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Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? - Travel (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by maternal: 5:32pm On Jan 02, 2017
TWoods:


To be honest, I think this was a passive aggressive and totally unnecessary confrontation with someone who was probably just trying to start a friendly conversation. I'm also fairly up the income/social ladder here myself and i often get the "where are you from" question from most people. The lady was correct, it's impossible for anyone born and raised in the US to have the sort of accent like yours so it was a fair question. There was no need for your response. It's ok to simply state that you were born African but a naturalized US citizen. We joke about it in my office here, people try really hard to say my name and i tease them by scoring them on points based on who can say the name the best. We all have a good laugh and that's it. I work with 99.9% whites and have never felt any disrespect on account of my name or accent (which people think ranges from English to Jamaican).

If you search desperately for bias or bigotry, you will find it.

Thank you. Though it obviously exist. My former Cameroon friend would claim a white guy was racist towards him, due to the way the white guy looked at him. He was crazy man.
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 5:47pm On Jan 02, 2017
maternal:


Thank you. Though it obviously exist. My former Cameroon friend would claim a white guy was racist towards him, due to the way the white guy looked at him. He was crazy man.

The danger about subtle racism is the fact that often time it can only be felt or perceived by the victim alone. And when the victim tries to cry for help, people think he is overreacting or he is crazy.

9 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TWoods(m): 2:02am On Jan 03, 2017
TheCongo2:


The danger about subtle racism is the fact that often time it can only be felt or perceived by the victim alone. And when the victim tries to cry for help, people think he is overreacting or he is crazy.

The danger about "subtle racism" is that often it is misinterpreted. Often times the "victims" end up being like the shepherd boy who cried wolf a little too often.

6 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Nobody: 8:13am On Jan 03, 2017
Is NIGERIA'S TRIBALISM not worse than the RACISM across the borders...??

15 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 8:20am On Jan 03, 2017
EVILFOREST:
Is NIGERIA'S TRIBALISM not worse than the RACISM across the borders...??
It may or may not.........(subjective) but we are not here to compare Nigeria vs USA/ western countries. The topic did say do you as a naturalized US citizen get fully respected/ treated as a native born citizen.
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 8:28am On Jan 03, 2017
TWoods:


To be honest, I think this was a passive aggressive and totally unnecessary confrontation with someone who was probably just trying to start a friendly conversation. I'm also fairly up the income/social ladder here myself and i often get the "where are you from" question from most people. The lady was correct, it's impossible for anyone born and raised in the US to have the sort of accent like yours so it was a fair question. There was no need for your response. It's ok to simply state that you were born African but a naturalized US citizen. We joke about it in my office here, people try really hard to say my name and i tease them by scoring them on points based on who can say the name the best. We all have a good laugh and that's it. I work with 99.9% whites and have never felt any disrespect on account of my name or accent (which people think ranges from English to Jamaican).

If you search desperately for bias or bigotry, you will find it.
Good write up but let me address some issues you raised; how many times do you go around asking people born in the USA where they are from? i mean you from the Southern US like Texas, Alabama, S. Carolina etc. secondly...this question is for you what response would you elicit from an american if you asked (reverse racism now) were your great great grandparents slaveholders or telling someone from south Carolina who is white do you support slavery? as long as i'm concerned certain questions require certain answers and my answer was assertive not passive, aggressive or passive-aggressive. thanks
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TWoods(m): 9:04am On Jan 03, 2017
lindaayim:

Good write up but let me address some issues you raised; how many times do you go around asking people born in the USA where they are from? i mean you from the Southern US like Texas, Alabama, S. Carolina etc. secondly...this question is for you what response would you elicit from an american if you asked (reverse racism now) were your great great grandparents slaveholders or telling someone from south Carolina who is white do you support slavery? as long as i'm concerned certain questions require certain answers and my answer was assertive not passive, aggressive or passive-aggressive. thanks

This is a fairly routine question that almost every American will get at some point. We often make fun of the southern drawl, the Jersey accent, the NY accent. This is nothing new. People comment on the French accent all the time... I work with European/Asian colleagues and part of our typical banter is trying to guess what country each person is from based on their accents. As far as i'm concerned, you're making a mountain out of a molehill. The problem is that you are very sensitive to anything that might be construed as racism so you take offense anytime you get a question that somewhat reminds you of your place of birth. There is nothing to be ashamed of in being born Nigerian.

