.

SirShymexx:

Two sources:

- Nigeria Under British Rule (1927) By Sir William M.N. Geary.

- John Beecroft, 1790—1854: Her Brittanica Majesty's Consul to the Bights of Benin and Biafra 1849—1854 by K. O. Dike

The second one is a journal and you can read it for free on jstor.org.

No luck yet trying to download either. Saw the jstor.org read online but would rather I have it downloaded, for easier read and reference. The first keeps turning up some spam links.

Thanks all the same.

AuroraB:
Eheeeehn! Na the kain thing wey you dey like. Lol

At times I wish I can ignore

stinggy:

At times I wish I can ignore

Ibile

stinggy:

No luck yet trying to download either. Saw the jstor.org read online but would rather I have it downloaded, for easier read and reference. The first keeps turning up some spam links.

Thanks all the same.

For the one on jstor.org, you've to register and read it online. It's only 14 pages.

As for the other book:

- This is the google scholar version: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=r-VkAgAAQBAJ&pg=PT87&lpg=PT87&dq=consul+beecroft&source=bl&ots=5aDLdjLFsB&sig=RKCURPk8fv4FXrtXZmf47XVY5to&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjYjbOh147QAhVBJMAKHULYB78Q6AEILDAD#v=onepage&q=consul%20beecroft&f=false

- You can also buy it one amazon (the kindle version is far more cheaper than the hard copy): https://www.amazon.com/Nigeria-Under-British-William-Geary/dp/0714616664

LordAdam:

Personally, I don't fault the Europeans. There is nothing the Europeans did that we have not done to ourselves over and over again.

In the height of the Bini empire, a dead Oba was buried with the heads of 2,000 slaves. These slaves were people after sacking a community or after war.

More powerful empires colonized less powerful empires. It has always been the ways of old. Japan colonized China and Korea at some point.

Although the animosity is still there, everyone has moved past that and are getting ahead with their economies (that are now trillion dollar economies by the way) and leaving the terrible events that characterize colonial rule for the history books.

Over here in Africa, we don't want to let it fly, because somehow we believe the rules for us should be different. That India, China that were colonized as late as 70 years ago and are now bigger than the economies of the countries that colonized them are not countries like us.

In fact, our Black chiefs and rulers share equal blame for whatever the colonialists did. And I don't believe black folks are enamored because of the massive slave trade. We are enamored because we're fuc*ed up naturally. It's been 60+ years after the slave trade, why are we still so screwed up as a people.

Why can't we see that as something to spruce us to surprise them. Jews died in their millions during WW2. Today, they have the highest per human capita of any ethnicity on the planet.

Or is it the Japanese and Germans that were humiliated (both in reality and in kind) in WW2 (Germans twice in WW1 and WW2). Until recently, Japan was the dominant economy in Asian, while Germany is still the dominant economy in Europe. It took both countries less than 35 years to get back on their feet.

Maybe we can keep passing the buck about, or we can just seize the bull by the horn. Even Ethiopia and Afghanistan that both have the unenviable record of never losing any prolonged battle against outside invaders are far worse than Indians that were pillaged by the Alexander, then the Mughal muslims, then the British.

The Europeans have done more than enough to pay back for their atrocities in Africa. They still send us aid, while our leaders stack our common wealth and same aid in their banks. They gave us bloodless independence. There's limited discrimination (that is decreasing by the day) on the World stage. What the Bleep have we used these privileges for?

-Lord

No, you can't absolve Europeans from the crimes they committed against black folks cos it's still on-going, albeit covert these days. That was the dehumanisation and pillaging of over 20 generations of black folks and generations of free labour and utter destruction. And we built everything they own today. The worst treatment in the history of humanity. However, unlike other folks, they never paid us reparations. So, they will never get a pass for what they did and white guilt will haunt them till they all perish.

The useless aids they send is for neo-colonialism and more of a Greek gift, than anything anyone should laud. For every $1million they give out in aid - they take $1billion back. That's the reality.

Regardless, the West African kings who ruled from the 17th century to the 20th century will never get a pass from me.They were all cowardly despots like the terrible leaders running around Africa today. And the folks were just as effed up as the white-washed black African folks we've running around today. Those from that era willingly joined the white man in destroying their problems cos most of the foot soldiers they used back then were Africans - just as the coons we've running around today.

SirShymexx:


No, you can't absolve Europeans from the crimes they committed against black folks cos it's still on-going, albeit covert these days. That was the dehumanisation and pillaging of over 20 generations of black folks and generations of free labour and utter destruction. And we built everything they own today. The worst treatment in the history of humanity. However, unlike other folks, they never paid us reparations. So, they will never get a pass for what they did and white guilt will haunt them till they all perish.

The useless aids they send is for neo-colonialism and more of a Greek gift, than anything anyone should laud. For every $1million they give out in aid - they take $1billion back. That's the reality.

Regardless, the West African kings who ruled from the 17th century to the 20th century will never get a pass from me.They were all cowardly despots like the terrible leaders running around Africa today. And the folks were just as effed up as the white-washed black African folks we've running around today. Those from that era willingly joined the white man in destroying their problems cos most of the foot soldiers they used back then were Africans - just as the coons we've running around today.

Here's the news flash mate, they don't need anyone's pass.

We can either rise from the ashes like a Phoenix and give this world a resounding success story to talk about akin to the Asian and South American countries, or we can just sit our ass down and keep waiting for an apology!

