Buddie

If you go to earlier pages on this thread you would see i clarified the position on this when IFY asked a question about permissibility of killings in islam.

I would try to dig out the page and paste it again but in the mean time. Killing is permitted as a capital punishment after conviciton by a court. By a court i mean full judicial process and if the suspect is found guilty then he his no longer innocent and capital punsihment is permissible if that is the punishment for the crime e.g murder.

Killing is also inevitable during war and by war i dont mean bombings of innocents on the train etc. I mean real war.

No one is allowed to take laws into his hands in islam and even if your family was murdered you cannot go on a killing spree there has to be conviction by a court before punishment could be meted out to the murderer. Islam does not permit us to act on impulse.

I hope you get the gist.

Very clear. Then you need to stop saying 'unjust killing' 'killing of innocents' etc

Because anyone can claim he/she has determined the other party is 'guilty' and hence killing that person is justifiable .

I'm sure you catch my drift.

@ ilussion2

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-359506.0.html

Check out page one and two .

Oh yeah i get what you mean. The qualification of who is innocent or guilty is by a court and not on impulse. Caliph Umar once peeped through the window and found some people drinking alcohol but he was handicapped in dishing out punishment. This was because firstly, he broke the law himself by peeping through the window and invading into their privacy.

Umar could not act on impulse as this is not our faith, there is a due process which we have to follow and Umar had to even provide other witnesses to butress his prosecution.

Lagosboy:

@ ilussion2

Illusion2

Lagosboy:

To conclude, islam recommends the husband to repel the radical and fight him in order to protect his family and belongings.

And God knows best

Thanks, that's all I needed.

theopops:

Thanks, that's all I needed.

You most and always welcomed. Please feel free to always ask any questions you require regarding islam and bros and sis here would always be happy to share info about their faith.

illusion2:

Illusion2

Ma binu eyan mi o I should not be making the same mistake twice.

Assalamu alaikum,

Where is IFY today? Haven't seen her around. Hope you are doing fine.

muhsin:

Assalamu alaikum,

Where is IFY today? Haven't seen her around. Hope you are doing fine.

Alaikum Salam.
I am ard and doing good.what abt u?
Can we please discuss "contraceptives and family planning" ,what shld a muslim do or not do,abortion;is it ever permitted etc

She you dnt read at all ni? sorry am sonuding like this,what about if this people are wrong?go to Islamic bookshops,get books,infact get the whole of volume 1-9 hadith,or ask from your local imams,though am not saying nairalanders are not knowledgeable but make effort to know some basic things via outside apart from nairaland

uplawal:

She you dnt read at all ni? sorry am sonuding like this,what about if this people are wrong?go to Islamic bookshops,get books,infact get the whole of volume 1-9 hadith,or ask from your local imams,though am not saying nairalanders are not knowledgeable but make effort to know some basic things via outside apart from nairaland

lol
Lets just leave it at . . .i love listening to ppl views,compare notes then make my own decision.
Its possible,i read more books than you,no?
Never knew asking equates been seen as not making enough efforts . . .anyway,sister,Salams,advice noted n taken in gud faith 

@Uplawal,
Let's thread softly pls.
There is nothing wrong in asking questions. In fact, books can sometimes be misleading, especially for someone who is new to the religion. What if she buys a book by a misguided sect presented as true Islam, and goes ahead to follow the 'misteachings' in that book. Also, even hadith books require scholarly interpretatiosn sometimes. I can remember buying and reading a book by one of the deviant sects, but due to teh fact that I had some basic knowledge about the puritan Islam before, I was able to decipher that the teachings in that book was not totally right.

So it's always good to compare notes and ask questions, in addition to reading oneself.

uplawal:

She you dnt read at all ni? sorry am sonuding like this,what about if this people are wrong?go to Islamic bookshops,get books,infact get the whole of volume 1-9 hadith,or ask from your local imams,though am not saying nairalanders are not knowledgeable but make effort to know some basic things via outside apart from nairaland

this one too: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria?topic=582312.msg7500082#msg7500082

i think both you and the other one should read this:

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16387.960.html#msg7483278

you defly need it. smh

uplawal:

She you dnt read at all ni? sorry am sonuding like this,what about if this people are wrong?go to Islamic bookshops,get books,infact get the whole of volume 1-9 hadith,or ask from your local imams,though am not saying nairalanders are not knowledgeable but make effort to know some basic things via outside apart from nairaland

Sister, A muslim that takes his knowledge from books without a teacher or guide would end up having Shaiytan as his/her teacher. yesterday you said hadith is bad , today you are recommending someone to buy vol 1 -9 of which hadith book?

