If there is an afterlife for humans, then there should be an afterlife for chimps, dinosaurs, radiolarians, trilobites, fungi, viruses and even bacteria.

McSterling:
If there is an afterlife for humans, then there should be an afterlife for chimps, dinosaurs, radiolarians, trilobites, fungi, viruses and even bacteria.

spot-on. Why humans price their existence as more meaningful and deserving of an unlimited after life than the animals is beyond an average freethinker,you can be gored by a bull or lion in a fraction of a second without the animal feeling guilty of a crime. Our sense of smell and eyesight is not better than most animals and countless of natures gift they posses that dwarfs ours is unlimited.We are the product of the universe,being a human or animal,plant or organism does not give one an edge than the other,it is different form of existence.

HIbreed:
spot-on. Why humans price their existence as more meaningful and deserving of an unlimited after life than the animals is beyond an average freethinker,you can be gored by a bull or lion in a fraction of a second without the animal feeling guilty of a crime. Our sense of smell and eyesight is not better than most animals and countless of natures gift they posses that dwarfs ours is unlimited.We are the product of the universe,being a human or animal,plant or organism does not give one an edge than the other,it is different form of existence.

A nairalander once asked me a question on BBM about life and meaning, he said

"Why is it that when a man kills a chimpanzee, it is not a crime but when a man kills another man it is a big problem, could it be humans are more valuable?"

my answer was same as i have said here before

[b]Value and meaning is determined by the observer and is subjective to distinct minds that conceives it.

In a Chimpanzee park, if a Chimpanzee kills another Chimpanzee it is a big problem but if a chimpanzee kills a human, it not a problem because they have no value for a human.

does this mean Chimpanzees are more valuable?

No.

Value is subjective..

To the Chimps their own existence is more valuable and meaningful that they find it ok to murder us without a second thought or remorse.

Just as to us our own existence is more valuable and meaningful and we can also kill a chimp and there is no problem.

so which is more valuable since both holds his existence more?

this is just natural "survival instinct" there is no point or goal to what nature does in totality.
(An asteroid can crash right into New York without minding the people living there)

A chimp would value a banana more than gold while the reverse holds true for a man.

So value is always dependent on the perception of the mind that conceives it. ..[/b]

Their delusion stems from that ego that their own perception is the bench mark for measuring value and not that of every other.

that is ego speaking not reality!!!

Immorttal:
The Bible taught you that right? Can you put your sense of discernment at work in place of passionate reliance in a book.

Your sense of discernment should show you that life is meaningless without God and Divine justice and immortality. One proof of God is that he is behind the very rationalé of living.

I'll reply Johnny in a bit, but I've had conversations like this before, and if you're honest with yourself you realize that your casting aside God will only with a futile, accidental and meaningless life.

Holding yourself to atheistic beliefs only leave you empty, suicidal, leaves grand atheists in a state of self gratification, insanity.

Joshthefirst:
Your sense of discernment should show you that life is meaningless without God and Divine justice and immortality. One proof of God is that he is behind the very rationalé of living.

I'll reply Johnny in a bit, but I've had conversations like this before, and if you're honest with yourself you realize that your casting aside God will only with a futile, accidental and meaningless life.

No i think you are the one that need to be honest with yourself and realize that it is a sad pitiable and bleak existence to hold a belief that without something/someone your life is meaningless and lacks point.

it deserves pity

You are the person who gives meaning and point to your life in coincide with your choice...

Since your own meaning and point is dependent on something/someone else, then it is a sad pitiable existence

Holding yourself to atheistic beliefs only leave you empty, suicidal, leaves grand atheists in a state of self gratification, insanity.

Pious deception and cognitive dissonance is at play again, actually the reverse is the case.

Holding a belief of a better paradise after here leaves you more bleak, makes this earth negligible and makes one more suicidal as it has been evidently shown in the millions of examples around where Such persons sacrifice themselves to attain a better place , as we have seen many times in staunch Christian/Muslim adherent, who sacrifice themselves for their beliefs because they think they are heading to a better place

That really is the complete mark of unparalleled insanity and self degradation

stop the lies.

There is more to life than the ropes of your beliefs, learn to see a life beyond that

UyiIredia:
@frank317: Nice crap you have up there. It's nice but it's still crap.

Thanks... Lol @ nice crap

HIbreed:
spot-on. Why humans price their existence as more meaningful and deserving of an unlimited after life than the animals is beyond an average freethinker,you can be gored by a bull or lion in a fraction of a second without the animal feeling guilty of a crime. Our sense of smell and eyesight is not better than most animals and countless of natures gift they posses that dwarfs ours is unlimited.We are the product of the universe,being a human or animal,plant or organism does not give one an edge than the other,it is different form of existence.

Very simple and on point.how millions of people fail to understand this is what I am yet to understand

johnydon22:


As i said earlier, "meaning" is a child of "human mind" there is no direction or goal to natural manifestations.

