of jehovah). The Greek word for "God" is theos written in the Greek alphabet as qeoV, or QEOS(the Greek signs cannot be pasted hereto fully explain what this section is trying to tell us) . The copyist abbreviations correspondingly took the form qV, or QS, with an faint overscore line stroke over the abbreviation. These strokes would often become quite faint in the copies. Now the Greek word for "who" is the word hos which is written in Greek as oV, or OS. Now notice the similarity between these two words QS, and OS, and also remember they were written by hand and would not be written so perfectly and distinctly as the typed letters on this page. With the exception of one penstroke, the Omicron (O) and Theta (Q) are nearly identical. It would be very easy to make a mistake here when copying from one manuscript to another and if that is what happened then it would be excusable. But it would also be very easy for an overzealous scribe to suppose he was doing God a favor and execute a forgery here by changing the manuscript and the handwritten O (Omicron) into a Q (Theta) with a stroke of his pen and thereby completely change the meaning of the verse. It would be also easy to change the word ho to theos by adding a stroke and an "s." And it would be far more difficult to do it the other way around without getting caught (removing the stroke). There is also evidence that ink may have bled through the other side of the media and made it appear to a copyist to read QS because the bleeding ink added what appeared to be a line where OS had been written. Whether or not it was an honest copying mistake or a forgery, it is very likely that the error was produced in this manner. (to be continued.....) |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 2:24pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
An explananation on 1ti 3:16 continued..... 6. The Internal Evidence a. The Greek Grammar The internal evidence also reveals the truth of the matter. First, the passage does not say "in the flesh" with a definite article but simply "in flesh." The word eusebias translated as "godliness" is difficult to translate into English with a word that exacts the Greek intention. The word "godliness" is a justified translation of the word and it is about as good as we can do with the selection of English words we have available. However, it does tend to over translate the Greek scope of the word. This is a common problem when translating from one language to another. The Greek word does not precisely mean what the English word "godly" tends to convey but it means something like reverent piety in a worshipful sense. The Greek words for "God" and "godliness" which are theos and eusebias are not related word cognates as they are in English. This can also tend to be misleading to English readers who might errantly conclude the word "godliness" in this passage is intended to correlate with the word "God". However, in Greek the word eusebias and theos do not bear that correlation. Also, there were also no sentence ending periods in the Greek text. If the word "which" is the proper rendering, the passage actually says in the Greek, "great is the mystery of godliness which was manifested in flesh, justified in spirit..." However, if the word "God" is used we have an abrubt break in the flow of the sentence, "great is the mystery of godliness. God was manifest in flesh, justified in spirit..." The rendering which uses the word "who" or "which" is much smoother and natural. Not only so, it is typical Pauline style to compose run-on sentences. b. The Immediate Context and Pauline Thought And there is yet more. Paul here is talking about the mystery. In 2 Timothy he says, "God who saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works but according to his own purpose and the grace which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages of time (2 Tim 1:8-9). This is nearly identical to what he says in Romans, "Now to him who is able to strengthen you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery of the times of the ages which was kept hidden" (Rom 16:25). And in Ephesians he says, "having made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure which he purposed in himself for the economy of the fullness of the times to head up all things in Christ, the things in the heavens and the things on the earth" (Eph 1:9-10) and "to enlighten all as to the communion of the mystery which has been hidden from the ages who created all things in Christ Jesus" (3:9) and "this is a great mystery but I speak of Christ and the church" (5:32). Paul desires "to make known the mystery of the gospel" (6:19) which is he also calls "the mystery of Christ" (Colossians 4:3). The mystery of the ages is Christ himself revealed to us by God. He tells us in Colossians, "the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory" (Col 1:27; see 1 Cor 1:30; 2:7). God's mystery appeared in flesh and Christ is that fleshly manifestation of His mystery. To be continued...... |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 2:32pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
