I don't know who thought that a doctor is supposed to be the NAFDAC DG. According to the constitution for Nafdac, ONLY a pharmacist and not a doctor with hundreds of post graduate degree in pharmacology is supposed to head Nafdac.

I need all the pharmacists in the house to please join me in protesting this ripoff. Afterall they took us to court for trying to upgrade to Pharm D and they booted us out of being the Minister of Health.

Pharm Bimbo (http://Acnespotfree..com)

eh ya, sorry about your loss.
you sound really sad, never mind, lets just see what the guy can do, if he matches dora then its ok,if not , lets toss him out the window.
meanwhile, it would be nice if you can post that part of the constitution for our education.

This culture of mediocrity will do us no good. So, a pharmacist who proceeded to medical school, took more advanced studies is not supposed to head the NAFDAC? This is where naija attitude stinks!

@ naijaking1
The laws setting up NAFDAC clearly states that the DG of NAFDAC MUST be a trained pharmacist.The law is the law and should be followed to the letter.The present DG is not a pharmacist and therefore does not qualify to be DG.That is the truth and no amount of talk can change it.That our obviously misguided president will do the right thing and follow his much heralded rule of law is another matter entirely.The man is simply not qualified to hold that post.

dreday:

@ naijaking1
The laws setting up NAFDAC clearly states that the DG of NAFDAC MUST be a trained pharmacist.The law is the law and should be followed to the letter.The present DG is not a pharmacist and therefore does not qualify to be DG.That is the truth and no amount of talk can change it.That our obviously misguided president will do the right thing and follow his much heralded rule of law is another matter entirely.The man is simply not qualified to hold that post.

You have not answered the question; is a pharmacist who proceeded to do more studies become disqualified??

@ reindeer, here is the part of the Nafdac law :'According to section 5 and 6 of Cap 535 LFN 1990, only registered PHARMACISTS can be appointed as pharmaceutical inspectors in Nigeria'. Hope you are satisfied.

@ naijaking1, please don't get offensive but try to be realistic. A pharmacist should head Nafdac and that is the bottom line. Whether he or she goes to medical school or not as long as the person is registered as pharmacist. Besides the guy is a DOCTOR claiming that he is qualified to head Nafdac because of a postgraduate degree in pharmacology. For people that do not know, pharmacology is taught in both pharmacy and medical schools. That does not mean that a pharmacist should head a medical association.

@ dreday, thanks for setting naijaking1 straight.

Anyway,i read in the newspaper that the matter is about to go to court. I would advice that the Doctor in question (Dr Paul) resign before he is forcefully removed. He knows that he is not fit for the job. For crying out loud, does he even know how to carry out a chemical assay on Vitamin C or any other drug for that matter? I wonder what is next, a doctor as the head of Pharmacists council of Nigeria? Pleeease give me a break.

Pharm Bimbo (http://Acnespotfree..com)

Hmm, I don't know the exact qualifications of the this new DG yet, so I will desist from making conclusions about him. however, it's important we understand that the position of DG of NAFDAC is a technical one, requiring indept knowledge of drug assessment techniques, which his training as a medical doctor might not have exposed him to, at least at the undergraduate level. If indeed the he does have the post graduate training that gives him the requisite skills then I don't think his lack of a first degree in Pharmacy should constitute an impediment to him heading NAFDAC.

Interesting that Pharm Bimbo brought up the PharmD issue. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was made to understand that the major opposition to the degree was from the pharmacists themselves, especially the older ones, and NOT the medical doctors. There are three of your colleagues from UNIBEN, the only school that is currently running the program, that work in my hospital, and that was what they told me.

Bimbo25:

@ reindeer, here is the part of the Nafdac law :'According to section 5 and 6 of Cap 535 LFN 1990, only registered PHARMACISTS can be appointed as pharmaceutical inspectors in Nigeria'. Hope you are satisfied.

@ naijaking1, please don't get offensive but try to be realistic. A pharmacist should head Nafdac and that is the bottom line. Whether he or she goes to medical school or not as long as the person is registered as pharmacist. Besides the guy is a DOCTOR claiming that he is qualified to head Nafdac because of a postgraduate degree in pharmacology. For people that do not know, pharmacology is taught in both pharmacy and medical schools. That does not mean that a pharmacist should head a medical association.

@ dreday, thanks for setting naijaking1 straight.