Our choice. Your choice. I've made my choice long ago. I'm not going to throw a pity party for myself, or anyone for that matter.

I'm leaving my mark whether Sub-Saharan Africa chooses to tow the same part or not.

-Lord

LordAdam:

Here's the news flash mate, they don't need anyone's pass.

We can either rise from the ashes like a Phoenix and give this world a resounding success story to talk about akin to the Asian and South American countries, or we can just sit our ass down and keep waiting for an apology!

Our choice. Your choice. I've made my choice long ago. I'm not going to throw a pity party for myself, or anyone for that matter.

I'm leaving my mark whether Sub-Saharan Africa chooses to tow the same part or not.

-Lord

This isn't about pity-party, it's about not forgetting what they have done and are still doing. And the fact that folks don't care about the experience and what the generational dehumanisation has done to us, is the reason why they're still fvcking us up.

Look at the Jews and how they'll never forget the holocaust. Even in China: they teach all their kids about the opium wars and how white folks effed them up. Never forget.

SirShymexx:


This isn't about pity-party, it's about not forgetting what they have done and are still doing. And the fact that folks don't care about the experience and what the generational dehumanisation has done to us, is the reason why they're still fvcking us up.

Look at the Jews and how they'll never forget the holocaust. Even in China: they teach all their kids about the opium wars and how white folks effed them up. Never forget.

You have a point about not forgetting history. I don't forget about history. I don't expect any true sub-Saharan African to ever forget. But it should not be yoke over us that stymies us from pressing forward.

Israel and the US (with the largest population of Jews outside Israel) still do business with Germany. China may have their differences with Japan and the West, but they trade with them, and even invest there. China is the largest oversea creditor of the US.

Politics and development shouldn't be Siamese twins. Every type of political system (whether democracy, monarchy, or communism) on the planet has at least one model country that is developed. So, we can't use our apathy of the slave trade and brutal colonial past as a reason not to shake hands and move our region forward.

Personally, I've placed that behind me. Maybe, it's easier for me because it's been generations since slave trade ended. But I look around the world, and I see everyone has moved on. Everyone is moving to greater heights, while sub-Saharan Africa is holding the tabs for only God knows what. And passing the buck isn't going to change anything.

You know why?

Because passing the buck hasn't changed anything yet. I'm not certain, doing it for another half a century will change anything.

If you are waiting for a Marshall Plan from the West for Africa. I hate to break it to you, it's not coming. It's why I call this a pity-party.

If it isn't a pity party, then we should be as developed as Asia and then keep the rhetoric going. It'd be more tolerable then.

Do you know that there is a strong apathy between the people of Hong Kong and those of Mainland China? Want to experience it first hand? Speak Mandarin in a store in Hong Kong...

Yet, these places are far developed than anywhere in sub-Saharan Africa (including South Africa).

Or should we talk about the apathy between India and Pakistan. China and many of its neighbors (Japan, Malaysia). These guys have the memory of an elephant. But in spite of all these, these countries are in a better position than 99% of countries in sub-Saharan Africa.

This is exactly why I call what we've been doing for the past 60 years a pity-party. And why we need a wake up call.

The world is tired of feeling sorry for a people who can yell aloud about how their resources (both human and natural) were pillaged for centuries, while let our own leaders launder at least $45b every year from the continent. And live in crisis-, disease-, hunger-infested, and underdeveloped climes.

-Lord

SirShymexx:


Lol. Why didn't you quote me? Scared much?

Don't turn this into Egbas vs. Ijebus cos Ijebus also sold tons of slaves. However, that doesn't negate my point about the Egbas cos they were instrumental in his defeat. And I believe Akitoye's mum was Egba and that might've also played a role cos he escaped to Abeokuta when Kosoko dethroned him.

Egbas loved white men back then and in return, the white man gave them Bible, munitions, and military training. Ever wondered why Ijebus who were the first naij folks to have contacts with white men, were the last to accept Christianity? And when Christianity came to Ijebuland, it came via the Egbas through Remo?

So the yorubas ve internal wranglings. . Thought the Igbos will kill thr selves once dey get biafra. . We laughing at u all

OAUTemitayo:
You must be seeing Egbas in your dream

So the yorubas ve internal wranglings. . Thought the Igbos will kill thr selves once dey get biafra. . We laughing at u all

Kosoko is a match for the evil of the queen's emissary. Men who imported pains into Africa and steal her resources. Any destruction to them as of then was a good act to mother nature. But times have passed, The narrative of advanced race is nothing but a sense of insecurity of the slave takers.........Africa is richer, and they know it.

Ejanla07:


So the yorubas ve internal wranglings. . Thought the Igbos will kill thr selves once dey get biafra. . We laughing at u all

STFU. What internal rambling are you alluding to?

A despotic king got dethroned by a next despotic king and folks from the former's maternal side colluded with the colonial masters to exile the latter to a next part of Yorubaland. So, how does that equate to "internal wranglings"?

A lot of you Igbos are miserable illiterates and you want everyone to be part of ya misery. Sorry, this isn't the thread for that. Heck, even if there's internal ramblings, how does that negate anything since human beings are naturally competitive and folks will always disagree. Even siamese and biological twins disagree. GTFOH and go solve ya Igbo problems.

LordAdam:

You have a point about not forgetting history. I don't forget about history. I don't expect any true sub-Saharan African to ever forget. But it should not be yoke over us that stymies us from pressing forward.

