Would you treat your servant like Jesus commanded in Luke 12:

46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.

47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.

48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.



Is this not Jesus advocating cruelty to fellow human beings?

No.

It is a parable.

Take it in full context and that becomes clear.

41Peter asked, "Lord, are you telling this parable to us, or to everyone?"

42The Lord answered, "Who then is the faithful and wise manager, whom the master puts in charge of his servants to give them their food allowance at the proper time? 43It will be good for that servant whom the master finds doing so when he returns. 44I tell you the truth, he will put him in charge of all his possessions. 45But suppose the servant says to himself, 'My master is taking a long time in coming,' and he then begins to beat the menservants and maidservants and to eat and drink and get drunk. 46The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers.

47"That servant who knows his master's will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows. 48But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.

He is also not advocating beating servants. He is saying that it is already a common practice in this instance and is using it as an analogy.

Bastage:

No.

It is a parable.

Take it in full context and that becomes clear.

He is also not advocating beating servants. He is saying that it is already a common practice in this instance and is using it as an analogy.

Yes, we have heard this "it is a parable" excuse many times before. Why would Jesus illustrate his point with a parable using such a vile act as beating another human, without condemning the act. In fact, this was an opportunity for him to condemn the habitual beating of servants/slaves by their masters, but he did not address the issue. Yes, it was common practice at the time, but does that make it morally right?

You really are a complete prick sometimes.

Saying it's a parable is not an "excuse".

It is a fucking parable. It even says it's a fucking parable.

I've had enough of this one already.

Bastage:

You really are a complete prick sometimes.

Saying it's a parable is not an "excuse".

It is a fucking parable. It even says it's a fucking parable.

I've had enough of this one already.

If you were a thinking man, you would not display this outburst of profanities.


Did I say it is not a parable? I assert that I did not. I said that the fact that it is a parable is used as an excuse for loose-handling of the content of the parable. It really bears to make this simpler for those like you:

Suppose someone (say President Obama) were to make a parable about the beating of captives and to paint the parable as though there was some high moral lesson in the parable, without condemning the act of beating. How well do you think that would be received?

huxley:

If you were a thinking man, you would not display this outburst of profanities. 

I use language to match the mentality of the person I'm replying to.

"Oh, you naughty boy, Bastage. Using bad language means you are unintelligent".

No. Using bad language means that the dipshit who cannot understand my original post can normally understand my second.

I'm not interested in this thread any more Huxley. Any answer I give will be treated with derision and scorn by your superiority complex. Even if I back it up with evidence as above.

The sad thing is, you could have been a beacon for atheism. You showed some knowledge. Instead you let your hatred cloud that knowledge. Now you're just a fundamentalist and the ironic thing is that you do more damage to your cause than good, without you even knowing it.
Fundamentalists who thrive on blind hatred just tend to drive their enemies deeper into the oppositions arms.

Bastage:


I use language to match the mentality of the person I'm replying to.

"Oh, you naughty boy, Bastage. Using bad language means you are unintelligent".

No. Using bad language means that the dipshit who cannot understand my original post can normally understand my second.

I'm not interested in this thread any more Huxley. Any answer I give will be treated with derision and scorn by your superiority complex. Even if I back it up with evidence as above.

The sad thing is, you could have been a beacon for atheism. You showed some knowledge. Instead you let your hatred cloud that knowledge. Now you're just a fundamentalist and the ironic thing is that you do more damage to your cause than good, without you even knowing it.
Fundamentalists who thrive on blind hatred just tend to drive their enemies deeper into the oppositions arms.

Yes, I have every justification to feel superior when faced with this sort of rationalisation of acts or behaviour that is universally regarded as reprehensible. And why would I not be?

huxley:

Yes, I have every justification to feel superior when faced with this sort of rationalisation of acts or behaviour that is universally regarded as reprehensible. And why would I not be?

Ever heard of a word called "humility"?

You may have a better argument, you may feel morally correct, but superior?
Only complete assholes ever think they're superior. Go take a look at the Christian right. They think they're superior too.

Well done. You exemplified all of my reasoning without any prompting from me.

Bastage:

Ever heard of a word called "humility"?

You may have a better argument, you may feel morally correct, but superior?
Only complete assholes ever think they're superior. Go take a look at the Christian right. They think they're superior too.

Well done. You exemplified all of my reasoning without any prompting from me.

Yes again.  This charge is what we hear all the time and I bear it without humility especially towards someone like you who is clearly capable of better but are willfully enslaved to some barbaric desert dogma.

Let me explain.  Say I were to meet a tribe of people who habitually beat their fellow men or practice cannibalism as part of their normal and standard culture.  Would I feel superior towards them?  Yes, I would and I will be humble as well and I would obviously find a way to convince them away from such acts.