Family planning and contraception is not a basic thing my dear sister, it is infact a very complex issue and it is this simplistic attitide to the knowledge of islam that misleads loads of muslim. Myself and bro Muhsin have begged to discuss with you privately but or even here but you tactically ignore and i have since chosen not to bother myslef as one can only benefit or benfit from a willing heart.

ifyalways:

lol
Lets just leave it at . . .i love listening to ppl views,compare notes then make my own decision.
Its possible,i read more books than you,no?
Never knew asking equates been seen as not making enough efforts . . .anyway,sister,Salams,advice noted n taken in gud faith 

Good reply though, May Allah increase you in wisdom. I would insha Allah talk on the subject in a bit.

mukina2:

this one too: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria?topic=582312.msg7500082#msg7500082

i think both you and the other one should read this:

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16387.960.html#msg7483278

you defly need it. smh

Good to have you back on the thread super mod , long time though, hope your well and good. Thanks for the links as it has some good advice on simple manners relating to seeking and giving knowledge.

ifyalways:

Alaikum Salam.
I am ard and doing good.what abt u?

Good. Glad to 'hear' that.

Can we please discuss "contraceptives and family planning" ,what shld a muslim do or not do,abortion;is it ever permitted etc

I see Lagosboy has attended to that. I may say more later, inshaAllah.

Lagosboy:



Good reply though, May Allah increase you in wisdom. I would insha Allah talk on the subject in a bit.

. . waiting.

muhsin:

Good. Glad to 'hear' that.

I see Lagosboy has attended to that. I may say more later, inshaAllah.

Not yet.You can set the ball rolling

Abortion according to scholars is only ever permitted if the health of the mother is at risk . This issue is non negotiable in islam, however there are differences in when abortion is deemed as "abortion". By that i mean if the pregnancy is just one week and the thing is still just blood and not formulated. Some scholars regard termination at that stage as not abortion. There are few technicalities regarding that, and i dont want to confuse us with this except you would like to probe further.

Secondly, birth control and family planning is largely allowed and permissible in islam. The reasons for this range from spacing of children to protect a womans health, enabling full suckling of a child for up to two years like the quran prescribes. Most  birth control method are permitted in islam except the permanent sterilization which is also overuled if is done for health reasons. Methods like condom and the withdrawal method should be done with mutual agreement between the two parties, as the satisfaction of the woman is very important in which case she has the right to turn down the use of condom/withdrawal by her husband if it affects her sexual pleasure negatively.

Having said all of the above, we should note that whatever will be will be and if Allah decrees a baby no matter the amont of contraception the baby shall be concieved. Such was the case when some men asked the prophet  PBUH about the withdrawal method and he did not condemn it, instead he said approved it but said the decree of Allah could not be prevented.

The quran in 17 v 31 said "dont kill your children for fear of poverty" , some scholars have prohibited use of contraceptive to prevent child birth for economic reasons based on this verse and some have said this verse actually refers to an already born child. By and large, the fear of poverty should not prevent us from having children as our sustainance is never in our hands but the hands of the almighty and every child comes with his or her own rizq. Nevertheless , we should also use our intellect and intelligence as regards birth control as economic factor is not the only issue with children but the psycological ability of the parents to rear them, the time and attention they require etc.

I hope i have briefly introduced this topic and the discusssion is open for all to contribute to please.

And God knows best

ifyalways:

. . waiting.Not yet.You can set the ball rolling

At your service madam

Lagosboy:

This was because firstly, he broke the law himself by peeping through the window and invading into their privacy.

Umar could not act on impulse as this is not our faith, there is a due process which we have to follow and Umar had to even provide other witnesses to butress his prosecution.

This stuff is deep and worthy of respect, it is not much different from evidence being thrown out of court if obtained inappropriately.

Uplawal

Please ignore me as best as you can, what i do or do not do does not add or take away anything from you, please i take God beg you ignore me totally.

