Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:10am On Feb 14, 2016 |
malvisguy212:
1. Jesus has two natures, He is God
and man.
2. Each nature is full and complete ,
He is fully God and fully man.
3. Each nature remains distinct.
4. Christ is only one Person.
5. Things that are true of only one
nature are nonetheless true of the
Person of Christ.
Jesus is a man. A man who was possessed by God. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by nasiayam: 7:20am On Feb 14, 2016 |
[quote author=malvisguy212 post=42905975][/quote]
Spreading of shirk, inviting people to paganism.. Minus two chum |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:35am On Feb 14, 2016 |
nasiayam:
Spreading of shirk, inviting people to paganism..
Minus two chum Surah 2:158: “Lo! (the mountains) As-
Safa and Al-Marwah are among the
indications of Allah. It is therefore no
sin for him who is on pilgrimage to
the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to
go around them ( AS THE PAGAN CUSTOM IS ).” (Pickthall) |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by HIbreed(m): 9:19am On Mar 19, 2016 |
Jozzy4: Malvisguy212 , in as much as I enjoyed reading the above analogy , i disagree .
- when Jesus say " God" , he is refering to His Father .
For example : john 14:1 " exercise faith in God, exercise faith also in me"
The big question is : who did he identify as God ? Himself ? Of course , not himself but his father .
Bro , nobody is good except God ( The Father)
Exercise Faith In God ( The Father) - John 14:1
thank you jozzy,. Nice analogy. Do people derive joy by twisting the word of God, i find it disheartening. Revelation 22:18 I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, if any man shall add unto them, God shall add unto him the plagues which are written in this book: Revelation 22:19 and if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the tree of life, and out of the holy city, which are written in this book.
1 Like |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 9:32am On Mar 19, 2016 |
HIbreed: thank you jozzy,. Nice analogy. Do people derive joy by twisting the word of God, i find it disheartening.Revelation 22:18 I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, if any man shall add unto them, God shall add unto him the plagues which are written in this book: Revelation 22:19 and if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the tree of life, and out of the holy city, which are written in this book.
and when jehovah witness change john 1:1 the word was God "to" the word was a God, this is not bible twisting right ? 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by HIbreed(m): 9:46am On Mar 19, 2016 |
Jesus affirmed clearly that the Father(God) is superior to himself. This thread is baseless as its a digression from what the bible teaches. Now can you elaborate on what apostle Paul was trying to say here. Remain blessed
1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
1 Like |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by HIbreed(m): 10:03am On Mar 19, 2016 |
malvisguy212: and when jehovah witness change john 1:1 the word was God "to" the word was a God, this is not bible twisting right ? My Boss,am not a Jw,but i do attend their meetings just like i,ve worshipped with plethoras of churches but discovered they are the false prophets depicted by Jesus. The so called men of God are too materialistic to be leading the flock of God, Among numerous waters of churches i tested,i found peace in Jw though but i do not abide in all their doctrines like beleiving they are the only ones to be saved on the last day. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by Scholar8200(m): 11:22am On Mar 19, 2016 |
HIbreed: Jesus affirmed clearly that the Father(God) is superior to himself. This thread is baseless as its a digression from what the bible teaches. Now can you elaborate on what apostle Paul was trying to say here. Remain blessed
1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Bro, consider this passage and answer the following question: Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Acts 2:22 1. As per the passage you quoted, was that so before the creation of Adam? 2. The arrangement in that verse you quoted became so because the Word became flesh, the Second Adam, for redemptive purposes. Yes or No? 3. Phil 2 shows that the Son became flesh and took upon Him the form of a Servant, could this verse not have been speaking in that term? 4. The verse I quoted, would it be right to take that verse and either: a. Claim to have found Peter contradicting the Word; or b. Establish that Jesus was an ordinary Man approved by God just like Elijah, No more, no less? choose (a) or (b) or both and give reasons. 5. Why did the Father call (by the hand of Isaiah) the Son, the Mighty God? or David in Spirit called Him Lord? Or Isaiah saw the Lord (Pre-Incarnate Christ) and next Isaiah heard was,"who shall I send and who will go for Us" why not Me? 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 3:25pm On Mar 19, 2016 |
