raphieMontella:

exactly my point...u believe it cs its in the ''bible''...i choose nt to because in the earth i live in..it is nt possible..
Like i said....telling my kids that i can see the inhabitants of planet kelper 186f does nt make it true....

Do you know that there is no compelling evidence that Aristotle , Plato and other philosophers that lived before Christ existed , just what we read in books about them . But you accept them anyway . And when it comes to religion you become overly pedantic ?

malvisguy212:
God command the israelites to be circumcised after 8 days, Moses knew that all Israelites were to be circumcised. But his wife Zipporah was not an israelite, she was a midinites ( although the midinite descendant of Abraham through his second wife katurah) the midinites do not follow the abrahamic covenant of circumcision. Instead moses obey his wife not to circumcised his two children, God was furious with him, so God want to show him how serious He is concerning breaking of His commandment. God did not kill him, he only show moses The danger of breaking His comand.

cc : JMAN05

SHALOM!

PAUL was ashamed of The Gospel of Christ: therefore he rejected it, and invented his own, totally-fake, Gospel.

. MARK 1:14-15.

14. Now after that John was put in prison,
Jesus came into Galilee,
preaching The Gospel of The Kingdom of God,
15. And saying,
"The time is fulfilled,
and The Kingdom of God is at hand:
repent ye, and believe The Gospel."

. MARK 16:15-20.

15. And he said unto them,
"Go ye into all the World,
and preach The Gospel to every creature.
16. "He that believeth and is baptized shall be Saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17. "And these Signs shall follow them that Believe;

'IN MY NAME SHALL THEY CAST OUT DEVILS;
THEY SHALL SPEAK WITH NEW TONGUES;
18. "THEY SHALL TAKE UP SERPENTS;
AND IF THEY DRINK ANY DEADLY THING, IT SHALL NOT HURT THEM;
THEY SHALL LAY HANDS ON THE SICK, AND THEY SHALL RECOVER.' "

19. So then after the Lord had spoken unto them,
he was received up into Heaven,
and sat on the Right Hand of God.
20. And they went forth, and preached every where,
The Lord working with them,
and confirming The Word with signs following.
Amen.

KingEbukasBlog:


cc : JMAN05

There is substance to the comment than what you said earlier. However, some of his story about Zeporah and Moses is self-made, not scripture.

raphieMontella:

lol bruh...u did nt read the bible...
Read it and understand the issue there

You are the one that do not read the bible with understanding. The event didn't happen within the same time frame. Disprove it let me see.

JMAN05:


You are the one that do not read the bible with understanding. The event didn't happen within the same time frame. Disprove it let me see.

the two writers gave the birth story of jesus and where he was met by the wise men....
They gave two different accounts...so one is wrong..

If u cannot read the preceeding andd succeeding verses...then dont reply

KingEbukasBlog:


Do you know that there is no compelling evidence that Aristotle , Plato and other philosophers that lived before Christ existed , just what we read in books about them . But you accept them anyway . And when it comes to religion you become overly pedantic ?

bros easy oo...
Aristotle works survived nd we have them...
Plato's works survived nd we have them...
U can only say that for socrates...nd thats where the socratic problem comes in...his existence has been debated...
Plato and aristotle both have direct eye witness accounts...unlike jesus...the first gospel ''Mark'' dates as far as 40 years after the death of jesus..in a period where life expectancies were low....and was nt written byy an apostle of jesus....
Comtemporary historians during jesus's existence didnt mention jesus(during his lifetime)...like phio the great abi na alexander the philo smtin like dat...
..whereas jesus was very famous and did great stuffs bt cudnt be recorded by them..
..many stuffs...
Jesus to me was jst a rabbi who was a humanist...

KingEbukasBlog:


Do you know that there is no compelling evidence that Aristotle , Plato and other philosophers that lived before Christ existed , just what we read in books about them . But you accept them anyway . And when it comes to religion you become overly pedantic ?