Thanks

@uplawal,
I have been away from nairaland for long,

I have read your replies to the posts and how you started the conflicts. My first reaction is to lambast you for being rude, but I think it is best to let you know that you are wrong and your conduct is not islamic at all, I observed that Ify is not even replying you with harsh tones, this show that she mean well and want peace, whaever apology you may have rendered, cannot remove the fact that your words created the conflicts,

insulting people who ask simple questions is not in Islamic teaching,,, there are lot of examples in the hadith where people have come to ask even unreasonable questions and teh prophet told the companion to always be polite.

I think right thinking people should stop wasting time repling insults. As i used to say, IT IS USELESS TELLING THE DEAF THAT THE MARKET IS ABOUT TO CLOSE. WHEN THE MARKET IS EMPTY, HE WILL PACK HIS WARE AND GO HOME. Why must you guys even bother to reply? Guys, we dont need to reply all insults. the diffrence between kids and adults is that kids reply everything.Adult know when to ignore kids that are throwing tantrum.

Peace, be still.

Seems some posts have been deleted , maybe there is good in me not being opportuned to read them.

Lagosboy:

Abortion according to scholars is only ever permitted if the health of the mother is at risk . This issue is non negotiable in islam, however there are differences in when abortion is deemed as "abortion". By that i mean if the pregnancy is just one week and the thing is still just blood and not formulated. Some scholars regard termination at that stage as not abortion. There are few technicalities regarding that, and i dont want to confuse us with this except you would like to probe further.

Secondly, birth control and family planning is largely allowed and permissible in islam. The reasons for this range from spacing of children to protect a womans health, enabling full suckling of a child for up to two years like the quran prescribes. Most  birth control method are permitted in islam except the permanent sterilization which is also overuled if is done for health reasons. Methods like condom and the withdrawal method should be done with mutual agreement between the two parties, as the satisfaction of the woman is very important in which case she has the right to turn down the use of condom/withdrawal by her husband if it affects her sexual pleasure negatively.

Having said all of the above, we should note that whatever will be will be and if Allah decrees a baby no matter the amont of contraception the baby shall be concieved. Such was the case when some men asked the prophet  PBUH about the withdrawal method and he did not condemn it, instead he said approved it but said the decree of Allah could not be prevented.

The quran in 17 v 31 said "dont kill your children for fear of poverty" , some scholars have prohibited use of contraceptive to prevent child birth for economic reasons based on this verse and some have said this verse actually refers to an already born child. By and large, the fear of poverty should not prevent us from having children as our sustainance is never in our hands but the hands of the almighty and every child comes with his or her own rizq. Nevertheless , we should also use our intellect and intelligence as regards birth control as economic factor is not the only issue with children but the psycological ability of the parents to rear them, the time and attention they require etc.

I hope i have briefly introduced this topic and the discusssion is open for all to contribute to please.

And God knows best

Thank you.
@Mushin . . . still waiting for ur inputs.

olanajim:

@
@Ify,

I miss you! Where have you been? Please email me at isqilnajim@yahoo.co.uk . I thought u have disappeared. You own me a lesson on Isoko delicacies,

Hey,Olanajim . . .u abandoned NLD.
Wud reach u as asap,expect ur hot banga(tinko,peri-winkles,snails inclusive) and starch.lolz

duduspace:

This stuff is deep and worthy of respect, it is not much different from evidence being thrown out of court if obtained inappropriately.

You are right and such was the level of islamic civilisation 1400 years ago , there are many other lessons to be learnt in law  & governance  from the governance of Umar ibn Khattab and man filled with wisdom and courage.

@Keep deleting post you guys,why dnt you leave the posts as it were,and why did you leave some and deleted some,very biased set of people

ifyalways:

Thank you.
@Mushin Muhsin . . . still waiting for your inputs.

Muhsin dey busy undertaking training for INEC Voter Register. Beside, I, sincerely and actually speaking, know little about that issue. I had a well written book concerning it and have read it sometimes ago, but it must have been either lost or misplaced. Can't locate it for now.

uplawal:

@Keep deleting post you guys,why dnt you leave the posts as it were,and why did you leave some and deleted some,very biased set of people

Wouldn't you sheath the sword and let the bygones be bygones. I, for once, read all the deleted and the present replies yesterday night. There is nothing that worrying if yours--meaning replies, are left or deleted as it doesn't make much difference. Wouldn't we behave like the Prophet, may Allah exalt his mention, and his Companions? What is the meaning of reading about them; it's of course primarily to learn from them, emulate them and do as such.