HIbreed: My Boss,am not a Jw,but i do attend their meetings just like i,ve worshipped with plethoras of churches but discovered they are the false prophets depicted by Jesus. The so called men of God are too materialistic to be leading the flock of God, Among numerous waters of churches i tested,i found peace in Jw though but i do not abide in all their doctrines like beleiving they are the only ones to be saved on the last day. you are not a jehovah witness but you find peace in jehovah witness. Well, who am I to judge ? God knows you more than you think. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:30am On Mar 31, 2016 |
malvisguy212: In the Gospels, a rich, young man approached Jesus and said to him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus gave the infamous reply,“Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.” This story is found in Matthew, Mark, and Luke; critics of Jesus’ claims to deity often use it as ammunition in their case for a non- divine Jesus. It seems, they argue, that Jesus is denying deity here by refusing the title ‘GOOD’ as it is something reserved solely for God. I contend that even a surface-level reading of this narrative does not even remotely support that conclusion. I don’t see how Jesus’ clarification of God’s nature is equivalent to him denying deity. This is akin to someone coming to me and calling me, “Dr. Paul.” I respond by saying, “Why do you call me doctor? No man can be a doctor, only he who holds a doctorate.”
I can either mean one of two things:
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I do not hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am not a doctor.
or…
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am a doctor.
By asking “Why do you call me doctor?”, am I denying my title? Of course not. I am simply clarifying what the title means. I am neither validating nor rejecting the title. In any case, I don’t have a doctorate (yet!) but the point still stands.
You can see how such reasoning is completely absurd, and yet this is what we see when critics use Jesus’ words in this passage to try to show his non deity. Having said all of that, let’s have another look at what Jesus said in this passage.
He only said two statements:
1. Why do you call me good? 2. No one is good except God
The only piece of information that Jesus gave is this: No one is good but God. There are 2 ways to understand his statement:
1. Only God is good. 2. I am not good. 3. Therefore, I am not God.
or
1. Only God is good. 2. I am good. 3. Therefore, I am God.
In this specific instance, from these words alone, Jesus does make known to us which of these he meant. It is both ignorant and presumptive of anyone to use this passage, alone, to argue for Jesus’ non-deity. Why should the first reading be the desirable one over the second reading? Jesus’ statement that only God is good does not, itself, tell us whether he was affirming or denying being God.
But if we keep reading, we find that Jesus sheds some light on what he meant. Jesus answers the man’s original question about obtaining eternal life with this“You know the commandments:
‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.'”
The man responds :”Teacher, I have kept all of these since I was a boy.”
Then Jesus finishes with: “One thing you lack. Go, sell everything you have then come, follow me.”
To summarize: In response to the man’s question, “What must I do to gain eternal life?”, Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. But which commandments does Jesus list? Notice that Jesus only lists the commandments that dealt with civil affairs. The Ten Commandments of Moses were divided into 2 parts: Laws on dealing with God and Laws on dealing with others. Respectively, these were the moral and civil laws. Jesus names the civil law for the young man and the young man responds like any good Jew would, These I have kept since I was young.” The man was doing great on keeping the civil law, but not so much with the moral law. Instead of then quoting the first four commandments to the young man,the commandments that dealt with man’s relationship with God, Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! And it gives us an answer to our initial dilemma. Did Jesus deny or affirm his deity in asking, “Why do you call me good?” I think the answer is clear in light of the rest of that conversation with the young man. Jesus equated following himself with keeping the moral law and obeying the commandments that governed man’s relationship with God. Thus, in bringing up this passage as ammunition for a non-divine Jesus, the critic shoots himself in the foot by bringing to the table a text in which Jesus clearly claims deity.
|
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 6:31am On May 30, 2016 |
malvisguy212: Jesus christ is a man who was possessed by God Himself, that is why He say "I and the Father are ONE" why dint you quote the rest of John 14?
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know[b] my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” 8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.” 9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 11:30am On Jun 26, 2016 |
malvisguy212: Jesus, his human nature, call God His father on many occasions. What did Jesus mean when He say "I and the father are ONE? " further more, what did He means in this conversation with Philip; John 14. 9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority.