Anyway,i read in the newspaper that the matter is about to go to court. I would advice that the Doctor in question (Dr Paul) resign before he is forcefully removed. He knows that he is not fit for the job. For crying out loud, does he even know how to carry out a chemical assay on Vitamin C or any other drug for that matter? I wonder what is next, a doctor as the head of Pharmacists council of Nigeria? Pleeease give me a break.

Pharm Bimbo (http://Acnespotfree..com)

My question persists. If the guy had earlier education as a pharmacist, and proceeded to medical school for advanced studies(like many of my classmates), does that disqualify him from becoming the NAFDAC boss?

Professional jingoism is as raw as it could be in Nigeria, and I understand that, but we should never loose sight of what's best for the patient. For example, a pharmacist hawking acne medications as a cure-all for all skin conditions is probably doing more harm to the patients on the long run, because many of those retinoic acid preparations have endocrinological, gyneacological , and even embryological implications. Dermatologists would understand my point.

Anyway, back to NAFDAC, untill we have proof that this guy had no training at all in his life as a pharmacist, we should not push him out because some older folks feel threatened by his long chain of academic degrees.

what i dont get is, is the head of NAFDAC just a 'pharmaceutical inspector'?that sounds like what the foot soldiers of NAFDAC should be and not the head.And that section you quoted didnt say anything about the office of the DG.
it would be better to show something more explicit about the office.

i copied this from shara reporters:
The new DG Dr. Orhii who has a Doctorate Degree in Neuro-Pharmacology takes over from Mrs. Dora Akunyili who was recently appointed Minister of Information and Communications.

He has over 20 years cumulative working experience in the field of medicine in Nigeria and the United States of America.

if you ask me, i dont think he's unqualified.

@ naijaking1
To answer your question.If pharmacist trains as something else or gets a million other degrees,he doesn't stop being a pharmacist.But the new DG is not a pharmacist and has never trained as one.I'm sure you're aware that his pharmacology degree is grossly inadequate as what NAFDAC does is mainly analytical.If a pharmacist takes a course in public health,does that qualify him as a doctor?
@ reindeer
With regards to your assertion as to the number of years the new DG has been practising medicine,you can liken it to getting a marine engineer of 25years to work on an airplane.The bracket is large and that's why there are different specialties.He may be overqualified as a doctor,but as DG of a regulatory body such as nafdac,he doesn't have the most basic of qualifications which is being a pharmacist.

Are you sure he was never trained as a pharmacist? If he was not then I reverse myself.

@ naijaking1
Takes a honourable person to do what you just did.

Looks like some people have not fully read the post before replying.

reindeer:

what i dont get is, is the head of NAFDAC just a 'pharmaceutical inspector'?that sounds like what the foot soldiers of NAFDAC should be and not the head.And that section you quoted didnt say anything about the office of the DG.
it would be better to show something more explicit about the office.

i copied this from shara reporters:
The new DG Dr. Orhii who has a Doctorate Degree in Neuro-Pharmacology takes over from Mrs. Dora Akunyili who was recently appointed Minister of Information and Communications.

He has over 20 years cumulative working experience in the field of medicine in Nigeria and the United States of America.

if you ask me, i dont think he's unqualified.

there is a difference between Pharmacy and Pharmacology.

According to the by laws of NAFDAC the person has to be Pharmacist.

He is a Neuro-Pharmacologist and not a Pharmacist.

WHICH ONE DEY PEPPER U FOR BODY? DOES IT MATTER IF THE PERSON IS A DOCTOR OR PHARMACIST? ITS SUCH BASE SENTIMENTS THAT HAS RETARDED THE PROGRESS OF OUR NATION.

This is the height of politics we are talking about in health system in Nigeria.Medical doctors take everything in health not just to make the health care grow but just to supress others, if they are objective in doing things nobody cares who is there, but once a Medical doctor enter there he will start supressing others.Imagine my dear,
Minister of health is a medical Doctor
minister of state for health is a medical doctor
NAFDAC DG is a medical doctor who did a minor 18months course or less in a small part of pharmacology

Note the name is ministry of health not Ministry of medcine,Health comprises,medcine,nursing,medical lab scientists,pharmacists,radiographers,physiotherapist,optometrists,occupational health ,dentists,nutritionists,medical record officers,etc,but the ministry turned to ministry of medcine and do you wonder why the new salary scale for medical doctors scalled through just like that, will the new salary scale make them happy,no.Even now they are still fighting others from having good pay,but they want supersonic pay rise.
In delta state they conspired with unremitting and useless health politics to stop optometrists allowance,which they are mandated to pay by law, but they know they must pay it,even if it takes so long.