So the point of "life" or "existence" how ever you put always will be a child of human mind, a human idea.

Your permission was not asked for before things became as there are, so obviously your idea of point, meaning is barely as relevant as you are in the cosmos.

Society is a collection of human interactions so it's meaning and point rest sorely in the definition of humans.

So what is your minds definition of purpose and meaning as an atheist? And how does this transcend your accidental existence and the futile short meaningless of your life?

I gave a good example with a plate of food, that a plate of food will eventually finish does not limit it's worth or value (which also are human ideas).

following this line of thought you probably should not eat that food at all since it eventually finishes.

the worth is not in the limit as a matter of fact limit ensures value (Gold is held higher than iron because it is of more limited deposition than iron)

So your mention of human discipline and asking for their point, their point lies within the "human society where in they are necessary"

the point in our varying professions as defined by human society is in the NOW of our existence not later.

the point of me being an athlete is in this Now if it was unneeded in the human society you wouldn't bother be one.

so the point of it is not in the assumptions of another life but in the eventuality of the one you have and where you are.

One who recognizes the limit of life and it's rare chance to me is the one that will value life more.

Now you talk about life being a 'rare chance'. Its obvious you're not being logical at all.

Does your life have intrinsic value and worth? As an atheist, you'd say no. So how do you value a life that is no greater life than that of a fly or goat? What's the point of your hard work when and art and athleticism when your life and the collective life of humanity is futile and has no real meaning or worth?

Only one who thinks and wishes for something greater will dispose the smaller, a typical example is the Extremist suicide bombers or Staunch religious adherents who would rather die than relinquish their beliefs all the while expecting a better place and reward.

That shows that belief in a better life than this actually is the idea can diminishes the meaning of life to the human mind (since meaning is a human idea)

No. Only one who looks for a better life will make the most of this one to ensure it. The suicide bomber is not a viable example as it is misplaced, the staunch religious adherent would rather die and wake to a glorious eternal future rather than relinquish his belief to live a purposeless and accidental existence that has no meaning or worth and is destined for annihilation.

I was hoping that i be shown how it was incorrect but i only get an emotional outpour.

Go through it again

You go through my response and show me how it was an emotional outpour. Smh.

[b] The assumption of an eternal life is actually the idea that makes this life
meaningless.

An unending life makes 100years look like nothing, how would one value
1naira when he thinks there is $100,000,000 waiting for him in an account.
so too can one not value the 100, 80 or less years of human existence in
contrast to 10000000000000000....years of a fantasy afterlife.

Unfortunately your flawed logic does not apply to the reality of human life and expectation. The real truth is that the power of an endless life is what makes life worth it. Look at those with too much money, the ones who throw it away in self gratification are those that believe you only live once. You cannot apply diminishing returns to human life. Concepts of the afterlife are not concepts of your very own purposeless and meaningless existence. We look to an eternity with meaning and purpose also. And a life of meaning and purpose is valued. An eternal life is not an eternity of accidental worthless nothing less for those who believe it.

So the "meaning" of life lies within the limits of life and that "meaning" is
rubbished by the concept of another unending life waiting somewhere else.[/b]

it so degrades the worth of the present life to a human mind that they willingly throw this life away in a chase and hope of getting another.

Once again you say 'throw this life away' as if this life has any meaning or worth to you. Lol.

For you, who believes life is an accidental purposeless existence, eternal life might be hell. But for those who believe in purpose and meaning, eternity would be endless advancement and peace and release from suffering.

This has been shown to be a dangerous fantasy in the examples of extremists who would throw this one chance at life away in a wishful hope of getting a better eternal one in paradise.

Only someone who holds such belief will find his life and existence so deplorable that is can be ended without a second thought because a glorious everlasting paradise awaits.

As it has been show nobody who think they have $1000000000 will ever value they #1 they actually have..

Once again, you contradict your atheistic yourself in stating that while our lives are no better than mosquitoes or flies they have some value. Do you believe life has value or not? How can an accidental futile existence have value?

Again, it is only when you believe in value and purpose in life than an eternal life of value and purpose will make sense. You can't make an unending life make sense to a man who believes in futility. Thats like condemning him to hell.

the sparks and glories of the paradise dwarfs that of the present world that people see this as doomed, marked for end, meaningless and wasteful.

such belief makes people view this life as meaningless and deplorable

Your labours in this life is for this life, if there are no "Money" in human societal dealings you wouldn't labour for one.

if there was no need for food you wouldn't labour for food, your labours in life are as a result of the needs of this life.

it is an abject greed to hope for double reward for the effects of actions carried out for your own needs.



One truth stands out that no matter how much you try to twist a simply fact and believe that twist, it never ceases to be Fact

Unfortunately as I have shown your fact is actually illogical nonsense.

What's the point of a labour in life when all including labour is futile? Your life is not worth more than a dead chicken, so what's the point of living?

Look at how the bold contradicts your position again. Or do you believe this life has any real meaning rather than what we make of it? Which is in fact meaningless?