Just Negodu

raphieMontella:

bros easy oo...
Aristotle works survived nd we have them...
Plato's works survived nd we have them...
U can only say that for socrates...nd thats where the socratic problem comes in...his existence has been debated...
Plato and aristotle both have direct eye witness accounts...unlike jesus...the first gospel ''Mark'' dates as far as 40 years after the death of jesus..in a period where life expectancies were low....and was nt written byy an apostle of jesus....
Comtemporary historians during jesus's existence didnt mention jesus(during his lifetime)...like phio the great abi na alexander the philo smtin like dat...
..whereas jesus was very famous and did great stuffs bt cudnt be recorded by them..
..many stuffs...
Jesus to me was jst a rabbi who was a humanist...

Your life , your opinions

4kings:


Just Negodu

But its true

@4kings

Why don't you attack atheists ? The only true deist I know , Deepsight , rubbishes the claims made by the atheist but you have never criticized any post made by an atheist . You are always quick to defend them , why

I think you just purport yourself as a deist to avoid criticism from the Christians

KingEbukasBlog:
@4kings

Why don't you attack atheists ? The only true deist I know , Deepsight , rubbishes the claims made by the atheist but you have never criticized any post made by an atheist . You are always quick to defend them , why

I attack statements that seems irrational to me. Just like I did with Se.un in the other thread about Intelligent Designer.

I also don't buy most of those Christians' claim(except the Gnostic Christians), so I try to address reasons why I think such claims are faulty whenever I see them, irrespective of who raised the discussion.

I think you just purport yourself as a deist to avoid criticism from the Christians

What criticism?
I have told you before, you better wake up from that your silly dream.

4kings:

I attack statements that seems irrational to me. Just like I did with Se.un in the other thread about Intelligent Designer.

I also don't buy most of those Christians' claim(except the Gnostic Christians), so I try to address reasons why I think such claims are faulty whenever I see them, irrespective of who raised the discussion.

Atheists have made so many irrational claims about God's existence and you have never attacked them except for se.un 's case .

What criticism?
I have told you before, you better wake up from that your silly dream.

You have not given me a compelling reason why you are a deist . You are the one dreaming .

So let's continue . Do you agree to the existence of a soul - an immaterial part of a human being that connects to the creator

Bible scholars come and explain this with scriptures.
I heard today that its only married women that commits adultery married men only commits fornication as the Bible only mention this instances in the Bible. There is No place in the Bible that it was mentioned that a man was punished for adultery.
That adultery has defined in the dictionary is not what the Bible captured, man just Define am that way to ensure fairness.

KingEbukasBlog:


Atheists have made so many irrational claims about God's existence and you have never attacked them except for se.un 's case .

Yeah, I know. This is my second account on nairaland, and yet, I just discovered there were freethinkers here on nairaland, like a month ago. So calm down.

You have not given me a compelling reason why you are a deist . You are the one dreaming .

Just address me as a freethinker.

So let's continue . Do you agree to the existence of a soul - an immaterial part of a human being that connects to the creator

I don't know what happens after death. So I can't make any assertion.

4kings:

Yeah, I know. This is my second account on nairaland, and yet, I just discovered there were freethinkers here on nairaland, like a month ago. So calm down.

Just address me as a freethinker.

Calling you a freethinker is a misnomer

I don't know what happens after death. So I can't make any assertion.

Your spirit - used interchangeably with the soul - is part of you .

Since you claim to be a freethinker - one who questions religious beliefs and is committed to the use of logic and scientific inquiry - do you think the existence of a soul is congruous with science

KingEbukasBlog:

Since you claim to be a freethinker - one who questions religious beliefs and is committed to the use of logic and scientific inquiry - do you think the existence of a soul is congruous with science

Nope.

4kings:


Nope.

Science is the study of nature . Don't you perceive the soul as a constituent of nature ? If not, why ?

JMAN05:


There is substance to the comment than what you said earlier. However, some of his story about Zeporah and Moses is self-made, not scripture.

Genesis 25.
25:1 Then again Abraham took a wife, and her
name was Keturah.
25:2 And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan,
and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah.