Israel and the US (with the largest population of Jews outside Israel) still do business with Germany. China may have their differences with Japan and the West, but they trade with them, and even invest there. China is the largest oversea creditor of the US.

Politics and development shouldn't be Siamese twins. Every type of political system (whether democracy, monarchy, or communism) on the planet has at least one model country that is developed. So, we can't use our apathy of the slave trade and brutal colonial past as a reason not to shake hands and move our region forward.

Personally, I've placed that behind me. Maybe, it's easier for me because it's been generations since slave trade ended. But I look around the world, and I see everyone has moved on. Everyone is moving to greater heights, while sub-Saharan Africa is holding the tabs for only God knows what. And passing the buck isn't going to change anything.

You know why?

Because passing the buck hasn't changed anything yet. I'm not certain, doing it for another half a century will change anything.

If you are waiting for a Marshall Plan from the West for Africa. I hate to break it to you, it's not coming. It's why I call this a pity-party.

If it isn't a pity party, then we should be as developed as Asia and then keep the rhetoric going. It'd be more tolerable then.

Do you know that there is a strong apathy between the people of Hong Kong and those of Mainland China? Want to experience it first hand? Speak Mandarin in a store in Hong Kong...

Yet, these places are far developed than anywhere in sub-Saharan Africa (including South Africa).

Or should we talk about the apathy between India and Pakistan. China and many of its neighbors (Japan, Malaysia). These guys have the memory of an elephant. But in spite of all these, these countries are in a better position than 99% of countries in sub-Saharan Africa.

This is exactly why I call what we've been doing for the past 60 years a pity-party. And why we need a wake up call.

The world is tired of feeling sorry for a people who can yell aloud about how their resources (both human and natural) were pillaged for centuries, while let our own leaders launder at least $45b every year from the continent. And live in crisis-, disease-, hunger-infested, and underdeveloped climes.

-Lord

I think the mistake folks who have your outlook make is that: they look at things from the simplistic side of things, without taking time out to analyse things and look beyond the cover. Yes, individually, just like everyone else - you can make personal adjustment against it, albeit you can't escape some elements of it. However, collectively, things haven't really changed but the chains and over dehumanisation are gone.

Let's start with the biggest reason why Africa is so underdeveloped and backward. You'd see that the colonial maps, neo-colonialism/imperialism, and mis-education are the biggest problems in Africa - not corruption and bad leadership. Corruption and bad leadership are the bastard offspring of the three-headed dragon that I listed. See with corruption, there's no country that isn't corrupt. Heck, most enlightened folks would argue that the US is most corrupt country in world (most of the folks running the show in the US are utterly corrupt including folks like Bill Gates who's using his foundation as a front to "charitable" causes to enrich himself and we all know what the Clintons use their foundation for). But that hasn't stopped it from being the best country in the world. And bad leadership is due to neo-colonial imposition cause of neo-colonialism, structure of the colonial maps, and mis-education of the people. So, you can't solve these problems without the legacies of the dark past. That's what a lot of folks don't understand. Evidently, collectively there's still a BIG problem, but individually, you can always do better - albeit it won't change anything.

Now, let me discuss the west cos that's my experience. You can come to the west as African and do whatever it takes to make it, including slaving it up and trying to fit in. However, that doesn't negate the fact that collectively, the black population has been systematically effed up and boxed in - and that has been going on for generations. Yes, the chains and overt forms of it are long gone. But that doesn't negate what is going on.

I was checking the list of the murder capitals in the US recently and it wasn't shocking that all the top-20 cities are cities with huge black population. You might look at it from a simplistic view that these black folks just love killing one another. However, someone who understands what's going on know what's going on cos they're not the one making the guns. You've to look back and start with what happened when slavery ended and how all slaves were let go without giving them anything or rehabilitation. They all ended up in the slums. Surprisingly after that, they created the police to arresting homeless and unemployed folks. So, in effect, they criminalised them after slavery. Now, fast forward to the 60s when they started fighting for civil rights and how the black folks started moving to bigger cities for employment. This triggered black folks forming groups in the new cities they moved to defend themselves against white gangs. Later, white flight, which comes with having too many black folks in an area started happening. And the civil right groups they formed were reined in. The 70s came, the Reagan era, and crack cocaine and guns were flooded into black neighbourhoods to fund illegal US wars oversea. Then the killings started. And they decided to further criminalise them with drug laws that targeted the dealers, not the user. The trend continued since then and has moved from the US to other black diaspora communities in the West cos they all have a lot in common.

^^^Up there, I just gave you three layers of systematic destruction against black folks. Individually, you can escape it - but collectively, it's deeper than what you think it's. Regardless, we as a people have to do better. However, when you talk about the elephant in the room - it isn't about trying to play victim, it's about saying it as it's. Other folks don't have it bad and that's the honest truth. So, you can't compare the black struggle to those of the Japanese, Jews, Koreans, etc.

SirShymexx:


STFU. What internal rambling are you alluding to?

A despotic king got dethroned by a next despotic king and folks from the former's maternal side colluded with the colonial masters to exile the latter to a next part of Yorubaland. So, how does that equate to "internal wranglings"?

A lot of you Igbos are miserable illiterates and you want everyone to be part of ya misery. Sorry, this isn't the thread for that. Heck, even if there's internal ramblings, how does that negate anything since human beings are naturally competitive and folks will always disagree. Even siamese and biological twins disagree. GTFOH and go solve ya Igbo problems.