You are an organism, a manifestation of biological interactions, you have no greater consciousness but rather greater Intellect as judged by human criteria.

Tell this to yourself and ask yourself how this statement makes your life more worthwhile than a mosquito's. This thinking takes meaning out of everything, especially this life.

a bird has the ability to build a nest so precisely, it requires a calculative mind, intellect and a good knowledge of geometry.

Every specie with the utilization of a nervous system has a "mind" only differs in their level of application as defined by need and Mechanisations.

So "Mind" changes nothing since all can boast of one.

Your emotions are no different from what every other specie out there feels.



Very greedy and selfish that you are not done with what you have already
wishing and clamoring for an unlimited one.



Here "Point" as i have mentioned before is firmly rooted as a product of human mind.. so my point of life always will be of my own idea and will not hold sway for every other specie out there.

None ever asked to be born neither will any ever be asked to be

My point of life as i have found myself in a human society is to blend as part of the society i have found myself in.

Partake in everything life provides, savor the joy, pain, tears, needs, adventure and social bond, family, friendship..

the point is as i have found myself in a life i didn't ask for, i'd ensure i am happy with in while it lasts

This truth holds sway for me as a child of my own idea and a point birthed from my own perception

A mosquito exist just as i do, so too does a tree saying which is more important will be on whose ground ?

Mine?

I am sure a mosquito will also show otherwise, it prizes it's own life more than yours that is why it doesn't mind hosting on you for survival even if it means you will die.

-Oh what makes me continue with this existence? its very simply, i didn't ask for it, i found myself in it and i found it very intriguing and interesting and i'd love to see it as much i can..

Family, social bonds, sex, study, food, science, social interactions, adventures, craze, truth, awe of things that are to be known and seen millions of reasons why i love to stay alive, lots of things that i have through the connections of their dots derived a meaning to my own life.
.................................

Unfortunately your life remains pointless, as your reason for living denotes you do not even believe your existence is actually accidental, and your art meaningless, and your study purposeless and human advancement ultimately futile. Do you believe life has intrinsic worth or value?

You should take your belief to its logical end and context, so you do not write these long contradictory posts for nothing.

so now my own questions

-Since there is a better place waiting for you infinite times greater and better than here, what exactly are you still doing here? why not go there immediately without delay?

the quality of my eventual eternal life is determined by this one. And I want to fulfil the purpose of this life before I enter the next.
Everyone who ends this life considers it to have no answers and to be without purpose for him. Is that not what you believe? Why not end this meaningless existence now? Or end it after indulging in meaningless self gratification for a few years?

- why waste your time over earthly wants since they end in earth and you transcend to a realm of needlessness and satisfaction.

As I have said, mh time on earth is not a waste, as I have [b]purpose]/b], neither will my life in eternity be meaningless, because of same purpose. Purpose gives worth to life's actions, and makes eternity worth living for and sacrifice and labour worth it. What is your purpose and how does it transcend your meaningless accidental existence?

-Is your own existence different from others and in what way is it judged and by whose standards?

-is your existence more meaningful than that of a star? a planet or asteroid out there or some small green plant in your backyard?

How?

-To what extent would life on earth or the universe have lasted before it becomes meaningful?

My existence is worthwhile because I have purpose given to me by my creator.

I have more value than a plant of course, I am a being with mind and self awareness.

Your last question doesn't make any sense as I believe life already has meaning, while you think you don't.

Time doesn't give life meaning, purpose does.

What is your purpose? If given an opportunity for eternal life would you not reach out anxiously to grab it?

johnydon22:


No i think you are the one that need to be honest with yourself and realize that it is a sad pitiable and bleak existence to hold a belief that without something/someone your life is meaningless and lacks point.

it deserves pity

You are the person who gives meaning and point to your life in coincide with your choice...

Since your own meaning and point is dependent on something/someone else, then it is a sad pitiable existence



Pious deception and cognitive dissonance is at play again, actually the reverse is the case.

Holding a belief of a better paradise after here leaves you more bleak, makes this earth negligible and makes one more suicidal as it has been evidently shown in the millions of examples around where Such persons sacrifice themselves to attain a better place , as we have seen many times in staunch Christian/Muslim adherent, who sacrifice themselves for their beliefs because they think they are heading to a better place

That really is the complete mark of unparalleled insanity and self degradation

stop the lies.

There is more to life than the ropes of your beliefs, learn to see a life beyond that

This is quite foolish and contradictory if you as usual.

What meaning is there in an accidental worthless existence?

Have you heard of Foucault and Nietzsche and hemmingway?

One died of self gratification, the others of insanity and suicide. Chief atheists who came to real terms with the implications of their atheism.

You are the one who deserves pity, living a hopeless and futile existence

Joshthefirst:
Your sense of discernment should show you that life is meaningless without God and Divine justice and immortality. One proof of God is that he is behind the very rationalé of living.