Mediacl doctors go and do 18months programme on any health course and come to lord the real people,imagine somebody will go and do postgraduate diploma in ophthalmaology,PGD ,which takes 18months and start fighting the optometrists and when you see their diagnosis you will weep for this country,they call themselves ophthalmologists, but you and i know that to be a consultant in ophthalmology need residency training for more than 5yrs,optometry is 6yrs and optometry has its residency,but what we see is that medical doctors join these diplomate to fight others ,they dont care who goes blind,but when they are among themselves they tell the diplomate where he/she belongs.
Have you ever wondered why they allowe medical doctors to take the job of hospital adminstrators, dont you see the result, total health decay, a simple memo will not be treated in a good way,but in a way to favour them, the other guy here ask the initiator wetin dey pepper am, that is the problem with our system, once you are not affected directly,it does not concern you, that is why we are not moving.Its effect will eventually get to us one way or the other,check out tis, a medical doctor out of negligence killed somebody,a precious pregnancy, panel was set up with an O&G specialist as chairman, the specialist who is a medical dr. recommended transfer for the young dr and recommended demotion for the nurses. what a jugdement. This case repeated itself somewhere again ,the panel headed by a medical dr, asked that the dr involve should undersudy the o and g specialist for 1 yr and they punished the nurses.
This country is funny and stinks.
One day the effect of these i dont care attitude will get to us one by one in a full scale, see Niger Delta,some people say i dont care ,civil war did not affect all people but the effect is with all of us,we dont trust ourselves again, the same thing ojukwu fought is now haunting other regoins,.Those that are taking there kids to Ghana ,etc to read ,after going to scholls themselves with schlarships here,after destrying our system are wasting time, for if they dont do some thing big walls cannot save their kids .i hope these kidnapping is checked and stoped, but if somebody get fever from malaria , treating the malaria will remove the fever , but if you are treating fever without malaria, after a while the fever will come again.

let us defend the weak, anywhere and everywhere
let us tell ourselves the truth .

This is the height of politics we are talking about in health system in Nigeria.Medical doctors take everything in health not just to make the health care grow but just to supress others, if they are objective in doing things nobody cares who is there, but once a Medical doctor enter there he will start supressing others.Imagine my dear,
Minister of health is a medical Doctor
minister of state for health is a medical doctor
NAFDAC DG is a medical doctor  who did a minor 18months course or less in a small part of pharmacology

Note the name is ministry of health not Ministry of medcine,Health comprises,medcine,nursing,medical lab scientists,pharmacists,radiographers,physiotherapist,optometrists,occupational health ,dentists,nutritionists,medical record officers,etc,but the ministry turned to ministry of medcine and do you wonder why the new salary scale for medical doctors scalled through just like that, will the new salary scale make them happy,no.Even now they are still fighting others from having good pay,but they want supersonic pay rise.
In delta state they conspired with unremitting and useless health politics to stop optometrists allowance,which they are mandated to pay by law, but they know they must pay it,even if it takes so long.

Mediacl doctors go and do 18months programme on any health course and come to lord the real people,imagine somebody will go and do postgraduate diploma in ophthalmaology,PGD ,which takes 18months and start fighting the optometrists and when you see their diagnosis you will weep for this country,they call themselves ophthalmologists, but you and i know that to be a consultant in ophthalmology need residency training for more than 5yrs,optometry is 6yrs and optometry has its residency,but what we see is that medical doctors join these diplomate to fight others ,they dont care who goes blind,but when they are among themselves they tell the diplomate where he/she belongs.
Have you ever wondered why they allowe medical doctors to take the job of hospital adminstrators, dont you see the result, total health decay, a simple memo will not be treated in a good way,but in a way to favour them, the other guy here ask the initiator wetin dey pepper am, that is the problem with our system, once you are not affected directly,it does not concern you, that is why we are not moving.Its effect will eventually get to us one way or the other,check out tis, a medical doctor out of negligence killed somebody,a precious pregnancy, panel was set up with an O&G specialist as chairman, the  specialist who is a medical dr. recommended transfer for the young dr and recommended demotion for the nurses. what a jugdement. This case repeated itself somewhere again ,the panel headed by a medical dr, asked that the dr involve should undersudy the o and g specialist for 1 yr and they punished the nurses.
This country is funny and stinks.
One day the effect of these i dont care attitude will get to us one by one in a full scale, see Niger Delta,some people say i dont care ,civil war did not affect all people but the effect is with all of us,we dont trust ourselves again, the same thing ojukwu fought is now haunting other regoins,.Those that are taking their kids to Ghana ,etc to read ,after going to schools themselves with schlarships here,after destroying our system are wasting time, for if they dont do some thing big walls cannot save their kids .i hope these kidnapping is checked and stoped, but if somebody get fever from malaria , treating the malaria will remove the fever , but if you are treating fever without malaria, after  a while the fever will come again.