Most white Americans are fiercely proud of their European heritage even though they are natural born US citizens. What is wrong in being proud of your Nigerian heritage, even if you are naturalized?

Your question with regards slavery is completely irrelevant. What has an accent to do with whether someone else had grandparent slave owners? Those are two completely dissimilar topics.

Your response to your co-worker was aggressive. Basically you've painted yourself into a corner... all of them now know to be extra sensitive and watchful of anything they say around you. Don't be surprised if they are not willing to invite you to out of office events.

You don't seem to understand what the term "assertive" means.

16 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 9:44am On Jan 03, 2017
TWoods:


This is a fairly routine question that almost every American will get at some point. We often make fun of the southern drawl, the Jersey accent, the NY accent. This is nothing new. People comment on the French accent all the time... I work with European/Asian colleagues and part of our typical banter is trying to guess what country each person is from based on their accents. As far as i'm concerned, you're making a mountain out of a molehill. The problem is that you are very sensitive to anything that might be construed as racism so you take offense anytime you get a question that somewhat reminds you of your place of birth. There is nothing to be ashamed of in being born Nigerian.

Most white Americans are fiercely proud of their European heritage even though they are natural born US citizens. What is wrong in being proud of your Nigerian heritage, even if you are naturalized?

Your question with regards slavery is completely irrelevant. What has an accent to do with whether someone else had grandparent slave owners? Those are two completely dissimilar topics.

Your response to your co-worker was aggressive. Basically you've painted yourself into a corner... all of them now know to be extra sensitive and watchful of anything they say around you. Don't be surprised if they are not willing to invite you to out of office events.

You don't seem to understand what the term "assertive" means.
You must have plenty of downtime/time at work to be playing a guess game on peoples accent...i guess u got nice job though. on the matter of irrelevance which you brought up i guess u misunderstood my position and am leaving it at that... talking about not understanding what is assertive i believe you need to go read the meaning of what being assertive is. aside the above you made a good point of being proud of my Nigerian heritage but maybe you didn't read the topic. It's doesn't primarily focus on one's heritage but focuses on how naturalized citizens are treated compared to native born. thanks

3 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by maternal: 12:01pm On Jan 03, 2017
TheCongo2:


The danger about subtle racism is the fact that often time it can only be felt or perceived by the victim alone. And when the victim tries to cry for help, people think he is overreacting or he is crazy.

If you apply to be a pharmacists with just a high school diploma you're not a victim, you're just an idiot. Stop it.

4 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by maternal: 12:03pm On Jan 03, 2017
lindaayim:

It may or may not.........(subjective) but we are not here to compare Nigeria vs USA/ western countries. The topic did say do you as a naturalized US citizen get fully respected/ treated as a native born citizen.

It's is and you know it. At the end of the day if people with the same colour as yourself discriminate against you, can you really be mad/surprise if those without do the same ?

1 Like

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by thebaft: 12:35pm On Jan 03, 2017
lindaayim:
Sometimes i struggle with the feeling that i'm an american and also a Nigerian in america. when i say struggle, i feel certain jobs i apply for despite being qualified as a citizen is not given and at the end native-born citizens are preferred despite having similar or better training. i feel the accent thing no matter how much american u claim affects u a little bit. Some people still see you as foreign. Actually some americans don't even believe you are a citizen with full rights like them. feel free to share your opinions..

So my question will be... Is the bias targeted towards only Africans or all immigrants in general?
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 1:47pm On Jan 03, 2017
thebaft:


So my question will be... Is the bias targeted towards only Africans or all immigrants in general?
i can't speak for all immigrants but myself. if you asked my opinion i will say its is more likely for a native born citizen to get treated favorably than a naturalized citizen...also it could be subjective
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TWoods(m): 3:38pm On Jan 03, 2017
lindaayim:

You must have plenty of downtime/time at work to be playing a guess game on peoples accent...i guess u got nice job though. on the matter of irrelevance which you brought up i guess u misunderstood my position and am leaving it at that... talking about not understanding what is assertive i believe you need to go read the meaning of what being assertive is. aside the above you made a good point of being proud of my Nigerian heritage but maybe you didn't read the topic. It's doesn't primarily focus on one's heritage but focuses on how naturalized citizens are treated compared to native born. thanks

Yes i do have a good relationship with my work colleagues. We travel on business together, we take lunches together, we work on projects together majority of the time, we have frequent happy hours or attend private parties hosted by each other... all of them are white, natural born US citizens. We joke about our selves, but we do so respectfully.