I'll reply Johnny in a bit, but I've had conversations like this before, and if you're honest with yourself you realize that your casting aside God will only with a futile, accidental and meaningless life.

Holding yourself to atheistic beliefs only leave you empty, suicidal, leaves grand atheists in a state of self gratification, insanity.

Oh what a very dishonest post

frank317:

Oh what a very dishonest post

lolzz. It looks like you and johny need schooling. You do not know the implication of your atheistic beliefs or their conclusions.

we stray through an
infinite nothing, with no up or down left
Lanterns must be lit in the morning hours and sacred games
invented to take the place of religious ceremony.
Finally, a universal madness would break
out when the truth of what mankind had done in
killing God dawned on us.

Friedrich Nietzsche (Nietzsche himself spent
the last thirteen years of his life in the darkness of
insanity, while his godly mother watched over him
by his bedside.)


I am a puny part of the great whole.
Yes; but all animals condemned to live,
All sentient things, born by the same stern law,
Suffer like me, and like me also die.
The vulture fastens on his timid prey,
And stabs with bloody beak the quivering limbs:
All’s well, it seems, for it. But in a while
An eagle tears the vulture into shreds;
The eagle is transfixed by shaft of man;
The man, prone in the dust of battlefield,
Mingling his blood with dying fellowmen,
Becomes
in turn the food of ravenous birds.
Thus the whole world in every member groans:
All born for torment and for mutual death.
And o’er this ghastly chaos you would say
The ills of each make up the good of all!
What blessedness! And as, with quaking voice,
Mortal and pitiful, ye cry, “All’s well,”
The universe belies you, and your heart
Refutes a hundred times your mind’s conceit. . . .
What is the verdict of the vastest mind?
Silence: the book of fate is closed to us
Man is a stranger to his own research;
He knows not whence he comes, nor whither goes.
Tormented atoms in a bed of mud,
Devoured by death, a mockery of fate.

Voltaire.

I pity every atheist I meet, especially those who fancy themselves cool and swag and free, like johny.

frank317:


Very simple and on point.how millions of people fail to understand this is what I am yet to understand

Maybe you should consider the possibility that something may be wrong with you.

Joshthefirst:

So what is your minds definition of purpose and meaning as an atheist? And how does this transcend your accidental existence and the futile short meaningless of your life?

The childish card of cognitive dissonance does not help your case, so the circular assertions and repetitions will only make your arguments weaker.

this have been answered time and again.

My point and meaning of life as i have found myself in a human society is to blend as
part of the society i have found myself in.

Partake in everything life provides, savor the joy, pain, tears, needs, adventure and social bond, family, friendship..

the point is as i have found myself in a life i didn't ask for, i'd ensure i am happy with in while it lasts

This truth holds sway for me as a child of my own idea and a point birthed from my own perception.

An exciting meaning roped within the pleasures and eventuality of Now and here . a super reality devoid of wishful fantasy and wishful delusions.

I particularly love the bolded, a testimony of what a rare chance life is and only one who recognizes that can value life and the one but intriguing chance it provides.

There were more than 2million sperm cells at the moment of conception and each sperm cell would have resulted into a distinct individual, not considering maternal factor, mortality.

the chances of your existence is up to 1:5,000,000 when grand parent values are added and almost amounts to 0 when it goes further than 10 generations.

Yet you are here.

the lucky sperm cell out of 2,000,000.. It is an outstanding chance that you are here today and because you are up to 2,000,000 aren't.

that is an explosive reality, that you will die shows you are the lucky one because it means you got to live at all.

that 2,000,000 will never die cus they never got to exist. So make the rare chance count not chase greedily after another..

Now you talk about life being a 'rare chance'. Its obvious you're not being logical at all.

Does your life have intrinsic value and worth? As an atheist, you'd say no. So how do you value a life that is no greater life than that of a fly or goat? What's the point of your hard work when and art and athleticism when your life and the collective life of humanity is futile and has no real meaning or worth?

Your futile attempt at comprehension makes you quite slow at learning. Everything in nature is not a plan of nature, nature has no good or bad plan or a value better than the other.

You are a child of nature, a living breathing organism like every other.

The value or worth of your life is subjective to your own perspective, a goat certainly sees his life worth more than yours.

A tiny mosquito will murder you just to survive even though it's just an existence of a few days yet it values it more than yours of about 80 or 90.

Value remains a subjective child of a mind and differs from every mind.

I am an athlete because it is a vital aspect of Human sociology in an existence defined by humanity and societal interactions.

Many may derived meaning from isolation, every meaning is subjective to the conceiver.

No. Only one who looks for a better life will make the most of this one to ensure it. The suicide bomber is not a viable example as it is misplaced, the staunch religious adherent would rather die and wake to a glorious eternal future rather than relinquish his belief to live a purposeless and accidental existence that has no meaning or worth and is destined for annihilation.

Is this another way of twisting it? it still means same thing they throw this life away in a bid to ensure a better one.

exactly what i said, oh thanks for putting it better

The truth is so glaring and evidential.