let us defend the weak, anywhere and everywhere
let us tell ourselves the truth .

All these ?

Na wah o!

What i think is missing in Nigeria is the office of a surgeon-general,

If thats created i think it will settle all this these industry rifts. And hey i don't think doctors in Nigeria will stop the government from paying other health workers, that will be absurd.What im aware they are fighting for is their own scale, thats all.
A scale commensurate with the years they put in studying, the demands of the job and the responsibility that goes with it.
See im sure most of you are familiar with the curriculum of medical schools and ow demanding it is, i know No other health worker goes through such rigorous training(their own trainings may be tough in its own self but side by side, nah!) I went to med school in Nigeria so i know this, especially if you have friends(or siblings) in other health fields.I know the curriculum includes a lot of things to be known in short time.

I dont think there should be any animosity between docs and paramedics, everyone should just be proud of their Job and training thats all.
At times those arguments against docs smack of an undertone of envy.

Like i said, im not against any other health worker being the Minister of health, i believe someone capable should just head that ministry but the office of a Surgeon general should be created which will take care of doctors and regulate the profession. This ministry of course MUST be headed by a doctor.Just imagine a court bailiff being the attorney-general

well ,i want to tell you that nobody is envying any medical doctor rather it is the medical doctors that is jealous with other health personnel.If not why will they be angry that somebody whose degree is doctor of optometry is been addressed as Dr. when theirs is bachelor of medicine and bachelor of surgery in some case.why are they trying to take control of the health system in the country but abroad you see how things run.Medical school is like other schools,there is nothing special about medical school,it is just personal decision move us where we want together with destiny.Pharmacist is a very difficult course,they dont make noise.
Yes medical doctors in Delta state stopped the allowances of optometrists in their employ,they used NMA,everybody know that,they even tried to stop the allowances of veterinary doctors in Delta state ,but it backfired for them because the head of service  of the state is a vet.dr. WHY SO, MEDICAL DOCTOR IS THE SSG, COMMISSIONER OF HEALTH, HEAD OF HOSPITAL MGT. BOARD,ETC

why do you want to head the ministry of health, are you the only people in health,are you more important than the medical lab scientist,the pharmacists,etc.
Medical doctors in Nigeria know what they want ,they are killing other profession but want theirs to grow,one day their kids,mum,dad,relations will fall victim to these politics,it is happening in our education system where the rich killed our education,sent their kids abroad,etc,but see,kidnapping is now the order of the day.

if we follow your argument that ministry of health must be headed medical  doctor ,then i ask why will a Dr. want to be governor of a state did he read political science?

Ministry is administrative not clinical,all these politics we know it wont help us but like a typical Nigerian once you are benefiting,others can burn.

I blame other health professional,if they leave the hospital for the doctors for just two weeks let us see how they will cope.The truth is that there is in burning anger against medical doctors by other health professional,may god save us the day it will explode anybody can be the victim.

we dont need surgeon general,it cannot work here, the mind of medical doctors are corrupt toward other health professional, ok will we have optometrist general, pharmacist general, etc,
to me what we need is  to create directors bearing the various health professions as departments.

I said b4 that if not for politics played by medical doctors starting with Prof. kuti we will not be having problem here and nobody will care who is where, we laugh when the minister was asking government to do some thing before medical doctors go on strike,strike do not work if they meet people that understand their politics.

