1. Causes must precede their effect in time
2. Their is no time prior to the beginning of time(the origin of the universe)
3. Therefore, the universe cannot have a cause
4.Theism requires that god be the cause of the universe
5. The universe cannot have a cause
6. Therefore, theism is false.

If something comes into being, it most have being created by something else. God by definition is the uncreated creator of the universe, so the question who created god is illogical, but if life cannot create itself how did god come into being? for I believe it is unreasonable for something to begin to exist without a cause - nothing is but thing make it so - simply put, nothing is that was not created. A book has an author, a cellphone as a producer, a music has a music artist - in short all things that begin, that have a start, have a cause to their beginning.


Why does God exist? if it is valid to say "everything has a cause except god", it is more likely that everything has a cause except the universe.
To be contd

He is the I Am that I Am, pls stop asking questions u can never find answers to. He is th uncreated Creator.

If god doesn't need a cause because it is infinite, it is more likely that the matural universe has and will exist forever & therefore doesn't need a cause. You therefore make fewer assumptions, and cause fewer puzzles, if you admits that you believe in one uncaused entity, and that one uncaused entity is the universe itself.

Aside from casual arguments there are problems with the nature of god. If god can make plans and think logically, then, logic is an arch-power that encompasses god and gives reason for god's existence. i.e god, without logic, could not do any creating nor planning. This appear to refute the idea that god could be the creator of logic, if logic was a precursor to god, then, god is not the sole creator, but merely a side-effect or some logical process.
If, in order to avoid this problem, you state that their is no logical reason why god exist, then it is more likely that there is no logical reason why the universe exists, and that instead of asumming that the organisational force is

Genius!

'god', Its simpler and more rational to assume that it is the universe itself. It appears that whether god exist for logical reason or not a fundermental contradiction occurs. The only answer is that creator-Gods cannot exist. Atheism is more logical.

If it is possible for something to exist forever and not need a cause then it is likely to be the universe, not god, and once again we can theorize that this is likely to be true because there would be no reason for god if it was true that something could exist with no cause.

If god created anything according to a thought-out logical plan, or if god has a desire to create anything that wasn't pure random chaos, then, god's thoughts must have been framed around logic. This logic allowed god to think and create, and gave motivation to god. Logic must have been the first cause; but if logic is a requirement for god and existed before god could create, then god cannot be the first cause and therefore creator-god theism is false, and atheism is true.

Some theists will make assertions that god is "outside of outside" "beyond logic" "transcends logic" not subject to "logical limitations" or that "human logic is limited" and other similar argument-stoppers. Although this at first appears to throw all intellectualizing out the window, kick all theology out the front door and firmly garrison the houses of religion from debate, it actually opens up the theists to some further criticisms:

* If "human logic" is insufficient for metaphysics then debating for the existence of god is pointless. Because it is by Human logic, thought and mentality that we arrive at the concept of god in the first place.

* If god bebave to logic that we don't understand (i.e human logic is limited) then god is still behaving according to logic, even if it is logic we don't understand.

* To say that god doesn't obey logical rules, to say that god could create a round square, for example, is to say that the abilities of god are abilities that logically exist, making god into fantasy.

* "Beyond logic" is a synonym "irrational" and admissions that belief are "beyond logic" is an admission that such beliefs are irrational and logically indefensible.

If god is beyond logic is it not true that atheists are at least somewhat more rational and logical in their beliefs? it seem to be.

I, myself do not believe in the existence of god, the supernatural - because it doesn't exist.... What is correct is that it does exist, not in reality but only in the minds of some people. god exists in fantansy in the mind of mentally sick people, weak, desperate and disillusioned.

mii4u:
He is the I Am that I Am, pls stop asking questions u can never find answers to. He is th uncreated Creator.

Who told you there are no answers to such questions? Seeking for rational answers to these kind of questions is more sensible than just concluding that God exists, wasn't created and existed out of nothing, without having any proof for such assertion.

If the idea of the origin of God's existence is incomprehensible and unfathomable, then how did you arrive at the conclusion that he wasn't created ? Aren't you contradicting yourself?

mii4u:
He is the I Am that I Am, pls stop asking questions u can never find answers to. He is th uncreated Creator.

I AM is actually YOU foo. When you say the phrase I AM you immediately imply your own consciousness. If God is THE I AM then he is the human being doing the speaking.

Decker:


Who told you there are no answers to such questions? Seeking for rational answers to these kind of questions is more sensible than just concluding that God exists, wasn't created and existed out of nothing, without having any proof for such assertion.