You go through my response and show me how it was an emotional outpour. Smh.

So glaring

Unfortunately your flawed logic does not apply to the reality of human life and expectation. The real truth is that the power of an endless life is what makes life worth it. Look at those with too much money, the ones who throw it away in self gratification are those that believe you only live once. You cannot apply diminishing returns to human life. Concepts of the afterlife are not concepts of your very own purposeless and meaningless existence. We look to an eternity with meaning and purpose also. And a life of meaning and purpose is valued. An eternal life is not an eternity of accidental worthless nothing less for those who believe it.

Such an infantile attempt, the analogy not only applies but is seen in every aspect of human life and expectation.

Endless life makes a short one very negligible and deplorable, makes it seem worthless and bleak to the mind who holds such lunacy.

A complete denial of reality to maintain people who think they have $100,000,000 sees #1 as anything.

it doesn't even measure up to the margin of the concept of the afterlife fantasy and the present life.

Bolded is so laughable, the ones who do not spend their money do they believe they are taking it to the afterlife?

the value of an existence is not in it's limitlessness, rather in the eventuality of it's present existence which is the most important of all.

No you do not look to eternity for meaning and purpose, you only lack meaning and purpose for this one cus only someone who lacks one would look at something else independent of what he has for meaning and purpose.

Your desperate greedy clutch at the fantasy of an unlimited second life in order to derive meaning shows you are the one who cannot find value and meaning in your own self or in what you have.

That is a meaningless earthly life and i wonder why you are not yet ready to go over to the realm of bliss and purpose but clings to this one that is meaningless and pointless cus it is fleeting and diminishing.

Once again you say 'throw this life away' as if this life has any meaning or worth to you. Lol.

For you, who believes life is an accidental purposeless existence, eternal life might be hell. But for those who believe in purpose and meaning, eternity would be endless advancement and peace and release from suffering.

And we go at it again, people often like dragging others down their mess. I am the one who recognizes a rare chance life is and only such a person values such more ..

You are the only person who thinks you will pick up an unlimited life after this limited one therefore relegates the limited to a state of worthlessness.

a distortion of value evidently since we know RARE things earn more values in the human mind than Common thing.

I wonder if it is i who see life as extremely rare a chance and you who think it's something you just pick up another limitless after this who values life more ..lmao

Once again, you contradict your atheistic yourself in stating that while our lives are no better than mosquitoes or flies they have some value. Do you believe life has value or not? How can an accidental futile existence have value?

You know sometimes you tend to wonder how people like you learn in a classroom...
I have kept ringing like a bell here the subjectivity of value to distinct minds that conceives it.

Has shown that to a mosquito it's own life is more valuable to it than yours and it would kill you to show that in a bid to survive.

To a human his own life is more valuable and so it would kill the mosquito to ensure it's survival.

value is a child of the mind and differs from mind to mind according to their natural instinct of survival..

lets hope we do not see more cases cognitive dissonance

Again, it is only when you believe in value and purpose in life than an eternal life of value and purpose will make sense. You can't make an unending life make sense to a man who believes in futility. Thats like condemning him to hell.

It is abject greed and ego, infantile and childish fantasy. .

The value of something is not in a prospect of it lasting forever, it is in it's present eventuality.

I completely see no reason why one should waste his time struggling to get a car in this world that is abjectly meaningless compared to the eternal paradise of needless bliss.

why would you waste your time clamoring to acquire a house? why even study medicine?
Are you going to practise medicine in the afterlife? or live in the house you bought in the afterlife? or drive that car?

So since you think without afterlife this life is meaningless, why bother do all these things since you still won't practise, drive them in the afterlife therefore they are useless and unneeded.

it is evidently clear that the meaning in these things is in the Now and Here

if not why bother getting a car and house or even an education or eating food at all since they are all limited and won't transcend with you to that eternal realm therefore going by your laughable logic is pointless and meaningless.

Unfortunately as I have shown your fact is actually illogical nonsense.

Jesuuuuuuu... lmao i'm dead with infantile attempts? Naaah you are not up to it yet you can try again though

What's the point of a labour in life when all including labour is futile? Your life is not worth more than a dead chicken, so what's the point of living?

You see you always show that a belief in an afterlife diminishes the worth of this in the mind of a greedy human.

Have been said times and again, your labour in this life are as a result of your needs in this life and so all are rooted in the eventuality of your Now and Here not by an unlimited fantasy.

it is too sad that here is a human who cannot derive a point to his life (even when he didn't even ask for it but now selfishly asking for an unlimited one ) but ropes his point and meaning in a vague fantasy of another life to the negligence of the one he has.

don't pretend not have always see this, we all know you hardly can boast of an honest cognitive ability.

Your labours in this life is for this life, if there are no "Money" in human societal dealings you wouldn't labour for one.

if there was no need for food you wouldn't labour for food, your labours in life are as a result of the needs of this life.

it is an abject greed to hope for double reward for the effects of actions carried out for your own needs.

