Church excommunicates mother of 9-year-old rape victim – but not accused rapist

Brazil rocked by abortion for raped child

Declaring that "life must always be protected", a senior Vatican cleric has defended the Catholic Church's decision to excommunicate the mother and doctors of a nine-year-old rape victim who had a life-saving abortion in Brazil.

Cardinal Giovanni Batista Re, who heads the Pontifical Commission for Latin America, told reporters that although the girl fell pregnant after apparently being abused by her stepfather, her twins had, "the right to live, and could not be eliminated".

In an interview with the Italian newspaper, La Stampa, the cardinal added: "It is a sad case but the real problem is that the twins conceived were two innocent persons. Life must always be protected."

Police believe the girl was sexually assaulted for years by her stepfather, possibly since she was six. That she was four months pregnant with twins emerged only after she was taken to hospital complaining of severe stomach pains.

The controversy represents a PR nightmare for the Vatican. The unnamed girl's mother and doctors were excommunicated for agreeing to Wednesday's emergency abortion yet the Church has not taken formal steps against the stepfather, who is in custody. Jose Cardoso Sobrinho, the conservative regional archbishop for Pernambuco where the girl was rushed to hospital, has said that the man would not be thrown out of the Church, because although he had allegedly committed "a heinous crime", the Church took the view that "the abortion, the elimination of an innocent life, was more serious".

The case has set off fierce debate in Brazil, where abortion is permitted only in cases of rape or a medical emergency. Brazil is one of the most populous Catholic countries, but conservative attitudes in rural areas are strongly at odds with the relatively progressive public view of abortion in major cities.

Even the President, Luiz Ignacio Lula da Silva, has waded into the row. "As a Christian and a Catholic, I deeply regret that a bishop of the Catholic Church has such a conservative attitude," he said "The doctors did what had to be done: save the life of a girl of nine years old. In this case, the medical profession was more right than the Church."

One of the doctors involved in the abortion, Rivaldo Albuquerque, has raised the prospect of public clashes at his local church, telling Globo, the nation's main TV network, that he would keep going to mass there, regardless of the archbishop's order. The young girl at the centre of the case escaped excommunication only because she is still a child in the eyes of Church authorities. The stepfather, who is 23, was arrested last week, apparently trying to escape to another region of the country. Police say he is also suspected of abusing the girl's handicapped 14-year-old sister. He is in protective custody, and if convicted faces up to 15 years in prison.

how pathetic!

this pple sef

I actually started a similar thread but anyway I hope this one gets the attention it deserves. Issues like these should never go unnoticed. The RCC would rather play politics with a child's life than disfellowship the sinner who committed the evil.

Its only a pity that members of the church are so blind to the hypocracy and deceit of their organization.

Bobbyaf:

I actually started a similar thread but anyway I hope this one gets the attention it deserves. Issues like these should never go unnoticed. The RCC would rather play politics with a child's life than disfellowship the sinner who committed the evil.

Its only a pity that members of the church are so blind to the hypocracy and deceit of their organization.

i honestly think this was just too harsh, i'm not supporting the parents or the girl here, but the idea of excommunicating som1 cox of that is just  blatantly too harsh. majority of Catholics commit abortion n r still Catholics, priest molest kids n some r still priest so i dnt  think this was the right course of action to take they should have taken another action. come to think of it shouldn't the stupid idiot that calls himself the step father b the first to b excommunicated 4 the hideous crime he committed .

The girl and her mother deserve support not the awful Vatican and church. Not offence to Catholics but I've always found the Catholic Church disgusting. The whole thing of Vatican this Vatican that makes me sick.

The Vatican felt what the child's mother did was wrong DESPITE the fact that it was siad that if she had that demon spawn, she would die yet they are treating her like a monster. What Bible are they following?

A bishop denying the genocide of millions of jews however is still a bishop.

Nonsense

DeReloaded:

The girl and her mother deserve support not the awful Vatican and church. Not offence to Catholics but I've always found the Catholic Church disgusting. The whole thing of Vatican this Vatican that makes me sick.

The Vatican felt what the child's mother did was wrong DESPITE the fact that it was siad that if she had that demon spawn, she would die yet they are treating her like a monster. What Bible are they following?

A bishop denying the genocide of millions of jews however is still a bishop.

Nonsense

exactly ! anyways since it is Latin American it wasnt such of a surprise cox those folks tend to very strict esp. since most of them r Catholics. and i guess they were just following what the CATECHISM of the CATHOLIC CHURCH  says concerning abortion. it says quoting here page 2272

" formal cooperation in an abortion constitutes a grave offense. the church attaches the canonical penalty of excommunication to this crime against human life. a person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae"

however, i still think it is harsh since the girls life was in danger. i dnt think this would have happened if it was in

deafening silence from most of the christians on the board. . . 