I want you to carefully notice the last statement "The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority" what does this indicate? Jesus did not speak on His own authority, why ? Because it was the Father(God) who dwell in Him speak. (just like A demon possessed man do not speak on his own authority) |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 6:53am On Jul 31, 2016 |
malvisguy212: Surah 2:158: “Lo! (the mountains) As-
Safa and Al-Marwah are among the
indications of Allah. It is therefore no
sin for him who is on pilgrimage to
the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to
go around them ( AS THE PAGAN CUSTOM IS ).” (Pickthall) |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 4:42am On Feb 05, 2017 |
malvisguy212: In the Gospels, a rich, young man approached Jesus and said to him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus gave the infamous reply,“Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.” This story is found in Matthew, Mark, and Luke; critics of Jesus’ claims to deity often use it as ammunition in their case for a non- divine Jesus. It seems, they argue, that Jesus is denying deity here by refusing the title ‘GOOD’ as it is something reserved solely for God. I contend that even a surface-level reading of this narrative does not even remotely support that conclusion. I don’t see how Jesus’ clarification of God’s nature is equivalent to him denying deity. This is akin to someone coming to me and calling me, “Dr. Paul.” I respond by saying, “Why do you call me doctor? No man can be a doctor, only he who holds a doctorate.”
I can either mean one of two things:
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I do not hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am not a doctor.
or…
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am a doctor.
By asking “Why do you call me doctor?”, am I denying my title? Of course not. I am simply clarifying what the title means. I am neither validating nor rejecting the title. In any case, I don’t have a doctorate (yet!) but the point still stands.
You can see how such reasoning is completely absurd, and yet this is what we see when critics use Jesus’ words in this passage to try to show his non deity. Having said all of that, let’s have another look at what Jesus said in this passage.
He only said two statements:
1. Why do you call me good? 2. No one is good except God
The only piece of information that Jesus gave is this: No one is good but God. There are 2 ways to understand his statement:
1. Only God is good. 2. I am not good. 3. Therefore, I am not God.
or
1. Only God is good. 2. I am good. 3. Therefore, I am God.
In this specific instance, from these words alone, Jesus does make known to us which of these he meant. It is both ignorant and presumptive of anyone to use this passage, alone, to argue for Jesus’ non-deity. Why should the first reading be the desirable one over the second reading? Jesus’ statement that only God is good does not, itself, tell us whether he was affirming or denying being God.
But if we keep reading, we find that Jesus sheds some light on what he meant. Jesus answers the man’s original question about obtaining eternal life with this“You know the commandments:
‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.'”
The man responds :”Teacher, I have kept all of these since I was a boy.”
Then Jesus finishes with: “One thing you lack. Go, sell everything you have then come, follow me.”
To summarize: In response to the man’s question, “What must I do to gain eternal life?”, Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. But which commandments does Jesus list? Notice that Jesus only lists the commandments that dealt with civil affairs. The Ten Commandments of Moses were divided into 2 parts: Laws on dealing with God and Laws on dealing with others. Respectively, these were the moral and civil laws. Jesus names the civil law for the young man and the young man responds like any good Jew would, These I have kept since I was young.” The man was doing great on keeping the civil law, but not so much with the moral law. Instead of then quoting the first four commandments to the young man,the commandments that dealt with man’s relationship with God, Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! And it gives us an answer to our initial dilemma. Did Jesus deny or affirm his deity in asking, “Why do you call me good?” I think the answer is clear in light of the rest of that conversation with the young man. Jesus equated following himself with keeping the moral law and obeying the commandments that governed man’s relationship with God. Thus, in bringing up this passage as ammunition for a non-divine Jesus, the critic shoots himself in the foot by bringing to the table a text in which Jesus clearly claims deity.
|
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 8:30am On Mar 26, 2017 |
malvisguy212: In the Gospels, a rich, young man approached Jesus and said to him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus gave the infamous reply,“Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.” This story is found in Matthew, Mark, and Luke; critics of Jesus’ claims to deity often use it as ammunition in their case for a non- divine Jesus. It seems, they argue, that Jesus is denying deity here by refusing the title ‘GOOD’ as it is something reserved solely for God. I contend that even a surface-level reading of this narrative does not even remotely support that conclusion. I don’t see how Jesus’ clarification of God’s nature is equivalent to him denying deity. This is akin to someone coming to me and calling me, “Dr. Paul.” I respond by saying, “Why do you call me doctor? No man can be a doctor, only he who holds a doctorate.”