Look at how the bold contradicts your position again. Or do you believe this life has any real meaning rather than what we make of it? Which is in fact meaningless?

SMH.. Nature as a whole of which everything including life is part of is a random manifestation, unplanned and has no definitive schedule towards a desired end product.

Your opinion wasn't sort for before every came to be, even before you came to be so your delusive idea of a universal purpose remains as irrelevant as your own existence in a deep cosmos that won't even notice your disappearance.

The values of things are what we make them to be and still doesn't make them any special from every other manifestation of nature.. Just our idea.

Tell this to yourself and ask yourself how this statement makes your life more worthwhile than a mosquito's. This thinking takes meaning out of everything, especially this life.

Here we go again with the cognitive dissonance and willful playing the daft card... how many times am i to repeat it that worth is a child of a mind and subjective to distinct minds.

Just like a mosquito will place his own worth more than mine, i also do so because this ensure survival and continuation in a natural world that is riddled with competition and dangerous factors.

This is a simple mark of a natural manifestation dubbed Survival instinct……

When referring to nature in totality there is no V.I.P seat reserved for you in the list anymore than there are reserved for planet Mars.

we all are tiny units that make a whole that is Nature

Unfortunately your life remains pointless, as your reason for living denotes you do not even believe your existence is actually accidental, and your art meaningless, and your study purposeless and human advancement ultimately futile. Do you believe life has intrinsic worth or value?
You should take your belief to its logical end and context, so you do not write these long contradictory posts for nothing.

It has been shown time and again the one who regards his life to be pointless, the one who cannot derive meaning and value from that which he has but depends on assumed fantasy to provide an escape route.

that is very sad and bleak a not too good for our existence as it has been shown through out the world the way such persons behave and kill themselves to gain a paradise.

I still wonder what you are doing here though, why you've not rushed off the limitless and valueable paradise and leave the limited pointless earth behind, someone is not sure

we are still waiting for you to make sense though.

the quality of my eventual eternal life is determined by this one. And I want to fulfil the purpose of this life before I enter the next.
Everyone who ends this life considers it to have no answers and to be without purpose for him. Is that not what you believe? Why not end this meaningless existence now? Or end it after indulging in meaningless self gratification for a few years?

The unparalleled self degradation in order to accommodate a wishful greedy fantasy.. You need not degrade your own existence in order to assume up another.

The value of our life as a human mind derives is in our Now and Here and is not dependent in a wishful hope of another

Such greedy mindset of another better life makes nonsense out of this one life that people have that they abjectly neglect it to chase after their assumptive fantasy.

-The worth of the food we eat is not that it does not finish, it finishes and that is a fact and that makes it all the more valuable. each bite very delicious because it will never be here again.

-the value of loading a recharge is not defined by it's unlimited tendency, in the human concept of value such infinite value reduces in worth and value that it becomes pointless..

Following your infantile thought, there is no point eating since is finishes.. lol

As I have said, my time on earth is not a waste, as I have [b]purpose]/b], neither will my life in eternity be meaningless, because of same purpose. Purpose gives worth to life's actions, and makes eternity worth living for and sacrifice and labour worth it. What is your purpose and how does it transcend your meaningless accidental existence?

It is a complete waste your time on earth since you neglect it, you think low of it to swim in the delusion of another.

You greedily waste your precious rare time in a futile greedy chase of another.

I have always said humans are the most blind and deluded beings, they chase what they do not have while neglecting what they have.

Chasing after the shadow of another life while neglecting the only one they know of and are sure of which is NOW and HERE.

Purpose being a child of human mind is subjective and as an earthling that knows the value and the slim rare precious chance life is wasting it over pointless things like chasing for another is a show of lunacy.

How would one eat the food he is carrying when he is busy dragging and fighting to get the pot.

Partake in the Now and Here that you are sure of, the love, adventures, sex, craze, pain, joys, tears, happiness, sadness, hot and cold of the life you have, that eventuality makes it worth living and makes it worth the while.

My existence is worthwhile because I have purpose given to me by my creator.

Hahahahahaha a star shines and gives energy to a planet and without this there won't be any organism or you wearing an unmatched lunatic ego to boast of a more valuable existence.

without a star you won't be here but without you, a star is, will and always be so who is more deplorable and expandable here.

Lets assume a purpose giving creator, since stars ensures life that means this creator gave it a purpose that is directly responsible for yours of which without yours won't exist.

so you are more valuable ?

I have more value than a plant of course, I am a being with mind and self awareness.

Awareness simply is being responsive to the surroundings and plants have a photoresponsiveness to their surrounding..

You still have no case, it lives as you live.

In another way without a plant you won't be here today but without you there were, will and can be..

so your worth won't be here without them, you are directly dependent on their existence for survival but they are independent of yours.

Talk about value

Haaaa ego is a bad thing.