Moses wife Zipporah , she is a midinite, alright, the midinites descend from Abraham through His second wife Keturah, the midinites do not follow the abrahamic covenant of circumcision. Where did I add my own interpretation here ?

Alright, Exedus 4, is were moses return to Egypt in other to lead the israelites to the promise land, right ? God CANNOT allow moses to do this when he had not brought his family to the Covenant of God, Which Circumcision is Among the Sign.

KingEbukasBlog:


Science is the study of nature . Don't you perceive the soul as a constituent of nature ? If not, why ?

If there is a soul, then I don't think it exists in this same realm, if not there would have been proofs.

Therefore, only the understanding of the science at work in that realm, can bring us closer to it.

raphieMontella:

exactly my point...u believe it cs its in the ''bible''...i choose nt to because in the earth i live in..it is nt possible..
Like i said....telling my kids that i can see the inhabitants of planet kelper 186f does nt make it true....

Not because it is in the Bible(write normally please, it is easier to read that way, wetin be cs, u, nt?) i believe because i trust people, and what is said is not out of this world as has already been explained to you. Soldiers can transmit messages to one another. If you speak HONESTLY to your kids, they should believe you except they are bastards.

Image123:


Not because it is in the Bible(write normally please, it is easier to read that way, wetin be cs, u, nt?) i believe because i trust people, and what is said is not out of this world as has already been explained to you. Soldiers can transmit messages to one another. If you speak HONESTLY to your kids, they should believe you except they are bastards.

you trust people...do you trust muhammed?
It is not out of this world..the odds are low...the soldiers are so much..1.2m soldiers..
Had it been something like 3hk soldiers that plausible means would be okay to think about..and he was at the top of a mountain..the energy of sound in air reduces as the distance travelled increases...or were tthe generals anchored att various points on the mountain?
On honesty..my kids would believe me(they may later outgrow it/or refuse to believe) even if what i said is a lie...bt a good father would not lie to his children..
Much said...i still have some more am going to bring up here..

raphieMontella:

the two writers gave the birth story of jesus and where he was met by the wise men....
They gave two different accounts...so one is wrong..

If u cannot read the preceeding andd succeeding verses...then dont reply

First, the two account didn't record that Jesus was visited by wise men.

Luke's account states that Jesus was born and kept in a manger because there was no room for them to stay. Do you think that there will continue to be no room in the lodging place? It further shows that Jesus was visited by shepherds, not wise men.

Matthew's account records when Jesus and his mom had found a lodging place. It states that Jesus was in a house, no longer in a manger. They ve moved from the area he was born to a house.

Another point is that the 'wise men' came when Jesus is no longer an infant. Matthew's account shows Jesus was a young child, no longer an infant. As such, considerable time had elapsed before they came.

raphieMontella:

bros easy oo...
Aristotle works survived nd we have them...
Plato's works survived nd we have them...
U can only say that for socrates...nd thats where the socratic problem comes in...his existence has been debated...
Plato and aristotle both have direct eye witness accounts...unlike jesus...the first gospel ''Mark'' dates as far as 40 years after the death of jesus..in a period where life expectancies were low....and was nt written byy an apostle of jesus....
Comtemporary historians during jesus's existence didnt mention jesus(during his lifetime)...like phio the great abi na alexander the philo smtin like dat...
..whereas jesus was very famous and did great stuffs bt cudnt be recorded by them..
..many stuffs...
Jesus to me was jst a rabbi who was a humanist...

Do you have the autograph of Plato and Aristotle's writings? That some historian didn't write about someone does not mean he didn't exist. It was not all the people during his time that philo recorded.

Secondly, Jesus was famous, but his teaching was unpopular. He is viewed as a heretic and even his resurrection was covered by religious leaders. Matt 28:12-15.

Contrary to popular belief, Matthews account was written quite earlier than Mark's.

In fact, it is quite a crapola and disingenuous to state that a historian's account of prior years are untrue and this assertion will continue to remain a cull.

Did Philo give the account of Judas of acts 5:37? Now eben the precise time of Philo's birth is unknown although he was popular.