May Allah, the Exalted, guide us all to the right path, amin.

BTW, Haven't you seen this: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-580613.0.html I assume you must have; why then you are yet to indulge me, Sister? Why and why? Please I beseech you to come up there. I got only some few days to leave this board for the INEC exercise, which is gonna last for at least two weeks. Hence it's either now or probably never. Understand? Thank you very much.

Ciao!

@Mukina,everyone that sees you here trying to defend your statement would think i actually insulted Davids mum,but its just one of the ways evil people like you find to mud peoples names,I could really remember  the thread,its "black man and his Allah",in this thread,someone was irritated at the way Osisi insulted someones mother,while David was hellbent trying to justify what Osisi did as commendable,he was supporting Osisi for insulting someones mum,and i disliked it,as well as everyone, so i replied to David saying"Davidlyan is an hypocrite,am sure his wife beats his mum thats why He sees nothing bad in Osisi Insulting someone mum,

Pls could anyone in his or right sense judge this as insult?only if you want to be biased.

On the same thread,a lady called thiefofheart insulted me,she actually was the first person to call my mum deranged(i reject it though in the name of Allah) and Ashewo all cos i was supporting Abuzola and she said i should learn from you cos someone insulted your mum you dnt retaliate,so i should learn from you not to deal with whoever insult my mum like you did,never will i keep quiet when my mum is insultedand to me its evil for anyone to insult anyones mum,not even my mum,i cant claim to be better muslim like you to have the insulter of my mum to go free,i would rather insult the persons mum back,and which i did,i cursed her mum back,cos am not omoode like some people,so anyone should come here now to tell me insulting her back is mannerless,i dnt care whatever anyone say really cos mio kin she omo lole lo gbesi wa,instantly i would give you your dose.dnt really care to reply you though,but just to clear myself from your evil plan.

@Muhsin,why would you say it makes no diffrence leaving some and deleting some,why dont they just leave all or delete all,very biased people

muhsin:

Muhsin dey busy undertaking training for INEC Voter Register.  Beside, I, sincerely and actually speaking, know little about that issue. I had a well written book concerning it and have read it sometimes ago, but it must have been either lost or misplaced. Can't locate it for now.

haha.
If dem  post u go my village u wud surely come back with your 4 wives complete . . .lolz.We are just too pretty and look take-away-ish.
May Allah(swt) be your companion,lighten your journey and grant u goodness and piety.Amin

E pe up Lawal kin gbo (up Lawal o). The way this sister posts makes me think she is under-13. I am sorry to take you back but I noticed what Hymen said earlier about how Lagosboy was just responding to some issues which she as a non-Muslim thought he would be afraid to answer; this is a very popular misconception about Islam and Muslims. This is the summary:

"Muslims can't be fun or practical, they are just a bunch of brainwashed dumdums." Lagosboy is doing an excellent job of dispelling that myth and May Almighty Allah bless him abundantly in this world and the hereafter, the same goes for us his brothers and sisters.

I am outa here. Ma Salam.

ifyalways:

haha.
If dem post u go my village u wud surely come back with your 4 wives complete . . .lolz.We are just too pretty and look take-away-ish.
May Allah(swt) be your companion,lighten your journey and grant u goodness and piety.Amin

Ha!! Abeg take me to your village and let me go there , me i dont need INEC to post me there i go go my self Would they let me take 4 at a go .

It is sunnah to also marry beautiful women you know

maclatunji:

E pe up Lawal kin gbo (up Lawal o). The way this sister posts makes me think she is under-13. I am sorry to take you back but I noticed what Hymen said earlier about how Lagosboy was just responding to some issues which she as a non-Muslim thought he would be afraid to answer; this is a very popular misconception about Islam and Muslims. This is the summary:

"Muslims can't be fun or practical, they are just a bunch of brainwashed dumdums." Lagosboy is doing an excellent job of dispelling that myth and May Almighty Allah bless him abundantly in this world and the hereafter, the same goes for us his brothers and sisters.

I am outa here. Ma Salam.

Jazakallah khair brother for the kind words, may Allah bless you abundantly as well and may he increase us all in knowledge, understanding and wisdom. May he increase us in taqwa and make us better muslims or mu´mins.

By the way where is Hymen ?