The long epistle doesn't stop the yoruba from having internal wranglings

Ejanla07:



The long epistle doesn't stop the yoruba from having internal wranglings

LordAdam and Sir Shymmex,
The African situation is a big and complex issue. To solve complex issue the evident problem must first be identified, the root of the problem should be located. This is diagnosis. Next is to see if a solution is possible and realistic. This is done by studying the chronology of the system...its past. If it worked efficiently at one time, it can work efficiently again after resuscitation. Then a solution path is drafted to begin the recovery. Next a pilot program, or model, is built to demonstrate the possibility and document process. A communication goes out to get buy in from those it will affect. At last the implementation begins. Finally the problem solves.

In Africa we are yet to even identify on the surface why our development is retarded and what are its roots.

Using Yorubaland as a simple model, since this is what Im familiar with, our problem lies in mis-identification. In other words, we are living with the wrong identificatiin for ancestry.

Ancestry is used here as the over-arching tenet for spiritualism, customs, worship, language, state, and sovereingty.

Yorubaland has shifted away from Adamuism to Eurocentrism, but we are not of European anestry, so why live like oyibo? At one point Adamuism worked for us effectively, out of one we produced many sovereingty and established a social order and civilization that ruled lands far and beyond. Is it recoverable? Today we live underneath a social order central to lands far away from us. Pathetic!

Lets discuss and use Yorubaland as a model for recovery. There should not be a English speaking Yoruba in Nigeria and Ghana and a French speaking Yoruba in Benin and Togo....we should just have Yoruba speaking sovereingties, period!

What is the template to adopt and realize this as a a mini objective and building block into the much larger challenge of resuscitating Black consciousness across the globe? Share thoughts.

SirShymexx:


I think the mistake folks who have your outlook make is that: they look at things from the simplistic side of things, without taking time out to analyse things and look beyond the cover. Yes, individually, just like everyone else - you can make personal adjustment against it, albeit you can't escape some elements of it. However, collectively, things haven't really changed but the chains and over dehumanisation are gone.

Let's start with the biggest reason why Africa is so underdeveloped and backward. You'd see that the colonial maps, neo-colonialism/imperialism, and mis-education are the biggest problems in Africa - not corruption and bad leadership. Corruption and bad leadership are the bastard offspring of the three-headed dragon that I listed. See with corruption, there's no country that isn't corrupt. Heck, most enlightened folks would argue that the US is most corrupt country in world (most of the folks running the show in the US are utterly corrupt including folks like Bill Gates who's using his foundation as a front to "charitable" causes to enrich himself and we all know what the Clintons use their foundation for). But that hasn't stopped it from being the best country in the world. And bad leadership is due to neo-colonial imposition cause of neo-colonialism, structure of the colonial maps, and mis-education of the people. So, you can't solve these problems without the legacies of the dark past. That's what a lot of folks don't understand. Evidently, collectively there's still a BIG problem, but individually, you can always do better - albeit it won't change anything.

Now, let me discuss the west cos that's my experience. You can come to the west as African and do whatever it takes to make it, including slaving it up and trying to fit in. However, that doesn't negate the fact that collectively, the black population has been systematically effed up and boxed in - and that has been going on for generations. Yes, the chains and overt forms of it are long gone. But that doesn't negate what is going on.

I was checking the list of the murder capitals in the US recently and it wasn't shocking that all the top-20 cities are cities with huge black population. You might look at it from a simplistic view that these black folks just love killing one another. However, someone who understands what's going on know what's going on cos they're not the one making the guns. You've to look back and start with what happened when slavery ended and how all slaves were let go without giving them anything or rehabilitation. They all ended up in the slums. Surprisingly after that, they created the police to arresting homeless and unemployed folks. So, in effect, they criminalised them after slavery. Now, fast forward to the 60s when they started fighting for civil rights and how the black folks started moving to bigger cities for employment. This triggered black folks forming groups in the new cities they moved to defend themselves against white gangs. Later, white flight, which comes with having too many black folks in an area started happening. And the civil right groups they formed were reined in. The 70s came, the Reagan era, and crack cocaine and guns were flooded into black neighbourhoods to fund illegal US wars oversea. Then the killings started. And they decided to further criminalise them with drug laws that targeted the dealers, not the user. The trend continued since then and has moved from the US to other black diaspora communities in the West cos they all have a lot in common.

^^^Up there, I just gave you three layers of systematic destruction against black folks. Individually, you can escape it - but collectively, it's deeper than what you think it's. Regardless, we as a people have to do better. However, when you talk about the elephant in the room - it isn't about trying to play victim, it's about saying it as it's. Other folks don't have it bad and that's the honest truth. So, you can't compare the black struggle to those of the Japanese, Jews, Koreans, etc.

Oh dear, you just like passing the blame on to someone else right! Like others should be perfect. Or the whites should be benevolent gods from Asgard to the blacks?

Listen to yourself!

What are the Fulanis doing in Nigeria? Yes, to fellow black people.

I don't think the black man has the moral right to ask for any correctionism, when we've been so eff*ng shameful at doing the basic thing of respecting each other.

And I don't need lengthy write-ups to prove that.

The Jews have endured more than any black ethnicity on the planet, so your example is in poor taste. It started around 3000 BC (Egypt) and extended all the way to 1945 (Western Europe), and you dare compare them to a three century old slave trade with undeniable influence from blacks.