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-230415.0.html
relevant quote:

from our very own dawoda -

trust me, christians are more critical of their own. The Anglican gay bishop crisis was roundly condemned by fellow anglicans and other christians . . . Ted Haggard was immediately removed by his own congregation . . . Pat Robinson was criticized by the christian community . . . sorry but we are not part of those who camouflage their own faults with "allah wills".

 

this thread gives the lie to that. at least for nairaland Christians no round condemning whatsoever. eagerly awaiting his 'criticisms of his own' - he must have missed this thread because he was monitoring the Islam threads .

dawodas aspiring clone, no2commonsense, is also no where to be found.

see as the thread struggle to reach five posts

now, if the equivalent had happened in any middle eastern country, osisi would have been up in arms - remember the girl punished in saudi arabia? and this thread would have reached 10 pages.

offtopic : in the world as it is today, i consider latin america/the phillipines  to be the closest thing to wholly christian nations run on christain values

oyb:

deafening silence from most of the christians on the board. . . 

If you havent noticed, most of the Christians esp David are against the Catholic Church. Abi you dont see the weekly showdown between him and ~Lady~?

To be honest, I put the Catholic church in the same box as The Church of Mormon.

oyb:

offtopic : in the world as it is today, i consider latin america/the phillipines  to be the closest thing to wholly christian nations run on christain values

Being brainwashed by the Vatican is hardly what any sane person would consider "Christian values"

DeReloaded:

Being brainwashed by the Vatican is hardly what any sane person would consider "Christian values"

  wisdom is beautiful thing to behold.

DeReloaded:

Jose Cardoso Sobrinho, the conservative regional archbishop for Pernambuco where the girl was rushed to hospital, has said that the man would not be thrown out of the Church, because although he had allegedly committed "a heinous crime", the Church took the view that "the abortion, the elimination of an innocent life, was more serious".

"The doctors did what had to be done: save the life of a girl of nine years old. In this case, the medical profession was more right than the Church."

    I shivered at the cold, callous heart void of compassion who uttered such a disgusting statement. In this case I 1000% support the mother and her decision to terminate . . . she is 9 yrs old for crying out loud! All those who said that "life must always be protected" should be tortured The "church" cares more about themselves and their precious laws than they do the very people they're supposed to be serving. May the judgement of God not escape those who suffer the little children.

JeSoul:

. May the judgement of God not escape those who suffer the little children.

Amen


Then again Im not surprised that the Catholic Church didnt find the rape of a 9 year old as being "serious". Kings of hiding perversion

Good that the pregnancy was aborted, if not, both the unborn babies and the 9-year old girl would have died, because she could not have been able to survive the heaviness of the pregnancy and if God helps would not be able to deliver the babies normally.

the catholic church is an abomination to the Lord.

Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

Judgement is coming.

@ MrCrackles

So Catholics are in trouble with God? Shocked

Fortunately, God still has His people in the organization, including priests and members. The honest ones have been leaving the organization over a period of time. Generally speaking the leadership is man-controlled. God is certainly not its head. Its one big fat cultic movement where the power brokers called cardinals run things, although it is largely believed that the real power broker is the Jesuit head called the black pope.

oyb:

deafening silence from most of the christians on the board. . . 

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-230415.0.html
relevant quote:

from our very own dawoda -   

this thread gives the lie to that. at least for nairaland Christians no round condemning whatsoever. eagerly awaiting his 'criticisms of his own' - he must have missed this thread because he was monitoring the Islam threads .

dawodas aspiring clone, no2commonsense, is also no where to be found.

see as the thread struggle to reach five posts

now, if the equivalent had happened in any middle eastern country, osisi would have been up in arms - remember the girl punished in saudi arabia? and this thread would have reached 10 pages.

offtopic : in the world as it is today, i consider latin america/the phillipines  to be the closest thing to wholly christian nations run on christain values

TOH answered you well.
are the condemnations not by Christians?
what else do you want to hear?
I'm not an advocate of the Catholic Church either.
What they did here is despicable ,I'm anti abortion too but if this were my 9 year old, most certainly I'll do exactly like this mom.
This mother and her child could go to another Church,that's the difference between you and us.
If this was Islam and it's sharia, do you realise the 9 year old would most likely be stoned at the village square amidst shouts of allahu akhbar.
do you want me to give an example?

Pathetic how the useless stepfather that raped her will most likely be "pardoned" yet the mother is excommunicated. Pathetic excuse of a church.