If the idea of the origin of God's existence is incomprehensible and unfathomable, then how did you arrive at the conclusion that he wasn't created ? Aren't you contradicting yourself?

pls if u have sought the rational answer, pls share with us, so who created God?

good thread

i so much love this thread

mii4u:





pls if u have sought the rational answer, pls share with us, so who created God?

Throughout time, man has always created god. That is why you will notice that all gods share similar traits with the culture of the man that creates it. All gods are jealous, have bad tempers, punish and bless when they are praised. These are typical human flaws.

Zeus, Yaweh, Jehovah, Sango, Buddha, Krishna and other 4000 gods are all products of men. Especially those who desire to rule and pursue power.

The only difference is that older religions such as African trad religions, ancient Greek, Indian etc religion all created idols to serve as a representation of their various gods while Muslims and Christians created an "invincible" god. I mean, who would you take seriously? A man bowing down to a stone or a man bowing down to nothing?

At the end of the day, they are all worshipping their imaginations

mii4u:
He is the I Am that I Am, pls stop asking questions u can never find answers to. He is th uncreated Creator.

The phenomenon of god seems to be a threatened reality. however, our inability to differentiate the objects of experience from those of thought makes the existence of god fallacious.

The belief in the phenomenon of god, which has been dogmatically embraced in our traditional/social/political societies, makes the idea of its existence to form one of the metaphysics problem. This is because such belief cannot be proved scientifically. It only find a way of escape in the realm of metaphysics, hence, any attempt to justify it beyond metaphysics realm will lead one to committing the fallacy of ignorance. An attempt to validate the existence of god in the contemporary world will amount to locating the immaterial in the material world which is tantamount to committing a naturalistic fallacy. simply put, god is a product of man, man gravious mistake.

mii4u:





pls if u have sought the rational answer, pls share with us, so who created God?

Man. God is the product of man insignificant figments of man's more infantile imagination.

hahn:


Throughout time, man has always created god. That is why you will notice that all gods share similar traits with the culture of the man that creates it. All gods are jealous, have bad tempers, punish and bless when they are praised. These are typical human flaws.

Zeus, Yaweh, Jehovah, Sango, Buddha, Krishna and other 4000 gods are all products of men. Especially those who desire to rule and pursue power.

The only difference is that older religions such as African trad religions, ancient Greek, Indian etc religion all created idols to serve as a representation of their various gods while Muslims and Christians created an "invincible" god. I mean, who would you take seriously? A man bowing down to a stone or a man bowing down to nothing?

At the end of the day, they are all worshipping their imaginations

we are all entitled to our own opinion, but I strongly believe in the uncreated Creator, the One that was, the One that is and the One that is to come

mii4u:




we are all entitled to our own opinion, but I strongly believe in the uncreated Creator, the One that was, the One that is and the One that is to come

Can you prove that it exists?

hahn:


Can you prove that it exists?

His Existence can't be prove Beyond Our Imagination. it (god) a product of man imagination/thinking.

BeastAmbition:


His Existence can't be prove Beyond Our Imagination. it (god) a product of man imagination/thinking.

I was hoping mii4u would answer the question

hahn:


I was hoping mii4u would answer the question

Let give her the benefit of doubt by waiting patiently to see if she wil be able to bring up a logical explainationl

BeastAmbition:


Let give her the benefit of doubt by waiting patiently to see if she wil be able to bring up a logical explainationl

I am actually waiting for a picture

hahn:


Can you prove that it exists?

u can't prove everything for sure, believing and knowing are too different things entirely, u can prove Wat u know but can't always prove Wat u believe. believe has nothing much to do with sight, it's a thing of the mind, but I repeat , GOD IS REAL AND HE EXIST.

mii4u:

u can't prove everything for sure

Actually, you can. You just need to spend some time researching, observing and asking questions.

believing and knowing are too different things entirely, u can prove Wat u know but can't always prove Wat u believe

In the religious concept of "belief", proof is not a prerequisite. It is all about blind faith. Can you apply belief in real life? If someone tells you not to write an exam, to just pray and that you will pass, your belief that you will pass will not reflect in reality. Yes or no?

. believe has nothing much to do with sight, it's a thing of the mind, but I repeat , GOD IS REAL AND HE EXIST.

You do not believe that the sun exists. You know. Of course, belief is a thing of the mind. That is why people like me, atheists, keep teling you that your god exists ONLY in your mind

hahn:


Can you prove that it exists?

Yes, God can be proven. Find my thread, "Does God Exist?".https://www.nairaland.com/3109094/does-god-exist#45678714

The Metaphysical is not govern by time nor space.