What about Haiti, Jamaica, Trinidad and Tobago, Barbados and the likes? Are they great model of governance? After all, the blacks built the structures in the countries and have been managing it since.

Asia and South America experienced the three-headed dragon. The Europeans were just as ruthless in Asia as they were in Africa. So what exactly is your excuse for Asia moving on, and Africa remaining in the back-burner.

This 'they're at fault' rhetoric is getting nauseating. We've been playing it since 1960. Of all the major names that championed Pan-Africanism after being educated by the whites to be independent and strive for self-actualization, how many built model societies. I can only look at Robert Kaunda. Perhaps the most famous, Nkrumah started a dictatorship. Let's not talk about Azikiwe.

So, what is the excuse? Really what is it?

What the Whites did in America to the blacks is what the Fulanis did to the Yorubas in Illorin. Prolly worse even. I'm not saying the Whites get a pass because they can do no wrong. But we need to stop this hypocrisy.

It's always their fault. It's the devils fault. It's our leaders fault. When are we ever at fault? Never.

And you call what you just wrote "saying it as it is"? That's not what this is. This is giving an excuse for failure.

Yes, we've failed. We will keep failing. And there's no hope at the end of the tunnel, because knowledgeable and enlightened minds by yourself keep giving in to the old blackmail tactic of blaming the whites for all our predicaments.

Keep it up! It has been working for the past six decades right? Keep 'saying it as it is.' Maybe, you're going to get the UN to ask the West to rebuild Africa for free, while you're at it. And probably get the entire world to set up a trust fund for Africans, because we are so inept at taking charge of our future.

With the second largest populated continent, being the most gifted continent with natural resources, and having a rich diversity to draw from; we are still the joke of the world. It's a shame that we let ourselves remain shackled with all we've got. And you need me to give you a standing ovation?

Well, get it from your fellow pity-party comrades. I'm going to amputate myself before I jam my hands together for that irresponsible plot.

Seriously, this is just irritating. I can't ask you to change your views. You can keep creating monsters and targets for your deadbeat hoi polloi to throw darts at, while you guys remain a liability to the planet. That's your call to make.

Africa has a long way to go, and I'm afraid your ideology is another reason why! When you guys are ready to stop the irresponsible blame games, you can call my attention. Until then, happy sling-shotting.

So long, mate.

Have a great weekend.

-Lord

OPCNAIRALAND:
LordAdam and Sir Shymmex,
The African situation is a big and complex issue. To solve complex issue the evident problem must first be identified, the root of the problem should be located. This is diagnosis. Next is to see if a solution is possible and realistic. This is done by studying the chronology of the system...its past. If it worked efficiently at one time, it can work efficiently again after resuscitation. Then a solution path is drafted to begin the recovery. Next a pilot program, or model, is built to demonstrate the possibility and document process. A communication goes out to get buy in from those it will affect. At last the implementation begins. Finally the problem solves.

In Africa we are yet to even identify on the surface why our development is retarded and what are its roots.

Using Yorubaland as a simple model, since this is what Im familiar with, our problem lies in mis-identification. In other words, we are living with the wrong identificatiin for ancestry.

Ancestry is used here as the over-arching tenet for spiritualism, customs, worship, language, state, and sovereingty.

Yorubaland has shifted away from Adamuism to Eurocentrism, but we are not of European anestry, so why live like oyibo? At one point Adamuism worked for us effectively, out of one we produced many sovereingty and established a social order and civilization that ruled lands far and beyond. Is it recoverable? Today we live underneath a social order central to lands far away from us. Pathetic!

Lets discuss and use Yorubaland as a model for recovery. There should not be a English speaking Yoruba in Nigeria and Ghana and a French speaking Yoruba in Benin and Togo....we should just have Yoruba speaking sovereingties, period!

What is the template to adopt and realize this as a a mini objective and building block into the much larger challenge of resuscitating Black consciousness across the globe? Share thoughts.

We've not even being able to fully capture what the problem is. Nelson Mandela knew, and he was right that it wasn't all about demonizing the Whites, bad as they may be!

Africa needs to let go. Not forget. Let go.

We can't progress if we don't confront our past, forgive our former adversaries, and see them as partners in our new journey to Elysia. Asia and South America did not get to where they are now without the West. Yes, the same people that fuc*ed them up so badly.

And it's a terrible trait we possess. Even in Nigeria, we don't teach history about the civil war. No one wants to talk about the Asaba massacre. No one wants to confront the past. No one wants to talk about the fact that sixty years ago, our fathers and grand fathers shut down our humanity as we let millions of fellow Africans starve to death. The new generation are so eager to even put more blood on their hands.

Yes, we have many justifications for our actions. But am sure we can look them in the eye and say it was worth it six decades later? When it clearly is not. And we can't even bridge the gap, get behind it, and court their help in moving the country forward. This is just Nigeria. In SA, after Nelson went off the scene, it's back to angling the whites. What have the SA blacks gained? Your guess is as good as mine.

The US and the UK have a special relationship today. It wasn't so rosy when America was fighting for its independence. After WW2, the Germans got a Marshall Plan that was well managed. Without it, Germany may not have become the cornerstone of the European economy today. Ditto for Japan. Former foes became allies, and former write-offs became the shining stars.

And over here, we're still talking about speaking Yoruba. What is the lingua franca in most South American countries? But look at Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Peru... Doing better than most of sub-Saharan Africa.