I can either mean one of two things:
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I do not hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am not a doctor.
or…
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am a doctor.
By asking “Why do you call me doctor?”, am I denying my title? Of course not. I am simply clarifying what the title means. I am neither validating nor rejecting the title. In any case, I don’t have a doctorate (yet!) but the point still stands.
You can see how such reasoning is completely absurd, and yet this is what we see when critics use Jesus’ words in this passage to try to show his non deity. Having said all of that, let’s have another look at what Jesus said in this passage.
He only said two statements:
1. Why do you call me good? 2. No one is good except God
The only piece of information that Jesus gave is this: No one is good but God. There are 2 ways to understand his statement:
1. Only God is good. 2. I am not good. 3. Therefore, I am not God.
or
1. Only God is good. 2. I am good. 3. Therefore, I am God.
In this specific instance, from these words alone, Jesus does make known to us which of these he meant. It is both ignorant and presumptive of anyone to use this passage, alone, to argue for Jesus’ non-deity. Why should the first reading be the desirable one over the second reading? Jesus’ statement that only God is good does not, itself, tell us whether he was affirming or denying being God.
But if we keep reading, we find that Jesus sheds some light on what he meant. Jesus answers the man’s original question about obtaining eternal life with this“You know the commandments:
‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.'”
The man responds :”Teacher, I have kept all of these since I was a boy.”
Then Jesus finishes with: “One thing you lack. Go, sell everything you have then come, follow me.”
To summarize: In response to the man’s question, “What must I do to gain eternal life?”, Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. But which commandments does Jesus list? Notice that Jesus only lists the commandments that dealt with civil affairs. The Ten Commandments of Moses were divided into 2 parts: Laws on dealing with God and Laws on dealing with others. Respectively, these were the moral and civil laws. Jesus names the civil law for the young man and the young man responds like any good Jew would, These I have kept since I was young.” The man was doing great on keeping the civil law, but not so much with the moral law. Instead of then quoting the first four commandments to the young man,the commandments that dealt with man’s relationship with God, Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! And it gives us an answer to our initial dilemma. Did Jesus deny or affirm his deity in asking, “Why do you call me good?” I think the answer is clear in light of the rest of that conversation with the young man. Jesus equated following himself with keeping the moral law and obeying the commandments that governed man’s relationship with God. Thus, in bringing up this passage as ammunition for a non-divine Jesus, the critic shoots himself in the foot by bringing to the table a text in which Jesus clearly claims deity.
hellow |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 9:02am On Feb 21, 2018 |
malvisguy212:
1. Jesus has two natures, He is God
and man.
2. Each nature is full and complete ,
He is fully God and fully man.
3. Each nature remains distinct.
4. Christ is only one Person.
5. Things that are true of only one
nature are nonetheless true of the
Person of Christ.
Jesus is a man. A man who was possessed by God. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 11:05pm On May 31, 2018 |
malvisguy212: Jesus christ is a man who was possessed by God Himself, that is why He say "I and the Father are ONE" why dint you quote the rest of John 14?
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know[b] my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” 8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.” 9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:46am On Mar 10, 2019 |
malvisguy212: In the Gospels, a rich, young man approached Jesus and said to him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus gave the infamous reply,“Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.” This story is found in Matthew, Mark, and Luke; critics of Jesus’ claims to deity often use it as ammunition in their case for a non- divine Jesus. It seems, they argue, that Jesus is denying deity here by refusing the title ‘GOOD’ as it is something reserved solely for God. I contend that even a surface-level reading of this narrative does not even remotely support that conclusion. I don’t see how Jesus’ clarification of God’s nature is equivalent to him denying deity. This is akin to someone coming to me and calling me, “Dr. Paul.” I respond by saying, “Why do you call me doctor? No man can be a doctor, only he who holds a doctorate.”