Don't get me wrong, i am not saying that subjective bias does not occur in the work place but oftentimes the problem we minorities tend to have is we are hypersensitive to perceived discrimination. So we read meanings to innocent questions and get defensive, assuming that everyone is out to get us on account of our skin color, accent or countries of origin. My colleagues sometimes find funny memes on Nigeria or they may run into a topic on Nigeria they are curious about, they send it to me... we discuss. I find memes about their own heritage too, i send it to them, we discuss... and get on with our jobs. No offense taken. If you command respect in your workplace, people will treat you with respect.

I absolutely disagree that naturalized Americans are treated differently from natural born citizens. I wasn't even an immigrant for many of the years i lived and worked here... yet i never felt anyone treated me differently because of that. Everyone knows i am Nigerian first and foremost... i'm proud of it. Anyone who doesn't like that fact can kick rocks.

12 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 4:20pm On Jan 03, 2017
TWoods:


Yes i do have a good relationship with my work colleagues. We travel on business together, we take lunches together, we work on projects together majority of the time, we have frequent happy hours or attend private parties hosted by each other... all of them are white, natural born US citizens. We joke about our selves, but we do so respectfully.

Don't get me wrong, i am not saying that subjective bias does not occur in the work place but oftentimes the problem we minorities tend to have is we are hypersensitive to perceived discrimination. So we read meanings to innocent questions and get defensive, assuming that everyone is out to get us on account of our skin color, accent or countries of origin. My colleagues sometimes find funny memes on Nigeria or they may run into a topic on Nigeria they are curious about, they send it to me... we discuss. I find memes about their own heritage too, i send it to them, we discuss... and get on with our jobs. No offense taken. If you command respect in your workplace, people will treat you with respect.

I absolutely disagree that naturalized Americans are treated differently from natural born citizens. I wasn't even an immigrant for many of the years i lived and worked here... yet i never felt anyone treated me differently because of that. Everyone knows i am Nigerian first and foremost... i'm proud of it. Anyone who doesn't like that fact can kick rocks.

There is the notion of cumulative effect that should be taken into account.
Remember that it would take one straw "last straw" to break the strong back of a camel.
Seemingly minor or routine action can cause an unpredictably large and sudden reaction, because of the cumulative effect of small actions.

2 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Nobody: 4:21pm On Jan 03, 2017
TheCongo2:


There is the notion of cumulative effect that should be taken into account.
Remember that it would take one straw "last straw" to break a strong back of a camel.
Seemingly minor or routine action can cause an unpredictably large and sudden reaction, because of the cumulative effect of small actions.
shocked shocked shocked
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Goldenboy007(m): 7:40pm On Jan 03, 2017
OP this is a fantastic review and everything you said I also have observed. I am a naturalized American with the best of education from the US system. I work in the corporate America sector but I know there is the systemic racism. When we use the word "Blacks" please let's clarify who we are referring to ....Black American or Black immigrants. The black immigrants are highly educated and hardworking compared to their black American counterparts however the immigrants have struggled to be at par with their white colleagues. I work with one of the biggest Telecom companies in US and it's so hard to see a "black manager", although we have a handful of Nigerian managers but I doubt if they will go higher than that.
Should we blame the whites? No ! It's their Country and we can't blame them if we cannot fix our own Country. My advice is - never forget where you are from regardless your status.

12 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by thebaft: 10:54pm On Jan 03, 2017
lindaayim:

i can't speak for all immigrants but myself. if you asked my opinion i will say its is more likely for a native born citizen to get treated favorably than a naturalized citizen...also it could be subjective

I guess it is the fear of the unknown that leads to the difference in treatment. As an immigrant myself, I can relate to what you are saying, however I feel that these obstacles can be overcome. Just as women have to work twice as hard to prove their worth in the workplace, I guess that immigrants have to work twice as hard to get what natural born folks get for nothing. I still use the current CEO of Microsoft (Satya Nadella)as an example of this possibility.

Perhaps this article will cheer you up after reading it ...
https://hbr.org/2016/10/why-are-immigrants-more-entrepreneurial

2 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 11:25pm On Jan 03, 2017
maternal:


If you apply to be a pharmacists with just a high school diploma you're not a victim, you're just an idiot. Stop it.