**osisi:

This mother and her child could go to another Church,that's the difference between you and us.
If this was Islam and it's sharia, do you realise the 9 year old would most likely be stoned at the village square amidst shouts of allahu akhbar.

Very true.

DeReloaded:

Pathetic how the useless stepfather that raped her will most likely be "pardoned" yet the mother is excommunicated. Pathetic excuse of a church.

Very true.

who in their right mind would let a 9 year old rape victim carry a pregnancy?
perhaps mallams in northern Nigeria not people who have brains.
I guess in their sick minds they would have preferred the girl dead from pregnancy and childbirth

This is despicable and sad. The Vatican goon supporting this nonsense needs to get his head checked.

If the twins are innocent, what about the 9 year old girl?? Sanctity of life my foot. When did some so called priests become medical experts to determine whether the girl's life was in danger?

Thank God the Brazillian president spoke out against the atrocity. The church was WRONG and the doctors were right in saving the poor child's life. A rapist who abuses children is welcome in their fold, but the innocent victim of a terrible, terrible crime and a destroyed childhood is not? Lord have mercy.

On a side note, I wonder if Islamic leaders (governors or presidents) would ever have the guts to do so.

Thank God the pedophile was caught.

debosky:

On a side note, I wonder if Islamic leaders (governors or presidents) would ever have the guts to do so.

That's what Ive always found weird, they never speak against evil. They simply just say "oh those people are following Islam" that's it

even the ones on NL sef, you never see them speak against evil done in the name of their religion like those imams going crazy cos of the suppose ban against child brides. Only time they come out is if someone like osisi or david or whomever makes a thread about it. Even then, instead of speaking against the atrocity, they rather just fight the thread makers

Tad Ridiculous.

Anyway this isnt about Islam, it's about how the Catholic Church is a fraud 

where's Lady to tell us why the Nazican is right

DeReloaded:

That's what Ive always found weird, they never speak against evil. They simply just say "oh those people are following Islam" that's it

even the ones on NL sef, you never see them speak against evil done in the name of their religion like those imams going crazy cos of the suppose ban against child brides. Only time they come out is if someone like osisi or david or whomever makes a thread about it. Even then, instead of speaking against the atrocity, they rather just fight the thread makers

Tad Ridiculous.

Anyway this isnt about Islam, it's about how the Catholic Church is a fraud 

where's Lady to tell us why the Nazican is right

Aptly said.   Check the link below and see how NL muslims reacted to atrocities done in the name of their religion.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-227897.0.html#top

@ DeReloaded

Anyway this isnt about Islam, it's about how the Catholic Church is a fraud Angry

where's Lady to tell us why the Nazican is right

Probably after they celebrate lent you might have her or them try to defend this atrocity. Excommunication is an old catholic stance against those who refused to pay homage. It hasn't changed at all, and mark my words carefully, she will once again develop so much power, that she will use the state to persecute those who doesn't go in line with her dogmas.

If you havent noticed, most of the Christians esp David are against the Catholic Church. Abi you dont see the weekly showdown between him and ~Lady~?

To be honest, I put the Catholic church in the same box as The Church of Mormon.

How related are both churches if you really have an idea of what you are saying. The problem with the world today is that we try to fit in our ideology into the word of God. The catholic church is not giving the step father accolades but they are taking a stand on their belief on abortion which is 100% intolerance no matter the case. Can you show me in your bible where abortion can be granted in cases like this?. Whether you can or cannot allow abortion in dire cases is left to you and your God but that does not mean the church should applaud abortion.

What will Kumiyi or Adeboye advise in cases like this since they are holier and more God worthy than catholics?. The world is going through a phase where the left is using force and abuse to force unbiblical practices into the church. That is why gays are fighting tooth and nail and so far they are successful. Soon, one will ask you whether there is a place in the bible where God said that for sex to be allowed, peewee must enter inside a female organ and blah blah blah.

Also try to reduce your obnoxious attitude because it's very disgusting i must say. You don't have to insult catholics here especially just to make a point. There are no prizes for people that shed out insults in quantum packets.

I repeat my question, since your pentecostal assembly are the ones that are heaven worthy, what will be their take on this issue? Will they bend their bible to accommodate this issue or remain silent and allow the catholics take the bullets for them  like they usually do?.