Continued.... God was Justified in the Spirit? Another problem associated with the "God" rendering is that if we just keep reading it would then say that God was justified in the Spirit. It makes no sense to say God was justified in the spirit, God was seen by angels, God was preached among the Gentiles, God was believed on in the world, and God was received into glory." One would have to create quite a theological spin to have this make any good sense. c. Paul's Vocabulary Elsewhere At Colossians 1:27 we read, "the glory of the mystery among the nations which is Christ in you, the hope of glory." The relative pronoun used here is the masculine relative pronoun hos which refers back to the neuter noun "mystery." This is nearly identical to 1 Timothy 3:16 which ends with the phrase "taken up in glory." Hence we can see that hos is the likely relative pronoun to be used at 1 Timothy 3:16. d. Constructio Ad Sensum Trinitarians have sometimes insisted the gender of the pronoun in question necessitates in Greek grammar the "God" rendering. This is highly misleading. Pronouns do not always refer to the immediate antecedent but sometimes to the contextual antecedent. Determining Factors Trinitarians are appealing to a version of a text which is known to be a scribal error. Modern Trinitarian translation reflect that Trinitarian translation scholars admit this is a scribal error. Therefore, they do not translate this passage in a way that supports Trinitarian doctrine We have a pretty good idea that this error was accomplished by either (1) one additional stroke of a pen changing the Greek word from "who" to "God" or (2) by two additional strokes of a pen changing the Greek word from "which" to God, or (3) by ink bleeding through the media. This version of the verse cannot be found absolutely anywhere in early Christian writings before the Trinity was developed. Considering the fourth and fifth century men were having a crisis in the church concerning the nature of Christ and his relationship to God, it is preposterous to claim this version of the verse is valid and they overlooked this passage. No early manuscripts contain this version of the verse. The corrupted version of this text appears only after the doctrine of the Trinity was developed in the fourth/fifth century. The Greek grammar also indicates this rendering is wrong. Conclusion So when we review all the evidence the solution is plain to see. The historical evidence indicates the word "God" was not there before the fifthe century. The manuscript evidence indicates the word "God" was not in the original text. All objections based on grammatical and theological grounds are nothing but vain babblings. Christ is the mystery in question which is why the passage should read, "great is the mystery of godliness who/which was manifested in flesh, justified in spirit..." Very obviously then the passage reads smoothly and makes total sense with the rest of Scripture by using either the word "who" or "which" or "that" instead of the word "God" which is an obvious error or forgery no matter how badly Trinitarian apologists want it to be there and who seem to somehow think they do God a favor by promoting something he never inspired in the first place |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 2:45pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
bingbagbo: |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by bingbagbo(m): 3:03pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
dolphinheart: Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one. HOW MANY GODS DO YOU WORSHIP THEN? |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 3:10pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
bingbagbo: It is good that you agree that jesus has a God. Anything that is worshiped can be termed a god, inasmuch as the worshiper attributes to it might greater than his own and venerates it. So there are many Gods or gods depending on who is worshiped and who is worshiping. Therefore anything can be a God to Mr b , but not a God to Mr a. Mr A can make reference to Mr b's God as "a God " or God " but it does not mean that that God is Mr A's God. In the scriptures jesus said that the father(also our father) is "my God"(his God). No where in the bible did the father ever use the word "my God" for jesus. The scriptures helps us to know that jesus always does the willof his God , even to the point of death. The scriptures helps us to know that jesus and the father are two different persons . Jesus said we should follow him and worship him who he(jesus) worships . Jesus said we should worship the only true God . Jesus said the only true God is the father,our father , the one he worships |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 4:20pm On Jan 11, 2015 |