Did you truly write "idiot" on this thread that could easily be used as an interesting topic for an academic essay ?

Anyway, it is possible that anyone driving slower than you is an idiot and anyone driving faster than you is a maniac. It is also possible that you are the idiot for driving slower or faster than them.

10 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by claremont(m): 11:31pm On Jan 03, 2017
TWoods:


Yes i do have a good relationship with my work colleagues. We travel on business together, we take lunches together, we work on projects together majority of the time, we have frequent happy hours or attend private parties hosted by each other... all of them are white, natural born US citizens. We joke about our selves, but we do so respectfully.

Don't get me wrong, i am not saying that subjective bias does not occur in the work place but oftentimes the problem we minorities tend to have is we are hypersensitive to perceived discrimination.

Discrimination is discrimination, regardless of whether it's overt or covert. The person who ''perceives'' the discrimination can either choose to ignore it, or fight against it; ignoring it on the pretext of trying to be a good team player automatically means that you are a part of the problem. It means that such practices wouldn't change, because the person on the receiving end believes that it's a normal part of being a team player. There is no such thing as being hypersensitive if a person believes that he/she has been treated unfairly, such a person is well within his/her rights to complain.

I will give an example of an applicant to a government job that just occurred here in the UK, and it was all over the news as well - a popular government TV station wanted to recruit 4 directors; and 5 people got to the final stage of the recruitment, 4 white males and 1 black female. The government chose to recruit the 4 white males for the 4 open slots, and when asked to justify their choices, the government said that the 4 white males were better qualified than the lone black female. That doesn't sound right to any rational person, and it doesn't instill confidence in highly-qualified black and ethnic minority groups who aim for the best government jobs.

In addition, comparing discrimination to the tribalism and nepotism some people face in Nigeria is a moot point, because we don't live in Nigeria. We are talking about issues that are prevalent in the country we call home, and of which we pay our taxes. Tribalism, nepotism, racism, discrimination are all wrong, and we should have the balls to call it what it is. However, it makes no rational sense for us to turn a blind eye to the one existing in the country we live in, just because the other happens to exist in a country we were born in.

I agree with your wider point that naturalized citizens should rise above it and aim to be the best in their careers, and it's a point I have always advocated. That doesn't mean that we should ignore subjective bias just because we receive a mess of pottage on a daily basis that we call a job, it's absolutely important that we not only talk about it, but also rebel against it regardless of whether it's perceived or real. If we don't ultimately benefit from speaking out, we hope that our black and ethnic minority colleagues who come after us will benefit from our activism.

Finally, subjective bias shouldn't be used an excuse for a highly-educated naturalized citizen to rest on his/her oars in achievement of career goals, it should actually be a spur. Personally, I have always worked in an environment were I was the only black person, and even more so, a black African. I have travelled with my white colleagues to most countries in 4 continents, with the exception of Australia; but, my white colleagues know that I don't take shee-it when it comes to making snide comments about my origin and/or accent. So it should be.

9 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 11:50pm On Jan 03, 2017
claremont:


Discrimination is discrimination, regardless of whether it's overt or covert. The person who ''perceives'' the discrimination can either choose to ignore it, or fight against it; ignoring it on the pretext of trying to be a good team player automatically means that you are a part of the problem. It means that such practices wouldn't change, because the person on the receiving end believes that it's a normal part of being a team player. There is no such thing as being hypersensitive if a person believes that he/she has been treated unfairly, such a person is well within his/her rights to complain.

I will give an example of an applicant to a government job that just occurred here in the UK, and it was all over the news as well - a popular government TV station wanted to recruit 4 directors; and 5 people got to the final stage of the recruitment, 4 white males and 1 black female. The government chose to recruit the 4 white males for the 4 open slots, and when asked to justify their choices, the government said that the 4 white males were better qualified than the lone black female. That doesn't sound right to any rational person, and it doesn't instill confidence in highly-qualified black and ethnic minority groups who aim for the best government jobs.

In addition, comparing discrimination to the tribalism and nepotism some people face in Nigeria is a moot point, because we don't live in Nigeria. We are talking about issues that are prevalent in the country we call home, and of which we pay our taxes. Tribalism, nepotism, racism, discrimination are all wrong, and we should have the balls to call it what it is. However, it makes no rational sense for us to turn a blind eye to the one existing in the country we live in, just because the other happens to exist in a country we were born in.