Your last question doesn't make any sense as I believe life already has meaning, while you think you don't.

Time doesn't give life meaning, purpose does.

Hahahahaha here goes the contradiction emanating from a childish stance.. Same you thinks that since life is limited (within a time frame) in this planet then it is meaningless.

and then still assumed up an eternal one in order to derive meaning without evening knowing that eternity is a product of time.

this what we get when you engage in a logical squabble so much above your level of deduction.

i ask a again..

-since the limited value of earth life makes you think it is worthless without an eternal one then at what number of time would it have existed to mean anything to you?

- how exactly does an infinite life equate meaning?

What is your purpose? If given an opportunity for eternal life would you not reach out anxiously to grab it?

Paradox of infinity, if there is an infinite number of something there is bound to
be an infinite number of repetitions in the infinite loop..if there is an infinite life,
it will be an existence of infinite repetitions

that is the most boring bleak and meaningless way to exist if you ask me. ..
but the greed in the need for another life clouds the human mind from thinking
the absurdity or the pointless bleakness in such existence.

the value of cold is in the hot, the value of up is in the down so too can there not be a life if there no eventuality of death.

a stone never dies cus it never lived....

Neglecting the earth for paradise is like neglecting substance for shadow

Joshthefirst:
I pity every atheist I meet, especially those who fancy themselves cool and swag and free, like johny.

Haaaaa such a punny childish display!!!

Joshthefirst:
This is quite foolish and contradictory if you as usual.

What meaning is there in an accidental worthless existence?

Have you heard of Foucault and Nietzsche and hemmingway?

One died of self gratification, the others of insanity and suicide. Chief atheists who came to real terms with the implications of their atheism.

You are the one who deserves pity, living a hopeless and futile existence

Hahahahaha we all know that which diminishes the human perception of their eventual worth and value and that is belief in a better existence somewhere else.

mentioning 3 atheist who committed suicide or anything does not help your case but rather a childish desperate clutch cus humans commit suicide on daily basis and most as worldly percentage are theists.

Or you want us to mention millions of theists who willfully sacrifice their today for a plater of wishful fantasy of another life?

Oh how wrong they have been

Holding a belief of a better paradise after here leaves you more bleak, makes this earth negligible and makes one more suicidal as it has been evidently shown in the millions of examples around where Such persons sacrifice themselves to attain a better place , as we have seen many times in staunch Christian/Muslim adherent, who sacrifice themselves for their beliefs because they think they are heading to a better place……

what a pity!!!

Neglecting the earth for paradise is like neglecting substance for shadow!!!

Joshthefirst:
Maybe you should consider the possibility that something may be wrong with you.

Lol, must be wrong with me? My creator must have made mistakes then.a

The problem John is saying one thing and u just over look it and say a totally different thing.

All u are being told is that life is worth living because that's just how life is. U must love, work hard, eat etc becasue that's what makes life meaningless interesting. no one likes pain dispite all life's meaninglessness. But this meaningleas life is sweeter when u love, earn money, and have fun.

U on the other hand believe in a better after life, yet you pray against death.

frank317:
There is never a convenient time for any of us to die. How can I make my theist brothers who 'think' they are in intimate relationship with a creator to realize that death defeats these existence of a 'known' creator.

Death implies imperfection, inconsistencies, disorderliness of everything seemingly orderly.


Order is just a perception. Man could have had four eyes (two front, two back. or six: Two front, two back, two sideways.) We rally have no means to determine perfection. Therefore, we really cannot explain our existence.

Bible explanation of death is completely faulty. Hence cannot be an authority. With our natural brains, a better reason on why we die is required..


To me, death can only imply nothing but, imperfection and disorderliness.

A creator can never have a rival? The existence of devil can therefore never be possible.

You are right about death. It's an imperfection. It's an evil in fact. So how does "death defeat the existence of a 'known' creator?" Because we are clear about the inception of death upon the world. We are even clear about its final defeat.

You are wrong about the devil being a rival to God. God has no rival. That is giving the devil too much cre dibility. The devil is just an angel amongst many who serve under the authority and power of God. This is what he (the devil) does;


Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

BiafranNigerian:


The universe has many Gods even as the Universe is God too, everything is God. Even the Bible God is also God, so are you, cos you are part of the whole. To know God you need to know all, and believe all. Religion echoes belief, science echoes knowledge, the truth is, death is a transition from 3D physical, to etheric physical and so on and so forth, but we chose to call what we cant see, spiritual, we are right, because spiritual is a finer dimension of the physical and one has to really tune his/her frequencies to receive signal and BE in that dimension.

Beware of the bolded.

Once u see the bolded, think of separation. Cos wherever theres a truth, theres always a lie.

There's no truth and there's no lie. The bible god is true to his subjects and others are too. Look for your own and leave other peoples patron god alone.

Africans will suffer until they know and accept that segregation is our bane, we accept other peoples gods but throw our inherited ones away.

don't misquote me bro, these days most of us are better than most of the gods, stronger even, more godlike.