correctguy0900: The bible made reference to jesus being a god, the bible made reference to Satan as a god. The scriptures let us know that there are many Gods The scriptures let us know that out of all those Gods , there is one true God . Jesus let's us know that that true God is the rather who we must worship , who he worships ,who sent him to do all he has done on earth. Jesus came wholly as a man, but not like anyone else, he was born perfect , through the process of his birth , he did not inherit the sin of his fathers. Jesus as a man did not perform any miraculous works until after he was anointed by a superior being with the holy spirit which enabled him to perform all the works. Just like moses , the prophets and the disciples did. After jesus resurrection by his God, he was giving the glory he requested for , now what glorywas he giving. The scriptures does not mention jesus having a throne before coming to earth . Proverbs 8: 20 -32 helps us to know that he was always beside his God , ready to do his Gods will. After his ressurection ,while he was still on earth, he told his disciples that that all authority has been giving to him. Apostle paul helps us to understand that despite All authority giving to him by his God , he is still subjected to the one who gave him that power. Thereby making that person who gave him such power the almighty of all the Gods. Even after resurrection, and being giving authority, jesus was not giving a throne imediately because upon ascension to heaven, his God , the father , told him to sit at his right hand until............ Unless u want to argue that jesus throne was or is at the right hand of Gods throne . Or that jesus is the same as the father or part of the father? The ransom that jesus payed must be in the form if the one that was lost by adam . If jesus had Any godship in him while paying the ransom means that God is surporting satans course when he said that man cannot serve God without divine influence . Jesus death shows that if perfect man can have the needed , full acurate knowledge of the father, the he can serve the father even till death |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by johnw74: 12:49am On Jan 12, 2015 |
dolphinheart: Untrue and plagiarism. http://www.angelfire.com/space/thegospeltruth/trinity/verses/1Tim3_16.html . |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by johnw74: 1:16am On Jan 12, 2015 |
dolphinheart: That is not true, here are just some I found in a quick search. 1 Timothy 3:16 HNV Hebrew Names Version Without controversy, the mystery of godliness is great: God was revealed in the flesh, Justified in the spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the nations, Believed on in the world, And received up in glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 KJV King James Version And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 NKJV New King James Version And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 DBY The Darby Translation And confessedly the mystery of piety is great. God has been manifested in flesh, has been justified in [the] Spirit, has appeared to angels, has been preached among [the] nations, has been believed on in [the] world, has been received up in glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 WBT The Webster Bible And without controversy, great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached to the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 TMB Third Millennium Bible And beyond controversy, great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 TYN Tyndale And with out naye great is that mistery of godlines: God was shewed in the flesshe was iustified in the sprete was sene of angels was preached vnto the gentyls was beleved on in erth and receaved vp in glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 WEB World English Bible Without controversy, the mystery of godliness is great: God was revealed in the flesh, Justified in the spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the nations, Believed on in the world, And received up in glory. 1 Timothy 3:16 YLT Young's Literal Translation and, confessedly, great is the secret of piety -- God was manifested in flesh, declared righteous in spirit, seen by messengers, preached among nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory! . 1 Like 1 Share |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by bingbagbo(m): 10:01am On Jan 12, 2015 |
johnw74: WHERE IS HE?  |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 7:46pm On Jan 12, 2015 |
johnw74: I do admit that some of the words I posted are taking from a website or . I do this because those words best explain what I'm trying to explain to you concerning 1 ti 3:16 . It will be stupid of me to see an already typed words that best explains my understanding, and now go on typing in my own words when the words and explanations are already there on the internet. You use the words plagiarism. Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work. Plagiarism is considered academic dishonesty and a breach of journalistic ethics. Plagiarism is not a crime per se but in academia and industry, it is a serious ethical offense. Now if you accuse me of plagiarism, this is what ill tell you : 1. I have not ascribed the words I posted to myself or my name as the author. 