I agree with your wider point that naturalized citizens should rise above it and aim to be the best in their careers, and it's a point I have always advocated. That doesn't mean that we should ignore subjective bias just because we receive a mess of pottage on a daily basis, it's absolutely important that we not only talk about it, but also rebel against it regardless of whether it's perceived or real. If we don't ultimately benefit from speaking out, we hope that our black and ethnic minority colleagues who come after us will benefit from our activism.

Finally, subjective bias shouldn't be used an excuse for a highly-educated naturalized citizen to rest on his/her oars in achievement of career goals, it should actually be a spur. Personally, I have always worked in an environment were I was the only black person, and even more so, a black African. I have travelled with my white colleagues to most countries in 4 continents, with the exception of Australia; but, my white colleagues know that I don't take shee-it when it comes to making snide comments about my origin and/or accent. So it should be.


I love you bro !

2 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TWoods(m): 12:12am On Jan 04, 2017
claremont:


Discrimination is discrimination, regardless of whether it's overt or covert. The person who ''perceives'' the discrimination can either choose to ignore it, or fight against it; ignoring it on the pretext of trying to be a good team player automatically means that you are a part of the problem. It means that such practices wouldn't change, because the person on the receiving end believes that it's a normal part of being a team player.

I doubt you understood anything i wrote. In no way did in indicate that i ignore discrimination just to be a good team player. I do not tolerate discrimination at all and i have had a colleague experience this at a former job and we took it to the highest authority to make sure it was duly addressed.

claremont:

There is no such thing as being hypersensitive if a person believes that he/she has been treated unfairly, such a person is well within his/her rights to complain.

The problem is that many minorities are on the hunt for "discrimination". If someone does not like your shirt, it must be because you're black... or perhaps that person just doesn't like your shirt?

claremont:

I will give an example of an applicant to a government job that just occurred here in the UK, and it was all over the news as well - a popular government TV station wanted to recruit 4 directors; and 5 people got to the final stage of the recruitment, 4 white males and 1 black female. The government chose to recruit the 4 white males for the 4 open slots, and when asked to justify their choices, the government said that the 4 white males were better qualified than the lone black female. That doesn't sound right to any rational person, and it doesn't instill confidence in highly-qualified black and ethnic minority groups who aim for the best government jobs.

I read this "example" at least three times to make sure i did not miss anything. What was the justification for assuming that the government was wrong to have considered the white males better qualified? Were you privy to the resumes of all 5 candidates? Why do you automatically ascribe some form of "discrimination" to this case if you have no evidence to support it? The black lady who got to the final stage of the recruitment process must have beaten out several other white men and women, are you claiming she was only put into that stage as a stooge?

The reason that crying "discrimination" now elicits yawns from many is because we've over-used it, even in cases where it did not apply.

claremont:

I agree with your wider point that naturalized citizens should rise above it and aim to be the best in their careers, and it's a point I have always advocated. That doesn't mean that we should ignore subjective bias just because we receive a mess of pottage on a daily basis that we call a job, it's absolutely important that we not only talk about it, but also rebel against it regardless of whether it's perceived or real. If we don't ultimately benefit from speaking out, we hope that our black and ethnic minority colleagues who come after us will benefit from our activism.

We should not ignore bias in any form, we should not assume that everything said or done comes from a place of bias either.

claremont:

Finally, subjective bias shouldn't be used an excuse for a highly-educated naturalized citizen to rest on his/her oars in achievement of career goals, it should actually be a spur. Personally, I have always worked in an environment were I was the only black person, and even more so, a black African. I have travelled with my white colleagues to most countries in 4 continents, with the exception of Australia; but, my white colleagues know that I don't take shee-it when it comes to making snide comments about my origin and/or accent. So it should be.

On this point we are agreed. I often say you are treated as much as you allow. If you command respect in the workplace, others will think twice before they make any snide comments about you.

8 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 12:27am On Jan 04, 2017
TWoods:





I read this "example" at least three times to make sure i did not miss anything. What was the justification for assuming that the government was wrong to have considered the white males better qualified? Were you privy to the resumes of all 5 candidates? Why do you automatically ascribe some form of "discrimination" to this case if you have no evidence to support it? The black lady who got to the final stage of the recruitment process must have beaten out several other white men and women, are you claiming she was only put into that stage as a stooge?