Whenever the fools at AU come together, it's always about the we against them mentality. And then they sell their skewed version of pan-Africanism to the gullible populace to hide their complacency, stupidity, crassness, and total inability to act as functional human beings.


Look at the leaders of the two biggest sub-Saharan economies? Complete mofos. And you say African situation is complex. If it is so complex, why are countries like Ghana, Kenya, and Botswana acting like they are close to the solution while others are acting like they are so comfortable with where they are.

Look at Lagos, why is it fast-becoming a success story, without Yoruba being the dominant language, and it receiving investments from every corner of the globe, including the West that your ilk say are out worst enemies.

That we don't realize that everyone's got an interest is bewildering. China is not giving us those loans for free. EU wants to maintain dominance. So if we want to take a seat at the table, we've got to fight for it. It wouldn't be handed to us on a platter.

If you say wrong identification with ancestry is our problem, why are we yet to fix that? We do have the power to make our own laws right? Why don't we have a Yoruba day or Hausa day or Igbo day. Or state-funded research institutes into our ancestry and ancient civilizations in Nigeria (it's not just the job of history professors in our tertiary institutions). I'm sure it's the Whites too holding us back right?

We are just a bunch of clueless people who like running in different directions, because we are so scared to come together, look each other in the eye and tell ourselves the blunt truth--that the African problem needs an African solution. And that this solution requires the commitment of other global entities (because no one is an Island), which we can't get by sling shotting, but by carefully making, following and actualizing a plan for this purpose. Which is the exact opposite of what we doing. In fact, that's not really accurate. We're not doing anything really.

Pan-Africanism got to a fiery start. Now it's going in so many directions, it looks like a divergent beam from a torchlight.

Even if the whole Africa can't and won't get together for a sit-down, what's stopping the largest black country on the planet from seizing the initiative. And then let others join the train or perish.

Anyway, I've gone long enough. Let's keep looking for phantom problems, like language, religion, culture, or what have you as the perfect scape goat to pin our massive failure on. And let's just forget that other people under similar circumstances have and are doing great.

Most of South America speak Spanish, practice Catholicism, and only trace heritage to long forgotten civilizations like the Aztecs, the Mayans et cetera. Yet it didn't stop them from seeking and actualizing massive development.

A people that want to succeed will succeed, regardless of the odds they face. Let's stop making excuses and start finding solutions. Scratch that, workable solutions, not irrational solutions like eroding a standing lingua franca, or being an economic island (yea, some people propose that we don't do business with the West because they're so evil).

-Lord

^^^
There are some embellishments in your response which, beside mentioning awareness, Im not going to dig into since they are not principal to the theme under discussion.

Social order is a first and fundamental principle of society. It is the framework that nation building, and ultimately, development and progress rest on.

At one point in their history the Asian examples you stated spoke the language of their colonial lords. Their social heirarchy was modeled after their colonial master's. Their academies were Eurocentric. Today these countries have subordinated the colonial civilization to home grown philosophies. Language, art, knowledge, worship, dress mode, cinema...have all found outlet in indigenous tongues and customs. This simply is the first step in rebirth. The second stage of their transformation is borrowed, again out of their indigenous principles, that humanity is one and diversity yields evolution.

So whatever gains is attributed to the new age in Asia is founded in their revolutionary change for recognition and elevation of indigeneous ancestry.

Ahmadinejad is fluent in English language and French, yet during his term as President speaks Farsi when on international engagement.

India began to exercise policies aimed at rebirthing itself, Pakistan and Bangladesh found it incompatible and went separate ways.

You might contend that Brazil is at par with India and still speaking colonial language. This is so because India was before England colonized it, whereas there was nothing known as Brazil before its colonization by Portuguese. Again, indigenization...in other words ancestry, ....is the framework around which any society can hope to reinvent and emerge as a respectable member of human society.

Yoruba has a philosophy that is reinventable. We must first indigenize ourselves. This is the mission the new Ooni has started. He is not condemning others, but he talks everyday about Yoruba language and unification of the Sixteen principles of ancestry. He knows what he is doing. Within the Sixteen principles are the Sovereign Crowns (Nationhood), Ifa Theology (Philosophy), deity worship (Divinity), urbanism (Diversity), art (Scholarship), and so on and so forth....

Each ethnic people waking up to its own reinvention accumulates to a new consciousness and awakening that self-evolve and gradually sheds the undesirable aspects stereotypical to Black lives and societies.

LordAdam

I don't think you have an understanding of the subject matter. Honestly, a lot of you don't, hence I don't bother most times. I'll post this last comment and leave it there.

Nelson Mandela like most black leaders/people, he was a simp – hence he sold out his people, for hero-worship in the west. Nelson Mandela isn’t a good example to cite cos he’s the reason why his people are the way they’re. Black South Africans (if coloured population is added to their population) make up almost 90% of the population, yet almost 90% of the South African economy/wealth is owned by the whites. Evidently, the Nelson Mandela example is a terrible one.

I don't even think you know the history of Haiti, Jamaica and the rest of the Caribbean countries you cited and how they're governed. Haiti's history is deep. And all the Caribbean countries you cited are till indirectly under British rule - with the Queen as the head of those countries.

American independence has no correlation whatsoever with black folks. A bunch of renegade ethnic Brits, Irish, and a few other European with the support of the French in Canada and African slaves – fighting again their homeland for the total control of their new abode – has no correlation whatsoever with the struggle of black folks.