Afterall, its just one mans opinion- ME but I AM WHO I AM

Think brothers, u don"t need d gods, they need u. Y?

Cos we created them.

Cheers

johnydon22:


Hahahahaha we all know that which diminishes the human perception of their eventual worth and value and that is belief in a better existence somewhere else.

mentioning 3 atheist who committed suicide or anything does not help your case but rather a childish desperate clutch cus humans commit suicide on daily basis and most as worldly percentage are theists.

Or you want us to mention millions of theists who willfully sacrifice their today for a plater of wishful fantasy of another life?

Oh how wrong they have been

Holding a belief of a better paradise after here leaves you more bleak, makes this earth negligible and makes one more suicidal as it has been evidently shown in the millions of examples around where Such persons sacrifice themselves to attain a better place , as we have seen many times in staunch Christian/Muslim adherent, who sacrifice themselves for their beliefs because they think they are heading to a better place……

what a pity!!!

Neglecting the earth for paradise is like neglecting substance for shadow!!!

See ehn, I know what u"ll think o
But for this comment, May Lord Ra, Horus Jesus, Ishtar, Krishna and all the demons bless u

edogho:


Beware of the bolded.

Once u see the bolded, think of separation. Cos wherever theres a truth, theres always a lie.

There's no truth and there's no lie. The bible god is true to his subjects and others are too. Look for your own and leave other peoples patron god alone.

Africans will suffer until they know and accept that segregation is our bane, we accept other peoples gods but throw our inherited ones away.

don't misquote me bro, these days most of us are better than most of the gods, stronger even, more godlike.


Afterall, its just one mans opinion- ME but I AM WHO I AM

Think brothers, u don"t need d gods, they need u. Y?

Cos we created them.

Cheers

You are operating in the premise of logic, and logic is subset of the mind. And guess what, conscious mind, sub-conscious mind are on different frequencies. So, expound your assertions beyond the mental frequencies and truth is out there. Absolute and relative truths no doubts.

Joshthefirst:
I pity every atheist I meet, especially those who fancy themselves cool and swag and free, like johny.

Good evening sir... How's things been?... May I know why you find atheists pitiful?

johnydon22:
Cc.lalasticlala Mynd44

Good evening sir... It's not like I intend to contribute to the discussion actually. Just wanna make a request... Do you mind giving me your facebook ID, please?

Joshthefirst:
I pity every atheist I meet, especially those who fancy themselves cool and swag and free, like johny.

Hey, what about me?

Another befuddling fact is the religious loves to claim that we, who don't assume the universe revolves around us, are the selfish ones

Many even suggest that we should accommodate their fantasies because it makes them feel better

DOHOHOHOHO

Ok, but what if, for instance, you saw a kid bullying another kid because he didn't get an xmas present? the bully reasoning that the kid didn't get any presents because he was bad and therefore deserving of some punishment?

you might want to consider telling the little bully santa doesn't exist, no? Let alone adults....

Aye, how selfish of us for pointing this out! We've now ruined xmas for everyone!!

[/color][color=#006600][/b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance... [b][/color][b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance... [/b][color=#006600][b][/b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance...

Looks like my reply was hidden too. Smh.

Ayomikun37:
[/color][color=#006600][/b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance... [b][/color][b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance... [/b][color=#006600][b][/b] To believe that our consciousness will survive our death is falling into the same arrogance that humans have had ever since they managed to control fire... We give ourselves purpose within our context. My purpose is to enjoy the life I have and try and make it better for those around me. That purpose means nothing to the universe but something to me. Only the very arrogant think that anything that a mammalian species on the third planet of an ordinary solar system in a remote part of an insignificant galaxy believes has any importance to the universe at large... If a large meteor comes our way and actually hits this planet with enough force to extinguish all life on this planet, what will happen to the rest of the universe? The answer of course is precisely nothing. Right there is the proof of our insignificance...

exactly on point but no, they no go hear

Ayomikun37:
Good evening sir... It's not like I intend to contribute to the discussion actually. Just wanna make a request... Do you mind giving me your facebook ID, please?

Hello brother... I rarely use my facebook you can get to me easily via email. . Johnydon22@Yahoo.com

johnydon22:


Hello brother... I rarely use my facebook you can get to me easily via email. . Johnydon22@Yahoo.com

Alright... Thank you sir.

Joshthefirst:


My existence is worthwhile because I have purpose given to me by my creator.

It absolutely blows my mind that an adult man can utter this, and confidently. How zombie-like, mindless, I don't even know how to call it. How willing humans can be to relinquish all sense of self-autonomy, independent thought, self-trust, to an idea. A very shakey, unsubstantiated, 20 century year old idea. It's incredible.

And yet the person who says, "my existence is worthwhile simply because of the experiences in life that I find worthwhile", HE is the one who is messed up? He is the one who is weak-minded and wasting his life?

Fear & indoctrination can truly do a number on the human mind.