2. I'm not a journalist as I have not produced any journal or book ,talk less of stealing someones work. 3.posting on nairaland is not publishing. If you have an issue with my post , it should be on if what I posted is true or not. You stayed that what I posted (no modern translation use God in 1 ti 3:16) is not true and defended ur statement by quoting bible translations that used the word God in 1ti 3:16. Now let's look at the bible translations you qouted and come to a better understanding. Hebrew Names Version The Hebrew Names Version of the World English Bible is an update of the American Standard Version of 1901. The Revised Version, Standard American Edition of the Bible, more commonly known as the American Standard Version (ASV), is a version of the Bible that was first released in 1900. It was originally best known by its full name, but soon came to have other names, such as the American Revised Version, the American Standard Revision, the American Standard Revised Bible, and the American Standard Edition. By the time its copyright was renewed in 1929, it had come to be known by its present name, the American Standard Version. Because of its prominence in seminaries, it was in America sometimes simply called the "Standard Bible". History The American Standard Version (ASV) is rooted in the work that was done with the Revised Version (RV) (a late 19th-century British revision of the King James Version of 1611). In 1870, an invitation was extended to American religious leaders for scholars to work on the RV project. A year later, Protestant theologian Philip Schaff chose 30 scholars representing the denominations of Baptist, Congregationalist, Dutch Reformed, Friends, Methodist, Episcopal, Presbyterian, Protestant Episcopal, and Unitarian. These scholars began work in 1872. The RV New Testament was released In 1881; the Old Testament was published in 1885. The ASV was published in 1901 by Thomas Nelson & Sons. In 1928, the International Council of Religious Education (the body that later merged with the Federal Council of Churches to form the National Council of Churches) acquired the copyright from Nelson and renewed it the following year. Conclusion 1. The HNV is an update of ASV therefore it is not a mordern translation of the original manuscripts . 2. The ASV is linked to the KJV. And published in 1900. I leave you to decide if this is modern . The Darby Translation The Darby Bible (DBY, formal title The Holy Scriptures: A New Translation from the Original Languages by J. N. Darby) refers to the Bible as translated from Hebrew and Greek by John Nelson Darby. Darby published a translation of the New Testament in 1867, with revised editions in 1872 and 1884. After his death, some of his students produced an Old Testament translation based on Darby's French and German translations. The complete Darby Bible, including Darby's 3rd edition New Testament and his students' Old Testament, was first published in 1890. If this is modern , let us know WBT: The Webster Bible Noah Webster's 1833 limited revision of the King James Bible focused mainly on replacing archaic words and making simple grammatical changes. Overall, very few changes were made, and the result is a book which is almost indistinguishable from the King James Bible. It has sometimes been called the "Common Version" (which is not to be confused with the Common Bible of 1973, an ecumencial edition of the Revised Standard Version). It is linked to the KJV and not directly a translation of the manuscripts. I leave you to decide if it is modern. TMB: Third Millennium Bible The Third Millennium Bible (TMB), also known as the New Authorized Version, is a 1998 minor update of the King James Version of the Bible. Unlike the New King James Version, it does not alter the language significantly from the 1611 version, retaining Jacobean grammar (including "thees" and "thous" , but it doesattempt to replace some of the vocabulary which no longer would make sense to a modern reader. The TMB also, like the original KJV in 1611, contains the Apocryphal/Deuterocanonical books of the Old Testament in between the Old and New Testaments. This has helped win it some support among traditionalist Anglicans and Eastern Orthodox Christians. A version without the Apocrypha (and with formatting changes) is known as the 21st Century King James Version. It is linked to the king James version and not a direct modern translation of the Greek manuscripts of the scriptures . TYN: Tyndal The Tyndale Bible generally refers to the body of biblical translations by William Tyndale. Tyndale’s Bible is credited with being the first English translation to work directly from Hebrew and Greek texts. Furthermore it was the first English biblical translation that was mass-produced as a result of new advances in the art of printing. The term Tyndale's Bible is not strictly correct, because Tyndale never published a complete Bible. Prior to his execution, Tyndale had only finished translating the entire New Testament and roughly half of the Old Testament.