Look at American politicking and the churches and tell me how many evangelicals that stand out to tell the left how disgusting and unbiblical most of their ideologies can be.

exactly ! anyways since it is Latin American it wasnt such of a surprise cox those folks tend to very strict esp. since most of them r Catholics. and i guess they were just following what the CATECHISM of the CATHOLIC CHURCH  says concerning abortion. it says quoting here page 2272

Being prolife has nothing to do with cathechism of the catholic church unless you can show me where the bible said you can abort if the mother's life is at risk.  It's like saying we can steal if we are so hungry and about to die. What I believe in this case is irrelevant but I don't believe in mediocrity. It's either you are for God or against Him.

majority of Catholics commit abortion n r still Catholics, priest molest kids n some r still priest so i dnt  think this was the right course of action to take they should have taken another action.

So because 'majority' of catholics commit the sin of abortion makes it right?. Typical Nigerian. So because majority of policemen collect N20 makes it right and improper for any Nigerian policeman to speak out against it?

Don't we also have pedophile pastors in the pentecostal assembly? Are majority of these women going to pentecostal church in lagos not half baked whores?. Don't many of the sleep around and commit abortions? Does that mean the church should endorse fornication because many of their members are involved in it?. This is the reason why I am always against islamic bashing because whatever is in Okeke's house can be found in Mustapha's house too.

I've seen God work with some pastors and many catholic priests alike. If all the catholics are demons, then God must be blind, confused and not omni potent.

Aloy.Emeka:

How related are both churches if you really have an idea of what you are saying. The problem with the world today is that we try to fit in our ideology into the word of God. The catholic church is not giving the step father accolades but they are taking a stand on their belief on abortion which is 100% intolerance no matter the case. Can you show me in your bible where abortion can be granted in cases like this? Whether you can or cannot allow abortion in dire cases is left to you and your God but that does not mean the church should applaud abortion.

   Lemme ask you this: A catholic woman is being constantly physically abused by her husband, should she stay in the marriage becos it does not say in the bible that divorce can be granted in a case like this?

  The bible is more than black and white. Thou shalt not do this or that for every situation is not written in it. It's not about fitting our ideologies into it, but taking the entire word and applying its principles in making decisions in unique situations that are not spelt out word for word in it.

The girl is 9yrs old, I repeat 9yrs old. Doctors said her life was being threatened and it could prove fatal if she had the babies . . . what kind of cold, unfeeling heart would still demand that the blanket letter of the law be followed when it is clear that this poor abused child desperately needs mercy? Jesus showed us times without number that it is more than laws and commandments, but moreso about the heart and intentions. I don't know of a situation where this could not be clearer.

What will Kumiyi or Adeboye advise in cases like this since they are holier and more God worthy than catholics?.

  I think I speak for others here when I ask who annointed those fellas the leaders of christians everywhere?    They are not my leaders, I don't answer to them, I answer to God and His word.

Look at American politicking and the churches and tell me how many evangelicals that stand out to tell the left how disgusting and unbiblical most of their ideologies can be.

  I understand your point and I agree that the left's agenda is being forced on religion but this issue is seperate & divorced from the topic at hand. Lets keep the discussion on the girl's case.

Can you show me in your bible where abortion can be granted in cases like this?

Who cares? Where does the bible support rape? Why is the stepfather rapist forgiven but not the mother or child?

Catholic Church is and has always been BS. Get over it.

what kind of cold, unfeeling heart would still demand that the blanket letter of the law be followed when it is clear that this poor abused child desperately needs mercy

A monster like himself obviously.

Dont even bother replying the lunatic. Same retard that went off making up garbage about remarriage in the Bible.

JeSoul:


  I think I speak for others here when I ask who annointed those fellas the leaders of christians everywhere?    They are not my leaders, I don't answer to them, I answer to God and His word.

I wonder. Unlike some brainwashed sheep, not all of us look up to mere humans like the Vatican and blah blah before we reason.

@Poster

The issues here are much more complex than bashing the catholic church. The correct way to discuss this topic  in my opinion is if you are faced with an identical situation, what will you do and what are your reason for doing so? The two important issues here are the life of the nine year old girl and the lives of the unborn twins. The correct way can only be found if collaborative medical report on the case is available. The report in this case did not  provide the medical report and neither did it say wheather or not vatican have access to the medical report before coming to their decision. What is reported is that one of the doctors said that the pregnancy may prove fatal to the nine year old child. Such an opinion is not enough to take a decision in this matter.