No erudite historian records events that happened at his time alone. Nor is the work of a historian false because his record happened when he was not alive. I will only accept your position as reasonable if you will tell me that all the persons mentioned by all historians, including Josephus when he was not alive didn't exist.

Another point is: Josephus wrote about Philo, and none of you question the story he gave about philo although he lived before him, but when it is about Jesus, the story became false. This idea is conked at birth.

Pls! Explain to me
Who is God the father,God the son and God the holy spirit......

malvisguy212:
Genesis 25.
25:1 Then again Abraham took a wife, and her
name was Keturah.
25:2 And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan,
and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah.

Moses wife Zipporah , she is a midinite, alright, the midinites descend from Abraham through His second wife Keturah, the midinites do not follow the abrahamic covenant of circumcision. Where did I add my own interpretation here ?

Alright, Exedus 4, is were moses return to Egypt in other to lead the israelites to the promise land, right ? God CANNOT allow moses to do this when he had not brought his family to the Covenant of God, Which Circumcision is Among the Sign.

You said:

"Instead moses obey his wife not to circumcised his two children, God was furious with him, so God want to show him how serious He is concerning breaking of His commandment. God did not kill him, he only show moses The danger of breaking His comand."

Where in the record did Moses wife tell him anything and he obeyed her? Was God intending to kill Moses in the first place? Who was it that did the circumcision finally?

JMAN05:


Do you have the autograph of Plato and Aristotle's writings? That some historian didn't write about someone does not mean he didn't exist. It was not all the people during his time that philo recorded.

what are u saying?
Aristotles writings survived..plato likewise...wat are u saiyng oga?

Secondly, Jesus was famous, but his teaching was unpopular. He is viewed as a heretic and even his resurrection was covered by religious leaders. Matt 28:12-15.

i dnt get u here...
He was so popular that he had to be killed by romans..romans didnt document this...i dnt understand ur claim here...simplify

Contrary to popular belief, Matthews account was written quite earlier than Mark's.

mark was written by an anonymous write...was dated to 70CE...matthew is dated to arnd 130CE or so..also anonymous..so what u saying?

In fact, it is quite a crapola and disingenuous to state that a historian's account of prior years are untrue and this assertion will continue to remain a cull.

with such supernatural phenomenom that occured at the hour of crucification of jesus(ghosts walking up and down,,,3 hours darkness etc) its funny that theres no record of it except in the gospels...whereas even pliny a christian recorded other phenomena like eclipses...
Ts quite disturbing ddnt u fink?

Did Philo give the account of Judas of acts 5:37? Now eben the precise time of Philo's birth is unknown although he was popular.

at least philo's writings survived..and he has eyewitness accounts...nt hearsays..

No erudite historian records events that happened at his time alone. Nor is the work of a historian false because his record happened when he was not alive. I will only accept your position as reasonable if you will tell me that all the persons mentioned by all historians, including Josephus when he was not alive didn't exist.

my assertion is that jesus existed..bt was nothing more than a rabbi of the religious sect of nazarene...
Do u know that the city of nazareth has no contemporary recordd?
Even when josephus listed cities in judea abi gallilee..smtin like that..

Another point is: Josephus wrote about Philo, and none of you question the story he gave about philo although he lived before him, but when it is about Jesus, the story became false. This idea is conked at birth.

philo's writings survived..nd were used in the first century and latter dates..josephus existed before philo died...josephus may have added some stuffs we do not know...bt the jesus issue is that...contemporary historians who existed arnd the timeline of jesus(his life) made no mention of the guy...despite his works..in the bible...jesus was so popular...he attracted crowds upon crowds..

Look at the resurrection...crowdds upon crowdds...do u grab?

Frm ur analogyy...then we shud also believe in hercules....do u believe that zeus is the true god?
Josephus wrote abt hercules...a lot
tacitus also...
I tinkk pliny also..
Many of them wrote abt hercules much more than they wrote abt jesus..so?
Should we believe the homers detailed story of hercules(in the odyssey)?