However, if I were to learn that you practise such acts ( I presume that you have been exposed to the light of the "modern world", but I may be wrong, given the sorts of beliefs you countenance),  I would feel superior towards you without a jot of humility.  It would be like feeling humility towards a burglar who has just burglarise your home,  or a rapist who has just raped your wife or sister or daughter.  Or it would be like feeling humility towards the Taliban/Alquada.   Christianity is responsible for this twisted notion of apportioniing of humility and you are clearly a victim of it here.  What a shame!!!!

You'll either have to believe the Bible as a whole or you don't. If you just take one part,you're likely to be confused later,be you born again or against.just a little tip sha.
When you read your Bible,you'll understand that Jesus doesn't need to be politically correct.He's not a politician,neither does he represent the UN. He's Lord of all,owner of heaven and earth. Also,that place is not only a parable but a prophecy. Its telling us what will happen at the end. Judgement is coming.God loves you too

Image123:

You'll either have to believe the Bible as a whole or you don't. If you just take one part,you're likely to be confused later,be you born again or against.just a little tip sha.
When you read your Bible,you'll understand that Jesus doesn't need to be politically correct.He's not a politician,neither does he represent the UN. He's Lord of all,owner of heaven and earth. Also,that place is not only a parable but a prophecy. Its telling us what will happen at the end. Judgement is coming.God loves you too

OK,  can you show me how taking the bible as a whole eliminates or removes this confusion?  Can you show me how the above quoted verse fit into some sort of "whole", which you suggest I am ignoring?


I suppose as a Christian, you take and believe the bible as a whole.   If you do, which of the following biblical injunctions to you observe?

1)  DO you keep the Sabbath which is a Saturday?

2)  Do you observer the dietary laws about clean and unclean foods

3)  Do you avoid planning for the future?

4)  Do submit to aggression and turn the other cheek to aggressors?

5)  Do you self-mutilate to avoid committing sin?


Consider the following biblical injunction about recalcitrant children:

Exodus 21: 17  And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.


And Jesus gave unremitting support for the above.  See the follwing;

Matthew 15:

1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;
6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.


Mark 7:

9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:



As someone who takes the bible as a whole, do you advocate the killing of children as commanded by Moses in Exodus and re-inforced by Jesus in Matthew?  If not, why not?

huxley:

Yes, we have heard this "it is a parable" excuse many times before. Why would Jesus illustrate his point with a parable using such a vile act as beating another human, without condemning the act. In fact, this was an opportunity for him to condemn the habitual beating of servants/slaves by their masters, but he did not address the issue. Yes, it was common practice at the time, but does that make it morally right?

Jesus Christ was simply using an analogy that would be easily understood by His listeners not endorsing the act. The same old testament laws firmly speak against maltreating your servant.

Perhaps He condemned the act and it was not written in the gospels . . . you nor i have no idea but as is usual with you trolls . . .

@huxley
when I say take the Bible as a whole,its the exact opposite that you're doing.You're to understand in the light of all that has been said and done,don't just pick one verse and run,compare scripture with other parts of scripture. Like I've said,its a lot easier to do when you're born again.In most of your above questions including the main thread question,you've only picked those verses singularly as a sentence,and not collectively and contextually with the whole counsel of God.Work on that and lets see how it goes,but it'll be much easier if you gave your life to Christ.

Image123:

@huxley
when I say take the Bible as a whole,its the exact opposite that you're doing.You're to understand in the light of all that has been said and done,don't just pick one verse and run,compare scripture with other parts of scripture. [b]Like I've said,its a lot easier to do when you're born again.In most of your above questions including the main thread question,you've only picked those verses singularly as a sentence,and not collectively and contextually with the whole counsel of God.Work on that and lets see how it goes,[/b]but it'll be much easier if you gave your life to Christ.

Yes, I suppose when you are born again it mean yiu are completed delusional so such immoral injunction appear OK to you. If you disagree, can you explain to me the context in which this barbaric act can appear acceptable? The table is all yours now. This is your turn to explain the appropriate conext in which this should be viewed.

Over to you and I am truly really eager to learn.

@huxley
please pardon me for I've not been available.Firstly,calling any biblical injunction immoral is an act which itself is immoral.You don't dictate right or wrong or accepted standard.only the judge can.God is judge of all,He's just got to be right.That's fact although you may feel uneasy with it. It is in this spirit that Luke12 begins. Jesus begins in verse 1 with warning against hypocrisy. He declares the whole truth,not just lying in the name of being politically/socially correct.He's talking about judgement,consequences. Thats life.There are consequences and there are rewards.Its only sincere to talk about the two.Many prefer the sweet talk about the rewards.yes there's time 4those talk about love and joy,happiness,provision and peace.Jesus dealt with that when due,but there're consequences,judgement,punishment for wrong doing.Jesus was sincere to declare that without hypocrisy.Criminals,defaulters and offenders shouldn't be praised or promoted in a normal setting.they should be punished and that what Jesus says.Look at Luke12v1-3.it says reckoning/judgement day is coming.v5 says God will do the judgement and should be feared.v9 tells us about consequences for denying Jesus.v20 continues with certainty that there are consequences and rewards for the way we live on earth.There's the challenge/exhortation to put more priority investment on Heaven and invest less on earthly pursuits.v42-44 assures that there'll be reward for doing good.v45-48 assures us that there're consequences for evil works/offences.The servant that beat the menservants and maidens will also be beaten with stripes.thats what v45-48 says ko?You reap what you sow. Its that simple.Its not just a beating for nothing,its with purpose. Moaning about it would not change it mr. Criminals complain all the time like they shouldn't be punished.Don't fight for them.You do your part so as not to be punished or found an offender.Unsuccessful people complain about everything else but themselves.Look inside of you.See and acknowledge your faults and make your ways right. God loves you Huxley.