In Edo state they went on strike because they made a pharmacist commissioner for health during igbenedion regime ,imagine that,but they are even commissioner for agriculture, water resources etc, the strike lasted for 2 long month and they went back to their work loosing  two months salary and edo people did not die, in Anambra they struck again,this time they want big pay,they went on strike for 4 months, and have to beg for their job and lost 4months salary, in Ebonyi state they went for strike for 3months,the Governor even locked the gate of the hospital when they where begging to come back and resume their job.El rufai taught them a big lesson too.In Kenya they sacked all of them and after all the noise they remained sacked.

In all these when bread fruit no dey ,we no dey chop goat shit. (ibo idom)
you just prescribe drug, what of the person who tru research produced this medication, what of the people who analysis these blood sample and tell you it is this or that, what of those that fight to make this country one,called soldiers ,what of the engineers that make sure each time you board your flight you arrive safe ,etc,ask nepa, go to shiroro dam some sea divers go down the sea level to see that certain machines are working, and if there is mistake ,woe unto us and adjoining town, some time last year one of such divers died while trying to do his job, is the medical doctor more important than the pilot.what made you think your course is the hardest,have you tried other courses,have you tried veterinary medicine,optometry,etc, all the course you do except for some ,optometrists do them but they focus more on the ocular side.you do residency,optometrists, vet drs. do theirs,what made you think your curriculum is so hard ,have you tried others,people have switch courses as they like,i have seen two ophthalmologists that still went to read optometry (another 6yrs),i have seen optometrist going to read medicine,i have seen pharmacist going to read law, i have seen a lawyer who is now reading medicine.

when we want the truth we will move close to freedom and when we know the truth ,we shall be free,no be surgeon general ,no be bad health politics.

@ikennahill, most of the things I would have said in response to your post has been handled by @reindeer. All those allergations of A Dr killing someone and nurses getting sacked is at the most baseless though not unheard of. Something you should know is that round the world, the Dr is the leader of the health team and thus all responsibilities fall on him including nursing of the patient. The pressure is so much as the Dr always has to be on top of his game. Most nurses don't like taking orders from Drs esp young Drs and they grumble here and there, yet if something goes wrong the Dr is in trouble. My point is that this megalomaniac attitude you think Drs are showing comes with the pressure of the job knowing he has to be prepared to lead when it comes to any patient. The lab scientist just sees blood and reports his results, he doesn't know the patient has 5 kids, one with a heart condition, and has just lost his job. But the Dr knows this and has to tailor his treatment aptly.
I'm sure Drs wouldn't sabotage other health workers' pay package. They only want the division of labour to be efficient. Wasn't Iyabo Obj Bello a commissioner of health in Ogun state sometime ago? I heard she is a Vet Dr though I never confirmed.
There's politics involved in all these but Drs only protest when their rights are being violated.

Its obvious this ikenna guy has a lot of beef for doctors in nigeria. I wonder if he ever failed an exam into medical school or something, those posts just show anger, bad blood and i can almost say hatred.
Why cant Nigeria have an office for the 'surgeon-general'?? Like i said earlier, doctors aren't interested in being the all in all that you are claiming, No, i said ANY capable administrator(doesn't even have to be from the health sector) can be the minister of health, i have nothing against that.I only say if thats the case then an office must be created :that of the surgeon general.
See there is nothing in the hospital a doctor cannot do, mind you, is it nursing?it only takes smartness, dispensing drugs?please, fact is the only person you cant replace on an ad-hoc basis is the doctor, look at it, you have auxiliary nurses that can with experience do what most nurses can do, you have pharmacy technicians that can dispense accurately,The lab? well a very well trained 400 level medical student can run most of those tests well! Its only the job of the pathologist that will be difficult to salvage.
Let me tell you during the numerous hospital strikes back in those days, the nurses had to lock up all equipments because they know medical students can always be drafted in to change bedsheets, drain catheter bags and administer drugs on time.

See you can hate doctors but fact is what i have just said, you cant do without them so i think you should be more focussed on how to work well together for the benefit of the patients.
All these wrangling are unnecessary and not in the interest of the patient.Be proud of who you are and what you have studied and do your work diligently, there is no limit.We know its just a matter of time before we have a health minister who isn't a doctor(frankly i felt Dora was very suitable at that time)

When all is said and done, doctors the world over are the leaders of the health team(that cant change, sorry)and that reflects in renumeration scales allover the world, lets not try to upturn the truth.As for other people being called doctors, i have no probs with that,so far they have a Ph.d. Fact is we are well aware of the Nigerian situation where people dont know their limits.I saw Auxiliary nurses tagging themselves doctors in nigeria, same with lab scientists and even pharmacists consulting in their shops! Imagine! Such things can send you to jail here! So allowing non Ph d holders and non physicians parading as such could be dangerous in a country where the populace is largely illiterate and where every white coat wearing person is a 'doctor' to be consulted.

lets face it, we all need each other to render quality health service for the country.I wonder why its only in Nigeria that those issues become something to even post about.I can imagine a lab techie in GKT saying doctors are full of themselves, really funny!