I can either mean one of two things:
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I do not hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am not a doctor.
or…
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am a doctor.
By asking “Why do you call me doctor?”, am I denying my title? Of course not. I am simply clarifying what the title means. I am neither validating nor rejecting the title. In any case, I don’t have a doctorate (yet!) but the point still stands.
You can see how such reasoning is completely absurd, and yet this is what we see when critics use Jesus’ words in this passage to try to show his non deity. Having said all of that, let’s have another look at what Jesus said in this passage.
He only said two statements:
1. Why do you call me good? 2. No one is good except God
The only piece of information that Jesus gave is this: No one is good but God. There are 2 ways to understand his statement:
1. Only God is good. 2. I am not good. 3. Therefore, I am not God.
or
1. Only God is good. 2. I am good. 3. Therefore, I am God.
In this specific instance, from these words alone, Jesus does make known to us which of these he meant. It is both ignorant and presumptive of anyone to use this passage, alone, to argue for Jesus’ non-deity. Why should the first reading be the desirable one over the second reading? Jesus’ statement that only God is good does not, itself, tell us whether he was affirming or denying being God.
But if we keep reading, we find that Jesus sheds some light on what he meant. Jesus answers the man’s original question about obtaining eternal life with this“You know the commandments:
‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.'”
The man responds :”Teacher, I have kept all of these since I was a boy.”
Then Jesus finishes with: “One thing you lack. Go, sell everything you have then come, follow me.”
To summarize: In response to the man’s question, “What must I do to gain eternal life?”, Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. But which commandments does Jesus list? Notice that Jesus only lists the commandments that dealt with civil affairs. The Ten Commandments of Moses were divided into 2 parts: Laws on dealing with God and Laws on dealing with others. Respectively, these were the moral and civil laws. Jesus names the civil law for the young man and the young man responds like any good Jew would, These I have kept since I was young.” The man was doing great on keeping the civil law, but not so much with the moral law. Instead of then quoting the first four commandments to the young man,the commandments that dealt with man’s relationship with God, Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! And it gives us an answer to our initial dilemma. Did Jesus deny or affirm his deity in asking, “Why do you call me good?” I think the answer is clear in light of the rest of that conversation with the young man. Jesus equated following himself with keeping the moral law and obeying the commandments that governed man’s relationship with God. Thus, in bringing up this passage as ammunition for a non-divine Jesus, the critic shoots himself in the foot by bringing to the table a text in which Jesus clearly claims deity.
|
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:13am On Jul 14, 2019 |
malvisguy212: In the Gospels, a rich, young man approached Jesus and said to him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus gave the infamous reply,“Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.” This story is found in Matthew, Mark, and Luke; critics of Jesus’ claims to deity often use it as ammunition in their case for a non- divine Jesus. It seems, they argue, that Jesus is denying deity here by refusing the title ‘GOOD’ as it is something reserved solely for God. I contend that even a surface-level reading of this narrative does not even remotely support that conclusion. I don’t see how Jesus’ clarification of God’s nature is equivalent to him denying deity. This is akin to someone coming to me and calling me, “Dr. Paul.” I respond by saying, “Why do you call me doctor? No man can be a doctor, only he who holds a doctorate.”
I can either mean one of two things:
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I do not hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am not a doctor.
or…
1. No one can be a doctor unless he holds a doctorate. 2. I hold a doctorate. 3. Therefore, I am a doctor.
By asking “Why do you call me doctor?”, am I denying my title? Of course not. I am simply clarifying what the title means. I am neither validating nor rejecting the title. In any case, I don’t have a doctorate (yet!) but the point still stands.
You can see how such reasoning is completely absurd, and yet this is what we see when critics use Jesus’ words in this passage to try to show his non deity. Having said all of that, let’s have another look at what Jesus said in this passage.