Lagos isn’t a success story and a terrible example. Any overpopulated shytehole with the concentration of almost all the resources in a country that has some natural resources. I bet you don’t know that cities like Cairo, Algiers, Cape Town, and J’burg have higher GDP than Lagos. And apart from Cairo, which as overpopulated as Lagos – the rest are decent cities and they represent what thriving cities ought to look like. If you understand economics, you’d know that Lagos on the other hand is a shytehole and a human disaster and what a city shouldn’t be.

What did Fulanis do to Yorubas in Ilorin that’s comparable to 400 years of killing, raping, maiming, and dehumanisation of a people – while using them for free labour? What happened in Ilorin is similar to how the US took California, New Mexico, Texas, Arizona etc. from Mexico – or how the UK has Northern Ireland under it – no correlation whatsoever with what we’re discussing. I honestly doubt you understand the history of Ilorin, and/or the subject matter.

And no, South Americans don’t practise pure Catholicism – they practise a hybrid form of it, with African religions. They created their own based on the convergence of the different cultures they’ve there.

Anyway, I’ll stop here cos I don’t think you have a proper grasp of the complexities of the problems plaguing Africans and black folks in general. It’s deeper than the simplistic way you’re looking at it. And even if you were to wake up tomorrow and kill all the corrupt folks and kow-tow to while folks – the problems are still going to be there. When you look at the foundation – you’ll see how effed up most African countries are – compared to, say, European countries. Evidently, things are never going to change – unless you appoint a brutal totalitarian with one-track mind, albeit with a good vision, to put everything in order. And he has to rule for at least 40 years lool.

But regardless, personally, I neither give a shyte about white folks nor rate them for anything. History is just there never to be forgotten and to solve ya problems, you always have to be cognizant about ya and how it affects ya existence.

OPCNAIRALAND:
LordAdam and Sir Shymmex,
The African situation is a big and complex issue. To solve complex issue the evident problem must first be identified, the root of the problem should be located. This is diagnosis. Next is to see if a solution is possible and realistic. This is done by studying the chronology of the system...its past. If it worked efficiently at one time, it can work efficiently again after resuscitation. Then a solution path is drafted to begin the recovery. Next a pilot program, or model, is built to demonstrate the possibility and document process. A communication goes out to get buy in from those it will affect. At last the implementation begins. Finally the problem solves.

In Africa we are yet to even identify on the surface why our development is retarded and what are its roots.

Using Yorubaland as a simple model, since this is what Im familiar with, our problem lies in mis-identification. In other words, we are living with the wrong identificatiin for ancestry.

Ancestry is used here as the over-arching tenet for spiritualism, customs, worship, language, state, and sovereingty.

Yorubaland has shifted away from Adamuism to Eurocentrism, but we are not of European anestry, so why live like oyibo? At one point Adamuism worked for us effectively, out of one we produced many sovereingty and established a social order and civilization that ruled lands far and beyond. Is it recoverable? Today we live underneath a social order central to lands far away from us. Pathetic!

Lets discuss and use Yorubaland as a model for recovery. There should not be a English speaking Yoruba in Nigeria and Ghana and a French speaking Yoruba in Benin and Togo....we should just have Yoruba speaking sovereingties, period!

What is the template to adopt and realize this as a a mini objective and building block into the much larger challenge of resuscitating Black consciousness across the globe? Share thoughts.

I already cited the three layers of the fundamental problems of Africa:

- Neo-colonialism.
- Colonial maps.
- Mis-education.

When you compare the structures of African countries to their European counterparts, you’d see that 99% of them aren’t even meant to be countries. Evidently, you’ll never make any progress whatsoever when you’re trying to live a next man’s experiment - especially when the man is an enemy. Hence I’ll never have a problem with Biafrans and their agitation unless they become covetous like they do most times.

There’s for the small ones if they can fix a few things…but I don’t think any of the big ones in Sub-Saharan Africa will ever surpass South Africa. And as the population grows, these countries would become much worse. But I’ll put Algeria and Angola in the African context as outliers cos Algerians are 99% Berbers and Angolans are close to 70% similar Bantus, albeit some are somewhat different. So, I won't surprised if both ever become fairly decent.

Personally, I’ll bet on Somalia being in a better shape than Nigeria in the next 30 years, if it can get over the hump/wars and become a decent country cos it has what it takes.

Interesting, pls give us more

SirShymexx:


Not debating if what he did was special or not. When you you wipe out ya own extended family, including women and kids, especially 2,000 folks out of less than 50,000 people (I doubt the population of Eko back then was up to 50,000) - you can't get a pass from me.

If ever you get in a position of power or authority, allow whoemever you deem an obvious threat to your survival go to bed at night then see if you wake up in the morning.

LordAdam:


It's been 60+ years after the slave trade, why are we still so screwed up as a people.


-Lord

Excuse you?

Sir Shymmex,
I believe in the inherent connection between mankind and his indigenous soil and every aspect of nurture native to the soil. There is good reason every human civilization have a earth cult they worship and venerate. It follows that man himself is a earth mineral and very resourceful when alloyed, in the right mix and refinement, with certain other gifts of nature discernible through the physical senses of man and as well in the silence of the metaphysical senses of man.