[1] Of the latter, the Pentateuch, Jonah and a revised version of the book of Genesis were published during his lifetime. His other Old Testament works were first used in the creation of the Matthew Bible and also heavily influenced every major English translation of the Bible that followed. History The chain of events that led to the creation of Tyndale’s New Testament possibly began in 1522, the year Tyndale acquired a copy of Martin Luther’s German New Testament. Inspired by Luther’s work, Tyndale began a translation into English using a Greek text "compiled by Erasmus from several manuscripts older and more authoritative than the Latin Vulgate" of St. Jerome (A.D. c.340-420), the only translation authorized by the Roman Catholic Church. the first complete edition of his New Testament was published in 1526.[7] Two revised versions were later published in 1534 and 1536, both personally revised by Tyndale himself. After his death in 1536 Tyndale’s works were revised and reprinted numerous times [8] and are reflected in more modern versions of the Bible, including, perhaps most famously, the King James Bible. Tyndale's Pentateuch was published at Antwerp by Merten de Keyser in 1530.[9] His English version of the book of Jonah was published the following year. This was followed by his revised version of the book of Genesis in 1534. Tyndale translated additional Old Testament books including Joshua, Judges, first and second Samuel, first and second Kings and first and second Chronicles, but they were not published and have not survived in their original forms. [10] When Tyndale was martyred these works came to be in the possession of one his associates John Rogers. These translations would be influential in the creation of the Matthew Bible which was published in 1537.[11] Tyndale used a number of sources when carrying out his translations of both the New and Old Testaments. When translating the New Testament, he referred to the third edition (1522) of Erasmus’s Greek New Testament, often referred to as the Received Text. Tyndale also used Erasmus' Latin New Testament, as well as Luther’s German version and the Vulgate. YLT: Young's Literal Translation Young's Literal Translation is a translation of the Bible into English, published in 1862. The translation was made by Robert Young, compiler of Young's Analytical Concordance to the Bible and Concise Critical Comments on the New Testament. Young produced a “Revised Version” of his translation in 1887, which he based on the 1881 Westcott–Hort text. After Robert Young died on October 14, 1888, the publisher[who?] released a new Revised Edition in 1898. With all the above, will you state that the verses u quoted on 1 ti 3:16 are from modern translations ? So up till now I'm correct to state that no modern translation of the manuscripts use the word "God" |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by dolphinheart(m): 9:12pm On Jan 12, 2015 |
bingbagbo: "He appeared in a body" (NIV) "He who was manifested in the flesh" (ASV) "He who was revealed in the flesh" (NASB) "He was manifested in the flesh" (RSV) "Which was manifested in the flesh" (Douey- Rheims) "Who was manifested in the flesh" (NAB)" New Living Translation Without question, this is the great mystery of our faith: Christ was revealed in a human body and vindicated by the Spirit. He was seen by angels and announced to the nations. He was believed in throughout the world and taken to heaven in glory. English Standard Version Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. New American Standard Bible By common confession, great is the mystery of godliness: He who was revealed in the flesh, Was vindicated in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Proclaimed among the nations, Believed on in the world, Taken up in glory. Holman Christian Standard Bible And most certainly, the mystery of godliness is great: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. International Standard Version By common confession, the secret of our godly worship is great: In flesh was he revealed to sight, kept righteous by the Spirit's might, adored by angels singing. To nations was he manifest, believing souls found peace and rest, our Lord in heaven reigning! NET Bible And we all agree, our religion contains amazing revelation: He was revealed in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among Gentiles, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. Aramaic Bible in Plain English And this Mystery of Righteousness is truly great, which was revealed in the flesh and was justified in The Spirit; He appeared to Angels and was preached among the Gentiles; He was trusted in the world and he ascended into glory. You have not responded to the other posts that are a continuation of the first post on 1ti 3:16 You have also not answered the question I and others posted on the trinity issue . I hope this put an end to the use of the verse in propagating the false doctrin of trinity. |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by johnw74: 12:59am On Jan 13, 2015 |
dolphinheart: By not ascribing the works to the owners of the works you allow people to think the works are yours, no matter how many excuses you may give. Most of all of this post of yours again is copied from the internet also, you should give credit or links to the owners of the works.