Nigeria needs to move forward especially in health, people have to work together harmoniously and stop comparing themselves. Saying there isnt anything to the curriculum of medical schools just state an obvious fact: you never went to one.

@reindeer, I don't even know what else to add!

Medical doctors can do everything,

They can do the job of all other health professional even without license to do so and that is the mind of average Nigerian doctor,that is the mind of a professional quack,let me tell you tha truth if not for regulation anybody can do the job of a medical doctor,what you need is to attache yourself to a clinic you do 'practical' and learn on the job,what is special about medical doctor that people dont know,many people that are just auxillary nurses are doing better than most so called medical doctors clinically,this is fact.
.Infact there are a lot of quack doctors all over the place and once they know their limit they dont enter trouble, at times the quack doctors are medical doctors.when one say he can do everything he is a quack.

most medical doctors that cannot even identify simple malaria parasites from a slide in lab can do the job of a lab scientists,medical doctor that write ibuprofen for stomach ulcer patient can also do the job of phamacists even if he kills 20 people in the process there is no problem,why wont medical doctors like pharmacist technicians,they dont pose threat to their continued opressive hold to power in health sector.go and see what medical house officers are doing,rubbish.one of them dont even know the job of bile.vry funny.



Well one dont need to have a P.hd to be called a doctor
medical doctor does not have a P.hd and his degree is even bachellor degree but he answers doctor(mbbs,mbch)

vet. Drs answer doctor it is not P.HD it is dvm doctor of vetinary medcine

dentists are not medical doctor ,they are dentists and have bds bachellor of dental surgery,they answer dr.

Optometrists are doctor of optometry (OD),it is not P.HD,they answer doctor,these are recognised by law.
what we actually need is for various health professionals to have departments in ministry of health as directors ,then this injustice will stop.

surgeon general alone,what of pharmacist general,optometrists general,med.lab.general,nurses general,etc.
when health sector go back to administrators ,there will be growth and peace.

ok

Erm, ok!
No better answer for someone who'll gladly put his life in the hands of a quack doctor who can do 'everything'

Ikenna, ok ok ok.
May you end up in the hands of a a quack in an emergency.amen

rotflmao

who is a quack
A medical doctor who claim she/he can do everything is a quack
as per emergency a trip to our hospitals will make you hate Nigerian medical doctors,last month one of them was sacked for negligence of duty that lead to somebody's death.the dead man na big man so head come roll,Nma protested what a country,but the government of that state stood their ground.

who is a quack if not medical doctors that know everything. so i wonder why they bother to specialize .

If the cap fits, let them wear it. let the most qualified person run any institution. That is how people make progress.

And if the most qualified person in every situation is a medical doctor, i don't see why anybody should complain.

In Nigeria, everybody wants to be boss, even when they obviously don't deserve it. Imagine somebody talking about learning medicine by going to a clinic.

Anyway, any animal with 2 heads is called a monster. Only 1 head per animal/institution. Please!

The head that want to stop others from growing must expect opposition, only medical doctors cannot be the ones to lead the health field ,others can lead too,but the most annoying thing is that they will want to be the head of other depts too.An ophthalmologist want to head optometrists and even say how they will be trained.pathologists want to head medical lab scientists,etc

if medical doctors in Nigeria are straight who care who head,but they have killed our health sector and they dont want to take the blame.

This thread still exists
The DG is somewhere enjoyin' himself and you are here arguing about a trivial matter

we need to talk for the future 2moro if they make a vet.Dr minister of health let the medical doctors no cry as they normally do

reindeer: eh ya, sorry about your loss.
you sound really sad, never mind, lets just see what the guy can do, if he matches dora then its ok,if not , lets toss him out the window.
meanwhile, it would be nice if you can post that part of the constitution for our education.

now, lets access, what has he done to surpass Mummy Dora?

.""nothing.