He only said two statements:
1. Why do you call me good? 2. No one is good except God
The only piece of information that Jesus gave is this: No one is good but God. There are 2 ways to understand his statement:
1. Only God is good. 2. I am not good. 3. Therefore, I am not God.
or
1. Only God is good. 2. I am good. 3. Therefore, I am God.
In this specific instance, from these words alone, Jesus does make known to us which of these he meant. It is both ignorant and presumptive of anyone to use this passage, alone, to argue for Jesus’ non-deity. Why should the first reading be the desirable one over the second reading? Jesus’ statement that only God is good does not, itself, tell us whether he was affirming or denying being God.
But if we keep reading, we find that Jesus sheds some light on what he meant. Jesus answers the man’s original question about obtaining eternal life with this“You know the commandments:
‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.'”
The man responds :”Teacher, I have kept all of these since I was a boy.”
Then Jesus finishes with: “One thing you lack. Go, sell everything you have then come, follow me.”
To summarize: In response to the man’s question, “What must I do to gain eternal life?”, Jesus responds by telling him to follow the commandments. But which commandments does Jesus list? Notice that Jesus only lists the commandments that dealt with civil affairs. The Ten Commandments of Moses were divided into 2 parts: Laws on dealing with God and Laws on dealing with others. Respectively, these were the moral and civil laws. Jesus names the civil law for the young man and the young man responds like any good Jew would, These I have kept since I was young.” The man was doing great on keeping the civil law, but not so much with the moral law. Instead of then quoting the first four commandments to the young man,the commandments that dealt with man’s relationship with God, Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! And it gives us an answer to our initial dilemma. Did Jesus deny or affirm his deity in asking, “Why do you call me good?” I think the answer is clear in light of the rest of that conversation with the young man. Jesus equated following himself with keeping the moral law and obeying the commandments that governed man’s relationship with God. Thus, in bringing up this passage as ammunition for a non-divine Jesus, the critic shoots himself in the foot by bringing to the table a text in which Jesus clearly claims deity.
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Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 7:36am On Aug 04, 2019 |
malvisguy212: Jesus christ is a man who was possessed by God Himself, that is why He say "I and the Father are ONE" why dint you quote the rest of John 14?
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know[b] my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” 8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.” 9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by Janosky: 10:19am On Aug 04, 2019 |
[quote author=malvisguy212 post=80920111][/quote]
"malvisguy212 : Jesus christ is a man who was possessed by God Himself, that is why He say "I and the Father are ONE" (1) If Malvisguy212 "possessed" someone, therefore Malvis & his possessed are one, in what sense? (2) *** Malvis,when & where did God "possessed" Jesus?
*3) Is the Father in you,Malvisguy212? If the Father is in you,"living in Malvisguy212" (John14:9,11), what does that imply?
(4) John14:10 "Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority."
In whose authority? |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by Janosky: 10:38am On Aug 04, 2019 |
malvisguy212: a
"....Jesus told the young man, “Sell your
possessions and follow me.” In other
words, “Your god is your money. Get
rid
of that and follow me.” Jesus is
equating obeying the moral law with following
himself. The manner in which men can
obtain eternal life is by getting rid of
the
false gods in their lives and following
Jesus , replacing them with him!
This claim is monumental! "
*** Malvisguy, whose message/doctrine is Jesus Christ teaching that young man?
You mean God sent himself?
John7:16. 3:16,36. 12:49,50. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by malvisguy212: 9:08am On Oct 27, 2019 |
Janosky:
"....Jesus told the young man, “Sell your possessions and follow me.” In other words, “Your god is your money. Get rid of that and follow me.” Jesus is equating obeying the moral law with following himself. The manner in which men can obtain eternal life is by getting rid of the false gods in their lives and following Jesus , replacing them with him! This claim is monumental! "
*** Malvisguy, whose message/doctrine is Jesus Christ teaching that young man?
You mean God sent himself? John7:16. 3:16,36. 12:49,50. shallow minded man. |
Re: Why Do You Call Me Good? Analyze. by Janosky: 11:47am On Oct 27, 2019 |
malvisguy212: shallow minded man. John 12:49,50, your "God" can not think for himself.... ... John7:16 is there in your Bible..... John7:16, did God send himself? Whose message did your "God" teach? You are not a shallow man, malvisguy212 answer both questions and stop deceiving yourself. |