Of course, I have already said that. If you think those translations I posted are not modern translations, then what do you think they are? do you think they are the ancient texts? do you think modern translations have to be written in the 20th or 21st century?
You must be blinded and confused by using other peoples works. . |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by TheIkoro(m): 1:10am On Jan 13, 2015 |
It is written, and by me: GOD is no longer with Christianity. I will not bother repeating myself here: not only because I see that there apparently remain a few who - though yet supposedly in the camp of Christianity - do seem to have a longing for the knowledge of The Truth; but also because, as it is written, Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself. That which, however, I will state here, I will state with words which will not leave me bereft of the good of GOD (as is Christianity) because, as it is also written, Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own eyes. And thus, I will answer the greatest folly that has ever risen out of any faith in GOD - that would any other being be worshipped as the one true good God; despite that which is written, that which was said: "WHY DO YOU CALL ME GOOD? No one is good but God alone." - I will answer that folly with these words (from the book, Ten Biblical Truths That Christians Always Strive To Deny; yet to be published, soon to be published): "As it is written, and of Jesus, " ''who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God.' "As it is written, and of Lucifer, " 'For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: " 'I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I WILL BE LIKE THE MOST HIGH.' "Therefore who then can Lucifer be, if not he 'who, being in the image of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God?' "HE THOUGHT IT NOT ROBBERY TO BE LIKE THE MOST HIGH." And finally, having answered the folly that is of Christianity according to its folly, I will leave Christian apologists that have absolutely no semblance of common sense between their ears to continue to insist that all it takes to be equal with GOD is to be (as was not only Jesus; but as was, even, Adam - AND, all that is Man) made in the image of GOD. - Ikoro Iyineleda. |
| Re: Jesus Is God Almighty......question Me by johnw74: 1:31am On Jan 13, 2015 |
dolphinheart: You are talking about the corrupted manuscripts of about the last fifty years, give or take. Why would you put your faith in those translations that detour from the original inspired Hebrew and Greek manuscripts. Because the Gnostics did not accept the divinity of Jesus Christ, we can see evidences of this doctrine in their corrupted New Testament manuscripts. Let us examine just one. One of the great affirmations of the divinity of Jesus Christ was stated in Paul’s first epistle to Timothy: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh. 1 Timothy 3:16 Virtually every modern translation, following the Western manuscripts corrupted by the Gnostics, delete the word God and substitute the word He in its place, thus concealing this powerful witness to Christ’s divinity. Let us examine three modern translations of this text as evidence. Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of our religion: He was manifested in the flesh. 1 Timothy 3:16, RSV And great beyond all question is the mystery of our religion: He who was manifested in the body. 1 Timothy 3:16, NEB Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great: He appeared in a body. 1 Timothy 3:16, NIV That the English translators of the King James Version were not alone in adhering to the legitimate Eastern manuscripts may be seen from an examination of the translation of this text in a number of European languages: Dieu a été manifeste en chair (1 Timothy 3:16, Osterwald’s French Version) Gott ist offenbaret im fleisch (1 Timothy 3:16, Luther’s German translation) Iddio e stato-manifestato in carne (1 Timothy 3:16, Diodati’s Italian translation). Deus se manifestou em carne (1 Timothy 3:16, Almeide’s Portuguese translation). Dios ha sido manifestado en carne (1 Timothy 3:16, Valera’s Spanish translation). William Tyndale had translated this passage in 1534 as God was shewed in the fleisch (1 Timothy 3:16, Tyndale translation). Clearly, the decision as to the stream of Greek manuscript in which to place one’s faith is a vital one. http://www.sundaylaw.net/books/other/standish/bibletrans/mbtu04.htm . |
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