Child molestation, rape and abortion are evil deeds and their should be no excuse for these  crimes. Abortion can only be allowed if their is strong, independent evidence that continuation of the pregnancy will be fatal to the mother or damage her health. Thus if in this case their is an independent medical evidence that the mothers health is in danger, then vatican is wrong. If however the medical records indicate that a successful pregnancy can be managed and the twins can be delivered by c-section, then vatican is correct in the decision not to support the abortion. A 10 year old have been known in the past to carry out succesful pregnancy while it proved fatal or harmful to some other 10 year old. Thus their should be no generalization but each case should be medically investigated before arriving at wheather the pregnancy will be fatal or safe.   Rape or the age of a child is not  enough reason to abort a foetus who is also a human being.  Thus abortion in my view is only permissible  on ground of the pregnancy causing the death of the mother or damage to the mothers health. 

The issue of excommunication is not relevant since no church, power or person can excommunicate any human being from God. Cheers

Im pro-choice so personally my decision would have been easy

m_nwankwo:

@Poster
The issues here are much more complex than bashing the catholic church. The correct way to discuss this topic  in my opinion is if you are faced with an identical situation, what will you do and what are your reason for doing so? The two important issues here are the life of the nine year old girl and the lives of the unborn twins. The correct way can only be found if collaborative medical report on the case is available. The report in this case did not  provide the medical report and neither did it say wheather or not vatican have access to the medical report before coming to their decision. What is reported is that one of the doctors said that the pregnancy may prove fatal to the nine year old child. Such an opinion is not enough to take a decision in this matter.

why do they need to provide anyone but the FAMILY medical report? or you think it's like Nigeria where anyone's medical report is allowed to be put in the open anyway? Unlike Naija, other countries have LAWS against such things. It is of no one's concern aside from the girl and her family. The doctors made it CLEAR that the girl can NOT handle having the children and her health would be in serious danger. That is ALL that is important, not whether the Vatican needs to see the medical report. Who the hell is the Vatican?
Jesus' teachings are completely OPPOSITE of all the garbage that the Catholic church teaches. He taught forgiveness and compassion. The Catholic Church is just filled with hate and damnation.

Once again, how is it that a bishop can deny the Holocaust and still be allowed in the church yet a mother who wanted to save her daughter's life isnt? They obviously dont worship the same God as other Christians. They worship the pope which is fine, they should just find a different title for themselves. Simple

@Deloaded

Im pro-choice so personally my decision would have been easy

It is your choice. But what is pro-choice? What are your reasons for being pro-choice?

why do they need to provide anyone but the FAMILY medical report? or you think it's like Nigeria where anyone's medical report is allowed to be put in the open anyway? Unlike Naija, other countries have LAWS against such things. It is of no one's concern aside from the girl and her family. The doctors made it CLEAR that the girl can NOT handle having the children and her health would be in serious danger. That is ALL that is important, not whether the Vatican needs to see the medical report. Who the hell is the Vatican?

There is no evidence in the newspaper report to shown wheather or not the pregnancy is harmful or fatal to the mother. One of the doctors expressed an opinion and if the parents of the child are seeking for answers to the moral and spiritual consequences of abortion in this case,  they should have at least two independent medical reports. It is not stated in the article wheather they did or not. Sure it is a family matter but they are catholics and seem to agree with the teachings of the church on this issue. The more important issue is wheather or not abortion under the circumstances they found themselves is against the laws of God. If they are seeking for clarity, they should get at least two collaborative medical decisions and not just take a decision on what appears to be convinient. As I said some 10 old girls have succesfully undergone pregnancy and birth while others did not. There are a good number of brilliant gyneacologists that support the catholic position on abortion. We do not know wheather or not vatican consulted these experts before coming to their decision.

Jesus' teachings are completely OPPOSITE of all the garbage that the Catholic church teaches. He taught forgiveness and compassion. The Catholic Church is just filled with hate and damnation.

There is no need to demonise the catholic church. What is the teaching of Jesus on abortion and how does it contradict the stand of the catholic church on abortion.

The Catholic Church is just filled with hate and damnation

This is your opinion but it is an unnecessary generalization. Within the catholic church are to be found some men and women who are serving God as well as those who are  serving satan.  The same is true for all churches and religions and their are no exception.

Once again, how is it that a bishop can deny the Holocaust and still be allowed in the church yet a mother who wanted to save her daughter's life isnt? They obviously dont worship the same God as other Christians. They worship the pope which is fine, they should just find a different title for themselves. Simple

This is an over simplification of the issues involved. Holocaust and its denial is evil and so is abortion under any circumstances except to save the life of the mother. It is not difficult for affected individuals to know when abortion of a pregnancy is to save the life of the mother or just for convinience. If one believes that an unborn baby is a human being and has the same God given rights as children, adults and old people, then abortion should not be contemplated except when robust medical evidence points to the pregnancy resulting in fatality or harm to the health of the mother. What is spiritually correct in most cases is not convinient to the flesh. Stay blessed.