JMAN05:


Do you have the autograph of Plato and Aristotle's writings? That some historian didn't write about someone does not mean he didn't exist. It was not all the people during his time that philo recorded.

The popular sculpture of plato's head was done 30years after plato's death, not centuries. , by the academy of athens.
Aristotle attended the academy.
Check the alumni of the academy before u make any assertions.
Apart from Jesus, no other popular men were recorded centuries after, even Mohammed.

Secondly, Jesus was famous, but his teaching was unpopular. He is viewed as a heretic and even his resurrection was covered by religious leaders. Matt 28:12-15.

***Jesus was famous, but his teaching unpopular***, WTF , what made him famous?

Contrary to popular belief, Matthews account was written quite earlier than Mark's.

Still, it was not an eyewitness account.

In fact, it is quite a crapola and disingenuous to state that a historian's account of prior years are untrue and this assertion will continue to remain a cull.

Out of the >5000 audience he received on several occassions, no single person could record the awesomeness of feeding crowds with 5 loaves and 2 fishes and several others.

Did Philo give the account of Judas of acts 5:37? Now eben the precise time of Philo's birth is unknown although he was popular.

No erudite historian records events that happened at his time alone. Nor is the work of a historian false because his record happened when he was not alive.
I will only accept your position as reasonable if you will tell me that all the persons mentioned by all historians, including Josephus when he was not alive didn't exist.

Another point is: Josephus wrote about Philo, and none of you question the story he gave about philo although he lived before him, but when it is about Jesus, the story became false. This idea is conked at birth.

Josephus did not believe in Jesus as confirmed by Origen the church father during his time .
And the paragraph that gave account of Jesus existence was first quoted by Eusebius(the liar), centuries after.

4kings:


Josephus did not believe in Jesus as confirmed by Origen the church father during his time .
And the paragraph that gave account of Jesus existence was first quoted by Eusebius(the liar), centuries after.

they forgot that the antiquites was written at 93CE...23 years after the first gospel Mark was written...how is it nt possible josephus got to read the book and add that paragraph?
Why did josephus write more abt hercules than jesus?
Was jesus an ordinary rabbi?...perhaps..

JMAN05:


You said:

"Instead moses obey his wife not to circumcised his two children, God was furious with him, so God want to show him how serious He is concerning breaking of His commandment. God did not kill him, he only show moses The danger of breaking His comand."

Where in the record did Moses wife tell him anything and he obeyed her? Was God intending to kill Moses in the first place? Who was it that did the circumcision finally?

moses wife, she is a midinite, do the midintes
follow abrahamic covenant of circumcision ? No, do you think moses just woke up one morning and decided to break God law ? In fact, circumcision is Among the sign of God covenant to the israelites. If not his wife, who else ?

raphieMontella:

they forgot that the antiquites was written at 93CE...23 years after the first gospel Mark was written...how is it nt possible josephus got to read the book and add that paragraph?
Why did josephus write more abt hercules than jesus?
Was jesus an ordinary rabbi?...perhaps..

"Jesus" probably existed as an ordinary rabbi and not what we know today.
****************
But Josephus did not write anything about him, or at least not what we know.
Origen the christian church father who was responsible for the growth of the christendom then, was alive during Josephus time but only mentioned him as a man who didn't believe the gospel of Jesus.
Besides, why should Eusebuis be the first person to quote that paragraph, years after his(Josephus) death.

4kings:

"Jesus" probably existed as an ordinary rabbi and not what we know today.
****************
But Josephus did not write anything about him, or at least not what we know.
Origen the christian church father who was responsible for the growth of the christendom then, was alive during Josephus time but only mentioned him as a man who didn't believe the gospel of Jesus.
Besides, why should Eusebuis be the first person to quote that paragraph, years after his(Josephus) death.

they forgot lying and forgery was a normal character of the early church..even the catholics had to forge the death of the apostles(most)
even martin luther said
''What harm could it do if a man told a good
lusty lie in a worthy cause and for the sake of the
Christian Churches?''