Image123:

@huxley
please pardon me for I've not been available.Firstly,calling any biblical injunction immoral is an act which itself is immoral.You don't dictate right or wrong or accepted standard.only the judge can.God is judge of all,He's just got to be right.That's fact although you may feel uneasy with it. It is in this spirit that Luke12 begins. Jesus begins in verse 1 with warning against hypocrisy. He declares the whole truth,not just lying in the name of being politically/socially correct.He's talking about judgement,consequences. Thats life.There are consequences and there are rewards.Its only sincere to talk about the two.Many prefer the sweet talk about the rewards.yes there's time 4those talk about love and joy,happiness,provision and peace.Jesus dealt with that when due,but there're consequences,judgement,punishment for wrong doing.Jesus was sincere to declare that without hypocrisy.Criminals,defaulters and offenders shouldn't be praised or promoted in a normal setting.they should be punished and that what Jesus says.Look at Luke12v1-3.it says reckoning/judgement day is coming.v5 says God will do the judgement and should be feared.v9 tells us about consequences for denying Jesus.v20 continues with certainty that there are consequences and rewards for the way we live on earth.There's the challenge/exhortation to put more priority investment on Heaven and invest less on earthly pursuits.v42-44 assures that there'll be reward for doing good.v45-48 assures us that there're consequences for evil works/offences.The servant that beat the menservants and maidens will also be beaten with stripes.thats what v45-48 says ko?You reap what you sow. Its that simple.Its not just a beating for nothing,its with purpose. Moaning about it would not change it mr. Criminals complain all the time like they shouldn't be punished.Don't fight for them.You do your part so as not to be punished or found an offender.Unsuccessful people complain about everything else but themselves.Look inside of you.See and acknowledge your faults and make your ways right. God loves you Huxley.

Image123, pardon me, but I find it rather difficult to read your post, mainly because is so badly punctuated and formatted. Can I suggest the following:

1) Break your main point up into separate paragraphs to encompass each salient point.

2) Punctuate each sentence better. Allow a space between a full-stop and the start of the new sentence. Also allow a space between a comma and the next word.

3) Enumerate where appropriate (just like I have done here).

4) Some highlighting or emboldening would also be useful.


All or some of these would make for relatively easy reading of your post. Hope you don't take offense.

I'm heavily sorry for being inarticulate,huxley. Its because I went to a good, international, world class, quality, bush, standard schools. I'll take it on myself to improve. The God of atheists is my witness. i will improve.

Please pardon me for I've not been available.
Firstly,calling any biblical injunction immoral is an act which itself is immoral. You don't dictate right or wrong or accepted standard, only the judge can. God is judge of all. He's just got to be right. That's fact although you may feel uneasy with it. It is in this spirit that Luke12 begins. Jesus begins in verse 1 by warning against hypocrisy. He declares the whole truth, not just lying in the name of being politically/socially correct. He's talking about judgement,consequences.
Thats life. There are consequences and there are rewards. Its only sincere to talk about the two. Many prefer the sweet talk about the rewards. Yes, there's time 4 those talk about love and joy, happiness, provision and peace. Jesus dealt with that when due, but there're consequences/ judgement/ punishment for wrong doing. Jesus was sincere to declare that without hypocrisy. Criminals, defaulters and offenders shouldn't be praised or promoted in a normal setting. They should be punished and that what Jesus says. Look at Luke12v1-3. it says reckoning/judgement day is coming.
verse 5 says God will do the judgement and should be feared.
verse 9 tells us about consequences for denying Jesus.
verse 20 continues with certainty that there are consequences and rewards for the way we live on earth. There follows the challenge/exhortation to put more priority investment on Heaven and invest less on earthly pursuits.
Then comes verses 42-44 which assures that there'll be reward for doing good.verses45-48 assures us that there're consequences for evil works/offences.The servant that beat the menservants and maidens will also be beaten with stripes. Thats what v45-48 says ko? You reap what you sow. Its that simple.Its not just a beating for nothing, its with purpose. Moaning about it would not change it mr.
Criminals complain all the time like they shouldn't be punished. Don't fight for them. You do your part so as not to be punished or found an offender. Unsuccessful people complain about everything else but themselves. Look inside of you. See and acknowledge your faults and make your ways right. God loves you Huxley.