I completely agree with Twoods on this one as much as I am standing on Claremont's side on this thread.
I had also read that example a number of times and couldn't see any indication of racism from the evidence provided here.
Maybe Claremont can elaborate more on that.

Good job guys. This has been a very interesting thread.

3 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Nobody: 4:25am On Jan 04, 2017
TheCongo2:


Not everyone who applied to join the police Force get accepted. Even the american born in the US also get rejected. I would advise you not to generalize based on the experience of few Nigerians whose applications got rejected. The reason could be that other applicants were more qualified than the Nigerians who got rejected. Once again, we need data from all department accross the country if we have to prove that discrimination against Nigerians is at play with respect to employment with the police Force. So far, there is no indication that discrimination is involved here.

On this link, you will find some police officers born in Nigeria:

http://www.africaninterest.com/for-safe-neighborhoods-moaa-and-mpd-establish-an-african-liaison-unit/




thank you very much brother for this clarification. some people will just come online and be wiping up unnecessary sentiment. unproven data and facts. even in your country are there not ethnic bias? at least we have aeen from the link shared by congo2 that there are nigerians in america police force. i knew many nigerians in usa army.
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Nobody: 4:43am On Jan 04, 2017
claremont:


Discrimination is discrimination, regardless of whether it's overt or covert. The person who ''perceives'' the discrimination can either choose to ignore it, or fight against it; ignoring it on the pretext of trying to be a good team player automatically means that you are a part of the problem. It means that such practices wouldn't change, because the person on the receiving end believes that it's a normal part of being a team player. There is no such thing as being hypersensitive if a person believes that he/she has been treated unfairly, such a person is well within his/her rights to complain.

I will give an example of an applicant to a government job that just occurred here in the UK, and it was all over the news as well - a popular government TV station wanted to recruit 4 directors; and 5 people got to the final stage of the recruitment, 4 white males and 1 black female. The government chose to recruit the 4 white males for the 4 open slots, and when asked to justify their choices, the government said that the 4 white males were better qualified than the lone black female. That doesn't sound right to any rational person, and it doesn't instill confidence in highly-qualified black and ethnic minority groups who aim for the best government jobs.

In addition, comparing discrimination to the tribalism and nepotism some people face in Nigeria is a moot point, because we don't live in Nigeria. We are talking about issues that are prevalent in the country we call home, and of which we pay our taxes. Tribalism, nepotism, racism, discrimination are all wrong, and we should have the balls to call it what it is. However, it makes no rational sense for us to turn a blind eye to the one existing in the country we live in, just because the other happens to exist in a country we were born in.

I agree with your wider point that naturalized citizens should rise above it and aim to be the best in their careers, and it's a point I have always advocated. That doesn't mean that we should ignore subjective bias just because we receive a mess of pottage on a daily basis that we call a job, it's absolutely important that we not only talk about it, but also rebel against it regardless of whether it's perceived or real. If we don't ultimately benefit from speaking out, we hope that our black and ethnic minority colleagues who come after us will benefit from our activism.

Finally, subjective bias shouldn't be used an excuse for a highly-educated naturalized citizen to rest on his/her oars in achievement of career goals, it should actually be a spur. Personally, I have always worked in an environment were I was the only black person, and even more so, a black African. I have travelled with my white colleagues to most countries in 4 continents, with the exception of Australia; but, my white colleagues know that I don't take shee-it when it comes to making snide comments about my origin and/or accent. So it should be.


you got a good self-esteem brother. you may need to make youtube videos and address topics like these. i love your points.

3 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by claremont(m): 6:50am On Jan 04, 2017
TheCongo2:


I completely agree with Twoods on this one as much as I am standing on Claremont's side on this thread.
I had also read that example a number of times and couldn't see any indication of racism from the evidence provided here.
Maybe Claremont can elaborate more on that.

Good job guys. This has been a very interesting thread.

There are a lot of articles on this issue. If you google ''uk culture secretary blocks black female from channel 4 board'', the list is enormous. Start from here http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/altha-efunshile-channel-4-board-blocked-board-member-diversity-government-a7463056.html.