My first encounter of blacks in America was in the nightlife, clubbing and partying. I was reminded to be careful that they are terrifying and don't value life. After couple of weekend outings I came to my own conclusion that blacks everywhere are the same, whether in Africa, Europe or America. The rhythym and note of inspiration in black man occur to him through the silence of his being. He is the closest being to life sustaining energies and their essences but his physical senses are dulled that what he ears, sees, feels through his inner being are blocked from finding meaning in outward physical needs and utilization.

The black man is at the same wavelength of physical presence with a stone, a rock, a tree, grains of sand, rainwater, stream, river, and so on.

We see a tree and view it as an extension of ourselves. We see the river as a part of our being. It is uncomfortable for us to exploit that which we see as extension of self.

The aboriginal blackman will not cut down a tree to build himself a shelter but will do so to build a drum that he can use to perform sacred dance to his deities. He will not mine the soil to dig up the buried treasures for commercial profit but he will do so to melt the gold so he can bury his dead parent as he travels to the land of ancestry. He refuses to dam the stream so he can trap fish upstream to feed his family but prefer to worship the stream in good faith that it will steer fish to his net and his family will not go hungry.

These are the ways of the blackman. Some will criticize it and say it is undesirable and say we are cursed. I disagree.

The multiGrammy Award winning James Ingram, in an interview, related how back when he was new in Hollywood and did some work for Ray Charles one of his dub recordings was played for Quincy Jones, who stopped by to ask if Ray has any upcoming songs. After listening to it Quincy called to see the guy who recorded the dub. In their meeting James was asked if he could read sheet music and he responded no. He was asked if he has ever taken any music lesson or been tutored in instruments, he replied no. Quincy advised him never ever to learn sheet music or take music lessons but continue to play his music by inner senses unti after retirement from music production. The same James Ingram played the base in Bad Mama Jamma for Carl Carlton. He wrote PYT for Michael Jackson. He has worked for or with many artistes, including Prince, Barry White, and so on.

I say this to highlight that the black race is not endowed for attachment to the rudiments of outward survival. He is most concerned with inward survival and explains why blacks all over the world hope and pray to a divine principal for the way forward, instead of activating the resources around us to erect a way forward.

What we have in our inner being the white race lack. What they have in their sharp outer senses we lack. Therefore each should use the rule of comparative advantage to best itself.

The earth is designed for collaborative effort. We see it echoed in every aspect of existence. Therefore the black must partner in collaborative efforts with white to better humanity.

Black is already in that partnership. What we need but lack is the discipline of identity, to realize that we cannot be what whites are because their endowment is unique and we are not built to fit in it. We must embrace our own enwdowment, that which sustained our ancestors before our awakening and diversion away from our legacy and oneness with the soil.

SirShymexx:


Lol. Why didn't you quote me? Scared much?

Don't turn this into Egbas vs. Ijebus cos Ijebus also sold tons of slaves. However, that doesn't negate my point about the Egbas cos they were instrumental in his defeat. And I believe Akitoye's mum was Egba and that might've also played a role cos he escaped to Abeokuta when Kosoko dethroned him.

Egbas loved white men back then and in return, the white man gave them Bible, munitions, and military training. Ever wondered why Ijebus who were the first naij folks to have contacts with white men, were the last to accept Christianity? And when Christianity came to Ijebuland, it came via the Egbas through Remo?

Sir, is the highlighted section a statement of fact?

rexbuton:


Sir, is the highlighted section a statement of fact?

that can never be facts and its not even correct.

SirShymexx:




Personally, in as much as I believe that majority of black folks who were enslaved in the new world were captured and a lot of them were already in the Americas, coupled with the ones they took from Europe, after black rule in Iberia collapsed - I think if we're going to call out white for folks for the crimes they committed during slavery, the kings complicit in the act, shouldn't get a pass. They're the reason why we're effed up today as black folks cos if they had shown the type of faux-bravery/power they used in ruling their people to take the war to white folks when they came back for colonisation - we'd be better off today.

They all sold folks for stupid shyte, but when the real war came to defend their kingdoms against colonisation - they couldn't fight. Only Ethiopia was able to fight them off. Ditto those in Kongo, albeit they took heavy losses and later caved in.

Only Akitoye might get a pass from me cos he tried to stop slavery. However, the vested interests denied him.

This holds true, till this current day; u dont argue with a gun!

Even d Ethiopians, were at a point, colonised by d Italians!

masseratti:
that can never be facts and its not even correct.

And what are the "facts" according to real history and early European explorers - not some village jejune tales/revisionism for dyck waving?

Please educate me.

rexbuton:


Sir, is the highlighted section a statement of fact?

That's the truth.

The first European explorers (Portuguese) got the West Africa in the 14th century and the first stop was Sierra Leone. Then they came down the coast all the way to Nigeria, and later went to Fernando Po and Kongo areas.

Now, before I post academic references: if you're to travel by sea from Sierra Leone to Nigeria according to the map - I believe the first people you would meet are the folks on the coast. And that would happen to be Aworis and Ijebus at that point in history. Then the Itsekiris. But Aworis were farmers back then and never lived on the coast. And the Ijebus were the only ones on the coast selling clothes.

So, who would you meet first?

Anyway, I'll dig my archives for Olfert Dapper's writings and post academic proofs in a bit, to answer the question, before I move to other things.

ISpiksDaTroof:


Excuse you?

It's an error.

You probably got that.

But thanks for pointing that out, I'll edit my post.

Happy Sunday!

-Lord