1 Like

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 7:56pm On Jan 04, 2017
Goldenboy007:
OP this is a fantastic review and everything you said I also have observed. I am a naturalized American with the best of education from the US system. I work in the corporate America sector but I know there is the systemic racism. When we use the word "Blacks" please let's clarify who we are referring to ....Black American or Black immigrants. The black immigrants are highly educated and hardworking compared to their black American counterparts however the immigrants have struggled to be at par with their white colleagues. I work with one of the biggest Telecom companies in US and it's so hard to see a "black manager", although we have a handful of Nigerian managers but I doubt if they will go higher than that.
Should we blame the whites? No ! It's their Country and we can't blame them if we cannot fix our own Country. My advice is - never forget where you are from regardless your status.
Great point u raised
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 7:56pm On Jan 04, 2017
Goldenboy007:
OP this is a fantastic review and everything you said I also have observed. I am a naturalized American with the best of education from the US system. I work in the corporate America sector but I know there is the systemic racism. When we use the word "Blacks" please let's clarify who we are referring to ....Black American or Black immigrants. The black immigrants are highly educated and hardworking compared to their black American counterparts however the immigrants have struggled to be at par with their white colleagues. I work with one of the biggest Telecom companies in US and it's so hard to see a "black manager", although we have a handful of Nigerian managers but I doubt if they will go higher than that.
Should we blame the whites? No ! It's their Country and we can't blame them if we cannot fix our own Country. My advice is - never forget where you are from regardless your status.
Great points u raised
Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by lindaayim(f): 3:23pm On Jan 05, 2017
Goldenboy007:
OP this is a fantastic review and everything you said I also have observed. I am a naturalized American with the best of education from the US system. I work in the corporate America sector but I know there is the systemic racism. When we use the word "Blacks" please let's clarify who we are referring to ....Black American or Black immigrants. The black immigrants are highly educated and hardworking compared to their black American counterparts however the immigrants have struggled to be at par with their white colleagues. I work with one of the biggest Telecom companies in US and it's so hard to see a "black manager", although we have a handful of Nigerian managers but I doubt if they will go higher than that.
Should we blame the whites? No ! It's their Country and we can't blame them if we cannot fix our own Country. My advice is - never forget where you are from regardless your status.
very educative write up but I tend to disagree when people say that the whites own this country. No. this country USA is owned by every citizen irrespective of race religion sex or national origin. that's not to say systemic racism doesn't exist.

4 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by TheCongo2: 5:01pm On Jan 05, 2017
lindaayim:
but I tend to disagree when people say that the whites own this country.

Thanks OP

1 Like

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Chelseafan1: 7:49am On Jan 21, 2017
lindaayim:

Obama was born in the us not a naturalized citizen. and just to let you know naturalized citizens are excluded from being president of the United States

LOL, sis, just manage the one you have, what do u have to say about us that have no hope of even stepping foot in the US let alone become a citizen, applied for a visit visa last August, yours truly got denied.

Naija just taya person.

3 Likes

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Originalsly: 3:54am On Jan 22, 2017
Naturalized, Permanent Resident or Illegal.... doesn't matter... no one will know... but as soon as you speak with a foreign accent.... you are perceived as a foreigner and should be expecting the question 'where are you from'?. If you were born in the US.... and at age 4 for whatever reasons taken to Nigeria and returned to the US at age 21 with a Nigerian accent... you will be perceived as a foreigner... then the question..'where you from'?.... if the answer is given without explanation.. you would be strengthening the belief that foreigners cannot be trusted... they are liars! If you were born in Nigeria... migrated to the US at age 5... illegally... by age 10 and above... no one would ever even think you are a foreigner.....accent is everything.... until it comes to documentation.... status documentation.
On descrimination..... yes... there is subtle discrimination in the US because open discrimination can send you to prison or companies sued. Punch a guy... you are charged for assault.... call him a nigga/white thrash then punch him.... you would be charged for assault and discrimination.
On Nigerians in the Police Force... you have to have College and above qualifications to be recruited. Not many Nigerians reaching that level of education would even consider being Police officers. Most likely, most of the ones whonare.. we're brought up in the US.

1 Like

Re: Naturalized US Citizens: Do You Get Treated/respected As A Native Born Citizen? by Marriott1980(m): 4:21am On Jan 22, 2017
Well let me lend my voice to this discussion. I am a naturalized citizen and i am in the army reserve. I work as an accountant in an Healthcare company and i have a good rappot with my senior vp cos im good at what i do.
People ask ne where i am from everytime because of my accent and im always proud to tell them im from Nigeria. I am in charge of the companys money and they trust me with it, i think it depends on the type of people you meet and how enlightening they are. My svp's husband is from Iran so she understands what it means to be an immigrant.

2 Likes

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